Live Justice Questions House of Commons


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Order, order. Questions to the Secretary of State for Justice.

:00:07.:00:20.

Kevin Foster. Question number one. Mr Speaker, the court and Tribunal

:00:21.:00:24.

service is evaluating all responses to the consultation and no decisions

:00:25.:00:32.

have been made. Announcements on the future of Torquay Magistrates' Court

:00:33.:00:35.

will be made in due course. I thank the Minister for his answer. At the

:00:36.:00:42.

end of this month, a successful team at the building is due to be

:00:43.:00:49.

evicted. Is this a sign that the decision has not yet taken and... ?

:00:50.:01:03.

I'm grateful to clarify the issue. No decisions have been taken. The

:01:04.:01:09.

arrangements for the turnaround integrated offender management team

:01:10.:01:12.

using the building was always due to end of this month. Alternative

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arrangements have been made for them to continue to provide valuable

:01:19.:01:21.

services locally. Question number two. The Conservative election

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manifesto included a commitment to introduce a new victims' law and

:01:31.:01:36.

enshrined the rights of victims including the right to a personal

:01:37.:01:42.

statement before prisoners are considered for release. I believe in

:01:43.:01:45.

the importance of giving victims a voice. I thank him for the answer.

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And Forbes, his son was murdered by five men in Corby in 1993, has this

:01:55.:02:00.

year had to read out three of these victim statements. This has taken a

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toll on her family and her health. Will he meet with us to discuss the

:02:06.:02:09.

role of victim statements and how they can work better for victims and

:02:10.:02:15.

their families? The whole idea of a victim statements is for the victims

:02:16.:02:19.

to fuel that they are part of the process and not for it to be a

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burden. I will meet with them to see how her experiences could improve

:02:26.:02:32.

the situation. The average time taken from charging to Crown Court

:02:33.:02:39.

trial is close to one year. That is lamentable for victims. What is the

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justice in that -- what is the Justice Minister going to do? I

:02:49.:02:55.

agree that this length of time should be improved and the whole

:02:56.:02:58.

experience for victims must be improved. The Justice Secretary has

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announced measures to increase the process and more will be coming

:03:06.:03:11.

forward shortly. Victims always remain victims were as criminals

:03:12.:03:15.

eventually served their sentence in full so will the Minister insurer,

:03:16.:03:18.

especially in cases of violent crimes, parole is rarely given? This

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is a matter for the Parole Board but my honourable friend is absolutely

:03:27.:03:29.

right that victims are victims for life, which is why the support the

:03:30.:03:36.

Government intends and continues to give to victims is important. One of

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my constituents'. Was murdered and her body was never found. The

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killer, whilst reviewing to review the whereabouts of her remains, is

:03:55.:04:00.

being considered for parole. Can he ensure cases like these are never

:04:01.:04:07.

released? I would like to meet the constituent is possible to make sure

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we can help her and her family as much as possible, but it is

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imperative that I think that where victims feel like they can and want

:04:17.:04:24.

to, their statements are taken into account. When are the wider

:04:25.:04:29.

community going to get a say on parole hearings? Violent crime might

:04:30.:04:36.

affect a whole community. When will they get a say alongside presentence

:04:37.:04:40.

reports so they are represented and their voices heard regarding the

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impact violent crime has an people? He raises an important point. But we

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must be careful that we do not take away from the individual victims

:04:55.:04:58.

feeling they are part of the process which is something that everyone in

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this House has been trying to do for years. We must also be careful we

:05:03.:05:10.

did not create a vigilante situation. I understand his point

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but we must make sure the criminal justice system works for every body.

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Question number three. Crime is falling and the female prison

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population is consistently under 4000 for the first time in ten

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years. Last year over 70% of women successfully completed their

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sentence in the community that we want to do more so in partnership

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with the Government equalities office we are making a ?200,000

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grant available to support local areas and pilot multi-agency

:05:48.:05:52.

approaches to female offending. It remains that across the UK the

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number of women in prison has doubled since 2000. Many are mothers

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serving six months or less for minor offences and this car as irreparable

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damage to family life. Will the Minister follow the example of the

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SNP Scottish Government on working harder to reduce the number of women

:06:12.:06:16.

in prison and get community services were possible? -- sentences? This is

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what these pilot schemes are about. Female offenders often have complex

:06:26.:06:30.

needs, are more likely to self harm or be victims of abuse than male

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counterparts. This pilot will help to divert women away from it pathway

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into prison. These are schemes which recognise sending them to prison can

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have a devastating effect on them and their dependents and children.

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Will the Minister confirm that for every single category of offence, a

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man is more likely to be sent to listen than a woman, for longer, and

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will serve more of their sentence in prison than a woman? In this age of

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gender equality that the Government believes in, what possible

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justification can there be for further releasing women from prison

:07:14.:07:17.

rather than men and what assessment as she made as to whether or not

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that breaks discrimination law? I am happy to answer this. Obviously

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sentences are on the individual offence and male offenders will come

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to knew to be supported through existing processes to address their

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needs but let's not forget our prison and privation service were

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designed with men in mind because that is 95% of the people. What

:07:51.:07:56.

levels of support are being considered for the dependents of

:07:57.:08:00.

those women, many who are young children. An excellent point. In our

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women's prisons we have made an effort to engage with families and

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children. Some prisoners have the opportunity to hold overnight visits

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with their children. These pilots are about recognising behaviour

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early on so we can divert women and bring in local authorities to divert

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women from ending up in prison. Question number four. The Government

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is committed to the residence test and plans the next steps following

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success in the Court of Appeal. Individuals should have a strong

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connection to the UK to benefit from the legal aid scheme. The Minister

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was forced to admit last year that there were no precise figures for

:08:57.:09:03.

savings from this. It was also criticised by the joint committee on

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human rights and is subject to further Supreme Court legal

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scrutiny. Is it not time he gave up the ghost on this? Given the

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judgment of the Court of Appeal when they sided with the Government, we

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have no intention of giving up. People who seek to benefit from UK

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taxpayers should show connections to the country and it is reasonable

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that people should have a continues to month residency in the UK before

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the benefit from tax payer money for legal aid. When the Minister

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considers legal aid and potential for change, as he thought of the

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disparity between one parent to abuses of legal aid to get an upper

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hand in contact cases with their children, against another parent who

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has to self finance? There are rules and regulations as to who qualifies

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or not and I can't comment on individual cases but the legal aid

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agency choice to make sure only those who qualify tried to make --

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get access. He criticised the two nation justice system but by

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restricting legal aid according to residency time, it widens the gap

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between those afforded access to justice and not. The residence test

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would have denied justice to the family of John Charleston Jean

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Charles De Menezes. It is right that British people in their millions say

:10:59.:11:07.

they have some connection before they are given access. It has gone

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to the processes and the Court of Appeal and if it goes further than

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this government will object robust leader defend its on the residence

:11:18.:11:18.

test. Question five. Thank you, Mr

:11:19.:11:38.

Speaker. We will be reviewing the entire structure and purpose of the

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orders handed down by the courts to offenders. Reviewing similar options

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for further improvement. Objections have been raised, in light of those

:11:51.:11:55.

concerns I decided to pause while the wider review is carried out.

:11:56.:12:02.

May I take this opportunity to congratulate the secretary of state

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for scrapping yet another proposal which was put forward by his

:12:07.:12:10.

predecessor. May I remind him that his cheap weapon at the time did

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vote for the policy? Individuals have incurred high levels of

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personal debt because of this cost. Bearing that in mind, will be

:12:23.:12:27.

secretary of state reveal and waive the outstanding payments which do

:12:28.:12:32.

nothing but blight our finances and our justice system and place an

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administrative cost on the taxpayer? I'm grateful for the kind words...

:12:37.:12:43.

LAUGHTER While I was not an unprecedented

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success as Chief Whip I did manage to vote with the Government for the

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majority of time while I was in that post.

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It is the case that people will pay penalties under this charge, that

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will be the law until the 24th of December, after which people will

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not be paying the criminal courts charge.

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Members on both sides of this house will be pleased at the fixed charge

:13:11.:13:13.

will no longer apply from this month. But does the secretary of

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state agreed that it is right that criminals should contribute not only

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towards supporting victims but also towards the costs?

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My honourable friend makes an important point. One of the ways in

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which we are reviewing the system is that there is a triple purpose.

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Remedies need to be paid, those that cross the threshold of a lonely to

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be punished, but there should also be a motion to the support of

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victims. Until the 24th of December,

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magistrates will be forced to impose watches now a discredited charge

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which has caused many of them to resign. What finances will the

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Secretary of State give to those people in the meantime?

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It is my responsibility to uphold the rule of law. We will take steps

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after the proper review of the criminal courts charge and after the

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spending review to suspend the charge. 21 days after this statutory

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instrument was laid, that is the 24th of December, then will be no

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further imposition of the charge. Can I also welcome the Lord

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Chancellor's fifth or sixth U-turn. Will he now clean up the mess he has

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made rather than walking away from it? When will the Chancellor deal

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with legislation was Mack? Will the Chancellor tell us the cost of this

:15:00.:15:03.

debacle and how it adds to the 15 million he has already wasted on the

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advertising and of the secure college?

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That was something of a multifaceted question. I think we can rely on the

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secretary of state to respond with his customary elegant simplicity.

:15:18.:15:24.

Thank you, Mr Speaker. There was more questions in that particular

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Sally then in a multiple-choice GCSE maths paper. I hesitate to say what

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the mark would be. I suggest we move as expeditiously as possible to

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suspend the charge, the advice of the legal department was that this

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was the most effective way of relieving magistrates of the

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obligation to impose it. Question six, Mr Speaker.

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With permission, I wish to group this with numbers ten and 17 as

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well. I'm delighted we have secured many millions of pounds of funding.

:16:03.:16:10.

We have enacted a plan to reform our court system to deliver swift and

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fairer justice to everyone in England and Wales at a lower cost.

:16:15.:16:22.

Mr Speaker, my constituents face the close of their two local courts in

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Pontypridd and Bridgend. Can I ask the Minister Howley responds to the

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president of the Law Society when he responds when reductions in court

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fees and legal aid, many of these closures will serve to deepen the

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inequalities in the justice system. How does you respond to that?

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What I would say to the honourable gentleman is that it is important

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that we recognise in the 21st-century that of the justice

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buildings we have, one third are used less than 50%. Many of these

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buildings are not fit for purpose. They are listed, they are not in

:17:08.:17:12.

compliance with equalities legislation, the cost of running

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them is phenomenal. We need to make sure we have a reformed and

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up-to-date modern court system which will, I can assure you, provide

:17:20.:17:27.

access to justice for all. I thank the Minister for that

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answer. Does he agree with me that it is high time in the 21st-century

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that we update our outdated court practices, particularly in regard to

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those with the way those with learning disabilities are treated?

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Absolutely. Can I just say to my honourable friend that as a

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consequence of the ?700 million investment that we received in the

:17:53.:17:57.

spending review, we have a once in a generation opportunity to create and

:17:58.:18:00.

what, user focused Courts Tribunals Service. The form of this

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service is crucial to provide better access for all, critically those

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with learning difficulties. We want to make sure everyone has access to

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all the facilities that are public facilities offer.

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As part of the Government's operation Cheltenham and Gloucester

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Magistrates' Courts can expect to receive cases from across the

:18:30.:18:35.

region. What steps will be taken to make sure this Court has the

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staffing resources they need? It is already the case that all

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Magistrates' Court work in Gloucestershire is heard at this

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Court. Should more work be moved into Cheltenham following the

:18:52.:18:55.

outcome of the consultation, then the Courts Tribunals Service will

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continue to assess the resources available at the court to make sure

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the meat operational requirements. I should emphasise that no decisions

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had been made for this Court as yet. My constituents in Stockport would

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probably understand where the Minister is coming from. Where they

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are Court has knocked down for closure. It is one of the busiest in

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Greater Manchester, refurbished as recently as 2010, and it has

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specialist facilities for witness support and protection. Isn't this a

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short-sighted moved by the Ministry of Justice? Will he now save

:19:35.:19:41.

Stockport courthouse? There is a think short-sighted about

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is to make sure that people such as is to make sure that people such as

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the honourable gentleman and his constituents can have their say and

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make a contribution, and try to persuade us that, perhaps after all

:19:55.:19:57.

things are being considered, the court should be retained. As I said,

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no decisions have been made so far, we are very careful and considering

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also missions that are made. I listen to stories MPs and

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ministers -- Tory MPs and ministers talking about localism. How can this

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be a form of localism when people, in order to get justice, are having

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to travel 50 and 60 miles instead of going to the local courts? It

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nothing but hypocrisy. Mr Speaker, I have utmost respect

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for the honourable gentleman. May I just gently bring him into the

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21st-century, which he may not be familiar with, on the basis that

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with modern technology, such as video conferencing, telephone

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facilities, people will actually be able to have access to justice

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without having to go to court. Having access to justice doesn't

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simply mean attending a court and the physical building that it

:20:59.:21:04.

represents. I fully realise the rationale for

:21:05.:21:08.

court modernisation which will help create a more streamlined and

:21:09.:21:11.

responsive justice system, whilst also generating substantial savings

:21:12.:21:15.

to the taxpayer. I'm grateful to the Minster for a meeting with me to

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discuss the proposed closure of Stockport court. Can he provide any

:21:20.:21:29.

update on this Court's situation, and can he confirm that any

:21:30.:21:33.

considerations which may make the court Bible had been considered?

:21:34.:21:40.

In this proposed closure of 91 courts I have tried to make myself

:21:41.:21:44.

available to as many colleagues are possible. As far as I'm aware I have

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met with every single person has wanted a meeting. As virus this

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proposal is concerned, I'm seriously considering them. -- as far as these

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proposals. With permission, Mr Speaker I want

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to groupies with questions 12 and 13.

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It is designed to make it easier to get prisoners learning and working.

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At the employers Forum for reducing reoffending I have works to increase

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opportunities. A telecom firm in Pendle are working

:22:31.:22:37.

to increase unemployment opportunities. Will my honourable

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colleague Johnny and welcoming this work to rehabilitate offenders and

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region just into society? I'll heartedly join the honourable

:22:47.:22:55.

member. As many as 90% of companies have expressed an interest in

:22:56.:23:00.

employing ex-offenders. I hope the example of the employer in this

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constituency will inspire others. With my right honourable friend

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agree with me that it makes moral sense to give these people who wish

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to turn their lives around an opportunity? Does he is agree with

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me that it makes sound business sense that these people are often

:23:21.:23:29.

hard-working, very loyal employees? My honourable friend makes a very

:23:30.:23:33.

powerful point. It is both economically sensible to make sure

:23:34.:23:37.

that ex-offenders are in work. Something like 22% of those in

:23:38.:23:41.

receipt of out of work benefits are ex-offenders. It also makes moral

:23:42.:23:45.

sense to give people dignity and a chance to redeem themselves.

:23:46.:23:51.

My right honourable friend will be aware of my interest in the Cascade

:23:52.:23:58.

foundation who do amazing work in rehabilitating them -- ex-offenders

:23:59.:24:05.

with learning difficulties. I wonder if you might meet with me to explore

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ways they may further improve? I would be delighted to meet the

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honourable lady and her constituent. There are many outstanding firms

:24:20.:24:26.

which are doing more and more to employ offenders, but we do need to

:24:27.:24:30.

reduce the bureaucratic burden standing in their way.

:24:31.:24:34.

When I was part of the justice Select Committee earlier in the

:24:35.:24:40.

summer I visited Holloway prison. There was a licence scheme allowing

:24:41.:24:46.

women to carry out jobs. Well that worked out extremely well and

:24:47.:24:50.

Holloway, what can this secretary of state do to make sure this is

:24:51.:24:54.

consistently good across all the women's prisons in the UK?

:24:55.:25:01.

It is not just women's prisons, I would like to see this expanded

:25:02.:25:05.

across the whole prison estate. We need to make sure there is a

:25:06.:25:10.

appropriate assessment of the risk protest in releasing prisoners in

:25:11.:25:21.

this way. -- risk posed. Can I take the Secretary of State

:25:22.:25:26.

not to forget the past and ask him to look to the experience of a

:25:27.:25:36.

cluster of companies working in Reading prison - which I believe is

:25:37.:25:42.

due to close - the employment rate was a great success, let's make sure

:25:43.:25:44.

that model is not forgotten. In my open... Own constituency, we

:25:45.:26:00.

worked with offenders to work again. What specific measures are

:26:01.:26:08.

being put in place to reduce the bureaucracy that companies have too

:26:09.:26:12.

overcome in order to employ offenders? The first thing we must

:26:13.:26:19.

do is give governors a greater sense of freedom to invite employers in

:26:20.:26:24.

and ensure they can make use of prisoners while they are still on

:26:25.:26:27.

the prison estate and employ them through the gate and the specific

:26:28.:26:32.

reforms we hope to bring forward will give more of that freedom and

:26:33.:26:38.

flexibility. Does he agree that key to improving employment in prisons

:26:39.:26:42.

is giving more power to governors and control over what goes on in

:26:43.:26:48.

prisons and giving them in Camden ability -- accountability and

:26:49.:26:50.

control to make sure the quality is appropriate. Many members will be

:26:51.:27:00.

aware of a restaurant social enterprise. It has expanded and Parc

:27:01.:27:10.

prison is also part of the initiative, because of great

:27:11.:27:12.

governor 's leading institutions, which we can learn from. Question

:27:13.:27:22.

number eight. The Government is determined to help all offenders

:27:23.:27:27.

including ex-Armed Forces personnel in the criminal justice system to

:27:28.:27:29.

turn their lives around away from crime. I was surprised when I took

:27:30.:27:37.

over as the veterans Minister that we do not ask prisoners if they have

:27:38.:27:43.

served in the forces and we are now doing that. The vast majority of

:27:44.:27:50.

military personnel successfully transition back into civilian life

:27:51.:27:55.

however veterans represent the largest single cohort in our

:27:56.:28:01.

prisons. Will he join me in praising the excellent work of care after

:28:02.:28:06.

combat, whose project Phoenix aims to reduce reoffending rates by

:28:07.:28:12.

mentoring veterans in prison and upon release? We should praise the

:28:13.:28:21.

entire voluntary sector which help, particularly with veterans. Project

:28:22.:28:31.

Phoenix, which was started by care after combat seems to be very

:28:32.:28:37.

successful. They were successful in getting ?1 million from the libel or

:28:38.:28:52.

fund -- Libor fund. Can we help with reducing reoffending rather than

:28:53.:28:58.

dealing with it in prison, by identifying the causes? It is a good

:28:59.:29:09.

and important point. I served in the armed forces and I left early and

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the support was minimal. We must support them because they have

:29:15.:29:23.

fighting for us. A similar sort of question but will the Secretary of

:29:24.:29:27.

State work with this victory as it for defence and the MOD to review

:29:28.:29:30.

the transition process so we understand why so many are going

:29:31.:29:37.

into prison? One of the reasons this government brought in the military

:29:38.:29:41.

covenant act was exactly this sort of situation and I have the honour

:29:42.:29:49.

of sitting on that committee sought these discussions take place

:29:50.:30:01.

regularly. Number nine. We are interest in using sports -based

:30:02.:30:08.

initiatives. We have part funded initiative called the national

:30:09.:30:12.

alliance of support for the assistance of crime which will

:30:13.:30:16.

provide evidence for whether and how sport may assist. The often troubled

:30:17.:30:23.

people who fall prey to extremist ideology, instead of having their

:30:24.:30:27.

anger on strike directed elsewhere, are to be pitied. Is the Minister to

:30:28.:30:38.

be aware of the success of boxing in rehabilitation and will he look at

:30:39.:30:41.

piloting noncontact boxing schemes in more prisons and for more

:30:42.:30:49.

categories of fender? I thank her for question and she has been

:30:50.:30:52.

persistent on this issue and she is right there is promising evidence

:30:53.:30:57.

for the positive influence of sport in rehabilitation. Across the UK we

:30:58.:31:07.

have 183 programmes, although not in all reasons. I will be very happy to

:31:08.:31:13.

meet with my honourable friend to speak further about these

:31:14.:31:20.

initiatives. I am not convinced that teaching potential jihadists table

:31:21.:31:28.

tennis or boxing will form part of anti-radicalisation programmes. But

:31:29.:31:40.

an officer should monitor radicalisation. We will proceed

:31:41.:31:48.

according to the evidence of what we find for the initiative we have just

:31:49.:31:53.

launched. He will know the Secretary of State has launched an independent

:31:54.:31:57.

review of extremism across the prison estate. I met with the former

:31:58.:32:02.

governor who was conducting that review yesterday and we will report

:32:03.:32:12.

in due course. I'm afraid there is a widening chasm between what the

:32:13.:32:15.

Secretary of State and the Minister says about what is happening in

:32:16.:32:21.

prisons, and the reality. I do not doubt that he is sincere in his

:32:22.:32:26.

belief that improvements are happening but when in most prisons

:32:27.:32:31.

exercise in the fresh air that the honourable lady wishes to see is

:32:32.:32:36.

limited to half an hour and purposeful activity outcomes are at

:32:37.:32:40.

the lowest level inspectors ever recorded, due to understaffing, how

:32:41.:32:46.

can he suggest there is anything other than a crisis in prisons? What

:32:47.:32:58.

I can say to that is that we have been successful in getting more

:32:59.:33:02.

prison officers onto the landings in the country. A net increase in 540

:33:03.:33:12.

prison officers which means less restricted regimes, more activities,

:33:13.:33:16.

and we will carry on recruiting at that number to the end of March next

:33:17.:33:24.

year when we seek an additional 1700 to 2000 officers. The Government

:33:25.:33:32.

believes it is a modern for children and young people to have access to

:33:33.:33:35.

justice and that is why we made sure legal aid funding is available for

:33:36.:33:39.

the highest priority cases, including many related to children.

:33:40.:33:47.

It is said many children are relying more on the advice and support of

:33:48.:33:54.

their security guard them legal term. What steps are being taken to

:33:55.:34:07.

help children? We are closely impacting any changes. We have this

:34:08.:34:15.

constantly under review and would be concerned if vulnerable children

:34:16.:34:17.

were not getting the help they needed. Number 14, please. In the

:34:18.:34:25.

past five years we have taken action to put country's finances back on

:34:26.:34:31.

track, while rejecting legal aid for those who need it most. It remains a

:34:32.:34:35.

vital part of the justice system and we should make sure it is

:34:36.:34:39.

sustainable and fair for those who need it. I am pleased the recent

:34:40.:34:47.

spending review led to no further reductions in criminal legal aid. I

:34:48.:34:53.

thank him for the response. All victims of domestic violence must be

:34:54.:34:59.

fully supported. Does the Minister agree that it is vital we continue

:35:00.:35:05.

to maintain full access to justice for victims of domestic violence all

:35:06.:35:11.

the way through the legal system? Yes, I agree. We have made sure that

:35:12.:35:19.

legal aid remains available for victims of domestic violence who

:35:20.:35:24.

need it. We have made recent changes to make it easier to obtain legal

:35:25.:35:29.

aid when domestic violence is a factor and once it is granted no

:35:30.:35:33.

further applications need to be made for the duration of the case.

:35:34.:35:39.

Chester is a centre for the legal industry and I am told numerous

:35:40.:35:43.

criminal legal aid solicitors have been forced out of business or to

:35:44.:35:47.

amalgamate with large firms and barristers are being forced to

:35:48.:35:54.

subsidise the access to justice of legal cases because they are not

:35:55.:35:57.

being paid enough through the current legal aid system. Will the

:35:58.:36:02.

Minister review changes to legal aid and deal with it by reversing these

:36:03.:36:13.

disastrous changes? We have a legal aid budget of 1.6 billion pounds,

:36:14.:36:21.

one of the largest in the world. In terms of other common law due

:36:22.:36:25.

restrictions like Australia, Northern Ireland, Canada, we have

:36:26.:36:28.

double the expenditure per inhabitant. We have started a

:36:29.:36:33.

process and will see it through and I can assure him that those who are

:36:34.:36:37.

in need of legal aid will be able to have it where necessary. Number 15.

:36:38.:36:50.

We can't rule out ever withdrawing from the EC HR but our proposals are

:36:51.:36:57.

focused on remaining within the convention which retains a

:36:58.:37:04.

common-sense list of rights. A constitutional court could

:37:05.:37:08.

potentially have primacy over Strasbourg decisions and that should

:37:09.:37:12.

be a part of further consultation? He makes a powerful point. We

:37:13.:37:19.

respect that the convention includes a common-sense list of rights and

:37:20.:37:21.

wants to make sure we have the proper interpretation of those

:37:22.:37:25.

rights and a Supreme Court that remains supreme. It should also be

:37:26.:37:32.

said that where the goals posts are shifted, it ought to be this House

:37:33.:37:39.

who has the last word. It was reported last week that the

:37:40.:37:43.

consultation on government plans to scrap the Human Rights Act will not

:37:44.:37:48.

be published until the New Year. Can the Secretary of State confirm when

:37:49.:37:52.

he intends to them for a British bill of rights and will he commit to

:37:53.:37:56.

ensuring there is full consultation and adequate time will be given to

:37:57.:38:03.

consider and answer responses? We have made clear that the proposals

:38:04.:38:08.

will be brought forward in the New Year for full consultation. We want

:38:09.:38:14.

to look at the impact of the jurisprudence of the Court of

:38:15.:38:20.

Justice in Luxembourg as well as a Strasbourg but I can reassure her

:38:21.:38:24.

that we will take the Scottish views very seriously. I have met with the

:38:25.:38:29.

Scottish Justice Minister and a range of practitioners and NGOs. In

:38:30.:38:38.

June, the Secretary of State assured this House that in his view human

:38:39.:38:42.

rights were a reserved matter. However last week he told the House

:38:43.:38:46.

of Lords Constitution offers admitted that legislation is about

:38:47.:38:54.

human rights are not there reserved nor devolved -- night reserved nor

:38:55.:39:02.

devolved. Would a Bill of Rights require the consent of the Scottish

:39:03.:39:07.

Government and is here where there is no question of such consent being

:39:08.:39:13.

given? Revising the Human Rights Act can only be done by the UK

:39:14.:39:18.

Government but implementation of human rights is devolved. SNP policy

:39:19.:39:25.

suggests Westminster is attacking human rights but the SNP agree that

:39:26.:39:29.

they do not want to give prisoners the vote. After the Scotland Bill

:39:30.:39:35.

becomes law, the Scottish parliament will be able to decide who votes in

:39:36.:39:43.

Scottish elections so the only way they can continue to back prisoners

:39:44.:39:46.

is by relying on Westminster legislation. She has no

:39:47.:39:54.

responsibility to confirm anything. He engages in rhetorical

:39:55.:40:00.

pyrotechnics but we did not need a treat as an SNP party matters. The

:40:01.:40:08.

Government policy of bringing in a British Bill of Rights I'm sure will

:40:09.:40:14.

be welcome across the whole house. With the Minister confirm that

:40:15.:40:17.

rather than rushing it we get it correct and bring it forward so

:40:18.:40:23.

everyone has had their say and we get it so it will stand the test of

:40:24.:40:29.

time? He is right. We make no apology for thinking through tricky

:40:30.:40:33.

constitutional issues and if only the Labour government has done them

:40:34.:40:41.

the same -- had done the same. Tony Blair is said he had opted out from

:40:42.:40:49.

the EU chartered only to find it looked like a sieve. -- leak. I

:40:50.:41:01.

think we nearly missed the honourable gentleman.

:41:02.:41:10.

Your very kind, Mr Speaker. I returned to Scotland. Clarity on

:41:11.:41:16.

this issue is now extremely important. Will the Minister say

:41:17.:41:21.

quite clearly that the deputy leader of the house was wrong when she said

:41:22.:41:25.

human rights were, a reserved right for the UK Parliament. Would you say

:41:26.:41:30.

she was wrong? I have made very clear the position.

:41:31.:41:35.

We have consistently made clear that revising the Human Rights Act can

:41:36.:41:40.

only be done by the UK, Mack. It is very clear. -- UK Government.

:41:41.:41:49.

Question 16. The Government is monitoring

:41:50.:41:55.

caseloads. It is too early to draw any firm conclusions at this stage.

:41:56.:42:00.

We will continue to keep the impact of any changes under review. We

:42:01.:42:04.

realise the changes are not popular, but at every stage we have moved to

:42:05.:42:08.

protect the most honourable by making sure they will not have to

:42:09.:42:12.

pay new and higher fees. In the current climate it is only right

:42:13.:42:17.

that we are taking any opportunity to raise fees.

:42:18.:42:24.

In March 2015 the Court issued fee for a ?200,000 claim was raised by

:42:25.:42:30.

over 600%. Does the Minister appreciate the impact that has an

:42:31.:42:34.

small, start-up companies, many of which are in my constituency? Will

:42:35.:42:40.

he assure them they will not be a further rise after the consultation?

:42:41.:42:45.

It is important that the honourable gentleman appreciates the court

:42:46.:42:48.

system needs to be properly funded. We also need to have an effective

:42:49.:42:51.

admission system so that people cannot afford, do not pay those

:42:52.:42:57.

fees. I should also state that the honourable gentleman should remember

:42:58.:43:01.

that the court fees are a tiny fraction of the total fees incurred.

:43:02.:43:07.

Topical questions. Number one, Mr Speaker.

:43:08.:43:13.

With your position to their schmo and permission, Mr Speaker, I hope

:43:14.:43:19.

that the whole house will agree that we are on the date of prison

:43:20.:43:22.

officers who will work over the Christmas period. I wish to

:43:23.:43:29.

congratulate the newly elected leader of the prison officers

:43:30.:43:33.

Association, and my department will work with them to improve their

:43:34.:43:36.

situation and support them in every way we can.

:43:37.:43:40.

Can I associate myself with the Justice Secretary's remark. Court

:43:41.:43:49.

charges and similar matters, millions of pounds wasted so far.

:43:50.:43:54.

Could the Justice Secretary lay before the house the full cost of

:43:55.:43:59.

these changes in policy, and which minister is responsible for the

:44:00.:44:02.

waste of public money? The honourable lady started any

:44:03.:44:09.

admirable way in a bipartisan manner. The by-product of each of

:44:10.:44:14.

the policies she mentioned is that we take the decision in the best

:44:15.:44:19.

interest of the taxpayer. Paul gamba Cheney, Jim Davidson,

:44:20.:44:27.

Jimmy Tarbuck have all talked of the appalling trauma and stress of

:44:28.:44:31.

having an investigation following allegations being conducted in the

:44:32.:44:35.

full glare of publicity. And then for the case to be closed with no

:44:36.:44:39.

further action, never mind the inclusion of the BBC over the

:44:40.:44:47.

investigation of Cliff Richard. Has the Government given any

:44:48.:44:49.

consideration to turning the clock back to where it used to be, so that

:44:50.:44:54.

these investigations could be conducted with no publicity until

:44:55.:44:59.

charged? I absolutely take account of the

:45:00.:45:05.

very important point raised. It is the Government's position that there

:45:06.:45:10.

should be a right to anonymity before the point of charge. The

:45:11.:45:14.

decision to release the details of the suspect in an investigation is

:45:15.:45:19.

one for the police to take. We should not interfere in the

:45:20.:45:24.

independence of the police, but the points raised is an important one. I

:45:25.:45:29.

think it is vitally important that we recognise the right to be

:45:30.:45:35.

regarded as innocent is an important one, and one that should be

:45:36.:45:38.

respected by everyone involved in the administration of justice.

:45:39.:45:48.

Briefly, if I may, working links which run rehabilitation companies

:45:49.:45:51.

in Wales and the West of England, are announcing redundancies of up to

:45:52.:45:58.

44% of staff, some 600 jobs. If these redundancies go ahead, what

:45:59.:46:01.

will the Secretary of State do to make sure the standard us service

:46:02.:46:05.

and safety of the public is maintained?

:46:06.:46:09.

The reforms introduced in the last Parliament have enhanced the quality

:46:10.:46:14.

of probation support that offenders enjoy, and we need to make sure that

:46:15.:46:18.

the improvements that have been made or built upon. Each of the community

:46:19.:46:23.

rehabilitation companies will make their own decisions on the Nexus

:46:24.:46:33.

staff in order to those decisions. These decisions are made in the

:46:34.:46:36.

interest of safety. The Lord Chancellor has seen the

:46:37.:46:42.

outrageous treatment reported today... Article eight of the ECHR

:46:43.:46:53.

was breached by an NHS Trust which reached a -- placed a do not

:46:54.:46:57.

resuscitate order against the wishes of the family. Is it not time, in

:46:58.:47:03.

the week where we celebrate European human rights Day, for the Chancellor

:47:04.:47:08.

to do another esteemed U-turns and keep the Human Rights Act?

:47:09.:47:12.

The case the honourable gentleman raises is indeed a very serious one,

:47:13.:47:16.

and I cannot imagine any human rights legislation that any of the

:47:17.:47:22.

parties in this house would subscribe to that were in any way

:47:23.:47:25.

countenanced the sort of behaviour that he has described.

:47:26.:47:33.

A recent report revealed that nearly 400 legal travelling campers across

:47:34.:47:42.

Warwickshire in the last four years. These are costing the taxpayer

:47:43.:47:44.

hundreds of thousands of pounds. Previous Justice Secretary 's pledge

:47:45.:47:50.

to deal with this issue, so will my honourable friend agreed to meet

:47:51.:47:53.

with me to discuss the progress that has been made?

:47:54.:48:01.

Mr Speaker, illegal encampment is cause a real worry too local

:48:02.:48:09.

residents. I will meet with the honourable gentleman. Local

:48:10.:48:13.

authorities have substantial powers already. There was a situation in

:48:14.:48:18.

Harlow that has been completely resolved because of some backbone in

:48:19.:48:27.

the local government they are. Many magistrates resigned over the

:48:28.:48:30.

fees which the secretary of state has now reversed because they felt

:48:31.:48:34.

that people were pleading guilty when they were innocent, because the

:48:35.:48:38.

fees would otherwise be excessive. What estimate has the Secretary of

:48:39.:48:45.

State made while making this decision of how many innocent people

:48:46.:48:48.

pled guilty in this time? I take account of the point. I think

:48:49.:48:54.

in certain circumstances we have to let the judgments of those courts

:48:55.:48:59.

rest, but every single magistrate who felt for whatever reason he

:49:00.:49:02.

could not sit on the bench because of that policy, I would invite to

:49:03.:49:07.

reconsider. Wimbledon is the home of one of

:49:08.:49:11.

London's provision services resource centres. There is a focus on

:49:12.:49:16.

providing ex-offenders with education. Given the importance of

:49:17.:49:21.

education skills to rehabilitation, does my friend agree that the

:49:22.:49:31.

rehabilitation service need someone can bring a concentration on that?

:49:32.:49:37.

I agree with my honourable friend. He will be aware of the importance

:49:38.:49:45.

of improving education in prayer the Leigh prisons, as highlighted in the

:49:46.:49:56.

review. I work in the pointy made. Mr Speaker, further to my earlier

:49:57.:50:03.

intervention, could I remind the Minister of the tens if not hundreds

:50:04.:50:06.

of thousands of pounds that had been spent in recent years on the courts

:50:07.:50:14.

in the Pontypridd and Bridgend. When they consider the upgrades, they

:50:15.:50:18.

have been upgraded, do not close them.

:50:19.:50:22.

What I say is that access to justice comes in very spawns. Can I say one

:50:23.:50:29.

thing to him that an African Chief Justice said to me earlier this

:50:30.:50:34.

year? He said that he wanted to see a justice system whereby the people

:50:35.:50:37.

living in the villages outside the capital city could access their

:50:38.:50:41.

courts through their mobile phones. That is how the world is

:50:42.:50:44.

progressing, and we have to make sure we keep pace with it as well.

:50:45.:50:50.

Will keep the majesty of the court building for those serious cases

:50:51.:50:53.

which require it, but we need to recognise that modern technology

:50:54.:50:56.

requires different forms of unification, and accessed to justice

:50:57.:51:06.

is not what it was in the past. The statement last week was welcome

:51:07.:51:11.

on a number of counts, in particular the reference to problem-solving

:51:12.:51:16.

courts in New York which the Justice Select Committee has looked at in

:51:17.:51:19.

on the disgust the Leigh discussions on the disgust the Leigh discussions

:51:20.:51:25.

he is having and how we take this process forward? -- the discussions.

:51:26.:51:34.

We are hearing from the chair of the justice let committee,... Secretary

:51:35.:51:44.

of State. I think it was the case that Lord

:51:45.:51:47.

Woolf when he was Lord Chief Justice and David Blunkett agreed that it

:51:48.:51:53.

was important to exploit the potential of probable scoring

:51:54.:51:59.

courts, to -- problem-solving courts. I know that the Justice

:52:00.:52:06.

Select Committee has highlighted certain work in America and will

:52:07.:52:14.

make announcements of decisions... The Government's own figures

:52:15.:52:19.

revealed the number of serious crimes committed by violent and sex

:52:20.:52:23.

offenders after leaving prison has risen by more than 28%. 222

:52:24.:52:30.

offenders under supervision in community were charged with crime

:52:31.:52:35.

including murderers, manslaughter and sexual offences in 2014. This

:52:36.:52:42.

has been said this is partly due to the privatisation, so that

:52:43.:52:47.

information exchange between agencies is not quite enough. Will

:52:48.:52:51.

the Minister explain what urgent steps he's taking to address this

:52:52.:52:54.

issue? The honourable Lido is right that

:52:55.:53:01.

serious offences are serious matters from which we must learn every

:53:02.:53:05.

possible lesson to make sure there is now repeat. But I do not agree

:53:06.:53:11.

with her that the rehabilitation reforms are in anyway responsible

:53:12.:53:14.

for a degradation of the probation service. I would remind her that

:53:15.:53:21.

there are 45,000 criminals who are now receiving probation supervision

:53:22.:53:24.

who did not get it before, because the last government brought in a

:53:25.:53:36.

system where they did not receive probation after being in prison for

:53:37.:53:40.

less than a year. Will the Minister's Department be

:53:41.:53:48.

giving full consideration for the case for Lowestoft magistrate court

:53:49.:53:53.

to remain open? I had to beat it with my honourable

:53:54.:53:57.

friend, and I can assure him that we are giving very serious

:53:58.:54:00.

consideration to all that he and his colleagues have given in regard to

:54:01.:54:03.

his local court. Has the Minister read the recent

:54:04.:54:11.

Locked Out report by Barnardos would say that improvements to a scheme

:54:12.:54:19.

mean that a child's right to see his father being eroded. Does the

:54:20.:54:26.

Minister think this is a good thing for the children whose fathers are

:54:27.:54:31.

in jail? I have met with Barnardos on a

:54:32.:54:34.

number of occasions and pay tribute to the work they do in this area.

:54:35.:54:37.

The secretary of state and I maintain the highest importance on

:54:38.:54:41.

maintaining family links for prisoners. You will continue to look

:54:42.:54:46.

at this policy and all policies which threaten family relationships.

:54:47.:54:53.

On the 27th of November, a transgender prisoner killed herself

:54:54.:54:59.

while serving in a male jail. What is the Government banning to do to

:55:00.:55:05.

address concern of another tragic death by a member of this honourable

:55:06.:55:12.

group of people? We take absolutely every death in

:55:13.:55:16.

custody very seriously. The management and care or transgendered

:55:17.:55:20.

people in prison is very complex and something we take seriously. We are

:55:21.:55:24.

currently undertaking a review of the relevant instruction to make

:55:25.:55:29.

sure that it does provide the correct balance between the

:55:30.:55:33.

individual and responsibility to safeguard all prisoners. This will

:55:34.:55:39.

be widened today to see what provision we can make across all

:55:40.:55:46.

areas of UK prisons. This review will engage with relevant

:55:47.:55:50.

stakeholders, and in addition, Peter Dawson from the Prison Reform Trust

:55:51.:55:58.

and a Dr from Gendered Intelligence which will be completed next year.

:55:59.:56:08.

I say kindly to the Minister that sometimes they may trim the official

:56:09.:56:18.

jargon which is written for them by others. The prison at Wrexham is

:56:19.:56:24.

extremely welcome but has the Minister had a chance to look at

:56:25.:56:29.

concerns made by the First Minister about the health care costs falling

:56:30.:56:38.

on the Assembly? I visited Wrexham a couple of weeks ago and I can tell

:56:39.:56:42.

the House the prison is progressing well and it has excellent work

:56:43.:56:48.

facilities. I am aware of his point and we will continue negotiations

:56:49.:56:51.

with the Welsh government. That is all I can say at this time. Our

:56:52.:57:01.

court system not only provides effective justice but it is also the

:57:02.:57:09.

choice of four for foreign litigation. Will he ensure our

:57:10.:57:17.

courts are not only effective for the resolution of domestic

:57:18.:57:20.

litigation but also international dispute resolution? It is a good

:57:21.:57:27.

point but she should bear in mind that the reason people come to

:57:28.:57:33.

Britain for legislation is not because of fees but expertise and

:57:34.:57:38.

the fact that UK law is used by large part of the world as well. How

:57:39.:57:43.

is transforming rehabilitation in Wales likely to achieve targets if

:57:44.:57:52.

operations are to move to Middlesbrough, making 200 staff

:57:53.:57:59.

redundant? I would say that these reforms give us the opportunity to

:58:00.:58:05.

bring down reoffending rates which have been high for a long time. We

:58:06.:58:09.

are tracking the performance very closely and we will continue to do

:58:10.:58:14.

so and in time I think we will see significant results from these

:58:15.:58:19.

reforms. I wrote to the Lord Chancellor and received on

:58:20.:58:24.

uncharacteristically noncommittal reply. Witty agree that the maximum

:58:25.:58:35.

tariff for child could take -- child cruelty, ten years, is to walk, and

:58:36.:58:39.

whether they will raise its 214 years? -- to 14 years? I'm afraid I

:58:40.:58:51.

will have to retain the enigmatic prevarication which characterised my

:58:52.:59:01.

previous communication with him. The High Court ruling of the 26th of

:59:02.:59:07.

November regarding the benefit cap applies to disabled people and their

:59:08.:59:12.

carers. What advice will he get to the secretary site for work and

:59:13.:59:18.

pensions in light of that? I will discuss it with him later. Order.

:59:19.:59:27.

Will the member wishing to take his seat please come to the table?

:59:28.:59:54.

Raise the Bible in your right hand. I swear by Almighty God that I will

:59:55.:00:06.

be faithful and bear allegiance to Queen

:00:07.:00:07.

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