Gorbachev - Part 2, The Great Dissident Our World


Gorbachev - Part 2, The Great Dissident

Similar Content

Browse content similar to Gorbachev - Part 2, The Great Dissident. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!

Transcript


LineFromTo

Now it is time for our World. We chart the downfall of Mikhail

:00:03.:00:06.

Gorbachev and the events that led to the break-up of the once-mighty

:00:06.:00:16.

empire. The revolution was swept away by

:00:16.:00:21.

the pace of his own reforms. The Kremlin leader who started out a

:00:21.:00:29.

master of compromise and ended up its victim. 20 years on, the Inside

:00:29.:00:35.

story Of Gorbachev's downfall and the demolition of the Soviet empire.

:00:35.:00:42.

TRANSLATION: It was a struggle for life and death.

:00:42.:00:48.

TRANSLATION: As a politician I lost what I could have won if I had been

:00:48.:00:58.
:00:58.:01:25.

prepared to use force. I refused. I stuck to my principles. By the

:01:25.:01:28.

early 1990s, simmering tensions were erupting into a crisis across

:01:29.:01:35.

the Soviet Union. Reform supporters were pushing Mikhail Gorbachev to

:01:35.:01:42.

go faster but opponents were also uniting against him.

:01:42.:01:47.

(CHANTING). That enormous white building across

:01:47.:01:51.

the Moscow river is exactly what it looks like - the imposing

:01:51.:01:55.

headquarters of somebody very high up and important. Vladimir Putin,

:01:55.:01:59.

the most powerful politician in Russia. 20 years ago it was

:01:59.:02:03.

something very different. It was the centre of the resistance to the

:02:03.:02:07.

attempted coup that tried to topple Mikhail Gorbachev and reverse his

:02:07.:02:14.

reforms. (CHANTING).

:02:14.:02:18.

Resentment of Moscow's control over the Soviet republic was growing.

:02:18.:02:27.

One by one, they were demanding more freedom. In Lithuania, one of

:02:27.:02:31.

the three Baltic republics, the parliament defiantly declared its

:02:31.:02:38.

independence. Gorbachev, who let Eastern European nations decide

:02:38.:02:44.

their own fate, refused to give them the same right.

:02:44.:02:50.

TRANSLATION: The Baltic states are part of the Soviet Union. Anyway,

:02:50.:02:54.

to resolve the issue, seceding from the Soviet Union, we agreed there

:02:54.:03:01.

should be special mechanism for leaving. But not through trembling

:03:01.:03:09.

on all of our laws or rewriting them. No. -- trampling. He really

:03:09.:03:19.
:03:19.:03:26.

did not understand the full force of nationalism. But the Soviet

:03:26.:03:29.

Foreign Minister had told the Americans of his worst fears some

:03:29.:03:34.

years earlier. He said - if we don't change our policies, that

:03:34.:03:38.

could be the end of the Soviet Union. I never thought I would

:03:38.:03:45.

heard the Foreign Minister of the Soviet Union told the United States

:03:45.:03:55.
:03:55.:03:59.

that his country could be doomed. Gorbachev's problems were many. He

:03:59.:04:04.

had given hardliners key positions in his government. His friends and

:04:04.:04:07.

Foreign Minister deserted him, warning of an impending

:04:07.:04:17.
:04:17.:04:17.

dictatorship. TRANSLATION: It was the shortest

:04:17.:04:23.

speech I ever made. I said they were preparing to take over power

:04:23.:04:33.
:04:33.:04:38.

with who knows what consequences. We will all be in danger and to

:04:38.:04:48.
:04:48.:05:06.

register my protest I am resigning right now. for the very people

:05:06.:05:11.

commit economic upheaval was making life unbearable. -- Fawdon Mary

:05:11.:05:21.

people. Gorbachev took the brunt of their rage. He said there was a

:05:21.:05:24.

food shortage in Moscow and people were queuing for bread and they had

:05:24.:05:29.

been queuing for a long time and were getting very irritated. One

:05:29.:05:33.

man turned in the queue and said to his neighbour - I am fed up with

:05:33.:05:40.

this, I blame Gorbachev. I am going to kill Gorbachev, and off he went.

:05:40.:05:44.

He came back a few days later and they ask him, did you kill

:05:44.:05:50.

Gorbachev? No, he replied, the queue to kill Gorbachev was just

:05:50.:05:55.

too long. There was another political threat to his power.

:05:55.:06:00.

Gorbachev had created for himself the post of Soviet President to

:06:00.:06:06.

bolster his weakening power. The Russian power called elections for

:06:06.:06:16.
:06:16.:06:35.

its own Russian President. Boris Yeltsin, a former protege of

:06:35.:06:41.

Gorbachev, won by a landslide. Suddenly, instead of one, there

:06:41.:06:51.
:06:51.:06:58.

were two contenders to the Kremlin throne. The West tried to court

:06:58.:07:04.

them both. Gorbachev is still resentful.

:07:04.:07:10.

TRANSLATION: They even entered into secret agreements with Yeltsin. The

:07:10.:07:13.

British and the Americans know about that. Particularly the

:07:13.:07:23.
:07:23.:07:26.

Americans. We didn't make any deals with Boris Yeltsin. We recognise

:07:26.:07:29.

the fact that Gorbachev was still the President of the Soviet Union.

:07:29.:07:34.

We were meeting with him. We also met with the opposition. We would

:07:34.:07:44.
:07:44.:07:48.

meet with Yeltsin as well. Both he and Yeltsin were reformers,

:07:48.:07:53.

Gorbachev wish to reform socialism and yachts and wish to destroy it.

:07:53.:08:03.

They wanted different relationships with the West -- Nelson. In January

:08:03.:08:09.

1991 the hardline KGB defence ministers in Gorbachev's government

:08:09.:08:14.

ordered an attack on the breakaway Lithuanian Republic, testing the

:08:14.:08:21.

waters for a crackdown. It was not clear how much Gorbachev knew. Now

:08:21.:08:31.

he admits he was sidelined. TRANSLATION: I never gave them

:08:31.:08:37.

permission to impose my shawl or presidential rule. -- martial law.

:08:37.:08:41.

They took that decision. People don't realise that the terrible

:08:41.:08:51.

thing was that I didn't know. Americans were horrified. The

:08:51.:08:55.

American ambassador went to the Kremlin to protest. Up to ask

:08:55.:09:02.

Gorbachev or was going on. Gorbachev said, tell me, had you

:09:02.:09:06.

assess the situation? I said, Mr President, I no longer understand

:09:06.:09:16.

we were going. He listened carefully and then he said - please,

:09:16.:09:21.

please explain to you President this country is on the brink of

:09:21.:09:31.
:09:31.:09:32.

civil war. And I must do, as President, all I can to prevent

:09:32.:09:42.
:09:42.:09:51.

that. That means I'm going to have to zig-zag. The assault on

:09:51.:09:57.

Lithuania failed, rebuffed by popular assistance. They still

:09:57.:10:07.

commemorate the event every year. It was an ominous sign that a power

:10:07.:10:17.
:10:17.:10:25.

struggle over who should rule the Soviet Union was imminent. By the

:10:25.:10:29.

summer of 1991 the public mood was becoming angry. At the annual May

:10:29.:10:34.

Day parade, the crowd in Moscow's Red Square jeered at Gorbachev.

:10:34.:10:39.

Members of his government next to him on the podium were privately

:10:39.:10:46.

scheming against him. TRANSLATION: We saw in Gorbachev

:10:46.:10:49.

someone who was incapable of governing, we were quite convinced

:10:49.:10:58.

of this. The Americans heard rumours that a coup was being

:10:58.:11:07.

planned to oust Gorbachev. It was Boris Yeltsin's idea. I told him it

:11:07.:11:11.

was more than a rumour. It could happen at any time. He actually

:11:11.:11:21.
:11:21.:11:22.

laughed and said something about naive Americans. By early August

:11:22.:11:26.

1991, Gorbachev decided to join forces with his arch rival, Boris

:11:26.:11:31.

Yeltsin. They struck a deal in a secret meeting.

:11:32.:11:36.

TRANSLATION: We agreed that Yeltsin would stay in Russia as he was the

:11:36.:11:39.

elected President, and Gorbachev would be Union President and we

:11:39.:11:43.

would get rid of all those who were putting spokes in the wheels. Then

:11:43.:11:51.

we named them, the people we were talking about. What Gorbachev

:11:51.:11:55.

didn't realise was that the very hardliners he was planning to get

:11:55.:12:04.

rid of had secretly used the KGB to record the conversation. His deal

:12:04.:12:08.

with Yeltsin backfired. His enemies, including his own for vice-

:12:09.:12:14.

president, defence and K G B chiefs decided to act at once and stage a

:12:14.:12:19.

coup against him. TRANSLATION: our goal was to

:12:19.:12:29.

convince him that it was essential to declare a state of emergency.

:12:29.:12:32.

Not necessarily in the whole country but wherever it was

:12:32.:12:42.
:12:42.:13:02.

required. It was threatening to destroy the Soviet Union.

:13:02.:13:06.

plotters sent a delegation to come from Gorbachev at his villa by the

:13:06.:13:12.

Black Sea. At a meeting they presented him with their ultimatum.

:13:12.:13:18.

TRANSLATION: I even swore at them. I said go and convened a Congress

:13:18.:13:22.

and we will see whose plan gets more support, yours or mine. In the

:13:22.:13:30.

end they left empty handed. I think they got drunk on the way.

:13:30.:13:39.

Reporting back by Gorbachev had refused. Refused what? Refused to

:13:39.:13:43.

sign the order delegating my powers to the vice-president due to the

:13:43.:13:53.
:13:53.:14:01.

poor state of my help. What lies. - - my health. In Moscow, tanks

:14:01.:14:11.
:14:11.:14:23.

State television and radio announced that Gorbachev was ill

:14:23.:14:31.

and an emergency committee was now in charge. It looked as though the

:14:31.:14:40.

old, terrifying Soviet dictatorship was back. Boris Yeltsin managed to

:14:40.:14:44.

hide in the Russian parliament to avoid arrest and appealed to the

:14:44.:14:51.

outside world for help. We managed to get through to him on the

:14:51.:14:55.

telephone and he said I am in the Russian White House and the

:14:55.:15:00.

communists are coming to get me. I have about 20 minutes. Will you go

:15:00.:15:05.

out and tell people what is happening. I did. I went out into

:15:05.:15:10.

Downing Street and I made a statement strongly in support of

:15:10.:15:20.
:15:20.:15:23.

reform. As the drama unfolded, Gorbachev

:15:23.:15:26.

realised the fines were disconnected and he and his family

:15:26.:15:36.
:15:36.:15:38.

were under house arrest. He and his wife feared the worst.

:15:38.:15:43.

They surrounded us with the cars down by the seashore and everywhere.

:15:43.:15:46.

They parked their cars so nobody could drive past at the entrance

:15:46.:15:56.
:15:56.:15:58.

because many people were trying to get in. They let nobody through.

:15:58.:16:02.

TRANSLATION: Several of our bodyguards deserted us and we were

:16:02.:16:06.

not sure we could trust those who stayed behind. I did not know

:16:06.:16:11.

whether they were protecting us off guarding us. They could have turned

:16:11.:16:20.

their guns on ask any time. They watch us from every staircase.

:16:20.:16:28.

somehow Gorbachev managed to follow the tense drama in Moscow.

:16:28.:16:34.

I listened mainly to the BBC. I had a Japanese radio which is in a

:16:34.:16:44.
:16:44.:16:54.

museum now. I have always trusted the BBC.

:16:54.:16:59.

Boris Yeltsin denounced the coup as illegal in the capital and urged

:16:59.:17:06.

people to join him at the White House to defend Russia's fledgling

:17:06.:17:12.

democracy. Thousands gathered, people who

:17:12.:17:20.

realise that after six years of Gorbachev's reforms they had lost

:17:20.:17:30.
:17:30.:17:31.

their fear. It was this new-found defiance

:17:31.:17:35.

which dealt an ultimate blow to the leaders of the coup. Parts of the

:17:35.:17:45.
:17:45.:17:47.

army also refused to fire on the people. Within three days, it was

:17:47.:17:51.

over. Gorbachev and his family returned to Moscow but everything

:17:51.:17:59.

had changed. The coup leaders had lost but so had Gorbachev, as it

:17:59.:18:06.

turned out. TRANSLATION: You could see that Gorbachev wanted to put

:18:06.:18:16.
:18:16.:18:20.

everything back in order. When Boris Yeltsin invited him to a

:18:20.:18:24.

session of the Russian parliament, he tried to reassert himself and

:18:24.:18:34.
:18:34.:18:43.

take control. But Boris Yeltsin would not let him

:18:43.:18:48.

and instead he had to sit near as not number one but a number two.

:18:49.:18:54.

That was when I realised that Gorbachev could no longer rely on

:18:54.:19:03.

the power he had before - the power of the presidents before him.

:19:03.:19:07.

But Gorbachev seemed to be in denial. He still thought he could

:19:07.:19:13.

keep the Union intact with himself at the helm. Readers in some Soviet

:19:13.:19:19.

republics were becoming restless. Trans Mak I believe it was Boris

:19:19.:19:26.

Yeltsin that brought up the idea of meeting without Gorbachev in

:19:26.:19:32.

conversation. We agreed to meet in Belarus.

:19:32.:19:37.

During an informal gathering in a remote hunting lodge deep in the

:19:37.:19:42.

forest, the presidents of Russia, Ukraine and Belarus dealt a final

:19:42.:19:52.
:19:52.:19:54.

blow to Gorbachev and the entire Soviet Union.

:19:54.:20:00.

TRANSLATION: Boris Yeltsin said, would you agree to the Soviet Union

:20:00.:20:09.

in its existence. I said OK. It only dawned on me afterwards when

:20:09.:20:19.
:20:19.:20:21.

my guard came to take me home. I was thinking, tomorrow I need to

:20:21.:20:25.

present this to do but there was Parliament and they can throw it

:20:25.:20:31.

out. This is a momentous thing. Usually I have a nap in the car but

:20:31.:20:36.

after that I could not sleep. It was decided that the bill was

:20:36.:20:39.

President should break the news to Gorbachev while Boris Yeltsin

:20:39.:20:49.
:20:49.:20:50.

announced it to the world. TRANSLATION: When they finally put

:20:50.:20:58.

me through to Gorbachev, Yeltsin was already on the phone to George

:20:58.:21:02.

Bush. I thought, can you imagine what the outside world will think

:21:02.:21:12.
:21:12.:21:18.

of this? Gorbachev said we were idiots to get involved and I said

:21:18.:21:24.

that Boris Yeltsin was on the find to George Bush right now. There was

:21:24.:21:34.
:21:34.:21:37.

a silence of the other end of the phone, and then Gorbachev hung up.

:21:38.:21:47.
:21:48.:21:53.

Gorbachev had no choice but to resign. TRANSLATION: -- After six

:21:53.:21:55.

years in power, he went on television.

:21:55.:22:02.

He was the last President of the Soviet Union. The red flag came

:22:02.:22:06.

down and was replaced by the Russian try:. Boris Yeltsin,

:22:06.:22:09.

President of Russia, was now in charge. He and Gorbachev never

:22:09.:22:19.
:22:19.:22:26.

spoke again. -- Russian tricolour. TRANSLATION: He is a scandal and a

:22:26.:22:33.

traitor. We agreed how things would be anti- began to scream behind my

:22:34.:22:39.

back. The story is about Boris Yeltsin, the traitor.

:22:39.:22:49.
:22:49.:22:51.

-- we agreed how things would be and then he began to scheme behind

:22:51.:22:58.

my back. I'll I was very sad for him on a

:22:58.:23:06.

personal level because I appreciated what he had achieved.

:23:06.:23:11.

20 years later, the last President of the Soviet Union lives quietly

:23:11.:23:16.

in Moscow with his family. In his 80s, he is still heading a

:23:16.:23:19.

political institute. His granddaughter helps him keep

:23:19.:23:29.
:23:29.:23:30.

abreast of technology. Politically, he is a lonely figure,

:23:30.:23:34.

respected abroad but blamed by many in his own country for bringing

:23:34.:23:40.

down the Soviet Union. Gorbachev is not nostalgic but he looks ahead

:23:40.:23:50.
:23:50.:23:53.

with trepidation. He is scathing about putting's Russia -- Putin's

:23:53.:24:03.

Russia. TRANSLATION: It should be a different countries. They are about

:24:03.:24:08.

stability but stability kills a country and leads to stagnation.

:24:08.:24:14.

-- a different country. I think they have blown it with democracy.

:24:14.:24:18.

Our electoral system was nothing remarkable but they have simply

:24:18.:24:27.

castrated it. I apologise for my choice of words.

:24:27.:24:32.

He insists his concern is not his own reputation but the future of

:24:32.:24:39.

his country. If we miss these next five or six years, we will always

:24:39.:24:45.

lag behind. We are in a transitional path to democracy and

:24:45.:24:54.

the best we are only halfway through. The man who changed the

:24:54.:25:01.

world but lost an empire. Gorbachev is one of the towering figures of

:25:01.:25:07.

the last half century because of what he achieved in changing a

:25:07.:25:12.

nation by the force of his own will and determination. In terms of

:25:12.:25:19.

internal reputation, he paid a heavy price.

:25:19.:25:24.

TRANSLATION: In the eyes of his own people, he will go down in history

:25:24.:25:29.

as the person who destroyed the country but in the west where they

:25:29.:25:33.

were always eager to see this country collapse, he is the man who

:25:33.:25:43.

made history. History will be extraordinarily kind to Mikhail

:25:43.:25:53.
:25:53.:25:58.

Gorbachev as well as to Edward Sheverdnadse. That is because they

:25:58.:26:03.

were determined not to use force. If not for them, the Cold War could

:26:03.:26:13.
:26:13.:26:20.

have ended with a bang instead of a have ended with a bang instead of a

:26:20.:26:29.

The weather was fairly mixed across the UK yesterday. There were spells

:26:29.:26:31.

of sunshine occasionally punctuated by heavy downpours. Most places

:26:31.:26:39.

will be dry today with a few showers in the north and west. It

:26:39.:26:42.

will feel quite warm in the spells of sunshine. The odd shower for

:26:43.:26:46.

north-west Wales is the exception rather than the rule. A dry and

:26:46.:26:49.

fine start to the day in Northern Ireland. A different story for

:26:49.:26:52.

northern and western parts of Scotland, with a high chance of

:26:52.:27:02.
:27:02.:27:13.

showers. Warm highs in London and Norwich. Very good news for the

:27:13.:27:17.

Download Subtitles

SRT

ASS