13/06/2014 Daily Politics


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Barack Obama says all options are on the table but it's still not


clear if he intends to do very much about the collapse of Iraq.


In the last 24 hours the Islamist extremists have seized two new towns


The Governor of the Bank of England warns interest rates may rise sooner


than the markets expect. But how soon?


We report on the wheeler-dealering in Brussels as


newly-elected MEPs try to form new pan-European political groupings.


And did you know that as well as its own flag,


All that in the next hour and with us for the next half


an hour is Times political correspondent Laura Pitel.


Let's kick off with last night's warning


from the Bank of England governor Mark Carney that interest rates


It rather overshadowed everything that George Osborne had to say.


There is speculation about the exact timing of the first rate hike and


this decision is becoming more balanced. It could happen sooner


than financial markets currently expect. But to be clear, there is no


preset course. The ultimate decision will be driven by the data. That was


the governor last night. A characteristic dry delivery that he


gives. Any idea why he has decided to say this? He wants to give people


a warning. If interest rates are going to go up it could be good news


for savers. We have had rubbish rates. They will not go much. And it


could be serious news for people with a mortgage. Some people are


struggling to handle the cost of living and if you're going to have a


massive hike on your mortgage payment, it is bad news. But it will


not be a massive hike to begin with. The governor has made it clear


not be a massive hike to begin with. that any rise will be very small to


begin with. And even when he reaches the peak of the interest rate cycle,


he does not think it will go back to the average of 5% before the crash,


it is more likely to be around three. It is not good news of you


have a mortgage but it may not be a disaster? It may be 2.25% over the


next three years. Mark Carney made it clear it would be a slow change


but it is interesting politically, because we had expected that the


interest rate hike might be held after the general election but comes


forward, is tricky. I have always thought he would not put interest


rates up until the second half of the next year. But the markets have


been pricing he would do it in the first part of next year, maybe the


first quarter. I wonder, he said he may do it sooner than the markets


were expecting. He may want to get it in this year, the first rise,


because to raise interest rates in the middle of an election campaign,


which will start on January one, is probably a sensible thing for any


banker to do. The markets have been expecting it in February time, maybe


before Christmas, in November. It presents a tricky dilemma for George


Osborne. If there is an interest rate rise he will say the economy is


recovering, we need it. It was interesting last night because he


said the economy was growing at an annual rate of 4%. If it is true


then you cannot keep interest rates at 0.5%. No, you cannot because


inflation will end up going out of control. The thing that is tricky is


Ed Miliband's big thing is the cost of living crisis. If the interest


rates go up, people will have bigger mortgage payments and that will play


into his agenda. If you have a mortgage, you should do your own


risk assessment and look at what will happen if interest rates go up


one and a half, 2%, where would that leave you with mortgage payments?


Exactly. Now it's time for our daily quiz.


David and Samantha Cameron were papped


on Wednesday having a night out in central London, so our question


for today is, what were they doing? Was it a)


Seeing the play Handbagged? b) Hanging out with celebs


at the Chiltern Firehouse? c) Enjoying some peri


peri chicken at Nandos? d) Partying in the notorious Soho


nightclub The Box? And a bit later in the show Laura


will give us the correct answer. Dealing with education manifesto


gets people squabbling like kids in a classroom. Here is what Nick Clegg


had to say. All parents, all mums and dads need parental guarantee


that regardless of what school their children go to cover all of their


children will be taught by qualified teachers, teachers who are seeking


and all their children will be taught a core body of knowledge,


regardless of whether the school is a free School, an academy or a


maintained school. We've been joined from Liverpool


by the Lib Dem's education spokesman What is new is what has been brought


about by the situation in Birmingham where the schools have not had the


freedom to teach a national curriculum and have got themselves


into all sorts of problems. I believe, as a head teacher myself


for 25 years, the most important thing for me in education is having


a qualified teacher. And secondly, making sure that all schools,


whether they are free schools are academies, follow a slimmed down


national curriculum which makes sure that we teach and give people the


flexibility which they have. If qualified teachers are so important,


when the academies act was passed in 2010 which allows for unqualified


teachers in academies, why did only six Lib Dem MPs vote against it?


First of all, you are right, Labour allowed academies to have


non-qualified teachers teaching. This was the Tory legislation. The


original academies at brought under the Blair government allowed for the


first time non-qualified teachers to be teaching in the classroom. Long


before that we had a system which does not get a mention, which is


when teachers are sick or on a course, you often have teaching


assistants brought in who do not have teaching qualifications. They


do a fantastic job but they are not qualified teachers. To go back to


your direct question, I think you learn from what happens. I think


politicians have said that is quite wrong. They should not be chastised,


they should be welcomed for being brave enough to say no, in all


schools, the most important thing is the quality of the teacher and that


goes without saying. Mr Clegg, the leader of your party and Mr laws in


the education department, they were both taught by unqualified teachers.


What damage did it do them? It is not to say there are not occasions


where you bring people into schools, into a classroom situation, who have


real qualities and expertise in a particular area, but the day-to-day


classroom teaching, whether it is in the primary school, or whether it is


in a secondary school, needs somebody who is qualified and


trained. What do we mean by that? They know about child development.


Can the person who taught David Laws or Nick Clegg be able to identify if


a child was dyslexic or not? If you just bring anybody in, those vital


ingredients of qualification are lost. And actually, it can be very


dangerous. New -- you need people who are qualified but also people


who will inspire and motivate. You will remember probably a teacher who


inspired you and that goes for all of us. If there are inspiring


teachers and schools who are not qualified and they do not want to go


down the route of qualification, will you fire them? If somebody does


not want to become a qualified teacher and we agree that all


children have the right to be taught by a qualified teacher, they will


have to step aside and maybe they will become a classroom assistant or


an assistant teacher. So inspiring teachers, if they do not follow your


rules, you will fire them? I did not say that. If somebody does not want


to become a qualified teacher, they can become an assistant to a


qualified teacher. They will be downgraded? That is an insult to


classroom assistants who do a fantastic job. They assist teachers


so an inspiring teacher who does not want to follow your rules will be


demoted to an assistant? So your assistant producer is downgraded?


You have not met my assistant producers say he would not be saying


that! While I have got you on, you will see that Mr Miliband and Mr


Clegg got their photographs taken with the Sun newspaper, apparently


it is something to do with a sporting competition going on in


Brazil at the moment. The leader of the Liberal Democrats in Liverpool


has Brazil at the moment. The leader of


the Liberal Democrats called on Mr Clegg to apologise for being seen


with the Sun. You Clegg to apologise for being seen


with the were a city councillor and city leader of Liverpool Council,


should he apologise? Of course he should. I do not think people


outside Merseyside realise the great upset and harm that the Sun caused


people of the city. It is an insult to what has happened. Both Miliband


and Nick Clegg should clearly apologise for the hurt they have


caused, particularly to the family and friends of those people


tragically killed at Hillsborough. and friends of those people


Thank you for that. Nice to talk to you.


Interesting there. There is pressure on both. I am puzzled with Mr


on both. I am puzzled with Miliband. Mr Clegg is a northern MP


as well. Why did it not stored on any of the people around them that


being seen holding up a copy of the Sun would not go down in Liverpool?


Ya No the Sun knows it will not go down well because they did not


deliver the paper there. It is an interesting situation. They could


have done without this after the bacon sandwich incident. In a great


he looked quite silly in the photo to add insult to injury. It is


remarkable that they pay all these people for advice. I understand that


Mr Miliband has apologised to the people of Merseyside, much good it


will probably do him and no doubt Mr Clegg will follow. It is apology


Friday. ISIS is an extreme Sunni Islamist


group which used to be a franchise of Al-Qaeda but became too hard line


even for it. It is now in control of huge swathes of eastern Iraq, the


country's second city. Everywhere it goes, it opens the jails to boost


its numbers, empties the banks to fund its operation and enforces the


strictest sharia law, including executions, amputations, beheadings


and crucifixions. It has taken a further two towns close to Baghdad


which is now preparing for an attack. President Obama has said


nothing except he is looking at his options, none of which are great.


Meanwhile, Iran's Revolutionary guard has been deployed to aid its


beleaguered Shia allies in the east of Iraq. We will talk about what is


happening there in the moment but first, let's have a look at the


timeline of events in Iraq since the invasion in 2003.


British and American troops invaded Iraq in March 2003, leading to the


toppling of Saddam Hussein's government. In September, the former


president was captured near his hometown of Tikrit which has just


been taken by ISIS. The following summer the US-led administration


transferred powers to the Iraqi government. Two years later, Nouri


al-Maliki formed the first post-war government. Later that year, Sadam


Hussein was executed. In 2007, Britain handed over the Basra


province to Iraqi forces. It marked the end of five years of British


occupation but Britain had lost control of southern Iraq before they


left. And the last troops withdrew from the country in September 2011.


Mr Obama wanted to keep some aside. 2013 was Iraq's deadliest year since


2008 with nearly 10,000 civilians killed in clashes between security


forces and largely Sunni Islamist militants. In April this year,


Iraqis voted in their first parliamentary elections since the


withdrawal of US troops but the elections were marred by nationwide


violence. Last night, Barack Obama said Iraq


was going to need more help from the US and the international community


and did not rule out airstrikes. My team is


working around the clock to identify how we can provide the most


effective assistance to them. I don't rule out anything because we


do have a stake in making sure that these jihadists are not getting a


permanent foothold in either Iraq or I'm joined now from Cardiff by


Ann Clwyd, who was Tony Blair's special envoy on human rights to


Iraq in 2003, John McTernan, who worked for Tony Blair


in Downing Street, is in Edinburgh. And Richard Ottaway,


chair of the Foreign Affairs Select You listened to President Obama, it


does not really sound like he knows what to do. He has made it clear


there will not be boots on the ground that he is prepared to


intervene. I expect there is quite a bit of intelligence and an


assessment on what is going on. What will this amount to? At the moment,


it will be logistical, humanitarian intelligence -based. I do not know


what that means? That means you can provide support for getting more


equipment there, humanitarian means money for aid. They have all the


latest American equipment. This is a fast moving situation and you do not


want to have knee jerk reactions. I am asking you what you think the


President should do. He has said he is considering all options. That is


the right thing to do. There is nothing obvious that the West can


do. What is important is to prop up the Kurds in the north. They are an


oasis of stability and prosperity. They have the good, well-trained


army. They have been circumvented. A lot of our focus should go on there.


But, it is not to say we are not interested and you have to look at


the options. There is nothing obvious the West can do, is there?


They can accelerate the supply of the new equipment to Iraq. They can


obviously, as Richard said, shared intelligence. And for the Kurdish


autonomous region, it is vital they do offer specific support like


restoring the no-fly zone. You can do air strikes. There is a capacity


for us to strike if we need to. What is the point of providing the Iraqi


army with new equipment if it drops it and runs away and it ends up in


the hands of Islamist militants? Sky it is very clear that when the Prime


Minister ordered the British and American troops to leave, he made a


massive, strategic error. In the end, if we do not want Baghdad to


fall and for democracy to stay, we will have to act. I'd take a more


positive view of what President Obama has said. What is the point of


giving them equipment they are not prepared to use? The most


sophisticated equipment is now ending up in the hands of ISIS. What


is clear is that we need to give military, defence and military


support everywhere we can. It takes time to make any deployment. We must


be clear and President Obama has been clear we will not allow ISIS to


gain a country from which they can then export the terrorism fell in


the region. How to we make that clear? Iran knows what it is doing.


It is deploying Revolutionary guards to help its Shi'ite friends in


Baghdad. Had we make it clear? We have no power to make it clear? Iraq


is in a very difficult situation at the moment. I had a phone call ten


minutes ago from the wife of a man who was the Water Minister in


Baghdad. She is the sister-in-law of the President. She said to me that


ten young women have been captured by ISIS on the road from Baghdad to


Kurdistan. Now they are demanding a ransom for each one of them. We know


how difficult the situation is. The question is, what is to be done? I


am not hearing anything that is so far practical. Sky we cannot


possibly say exactly what the military should do. I worry about


things like drones. They have too many accidents and bombed the wrong


people very often. I am concerned about the vast number of people,


there are supposed to be half a million people already, who have


gone towards the burden with Kurdistan. I think the Kurds are


perfectly able to protect themselves. They moved into Cukor


and that has been a disputed territory for some time. -- Kirkuk.


It is about the rest of the country. It is an urgent situation. I think


the intelligence, both on the American side and the British side,


has been absolutely rotten. The Pentagon warned the president in


February of this year this would happen, in broad terms, and nothing


was done. I will come to Richard now. The Kurds ignored the Americans


and formed their own army. What is the point of a no-fly zone over what


we might call Kurdistan in northern Iraq? ISIS do not have any planes.


Kurdistan is now a semi-independent autonomous region. It was not given


to them by the Americans. They had their own constitution. High point


is that the Americans did not want the Kurds to have an army. -- my


point is. My point is they do not need our protection. You are


disillusioned to think the Kurds do not need our protection. What we


do? We need to tell them we are right behind them and standing


shoulder to shoulder with them. What does that mean? Politically, it


means quite a lot. If you are going to say you are going to give all


that it needs to protect the region, that can possibly prevent an


escalation. I do not think we have the capacity to deploy troops. Going


back to your original question, we have participated in a no-fly zone


before, together with the Americans. Whether we have the capacity now to


do so again remains to be seen. I asked the question. What is the


point of a no-fly zone in northern Iraq when ISIS do not have any


planes? If you can control airspace, you can often control the


ground. You need a military person here to say it. They have already


captured helicopters. They are very sophisticated helicopters. It is


unlikely they know how to fly them. Northern Iraq seems to be under


control at the moment. Is dinner rack is now in the hands of a


machine that was too powerful for Al-Qaeda. The Americans are helping


in the West and helping the Government in eastern Iraq. The


company is de facto partitioned. Sky you cannot say it will be


partitioned. It is occupied by ISIS. There has been a catastrophic


failure by the Prime Minister and we are in an extraordinary situation


where the new relationship that America has with Ron is being tested


in a very challenging way, a way we have not anticipated. -- with Irani.


Grant will also protect the Kurds. We do have to go back to using our


intelligence and using drone strikes, actually using the weapons


we have. We do not need boots on the ground. We will probably have to be


talking to Iran at the moment. Was the real catastrophic failure not


John McTiernan and and included, going into the country in the first


place? There was no Al-Qaeda Organisation in 2003 and the place


is covered with them now. A man was in charge committed to the genocide


of the Kurds. It is an utterly amoral position to say we would


rather have a fascist dictator, a strong man, holding that they


Al-Qaeda and holding at bay Irani. It is an amoral politics. We have no


idea what the Coalition Government thinks. They appear to have no


foreign policy in this area. They have not said we should intervene or


do what ever President Obama has done. They are silent because they


have no idea what to do. It is a shocking disgrace to have our


government in that position. It is true that Saddam Hussein was a


fascist dictatorship. There is crucifying and beheading at the


moment. The difference is that these people can export back to the West.


Saddam Hussein did not do that. He might have done that, Andrew. It is


not true to say archives was not in Iraq before 2003. Ask the Kurds. --


Al-Qaeda. Kurds were being executed and the Americans were called in.


There were a handful of them and the place is awash. Please started off


as a handful. Andrew is the chair of the foreign affairs select


committee. We were due to go to Kurdistan this Sunday. We were given


a security briefing on Tuesday and it seemed to me that people than


were only vaguely aware of what was going on. I do not think we knew


much of anything. What is coalition policy at the moment? It is


ridiculous to say the Foreign Office has no policy. The policy has always


been to recognise Iraq as a state which we supported. We will provide


it with humanitarian support and political support. That will


continue to be the case. This has caught at everyone. I think you


would rather have a Revolutionary guard, wouldn't you? I am not sure


he would like to have the Revolutionary guard from Tehran, to


be honest with you. He has got it. Since when? It is pretty rich for


the Iranians to be complaining. This attack from ISIS was born in an


unstable region of Syria. The reason it is unstable is because the lack


of support by the Iranians. You heard Richard to weigh outline


coalition policy. You any the wiser? I am not. There is a savage irony


that this does start in Syria so that a place that we intervened in


successfully is being stabilised by a place that we did not intervene


in. What is Labour 's policy in this matter? Labour 's policy is to


support. It is rare for the opposition to split from what the


Government is doing. The pressure is on the Government to say what they


are going to do. Labour has always been clear about support for the


Kurds in the autonomous region. That is the test I apply to all of this.


What is in the best interests of the Kurds? What is in their best


interests would be in the best interests of everyone. I think there


is a dark humour in talking about us. I do not understand how our


politicians can talk about we doing something militarily when you have


made redundant and other round of troops this week. We have not said


we will intervene militarily. That is not a policy. It is a clear


policy. In international affairs quit you cannot react to a situation


that started on Tuesday with an instant policy by Friday. You have


to sit back, assess what is going on on the ground, and come up with


something clear. That is why the Labour Party is not saying anything


because they agree with that. That would be true of the Americans. They


have a big decision to take. We should stop behaving as if we have


any say, or any clout, in this matter whatsoever. As a permanent


member of the Security Council of the United Nations, we have a lot of


say in what happens with world affairs and what will happen here.


What would you do? Sky I would say everybody took their eye off the


ball. -- I would say. Everybody took their eye off the ball. That is a


big mistake. We went into Iraq to create a democracy. We did not have


a plan to do so. We lost control of southern Iraq even before we left


and we ended up with a sectarian Prime Minister in Iraq, who, the


first thing he did was start to attack and discriminate against


Sunnis. We did have democratic elections. I was there for the first


one. People turned out in their masses to vote. That was the first


time they were able to vote freely. Much good it has done them. The


results of the recent election means Nouri al-Maliki has not got a


majority. There is a group of people all with particular points of view


and he must try and pull them together as he did before. He has


alienated the Sunnis, that is true. They felt they were completely left


out of planning for the new Iraq. It varies from wherever you live. Some


areas get 24 hours electricity, some areas only get four hours a day. I


understand that. John McTernan, I would suggest to you, this is not


just an Iraqi problem, it is a regional problem. The whole of the


region from Beirut, from Lebanon, through to the Gulf states opposite


Iran, are basically in the grip of a Sunni Shia sectarian war? That is


what is going on in that part of the world. And in these circumstances,


the West is unlikely to be more than a spectator? I think it is right


that it is a regional conflict and it is right to see Iran in the hand


of destabilisation in the region. It is wrong that you have to have a


sectarian fight between Sunnis and Shia 's. It does not happen in the


Kurdish region, it did not happen in Baghdad initially after the


liberation. We know how to deal with ISIS. It is what we did when we were


there. Using special forces work, using intelligence worked.


Interrupting the line of supply for the car bombers worked. The tragedy


is, the cuts the coalition have made the British Army mean we do not have


a deployable force any more. There is no political appetite to deploy


it either. The British people will not stand for a further deployment


into the Middle East? I'm not clear about that at all. British people


believe in democracy at have no options is terrible. Richard


Ottaway, I wonder whether ISIS will go into Baghdad because Baghdad will


be heavily defended and the Shia militia have been mobilised. It may


suit their purpose is to control the western part of Iraq, where the


border with Syria is now porous and they have the caliphate? I think


they would like to go into Baghdad but they think it is a step too far.


I think they will probably sit back now and as you alluded to, I think


we'll see a regional setup here, the Kurds to the north-east, ISIS on the


Syrian border and to the west and the shears to the south. We will


have to leave it there. I thank all three of you for that discussion --


the sheers to the south. We will cover this on the sunbaked politics


as well on BBC One this Sunday. -- we will cover this on the Sunday


Politics as well. We asked what David and


Samantha Cameron were doing when they were spotted on


a night out in central London. Was it a) Seeing the play


Handbagged? b) Hanging out with celebs


at the Chiltern Firehouse? c) Enjoying some peri


peri chicken at Nandos? d) Partying in the notorious Soho


nightclub The Box? So, Laura,


what's the correct answer? It is the Chiltern Firehouse. Had he


been? I have not been, I'm told there is a six month waiting list.


Can you get me in? I will see what I can do.


Coming up in a moment it's our regular look at what's been


For now it's time to say goodbye to Laura Pitel.


So for the next half an hour we're going to be focussing on Europe.


We'll be discussing who'll be the next president of the


EU Commission, looking at some of the new parties in the European


Parliament, and asking whether the EU is right to have its own anthem.


First though here's our guide to the latest from Europe,


You wait for a taxi and then all turn up at once. European cities


were gridlocked as cab drivers blocked streets were testing against


an app which they say will push them off the board.


The tax affairs of Star Bucks will be investigated to see if they are


not paying their share. It was three men and a powerful


woman in a boat in Sweden. David Cameron went to meet the Swedish and


Dutch prime ministers and German Chancellor Angela Merkel. They rowed


and then row. The PM's confidence seems to have sunk after the


discussions. We're here to discuss the policies which the commission


should take over the next five years. That is what the discussions


have about, not people. Meanwhile, Mr Junco was in a bunker and looking


decidedly fed up with us Brits. -- Claude Junco.


And with us for the next 30 minutes I've been


joined by two newly elected MEPs - UKIP's Margot Parker and Clare Moody


from Labour - as well as the leader of the Conservative MEPs in the


Let me start with the Juncker problem, if I can call it that. The


main political groups have said there will be an institutional


crisis if Mr Juncker is not nominated as the European Commission


president. It is clear there are a number of people who are concerned


about Juncker. He is yesterday's man. Some people look at him as


business as usual, the Sepp Blatter of European politics. I understand


that but the main groupings on the left and the right have said there


will be a crisis if he is not nominated. That is not true. What


will happen is the groups will discuss it, Parliament will try and


push for Juncker, because they want this process which is based on the


loose interpretation of the Lisbon Treaty. There are heads of


government to have said clearly that Juncker was with Merkel and others


the other day and they have said they want a candidate for reform. It


is what most people have voted for and it is clear that Juncker does


not represent reform. But Angela Merkel is going for him. Can


anything stop him? Who would you like? We do not really care. They


are all the same. Who would you like? One thing we are clear about


is we are waiting to see what the commission will propose in terms of


the new president, the Council of ministers. It is the Council of


ministers. We are not in support of Juncker. It is as appointing the


Cameron has played this so badly in terms of Britain's influence. What


way has he played it badly? Said publicly. The way he initiated it.


The battle plan that was drawn and subsequently, it seems he has done


everything to alienate his allies across Europe. If you do not want


somebody, it hopes to have an alternative that other people do


want. Who would you have? There are other candidates who are committed


to reform. A number of candidates. There is Enda Kenny out there. He


has indicated he does not want it. Maybe it is about time we had a


female candidate. Who would that be? What is important is we are not


squabbling about who it is, we want real reform on the ground. That is


the most important thing. So who would your candidate be to deliver


real reform? I want to see which other alternatives are proposed. So


who? He is waiting to see who comes up. It is probably Mrs Gillick --


Mrs Kinnock, isn't it? You mean the Danish Prime Minister. It is a nice


job, well, not really, but it does not answer my question. Lets see


what comes out of this process. You are the head of this conservative


reformist group which is quite a big group now. We are the largest group.


I will come onto some of your allies in a minute. But what are you


advising the Minister? The Prime Minister is dealing with this at


head of government level. This is an institutional stand-off between a


misreading of the Lisbon Treaty where people in the Parliament


consider that they should propose, whereas Cameron has been clear it


should be heads of government who consider who it should be. You are


no socialist group, is to supporting Mr Juncker? I am speaking on behalf


of the Labour Party. But the group you are part of our supporting


Juncker. It is not about the institutional setup. What is the


political reason? He is an architect of what has been imposed across the


European Union. His political background is very different from


ours. What part did he play in austerity? Reader macro his role in


the commission. We are absolutely wanting to see someone who would


implement policies for jobs and growth. I cannot give you names and


candidates because it is the Council of Ministers. But you are allowed to


have a view. In deed! I do not have a name. You do not have a view, you


do not have of view and you do not care? There all the same, they all


dance around the same table. We want a candidate committed to reform. But


you will not tell me who it is so we will move on.


The European elections three weeks ago saw big gains for protest


parties and fringe groups on both the political left and right.


Partly a consequence of the deep - and for some countries -


As a result, Brussels will look and feel very different


as many new, younger faces try and influence how Europe is governed.


Jo has been to Brussels to meet some of them,


It seems getting elected as an MEP is just the beginning of the party


struggles to form power bases in the European Parliament. Building


political alliances with like-minded people is the key to winning votes.


But it is a tricky business as this week's negotiations in Brussels have


shown. Many of the winners in these elections were from new protest


parties, challenging the status quo. One of them, the German anti-Europe


party, opponents of Miss Merkel, are clear who they want to sit with. We


want to sit with people who think alike like the British


Conservatives. In our own party programme for the European


elections, we have made references to David Cameron's programme. There


are a lot of similarities. Yesterday, there was good news for


this party. Deals are being done all the time here in the European


Parliament. In this meeting room behind me, the European


Conservatives and reformist group, of which David Cameron's


Conservatives are part, have decided formally to admit a new group of


German MEPs. But making new political acquaintances risks


alienating more important friends. The reason why David Cameron warned


his own MEPs to vote against admitting the German Chancellor's


arch rivals into their ranks because Angela would be furious. It was not


enough, the new chair of the group, Tory MEP Syed Kamall put on a brave


face. David Cameron has made his these absolutely clear about the


AFD. He asked me to pass that view on. Now was not the time to look


back, it is time to look forward. Questions were also asked about why


the Conservatives are sitting with the Danish People's party and the


True Finns, whose views on immigration and Islam are


unacceptable, according to Labour. Nigel Farage was on an offensive


with the Italian media. He needs an Italian party on board to form a


parliamentary group. Without it, there will no access to funding and


committee posts. Nigel Farage is the one who has been flirting with us


more than others. How has he been flirting with you? Not with me


personally, but with my party. He has been talking to us. He probably


sees a different vision of Europe. Last night, they were celebrating


after an online referendum of 5-star Movement's supporters found a


majority favoured an alliance with Europe. Federalism versus euro


scepticism is not the only fault line. Pro-and anti-austerity parties


are also set to do battle. A new Greek far left party came first in


the elections and wants an end to the austerity measures of the past


few years. It is a catastrophe for the whole of Europe. It is


increasing explosion of inequalities and if it doesn't work, it creates a


lot of pain. The other goal is to stop the rise of far right parties


like the Front nationality. The party came first in the poll in


France but has not yet found enough partners for its new European


Alliance for freedom group. Sources say they are still one country


short. You had some good news some good


news last night. You need seven countries. How far short you? I


cannot answer that. They are all negotiating. We are working at it.


We are not going to the beach. What other possible candidates would you


like to see? What are your targets? Our targets really are the


negotiations are completely wide open at the moment. I cannot give


you those. You cannot give me one political party you may be looking


at. Do you still rule out the French National Front? They are really


unfortunate. They have very far right views. They do not sit well


with UKIP. We do not and will not sit with them. If you get a


grouping, what benefit will you get from that? Will you get more money?


We have the ability to have more staff. We have more research, more


publications, more airtime. You can get your message out much more


easily. When I saw Nigel Farage in Brussels earlier this week he said


the Conservatives are really gaining up to stop this. They would try to


pick off as many as they could. That is what they do, it is what we


expect. It is what happens. It is what they do, it is what we


politics. We want to impart on the largest growing group. We are the


third largest group. You have admitted the German AFD, which is a


rather moderate Eurosceptic group in Germany. The Conservative leadership


in London told you not to. David Cameron setup the group. It is now


the growing group. He did not want AFD. He asked me as leader of the


Conservatives to request MEPs not to vote for them. Because we are the


fastest-growing group, we are 19 out of 63 MEPs from 13 countries. We do


not have the majority. Some of the new MEPs voted for AFD. We do not


know that. It was a majority of one. Do you regret you voted to have AFD


joined a group? I am the leader of the group and I have to look


forward. We must make sure we must make sure we're looking forward to


the future and we are committed to reform. AFD have said they are


committed to reform. Within the European Parliament, we are going to


be the only group committed to reform in the European group. We are


going to be at the forefront. Let's have a look at who is part of this


consensus. Let's look at the Danish People's party. I you happy with


them? A spokesman once like all -- likened the Muslim headscarf to the


swastika. I had a conversation with them and asked them about the


allegations. They said they had moved on and would move towards the


future for a mainstream party. Let's face it. These very same people you


through accusations that are the same people who voted for me. Look


at me, Andrew! The first Muslim leader of any digital group in the


Muslim Parliament. How can you tell me which people voted for you? I


know the results of the ballot. It is quite clear who voted for me.


Morton is the leader of the party. He was actually convicted for


publishing material of a link between a multiethnic society and


rape, violence and forced marriages. I sat down with him and had a


conversation. He said, I was young, foolish, I have moved on. I want to


grow up. Are you happy to have these people as friends? As a party


committed to reform and committed to building a new Europe for 2015, not


looking back to the 1950s, it is exciting we can help people move


into the mainstream of policy. -- politics. It is claimed that is lamp


reveres paedophilia. It is not claimed that. -- Islam. I read the


blog and the blog said quite clearly, it was a freedom of speech


issue. They did not like being in the centre-right group because they


thought it was fabulous. -- Federalist. Why don't you, that


group? Sky we think it is important to have influence at European Union


level. -- we think. We are now the only UK party with a part of the


mainstream politics -- which is part of mainstream politics in the


European Union. We are after getting reform, bringing about the gross


Commissioner. It is about getting investment kick started properly.


Unless you believe in federalism, which I don't think you do, as he


probably would not be allowed to by Mr Miller band at the moment, you


will belong to a group you do not actually agree with. There are more


things we do agree with our colleagues across the European Union


than things we disagree with. This issue of federalism would be


something that is determined at the council of ministers, determined


across 28 countries. I do not believe across those 28 countries


there is an appetite to suddenly federalise, roller head to


federalism. That is the policy of Mr shorts and he is your leader.


Absolutely. -- Schulz. Which you have voted for him? We remained


neutral. It is an awful beauty parade. You're talking about


influence. We do not have any. You ask officially in the same pool for


candidates. -- you are fishing in the same pool for candidates. I


reject it. Unlike the Danish People's party. They are on a


political journey and they are committed to reform. I am glad you


are excited. I hope you will be one day.


You probably know what the flag of the EU looks like - 12 yellow


But did you know the European Union also has its own official anthem?


Or that there's a special EU Day every May?


Here's Adam with the latest of our A to Z guides to Europe.


The gift shop at the European Parliament. Proof you can put the EU


flag on just about anything. It is a serious business for this man, he is


head of protocol in Parliament. That means flax. We have two kinds of


flags. For the member states, we have better quality ones. They are


made of silk. The common flag is in polyester. That is a less noble


material. The rules say the European flag should be flown in every


meeting room and at every event and flowing correctly. It has a sense in


the way that the styles are always looking, the hat right up and the


feet, two feet open. Imagine it looked like this or this. These are


some of the rejects from the competition to design the flag held


in the 50s. It was originally the council of Europe, which oversees


the Court of Human Rights. In 1985 a bit of global branding was required.


In the present world, it is important. As national states, we


are really too small compared with these big countries like India or


China or let's say Brazil. It is instantly recognisable but you can


hum it. Unlike the EU official anthem, Owed To Joy by Beethoven. He


revealed all about it. It is the scale and the harmony. It is very


simple. More simple you cannot. Beethoven was a genius because of


that. A simplicity founded music of all cultures and all ages. It is


completely universal. More universal, more federal, more


European. More for everybody cannot find. Who knows the other emblems?


United in diversity of Europe 's official day, maybe ninth, if you


have your Euro branded calendar to hand. Then there is the symbol for


the Euro which is chosen because it looks like the Greek letter,


Epsilon. The two lines in the middle are meant to represent stability and


reliability. How is that going? Adam Fleming reporting. Does Europe


need its own anthem? Absolutely not. We are 28 member states. I do not


really need to ask you that. I will bring my own Union Jack and carry it


at all times. By Maggie do you have it on you? -- do you have it on you?


It is a beautiful piece of music. Beethoven. You are happy with the


national anthem? Not the national anthem, the European... What did you


do to celebrate the day? It was made a seventh, the run-up to the


European elections. I was undoubtedly on doorsteps. I was


knocking on doors, campaigning for further European form. You must have


celebrated EU day. I knocked on doors and lots of people told me all


the ills of the EU. I separated by telling what people told me. I was


delighted they would vote for us. David Cameron talked about British


values, Angela Merkel talked about the European spirit. What is the


difference? Weird gree with an outward looking -- we agree with an


outward looking Europe. By tabloid talk about British values against


European spirit. -- we talk about. We believe in freedom and tolerance.


The Europeans do not? They aren't against a one size fits all Europe.


-- they are against. Stop arguing. Next to my guests. Goodbye. --


thanks to my guests. MUSIC: "The Yeah Yeah Yeah Song"


by the Flaming Lips # Yeah-yeah-yeah-yeah


Yeah-yeah-yeah-yeah MUSIC: "The Yeah Yeah Yeah Song"


by the Flaming Lips # Yeah-yeah-yeah-yeah




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