Browse content similar to 25/06/2013. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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You can hear the whole documentary by visiting the BBC Asian Network | :00:01. | :00:11. | |
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Tonight on Newsnight Scotland: We've been inside Glasgow's schools to see | :00:13. | :00:16. | |
how they're trying to improve results for some of Scotland's | :00:16. | :00:18. | |
poorest children. Can they match the extraordinary results seen in | :00:18. | :00:22. | |
London? Good evening. Last month we looked | :00:22. | :00:25. | |
at how the London challenge improved the standards of the capital's | :00:25. | :00:31. | |
schools. At the turn of the century, they had a terrible reputation for | :00:31. | :00:33. | |
poor attainment. But in 2003 the then Labour Government pumped extra | :00:33. | :00:37. | |
cash and resources in to help turn them around. A number of the schools | :00:37. | :00:40. | |
were in disadvantaged areas. In less than a decade these schools have | :00:40. | :00:43. | |
gone from the worst in the country to among the best. Given Glasgow's | :00:43. | :00:46. | |
challenges with similar problems, could we learn anything here from | :00:46. | :00:49. | |
the London challenge experience? Ian Hamilton visited two Glasgow schools | :00:49. | :00:53. | |
- a primary and a secondary in opposite ends of the city - to hear | :00:53. | :00:56. | |
how they are trying to turn the fortunes around for the city's | :00:56. | :01:02. | |
children. Last month I reported from London, | :01:02. | :01:05. | |
where I discovered they had gone from having some of the worst | :01:05. | :01:10. | |
schools in England to some of the best, in less than one decade. But | :01:10. | :01:15. | |
that was London, and this is Glasgow. What is the council doing | :01:15. | :01:25. | |
:01:25. | :01:43. | ||
to improve the standards of schools The pupils at Castlemilk High School | :01:43. | :01:50. | |
are squeezing in one final rehearsal for the autumn show. This secondary | :01:50. | :01:56. | |
school is one of the smallest in the city, with only 430 pupils, but this | :01:56. | :02:01. | |
does not hold it back, nor does it being located in one of the poorest | :02:01. | :02:10. | |
parts of Glasgow. What is remarkable about this school is that 99% of its | :02:10. | :02:16. | |
leavers last year either find a job, an apprenticeship or a place at | :02:16. | :02:19. | |
university or college, making Castlemilk High School not only the | :02:19. | :02:24. | |
best in Glasgow but one of the best in Scotland for school leavers. So | :02:24. | :02:29. | |
how did they achieve this? According to the headteacher, it is all about | :02:29. | :02:34. | |
relationships. It is a long time since the only thing that mattered | :02:34. | :02:39. | |
was your curricular expertise. It does count, but what is really | :02:39. | :02:42. | |
important to effective teaching is that we can build relationships with | :02:42. | :02:51. | |
children. For many years, the number of schools in Glasgow have not had | :02:51. | :02:56. | |
the best reputation. For some areas that was due to a background of | :02:56. | :03:00. | |
economic deprivation. According to the Director of education, | :03:00. | :03:05. | |
Glasgow's situation is so unique, it is unreasonable to compare it with | :03:05. | :03:11. | |
any other local authority. If you take statistics that link to areas | :03:11. | :03:19. | |
of multiple deprivation, Glasgow has 26,700 children living in the 10% | :03:19. | :03:25. | |
most deprived postcodes. One of my neighbouring authorities has 363. We | :03:25. | :03:32. | |
play a different game in the city. They believe that Glasgow City | :03:32. | :03:38. | |
Council have two focus and nourishment and nurturing, because | :03:38. | :03:42. | |
if they do not, some of these boys in the East End of the city would | :03:42. | :03:52. | |
:03:52. | :03:55. | ||
not see their 55th birthday. That is why here in macro -- tempter -- St | :03:55. | :03:59. | |
Anne's Primary School, they are starting them young, teaching them | :03:59. | :04:05. | |
about healthy eating. Children need to recognise that they are valued, | :04:05. | :04:09. | |
laughed, and have lots to offer. We need to make sure they have the | :04:09. | :04:15. | |
skills to be able to do that, and that can be hired because of the | :04:16. | :04:21. | |
challenges the children come from. What did the pupils think? | :04:21. | :04:26. | |
favourite thing here would probably be inside in the classroom. Do you | :04:26. | :04:32. | |
feel quite confident at this school? Yes, because I know if there is | :04:33. | :04:39. | |
anything wrong -- if I do anything wrong, nobody will say anything | :04:39. | :04:43. | |
because you are trying your best. like the teachers, I like the | :04:43. | :04:48. | |
lessons, and we do not just learn with our heads down and working, we | :04:48. | :04:56. | |
get to play fun games to help us learn about it more. We have | :04:56. | :05:01. | |
children coming to school who have not eaten the night before, or they | :05:01. | :05:05. | |
did not eat properly, so how can they sit down in classes and learn? | :05:05. | :05:09. | |
We need to think about the whole child, and all our interactions with | :05:09. | :05:16. | |
children. Glasgow is starting to see more than a glimmer of hope. In the | :05:16. | :05:23. | |
past five years, they have seen a 9% increase in gaining one or more | :05:23. | :05:28. | |
Highers in fifth year, and by the end of fourth year they are seeing a | :05:28. | :05:33. | |
7.5% increase in pupils gaining five or more level threes. Attendance at | :05:33. | :05:39. | |
secondary schools is more than 90%, the highest it has ever been. We are | :05:39. | :05:43. | |
still a long way behind other local authorities, but given the | :05:43. | :05:46. | |
challenges in the city, this academic believe that Glasgow should | :05:46. | :05:51. | |
be praised for the work they have done. I think Glasgow is making huge | :05:51. | :05:57. | |
strides to deliver the sort of change that the London challenge | :05:57. | :06:02. | |
delivered, but without the same funding. I think that is brave and | :06:02. | :06:05. | |
difficult task, and a task quite frankly that they deserve to praised | :06:05. | :06:13. | |
for. If you had the resources that the London challenge and the city | :06:13. | :06:18. | |
challenge have got, could you tackle a lot of the problems in Glasgow? | :06:18. | :06:23. | |
think that I could use the money carefully and wisely. I don't think | :06:23. | :06:30. | |
that I need a massive amount of money. Currently, 2013, 2014, and | :06:30. | :06:34. | |
the forecast for beyond financially, is going to make it very difficult | :06:34. | :06:39. | |
to continue to improve. That is without a shadow of a doubt. Two | :06:39. | :06:47. | |
thirds of the budget is taken up in salaries. So some difficult | :06:47. | :06:51. | |
decisions ahead for Glasgow City Council. St Anne's Primary School | :06:51. | :06:56. | |
choir has travelled the UK with the message of hope and self belief. | :06:56. | :07:00. | |
From one of the poorest parts of the country. The big question for | :07:00. | :07:04. | |
Glasgow City Council and the Scottish Government, can they invest | :07:04. | :07:07. | |
in these children to give them the same opportunities as those from | :07:08. | :07:11. | |
wealthier backgrounds? I'm joined in the studio by Stephen | :07:11. | :07:14. | |
Curran, who is Executive Member for Education on Glasgow Council and by | :07:14. | :07:17. | |
Dr Sue Ellis from Strathclyde University, who you saw in that | :07:17. | :07:24. | |
film. In Edinburgh is Alex Massie of The Spectator. | :07:24. | :07:31. | |
I think everyone will be impressed by the effort, but this statistic | :07:31. | :07:37. | |
about Castlemilk, but 99% of the students who leave go on to a job or | :07:37. | :07:44. | |
apprenticeship. That would not mean that in a conventional league table | :07:44. | :07:51. | |
but is necessarily a particularly good school, would it? Positive | :07:51. | :07:54. | |
destinations mean something positive... But where would that | :07:54. | :08:00. | |
rate compared to other institutions in Glasgow? If you look at the | :08:00. | :08:03. | |
number of Highers, it is different, but the young people there are | :08:03. | :08:08. | |
moving on to a far better place, and we would expect better for them over | :08:08. | :08:15. | |
time. But is that one of your poorest schools better schools? In a | :08:15. | :08:21. | |
strictly academic sense. It is an area that is very deprived, so it | :08:21. | :08:30. | |
has done exceptionally well. But it is still one of your poorer ones. | :08:30. | :08:36. | |
The other thing is, when Diane King, the headteacher, talks about | :08:36. | :08:40. | |
the most important thing being building relationships, I am not | :08:40. | :08:45. | |
sure what she meant. She means understanding the young people and | :08:45. | :08:49. | |
getting the best opportunities for them. Some could be in circumstances | :08:49. | :08:52. | |
where it is difficult to do homework, so they will have homework | :08:52. | :08:59. | |
classes in the school. Some might be coming from difficult | :08:59. | :09:02. | |
circumstances. So it is understanding the challenges they | :09:02. | :09:07. | |
have at school and making sure they get the best out of school in a safe | :09:07. | :09:12. | |
environment. Sue Ellis, I think everyone here will agree that what | :09:12. | :09:20. | |
Glasgow is trying to do is laudable, but the fact is we are not seeing | :09:20. | :09:27. | |
the dramatic turnaround that we saw in London, I'll be? Two I think what | :09:27. | :09:37. | |
:09:37. | :09:40. | ||
happened in London took ten years. Going back to that issue about | :09:40. | :09:44. | |
relationships, what we know about children and learning, is that | :09:45. | :09:48. | |
unless they feel secure and comfortable and confident in what | :09:48. | :09:52. | |
they are doing, they will not try and attempt difficult tasks, and | :09:52. | :09:57. | |
they will not be learning anything. So that willingness to have a go if | :09:57. | :10:01. | |
you like is really absolutely crucial, and if you do not get that | :10:01. | :10:04. | |
right, if the children are sitting there and they feel that any attempt | :10:04. | :10:12. | |
they make will be belittled then... But you said in the film there that | :10:12. | :10:16. | |
Glasgow does not have the money. There was not very much money, it | :10:16. | :10:23. | |
was about �50,000 per school, but Chris Cook of the financial Times | :10:23. | :10:32. | |
work out that a child entering from the poorest area of London into a | :10:32. | :10:37. | |
state school now, can expect to come out with the average result for the | :10:37. | :10:44. | |
whole of England. That is extraordinary, no matter how | :10:45. | :10:53. | |
laudable Stephen Curran has done, it is a million miles away. The London | :10:53. | :10:58. | |
Challenge was about networking skills. That was the key to it. | :10:58. | :11:02. | |
Schools that were struggling but connected with schools that have | :11:02. | :11:08. | |
similar areas... I just want to bring Alex Massie in. I want to come | :11:08. | :11:13. | |
to this first point about the 99% figure. Alex, I suspect you want to | :11:13. | :11:19. | |
praise what Glasgow have done. I just wonder what the key to some of | :11:19. | :11:23. | |
this London stuff is. This idea of children coming from deprived areas, | :11:23. | :11:26. | |
and you have got to make allowances and build relationships and all the | :11:26. | :11:30. | |
rest of it, one of the things that seems pretty key to these schemes is | :11:30. | :11:35. | |
that they do not do that. They have expectations of students from the | :11:35. | :11:38. | |
most deprived areas which are the same as the expectations of students | :11:38. | :11:45. | |
from middle-class areas. Exactly. That is the key point. It is the | :11:45. | :11:50. | |
case not just in London, but in Detroit, in the south side of | :11:50. | :11:54. | |
Chicago, in other disadvantaged areas. The very worst thing that you | :11:54. | :11:57. | |
can do for children from disadvantaged backgrounds, and we | :11:57. | :12:03. | |
know the challenges that these children space, is make excuses for | :12:03. | :12:09. | |
them -- children face. It is that sort of thing that rates them off | :12:09. | :12:14. | |
before they have even made it to school. It is that sort of thing | :12:14. | :12:17. | |
that is so dispiriting. It is the sort of thing that should actually | :12:17. | :12:22. | |
be a matter of anger, it should induce anger, and one of the scary | :12:23. | :12:27. | |
things about education politics is how little anger it produces. If as | :12:27. | :12:37. | |
:12:37. | :12:41. | ||
many people failed in treatment of the elderly or in the NHS, it would | :12:41. | :12:44. | |
be considered a scandal. Far too many children have their lives John | :12:44. | :12:46. | |
this add to the NHS, it would be considered a scandal. Far too many | :12:47. | :12:49. | |
children have their lives jaundice at two earlier stage. What Glasgow | :12:49. | :12:51. | |
it must begin before children get to school. You are absolutely right. It | :12:51. | :12:56. | |
is a culture of low expectations. Stephen Curran, the thing that | :12:56. | :13:02. | |
strikes me, we talked about networking. The London Challenge was | :13:02. | :13:06. | |
not just a nice idea. It was a very specific thing that you do not seem | :13:06. | :13:13. | |
to have. For example, pitting people who were in a unit at the Department | :13:13. | :13:17. | |
Of Education into schools that were failing to help turn them around, | :13:17. | :13:21. | |
with the agreement of schools, getting partnership boards, having | :13:21. | :13:25. | |
this idea of mentoring and having teachers spending time away from the | :13:25. | :13:29. | |
schools. This idea that your job was not teaching in your local school, | :13:29. | :13:33. | |
but teaching for the whole of London. But, you do not seem to have | :13:33. | :13:39. | |
any of that. We are doing some of that work. Because of the Curriculum | :13:40. | :13:49. | |
For Excellence, we have a teacher who is a national leader, in | :13:49. | :13:55. | |
languages, who is going great across the country. Some of this is | :13:55. | :13:59. | |
happening already. Alex Massie is right. We are angry about this and | :13:59. | :14:02. | |
we are passionate about lifting expectations at all of the schools. | :14:02. | :14:07. | |
The support network is really important. I come back to this point | :14:07. | :14:11. | |
that there were very specific things done in London, and it is very easy | :14:11. | :14:15. | |
to talk as if you are doing the same thing. You can even convince | :14:15. | :14:23. | |
yourself you are, but in fact, you are not. I think that London, | :14:23. | :14:28. | |
because the education system is different in London, the schools had | :14:28. | :14:31. | |
access to different sorts of data, and that is an important thing to | :14:31. | :14:35. | |
think about. Schools had better quality data about literacy and | :14:35. | :14:39. | |
numeracy than the schools in Scotland have. They also, because of | :14:39. | :14:43. | |
the way education is organised, had access to how schools in | :14:43. | :14:47. | |
neighbouring authorities with similar pupils were doing, whereas | :14:47. | :14:51. | |
in Scotland, a local authority knows how their own schools are doing, but | :14:51. | :14:55. | |
they do not necessarily know how other schools are doing. You are | :14:55. | :14:59. | |
getting too part of the problem here. It is surely a national | :14:59. | :15:03. | |
disgrace that we do not have that information to hand. We are trying | :15:03. | :15:07. | |
to reform... It is a bit like the NHS. You are trying to reform will | :15:07. | :15:13. | |
you do not know how something is performing. You would not want to | :15:13. | :15:22. | |
import all of the English elements. This identifying... Identifying | :15:22. | :15:26. | |
that, moving in, and the whole idea of mentoring and moving teachers in | :15:26. | :15:32. | |
to help you, that is what Glasgow needs to do. I think the thing about | :15:32. | :15:35. | |
the London Challenge that was very distinctive was that when people | :15:35. | :15:43. | |
moved into those schools, the same teacher was still in charge. | :15:43. | :15:48. | |
schools headteacher was still making the decisions. It is an important | :15:48. | :15:54. | |
point as well, you have got to remember, the New Labour Government | :15:54. | :15:58. | |
had gone through before that started. A lot of the worst | :15:58. | :16:04. | |
teachers... They had abolished the LGA and replace it with a private | :16:04. | :16:10. | |
company. There is a real support and challenge around teachers. If they | :16:10. | :16:18. | |
are not performing, gave it -- they get the chance to get professional | :16:18. | :16:21. | |
support. Sometimes they leave the position because young people 's | :16:21. | :16:26. | |
futures are at stake. Alex Massie, what would you like to see Stephen | :16:26. | :16:32. | |
Curran doing? In the sense of structure and governance, there are | :16:32. | :16:35. | |
many different ways to run a successful school system. | :16:35. | :16:39. | |
Personally, I think there is a lot to be said for setting schools free | :16:39. | :16:43. | |
from local authority control. was not part of the London | :16:43. | :16:53. | |
experience. It is sort of...It was before academies. The academies were | :16:53. | :17:03. | |
:17:03. | :17:03. | ||
part of the success... I am sorry, I must correct you. What would you say | :17:03. | :17:09. | |
to Stephen Curran? We need to demand more from all sectors. We also need | :17:09. | :17:13. | |
to demand more from teachers. There are a lot of very good teachers who | :17:13. | :17:18. | |
do a lot of very good work. Teachers want to be treated as a high status, | :17:18. | :17:20. | |
well-paid profession and that is the right thing to do. That means that | :17:20. | :17:27. | |
we must demand more from them. think we will leave this with the | :17:27. | :17:34. |