Urgent Question - Grammar Schools House of Commons


Urgent Question - Grammar Schools

Similar Content

Browse content similar to Urgent Question - Grammar Schools. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!

Transcript


LineFromTo

the coming months. There is no shortage of demand in this session

:00:00.:00:00.

and I dare say it will continue. Urgent question, Angela Rayner. Two

:00:00.:00:00.

of the Secretary of State for Education to make a statement on

:00:07.:00:09.

government plans to lift the statutory ban on opening new grammar

:00:10.:00:14.

schools in England. Secretary of State. Thank you, Mr Speaker. As the

:00:15.:00:23.

Prime Minister has said, this government is committed to building

:00:24.:00:26.

a country which works for everyone and not only the privileged few. We

:00:27.:00:32.

believe every person should have the opportunity to fulfil their

:00:33.:00:34.

potential, no matter what their background, or where they are from.

:00:35.:00:39.

Education is at the heart of this ambition. We inherited a system from

:00:40.:00:44.

the last Labour government, however, were too many children left school

:00:45.:00:49.

without the qualifications, or the skills they needed to be successful

:00:50.:00:54.

in life. Our far-reaching reforms in the last six years have changed

:00:55.:00:59.

that. Strengthening school leadership, improving standards of

:01:00.:01:03.

behaviour in classrooms and making sure children are taught to read

:01:04.:01:08.

more effectively, improving mathematics teaching in primary

:01:09.:01:12.

schools. There are now 1.4 million more pupils in schools rated as

:01:13.:01:18.

good, or outstanding, than in 2010. That means more young people are

:01:19.:01:22.

getting the opportunity to access better teaching and to maximise

:01:23.:01:25.

their potential. That is what we want for all children and we are

:01:26.:01:30.

continuing reforms so that every child can have the best possible

:01:31.:01:35.

start in life. We are doubling the childcare to 30 hours for parents of

:01:36.:01:40.

three and four-year-olds and in July, on the issue of academic

:01:41.:01:45.

selection we are open minded. We cannot rule anything out which could

:01:46.:01:48.

help grow opportunity for all and give more people the chance to do

:01:49.:01:49.

well in life. The landscape for schools has

:01:50.:02:01.

changed greatly, we now have educational opportunities available.

:02:02.:02:07.

There will be no binary choice of the past, we're schools separate

:02:08.:02:09.

people into winners, losers, success or failure. Badge wearer

:02:10.:02:50.

schools. We want to build on our success and create a truly 21st

:02:51.:03:05.

century School system. We want a system that can cater for talent and

:03:06.:03:12.

the abilities of every single child, so to achieve that we need a truly

:03:13.:03:20.

diverse range of schools and specialisms. We need more

:03:21.:04:58.

good schools in more areas of the country responding to the needs of

:04:59.:05:01.

every child, regardless of their background.

:05:02.:05:21.

Education policy, that will be set in due course. Thank you. Despite

:05:22.:05:30.

the waffle, the cat is finally out of the bag. The government has

:05:31.:05:32.

revealed their plans for new grammar schools in England, but not in this

:05:33.:05:35.

House. We did not even hear word grammar. It was linked in the press.

:05:36.:05:38.

Will the Secretary of State promised today that future announcements will

:05:39.:05:41.

be made here so that we can give the policy the scrutiny it so badly

:05:42.:05:43.

needs? And perhaps she can tell us the evidence base for it today. As

:05:44.:05:46.

she read the ISS report entry into grammar schools in England? If so,

:05:47.:05:48.

perhaps she remembers the conclusion that among high achievers, those

:05:49.:05:51.

that are eligible for free school meals are significantly less likely

:05:52.:05:53.

to go to grammar school. The OECD, the Sutton Trust, and even the

:05:54.:05:55.

government's on social mobility Tsar have cited evidence against this

:05:56.:05:57.

policy. With schools facing jail term cuts to the budget for the

:05:58.:06:00.

first time in nearly two decades, pushing ahead with grammar schools

:06:01.:06:02.

shows a dangerous misunderstanding will be the lucky few that can

:06:03.:06:04.

afford the tuition who will get ahead, and the disadvantage that

:06:05.:06:07.

will be left behind. A policy for the few at the expense of the many.

:06:08.:06:10.

Mr Speaker, I was told that the Tories know the cost of everything

:06:11.:06:12.

but the value of nothing. I do not even think they know that any more.

:06:13.:06:15.

Finally, the Prime Minister promised to lead a one Nation government, but

:06:16.:06:18.

she said her policy would be led by the evidence. She claimed she would

:06:19.:06:20.

govern for the disadvantaged and not the privileged few, but this policy

:06:21.:06:23.

fail on every single count. It may be a new Prime Minister, but the

:06:24.:06:26.

same old nasty Tories. Thank you. I suppose the first thing I would say

:06:27.:06:28.

to the honourable lady is we haven't actually made any policy

:06:29.:06:30.

announcements yet. They will be made in due course. She has given a

:06:31.:06:33.

commentary on I guess what she presumes that policy announcement

:06:34.:06:35.

will be, and I would encourage her to wait. But broadly, what we're

:06:36.:06:37.

interested in doing is increasing diversity, meeting parents' desire

:06:38.:06:40.

for choice to have a school nearby to them who matches the needs of

:06:41.:06:43.

their child, and we also want to see capacity built in the system in two

:06:44.:06:49.

weighs. More schools near to children where they need them.

:06:50.:06:53.

Despite all the reforms we have had and improvements in attainment,

:06:54.:06:56.

there are still children who cannot get access to a good enough school.

:06:57.:07:02.

Also building capacity by having some of the best schools in the

:07:03.:07:08.

system to help collectively obtain standards as a whole. We want to see

:07:09.:07:13.

all parts of the education system, universities as well, playing a

:07:14.:07:18.

stronger, better role in that. She asked about evidence. Well, she

:07:19.:07:25.

quotes a report by the ISS that mentions issues on free school

:07:26.:07:29.

meals, but I must say, I do not understand her argument. She seems

:07:30.:07:31.

to be criticising the status quo whilst resolutely defending to keep

:07:32.:07:42.

it in place. It was really interesting listening to her because

:07:43.:07:47.

the words were in many respects the voices I heard, the voices of my

:07:48.:07:50.

childhood, people having a dogmatic debate about the education system,

:07:51.:07:55.

whilst I studied in my local comprehensive and entirely untouched

:07:56.:07:58.

by this ideological debate. What we want to do and what we think this

:07:59.:08:02.

parliament and the country should do is to be prepared to look at the

:08:03.:08:07.

practical ways that we can improve attainment for our children and to

:08:08.:08:13.

be prepared to leave no stone unturned to do that. Frankly, to

:08:14.:08:19.

complain about one aspect of our school system and then say that we

:08:20.:08:21.

shouldn't even have a debate about that element is frankly an untenable

:08:22.:08:26.

argument and it is essentially politics and dogma coming before

:08:27.:08:35.

pupils and opportunity. It is about prioritising benches opposite, as we

:08:36.:08:42.

can see today, of an ideological debate, when what we want is a

:08:43.:08:46.

debate about the practical steps we can take to tackle generational

:08:47.:08:50.

failure and schools that are not still delivering for children who

:08:51.:08:55.

live nearby them. It would be wrong to discount how we can improve

:08:56.:09:00.

prospects for those children, especially the most disadvantaged,

:09:01.:09:04.

purely because of political -- of political dogma. If Labour is not

:09:05.:09:08.

willing to ask itself these difficult questions, how can it

:09:09.:09:12.

possibly come up with any of the solutions? We do believe selection

:09:13.:09:17.

can play a role. We think that there is evidence to show that it does for

:09:18.:09:21.

many children who are in grammar schools. But anyhow we would need to

:09:22.:09:28.

leave no stone unturned, we will be setting out in due course. World

:09:29.:09:41.

Economic Forum has recommended that reminded us that we are on the table

:09:42.:09:45.

for literacy and numeracy -- well down on. Some 18-year-old struggle

:09:46.:09:55.

with literacy -- 17%, and this figure is even worse for numeracy,

:09:56.:10:01.

25%. It is necessary for discussion about grammar schools not to

:10:02.:10:06.

distract us for the fundamental task of improving social mobility and

:10:07.:10:10.

ensuring we make the best use of all the talent across the whole country

:10:11.:10:17.

and not just talk about the few? I very strongly agree. Going back to

:10:18.:10:23.

the Sutton Trust report, which actually did focus particularly on

:10:24.:10:27.

free school meals children and how they performed in grammar schools,

:10:28.:10:32.

their educational games from attaining in grammar schools were

:10:33.:10:36.

twice as high pupils with free school meals compared to the overall

:10:37.:10:43.

impact at pupils overall. Whilst they provide the stretching

:10:44.:10:48.

outstanding education for children from all backgrounds, they are one

:10:49.:10:54.

part of a very broad-based school system now. A school system that has

:10:55.:11:00.

transformed out of all recognition from when grammar is originally were

:11:01.:11:04.

introduced. I think what we now need to do is think about how we can have

:11:05.:11:07.

a 21st century education policy that takes a pragmatic look at the role

:11:08.:11:12.

of grammar schools, and across the whole of the system. He is right

:11:13.:11:15.

that we will not lose sight of the broader reforms that we are bringing

:11:16.:11:20.

through that will improve standards across the board. The Secretary of

:11:21.:11:25.

State represents a London constituency, so she will know that

:11:26.:11:31.

London schools have improved dramatically. Does she agree that

:11:32.:11:34.

has happened because of focus on high standards for all children in

:11:35.:11:38.

all schools, not by going down the route of selection, and I urge her

:11:39.:11:42.

today not to go back, not to turn the clock back to grammar schools,

:11:43.:11:46.

but to focus on high standards in all schools in all parts of the

:11:47.:11:52.

country for all children? I think I can reassure him, we will not be

:11:53.:11:56.

turning the clock back. He speaks about London, and I think the London

:11:57.:12:03.

lessons around collaboration, school leadership and sharing those best

:12:04.:12:08.

practice experiences across schools. I think the challenge I want us to

:12:09.:12:12.

discuss is how we can make sure all schools play a role in doing that,

:12:13.:12:16.

rather than simply saying that grammar is set on one side and

:12:17.:12:21.

should not play as greater role across the school schism -- school

:12:22.:12:25.

system. I think they should, and I think we have to have that debate.

:12:26.:12:31.

Fundamentally, this is about having more good school places for more

:12:32.:12:34.

children, about building capacity by better places and more Kelly's --

:12:35.:12:40.

places, and about sharing best practice and improving school

:12:41.:12:43.

leadership by having schools working closely together. I am fortunate to

:12:44.:12:52.

have an excellent grammar school in my constituency. As my honourable

:12:53.:12:56.

friend will know, people move to Kent because of its grammar schools.

:12:57.:13:00.

Does she agree that it is not right for an excellent academic education

:13:01.:13:03.

to be only available to those who can move to the catchment areas of

:13:04.:13:12.

outstanding schools? We need to improve diversity and choice. As the

:13:13.:13:16.

Prime Minister said, too often in Britain we have selection, but on

:13:17.:13:19.

the basis of House prices which is totally unacceptable. We need to

:13:20.:13:25.

challenge ourselves to talk about how we can change that and improve

:13:26.:13:30.

standards for children wherever they are in the country. And simply

:13:31.:13:33.

saying something is off the table because of political ideology and

:13:34.:13:39.

dogma does not serve the children that we want to see have an improved

:13:40.:13:47.

prospect for the future. Can I thank the new Secretary of State and beg

:13:48.:13:52.

her to listen to the expertise out the. I cheer the advisory Council of

:13:53.:13:57.

the Sutton Trust. Listen to the Sutton Trust because we believe in

:13:58.:14:02.

evidence -based policy. Listen to the Chief Inspector of schools. And

:14:03.:14:07.

indeed just look at the areas where, for years we have had this kind of

:14:08.:14:13.

education, and what it has done to the entirety. Look at Kent, and it

:14:14.:14:19.

sure looks at Kent in depth, she will learn some lessons. I think it

:14:20.:14:27.

is time that we looked at the Kent experience. I know that Kent

:14:28.:14:30.

themselves have done a lot of work to really dig into the background as

:14:31.:14:35.

to how they can get more children from disadvantaged backgrounds into

:14:36.:14:42.

the grammar schools. He has raised issues, a principle, and my response

:14:43.:14:46.

would be if that is how he feels, why would he want to discount

:14:47.:14:49.

looking at the areas of grammar schools to see how we can make them

:14:50.:14:52.

work effectively not just for children who get them, -- get to

:14:53.:14:57.

them, but for those who do not get to them, how grammar schools work

:14:58.:15:02.

with their communities. It seems to me that the response of the Labour

:15:03.:15:06.

Party to all of those challenges is to raise them, but then simply put

:15:07.:15:11.

them on one side and ignore them. I do not think that is sensible.

:15:12.:15:18.

Bradford is one of the worst performing education districts in

:15:19.:15:21.

the country. There is a wide provision of some outstanding

:15:22.:15:28.

results and very dire results. Where people can afford to buy a House and

:15:29.:15:32.

a good catchment area, they can get themselves to a school that produces

:15:33.:15:35.

outstanding results, and those who cannot afford a House and a good

:15:36.:15:39.

catchment area tend to get a school with worse results. Went on people

:15:40.:15:47.

in Bradford get access to the very best grammar schools that we need?

:15:48.:15:50.

They surely shouldn't not just be a preserve of the Tory areas. I think

:15:51.:15:59.

he speaks for many constituency MPs, and the point is people should have

:16:00.:16:02.

the choice. It should not be for government to deprive them of the

:16:03.:16:07.

joys of how they want to educate their children. So this is about

:16:08.:16:11.

choice, diversity and building capacity in the system. The

:16:12.:16:18.

Secretary of State knows that apart from the best possible teaching, the

:16:19.:16:21.

most important thing we can do for young people is to encourage them as

:16:22.:16:25.

they make their way through school. Given that as a nation we still deal

:16:26.:16:29.

with the legacy of a divided education system, why on earth does

:16:30.:16:33.

she think that subjecting more 11-year-old children to that

:16:34.:16:40.

experience and their tearful parents having opened the envelope telling

:16:41.:16:43.

them that they have failed, is going to encourage and support them in

:16:44.:16:48.

their self-esteem and the continuing career through the education system?

:16:49.:16:54.

Dare I said, get another Labour MP saying what is wrong with the

:16:55.:16:59.

current system, while arguing we should not look at it. The legacy we

:17:00.:17:04.

are interested in challenging was the one left by the last Labour

:17:05.:17:09.

government, inflation, declining standards, children leaving the

:17:10.:17:13.

system without even basics in maths and literacy. I sat on a train last

:17:14.:17:19.

weekend and listened to a young man talking about how the fact he did

:17:20.:17:22.

not know how to spell was holding him back at work. We managed to take

:17:23.:17:28.

power from the Labour Party but he is having to live with the

:17:29.:17:31.

consequences of an education system is fundamentally failed him every

:17:32.:17:38.

single day of his life. We inherited a university system with a on the

:17:39.:17:42.

number of children that could go there. -- limit. Record numbers that

:17:43.:17:49.

were not in employment, education, or training. Youth Imp ointment had

:17:50.:17:55.

gone up by 50% by the time the Labour left office. -- youth

:17:56.:18:01.

unemployment. Not only do we want to make up for lost ground but make

:18:02.:18:05.

sure beyond that we leave no stone unturned, we look across the whole

:18:06.:18:10.

education system, to make sure we turbo-charge the prospects and

:18:11.:18:15.

opportunities that all children in our country, but especially the most

:18:16.:18:20.

disadvantaged, and especially those who do not currently have the

:18:21.:18:23.

opportunities they need, deserve and should have. Thank you, Mr Speaker.

:18:24.:18:29.

I welcome the Government decision to at least open this debate. It should

:18:30.:18:34.

be no part of a Conservative government's policy to have a

:18:35.:18:38.

statutory ban on the establishment of grammar schools. Evidence in my

:18:39.:18:43.

area, where they are available just down the road in the neighbouring

:18:44.:18:48.

council area indicates there is widespread support for the

:18:49.:18:53.

establishment of a grammar school. Coastal communities are particularly

:18:54.:18:55.

vulnerable to poorer education standards and I hope she will

:18:56.:19:00.

consider that if the policy goes ahead. And could I also urge to

:19:01.:19:05.

consider the possible extension bilateral schools? I am sure he will

:19:06.:19:12.

be interested to see our policies when they are published shortly. He

:19:13.:19:15.

raises some of the different elements of the secondary system

:19:16.:19:20.

currently the and the desire that I know he has to make sure his local

:19:21.:19:25.

community has access to better, good schools for more local children and

:19:26.:19:28.

that is exactly what we are aiming to achieve. Thank you, Mr Speaker. I

:19:29.:19:35.

think the Secretary of State is right not to rule out a discussion

:19:36.:19:40.

on grammar schools as part of the wide types of schools we have in

:19:41.:19:44.

this country and I declare an interest as the product of a

:19:45.:19:48.

wonderful grammar school. Would she like to visit Northern Ireland,

:19:49.:19:51.

where grammar schools still exist, they are hugely popular and weather

:19:52.:19:57.

is good education across the spectrum, no matter what the ability

:19:58.:20:03.

of the young person at Northern Ireland's results continue to

:20:04.:20:05.

improve and be better than the United Kingdom and that there is

:20:06.:20:10.

very little private education? Perhaps she would like to talk to

:20:11.:20:12.

the first Minister in Northern Ireland. I thank her for that

:20:13.:20:18.

invitation and I am sure I will want to take up on that at point. I

:20:19.:20:23.

should emphasise to the House that as my honourable friend said, this

:20:24.:20:27.

is the opening up of a debate and I think it is important to have this

:20:28.:20:31.

poor our children if we are to rise to the challenge of looking at what

:20:32.:20:35.

it takes to improve attainment and making sure we have good schools

:20:36.:20:38.

where they are growing up. We are going to look at these options

:20:39.:20:43.

carefully. I recognise this is a very emotive debate. That is because

:20:44.:20:47.

it matters but that is also why we should be prepared to have a debate

:20:48.:20:51.

about this, given how much the broader school system has now

:20:52.:20:56.

changed. I will look very carefully at all of the arguments that are

:20:57.:20:59.

made and all of the evidence that is produced because I do think that is

:21:00.:21:04.

important. I will say to colleagues that I am keen to hear from

:21:05.:21:08.

colleagues across all sides of the House and we will be setting out all

:21:09.:21:14.

of our policy options shortly. Thank you, Mr Speaker. I welcome her

:21:15.:21:18.

comments very warmly indeed. All children have the rights to fulfil

:21:19.:21:24.

their full potential. Will the Secretary of State assure the House

:21:25.:21:28.

she is considering all methods of selection and that this is not all

:21:29.:21:34.

about bringing back the 11 plus? We will set out our policy is much more

:21:35.:21:38.

broadly, but I can assure you, Mr Speaker, there will be no return to

:21:39.:21:43.

the past. This is about moving forward, having a 21st-century

:21:44.:21:48.

approach in relation to the school system, precisely not one rooted in

:21:49.:21:53.

the 1960s and 1970s. I hope the party opposite can engage in a

:21:54.:21:57.

modern debate rather than one that is 40-50 years old. I think in the

:21:58.:22:04.

clamour coming from some areas about creating new grammar schools, what

:22:05.:22:07.

many people forget is when you create a new grammar school, you

:22:08.:22:13.

also create secondary modern schools because of the skewing of the intake

:22:14.:22:20.

of those other schools. The chief inspector in his speech to London

:22:21.:22:23.

local government on Monday accepted that grammar schools where they do

:22:24.:22:27.

exist do a fine job with the intake they have, but have a very poor

:22:28.:22:32.

track record in terms of admitting youngsters from a non-middle-class

:22:33.:22:37.

background. If we are going to go down this road, what can the

:22:38.:22:41.

Secretary of State dude confirmed that would be the case in other

:22:42.:22:46.

parts of the country? I think it again underlines why we are right to

:22:47.:22:52.

open up this agenda for debate. In a way, we are not going to tackle any

:22:53.:22:57.

of the issues he cares about without having a broad look about what a

:22:58.:22:59.

modern policy approach to grammar should look like. We should not

:23:00.:23:04.

simply discount the excellent education so many children do get at

:23:05.:23:07.

grammar school, including children from very disadvantaged backgrounds.

:23:08.:23:12.

We should look harder at how we can make sure grammar schools play the

:23:13.:23:15.

role more collaboratively in a broader system to make sure they

:23:16.:23:22.

build up capacity and more good places as they steadily improve

:23:23.:23:27.

themselves. Yesterday in the course of an education select committee

:23:28.:23:30.

hearing we have the evidence, the truism of what can affect attainment

:23:31.:23:36.

most is good teaching in the classroom, which is evidently true.

:23:37.:23:39.

Does she agree sometimes structures can support learning and the recent

:23:40.:23:44.

study of 2011 showed that giving schools autonomy improves outcome,

:23:45.:23:49.

so that further choice for parents, teachers and students may give

:23:50.:23:54.

further opportunity? I think that is right. Critically, we need to have

:23:55.:24:01.

the right level of autonomy for schools so they can actually get on

:24:02.:24:05.

with the job of teaching our children, but also fantastic

:24:06.:24:08.

leadership in our schools. We know from the London experience that was

:24:09.:24:12.

critical. Heads showing what could be done in difficult schools and

:24:13.:24:17.

working with others for their schools to put in place the same

:24:18.:24:20.

sort of approaches and then teaching staff more broadly that are

:24:21.:24:26.

motivated and able to work in the classroom effectively with children

:24:27.:24:29.

who are able to be disciplined ineffectively by the head and a head

:24:30.:24:34.

that genuinely feels they have control and leadership over the

:24:35.:24:38.

school. All of these things make a difference and beyond that, if we

:24:39.:24:41.

are really going to make an impact on the long-term social mobility in

:24:42.:24:47.

Britain, which will not change overnight, we need not only schools

:24:48.:24:51.

and the education family to be driving social mobility, but we need

:24:52.:24:57.

local communities, business, universities, civil society,

:24:58.:25:01.

everybody needs to play a role alongside core education reform, to

:25:02.:25:06.

make sure children inside the classroom and also outside are

:25:07.:25:11.

getting the skills, knowledge, the advice and experience they will need

:25:12.:25:17.

to truly develop their potential. When the former chief inspector said

:25:18.:25:24.

that the idea that poor children will benefit from an expansion in

:25:25.:25:28.

the number of grammar schools was too and nonsense, was he being

:25:29.:25:37.

ideological? -- was nonsense. In opening up this debate, there will

:25:38.:25:40.

be people that have different views but I do not believe that as a

:25:41.:25:45.

reason not to have the debate. The issue of improving attainment and

:25:46.:25:47.

having more good school places for more children, building the capacity

:25:48.:25:53.

that we need in our system for it to have great schools on the doorstep

:25:54.:26:00.

is too important to put in the bracket that it is too hard and we

:26:01.:26:03.

should not have a debate. We should have the debate and work out what we

:26:04.:26:06.

need to do to do a better job of raising attainment for children who

:26:07.:26:13.

currently do not go far enough. Doctor Julian Lewis. Not him! I am

:26:14.:26:19.

not an expert on the theory of secondary education but having

:26:20.:26:26.

attended a grammar school with a largely working-class contingent in

:26:27.:26:30.

the 1960s, I know something about the practice from which we all

:26:31.:26:36.

benefit. Can the Secretary of State explain why it is acceptable to

:26:37.:26:41.

nurture and promote sporting excellence, but not academic

:26:42.:26:49.

excellence? He raises a good point around the broader issue of

:26:50.:26:52.

selection, which is that all children are different and

:26:53.:26:57.

therefore, playing to those talents and natural interests of children is

:26:58.:27:02.

important. Parents should have more choice and more diversity in the

:27:03.:27:06.

school system to find not only a good school but a good school that

:27:07.:27:09.

will be particularly good for the child. Thank you, Mr Speaker. The

:27:10.:27:18.

job of education in the 21st century is to maximise opportunity for the

:27:19.:27:21.

maximum number of children, whatever their background. The Ofsted chief

:27:22.:27:27.

Inspector said this week that a return to grammar schools would not

:27:28.:27:30.

do that. He said it would be a profoundly retrograde step that

:27:31.:27:34.

would actually lead to overall standards sliding back, not

:27:35.:27:39.

improving. He said just 9% of disadvantaged children go to the

:27:40.:27:44.

grammar schools in grammar school Bexley, were as a non-grammar school

:27:45.:27:50.

Hackney, 62% of children go to university compared to 48% as a

:27:51.:27:54.

whole. Does she not agree that where there is a failure and disadvantage,

:27:55.:28:00.

the answer should not be a festival of bringing back but instead a focus

:28:01.:28:05.

on expanding opportunity for all schools right across the system?

:28:06.:28:10.

Expanding opportunity is at the heart of what we are doing. I would

:28:11.:28:14.

encourage him to rather than jump the gun, wait and see the Government

:28:15.:28:19.

proposals when they are set out. Yet again, we have heard from the party

:28:20.:28:22.

opposite of complaints about the current system while apparently

:28:23.:28:26.

maintaining a position of not wanting to have a debate about how

:28:27.:28:32.

we can improve it and make it better overall and ensure that improvement

:28:33.:28:35.

is something the whole school system can benefit from. I realise the

:28:36.:28:41.

honourable gentleman may experience some teething problems as he makes

:28:42.:28:44.

his adjustments to life in the backbenchers. We look forward to

:28:45.:28:49.

hearing from him on a regular basis but unfortunately he is no longer a

:28:50.:28:53.

minister and does not have a guaranteed slot, but an expectant

:28:54.:28:58.

nation will now hear him! I am slowly readjusting to the

:28:59.:29:04.

metaphysical plane. I welcome what the Secretary of State has said

:29:05.:29:08.

about diversity and choice. But will she acknowledge that a grammar

:29:09.:29:11.

school might not be suited to every town? I would not relish the

:29:12.:29:16.

prospect of informing parents informing bread, Milton or

:29:17.:29:24.

Leamington that the child had not been able to get into the grammar

:29:25.:29:27.

school and would have to be bussed elsewhere. He raises an important

:29:28.:29:34.

point about how local communities needs to be intrinsically involved

:29:35.:29:37.

in how the school system locally develops. I can assure him we are

:29:38.:29:43.

very seasoned in that. I should also take this opportunity to put on

:29:44.:29:47.

record how much I enjoyed working with him in our previous department

:29:48.:29:52.

roles for education. He did an outstanding job and was a pleasure

:29:53.:29:57.

to have as a ministerial colleague. Thank you, Mr Speaker. All of us

:29:58.:30:03.

wants the best for our children. But following on from my honourable

:30:04.:30:08.

friend for Gateshead, in answering his question, which in my view she

:30:09.:30:11.

did not, does she not understand the very real concern is that in

:30:12.:30:16.

reintroducing grammar schools, you also reintroduce secondary moderns?

:30:17.:30:22.

You recreate the division that there has been a consensus about that we

:30:23.:30:26.

should not allow within the education system. How is it that

:30:27.:30:31.

proposing new grammar schools, which will bring secondary moderns is

:30:32.:30:36.

going to improve attainment for all pupils in all of our communities?

:30:37.:30:41.

The fundamental premise of his question I think is wrong. This is

:30:42.:30:45.

absolutely not about going back to the past. Secondary moderns for many

:30:46.:30:49.

years did not even put their children through a single exam. Our

:30:50.:30:55.

school system has reformed, thankfully, beyond all recognition

:30:56.:31:01.

since then. The premise of his question is wrong. This is about

:31:02.:31:04.

improving standards for all children. He asked about how we can

:31:05.:31:09.

make that happen. One of the ways is having good and outstanding schools

:31:10.:31:12.

playing more of a role, lifting other schools that can benefit from

:31:13.:31:17.

the experience and knowledge. Could I welcome the Secretary of State's

:31:18.:31:23.

focus on excellence in education for all and invite her to Salisbury to

:31:24.:31:27.

look at the mixed economy with grammar schools, UTC, a free six

:31:28.:31:32.

form, local authority schools and a multi-Academy trust forming shortly,

:31:33.:31:37.

and also place matters is on the dynamic between those different

:31:38.:31:41.

types of schools and how in particular grammar schools work with

:31:42.:31:44.

the neighbours nearby to raise standards across the board? Finally,

:31:45.:31:49.

the focus on the P8 school which does a loss to put into focus the

:31:50.:31:55.

progress made by every school would surely needs to be where the

:31:56.:31:56.

emphasis should be placed? He is right, collaboration and

:31:57.:32:06.

having good schools working with families to raise attainment is

:32:07.:32:11.

important. We should be challenging schools on progress that every

:32:12.:32:16.

child. Part of the problem of this approach of getting people into

:32:17.:32:23.

GCSEs was that it missed out the progress schools often make

:32:24.:32:25.

brilliantly with children that are perhaps further back in there

:32:26.:32:28.

attainment, and we should be valuing that. We should hear from a

:32:29.:32:37.

philosopher. Doctor John Pugh. On a consensual note, she will agree that

:32:38.:32:44.

the biggest problem is underperforming boys in poorer

:32:45.:32:48.

areas. Few of whom will pass the 11 plus. How does she think the

:32:49.:32:53.

creation of grammar schools is a solution to this, in simple terms?

:32:54.:33:00.

You will be pleased to hear that the Department for Education has a range

:33:01.:33:03.

of different policies. We're allowed to have more than one to tackle poor

:33:04.:33:07.

attainment, and we will be bringing forward some proposals on how we

:33:08.:33:11.

feel the broader school system, including grammars, can work more

:33:12.:33:19.

effectively and indeed the education system can improve attainment. But

:33:20.:33:26.

he is right to highlight white working-class boys in particular.

:33:27.:33:29.

Some work was done by the Sutton Trust that looked at primary schools

:33:30.:33:32.

that were doing a good job on improving attainment of white

:33:33.:33:35.

working-class boys, and sadly only eight to ten really improved

:33:36.:33:40.

attainment dramatically, but we can learn from the experience and make

:33:41.:33:44.

sure the best practices spread more effectively. But it is critical, and

:33:45.:33:49.

he is right to focus on it. There is no doubt that there is a virtual

:33:50.:33:53.

scrum of parents around almost every grammar school in the country trying

:33:54.:33:58.

to take advantage of the excellent education opportunities they

:33:59.:34:02.

provide. The answer is not to sneer at grammar schools or to try to

:34:03.:34:07.

close them down, the option surely should be to enhance them. At the

:34:08.:34:11.

moment new schools can select on the basis of children's ability at

:34:12.:34:17.

performing arts, sport and music, but not on that ability at maths or

:34:18.:34:23.

English. How can that be right? He is right, and the scrums around good

:34:24.:34:30.

schools, not just grammar schools, so our focus has to be on opening up

:34:31.:34:36.

the system as much as we can to maximise our ability to get good

:34:37.:34:40.

schools and more good places for children in their local area, and

:34:41.:34:46.

many of our colleagues have spoken about how children come from miles

:34:47.:34:49.

away to the good school in their constituency. Perhaps if we already

:34:50.:34:53.

had a good school closer to where those children left, they would not

:34:54.:34:57.

need to do and they would not spend their time travelling and losing out

:34:58.:35:00.

on homework and study time to do so. I welcome the comprehensively

:35:01.:35:07.

educated Secretary of State to her place. The age of 11 is too early to

:35:08.:35:11.

make final decisions which affect the child's whole future, so said

:35:12.:35:16.

Margaret Thatcher, the Secretary of State who oversaw the most expansive

:35:17.:35:22.

change in education. Does she really want to bring back secondary modern

:35:23.:35:30.

and grammar schools with a negative impact on achievement, predicted by

:35:31.:35:33.

Her Majesty is inspected and a negative impact on social mobility

:35:34.:35:37.

predicted by the government's social mobility adviser? I have a great

:35:38.:35:43.

amount of respect for the honourable gentleman and now that he spent a

:35:44.:35:45.

career in education before coming into this place, and I would simply

:35:46.:35:51.

say to him to wait for the policy options to, it, and I will be

:35:52.:35:56.

interested to hear his response to those in due course. I went to a

:35:57.:36:02.

state grammar school in south London and I owe my place here to that

:36:03.:36:06.

school. The best grammar schools actively seek children from

:36:07.:36:15.

disadvantaged backgrounds, and Wallington County Grammar next door

:36:16.:36:21.

to Croydon has 14% on free school meals. With the Secretary of State

:36:22.:36:24.

support their plans to open up a satellite grammar school in my

:36:25.:36:28.

constituency, rather like the one opened up in Sevenoaks a few months

:36:29.:36:34.

ago? I think all of us are here because of the education we were

:36:35.:36:37.

lucky enough to have. I think the challenge we face and we are

:36:38.:36:41.

debating is how we can make sure that no child misses out on that

:36:42.:36:45.

opportunity because of the postcode lottery of where they happen to be

:36:46.:36:50.

have been born in in the country. We need to make sure that whatever kind

:36:51.:36:53.

of good schools they are, that they have more freedom to be able to

:36:54.:36:58.

expand and deliver more good places in our school system for children

:36:59.:37:02.

who do not currently have them. I have listened carefully to the

:37:03.:37:06.

Secretary of State, and I have not heard her explicitly support the

:37:07.:37:09.

policy announced by the Prime Minister that the backbench

:37:10.:37:12.

Conservative private meeting last night. And it was leaked to the

:37:13.:37:17.

media. It is an interesting fact. Given that the Prime Minister has

:37:18.:37:22.

repeatedly boasted that she likes to take decisions thinking very

:37:23.:37:26.

carefully about them based on evidence, is she aware of any

:37:27.:37:30.

evidence that shows that a grammar school system improves attainment

:37:31.:37:33.

across the piece or improves social mobility? As I have said in the

:37:34.:37:41.

past, we have not set out the policy proposals. They will be set out in

:37:42.:37:45.

due course. I would point him to the search by the Sutton Trust which

:37:46.:37:49.

clearly set out the improved attainment for free school meal

:37:50.:37:54.

children, but also actually said that in that particular piece of

:37:55.:37:56.

research they did not see any negative impact on children outside

:37:57.:38:01.

of the grammar school system on attainment. I recognise that there

:38:02.:38:05.

are different studies that have recognised different challenges

:38:06.:38:07.

around selection, but again I would say that if that is the view

:38:08.:38:11.

honourable members take, isn't that all the more reason to open debate

:38:12.:38:15.

and discuss how we can have a sensible policy on grammar schools?

:38:16.:38:23.

Speaking as someone who was comprehensively educated in a

:38:24.:38:27.

comprehensive school, I saw the benefits both of academic education

:38:28.:38:32.

but also vocational education. With my right honourable friend not agree

:38:33.:38:35.

that one of the things we have to do in society is to assess young

:38:36.:38:40.

people, make sure that we have teaching for them that stretches

:38:41.:38:43.

them to the utmost so they achieve the best they can, and that actually

:38:44.:38:48.

assessments of all ages are important, so we achieve that, so we

:38:49.:38:53.

get the best possible role in society? He is absolutely right and

:38:54.:38:58.

while we are right to focus on the academic attainment on children in

:38:59.:39:03.

our schools because if they do not get those basics they will not be

:39:04.:39:09.

able to succeed, it is also important to recognise that one of

:39:10.:39:12.

the most important thing we can do alongside that is improved reforms

:39:13.:39:17.

on vocational education and apprenticeships, and make sure they

:39:18.:39:23.

are attainable writs for people who want to choose an academic path of

:39:24.:39:34.

life different from an... There are sometimes ascends from the

:39:35.:39:36.

opposition benches that education is purely about academic attainment. It

:39:37.:39:40.

is critical, but it is absolutely not the totality of what we need to

:39:41.:39:48.

be ensuring our children need to be getting. We have to build pathways

:39:49.:39:53.

on skills for children who are going to pursue a course that is much more

:39:54.:39:58.

vocational. The Secretary of State recently told the TES, the times I

:39:59.:40:10.

had best were the teachers that excited me about learning. When

:40:11.:40:13.

heads and cheers of governors in my constituency who are working really

:40:14.:40:17.

hard to raise standards and opportunities for all our young

:40:18.:40:20.

people tell me that the recruitment and retention of good teachers is

:40:21.:40:25.

the biggest challenge that they face, does she not understand the

:40:26.:40:29.

frustration that they feel that she is focused on structures where the

:40:30.:40:34.

evidence does not support them working, rather than the problems

:40:35.:40:39.

they see every day in trying to deliver a fantastic education for

:40:40.:40:43.

people on Friday in Nottingham? I would like to thank her for that

:40:44.:40:49.

point. She's right that the issues of teacher recruitment and retention

:40:50.:40:52.

and enabling and unlocking teachers to get on with the job and be

:40:53.:40:59.

excellent in the classroom is truly important. It sits alongside some of

:41:00.:41:04.

the policy options we will be bringing forward around selection,

:41:05.:41:08.

but it is absolutely vital and we're not losing focus. I am sure many

:41:09.:41:17.

across Torbay, we're three grammar schools work well with comprehensive

:41:18.:41:20.

schools, a studio school and a technical college, we are listening

:41:21.:41:26.

to some of the comments today, particularly the Education

:41:27.:41:28.

Secretary, with amazement. There is nothing radical about the idea that

:41:29.:41:31.

we will give arbitrary areas the chance to choose to have the

:41:32.:41:35.

education system that we already benefit from. It is about two

:41:36.:41:42.

things, about being clearly prepared to leave no stone unturned in asking

:41:43.:41:46.

what it is going to take to improve the education system for children,

:41:47.:41:51.

and it is about having a practical debate on that that goes beyond the

:41:52.:41:54.

ideological debate and puts pupils first. In Trafford where we have

:41:55.:42:02.

selection, our schools perform very well, not because of selection but

:42:03.:42:07.

because of great teaching and good leadership. But I must tell the

:42:08.:42:11.

Secretary of State that the majority of parents in Trafford, especially

:42:12.:42:15.

parents of children with special educational needs, do not feel that

:42:16.:42:23.

they get their child into the school, in particular they feel that

:42:24.:42:25.

grammar schools are reluctant to take those children with special

:42:26.:42:28.

needs because they want to press the school's results. When the Secretary

:42:29.:42:32.

of State comes forward, and she assure the House that the needs of

:42:33.:42:36.

those particularly vulnerable children will be given appropriate

:42:37.:42:38.

attention in the strategy she proposes? I am very grateful for

:42:39.:42:46.

that question. I would be happy to sit down with her and further

:42:47.:42:50.

discuss this. It is an incredibly important point that we not only

:42:51.:42:53.

raise attainment across the board but we leave no child out of that

:42:54.:42:57.

progress we are seeing in the School improvement. Parents in Kent as a

:42:58.:43:08.

whole see grammar schools and faith -based schools as engines of

:43:09.:43:12.

opportunity and aspiration, and will the government also look at more

:43:13.:43:21.

faith -based schools and more skills -based education at any stage in

:43:22.:43:31.

their lives? I agree it is about choice and a school system that

:43:32.:43:34.

means you can find the right school for your child that is tailored to

:43:35.:43:41.

their needs. And the Secretary of State tell us how this helps with

:43:42.:43:45.

the government's new industrial strategy. We know that there are

:43:46.:43:52.

technology colleges, and we seemed to -- they seem to have disappeared

:43:53.:43:55.

somewhat. How will grammar schools help? And have they had any

:43:56.:44:00.

discussions about the church about any impact on faith schools? We will

:44:01.:44:08.

be announcing our policy options in due course and I am sure he will

:44:09.:44:11.

want to respond to them. But education in schools is critical for

:44:12.:44:15.

delivering on our long-term industrial strategy if we're going

:44:16.:44:18.

to meet these challenges of having a successful economy but also having

:44:19.:44:23.

our migration levels more under control. One of the ways we can do

:44:24.:44:27.

that incredibly constructively is to meet more of our skill needs from

:44:28.:44:32.

our own young people and to be training them and educating them to

:44:33.:44:35.

be able to play their role in British industry, helping our

:44:36.:44:45.

country be successful. Is my right honourable friend in agreement that

:44:46.:44:48.

with all the different schools now available, if parents do not want to

:44:49.:44:50.

choose a grammar school education for their children, such schools

:44:51.:44:53.

will not survive and thrive, but we should at least give parents with

:44:54.:44:56.

limited means the same choice that better off parents have. He is

:44:57.:45:04.

absolutely right. We should not accept poor school standards and

:45:05.:45:08.

whatever school they are in. We have to challenge low attainment wherever

:45:09.:45:13.

we find it, but the point I am making today is that it is not good

:45:14.:45:16.

enough to just take something off the table because of political

:45:17.:45:20.

ideology. What we need to do is challenge all aspects of our

:45:21.:45:23.

education system to play a greater role in raising attainment and

:45:24.:45:28.

building capacity. There remains a fundamental contradiction at the

:45:29.:45:31.

heart of the government's thinking which I suspect has been muddled by

:45:32.:45:34.

the ideology that they are accusing our side of the household, which is

:45:35.:45:40.

that the school selects or the parents choose, but you cannot have

:45:41.:45:44.

selection and choice together. So does the suggestion from the Prime

:45:45.:45:47.

Minister last night that she wants to see an element of selection

:45:48.:45:51.

indicate that the government has abandoned parental choice? I would

:45:52.:45:56.

encourage him to wait for the policy options to be announced and I am

:45:57.:45:59.

sure he will want to respond to them when they are. I'm sure parents in

:46:00.:46:06.

your will warmly welcome a grammar school as hundreds have to cross the

:46:07.:46:10.

border into Lincolnshire, often on low incomes. But that she

:46:11.:46:16.

acknowledge what a lot of existing -- of our existing grammar schools

:46:17.:46:20.

are cheering on low funding. There are ?4000 per pupil in my

:46:21.:46:31.

constituency, whereas the lowest performing school in Lincolnshire is

:46:32.:46:36.

?8,000 per pupil. We are developing our proposals on funding formula for

:46:37.:46:42.

schools, and I know he will want to represent his community as we do

:46:43.:46:46.

get a more equitable funding for get a more equitable funding for

:46:47.:46:49.

pupils than we have. It has been a trait of this Tory

:46:50.:46:59.

government that they of the left to cover up regressive policies they

:47:00.:47:03.

introduce, infusion -- if using terms like social mobility, which in

:47:04.:47:10.

fact are quite the opposite. They say investment in early years does

:47:11.:47:14.

more to move children forwards than any form of selection that 11 could

:47:15.:47:22.

ever justified. Does she regret closing 800 sure start centres, and

:47:23.:47:27.

should we not be investing the instead of having a pointless debate

:47:28.:47:33.

about bringing back selection? I do not accept this either- or

:47:34.:47:38.

characterisation. We need to improve education at every stage of a

:47:39.:47:43.

child's life. That is including early years, as well. What a choice.

:47:44.:47:54.

Mr Peter Bowen. I am not entirely sure what Northamptonshire has done

:47:55.:47:58.

to deserve this. Anyway, can I say to the honourable lady who speaks

:47:59.:48:02.

for the opposition, can I congratulate her for getting the

:48:03.:48:07.

urgent question? I know under Labour announcements were made in the

:48:08.:48:10.

press. This government makes announcements here. At a meeting

:48:11.:48:16.

last night there were no new announcements of policy and I would

:48:17.:48:19.

be the first to object if the Government started doing that. Can

:48:20.:48:23.

the Secretary of State confirmed that when the policy has been

:48:24.:48:29.

decided, she will come to this House and report on it? I thought that was

:48:30.:48:35.

a very good choice, Mr Speaker and I can, I will come and make a

:48:36.:48:41.

statement. In Kettering, where five out of the six secondary schools are

:48:42.:48:46.

already academies, where we have one of the fastest house building rates

:48:47.:48:50.

in the country and were recent exam success was very encouraging, I have

:48:51.:48:55.

to tell the secretary of state whether we bring grammar schools

:48:56.:48:59.

back or not, the debate is about having more school places. Will she

:49:00.:49:04.

support the Conservative manifesto commitment that all good schools,

:49:05.:49:09.

whether they are academies, free, or grammar, be allowed to expand?

:49:10.:49:14.

Absolutely. I think our desire is to make sure that it does not matter

:49:15.:49:19.

what kind of good school it is, but it has the chance to create

:49:20.:49:23.

additional good places that our country needs and for areas that do

:49:24.:49:27.

not have good schools are told, we need to make sure we have a school

:49:28.:49:31.

system which is freed up enough so schools can be set up the that

:49:32.:49:37.

really do improve prospects for children, or that we network the

:49:38.:49:41.

schools with other good schools nearby that are delivering. But I

:49:42.:49:44.

have to say there are some parts of the country where that has been

:49:45.:49:47.

challenging and we need to leave no stone unturned. Thank you, Mr

:49:48.:49:52.

Speaker. Would she agree with me that not only do different things

:49:53.:49:55.

work in different areas but it is also essential we have a mix of

:49:56.:50:01.

routes by which young people can go on to succeed? Surely it is only

:50:02.:50:05.

write a new government is reviewing where we are and looking at how best

:50:06.:50:09.

we can enhance what matters most, which is opportunity? He is

:50:10.:50:15.

absolutely right. We have 1.4 million more children in good, or

:50:16.:50:19.

outstanding schools. We have done that in a variety of ways in terms

:50:20.:50:22.

of what children are learning in class and also how we are getting

:50:23.:50:25.

schools to work together collaboratively. We now need to say

:50:26.:50:30.

how can we take that to the next level but also critically, for

:50:31.:50:34.

million-plus children who are still not getting the attainment levels

:50:35.:50:37.

that we want and live in parts of a country where they do not have the

:50:38.:50:41.

chance to get to a good school, we have to make sure we change the

:50:42.:50:46.

terms of trade to make sure that they are turned into education

:50:47.:50:50.

opportunities. Business question, Mr Paul Flynn. Will the leader of the

:50:51.:50:57.

House gave us the business for next week? Leader of the House, Mr David

:50:58.:51:02.

Liddington. Mr Speaker, the bidders for next week, Monday the 12th of

:51:03.:51:07.

September, remaining stages of the Wales Bill. Tuesday the 13th,

:51:08.:51:11.

secondary reading of the Digital economy Bill. Wednesday the 14th,

:51:12.:51:17.

motions to approve statutory instruments relating to welfare

:51:18.:51:22.

reform in Northern Ireland and pensions. Followed by an opposition

:51:23.:51:27.

day, and on allotted half day, they will be a debate on NHS

:51:28.:51:35.

sustainability and transformation plans... On the 15th

:51:36.:51:36.

Download Subtitles

SRT

ASS