18/11/2015 Victoria Derbyshire

It's Wednesday, it's 9.15, I'm Victoria Derbyshire.

This morning there is an ongoing stand-off outside an apartment

building in Paris. people have been killed in a major

operation targeting the suspected Loud explosions

and gunfire were heard during the raid on a flat

in the suburb of Saint-Denis, which is continuing - and began soon

after 4 in the morning. Latest

reports say one of those killed was a woman who blew

herself up with a suicide vest. Four police officers are

said to have been injured. I will bring you the latest from the

scene where that operation is continuing. Hundreds of police are

here and so our troops from the Army.

Throughout the programme we'll keep you up to date with

the latest developments and we'll bring you more stories from those

Including one British couple from Leeds. We will tell you the dramatic

story of their escape through the roof of the Bataclan in the next

hour. Good morning and welcome to the programme.

Throughout the programme we'll keep you up to date with the fast moving

situation in Paris - where there's a major operation going on

The operation began before dawn

The French Prosecutor has confirmed that a woman inside the apartment

set-off an explosive vest and died at the beginning of the raid.

In this amateur footage shot by one resident you can hear the gunfire

in the apartment have been taken out of the building by anti-terrorist

Their identities aren't confirmed so far.

One person is apparently still holed up in the apartment.

Five police officers have been lightly injured. One man and one

woman were detained in proximity to the apartment. The alleged

mastermind is thought to have been involved in the raids this morning.

Abdelhamid Abaaoud. He has previously boasted about avoiding

the police. He then gave an interview to the Islamic State

English-language magazine suggesting he was in Syria. His whereabouts

until that in February remained unknown.

Belgian authorities had suspected Abaaoud, in his late 20s, of being

the head of a terror cell which was smashed in January in the wake of

Stade de France, where three suicide bombers

blew themselves up during last week's violence in

Here are some of the latest pictures of that operation:

This footage was filmed at the scene, as you can hear

Ben Brown is in northern Paris where that police

Tell us the very latest. quite confused situation. Let's tell

you what we know so far for sure. That is coming from the Paris

prosecutor 's office, beginning at 20 Basque for in the morning local

time, as another ambulance goes past me. -- at 4:20am. We are at the end

has been going on in Saint Denis. It has been going on in Saint Denis. It

began at 4:20am and this was a police raid on an apartment

began at 4:20am and this was a there were suspects holed up. There

was a series of explosions which local residents heard, obviously

terrifying for the people around here. Very loud explosions. It seems

that a woman inside the flat blew herself up. Then there was an hour

of heavy sustained gunfire down the street here behind me. The operation

is still going on. Although it has been much quieter for the last hour.

We have not heard any gunfire or explosions for some time. It seems

that at one stage there was a pitched battle. One woman blew

herself up and there were reports of the fatalities. We know for sure

from the Paris prosecutor that three men from the flat were arrested by

counterterror police and then separately

counterterror police and then Denis and man and woman were also

detained. Five people have been detained. Let me show you the scene.

-- in Saint-Denis a man and a woman were detained. This area is in

lockdown at the moment, lots of police. I had through this line of

police vans there are troops from the French army, not just

counterterrorism police and gendarmes, this is also the Army.

Francois Hollande has said that this is war. Perhaps that is an

indication of the war that it believes it is in with Isis. It is a

state of emergency which the president wants to extend. Down this

end of the street there is a lot of emergency vehicles, ambulances and

more police vehicles. This emergency vehicles, ambulances and

the outer edges of where the operation has been going on this

morning. Through here asked the lines of media who are obviously

gathered here this morning, you can see some of the local people here in

Saint-Denis who have been their world and by what has been going on.

They have been coming up to the red and white line of the

They have been coming up to the red just trying to get a sense of what

is going just trying to get a sense of what

Many of them were woken in the early hours of the morning by the

explosions and gunfire. Quite a few of them were utterly terrified as

you would expect. If of them were utterly terrified as

something like that on your doorstep. Some of them even thought

they were under attack themselves from terrorists. But this was a

police operation, and their information was that they were after

some of the ringleaders and suspects involved in Friday nights attacks

which killed 120 -- 129 people. Benson Hoi lives near the scene

in Saint-Denis and is currently People living in the area have been

told to stay indoors. That is correct. What did you hear this

morning? It felt like fireworks for over an hour. This morning at around

4:30am and then obviously there was the explosion around two hours ago,

the suicide vests. And then we have obviously been hearing in nearly

stages that lots of people were trying to get out on the streets to

watch it which obviously the police were shouting at them to try to ask

them to get back to their flats. How close are you to the apartment that

was targeted by the police? To the best of my knowledge it is within

walking distance of a couple of minutes. Basically I am situated

less than one minute, I can see the cathedral from my flat. I can also

see the corner of the street on the other side, so I am in the middle of

the police blockade. I understand. Is there much activity that you can

see from your window? Are you able to safely show us what is going on?

Yes, during the beginning of the attack... I can do a slow panorama

of the scene. Obviously insuring my safety, I will do a slow panorama.

That side is the cathedral. And this is the Main Street. And what we are

looking at now is a lot of army presence which is slowly moving away

but they are still here around the scenes. Thank you, we can clearly

see the armed response units and it looks like fire engines and also

police motorbikes as well. It is very calm down there. It looks like

it anyway. INAUDIBLE Looking outside the window... Most

people are hiding inside. It is said... Maybe if you move back

indoors the connection might strengthen a little bit. Thank you.

We can still hear you even if we can't see you. It is said that the

main suspect who planned Friday's attacked in your capital is

potentially in the apartment that the police are targeting, this

Abdelhamid Abaaoud, a Belgian national of Moroccan descent who

initially authorities believed was in Syria, but it is now being

reported that he could be in an apartment building not far from

where you live. How do you respond to that? I would not be surprised.

The Saint-Denis area is known among Parisians as being a region with

most people from immigrant regions. I'm not surprised. And I suspect

that my flatmates would not be surprised too. Do you feel safe? To

be honest, I am still in a slight panic mode. My life is at a slight

risk here, although the situation is under control. It seems as though I

am in the middle of the scene. For now, I can only have faith in the

police and the army. Thank you very much for talking to us. We

appreciate your time. As you heard, Benson Hoi lives not very far from

the scene where the police still are. It's an ongoing situation. This

is what we know so far. Our correspondent can recap. We need to

divide out where these pieces of information are coming from. What we

have been told officially by prosecutors is that a woman inside

an apartment set off an explosive vest and died at the beginning of

the raid. We are also told that three men who were in the apartment

were taken out of the building by anti-terror police and have been

detained. And a man and woman were detained nearby. We are also told by

other sources, this is coming from either unnamed police sources or

from the French media, that possibly a second or third person may have

died as well. This is unconfirmed. It is also reported that at least

one person is still cut off inside the apartment. That is why the

situation is ongoing. Exactly, six hours after this started the

operation is still ongoing and it's a lot calmer on the ground. We also

hearing that police are checking in and around the apartment for

booby-traps. Presumably before they move in to make sure that it's safe

for police and the troops in that area to move in. As far is who might

be inside the apartment, who might have been inside, it is not clear.

We have heard that one of the people suspected of being inside is

Abdelhamid Abaaoud. We are told that he is the man suspected of

organising the attacks. Again that has not been confirmed and until now

it was believed that he was in Syria. Obviously they're also

thought to be other connected with these attacks in terms of logistics

and finance and arranging for weapons. So as well is the people

involved in the attack, those on the periphery. It could be that some of

those are involved in the operation as well. We are also told that

authorities now believe that there was a ninth attacker, and this was

identified through CCTV footage of one of the cars that was believed to

be used in one of the attacks. Of those attackers that died on Friday

we know that there were seven. We know that Sal Abdallah Islam is on

the run although it has not been confirmed that the man who planned

all of these attacks across Paris Abdelhamid Abaaoud may well be in

this apartment building in Saint-Denis, hence the reason why

this situation is ongoing. -- Salah Abdeslam. Police appear to have been

surprised by the ferocity of the response that they received when

they went into the apartment in the early hours of the morning. At this

stage the stand-off is ongoing. It has been going on for six hours now.

It began just after dawn this morning in the French suburb of

Saint-Denis which is where the Stade Francais is. One of the target of

the attacks last Friday where three suicide bombers blew themselves up.

An armed operation and intense gunfire heard at around 4:30am UK

time in Saint-Denis and again gunfire and a small explosion at

6:30am UK time. Police targeting suspects involved in Friday night's

terror attacks including Abdelhamid Abaaoud.

Two people have been killed including a female suicide bomber

who blew herself up. Three men in the apartment have been arrested by

anti-terrorist officers. Two people in close proximity to the building

have been arrested. Time for in close proximity to the building

main news. Two people have died and there have been five arrests during

a police operation in there have been five arrests during

targeting the mastermind of the attacks. One of those who died was a

woman who blew herself up with a suicide vest. France has been

continuing its military response to the attacks by bombing the Islamic

State stronghold of Raqqa for the third consecutive night. The parents

of a teenager who has been missing since the weekend and appealed for

her to return home. She was last seen outside her former school in

Leicestershire on Friday. Two men are being questioned by the police

in connection with her disappearance. The time is 9:31am.

We can speak to someone who lives in the district of St Denis and who was

woken by the explosions. It started at 4:30am. We were woken up by

explosions. At at 4:30am. We were woken up by

was fireworks. We realise it was gunfire, we went to the windows to

check what was going on, nobody could believe this could happen at

this time, then we realised there was an operation going on. Can you

tell us a little bit more about St Denis? It is actually outside Paris,

it is not in the capital. That is a reason why we were wondering why

there was an attack at this place. There were no people on the street

at this time. I heard people saying it was a police operation.

Instinctively, you stayed indoors? Have you communicated with the

police? We had no communication with the police. We did not know it was a

police operation. First thing we did was go to the windows, looking at

what was going on. Nobody thought about gunshots. When people started

to realise there was something serious going on, they stayed inside

and close the windows. Initially, you thought this was an attack on

where you live? Yes, just on the corner of the street, I could not

believe we were into that because it seems so far away. Knows you are

aware -- now you are aware that there are people who were possibly

involved in the attacks nearby, what do you think of that? It is scary to

know that, but they could be everywhere, it is scary for people.

Nobody is allowed to go outside, you got to stay at home, police are

patrolling in the streets, and... Presumably, friends and relatives

have got in touch to ask if you are all Kate. What are you telling them?

And telling them I'm fine, we were a little scared during the attack but

you feel safe because we were at home. We were just hoping nobody was

outside. Now just waiting for the day to return as normal. Thank you

for talking to us. This is what we know so far. Major police operation

began just after dawn this morning. A woman wearing a suicide vest blew

herself up when the police were trying to storm an apartment. Five

people have been arrested. It is believed one person is still in the

apartment. Five police have been slightly injured. The target of the

police raid are the suspected mastermind of the attacks,

Abdelhamid Abaaoud, as well as SAP SAP -- as well as Salah Abdeslam. It

is not confirmed whether these were in the apartment. Heavy shooting

began at 4:20am. It took place to climate is from the national

football stadium, roads have been. Full stops some people have been

evacuated. Let's talk to our correspondent in the centre of

Paris. Presumably, news has filtered through? Absolutely. We were here

early this morning and I was breaking this news to many people.

The initial reaction was relief that these men might have been caught,

shocked that there were so many more, but I think people have got

used to it, one man said to me, there will be others. It is very

tense here, people are on it, but try to get news to the. The

Solidarity, people said it would never hit Harris -- hit Paris again

and it has. They are relieved, but there is a sense that this might

become a grim reality for the future and the people of France. People

realising that perhaps the man behind the attacks on Friday, who we

were told was most likely in Syria, could well be just to the north of

where you are right now. Absolutely right. Abdelhamid Abaaoud is one of

the most notorious Western Jihadi John the world. He is Belgium's most

notorious. He has spent the last two years inside Syria recruiting

Belgians. Belgium has the highest proportion capita from anywhere in

Europe. It sits next to France. This part of Europe has a real problem

with extremism and people going to join Isis but the fact that these

individuals have be able to not only leave Belgium, crossed the border,

and also go to Syria, that is extraordinary and I think there will

be real questions about how this has managed to happen. He is a

well-known individual, thought to be behind the attack on the real plan.

Maybe not a question for today but if it is this individual, it is a

great catch to have found him but how embarrassing. Bearing in mind

what you've said, there is a theory that the authorities said he was in

Syria to give him a sense that they did not know where he was.

Definitely not confirmed, just a theory. That might be the case but

they could not find Salah Abdeslam and they thought he had gone to

Belgium. That might not be the case. The French authorities have

certainly got the man they wanted. The fact there were six people in

this apartment would suggest, we also heard reports this took two

hours to resolve. They were not aware of how many people might have

been in this apartment. This is in the context of raids going on

throughout France. This might just be a routine raid that turned into

them pinpointing the guy they needed. A lot of this is informed

guesswork. We will find out the facts soon enough. The fact this man

was ill matters away from centre of Paris, for these people, is not

reassuring. We will go back to the north. The latest? You can probably

see behind me some of the soldiers who are here as well as the police.

This is an extraordinary operation. The police and the military joining

in. This location is close to the stadium where there were attacks.

What has happened here, to bring you up to date, then the street behind

me where all these please fans are, they moved in on apartment and that

is well they believe the terrorist cell. There were a series of

explosions, followed by sustained gunfire for at least one hour. After

that, sporadic gunfire and explosions. The reports from the

Paris prosecutor office is one woman explosions. The reports from the

inside that flat blew herself up early on the road. But there have

been five arrests, three from inside and two outside. The operation is

continuing and we are hearing as many as five police officers might

have been injured. A police dog that was set into the flat has been

killed. It is an operation that is continuing. It has been quiet for

the last hour or so. We've not heard any more gunfire for quite some

time. We are hearing the Prime Minister and the interior minister

are here. It appears this is winding down. Who was inside, we don't know

yet. The owner has spoken to friends TV. There have been reports one of

the men they were looking for was the ringleader of the attacks on

Friday night. He is the Belgian of Moroccan origin who is thought to

have been the ringleader. Clearly if he was in that flat, or

was closely associated with any of the people inside the flat that they

have raided, that could be a very important scalp for the intelligence

services, the security services. Obviously they have been conducting

huge operations here and across France ever since the attacks on

Friday. They have been carrying out hundreds of raids at addresses and

properties at suspected Islamist extremists pretty much every night

since the attacks on Friday. They have

since the attacks on Friday. They Whether some of those other

breakthroughs led them to this address behind me in Saint-Denis we

will have to wait and see. It has certainly been a dramatic and

intense operation here. I'm just reading that France 2, a TV station,

says that DNA samples have been taken from those arrested.

says that DNA samples have been we can see and what you can see,

there is we can see and what you can see,

suggested that perhaps the operation was winding down. Do we think there

is somebody still holed up in the apartment or has that individual

been taken away? Well, there were reports, you know, on an event like

this clearly there is a lot of confusion and speculation, there

were reports that one suspect might still be at large. And possibly

holed up in there. I don't think that is probably the case because

the officers around here certainly that we have seen are a little bit

more relaxed than they were earlier in the operation. We certainly have

not heard any gunfire or explosions for quite some time. Probably what

is going on is that there is a big brands Corporation in and around the

flat where this operation took place. -- there is a big operation.

They are potentially looking for any booby-traps which may have been left

in the flat or the surrounding buildings. They want to check all of

that before opening the road. At the end of it all they seem to have got

five suspects detained and at least one woman who blew herself up

earlier in the raid. Reports of another person killed early on in

fact. Reports of three people killed altogether. We still have not got

confirmation on the number of fatalities in all of this but the

only absolute fact that we have from the prosecutor 's office is that one

woman blew herself up early on as the raid began and the police

stormed in. We are showing the audience here live pictures which

have shown in a last minute or two police tent. Now the pictures are

focusing on an ambulance and various emergency vehicles. The activity of

the officials and emergency workers is calm, composed. There is

certainly no sense of urgency, presumably they are on stand-by. In

case anything should happen. Various ambulances coming into shot. And I

think we are now going to show an image of a French police officer who

has been led away, slightly limping, hobbling away. We know that various

police officers were injured, five is the latest figure. Five police

officers have been injured this morning. Presumably the police will

be there for some time? I think they will be here all day, to be honest.

This is an area of Paris that will be closed off and locked down all

day. Hats I could show you what's going on, there is a lot of media

where we are, it is cordoned off as you would expect. Just beyond the

media there is a second Gordon, red and white tape, where the local

media there is a second Gordon, red people of Saint-Denis have come out

onto the streets and they are really pretty bewildered. -- a second

The schools and public buildings are close down the moment. Potentially

for the rest of the day as well. This is a part of Paris that has

been brought to a standstill really buy this enormous police operation.

It is an indication of how life in Paris is changing, we have the state

of emergency at the Paris is changing, we have the state

Francois Hollande has said that he wants the operation to continue for

three months. He has said that France is a country that is at war.

It is at war with terrorism, it is at war with Islamic State. That is

why it is incredible to see soldiers... I don't know if you can

see them but they are through the trees beyond the police vans.

Thereafter wrench Army soldiers still here on the streets. As part

of the operation. -- there are French Army soldiers. That is part

of the state of emergency that the president wants to last for three

months. Parisians and French people are learning that this will have to

be how they live for the time being, with the threat, Manuel Baltacha,

the Prime Minister said we will have two brace ourselves for more

attacks. Whether they were planning another attack or whether there were

people their central to the attacks on Friday which killed more than 120

people, we don't yet know. This is the kind of incident and drama and

fear that people in Paris are learning to come to terms with and

live with. For the moment, many thanks. We will be back with Ben

Brown in the suburb of Saint-Denis later. There growing moves for air

strikes in Syria, David Cameron will go to the House of Commons before

Christmas. Norman Smith is at Westminster. Is that right, before

Christmas? I think what you will find is that Mr Cameron will set out

his arguments to MPs next week, probably Thursday. Then people will

take soundings among MPs to see how the arguments have gone down. If

they take the view that there is a groundswell of support for action

then he will move quickly. Within weeks. Because he wants to have this

bowled, if you like, while the horror is still raw. And people

asked ill angry. -- this voted It is high risk country. There is no

guarantee that he will win. He lost last time and he only has a majority

of 12 and we know that there are around 30 Tory MPs who are opposed

because you need ground troops to take out Isis in Syria. It is no

good bombing from the air. That means getting troops from Muslim

countries to sign up to fight on the ground. The SNP say that we will not

support you unless you have a UN resolution which is unlikely. This

is a flavour of the opposition that he is likely to face. Getting our

aircraft employed temporal in the complicated area militarily --

embroiled in a complicated area is frankly not an issue. People want to

see the reason why the UK adding to the 12 countries already bombing in

Syria will make any material difference to the military

situation. I want to make sure that innocent people are protected and

evil people are punished and that their rain is ended. I want to do

that effectively and not in a knee jerk way which might make me feel

good for a short time. The key to whether Mr Cameron wins the vote may

lie in the hands of Jeremy Corbyn. He has signalled that he is not in

the market for pretty much any military action come what may. Mr

Cameron, if he is to win the vote, given that a number of MPs, the SNP,

and the Lib Dems are against it, he will have to win over Labour MPs. Mr

Corbyn is saying no, we don't want to support military action. And the

signs are that he is not going to give his MPs a free vote. It comes

down to this, how many Labour MPs will be willing to defy Mr Corbyn

and back David Cameron? The indications are that there could be

a sizeable number. Here is one of them, Mary Creagh. We have seen the

consequences of doing nothing in the past two years, the free Syrian army

have been all but destroyed, the terrorism that Assad has provoked

against his own people has led to Islamic State moving in. We have

seen a loose network lying themselves with them and they are

not just going to go away, they will carry on recruiting. Maiming women

and enslaving children, throwing gay men off buildings and beheading

humanitarians and journalists. It is our duty to defend our country from

them. It is a funny old world, the outcome of the vote, David

Cameron's political standing and whether we bomb may hinge Hammond

loyalty Jeremy Corbyn can command among his own MPs. The in no doubt,

this really is high stakes because if Mr Cameron loses, that is a

massive, massive political blow. More than that, it is a huge setback

potentially to our diplomatic clout in the region and quite possibly a

massive propaganda coup for Islamic State. This is high-stakes. Have a

moment, many thanks. Welcome to the programme. We are keeping you

up-to-date with developing events in the northern suburb of Paris called

Saint-Denis. Daniel Bircher is going to update you on what has been

happening since four o'clock this morning. This is six and a half

hours since this started. It is reported that this is still ongoing

and that there is at least one person still inside the apartment.

From the pictures we are seeing and reports from our correspondents on

the ground, that perhaps is not as clear as you would imagine because

things seem to be a lot calmer on the ground. We don't know whether it

is ongoing at the moment. The fact that we have from the Paris

prosecutor are that one woman inside the apartment set off an explosive

vest and died. This was at the beginning of the raid. Three men who

were in the apartment that was targeted by this operation have been

were in the apartment that was taken out of the building by

anti-terrorist and they have been detained. And that a

anti-terrorist and they have been have been stopped and detained

nearby. We are told by an unnamed police official that in fact two

people have been killed, as well as the woman who appears to

people have been killed, as well as herself up, a man has also been

killed. Again that has not been confirmed. Five police officers have

been injured although those injuries are not thought to be serious at the

moment. We are also told that police have been checking for booby traps

around that apartment, presumably before they going to try to secure

any evidence that they can find. French television is also reporting

that DNA samples are being taken from those who have been detained to

try to establish their identity is. A little bit more about the people

in the apartment that has been targeted by French armed police. --

their identities. A witness living in the apartment below the one

targeted by the parities, the man who let them live there seemed to be

in charge of a squat. And this particular witness said that three

people, two men and a woman apparently moved in very recently

and the woman he had seen around Saint-Denis. The two men he had not

seen before. The woman told him that they were from Belgium. This is

according to a witness living in the same apartment block where the

suspect were targeted this morning. Three people, two men and a woman

moved in recently and Three people, two men and a woman

the two men he had never seen before and he had spoken to the woman, she

said that they were all from and he had spoken to the woman, she

Belgium. Also in Saint-Denis the schools in the area are closed as

you would expect and we have spoken to two people living close by to the

apartment that was targeted. Those residents have obviously been asked

not to leave their homes. They were nervous, it's fair to say. Nervous

about the proximity to the police operation this morning. We have

heard from a lot of residents who witnessed this, most of them heard

what was going on rather than saw the costs they were told to stay

inside. -- because they were. There were reports of gunfire possibly

from automatic weapons, and also from explosions which some people

believed may have been grenades. At one point there was a succession of

seven explosions in a short period of time. This was clearly a large

operation, as well as the police officers, the army has also been

involved. In terms of exactly who might have been in the building, who

might have been detained, it has been reported that officials believe

that Abdelhamid Abaaoud was in the apartment. He was the man suspected

of organising the attacks in Paris. That has not been confirmed. Up

until now it had been believed all reported that he was actually in

Syria. -- or reported. There might have been a ninth attacker and that

emerged from CCTV footage, whether that person might have been one of

those inside this apartment, we don't know. There is also some new

information on Sal Al-Abbas Lamb, the suspect whose photograph was

published quite soon after the attacks. -- Salah Abdeslam. He was

on an EU wide police list when he was stopped in Austria in September

having moved from Germany to Austria. The parities say that his

presence was reported back to the Belgian authorities. That tells us

nothing about where he might be now. It does add to the pressure on the

French authorities to explain why this plot was not picked up, why it

was not stopped. This is being reported on French television,

France 2. The members of the terror cell that was raided in

France 2. The members of the terror the northern suburb of Paris, where

planning a new attack against Place de la Defence. That is the business

district. I am just reading about this. The police moved into

Saint-Denis because of a planned attack on the business district of

Paris. Being reminded that a French soldier

was stabbed and survived. Good morning. A tense stand-off continues

in the St Denis area of Paris. The police have said two people have

been killed in a major stand-off with the suspect said to have

planned Friday's attacks. Reports are that one of the people who

killed themselves up was a woman with a suicide vest. Five police

officers have been injured. Still in panic mode. My life is at risk here,

even though the situation is control. I'm live in central Paris,

gauging the reaction to the news that the mastermind might have been

caught. It has been reported two people have died and have been five

arrests during a police operation in Paris thought to be targeting the

mastermind of the attacks. The police said one of those who died

was a woman who blew herself up with a suicide vest. It is believed that

one person is still holed up in an apartment. The police raid began in

the early hours of the morning to the north of Paris. These two plays

in the same district where the Stata -- where the stadium is. The focus

is this man. He is the alleged planner behind the attacks.

Intelligence reports suggested Abdelhamid Abaaoud coordinated the

attacks from Syria but he is now believed to be one of the people who

was in the apartment. France has been bombing the Islamic State

stronghold of Raqqa for the third consecutive night. Russian

long-range missiles also hit the city. Going back to the centre of

Paris. What is the reaction of people they are to the events of the

morning? People are relieved, this individual might have been

apprehended. I spent the morning talking to people who'd been laying

their tributes. It has become the focal point. There is a sense of

relief but also a sense of worry. Worry that this man and his

associates might have been on the outskirts of Paris, and also that

this is not the last, necessarily, of these sorts of attacks in Paris.

The sense was, never again. It has happened again and it has happened

even worse this time. People are getting used to a new world. The

tension has been very high and I don't think this operation, even

though it will reassure people, I don't think anything will really

change in the long run. This is what we know so far. A major police

operation has been going on since early this morning. A woman blew

herself up with a suicide vest when police tried to storm an apartment.

Five people have been arrested. It is believed one person is still in

the apartment. Not confirmed. The ports are confusing at the moment,

which is understandable. The targets of the raid... It was Abdelhamid

Abaaoud, Salah Abdeslam and an unnamed third person. The police

have said they believe Salah Abdeslam was in the apartment with

five other heavily armed people and offices were met with violent heavy

resistance. Five of them have been slightly injured. Heavy shooting

began at 4:20am, local time. It took place near the stadium. Roads have

been closed off. Residents have been told to stay away from there in

the. In the past few minutes, French media are reporting that the

terrorist suspects were a team planning a new terrorist attack in

Paris's business district. We can talk now to another person with at

flat in this part of town. How are you feeling? I don't really know.

flat in this part of town. How are What did you hear? I saw lots of

people talking about Saint Denis. I opened my Windows, I heard

explosions, 50 shots, helicopter I just put on my TV and I saw it had

been just next to my house. How far away is your flat from the gunfire?

Two minutes. The police take us to one side, they tell us to close our

windows and doors and feel safe. Do you feel safe? Not really. Is there

is nothing you can do except wait for this authority is. British

audience might not know much about the place where you live, can you

tell us about it? I have never seen cops like this, helicopter, never

seen that. Thank you very much for talking to us. Let's read with our

reporter in the centre of Paris. Probably worth going over what has

happened this morning. At 4:30am, a police operation began in a suburb

of Paris. It is a suburb in which the national stadium is located.

They targeted an apartment where it was believed fugitives had

barricaded themselves. We now understand there were six people in

that apartment, reports of explosions, sustained gunfire. The

police and the Armed Forces are on the streets as we speak. The gunfire

has subsided. We believe one man has either escaped or is still inside.

We are not sure. Two people killed including a woman who set a suicide

vest off. There have been injuries on the police side, including the

death of a police dog. We understand there have been some arrests as

well. And as you can understand, it is a situation that is moving

quickly. News has dropped that these individuals were planning another

terrorist attack in the city, this time in the business district. It

would have hit commercial interests and been a devastating attack. These

are the facts as we have them. People are coming to terms with the

fact that this is their new reality. And news channel is saying in this

particular flat there were six people. I woman blew herself up,

another man was killed by snipers, three were arrested and another one

was not accounted for. The body is sure at this stage if this person is

still in the flat or has escaped. Let's talk to a reporter at the

scene. You've been speaking to many people, what do they say to you? I

came here early in the morning, around 6:30am. We heard an explosion

and probably we think it is the woman who blew herself up. We spoke

to people living close by, soldiers came to their houses and told them

what was happening, handwritten papers everywhere saying there was

an operation. The situation was really tense. You saw soldiers on

this street. It is still going on. In terms of what you know about who

might still be in that flat, what are you getting? Is different

information. We don't know if the mastermind is still alive, if he is

inside the house or not. We are waiting for information. What is

confirmed is that five people are arrested, three of them were inside

the flat. We don't know if this terrorist is still inside. Some

media are reporting they were planning a new attack on the

business district of Paris. We heard this. It is a big discussion going

on. The police and the military don't give us further information on

that. They just say that it is going on, we cannot give you more detail

because of security concerns. I think we've got to wait, and check

the information. You can see behind me some of the

soldiers who are here as well as the police. This is an extraordinary

operation. Police and the military joining in this operation here in

the streets of Paris in this suburb, Saint-Denis, in the north of Paris,

close to the Stade de France. Where there were attacks on Friday night

at the Stade de France and nearby. What has happened here, just to

bring you up-to-date, at What has happened here, just to

local time, down that street behind me where the police vans are, police

moved in on an apartment where they believe there was a terror cell or

certainly suspects involved in the Friday night attacks. There was a

series of explosions followed by sustained gunfire for at least an

hour. Then continuously after that sporadic gunfire and explosions as

well. It had been going on for hours. Reports and confirmation from

the Paris prosecutor 's office is that one woman inside the flat blew

herself up earlier in the raid. There may have been another fatality

as well. Also according to the Paris prosecutor, five arrests, three men

inside and a man and a woman outside were arrested. The operation is

continuing and as many as five officers involved in the raid may

have been injured and a police dog has been killed. It's an operation

that is still continuing and it has not been... I have to say it has

been quiet for the past hour. We have not heard any more gunfire or

explosions for quite some time. We are also hearing that the Prime

Minister and interior Minister are here. It appears that this is an

operation that is winding down and they have been checking for

booby-trap devices in and around the flat that was involved in the police

raid. Who exactly was involved inside the flat, we don't yet know.

We have heard from the owner who has spoken to French television saying

that he was asked by a friend to let a few people, let a couple of people

stay in the flat for a few days. As more police vehicles come here

behind me, there have been some reports that one of the men they

were looking for was the ringleader of the attacks on Friday night,

27-year-old Abdelhamid Abaaoud. He is the Belgian of Moroccan origin

who is thought to have been the ringleader, the mastermind, the key

architect of the attacks on Friday night that killed 129 people. If he

was in the flat or was closely associated with any people in the

flat that they have raided, then that could be a very important scalp

for the intelligence services and security services. They have

obviously been conducting huge operations here across France ever

since the attacks on Friday night. They have been carrying out hundreds

of raids at addresses and properties of suspected Islamist extremists,

pretty much every night since the attacks on Friday. They have made

other breakthroughs. Whether some of those breakthroughs did lead them to

this address down this road behind me in Saint-Denis we will have to

wait and see. It has been a dramatic and intense operation here,

Victoria. This is being reported by the Associated Press, seven people

have now been arrested in raids in Saint-Denis. In case you are just

tuning in, a woman wearing an explosive suicide vest blew herself

up as police tried to storm a suburban Paris apartment where the

suspected organiser of the attacks was believed to be holed up. One man

was also killed and five people arrested and it is still continuing.

It is not clear whether one person remains inside the apartment

building in Saint-Denis. It is unclear at the moment. A senior

police official says that he believes the person who was behind

the attacks Abdelhamid Abaaoud, a Belgian Islamic State militant, was

inside the apartment but it has not been confirmed. What has been

confirmed is that police have now arrested seven people linked to the

attacks on Friday. A couple of messages from you as you are

watching and listening to us. This text from Bernie says, the people

are not broken or scared, they are determined to carry on. I am on tour

managing a band from San Francisco who played the first gig since the

attack. The place was full. Bob on Twitter says the UK should do the

same, raid sympathisers' homes, it is time to stop dithering. Let's go

back to Paris and James Longman is there in the centre. Yes, as I said

earlier we have been gauging reaction to locals here, to a

fraught few days and obviously these developments this morning. Joining

me now is Judith, she is British but lives in Paris. Thank you for

joining us. What is it like in Paris at the moment? It's very quiet.

People are walking more slowly than usual, and you can see that people

are really thinking more deeply than they usually do. If you have any

kind of human feeling at all you can feel that people are in pain and

asking questions. Quite a few people have lost loved ones or people who

have had near is Gates, and it is something about the French, they are

resistant but they do show emotions. --

resistant but they do show emotions. can't help but be touched. Have you

had friends affected by what happened on Friday? I had friends

and family that could have been involved but they left the area

before it happened. I am involved in a local Democratic People's Council

just up the road. They told me that somebody from the area where I live,

the neighbouring area, was killed, even though I did not know the

person. You still look at people's faces on the Metro and you can tell

that someone was affected. It is a lot of sorrow. They will get over

it. I wanted to say thank you to the Brits for last night because I know

that the French were really Brits for last night because I know

by the Marseillaise at Wembley and the show of solidarity. I know as a

British person that all of this stuff about the British not liking

the French and vice versa, that is not true and there is a lot of

sympathy underneath. Can you tell me about Friday about where

sympathy underneath. Can you tell me and what was going through your

mind? Yes. It is quite specific because I was at a prayer meeting

with friends in the 93 department which is unfortunately where a lot

of action is happening at the moment, but not in that sector. I

live about a mile up the road, as I said, in the neighbouring area to

where this happened. I did not know anything about it and I got the text

from a friend at the same prayer meeting saying, are you all right?

She said, turn on the telly. I don't have a telly but I turned on the

computer. It was surreal. People started me sending messages on

Facebook wanting to know what was happening. We have all been told to

stay inside. Then I added, this is not a joke. Obviously pray for

Paris, that is one of the slogans that even people of no faith have

put on their Facebook pages. There was an operation in Saint-Denis,

what is your reaction? I'm not at also prized. I think most people are

not either. -- I am not at all surprised. I'm determined to carry

on with my life and if I had a paintbrush I would go and write on

that statue that God is not like that. These people have a very

twisted idea of spirituality, and we have two showed the difference, God

is not like that. This morning we understand that the mastermind has

been apprehended, that may be the case. Does it make you feel safer?

Yes and no. I have my own views on wife and I don't feel intimidated in

that sense. -- views on life. I am glad that they have found him

because that is one more person being put away who could mastermind

things that may really trouble other people but I have to say that I know

it is a very sensitive subject but I do think the French authorities

could do more, and I do believe that the president and other people

involved realise that. I do think that people won't feel safe as long

as they know that people are allowed to roam around. Who have been

noticed as being terrorists but they are allowed to go around the country

even though they have committed terrorist acts. I do not think

anyone will feel safe, and that is not a political statement, that is

just how everyone feels and the political parties are beginning to

realise that they have to act for people who have already been

identified. You are British but you are also French, which country would

you be safer in? That's a very interesting question. At the moment

possibly the UK, possibly the UK. But I don't think that is always the

case and it really depends on the news and what is going on and what

these people get into their heads about who their enemies are. They

just want to hurt as many people as possible and they choose the target

which will create the most media buzz. Being British but being French

also, you can kind of understand the differences between the sense of

proud history of freedom in France, and do you think that will change

and will there be something around the balance between security and

liberty and will that outweigh that and change in France in the future?

It depends on what you mean by liberty. We do say in France that my

liberty stops where yours starts. There is also the liberty of the

victims to walk around and be free. And not to be in fear and not be

killed because they happened to go to a concert or a cafe. It depends

what you mean by liberty, it is not just liberty to kill people and

introduced a reign of terror, you have to be careful in how you define

liberty because we should not be free to kill. Somebody wrote that

you should not kill, on the statue, behind there. It depends what you

mean by that. It is a complicated situation, the French still reeling

from the attacks on Friday. Judith anyway seems upbeat about the future

for the country that she now calls home. Thank you, James. We are now

going to show you pictures of what looks like a naked man being removed

from the scene in Saint-Denis. They are about an hour old, some of you

spotted this earlier. When we were showing it to you live. At the back

of the right gazebo you might be able to see the legs of a naked man.

We have no idea if he is a suspect or if he happened to be in the

building and he was stripped for safety reasons. He is at the back of

the tent being escorted away by armed police. Those pictures are

about an hour old but we have no information on who the individual

is. I should tell you that regarding the conversation that James was

having with Judith a moment ago and whether or not the man who planned

the attacks on Friday Abdelhamid Abaaoud, whether he was

apprehended, we cannot say for sure either way. One TV channel, BFM is

saying that there were six people in the flat, one was shot by snipers.

No one is clear on whether there is still an individual in the flat. It

is a fast-moving situation with lots of disparate pieces of information,

some of them are unconfirmed. This is what we know, and major police

operation has been going on in Saint-Denis since the early hours of

the morning. A woman wearing a suicide vest blew herself up when

heavily armed police tried to storm an apartment.

Police say that another man was killed and seven people arrested. It

is thought one person is still holed up in the apartment. The targets of

the raid, the suspects behind those attacks on Friday night, in

particular 27-year-old Abdelhamid Abaaoud, as well as Salah Abdeslam,

as well as a ninth attack afford to be involved in the attacks on Friday

night. A senior police offers has told a news agency that he believes

that Abdelhamid Abaaoud, a Belgian Islamic State militant, was inside

the apartment with five other heavily armed people and that

officers were met with violent resistance when they stormed the

building. Five police officers were slightly injured and one police dog

was killed. Heavy shooting including automatic gunfire and explosions

began at 4:20am local time. The raid took place two calamitous from the

Stade Francais, one of the targets of Friday's attacks. Roads were

closed off. Residents were told to stay away from windows and some have

been moved to a temporary shelter in the town hall. Public transport has

been suspended and schools closed. In the past few minutes French media

have reported that the suspected terrorists in the apartment in

Saint-Denis were a team" planning a new terrorist attack in Paris's

ladder -- business district". Let's talk to a journalist based in

Germany. He is on the scene. Phil us in with the latest.

This Ten minutes ago we heard what sounded like another explosion, we

got here at 530 with the first news crew, there was sporadic gunfire.

They narrowed down to a small street which was where the explosions came

from, then after that, they were searching from street to street.

There may be at least one person and accounted

There may be at least one person and over. Is that your impression? Yes.

After the explosion over. Is that your impression? Yes.

dying down of tension. Then there was armed

dying down of tension. Then there the streets. Make sure the streets

were secure. From the information you're trying to gather, does it

mean nobody is left in that apartment building? That is what

mean nobody is left in that team on the ground saw.

mean nobody is left in that evidence gatherers turn up with

cameras and forensics teams. The police taking off their helmets. It

seemed as if the operation was over. So the last explosion you heard was

when? We are not quite sure. There was something that sounded like an

explosion in 15 minutes ago but it might just be the police making sure

it was completely secure. We might just be the police making sure

get right up to the scene of might just be the police making sure

suspects were. Thank you very might just be the police making sure

John. Have you heard this? It is what we are hearing as well and I

think effectively it has been over for a while. It has certainly been

very quiet for some time. Initially, there were those huge explosions,

sustained gunfire, then, really, we have not heard anything like that.

At the end of it all, what we do know for sure, the street where it

happened is just know for sure, the street where it

these bands. This woman inside the flat blew herself up and another

gunman inside the flat was flat blew herself up and another

and French media are reporting he was killed by a police sniper and

there were three others arrested from the flat after this gun battle.

there were three others arrested The whereabouts of a sick person was

unknown but then another person was led away. Two others were arrested

outside. We are hearing there have been some casualties. Five officers

injured and a police dog, a 7 -year-old dog was killed, having

been sent into that flat. It has been a dramatic day, it began just

after 4am. This area is a very ethnically mixed area. Very

cosmopolitan and just down the road from the football stadium which was

the scene of one of the attacks. It has been a very dramatic morning but

it looks like finally the operation is dying down. We have heard that

the Prime Minister and the interior minister are here, looking at the

police work. What we need to know is if the man who planned the attacks

is in custody or dead. Yes, that is one of the key questions. It was

reported he was one of the targets of this raid. We don't even know if

he was in the flat. Obviously, if he was and they have killed or captured

him, that is potentially a big scalp. He is reported to have been

the mastermind behind the attacks on Friday night. This man, originally

from Morocco, has lived in Brussels, a radical. An organiser within. He

had posted before about how he's managed to slip away from a previous

raid. We don't know whether he was in the flat down the street behind

me. We know there are reports this was a terrorist cell that was

planning another operation in Paris, another atrocity on top of what we

saw on Friday night. We will bring you the latest news headlines. There

are reports the armed police raid is over. Two people are thought to have

died including a woman who blew herself up. Seven arrests were made

and several police officers injured. The suspected terrorists in the

apartment were planning a new attack, it is being reported. The

raid began in the early hours, to the north of Paris. Heavy gunfire

and explosions were heard. This all took place in an apartment in the

same district as the stadium. The focus is believed to have been this

man, Abdelhamid Abaaoud. But. Initial reports suggested he had

coordinated the attacks from Syria but it is now thought he could be

one of the people who were in the apartment. France has continued its

military response to the attacks by bombing the Islamic state stronghold

of Raqqa for the third consecutive night. We are staying with the

breaking news. We will keep you up-to-date. Now we are going to talk

to two British survivors from the Bataclan Theatre. They have not told

their story publicly but they got in touch with us yesterday following

our interview yesterday. Thomas yesterday told us he saw people

covered in blood and the attackers still shooting. We saw people

covered in blood, they were still shooting. I believe it was 15

minutes I stayed down for, I don't really know. They continuously shot

at us. Some people said they were going upstairs, I thought they would

be shooting us from above and we will die. That was the only moment I

lifted my head up, there was nobody. That saved my life. I tried

to run. There were a lot of bodies. Fight had made my move earlier I

would be dead. If it had been later, I would be dead. There were injured

people outside as well. I just ran. I know that many of you will

remember him for this. You can find the interview on our

programme page. Just Dean and Tony were in the balcony of the

Bataclan. -- just. I know that you were watching Thomas yesterday, what

were you thinking? We had a similar feeling of compassion and love for

people. It really came across to us. It was exactly how we felt. There is

a lot of heat being thrown about -- anger, and we do not feel any of

it. We have been through a traumatic experience and we are incredibly

lucky to be alive, and not only that, we were up on the balcony, we

did not... It was terrifying. We had been down on the floor, I cannot

imagine what it was like. We were together, on the balcony, we did not

get separated and we got out before the gun men came up to the balcony.

We were really lucky. We saw the worst of humanity and also the very

best. People were doing selfless, courageous things, the guys who had

broken the skylight open could have got out themselves but they waited.

Tell our audience what you did, because you were on that balcony. We

go to a lot of gigs, we met at a rock concert, we quite often go down

the front, but we got there late, it was sold out, lots of people, we

thought we would go to the balcony. These little decisions seem

insignificant, they were the difference between life and death.

What did you do when you heard the gunshots? I thought it was part of

the show. Then it became clear it was part of the show. Then we fell

to the floor. We had bind the seats. We lay there for what felt an

eternity, probably about five minutes. The shots kept coming. The

lights had gone on. You would hear silence while they were reloading. I

remember saying, keep down. I said, we've got to get out, I knew that

they were going out systematically shooting people. There was an

excellent behind us but it led back down to the main hall. Did not want

to go that way. I saw that there was annexed it, if we crawled toward the

stage. We were crawling along on our bellies. There were gaps between the

rows of seats so we were exposed as we went through them. We had no

idea, we had seen the gun men in front of us, a report said they were

up on the balcony as well and we did not realise that. Probably just as

well. There was that fear, having to get from where we were heading to

being exposed to where we were ahead and again. When you got through the

door, what happened next? S it was a stairwell, there are quite a few of

us, they were barricading it. They had pulled down a great, their words

three blokes hoisting people up. It was quite high up. Tony had to jump.

I am going to pause and be right back with you, we are going to

Paris, where a government press conference is to be held. The

project reinforces the efficacy of the police, and the serious reasons

that exist about the behaviour that constitute a threat to the public

order. House arrest conditions are defined by the Dutch police -- by

the French police. Any person under house arrest cannot go to any place

where it is thought they might be carrying out attacks against

citizens. This should not be carried out without a Parliamentary warrant

or the activities of the magistrates. The prosecutor of the

Republic will be informed about all searches and warrants and raids. As

well as the judiciary police. They will be informed about all of the

elements that have been found, bodies, computers, and data taken

from any house will be relayed to the appropriate authorities. Any

person who facilitates or participates in any operation that

threatens the public order, and we will target people who we will put

under house arrest. The control of the press. As stipulated by the law

of 1905. It has been cancelled. The research of people under house

arrest will be enforced and this is what the Prime Minister presented to

the Council of ministers. As I said, this law will be discussed by the

commissions and by experts in charge of the debate and the debate will

take place in the National Assembly tomorrow and the Senate on Friday.

The Prime Minister, interior Minister, and the overseas

ministers... Declared a state of emergency from the 19th of November

20 15. In quad loop, Guy an, Martin eat, reunion, Mayotte and Saint

Martin. -- Martin This is within the framework of the

presentation of ministers, and some important degrees were discussed

about the overseas Territories. Another point was raised about the

international situation, especially about the solidarity shown by the

G20 countries, clearly expressed during the G20 summit and also the

fight against terrorism. That is a French government spokesman

confirming that the raid in the north of Paris is over. And talking

about various other things to do with the state of emergency in

France. Let's continue the conversation with Tony Scott and

Justine Merton, British survivors from the Bataclan attack on Friday

night. You were just describing that effectively you escaped through a

skylight. Yes, we got out onto the roof... People were being ushered

towards an apartment, like a rooftop apartment, we weren't exactly sure

where it was. We worked it out in retrospect, but we were ushered up

there and it was somebody who live there, just getting people in

through the window. He was welcoming you in? He did know -- he did not

know what was happening, he could have just sat there and hidden but

he was getting people in. Everybody was just in there. And I think the

lights went off at one point and we were just in darkness but we could

still hear gunfire. It was like bursts of gunfire. We still did not

know whether we were safe. It was like coming up... We were sat in

their and what is going through your head is, if that was our way out,

what happens if the gunmen get cornered? Is that their way out too?

Even though we were away from it all, we were still in the building.

But still fearing that we could get found. How many people were in the

apartment on the rooftop? 20 or 30 people. Mostly French people? We

were the only British people. There was a nice guy, I can't remember his

name, he was translating, because we did not know what was going on. We

do not speak French. He was telling us what was happening. We had a

period of it being quiet and you start to relax a little bit. And

there was more gunfire. And then we heard explosions and there was three

explosions. The whole building shook. Going through our head was

whether the building was going to collapse as well. I want to

introduce you to two whether people in the Bataclan. It is David and his

Beyonce who are joining us from France. Thank you very much. -- his

fiancee. I don't know if you heard much of what we were saying, but

David, tell us your story. Just before the gunman opened fire you

were uploading video showing the concert and the atmosphere. Yes,

that's it. We were just making a short film to show people on social

media how the concert was going and it was great. Yes, there was joy and

people were singing. It was great. Tell us what happened next. The show

was going on, I think maybe the singer introduced a new song and

then we heard a little explosion like a firework. We did not

realise... We saw some small whites as well but we did not realise what

was going on really. -- small lights. It was maybe ten seconds,

after the shot began. When we realised that it was not fireworks

or lights, it was really people with guns that were shooting people. We

heard screams and most people collapsed on the ground. Immediately

we got on the ground. I told my fiance not to move. We knew that it

was very bad, what was happening. And I think, David, you were

actually shot in the back and the leg, is that correct? It was in my

hip and in the elbow. Are you OK? I'm OK, yes, because I am very

lucky. I can't find the words. I did not feel really bad when it

happened, I just realised after we had run away. With the

happened, I just realised after we all of the staff. Yes, I

happened, I just realised after we but I did not feel anything,

hopefully I did not have any bones broken, you now, nerve damage. --

you know. The only thing I was thinking was about

you know. The only thing I was survive. The first thought was, we

are going to die anyway. The terrorists did not want to leave any

survivors. It was awful. We were thinking that it had stopped. We

thought there would be a negotiation with policeman but that was not

their purpose. Their purpose was to kill people. As much as they can.

What do you think of the police kill people. As much as they can.

that has been going on in Saint-Denis this morning?

that has been going on in repeat the question?

that has been going on in operation going on in Saint-Denis

this morning, what do you think of that? I am happy that they are doing

something to try to get all of the people that were involved in all of

this stuff, but I hope and I think it is one of the parts of the

reseau. We know anyway that too many people have died and to many people

have been hurt. It's enough. Yes. We know that there will be

have been hurt. It's enough. Yes. We don't know the word. Another attack.

Thank you for joining us. Justine and Tony, thank you very much for

talking to us about what happened to you. Thank you. We want to bring you

some of the images from the raids in Saint-Denis, the northern suburb of

Paris Saint-Denis, the northern suburb of

now say is over. These pictures show what are believed to be suspects

being arrested and led away from the apartment in Saint-Denis. The video

was captured by a TV crew and just underneath the roof of the white

tent you might have been able to see the legs of a naked man, a naked man

in Frank Kearse being led away by armed officers. This particular

photo shows a man who appears to be naked from the waist down with a

bloodied bandage on his hip. I don't know if you can just see that. He is

either in handcuffs are his -- or his hands are being held by police

officers. Thank you for joining us. Stay with

officers. Thank you for joining us. day. We are back tomorrow at 9:15am.

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