The People's Painting: A Mural for Glasgow


The People's Painting: A Mural for Glasgow

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As Glasgow prepares to host this summer's Commonwealth Games,

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two artists are setting out to create a legacy

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which will last long beyond the sporting events.

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It's not just us stamping our identity on an area,

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it's taking a little bit of everyone

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to create something hopefully beautiful.

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In a city which has a long tradition of public murals,

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the artists are planning a large-scale wall painting

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with a difference,

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one which reflects what Glasgow means to the people who live here.

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We wanted it to be a collaboration between us and the city.

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Michelangelo has came to the East End of Glasgow.

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We're very delighted.

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Just beyond Glasgow's famous Barrowlands

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and home to an equally famous football ground,

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the area of Parkhead in Glasgow's East End

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is where many of the Commonwealth Games venues are situated.

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But it's also where artists Louise Chappell and Becky Bolton

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are going to create their wall painting.

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Today, they've come to the corner of Beattock and Crail Street

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to look at the gable end site for the mural for the first time.

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Maybe it's a lot bigger than we expect

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-and we'll be suitably surprised!

-I don't know what I'm hoping for!

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-OK, oh!

-Oh, there?

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-There it is.

-OK! I think that's doable.

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-Yeah, that's totally fine.

-Yeah.

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So we've been told that we can do whatever we want with this wall

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but the fact that it already has this, sort of, red line

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that then echoes in all the surrounding buildings...

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I think we'd probably use that as an architectural element.

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Do you think? Yeah, I think it gives us a really good

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-natural proportion.

-We want this to fit in with what's around it.

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-We don't want it to become this new blank canvas.

-It doesn't need to jar.

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-It's already part of...

-It needs to be an enhancement of the existing...

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-Yeah.

-..space.

-Yeah.

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I guess the weather might be an issue

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-for an outdoor painting in Glasgow for a month.

-"Might!"

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I mean, it is June.

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If it's, like, really solid rain for a couple of days, what can we do?

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-Cry.

-Cry!

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I think we have enough stamina.

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-I think so, too.

-We've been in training.

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Louise and Becky met

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when they were studying painting at Glasgow School of Art

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and for the last seven years have been working together

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as Good Wives and Warriors.

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Their projects span both the commercial

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and fine art worlds...

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from magazine illustrations

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to brand logos,

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restaurant interiors

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to large-scale art installations around the world.

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But it's the city of Glasgow that's inspired this latest project.

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Glasgow's got a real history of knocking down and rebuilding

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and regenerating.

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And I think that murals and gable ends

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can be really important in that,

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because they do lift the spirit of an area,

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making something more beautiful.

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The three-storey wall painting in the East End

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will be the first time Good Wives and Warriors have tackled

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a large-scale public mural.

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But they're planning to get a little help

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from the people of Parkhead.

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This painting is called the People's Painting

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and that idea...

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Well, it comes from the People's Palace,

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which is one of our favourite museums in Glasgow.

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It's not just us stamping our identity on an area.

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It's taking a little of everyone

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to create something hopefully beautiful.

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We wanted it to be a collaboration between us and the city.

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Louise and Becky have put up posters across the East End

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asking for people to send them ideas.

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But they're also out and about to find out first-hand

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what locals would like to see on the wall.

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I'm going to take a picture with the clootie dumplings sign.

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Is there anything...an object that you think might...?

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Well, I think the object just burned there, yesterday.

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So you'd say the art school?

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I would say the art school was a big, big, massive feature.

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Charles Rennie Mackintosh, anything along those lines.

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Let's go and have a look in here.

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-At least it's a bit more rummagey.

-Yeah.

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Oh, look at the old sketches.

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We are looking for any antiques or objects

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-that are particularly from Glasgow.

-This is Glasgow Bell.

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-Was Glasgow Bell a pottery...?

-Yes, pottery.

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And they closed about 1900.

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The details in them are so unusual.

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-Yes, it's quite modern, isn't it?

-Yeah.

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The Glasgow Bell.

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-Some nice tree.

-A tree.

-Maybe a big pigeon.

-Oh, big pigeons!

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We can definitely put some pigeons in it.

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Yeah, that's good.

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Well, the spirit of Glasgow, the spirit of this end of the city

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is dookits, you call them - pigeon huts.

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-You see all the pigeon huts about the East End.

-Uh-huh!

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I've done it since I was 14 years old.

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Back in their studio, Louise and Becky sift through

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all the ideas they've received

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and work out how they're going to combine them.

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Bream? I think it was maybe bream or trout

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going into a pigeon. So those little claws.

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Here's some others. So we're trying to do the different versions of...

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pigeon wings, fish tail...

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This one's maybe a bit weird

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fish head, pigeon bottom.

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The two animals people kept referring to

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were the doos and the fish.

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And then to have them coming down the painting,

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changing from one to the other.

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We tried to speak to as many people as possible,

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to kind of get everyone's individual idea

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of what the spirit of Glasgow was and what it meant to them.

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So we're really trying to use our magpie approach

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to collect as many images as possible.

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It would be great in the end if people can point and say,

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-"That's mine."

-"That's my bit."

-Yeah.

-That's what we want.

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While Good Wives and Warriors

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put the finishing touches to their grand design

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for the 9x8 metre mural,

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back on site, the scaffolding goes up

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and the wall is whitewashed, ready for work to begin.

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Although the mural will be predominantly black and white,

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Becky's called on some local help to create a green wash in the centre

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to represent the hills of Glasgow.

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But they're not having much luck with the weather.

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I think we're just going to stop.

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Cos we're quite worried that all the paint is just...

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being washed off the wall!

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We might just give up for today.

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Oh, yeah look at it!

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Looks amazing though, doesn't it?!

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Fortunately the sun is shining when Louise arrives to join Becky

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and start on the intricate design work,

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which is just as well

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as they have under three weeks to complete the mural.

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-The streets are going to start down here.

-Yeah,

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-I drew in the triangles already.

-Amazing.

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Louise is starting at the very centre of the wall,

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giving pride of place to the doos and dookits

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suggested by so many local people.

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In Parkhead, collecting, breeding and flying pigeons

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is a long-held tradition

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and the area has the highest concentration

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of man-made huts, or dookits, in the city.

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MAN IMITATES PIGEONS

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-Come on, hen.

-HE COOS AGAIN

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I was still in my primary school when I started the pigeons.

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You just watched the old men flying pigeons

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and you went to dog school

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and watch the pigeons getting caught and all that.

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And ever since then... You build your hut

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and that's me for 40 years now, 50 years.

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And now I'm the older guy!

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So the other kids come round and watch us flying them, now.

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And hopefully they learn off you and carry it on and carry it on.

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It's not racing pigeons,

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they're pouters, what they call pouters.

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Basically they're bred for, just, sport.

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They're just to go out and basically they've got to

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go and steal another pigeon back off the other guy

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and he's put his pigeon out to steal mine.

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And it's whatever one's got the most brains,

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whatever's cleverer than the other one.

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And hopefully it's yours that's the clever one, you know?

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If a doo likes a hen, he'll come back with her.

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And vice versa, if a hen likes a doo,

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she'll go back with him.

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You're hoping to catch as many as you can catch.

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If you've got six pair,

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you'll put your six pair out.

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And you're hoping every one can do the business and catch.

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But again, you could maybe lose two or three

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and it sets you back to the drawing board again.

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You've got to get another hen and another doo

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and start all over again with that pigeon.

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On the wall, the artists have created

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a long line of the iconic dookits

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and pigeons feature prominently throughout the design.

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This pigeon, we were just wondering

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-what it should be carrying in its feet and...

-A teacake!

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..and as I wanted to eat a teacake, Louise has put a teacake in it.

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Now I can have the real object to draw from.

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But I'm going to eat it so you just get the wrapper.

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Underneath the dookits, Louise is painting a line

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of Parkhead's most striking buildings

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from the Congregational Church to the White and Bluevale flats

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and the public wash house or steamie,

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another Parkhead institution

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mentioned by many of the older residents.

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The artists have also chosen to represent the steamie

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with clouds of steam which fill up the mural

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and rain down on the city.

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Four days in

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and the artists have climbed to the very top of the scaffolding

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to add another East End landmark.

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It's a surprisingly beautiful day here in Glasgow

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so we wanted to come up here to the top level of the scaffolding

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to get some sun

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but also to finish painting the...

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What are you painting?

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The Tolbooth clock tower,

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which was one of the first things mentioned to us by Rico

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at the Val D'Oro.

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# More

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# Much more than this

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# I did it my way... #

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Glasgow means everything to me, obviously.

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Because it's given us life, it's given us our livelihood.

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-If I had to pick one thing that really moves me...

-Means Glasgow.

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-Yes.

-..the Tolbooth clock.

-Thank you.

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You know, I've lived with it all my life.

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And to me,

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coming down London Road, Glasgow Cross,

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the old mercat cross,

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I learn more about life than anywhere else in the whole world.

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-Aw-w, thank you.

-Perfect.

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And the artists have placed the Tolbooth steeple

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in prime position at the summit of their painted Glasgow skyline.

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It's also one of the few sections of the mural

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where they've added a splash of colour.

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We're painting this trompe l'oeil archway just now

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which is going to be a fairly flat, three-colour blue sky.

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And it was inspired by the mural we went to see at the Gallowgate.

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And it's a mural that both me and Beck have loved for years.

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But it's this really very simple painting of a trompe l'oeil archway

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looking to the city beyond.

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Just the simplicity. The four colours.

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It is, it's really optimistic.

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It's a beautiful painting.

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I think with the blue, that idea of going straight into the sky

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is something you should use in our painting, too.

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-Yeah, and the strong, structural element.

-Yeah, the 3D.

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Something architectural and recognisable.

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So we really wanted to reference that in this painting

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and we wanted to paint an optimistic blue sky

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for all the grey days in Glasgow.

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So we're lucky - blue sky today!

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For Louise and Becky, half the fun is finding playful ways

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to link all the ideas they've been given.

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At the moment I'm painting...

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this is the top of the sort of "stuff" triangle

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and we're just getting a few more of the elements

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that people have mentioned to us, while we can, in this area.

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So some of the older people we talked to

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were mentioning jeely pieces. They're like jam sandwiches.

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So here we have...I've done this

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as the knight from the Glasgow coat of arms.

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So he's eating the jeely pieces.

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So it's just a little sort of fun thing going on, here.

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And then this is one of the wallies,

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which is the hot water bottles.

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and they were made in a factory near here

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that someone was mentioning.

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But the whole idea of this area with the things on the chains

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was because of the guy Tam that we met on the high street, there.

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-Could I interest you in some of my products...

-What have you got?!

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-What's in here?!

-..out of my Glasgow shop?

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-I've got lovely nylons.

-Uh-huh.

-One and threepence.

-Wow.

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-Bargain.

-And if you need the line painted on,

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I'll paint the line for you.

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-Excellent.

-We've got lovely watches.

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-Oh, yeah?

-Take your pick. Beautiful.

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-Oh, my God, that's a big one.

-That's an amazing one.

-Lovely.

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That's the biggest watch I've ever seen.

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That's what they all say. Wait till you see my clock!

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-This is incredible!

-And they call it a no for sale shop.

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"Much is that?" "It's no for sale."

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-"Much is that?"

-Lots not for sale?

-Tam doesnae sell anything.

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I just keep the stuff that I like cos it's hard to get this stuff.

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I really like what Tam's doing here.

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He's kind of creating a museum of Glasgow

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but in a really immediate way,

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like, a granny's living room museum.

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Just like in Tam's shop,

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there's a rich history of Glasgow emerging on this wall,

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if you care to spend time looking.

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The artists' magpie approach means they've found a place for everything

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from caramel wafers and Mother's Pride bread

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to pies from the local pie shop.

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From the Barras

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to Glasgow's Bell's pottery patterns.

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And the city's famous traffic cone,

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which sits permanently on the Wellington statue in Royal Exchange Square,

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has been painted on top of everything,

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from the Tolbooth clock tower to fishes' heads.

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The artists want to reference not only buildings and objects

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but the factories and industries that produced them.

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Well, there's been a rope factory for a long time in Parkhead

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and now it's a twine factory.

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So with our paintings we often do...

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We use techniques and devices to make a change,

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like, a different style of painting or use cut-throughs.

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So we thought that by doing a rope it would make a nice contrast

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but it was also relevant because of the rope and twine factory.

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Just a street away from the mural, on Caroline Street,

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stands Henry Winning's rope factory.

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The business started from this unassuming brick warehouse

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back in 1880.

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And though these days Winning's makes string not rope,

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it's the last remaining twine factory in the UK,

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supplying demand from all over Europe.

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In the factory we make lots of different twine.

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I'd say there's about ten different kinds

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and we maybe do five different types of rayon as well.

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So there's quite a lot involved in it.

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It's not just a bit of string.

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The first day you start, we do special knots

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so what you have to do is learn your knot.

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Then as time goes on, when you're tying the knot

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you'll do it as the machine's running.

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The factory employs 32 on its shop floor,

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and most are from Parkhead and the East End.

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I've worked about 37 years altogether.

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I was 15 years when I started, straight from school.

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I didn't think I would be here that long

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but the years just passed by so I'm still here!

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My sister's always also worked in here.

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My mother's worked here.

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My son and my daughter go to college and university

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so they come in and give a wee hand

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when they're off college and university, to give a wee hand.

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All the family's worked here, yeah.

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The only factories I know that's left in the East End is this one

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and the biscuit factory over in Tollcross.

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All the rest are away and there used to be quite a lot.

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Back on the wall,

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Good Wives and Warriors are using the local rope

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to tie all the elements of the mural together.

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There's so much going on, isn't it?

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I really like that about it. The...

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-I think it's so different.

-The twine factory...

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There's so many things that's from around this area.

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-It's good for our community.

-What's that?

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Is it a squirrel or a ferret?

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12 days into the project,

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the artists are working on the suggestion

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to include a building extremely close to their hearts,

0:17:370:17:40

without which there would be no Good Wives and Warriors.

0:17:400:17:43

So the section we're working on right now

0:17:470:17:49

is lifted directly from a Mackintosh design.

0:17:490:17:52

For the competition we wanted to have something quite bold

0:17:520:17:55

and we also really wanted to reference the art school in the painting

0:17:550:17:59

because the Mac building's somewhere that's so important

0:17:590:18:03

to our experience of Glasgow.

0:18:030:18:05

These blocks we know specifically feature in

0:18:050:18:07

the furniture in the Mackintosh building

0:18:070:18:09

and also the sort of blocks and the grid reference

0:18:090:18:12

is used all over the art school.

0:18:120:18:15

Depicting the art school became even more important to Louise and Becky

0:18:190:18:23

after an accidental fire broke out

0:18:230:18:25

and destroyed perhaps the most precious part of the building,

0:18:250:18:28

the wooden library and much of its contents, earlier this year.

0:18:280:18:32

-Oh, I mean, we both cried. It was...

-It was kind of horrendous.

0:18:320:18:35

There was lots of messages going around from...

0:18:350:18:37

-All of our friends.

-..various ex-graduates and friends

0:18:370:18:40

and just everyone was really emotionally hit, weren't they?

0:18:400:18:43

Yeah. And I think seeing those pictures of the flames, you know,

0:18:430:18:46

whooshing up, that was so upsetting.

0:18:460:18:48

We would have probably put references to the Art School

0:18:540:18:56

into our mural anyway, but after this happened,

0:18:560:18:59

we definitely knew that we wanted some of the parts of the library.

0:18:590:19:03

So we put some of the lights that were in the library,

0:19:060:19:10

which is this really beautiful ironwork.

0:19:100:19:14

It was something that was really important to us

0:19:140:19:17

and important to the city,

0:19:170:19:18

so we want it to live on, in a small way, on a wall in Parkhead.

0:19:180:19:21

But there's another historically important Glasgow building

0:19:260:19:30

that the artists just had to include in their mural for Parkhead.

0:19:300:19:33

A lot of older residents, when we spoke to them, remembered the Forge,

0:19:350:19:40

which was a steel factory opened by William Beardmore.

0:19:400:19:44

In the middle of the 19th century,

0:19:450:19:47

Parkhead developed from a small village

0:19:470:19:50

into a thriving industrial suburb at the Eastern end

0:19:500:19:53

of the expanding city, largely driven

0:19:530:19:55

by William Beardmore's famous Parkhead Forge.

0:19:550:19:59

Today whether we speak of Beardmore's or Parkhead,

0:19:590:20:02

which mean the same thing,

0:20:020:20:03

we are speaking of one of the greatest industrial concerns

0:20:030:20:06

in the world.

0:20:060:20:07

I stayed in the Gallowgate.

0:20:090:20:10

My back windows looked into the back end of the Forge.

0:20:100:20:14

You could smell the Forge. You could smell the smoke

0:20:140:20:18

when they were melting.

0:20:180:20:20

You knew the furnaces were on, because you could hear the noise

0:20:200:20:22

and you could see the black smoke going up.

0:20:220:20:25

You could smell it. You were shutting your windows.

0:20:250:20:28

If your windows weren't fitting too good, you'd put the bits of paper in,

0:20:280:20:31

shut the window down on to the bit of paper

0:20:310:20:33

so as the dust didn't come in.

0:20:330:20:35

Covering an area of 25 acres,

0:20:350:20:38

the Forge became the largest steelworks in Scotland.

0:20:380:20:41

Davey and Norrie were some of the last to work

0:20:410:20:43

within these old forge walls.

0:20:430:20:46

It was like a football match coming out,

0:20:460:20:48

the amount of people that were there.

0:20:480:20:50

At one time they reckon there was 30,000, at one time.

0:20:500:20:53

It was the place to be. It was Parkhead Forge.

0:20:530:20:58

It was the working man's Mecca, if you like.

0:20:580:21:01

You worked in the Forge

0:21:010:21:02

or your Granda worked there.

0:21:020:21:05

It was just a natural thing that you were going to work in the Forge,

0:21:050:21:08

if you were a boy, that was it.

0:21:080:21:09

That was it.

0:21:090:21:11

It was the lifeblood of the community.

0:21:110:21:13

The original Forge closed its doors in 1976

0:21:130:21:17

and is now a shopping centre.

0:21:170:21:18

In their tribute to the steelworks,

0:21:210:21:23

Louise and Becky have included the original factory sheds,

0:21:230:21:27

but the story of the Forge and its founder William Beardmore

0:21:270:21:30

has also inspired another section of the mural.

0:21:300:21:33

We started looking into history of the Forge

0:21:340:21:36

and found out that he sponsored Shackleton in his bid

0:21:360:21:40

to be first man at the Antarctic, at the South Pole.

0:21:400:21:46

So we found out more about it,

0:21:460:21:48

and we found out that his ship the Nimrod

0:21:480:21:51

was pretty much sponsored by William Beardmore.

0:21:510:21:55

So we thought it would be really nice

0:21:550:21:57

to put the Nimrod in the painting.

0:21:570:21:58

We thought it would be quite nice to have a ship in the bottle

0:21:580:22:01

at the bottom of the Clyde, with a bit of history attached to it.

0:22:010:22:04

And it had to be an Irn Bru bottle, really.

0:22:040:22:06

In their final week of painting,

0:22:080:22:10

Louise and Becky have come down to the ground level.

0:22:100:22:13

For the last section of their mural,

0:22:130:22:15

the artists have designed a riverbed under the Clyde.

0:22:150:22:18

They've trawled Glasgow's past for their design,

0:22:190:22:22

and the ship in the bottle is just one of many objects

0:22:220:22:25

which the artists have sunk to the bottom of the river.

0:22:250:22:28

It is basically going to be a mixture of the different fish

0:22:280:22:31

that were suggested to us that are going to be moving

0:22:310:22:34

in between underwater plants

0:22:340:22:37

but also lost bits of Glasgow buildings,

0:22:370:22:40

made to look a little bit like the castles

0:22:400:22:43

and decorations you put in a fish tank.

0:22:430:22:45

We brought loads of really big brushes

0:22:490:22:51

that we haven't even looked at,

0:22:510:22:53

because we've decided to do the whole painting

0:22:530:22:56

in a range of really tiny brushes,

0:22:560:22:58

which is possibly not the right size of brush

0:22:580:23:01

to paint a three-storey building with.

0:23:010:23:04

Good Wives and Warriors have just three days left

0:23:050:23:08

to complete their intricate riverbed.

0:23:080:23:10

Is some of this stuff references to Glasgow?

0:23:100:23:12

Yeah, everything has come from something that someone's suggested.

0:23:120:23:16

That's good. Really smart.

0:23:160:23:18

But as they work away on the street level,

0:23:180:23:20

the mural is attracting quite a bit of local interest.

0:23:200:23:23

Which is your favourite bit?

0:23:230:23:25

-That one near the keyhole.

-Ah, cos that's the Quarry Brae logo

0:23:250:23:31

for the football team.

0:23:310:23:33

-Mm-hmm.

-Yeah, your coach asked us to put that in.

0:23:330:23:36

-Is it sort of the universe or not?

-Sort of the Parkhead universe.

0:23:380:23:43

-Parkhead.

-Yeah. It's just lots of images and objects

0:23:430:23:46

that people have suggested to us to represent Parkhead and Glasgow.

0:23:460:23:52

Fortunately, with time fast running out,

0:23:520:23:54

the artists receive some welcome help...

0:23:540:23:56

Oh, tea!

0:23:560:23:58

..and refreshments.

0:23:580:23:59

Thank you very much.

0:23:590:24:02

So like this?

0:24:020:24:04

Yeah, just like that.

0:24:040:24:06

-That's really nice.

-Do it, like, here?

-Uh-huh.

0:24:060:24:10

WHat do you like most?

0:24:100:24:11

The wee fish with the ice cream cone on its head.

0:24:110:24:16

I love ice cream. I like fish.

0:24:160:24:18

-WOMAN:

-Do yous mind people talking to yous when you're doing it?

0:24:180:24:21

-No.

-GIRL:

-It just takes 'em longer!

0:24:210:24:25

-You do yours nice and neat.

-I am!

0:24:250:24:28

Do yous want to be an artist when you're older?

0:24:280:24:30

-Yes, definitely!

-When we grow up.

0:24:300:24:32

When I grow up, I definitely want to be an artist.

0:24:320:24:35

Irn Bru.

0:24:350:24:37

Three Irn Brus and the wee green circles, and the flowers.

0:24:370:24:42

Mucky hands.

0:24:420:24:44

Yep, very mucky hands.

0:24:440:24:46

It's the last day of painting, but there's one final creature

0:24:470:24:51

to add to the design.

0:24:510:24:53

We had the idea to use a hybrid animal,

0:24:530:24:59

combining pigeons and fish,

0:24:590:25:01

because the whole bottom part of the painting is the Clyde,

0:25:010:25:03

then at the top we've got the archway

0:25:030:25:05

and we had the dookits and the doos.

0:25:050:25:08

So we did a few drawings of these... We're calling them Doofish.

0:25:080:25:13

They had to be one of the last things that we painted,

0:25:130:25:17

because we had to paint the coloured layer on top of everything else.

0:25:170:25:21

So we needed to know where to put them,

0:25:210:25:23

but we could only judge that after everything else had been finished.

0:25:230:25:27

Michelangelo has came to the East End of Glasgow.

0:25:340:25:38

We're very delighted and very proud, aren't we, Billy?

0:25:380:25:41

Oh, it's absolutely breathtaking.

0:25:410:25:43

It'll be here long after the memory of the Commonwealth Games.

0:25:430:25:47

This is pretty much the last bit of painting.

0:25:510:25:55

Louise was just saying it feels like the last day of school.

0:25:580:26:02

I think I might wait and just do his eye as the very last touch.

0:26:020:26:06

With the painting finally complete,

0:26:140:26:17

the scaffolding comes down and the artists get their first proper look

0:26:170:26:21

at the whole mural.

0:26:210:26:22

I have to stop myself looking for mistakes, though.

0:26:260:26:28

-I can see mistakes.

-Yeah, me too.

0:26:280:26:30

I think those two doofish are in the wrong place.

0:26:320:26:35

-No, I think they're OK.

-You think they're OK? OK.

0:26:350:26:37

-I think it's really good.

-It looks like how it's supposed to look.

0:26:370:26:40

It looks like we're slightly insane that we've done that amount of work.

0:26:400:26:44

Stacy, there's food!

0:26:440:26:46

There's food!

0:26:480:26:49

Hello, everyone.

0:26:520:26:54

This painting was always meant to be

0:26:540:26:56

more about the people of Parkhead than us,

0:26:560:26:58

so everything here is a suggestion that one of you,

0:26:580:27:01

all of you have given to us, we've put it in there.

0:27:010:27:05

Although we feel like we've...

0:27:050:27:07

Obviously it's our style and our painting,

0:27:070:27:08

it's very much your painting. We hope that you're proud of it.

0:27:080:27:13

We've had such a good time.

0:27:130:27:14

Just thank you, really, is all we want to say.

0:27:140:27:16

APPLAUSE

0:27:160:27:17

But more importantly, what do the locals think?

0:27:170:27:20

That is very nice.

0:27:200:27:21

I'm trying to figure out where does Benmore come into it.

0:27:210:27:23

It's been good. Really good. Watching it every day.

0:27:230:27:26

We could se a big improvement, different colours and all that.

0:27:260:27:32

-Every gable end should have one.

-Every gable end should have one.

0:27:320:27:36

Every time you look at it, you see something else.

0:27:360:27:39

An Irn Bru bottle down the bottom.

0:27:390:27:41

I like the whole lot, what they've done.

0:27:410:27:46

It's really, really lovely.

0:27:460:27:49

It looks really detailed. Not all the fish are the same.

0:27:490:27:53

We've watched it every day since it started.

0:27:530:27:56

Watched it getting bigger and bigger. It's lovely.

0:27:560:28:01

We wanted it to have longevity,

0:28:010:28:02

so that it would give people something different

0:28:020:28:05

every time they looked at it. If they could keep coming back to it

0:28:050:28:07

and finding new things and exploring it...

0:28:070:28:09

-It's not just one line.

-Yeah.

0:28:090:28:11

It's many lines that people can pick up on.

0:28:110:28:14

Good. It's very nice, really.

0:28:140:28:16

Are we not doing nothing with the middle?

0:28:180:28:20

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