24/05/2016 Tuesday in Parliament

Hello there and welcome to Tuesday In Parliament.

Sharp exchanges between the governor of the Bank of England and a leading

Eurosceptic over the bank's views on our EU membership.

The head of the firm set to build a new nuclear power station

in Somerset says he doesn't know when a final decision will be made.

And it's time for a kitty catch-up on Palmerston,

I'm pleased to report to the House that he has settled in perfectly.

But first, the governor of the Bank of England, Mark Carney,

has denied accusations that he has become politically involved

Earlier this month, the Bank gave a stark warning of the dangers

to the economy of the UK leaving the European Union,

including the possibility of a recession.

Vote Leave campaigners reacted angrily to that, with

the Conservative MP Jacob Rees-Mogg calling on Dr Carney to resign.

So there were prickly exchanges when the Governor appeared before

the Commons Treasury Committee, of which Mr Rees-Mogg is a member.

The Conservative wanted to know if it was possible to see

the minutes of meetings between George Osborne and Mark Carney.

And would there be a possibility of publishing those, so we can see?

I mean, it's not the norm to publish those minutes.

It's highly politically sensitive, and to see that there has not been

undue influence coming from the Treasury...

I mean, there is no possibility of undue influence coming

There is no possibility of undue influence.

There is no possibility of effective influence,

But it is very convenient that you are giving out exactly the same

I don't accept that at all. I don't accept that at all.

Mr Rees-Mogg, the judgment in the Monetary Policy summary,

in the minutes, in the letter to the Chancellor,

Those judgments around the risks around the referendum,

both actual and manifesting in the economy today,

in respect of the event of the vote to leave,

those are the judgments of, individually and collectively,

the nine independent members of the Monetary Policy Committee.

In a deeply political area where you would not,

in a general election, give a view, when it had gone away

from the normal independence of the bank...

This is not a general election, Mr Rees-Mogg.

I'm aware of that but it's still a popular vote across the country.

As the Prime Minister has said, it is more important

Mr Rees-Mogg, we have a responsibility,

both to discharge our remit, and we have a broader responsibility

to the British people, who don't want risks kept from them,

They expect us to come straight with them about issues,

and they expect us to take action to the extent possible

to mitigate those risks, and that's entirely right.

Don't you have a responsibility to be apolitical?

As soon as you become political and you support one

side of the campaign, why should anyone now trust

what you said on interest rates gor the benefit

Mr Rees-Mogg, we have not supported a side in the campaign.

The only side we have supported is the pursuit of low, stable,

veritable inflation, which is our remit.

You have effectively... And we have made...

And by our actions, by our commentary,

which may be inconvenient for you, it may be inconvenient for you,

we have made it more likely that we will bring

inflation back to target, whatever the outcome

of the referendum, sooner and more sustainably, and that will be

Tha's our contribution to a better economic outcome

and to suggest otherwise is to try and undermine that.

I do suggest otherwise. And so you try to undermine that.

I think you have become politically involved in a way you have quite

clearly said you would not in a general election.

Jeremy Corbyn made an important speech on economics a few days ago.

The MPC has not given a view on whether his new economics

Now, the UK is investigating reports that British-built cluster bombs

made in the 1970s have been found in Yemen, near the border

A Saudi-led coalition has been involved in military action in Yemen

Ministers said it was not yet clear how the weapons came to be there.

Cluster bombs have been banned by over 100 countries -

We know what these weapons can do, especially to children,

Amnesty also reports that, on 1 March, two children

near the village of Fard were herding goats,

when they found some other cluster bomblets and played with them

It killed an eight-year-old and severely injured

Does the Foreign Secretary regard the use of cluster bombs

in civilian areas as a breach of international humanitarian law?

Mr Speaker, as the honourable gentleman knows, the UK has

long since given up the use of cluster munitions.

Their use or supply is illegal under British law, and the weapons that

are being described here, as my honourable friend said

We are aware of reports of the alleged use of

cluster munitions by the coalition in Yemen.

We have raised the issue of their use during the current

conflict in Yemen several times with the Saudi Arabian authorities

and, in line with our obligations under

the Convention on Cluster Munitions,

continue to encourage Saudi Arabia -

as a non-party to the convention - to accede to it.

The Saudis have previously denied using UK cluster munitions

during the conflict in Yemen, but we are seeking fresh

assurances in light of this new serious allegation.

Will the UK Government now finally suspend arms sales to Saudi Arabia

and properly investigate the issues raised by Amnesty International?

And will the Secretary of State now confirm that the Government

will keep its commitment to the EU not to export in these

And, finally, will the Secretary of State now apologise to the House

for this Government's continued inaction in this vital matter,

which has resulted in the deaths of Yemeni men, women and children,

The minister said Britain was seeking further assurances

from the Saudi authorities that British weapons had not

The Government's Special Envoy to Kuwait said to remember

the current peace talks were at a critical phase.

I've also personally been to the operational targeting

headquarters of the Saudi - led coalition, and have seen

for myself what I believe to be the very high professional standards

Notwithstanding the honourable lady's passion on this,

driven, I think it's fair to say, much more by NGO briefings...

..than it is by any kind of personal experience in this.

Would it not be...? Would it not be...?

It's not insulting at all, to suggest that experience

We are involved in Yemen because we are peacemakers.

We want to see peace restored to this country that is bleeding

to death, because of the involvement of so many countries.

Of course, we needed the support of the Saudi Arabians in order

to restore a legitimate Government with President Hadi, because of

However, it is important that they now stop and

These kinds of allegations undermine the work that is being

Could he ensure that the Saudi Arabian ambassador is called to see

the Foreign Office Minister, so that we can reinforce the message

that these kinds of allegations undermine the peace process?

The minister replied that the UK did all it could to work

You're watching Tuesday In Parliament, with me,

The boss of EDF Energy has told MPs he does not know

when a final investment decision on the ?18 billion Hinkley

The decision had been due to take place this month, but the company's

trade union members have suggested the Somerset nuclear project should

The Energy Climate Change Committee heard

that the French Economy Minister had said his government remained

committed to the project, and a final decision would be

taken once a consultation with the unions had taken place.

At the moment we speak, the project continues

to prepare for the final discussion, at which time we will confirm

Secondly, EDF has secured its overall financing.

We are consulting with the trade unions, and teams are still working

Hinkley Point C is a strategic project for France and for China.

It is as essential for EDF as it is for the UK.

Can give us dates for the end of the consultation period,

or the time needed to analyse responses, or indeed,

the earliest possible date for the final decision being made?

I understand the form of impatience that you express, and many express,

which is for me a good sign of support for the project.

In a sense, I have teams with the same impatience.

But we have, at the same time, to remain calm and dispassionate.

If I was prejudging the outcome of the process,

And I would not prejudge, cos I do not want to harm the process,

So when is the end of the consultation period?

Therefore, you can understand that it is in the best interests

of all who are expecting that the final investment

decision is taken and the sooner the better...

It is in the best interests not to prejudge the consultation.

Also appearing before MPs was the Energy Minister,

She was confident Hinkley C would go ahead.

I've been down to Somerset myself to see the Hinkley Point C,

and I can tell you I was absolutely overwhelmed by the massive amount

I had the great pleasure of seeing the brilliant bat house,

and I've seen hedgehog tunnels, and an amazing levelling

A huge amount of work that is going on onsite that is not

the actions of a company that is not planning to move ahead with it,

and I think, as you have just heard very strongly from EDF's senior

people, that this project is going ahead.

What contingency plans are you making in the event

that the decision is not taken and is not taken soon?

Nuclear is a core part of our energy ambitions.

We are also, as you will be aware, bringing on more offshore wind.

We're also doing everything we can to promote new storage.

We are looking at new combined gas cycle turbines.

I just want to reiterate, we don't have all our

The construction of Hinkley C, said the Minister,

If it does not go ahead, we will not leave the British

consumer honourable to the lights going out.

So you are planning for the position that it could potentially not

go ahead? What?

Obviously, my department's core function is to ensure energy

Thirdly, it's to decarbonise at the lowest possible price.

New nuclear hits all of those buttons but we will not leave the UK

consumer vulnerable to the lights going out.

The Defence Secretary has admitted that progress to end the conflict

in Syria has been far slower than he would have wanted

Michael Fallon was giving his quarterly update to MPs on how

the fight against so-called Islamic State, or Daesh, was progressing.

The military programme is making progress. It is on the back foot and

its leadership has been struck. Over 40% of the territory Daesh once held

has been retaken. Several different places have been taken and

preparatory operations are under way and at the weekend the Prime

Minister they announced the beginning of the operation to retake

the ledger. The persistence of Daesh and Russia's intervention has

created a more complex association. In Aleppo, hospitals and schools

have been repeatedly shelled. On the 4th of May, the UK called in urgent

session of the security council to highlight the regime's atrocities.

Russia, the Assad regime's protector, must apply pressure to

end this violence. Nonetheless, even in Syria, they have lost ground and

has been driven from a major supply route. A particularly significant

development in Iraq was seen at the weekend, which was the launch of a

ground offensive against the diet should stronghold of foliage. It's

often forgotten that around 350 -- 250 British troops have also been

deployed on the ground in Iraq providing advice to the Iraqi

security forces. We have an important stake in the success of

the Iraqi military and will continue to monitor their progress carefully.

As the Secretary of State acknowledges, Syria is a situation

which is much more complex. Last year, he said we were going to

tighten the noose around the head of the snake which was Raquel, but in

taking the fight to the Dave facto capital, it would present many

challenges. -- Raqqa. If the government's elections has proven

correct, Syria would have a transitional government next week.

What is the minister's most up-to-date predictions as to when

these two vitally important milestones will be delivered? To be

honest, I would not have predicted the progress that has been made in

Iraq. It's been more rapid than I would have thought. The honourable

member asked me about that during the debate in December. In Syria,

yes, it's been far slowly than we would have wanted, far slower than I

thought would be the case when the cessation was agreed in Munich in

February. But this is war. There are a lot of people involved who have an

interest in sustaining this war, especially the Assad regime,

supported by Russia. We have to keep working at it.

Now to the continuing debate on the Queen's speech.

The topics for the day - Europe, human rights and keeping

Labour's Harriet Harman turned to the counter-extremism measures

Everyone seems to agree that the most precious asset in the fight

against terrorism is a relationship between the authorities, the police,

schools, councils, and the Muslim communities of this country. We must

guard against any undermining of the relationship between the authorities

and the Muslim community, which would thereby make the fight against

terrorism even harder. The last thing we must do is anything which

fosters the alienation that can lead to radicalisation.

A Conservative turned to so-called Islamic state.

In defeating IES, they could be easily defeated, but it's largely an

ideological defeat and that's very much more difficult. We must show

the same abhorrence of Islamophobia as we show of anti-Semitism.

One Conservative had just returned from a foreign affairs

There is an issue about whether we are going to try and help the

Russians out of the cul-de-sac that have got themselves into and I do

think even if it is initially at the level of cultural exchanges as

students coming, we should invest in this relationship in any way that we

can. It's a very important relationship. Russia is a very

important country. That is why it becomes even more critical when a

country of that size is under the leadership that it is, a position of

deep lack of self-confidence underneath.

And there was a maiden speech from the winner

who spoke about one of his predecessors, Sir Raymond Powell.

We are in fact both trade being butchery. Sir Raymond, a master

butcher, and me, a butchery assistant. I'm not sure if my skills

with a knife will ever come to use in this house but I'm told by

members it's a useful skill to have. I of course assume metaphorically.

Chris Elmore, the new MP for Ogmore, with a surprising skillset.

Now, regular viewers will know that there's increasing

disquiet about the size of the House of Lords.

Now topping 800 members, there have been growing calls -

not least from peers themselves - for a fairly radical rethink.

One Labour peer thought he'd spotted another problem with the make up

Lady Stowell agreed an incremental approach

Out of 808 rates, 383 -- 385 were living in London, and very few in

Wales, in the East Midlands and West Midlands, in the north-east of

England and the north-west of England, and in Yorkshire and

Humberside. In order to reflect all of those interests properly, is it

not better to have people from all quarters of the United Kingdom? And

world leader of the house look at ways in which this terrible

imbalance can be rectified? The noble Lord is right that there are

certain parts of the United Kingdom that are better represented than

others and I certainly believe it is very important that for us to be

effective as a house, we all offer a range of backgrounds and experiences

and expertise. But because we are unelected and don't have that

represent -- responsibility to represent any parts of the United

Kingdom, it is not an easy question for us to remedy. But it's certainly

one I will reflect upon. The noble lady pointed out that the

Conservative manifesto said there was going to be no comprehensive

reform of this house. And insofar as that is shorthand for not

introducing a bill for unelected house, it's very welcome to some of

us. Budget would she make clear that it doesn't rule out sensible

incremental reform of your lordship's house and that means

taking decisive action to reduce the numbers in this house. As far as

further steps along that track, if there is broad consensus and we are

able to attract some cross-party agreement on reforms, I would be

interested to support that sort of thing.

Lawrence of Arabia's robes and dagger should go on display

in the Foreign Office - so says one of its ministers,

after they were saved from going overseas.

TE Lawrence, an archaeologist and diplomat,

became internationally famous following his exploits

in the Arab peninsula during the First World War.

He was later immortalised in the 1962 David Lean

His robes and dagger had been bought at auction

but were then subject to a temporary export ban.

At Foreign Office questions, a Conservative MP wanted to know.

Now that the government has prevented the export of his robes

and dagger, can he tell the house where they will be available for the

public to see them as an inspiration for greater understanding of the

Middle East and also to encourage greater freedom in that part of the

world? The Foreign Office Minister,

an ex-army officer replying to the question, is said to have

taken a keen interest in the case. He is absolutely right to say this

important, not only the robe of the dagger itself, has been saved for

the nation and will not be departing. This was a gift given to

Lawrence of Arabia by the man after his fantastic attack on Akbar,

where, glossed over by the media at the time, he actually accidentally

shot his camel. It continued on another camel. He then moved to work

in the Foreign Office. I would like to see the garment, the gown and

indeed the robe and the dagger on display in the Foreign Office. I'm

not sure we will be successful in that but I'm glad to say it will

stay the United Kingdom. While we're on the subject

of working for the Foreign Office there was also a question

about an altogether Palmerston the Foreign Office

cat was recruited from Battersa Cats Dogs Home

this spring. The continued presence of mice in

the main building has given by officials pause for thought. After

can -- careful consideration, we appointed Palmerston Cats last month

as chief Mouser to the FCO, to comp lament the work of our contractor

and I'm pleased to report that he has settled in perfectly and is

performing his duties more than satisfactorily. For five years,

we've had a first-class cat which has done the necessary and its name

is Order. I am sure the whole house will welcome the Prime Minister's

statement and also the arrival of Palmerston the FCO's rodent killer

but there is a serious point here, Mr Speaker. Can I ask my right

honourable friend whether Palmerston has been security cleared or not.

You may recall that the Chancellor's cat had access to the Foreign

Office, number ten Downing St and it was thought that she might have been

got out by a foreign power. Can I ask him, as he been positively

vetted by the Security service and scanned for bugs by GCHQ? And can my

right honourable friend assure the house and the more paranoid element

in the Brixton is, or Palmerston's British provenance and that he isn't

a long-term mole working for the EU commission. Mr Speaker, he is

definitely not a mole. I can, Mr Speaker, categorically assure my

honourable friend that Palmerston has been regularly vetted. As for

being a sleeper, he is definitely a sleeper. I'm told very often in my

office. But unlike Freya, who went missing for two years, his

attendance record has been 100% and my experts tell me that pretty much

rules out the possibility of him being a commission employee. I

should also tell the house that while Palmerston so far has a record

three mice, his Twitter account has attracted 8158 followers with a rate

of growth that implies he will overtake me by the summer recess.

Which feline frenzy brings us to the end of this programme,

but do join me tomorrow for another round up of the day at Westminster,

including Prime Minister's Questions, when George Osborne

and Angela Eagle will be taking centre stage.

But until then, from me, Alicia McCarthy, goodbye.