Browse content similar to 20/02/2017. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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in the Department always have the opportunity to ask for a call back | :00:00. | :00:00. | |
if they do not wish to continue with the call and wished the departments | :00:00. | :00:07. | |
to make the call. I understand this point of order flows directly from | :00:08. | :00:17. | |
questions. Specifically to call upon the answer given a few moments ago | :00:18. | :00:22. | |
about the work-related, the minister said nobody would be affected by | :00:23. | :00:26. | |
this change before the summer but in fact the DWP website says and we all | :00:27. | :00:30. | |
understood that this change takes effect from April, I wonder if you | :00:31. | :00:33. | |
can invite the Minister to clarify or correct the record. The Minister | :00:34. | :00:41. | |
is itching to appear at the bar 's. The policy change happens in April | :00:42. | :00:45. | |
but it will not start impacting people until later in the year and | :00:46. | :00:49. | |
because of the process they will be going through. But all of the | :00:50. | :00:55. | |
elements of the personalised support package, and all of the other things | :00:56. | :00:59. | |
we are seeking to do to help that individual's liquidity will be in | :01:00. | :01:06. | |
place by April. Urgent question, just in matters. Thank you Mr | :01:07. | :01:17. | |
Speaker, he will make a statement on the proposed takeover of Vauxhall | :01:18. | :01:26. | |
and overall by PSA. Secretary Doctor Greg Clark. Voxel is one of our | :01:27. | :01:32. | |
oldest and most valued motor manufacturers, making cars in | :01:33. | :01:38. | |
Britain for 113 years and owned by an overseas investor, General | :01:39. | :01:41. | |
Motors. There are over 40,000 people employed directly by GM or in | :01:42. | :01:46. | |
voxel's retail or supply chain in this country. News emerged that GM | :01:47. | :01:53. | |
were in discussions with the French company PSA about the future of GM's | :01:54. | :01:59. | |
European operations. I spoke to the president of GM and communicated the | :02:00. | :02:04. | |
importance we attach to the presence of Vauxhall in the UK and its | :02:05. | :02:08. | |
workforce. I am grateful for him travelling to meet me in my office | :02:09. | :02:12. | |
on Thursday. In my meeting he told me no agreement with PSA had been | :02:13. | :02:15. | |
reached and that discussions were ongoing. He shared my assessment of | :02:16. | :02:19. | |
the success of the Vauxhall plants in Britain and the brand. GM's | :02:20. | :02:25. | |
intention was that any deal should be building on the success of these | :02:26. | :02:30. | |
operations. Following on my meeting with GM I travelled to Paris to meet | :02:31. | :02:34. | |
my counterpart in the French government and following these | :02:35. | :02:38. | |
discussions I met with PSA board members for two hours late on | :02:39. | :02:42. | |
Thursday night. I emphasise once again the importance I attached to | :02:43. | :02:46. | |
the continuing success of Vauxhall in Britain and the recognition of | :02:47. | :02:51. | |
its workforce. The PSA executives said they greatly valued the | :02:52. | :02:56. | |
Vauxhall brand and that any deal would build on the strengths. They | :02:57. | :02:59. | |
emphasise that their operational approach has not been to engage in | :03:00. | :03:04. | |
plant closures but to focus on continuous improvements in plant | :03:05. | :03:08. | |
performance. On behalf of the UK Government I emphasised our | :03:09. | :03:12. | |
commitment to securing continued and mutually beneficial excess to | :03:13. | :03:14. | |
European markets and our intention as part of an industrial strategy to | :03:15. | :03:24. | |
enhance the British economy including the automotive sector. My | :03:25. | :03:28. | |
Minister of State spoke to his German counterpart. We remain in | :03:29. | :03:33. | |
close contact with GM, PSA, the French and German governments. And | :03:34. | :03:40. | |
of course I have met and will continue to meet with the trade | :03:41. | :03:45. | |
unions, and members of this house with constituency interests. I will | :03:46. | :03:48. | |
do everything I can at all times to secure the best possible future for | :03:49. | :03:53. | |
Vauxhall and its workforce. Our unity of purpose in seeking this | :03:54. | :03:56. | |
good future should be a source of strength in this house and I will | :03:57. | :04:02. | |
keep the house involved at every opportunity. I'd like to thank the | :04:03. | :04:06. | |
Secretary of State for his response and a helpful way he has kept myself | :04:07. | :04:09. | |
and other interested parties informed as matters have unfolded. | :04:10. | :04:14. | |
As he said, not only are their thousands employed directly at the | :04:15. | :04:16. | |
plants but there are tens of thousands of other people working in | :04:17. | :04:21. | |
the associated supply chain, sales network. I want to make it clear | :04:22. | :04:26. | |
Vauxhall is a British success story. The plants benefit from dedicated | :04:27. | :04:29. | |
and highly skilled staff who are among the most efficient anywhere in | :04:30. | :04:33. | |
Europe. If this takeover goes ahead we need to get the message out that | :04:34. | :04:37. | |
risking the closure of either facility would be a retrograde step, | :04:38. | :04:40. | |
not just for the UK economy but also the new owners. Will the Secretary | :04:41. | :04:46. | |
of State confirm the government will use all tools at its disposal to | :04:47. | :04:51. | |
protect British jobs that Vauxhall? This is not a new experience, there | :04:52. | :04:54. | |
have been threats to the plants in past but they have been seen off by | :04:55. | :04:58. | |
industry-leading collaborations between union, workforce, management | :04:59. | :05:02. | |
and government. Can the Secretary of State confirm he will work closely | :05:03. | :05:06. | |
with everybody at every stage? Whilst I think it would be an | :05:07. | :05:10. | |
oversimplification to characterise the deal as being entirely down to | :05:11. | :05:14. | |
Brexit, there are understandable concerns about its impact, | :05:15. | :05:17. | |
particularly if tariffs were imposed. Will the Secretary of State | :05:18. | :05:21. | |
ensured the future of the automotive industry is put front and centre of | :05:22. | :05:26. | |
negotiations and the red line will be no tariffs, not only on the | :05:27. | :05:30. | |
finished product but also components in the supply chain? We are very | :05:31. | :05:33. | |
proud of our automotive sector and we know we cannot take it for | :05:34. | :05:37. | |
granted. I will do everything that I possibly can to fight for the future | :05:38. | :05:41. | |
of Vauxhall and I expect nothing less from the government. Can I | :05:42. | :05:46. | |
commend the honourable gentleman and I'm grateful to him for giving us | :05:47. | :05:50. | |
the opportunity to update the house on these matters. I completely agree | :05:51. | :05:54. | |
with him about the importance and the success of the workforce. At | :05:55. | :06:00. | |
both the Ellesmere Port constituency plant and Luton. And of course the | :06:01. | :06:04. | |
supply chain and the retail network across the country and the call | :06:05. | :06:09. | |
centre and the customer service centre. Every part of Britain has a | :06:10. | :06:16. | |
stake in Vauxhall and so I completely agree and we will do | :06:17. | :06:17. | |
everything that we can. My personal commitment at the moment | :06:18. | :06:26. | |
of this government will be unbounded to ensure that the future building | :06:27. | :06:29. | |
on the success of the plant in his constituency of the workforce will | :06:30. | :06:34. | |
be maintained. That is my purpose. I am grateful for his support for that | :06:35. | :06:39. | |
and I will of course work with all of the groups, including the trade | :06:40. | :06:43. | |
unions and workforce to make that case, if new owners the right to be | :06:44. | :06:50. | |
the those new owners. Vauxhall has been a huge name in Beds for over a | :06:51. | :06:56. | |
century and that continues with the IBC plant in Luton building the | :06:57. | :07:03. | |
excellent Vivaro van. Can he say a little bit about the pensioners in | :07:04. | :07:10. | |
this country, many of whom are in my constituency and across Beds? They | :07:11. | :07:12. | |
will be worried for the future of their pensions. Can he say a little | :07:13. | :07:16. | |
bit on that issue as well as the jobs? In any prospective takeover, | :07:17. | :07:23. | |
the continued welfare of pensioners is of great importance and I | :07:24. | :07:29. | |
mentioned how important that would be in my discussions both with GM | :07:30. | :07:34. | |
and PSA. As I say, no deal has been concluded yet, but both | :07:35. | :07:39. | |
organisations are well aware of the importance that I as well as my | :07:40. | :07:42. | |
honourable friend attached to that. Thank you, Mr Speaker. I thank the | :07:43. | :07:54. | |
Secretary of State for his response and indeed the honourable Mulumba | :07:55. | :07:57. | |
the Ellesmere Port and Neston. Rock-solid flows over 40,000 people | :07:58. | :08:03. | |
as the Secretary of State stated, including 4500 at its manufacturing | :08:04. | :08:06. | |
plants in els airport and Luton, and tens of thousands in its retail and | :08:07. | :08:09. | |
support arms and within the supply chain. It is, as we have heard, a | :08:10. | :08:14. | |
great dish success story and there are in above questions I would like | :08:15. | :08:19. | |
to raise. Firstly, the French government owns a 14% share in | :08:20. | :08:23. | |
Peugeot, which has prompted many to suggest that any jobs cuts are | :08:24. | :08:29. | |
likely to fall on Oprah's six plant in Germany, the UK and Spain. The | :08:30. | :08:32. | |
German government has already demanded they must be no job losses | :08:33. | :08:36. | |
or plant losses as a result of the deal. Yesterday German papers | :08:37. | :08:42. | |
reported that PSA had pledged to continue operating all four of | :08:43. | :08:48. | |
Opel's German production sites. Can the Secretary of State state what | :08:49. | :08:53. | |
actions the government is taking to ensure the same in the UK, and can | :08:54. | :08:59. | |
she say that no jobs will be lost when she meets PSA executives? At | :09:00. | :09:05. | |
the 2016 Conservative Party conference, the Prime Minister | :09:06. | :09:07. | |
stated we are the party of workers. Can the Secretary of State confirm, | :09:08. | :09:11. | |
therefore, he will demand equal treatment of UK workers, compare the | :09:12. | :09:16. | |
workers in France and Germany, in any final deal package to make good | :09:17. | :09:22. | |
on that package? And finally, the UK's automotive industry is | :09:23. | :09:25. | |
dependent on the EU for both sales and components. Nissan's special | :09:26. | :09:32. | |
deal provided assurances of unencumbered EU market access, more | :09:33. | :09:37. | |
UK suppliers, support for more green vehicle are handy and the jobs and | :09:38. | :09:41. | |
training. Can the Secretary of State confirm reports PSA have been | :09:42. | :09:44. | |
offered the same deal and weather in return they have assured that no UK | :09:45. | :09:49. | |
jobs or plants will be lost? Was it not the case that all UK industry is | :09:50. | :09:53. | |
however require certainty and stability, and would he agree with | :09:54. | :09:58. | |
me that a haphazard and crisis led approach is quite simply the very | :09:59. | :10:01. | |
antithesis of an industrial strategy? Can I first of all | :10:02. | :10:08. | |
welcomed the honourable lady to the dispatch box and congratulate her on | :10:09. | :10:11. | |
her appointment. She will find there is no one more prepared than I am to | :10:12. | :10:16. | |
be active in supporting the employment aspects at every | :10:17. | :10:18. | |
constituency in the country, wherever that may be. And in our | :10:19. | :10:25. | |
discussions with industry including the automotive industry and overseas | :10:26. | :10:30. | |
investment, there is tremendous enthusiasm, warm encouragement for | :10:31. | :10:33. | |
our industrial strategy, and this is something that in other countries | :10:34. | :10:39. | |
has been pursued for some time. So I think in terms of haphazard and | :10:40. | :10:43. | |
random, or whatever she described, I am not sure, crisis led and | :10:44. | :10:52. | |
haphazard, I am not sure the honourable A.D. Speaking from her | :10:53. | :10:54. | |
front benches in the Bezus position to talk about that batch you make | :10:55. | :10:57. | |
some important points. She mentioned the fact that the French government | :10:58. | :11:01. | |
to own a significant stake in PSA, which is why I thought it was | :11:02. | :11:04. | |
important immediately to have a meeting with my French counterpart. | :11:05. | :11:08. | |
I did, it was very constructive and he recognised the importance in | :11:09. | :11:14. | |
making sure that the whole of Europe is treated fairly in these | :11:15. | :11:20. | |
discussions, and we agreed to stay in close touch on that. I was very | :11:21. | :11:26. | |
grateful to him seeing me. In terms of the treatment of plants across | :11:27. | :11:31. | |
Europe, one of the points that the PSA executives made to me was that | :11:32. | :11:37. | |
since the new management of PSA has been in place, they have taken some | :11:38. | :11:45. | |
pride in having part of their strategy not to close plants. As I | :11:46. | :11:49. | |
say, these the sessions are clearly continuing, there is no deal that | :11:50. | :11:53. | |
has been done, but I share her view and the view of her colleague and | :11:54. | :11:57. | |
our friends across the house, that it is very important that what our | :11:58. | :12:02. | |
successful enterprises with successful workforces should be able | :12:03. | :12:05. | |
to continue that success in the future. As for questions about the | :12:06. | :12:12. | |
European Union, of course many of the operations of GM in Europe are | :12:13. | :12:17. | |
in Germany, and Germany is not about to leave the European Union, so this | :12:18. | :12:24. | |
is not a Brexit related transaction. What I said very clearly is our | :12:25. | :12:30. | |
commitment, evidenced in black and white in our industrial strategy, to | :12:31. | :12:34. | |
build on our strengths and advanced manufacturing, including in the | :12:35. | :12:38. | |
automotive sector, are available to all players in that sector through | :12:39. | :12:42. | |
the automotive council. That is laid out in our industrial strategy, we | :12:43. | :12:45. | |
mention electric vehicles, battery storage and training. These are very | :12:46. | :12:50. | |
important for all members of the sectoral, and as I began by saying | :12:51. | :12:55. | |
they have attracted enthusiastic support from fans all over the world | :12:56. | :13:05. | |
are. I recommend my honourable friend's speedy response to the | :13:06. | :13:09. | |
situation. Can my right honourable friend recommend that it is not just | :13:10. | :13:12. | |
important for our industrial strategy but will also play a | :13:13. | :13:14. | |
vitally important role in shaping our future relationship with trade | :13:15. | :13:22. | |
with other EU member states, post-Brexit? Honourable friend, one | :13:23. | :13:26. | |
of the strengths of our automotive sector is that it is particularly | :13:27. | :13:29. | |
international. It benefits from and is strengthened by trade to and from | :13:30. | :13:35. | |
not only the rest of Europe but the whole of the world. And it is, I | :13:36. | :13:41. | |
think, a reflection of the fact that at Boxall has been owned by GM to | :13:42. | :13:45. | |
such a long time that actually the motor industry has long been | :13:46. | :13:51. | |
international beyond Europe, so I think there will be very prominent | :13:52. | :13:55. | |
in our discussions Trasch Vauxhall has been owned. , I congratulate the | :13:56. | :14:00. | |
member fails me a port and welcoming his colleagues the honourable lady | :14:01. | :14:03. | |
to her front bench position, look forward to working with her -- for | :14:04. | :14:09. | |
Elsner point. Our thoughts are with her is affected in the plant at | :14:10. | :14:13. | |
Elsner port, Luton and those working in the supply chain and for the | :14:14. | :14:16. | |
company in other ways and can I welcome the fact the Secretary of | :14:17. | :14:20. | |
State has led from the front, in terms of his interactions with the | :14:21. | :14:25. | |
French and others on this. Can I ask what assurances he has sought and | :14:26. | :14:29. | |
received from the French government or from PSA around about the plans, | :14:30. | :14:33. | |
employment and particular terms and conditions of employees and the | :14:34. | :14:35. | |
issue around about pensions around about there? I do not think we can | :14:36. | :14:41. | |
ignore the impact that Brexit may have in this going forward. This fit | :14:42. | :14:46. | |
is a direct accommodation between a plant and a UK plant, regardless of | :14:47. | :14:49. | |
the undoubted strength of the UK plant, when they have 75% of their | :14:50. | :14:53. | |
components and 80% of their exports going to the single market, they | :14:54. | :14:57. | |
will be at a comparative disadvantage with European | :14:58. | :15:01. | |
counterparts. So can take this opportunity to ask the Secretary of | :15:02. | :15:05. | |
State, given he will say he will do everything he can at all times to | :15:06. | :15:08. | |
rule out the hard Brexit that is being proposed, reassessed the | :15:09. | :15:12. | |
single market than the ship. We can leave the EU but we don't have to | :15:13. | :15:15. | |
leave the single market and doing so would protect employees at Boxall | :15:16. | :15:21. | |
and right across the economy. I am grateful to the honourable gentleman | :15:22. | :15:25. | |
for his kind words. I thought it was important to have discussions | :15:26. | :15:29. | |
immediately with both parties to the negotiations. It is fair to say that | :15:30. | :15:37. | |
since a deal has not been concluded and discussions are continued, the | :15:38. | :15:41. | |
prospective purchaser is clearly not in a position to give contractual | :15:42. | :15:49. | |
guarantees, but one of the important reasons for meeting was to have a | :15:50. | :15:54. | |
clear understanding of their purpose, and to commit to having | :15:55. | :15:57. | |
further meetings as the discussions continued, and I will be having that | :15:58. | :16:01. | |
later in the week. Of course the conditions for workers and for | :16:02. | :16:10. | |
pensioners are uppermost in that. In terms of the context of Brexit. I | :16:11. | :16:15. | |
made very clear, as the Prime Minister did in her speech at | :16:16. | :16:18. | |
Lancaster house, that we want to negotiate the best possible access | :16:19. | :16:26. | |
to the single market and free of tariffs and bureaucratic impediments | :16:27. | :16:29. | |
was that it is also important to reflect that we have a very strong | :16:30. | :16:33. | |
mastic market and Boxall has a particularly strong share of that | :16:34. | :16:37. | |
domestic market, something that was mentioned to me by both parties, by | :16:38. | :16:44. | |
GM and PSA. They are very aware of that and we will emphasise that in | :16:45. | :16:50. | |
the days and weeks ahead. Is the government considering its policy of | :16:51. | :16:54. | |
when, why and how to intervene in mergers that could be damaging to | :16:55. | :16:58. | |
British jobs and the public interest? In the context of the | :16:59. | :17:04. | |
Hinkley Point C decision, we did say we would come forward with measures | :17:05. | :17:12. | |
to govern the critical of structure regime, and also when we have made | :17:13. | :17:15. | |
some proposed changes to our corporate governments regime, and we | :17:16. | :17:25. | |
will be making some suggestions. In an earlier answer the Secretary of | :17:26. | :17:28. | |
State said this will not become entangled in Brexit. But the concern | :17:29. | :17:32. | |
will be that this is to this important company's future in | :17:33. | :17:38. | |
Britain will become collateral damage in wider negotiations and | :17:39. | :17:41. | |
deals regarding Brexit, and in the face of elections in France and | :17:42. | :17:45. | |
Germany this year, does he think nations will have to engage in an | :17:46. | :17:50. | |
ever rising game in order to maintain production facilities in | :17:51. | :17:54. | |
their own countries. If so, what will differ British manufacturing? | :17:55. | :17:58. | |
If the honourable gentleman should reflect a bit more positively on the | :17:59. | :18:03. | |
success of Vauxhall in this country. The two plans we have been talking | :18:04. | :18:07. | |
about are amongst the most efficient in Europe and therefore amongst the | :18:08. | :18:11. | |
most efficient in the world. So this is not about altruism, these are | :18:12. | :18:15. | |
successful plants, a tribute to their workforce, and they are | :18:16. | :18:18. | |
competitive. The other side of the equation, as I said a few moments | :18:19. | :18:23. | |
ago, is the box -- the Vauxhall brand is very successful in this | :18:24. | :18:26. | |
country. We start from a position of strength, and I will come as he | :18:27. | :18:30. | |
would want be to come to be vigorous in promoting those strengths, and to | :18:31. | :18:37. | |
influencing the negotiation so that the excellent workforce we have | :18:38. | :18:40. | |
there can continue and go from strength to strength in the future. | :18:41. | :18:47. | |
My right elbow friend will be unaware of the importance of this | :18:48. | :18:51. | |
plant to the Cheshire economy. Will he ensure the house that he make | :18:52. | :18:55. | |
sure you understands the skill and efficiency of this plant and indeed | :18:56. | :19:00. | |
its workforce? I will indeed, from my additional conversations I think | :19:01. | :19:06. | |
this is well understood. It is a matter of pride that our automotive | :19:07. | :19:10. | |
industry in general and those two plants in particular are such | :19:11. | :19:13. | |
high-performance, and there will be no one more vigorous in all parties. | :19:14. | :19:22. | |
Does the Secretary of State believe that it is going to be much harder | :19:23. | :19:29. | |
for companies that are looking at the integrated European operations | :19:30. | :19:32. | |
to want to base themselves in the United Kingdom because of the | :19:33. | :19:38. | |
uncertainties surrounding leaving the single market and the customs | :19:39. | :19:41. | |
union? And does he agree that in their circumstances they are going | :19:42. | :19:46. | |
to need some very attractive sweetness? What sweeteners has he | :19:47. | :19:50. | |
offered, and are those is also going to be available to the medium and | :19:51. | :19:54. | |
low priority areas the government have identified, such as fisheries | :19:55. | :20:00. | |
and steel and telecoms? I would say what I said to the honourable | :20:01. | :20:04. | |
gentleman who chairs the select committee. He should reflect on the | :20:05. | :20:09. | |
competitiveness of our automotive industry. The reason that companies | :20:10. | :20:13. | |
choose to invest in Britain is because we are a competitive place | :20:14. | :20:20. | |
from which to do business. We have a skilled and flexible workforce. We | :20:21. | :20:24. | |
have fantastic research and develop facilities. We have been absolutely | :20:25. | :20:28. | |
clear in the industrial strategy consultation that these strengths | :20:29. | :20:31. | |
will be extended, so that we continue to be a beacon of success | :20:32. | :20:38. | |
in this and other industries. The Secretary of State has clearly made | :20:39. | :20:41. | |
some reassuring noises to the firm. We need transparency on these. So | :20:42. | :20:45. | |
will the Secretary of State now respond to the Treasury committee | :20:46. | :20:50. | |
request to publish the letter that he sent Nissan on 21st of October, | :20:51. | :20:56. | |
giving reassurances to them? My right honourable friend may not have | :20:57. | :21:01. | |
noticed that, sometime ago, we said that of we would release the letter | :21:02. | :21:06. | |
that was sent to to Nissan have the time that it is no longer | :21:07. | :21:18. | |
commercially confidential. I commend the Secretary of State for his fast | :21:19. | :21:20. | |
action in meeting all of the parties, and I speak as someone who | :21:21. | :21:25. | |
represents people who work in the Ellesmere Port factory. We are all | :21:26. | :21:32. | |
as local MP is justifiably proud of the work that they have done, which | :21:33. | :21:38. | |
has kept this production one of the most efficient in the world. We do | :21:39. | :21:46. | |
not bow to anybody in the world for our efficiency and productivity in | :21:47. | :21:49. | |
the Ellesmere Port plant. But given that it is much cheaper, | :21:50. | :21:54. | |
effectively, to get rid of British workers, because of the nature of | :21:55. | :21:59. | |
the employment rights in this country, compared to Watt France and | :22:00. | :22:03. | |
Germany, what can he do to insure that when it comes to potential | :22:04. | :22:11. | |
cost-cutting, that equation is evened up and can support British | :22:12. | :22:12. | |
correction and British jobs? I am proud of the performance of the | :22:13. | :22:19. | |
two plants and the other plants we have in our automotive sector. What | :22:20. | :22:28. | |
the PSA executives communicated was that performance is the guide to | :22:29. | :22:33. | |
strategy. I think that those two plants we have very effective | :22:34. | :22:37. | |
performance so I would want and expect them to be major parts of the | :22:38. | :22:44. | |
future of an expanded group if the transaction proceeds. May I welcome | :22:45. | :22:49. | |
the action of my right honourable friend in this incredibly important | :22:50. | :22:57. | |
issue of retaining the plants. Most investment into motor Manufacturing | :22:58. | :23:02. | |
in this country comes from overseas with the possible exception of Aston | :23:03. | :23:06. | |
Martin and Triumph. Would my right honourable friend say what he's | :23:07. | :23:10. | |
doing to encourage British-based investment into motor manufacturing | :23:11. | :23:13. | |
so we don't always rely on overseas investment? I'm proud that we | :23:14. | :23:19. | |
attract the world's best automotive companies and that they see Britain | :23:20. | :23:23. | |
as a place to prosper and to succeed in. So I'm always encouraging that | :23:24. | :23:30. | |
level of investment. But of course it's not just the major | :23:31. | :23:36. | |
manufacturers. The supply chain is increasingly important in all | :23:37. | :23:40. | |
advanced manufacturing including the automotive industry. And we have an | :23:41. | :23:46. | |
increasingly good record in attracting small and medium-sized | :23:47. | :23:50. | |
businesses either to come and locate here from overseas or to grow them | :23:51. | :23:55. | |
from the bottom-up, as it were. And he will know that industrial | :23:56. | :24:00. | |
strategy makes great focal point of the need and the opportunity to grow | :24:01. | :24:08. | |
our supply chains. The Secretary of State I think understands how | :24:09. | :24:12. | |
important the plant at Ellesmere Port and its suppliers and retailers | :24:13. | :24:17. | |
are to the north-west, the wider North West's automotive sector which | :24:18. | :24:21. | |
includes Jaguar, Land Rover in my own constituency. What is he going | :24:22. | :24:26. | |
to do to make sure that we don't lose some of these essential skills, | :24:27. | :24:34. | |
jobs, firms and that our sector in the Northwest does not shrink as a | :24:35. | :24:36. | |
consequence of these factors which are completely out of control of the | :24:37. | :24:42. | |
government and of the people who work at the Ellesmere Port plant? | :24:43. | :24:46. | |
The honourable lady knows from work we have done together that I think | :24:47. | :24:52. | |
it is possible to make a case for attracting investment and | :24:53. | :24:56. | |
commitment. She is absolutely right that it is important, not just for | :24:57. | :25:00. | |
the north-west but for the entire country, if you take the dealership | :25:01. | :25:05. | |
network into account. I ambition is for our automotive sector, like the | :25:06. | :25:08. | |
rest of the advanced Manufacturing, to be more successful and employee | :25:09. | :25:13. | |
more people in the future. That doesn't happen by accident, it | :25:14. | :25:17. | |
involves being engaged with the sector, they can sure that | :25:18. | :25:20. | |
facilities for research and development, claiming, establish our | :25:21. | :25:26. | |
reputation as the best place in the world for motor manufacturing. I | :25:27. | :25:29. | |
will work with her and others to make sure that message is loudly | :25:30. | :25:34. | |
understood. Leyland in my constituency has a long and proud | :25:35. | :25:39. | |
history in the automotive sector, can my right honourable friend tell | :25:40. | :25:42. | |
the house what support there will be for the automotive sector in the | :25:43. | :25:47. | |
industrial strategy? Indeed. The automotive sector has been one of | :25:48. | :25:50. | |
our most successful sectors in recent years and that partly comes | :25:51. | :25:55. | |
from the effective arrangement through the automotive council put | :25:56. | :26:01. | |
in place whereby the firms including the small and medium-sized suppliers | :26:02. | :26:04. | |
can work together to support each other. There was an example of this | :26:05. | :26:11. | |
in the national automotive innovation Centre I visited recently | :26:12. | :26:16. | |
that is making new facilities available for people with new ideas, | :26:17. | :26:21. | |
with setting up new businesses, so that that can reinforce and continue | :26:22. | :26:27. | |
the success of one of our most effective industrial sectors. My | :26:28. | :26:35. | |
constituents work for Vauxhall at Ellesmere Port and Unilever, so if | :26:36. | :26:40. | |
there are members of this house who think everything is rosy in our | :26:41. | :26:44. | |
economy, I would invite them to come to Wirral South and say that. When | :26:45. | :26:48. | |
it comes to the high-value manufacturing that he has talked | :26:49. | :26:51. | |
about, does he realise the importance of the customs union and | :26:52. | :26:55. | |
has he made great and important contribution to the Prime Minister's | :26:56. | :26:59. | |
strategy on Brexit in keeping us inside the customs union? The | :27:00. | :27:04. | |
automotive sector and others trade a lot across borders and it is one of | :27:05. | :27:10. | |
the reasons the Prime Minister has been clear that we need to be able | :27:11. | :27:13. | |
to negotiate a trading arrangements that maintain our access across | :27:14. | :27:19. | |
those borders without tariffs or bureaucratic impediments, that is | :27:20. | :27:23. | |
clearly understood. Those negotiations have some way to go but | :27:24. | :27:28. | |
it is important, I think, to emphasise, as I have done, and the | :27:29. | :27:31. | |
Prime Minister has done, what our intention is. What guarantees might | :27:32. | :27:38. | |
be required from General Motors USA to General Motors GB with respect to | :27:39. | :27:46. | |
the pension deficit before any dispersal can take place? As my | :27:47. | :27:51. | |
right honourable friend knows, the independent pensions regulator is | :27:52. | :27:54. | |
the arbiter of any changes, were there to be any, and it is | :27:55. | :28:01. | |
absolutely right that the robust independence is in place. I would | :28:02. | :28:06. | |
emphasise that discussions are continuing, there is no agreement | :28:07. | :28:10. | |
yet that has been made. As I said to a number of colleagues across the | :28:11. | :28:14. | |
house, the future of pensioners is of course very important. I was | :28:15. | :28:21. | |
involved in the discussions last time GM considered selling its | :28:22. | :28:26. | |
European friends in the wake of the financial crisis and at that time we | :28:27. | :28:31. | |
had a successful resolution in that the company decided to retain the | :28:32. | :28:36. | |
brands. The secretary of State is right, Vauxhall is extremely | :28:37. | :28:41. | |
successful, the Astra and the course are among the top ten bestselling | :28:42. | :28:46. | |
cars in the UK. But the cars are made as part of a European wide | :28:47. | :28:50. | |
company and a European wide supply chain. Can I ask the Secretary of | :28:51. | :28:55. | |
State, in any of the discussions that he has had over the past week, | :28:56. | :29:00. | |
have exchange rate movements over the past year been raised? In | :29:01. | :29:06. | |
discussing the context of Brexit, of course we have discussed all aspects | :29:07. | :29:13. | |
of it. And one of the features of decisions that are being made on | :29:14. | :29:20. | |
investment is the opportunity, for example, to locate more of the | :29:21. | :29:24. | |
supply chain nearer to the production facilities. And across | :29:25. | :29:31. | |
the board, I think it is important to emphasise the commitments that we | :29:32. | :29:37. | |
have two negotiate the best possible access to the single market but also | :29:38. | :29:41. | |
the intrinsic competitiveness of the UK that make it attractive to | :29:42. | :29:48. | |
overseas investors. If I was on the board of directors and had a very | :29:49. | :29:54. | |
successful vehicle manufacturing output in the fifth biggest economy | :29:55. | :29:57. | |
in the world and that economy was about to leave the EU, I think I'd | :29:58. | :30:02. | |
want to invest more in that facility and make sure that I don't put all | :30:03. | :30:07. | |
my eggs in one basket. Doesn't the future of Vauxhall look rather good, | :30:08. | :30:13. | |
not the reverse? I would agree with my honourable friend in saying that | :30:14. | :30:16. | |
we have, in Vauxhall, a very successful firm that is well | :30:17. | :30:22. | |
regarded in the domestic market and across the continent. It is building | :30:23. | :30:29. | |
on the success that I think is the prospect. It is important that | :30:30. | :30:32. | |
through the discussions that is secured in the future arrangements. | :30:33. | :30:43. | |
Many of the thousands of people employed at Vauxhall are | :30:44. | :30:48. | |
understandably concerned about the future of their jobs. 80% of cards | :30:49. | :30:55. | |
may get Pepper are exported to EU states, and 75% of the value of the | :30:56. | :31:02. | |
car is imported. There has been meeting request from the Chief | :31:03. | :31:05. | |
Executive the PSA group which Downing Street has said it will take | :31:06. | :31:12. | |
in principle subject to diary. We'll be Secretary of State suggest that | :31:13. | :31:15. | |
the Prime Minister makes space in her diary as a matter of urgency? | :31:16. | :31:21. | |
The deal has not been done. The second thing is, no one could be | :31:22. | :31:27. | |
under any illusions as to the vigour of our response. Of course the Prime | :31:28. | :31:31. | |
Minister will need to find the time in her diary to meet. We are very | :31:32. | :31:35. | |
keen to continue this close contact that we have had. The various | :31:36. | :31:42. | |
takeovers talked about over the weekend have shown the importance of | :31:43. | :31:46. | |
having a robust, enforceable set of rules on takeovers and mergers. When | :31:47. | :31:50. | |
will the government come forward with their new policy in this area | :31:51. | :31:54. | |
so that we can know, not only when we leave the European Union, how we | :31:55. | :32:01. | |
will handle takeovers? It is important to reflect on the context | :32:02. | :32:04. | |
that our reputation for being an open economy that attracts overseas | :32:05. | :32:08. | |
investment is one of our foundations of success. So we need to maintain | :32:09. | :32:15. | |
the success and that reputation. But we have said that we will bring | :32:16. | :32:21. | |
forward proposals and will do that in due course and I will update the | :32:22. | :32:28. | |
house at that time. As a trade union official three times I supported | :32:29. | :32:32. | |
management and workers at Ellesmere Port through new model bidding | :32:33. | :32:34. | |
processes and each time they demonstrated themselves to be | :32:35. | :32:38. | |
productive, efficient, flexible and their plant to be profitable. | :32:39. | :32:42. | |
Unfortunately those attributes don't cut any ice with Peugeot as the | :32:43. | :32:48. | |
honourable member for Coventry will attest. Can I suggest to the | :32:49. | :32:52. | |
Secretary of State that he uses this opportunity to beef up his | :32:53. | :32:56. | |
industrial strategy and suggest that any public procurement of motor | :32:57. | :33:00. | |
vehicles by police forces, local authorities, government department | :33:01. | :33:04. | |
's, only procure cars by companies that built in the UK and that those | :33:05. | :33:07. | |
who choose not to build in the UK will not be considered? What I would | :33:08. | :33:16. | |
say is that of course I discussed with PSA the context of their | :33:17. | :33:24. | |
closure of the plant in Coventry. It is a new management of the company | :33:25. | :33:28. | |
and what they described to me is a different approach. These are early | :33:29. | :33:33. | |
stages but that was a better message to receive than the alternative. But | :33:34. | :33:40. | |
like him I want to make sure that is reflected in practice. On | :33:41. | :33:44. | |
procurement, it is obviously important that we get good value for | :33:45. | :33:49. | |
money. One of the things we have done is to change procurement rules | :33:50. | :33:52. | |
to allow some of these wider impacts to be taken into account. We know | :33:53. | :34:04. | |
that Opel has not made a profit in the EU since 1999 and the Chief | :34:05. | :34:08. | |
Executive of PSA has a record of drastically reducing costs. But I | :34:09. | :34:13. | |
wonder whether my right honourable friend could tell us what further | :34:14. | :34:17. | |
tours in his armament he has to make sure that PSA do not move the | :34:18. | :34:21. | |
factories and the supply chain out of the UK? What I would say to my | :34:22. | :34:27. | |
honourable friend is again, the discussions are at an early stage, | :34:28. | :34:33. | |
the leak of these discussions only came out in the past week, and I | :34:34. | :34:38. | |
think I've had a number of meetings since then and been very clear with | :34:39. | :34:43. | |
the house, but my view is that the successful operations and we have in | :34:44. | :34:46. | |
this country need to be maintained to continue. The PSA side of the | :34:47. | :34:53. | |
discussions have pointed out quite reasonably that this is not their | :34:54. | :34:58. | |
company yet to make contractual statements about. But it is clear | :34:59. | :35:03. | |
that direction that the discussions are going in, and I will continue to | :35:04. | :35:09. | |
be vigorous in extracting the best possible agreements about the future | :35:10. | :35:15. | |
of Vauxhall. Can I also welcome the ministers statement and the content | :35:16. | :35:21. | |
of what he's said so far. It is clear the UK plants at Vauxhall are | :35:22. | :35:26. | |
run to a high standard. Can the Minister outlined what support he | :35:27. | :35:30. | |
will be offering to ensure the plants are maintained, enhanced, and | :35:31. | :35:36. | |
jobs secured in any takeover, and what influence including financial | :35:37. | :35:39. | |
assistance does the Minister believe the government can exert? I am | :35:40. | :35:43. | |
grateful for what he said. I come back to the fact that the Vauxhall | :35:44. | :35:47. | |
operation in the UK is successful, it is efficient and effective. And | :35:48. | :35:53. | |
that is, as with other car companies, the reason that | :35:54. | :35:56. | |
investments come to this country. We have had a very successful programme | :35:57. | :36:02. | |
of joint working with the automotive sector in areas like research and | :36:03. | :36:06. | |
development and in training and obscuring the workforce. That | :36:07. | :36:12. | |
continues and is available to any manufacturer that participates in | :36:13. | :36:19. | |
the sector. Thank you Mr Speaker. The UK car sector and the | :36:20. | :36:23. | |
manufacturing of steel are inextricably linked, so what role | :36:24. | :36:26. | |
does my right honourable friend see the industrial strategy having to | :36:27. | :36:31. | |
the betterment of both? The benefit of an industrial strategy is that | :36:32. | :36:35. | |
you can look at the connections between areas and between different | :36:36. | :36:41. | |
sectors. And of course a thriving automotive sector in this country is | :36:42. | :36:48. | |
good for the steel industry. Does the Secretary of State agree that | :36:49. | :36:54. | |
weaker protection against dismissal afforded to EU workers makes them | :36:55. | :36:58. | |
more vulnerable relative to their European counterparts, and given his | :36:59. | :37:05. | |
parties, version into a party of the workers, what plans does he have two | :37:06. | :37:08. | |
strengthen protections for UK workers? First of all, the standards | :37:09. | :37:15. | |
that we have for workers in this country are very exacting, and we | :37:16. | :37:20. | |
have made a commitment to maintain them as we leave the European Union. | :37:21. | :37:24. | |
The second thing is that our record of employment is one that we should | :37:25. | :37:31. | |
be proud of. Just in the last few days we were able to report | :37:32. | :37:36. | |
employment of record numbers. And I think that shows that the | :37:37. | :37:43. | |
environment that we operate in is attractive to investors, and the | :37:44. | :37:48. | |
consequence of that is good jobs for British workers. | :37:49. | :37:53. | |
Has the Secretary of State has said, the UK automated manufacturing | :37:54. | :38:00. | |
sector has been extremely impressive than the last decade, but what is | :38:01. | :38:05. | |
striking is that the one advanced industrial nation that hasn't | :38:06. | :38:08. | |
invested in the UK manufacturing sector is France. Does the Secretary | :38:09. | :38:16. | |
of State really believe that the French business, like PSA, will | :38:17. | :38:21. | |
choose to invest in the UK outside of the European Union, or will | :38:22. | :38:27. | |
invest in France and Germany? And will they therefore urgently look at | :38:28. | :38:33. | |
a British solution to the future of this excellent plant which provides | :38:34. | :38:39. | |
work in North Wales and Merseyside and right across the Northwest? I | :38:40. | :38:45. | |
would say that notwithstanding and in many cases as a result of the | :38:46. | :38:53. | |
successful partnership with other overseas car manufacturers, 2016 was | :38:54. | :38:59. | |
a record year for carpet action in this country. It was at a 17 year | :39:00. | :39:05. | |
high. So I think that providing the arrangements are right, we should | :39:06. | :39:11. | |
welcome the confidence of the countries have in this country, and | :39:12. | :39:16. | |
of course the conversations I have heard with PSA lead me to believe | :39:17. | :39:22. | |
that the intentions as communicated to me are to invest in performance, | :39:23. | :39:26. | |
and we have a very proud record of that. The Secretary of State | :39:27. | :39:37. | |
approaches this with great calm and carefulness. I am sure he has looked | :39:38. | :39:44. | |
at the impact on the firm of being inside and outside the customs | :39:45. | :39:49. | |
union. I know he wants to have a zero turf regime with Europe, but we | :39:50. | :39:54. | |
have heard what a high proportion of the components are imported. Does he | :39:55. | :39:59. | |
know whether the Vauxhall cars which are exported would actually meet the | :40:00. | :40:05. | |
threshold for made in the UK under the rules of origin? The little lady | :40:06. | :40:14. | |
takes us further ahead than these preliminary discussions about a | :40:15. | :40:18. | |
prospective scale -- sale of GM 's assets to PSA has got to. I have | :40:19. | :40:22. | |
been very clear, not just with PSA but with every auto company, and | :40:23. | :40:27. | |
every manufacturer, that our intention in the negotiations is to | :40:28. | :40:31. | |
pursue constructive negotiations, to have the best possible access to the | :40:32. | :40:37. | |
single market, respecting the need to avoid bureaucratic elements as | :40:38. | :40:45. | |
well as tariffs. I was born and spent the first 40 years of my life | :40:46. | :40:49. | |
in Luton Soi know-how losing the Vauxhall plant would absolutely rip | :40:50. | :40:54. | |
the heart out of the town but it is a much older issue than that, and | :40:55. | :40:59. | |
the anxiety felt by Vauxhall workers now is being shared by other workers | :41:00. | :41:03. | |
in the manufacturing sector as we face Brexit. What assurances can the | :41:04. | :41:08. | |
Minister give that he is building into the strategy is something that | :41:09. | :41:12. | |
will embed those manufacturing jobs in our communities? I am delighted | :41:13. | :41:15. | |
the honourable lady made that point and I hope she will respond to the | :41:16. | :41:20. | |
consultation, because it is very clear it reflect on and proposes | :41:21. | :41:26. | |
ways to strengthen what are already pillars of success, including our | :41:27. | :41:30. | |
excellent research and of element in terms of the efficiency of | :41:31. | :41:33. | |
industrial processes, and the skills of the workforce. You can't stand | :41:34. | :41:38. | |
still. You need to prepare for the future. And that is precisely what | :41:39. | :41:42. | |
the industrial strategy, which has been warmly welcomed by | :41:43. | :41:45. | |
international investors, is setting out to do. Mr Speaker, this deal | :41:46. | :41:51. | |
inevitably would lead to job losses around Europe. The Prime Minister | :41:52. | :41:55. | |
has said we might have to leave the EU without a deal, so tariffs on | :41:56. | :42:00. | |
vehicles and components are now a possibility. Doesn't that mean that | :42:01. | :42:05. | |
the UK employees inevitably will be at a disadvantage, relative to their | :42:06. | :42:08. | |
colleagues elsewhere in the European Union? What I think the right | :42:09. | :42:14. | |
honourable gentleman has missed out of that analysis is the efficiency | :42:15. | :42:18. | |
and the success of our operations here, and also the strong domestic | :42:19. | :42:25. | |
market that we have in this country. It is necessary to negotiate and to | :42:26. | :42:31. | |
get the best possible terms for our Brexit arrangement, everyone is | :42:32. | :42:35. | |
clear about that, but you should not underplay the strengths we have that | :42:36. | :42:39. | |
attract businesses to invest in this country. | :42:40. | :42:48. | |
Just for one moment, it would appear that there has been no change in the | :42:49. | :42:55. | |
processes of the house as a result of the change of the table, no wigs, | :42:56. | :43:01. | |
which I certainly much welcome. I wish it had happened a long time | :43:02. | :43:06. | |
ago. But can I ask you this, and I do so with respect to the message | :43:07. | :43:12. | |
which is received from the Queen to the head of state, what -- from the | :43:13. | :43:17. | |
head of state, I am just wondering whether the message could be | :43:18. | :43:21. | |
communicated to the house by you, sir, instead of the whip coming in | :43:22. | :43:27. | |
with a stick and the rest of it. No, Diyas. | :43:28. | :43:33. | |
I am very grateful to the honourable gentleman for his point of order. | :43:34. | :43:38. | |
The answer is that the message that is the livered comes from the | :43:39. | :43:45. | |
government, and so I don't myself see that there would be an obvious | :43:46. | :43:48. | |
logic about it being delivered by me. LAUGHTER | :43:49. | :44:01. | |
I'm extremely grateful, but Her Majesty communicates through | :44:02. | :44:04. | |
ministers, that is what has happened. With respect to the other | :44:05. | :44:07. | |
observation the other honourable gentleman has made, I note what he | :44:08. | :44:12. | |
has said, and without rehearsing the Holebas you, the honourable | :44:13. | :44:14. | |
gentleman will know that the request for change came from the clerk of | :44:15. | :44:22. | |
the house and his senior colleagues, and it was agreed to unanimously by | :44:23. | :44:27. | |
members of the House of Commons commission. I made no bones about | :44:28. | :44:30. | |
the fact when I responded points of order that I welcome that change, | :44:31. | :44:35. | |
that it was a change proposed by others, and agreed by the commission | :44:36. | :44:45. | |
chaired by me. Very briefly, Mr Speaker, I agree internally what you | :44:46. | :44:49. | |
said about the weeks and the rest of it. I just wonder whether the | :44:50. | :44:54. | |
procedure we have at the very beginning, despite the explanation | :44:55. | :44:57. | |
you have given on the advice I understand of the clerk, whether you | :44:58. | :45:02. | |
could be so altered so that there would be more emphasis on the | :45:03. | :45:06. | |
message from the head of state from the Queen, rather than all the sort | :45:07. | :45:11. | |
of attention to the whip coming in, and whether he will be able to march | :45:12. | :45:18. | |
backwards without any difficulties and the rest. It doesn't give the | :45:19. | :45:22. | |
impression of a modernised House of Commons. I am very grateful to the | :45:23. | :45:27. | |
honourable gentleman. I have made a point before and I think most people | :45:28. | :45:33. | |
will accept this, that change in this place comes about by Will of | :45:34. | :45:39. | |
the house, and it is right that that should be the case. If the | :45:40. | :45:43. | |
honourable gentleman wishes to initiate a process of attempted | :45:44. | :45:49. | |
change, it is absolutely open to him to do so, and for the case to be | :45:50. | :45:53. | |
argued either way. I think we will leave therefore today. We come now | :45:54. | :46:02. | |
to the programme motion. The Minister to move? The question is | :46:03. | :46:07. | |
the proper is on the order paper, the number | :46:08. | :46:11. | |
two motion. Well, I allowed the scope, and the | :46:12. | :46:26. | |
momentary weight, and the honourable gentleman has taken his opportunity. | :46:27. | :46:32. | |
Mr Peter Bone. Mr Speaker, I just wondered if the Minister could | :46:33. | :46:35. | |
explain why we are changing the programme motion? I am extremely | :46:36. | :46:43. | |
grateful to the Minister for a succinct speech. She does not seem | :46:44. | :46:50. | |
to wish to take advantage. The question is is on the order paper in | :46:51. | :46:55. | |
respect of the programme motion. Say I? On the country say though, the | :46:56. | :47:00. | |
ayes have it, the ayes have it. De Klerk will now proceed to be of the | :47:01. | :47:05. | |
day. Cultural property bill not prevented in the public bill to be | :47:06. | :47:14. | |
considered. Now. Thank you. We begin with amendment four, with which it | :47:15. | :47:18. | |
will be convenient to debate the other amendments. The move amendment | :47:19. | :47:26. | |
four I called Mr Kevin Brennan. Thank you very much. I rise to move | :47:27. | :47:30. | |
amendment four which turns in my name in order to probe the | :47:31. | :47:35. | |
government not thinking on whether digital attacks on cultural property | :47:36. | :47:41. | |
which take a digital form would be considered as damaging cultural | :47:42. | :47:43. | |
property under this bill. If I could just say in passing that we are | :47:44. | :47:49. | |
broadly in support, very much in support actually, of the bill, | :47:50. | :47:52. | |
having judges to do ourselves and sadly run out of time in the last | :47:53. | :47:57. | |
parliament, prior to 2010, because of course this is a bill that will | :47:58. | :48:02. | |
bring into domestic law the offence created by Article 15 of the second | :48:03. | :48:06. | |
protocol to the 1954 Hague Convention, so it is not before time | :48:07. | :48:10. | |
we are doing this and I am glad there are support across the house. | :48:11. | :48:16. | |
We want to during the remaining stages just probed to make sure the | :48:17. | :48:21. | |
government was my position is clear and on the record before the bill is | :48:22. | :48:26. | |
sent off for its royal assent. During previous stages of debate, we | :48:27. | :48:34. | |
had many discussions regarding the Digital reach of this legislation, | :48:35. | :48:38. | |
considering that the original convention as I said was written in | :48:39. | :48:44. | |
1954, with a subsequent protocol of fiercely long before the issues of | :48:45. | :48:48. | |
digital property would have been actively considered. The government | :48:49. | :48:53. | |
during the course of the bill has provided numerous assurances that | :48:54. | :48:57. | |
cultural property which is in digital form could be protected, and | :48:58. | :49:01. | |
we very much welcome the assurances that the minister gave us during | :49:02. | :49:06. | |
committee stage to that effect. And of course if that is true it would | :49:07. | :49:10. | |
be natural therefore if digital property itself is protected under | :49:11. | :49:15. | |
the bill that digital attacks on that digital property would also be | :49:16. | :49:20. | |
covered. And the purpose of this amendment is to get the government | :49:21. | :49:25. | |
to confirm whether or not that is the case, and that our understanding | :49:26. | :49:30. | |
of that is correct. It would not be reasonable to recognised as the tour | :49:31. | :49:34. | |
cultural property but not digital attack upon such digital cultural | :49:35. | :49:41. | |
property. But since this bill involves creating criminal offences, | :49:42. | :49:46. | |
having the government's thinking on the record is very important. The | :49:47. | :49:53. | |
government's response to a different amendment highlights the need for | :49:54. | :49:57. | |
clarity here. In committee we debated whether the cultural emblem, | :49:58. | :50:01. | |
which is introduced in the bill from the convention, the blue shield, | :50:02. | :50:09. | |
which marks are a protected out, could be shown in digital form. The | :50:10. | :50:13. | |
Minister acquired at Columbine on 15th November 2016 in committee and | :50:14. | :50:21. | |
I quote for modern born digital material, such as films and music, | :50:22. | :50:24. | |
in practice we would expect the emblem to be displayed on the | :50:25. | :50:27. | |
physical object on which the material is stored, or on the | :50:28. | :50:32. | |
building in which the physical storage object is kept. Rather than | :50:33. | :50:38. | |
being displayed digitally. That would help to ensure that the emblem | :50:39. | :50:43. | |
is readily visible. That is not to say that it cannot also be depicted | :50:44. | :50:48. | |
in digital form. Now that could be interpreted potentially Mr Deputy | :50:49. | :50:53. | |
Speaker to assume that cultural property, even that which is | :50:54. | :50:57. | |
digital, would only be attacked in a physical sense. That is that it | :50:58. | :51:02. | |
could be interpreted as an assumption that any attacker would | :51:03. | :51:07. | |
be in physical proximity to the item, or in close on a physical | :51:08. | :51:10. | |
proximity to the item to be able to see the blue shield on its casing. | :51:11. | :51:17. | |
However, of course, in reality, digital content is more likely to be | :51:18. | :51:22. | |
attacked by way of hacking. In which case, the question of how the blue | :51:23. | :51:28. | |
shield could flag digital cultural property to a potential attacker is | :51:29. | :51:34. | |
relevant. You won't see the shield on the hard drive's casing if you | :51:35. | :51:37. | |
are hacking into a database of some | :51:38. | :51:39. |