Browse content similar to 31/07/2012. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Tonight, will Olympic athletes soon have genetic engineering at their | :00:12. | :00:18. | |
fingertips. This unexpected gold medal has won top one top swimming | :00:18. | :00:24. | |
coach suggesting one -- this might be already a possibility. Can such | :00:24. | :00:28. | |
engineering even been done. Better, stronger, faster, it is possible if | :00:28. | :00:32. | |
you are a mouse, but humans? If we know what the key genes are, and | :00:32. | :00:36. | |
many people in sports genetics believe they have a list of around | :00:37. | :00:40. | |
100 genes they think are very important, theoretically, they | :00:40. | :00:44. | |
could all be manipulated. scientist, an athlete, and bioet | :00:44. | :00:47. | |
cyst, discuss what kind of modification is happening and | :00:47. | :00:51. | |
whether we can test for it. Also tonight, we have been given | :00:51. | :00:55. | |
new figures of the scale and causes of anorexia, does that change the | :00:55. | :01:00. | |
way we see its victims. I would make myself run in the snow when I | :01:00. | :01:07. | |
have chill blains, and I wouldn't touch food in case it went through | :01:07. | :01:14. | |
my skin. A writer recovering joins the chair of the health Select | :01:14. | :01:18. | |
Committee. Was there it all a Romney shambles, as his foreign | :01:18. | :01:22. | |
tour jets home from Poland, what has it told us of the foreign | :01:22. | :01:32. | |
:01:32. | :01:35. | ||
policy of the man who could be US President in a few weeks time. Ye | :01:35. | :01:40. | |
Shiwen has done it again, tonight she won gold in the 200ms medley, | :01:40. | :01:47. | |
with the shockwaves still rerating from her gold in the 400 individual | :01:47. | :01:51. | |
medley. In that race she took five seconds off her previous best time. | :01:51. | :01:55. | |
Resulting in one of the US senior coaches labelling her performance | :01:55. | :01:58. | |
immediately after heroin as "disturbing", there was no evidence | :01:58. | :02:02. | |
of doping, and according to the chair of the Olympic Association in | :02:02. | :02:06. | |
Britain, the swimmer deserves recognition for her talent. She | :02:07. | :02:10. | |
also has particularly large hands and feet, which is not a crime. | :02:10. | :02:17. | |
Imagine in the future if athletes could be genetically modified. We | :02:17. | :02:22. | |
have news into research into this field? In the midst of this row, | :02:22. | :02:26. | |
the idea of genetic manipulation, or gene doping in sport has sur | :02:26. | :02:30. | |
Fayeed. We looked at this last -- if you are faced, we looked at this | :02:30. | :02:34. | |
last week, some of the enhancing coming along in the future, the | :02:34. | :02:40. | |
idea of epigenetics, a road athlete turning up or down useful genes. It | :02:40. | :02:45. | |
turns out this very idea of how our genes and our environment interact | :02:45. | :02:49. | |
will be the legacy of the Olympic testing lab. The Olympic testing | :02:49. | :02:53. | |
lab, where they look at all the samples of athletes, we should hear | :02:53. | :02:58. | |
from the Government tomorrow, will become a multimillion pound medical | :02:58. | :03:02. | |
research centre, where we will look at the interaction between our | :03:02. | :03:06. | |
genes and environment, to try to find new treatments. The way that | :03:07. | :03:10. | |
our genes and environment interact determines how well we respond to | :03:10. | :03:14. | |
certain treatments. So, for the time being, this lab is going to be | :03:14. | :03:24. | |
:03:24. | :03:37. | ||
focusing on keeping these Olympic It looks like it will be Ye Shiwen. | :03:37. | :03:41. | |
Tonight Ye Shiwen was in the pool again, winning her second golgd in | :03:41. | :03:50. | |
the final of the women's -- gold, in the final of the women's 200ms | :03:50. | :03:56. | |
individual medly setting an Olympic record not a world record. The row | :03:57. | :04:01. | |
was fuelled by outspoken reaction to that performance, byed leading | :04:01. | :04:05. | |
American swimming coach, who described it as "unbelievable", | :04:05. | :04:11. | |
today there has been huge support for the young young swimmer, by | :04:11. | :04:17. | |
officials and athlete. These are athletes competing at the highest | :04:17. | :04:22. | |
level, we have seen records broken all over the place. In terms of | :04:22. | :04:26. | |
athletes themselves, as you know, in the final, the first five | :04:26. | :04:33. | |
athletes are tested, compulsory, and two others. It is really well, | :04:33. | :04:37. | |
we have a very, very strong drug testing programme, we are very | :04:37. | :04:40. | |
confident if there are cheat we will catch them. As we already have | :04:40. | :04:45. | |
done. This morning, the head of spwrin's Olympic Association backed | :04:45. | :04:50. | |
up that position. -- Britain's Olympic Association backed up that | :04:50. | :04:58. | |
position, saying Ye Shiwen had passed WADA tests. She has insisted | :04:58. | :05:01. | |
there is no problem with her performance, because the Chinese | :05:01. | :05:05. | |
sticks to the strict antdy doping policies. But there is another | :05:05. | :05:09. | |
possibility, the idea that such outstanding performances might be | :05:09. | :05:19. | |
:05:19. | :05:31. | ||
the product of some form of genetic His is a lone voice, and US | :05:31. | :05:37. | |
officials have today distances themselves from his views. But is | :05:37. | :05:42. | |
genetic manipulation in sport possible, can we test for it? And | :05:42. | :05:46. | |
is it happening. When people talk about gene doping in sport, they | :05:46. | :05:50. | |
are not talking about designer babies, with genes hand-picked to | :05:50. | :05:54. | |
create the superathlete of the future. What people mean by gene | :05:54. | :05:58. | |
doping at the moment, is either adding genes to particular cells or | :05:58. | :06:02. | |
organs of an athlete's body, say to increase oxygen uptake in their | :06:02. | :06:07. | |
lungs, or the new science of epigenetics, turning up the power | :06:07. | :06:17. | |
:06:17. | :06:18. | ||
of any useful genes an athlete happens to have been born with. | :06:18. | :06:23. | |
Tweaking genes can work in animals, Tweaking genes can work in animals, | :06:23. | :06:28. | |
the mouse at the front has been manipulated from birth to carry | :06:28. | :06:33. | |
extra genes to make it run faster, but also to want to run faster too. | :06:33. | :06:38. | |
It might work in mice, but how might human athletes improve their | :06:38. | :06:42. | |
performance by tweaking their genes. The two areas, strength and | :06:42. | :06:46. | |
endurance. The strength we have genes like insulin growth factor 1, | :06:46. | :06:51. | |
shown in animals, able to increase strength and power of animals | :06:52. | :06:55. | |
models. That is a possibility. The second is the gene you get more of | :06:55. | :06:59. | |
when you go to altitude, we have seen individuals who have mutant | :06:59. | :07:03. | |
genes in that area, they have also enhanced performance in humans, | :07:03. | :07:08. | |
that also would be a possibility. Tim Speckor carries out unique | :07:08. | :07:16. | |
studies on twins, he's looking at how the outside world can help our | :07:16. | :07:22. | |
how the outside world can help our genes being expressed in our body. | :07:22. | :07:26. | |
We know what the key genes are, and sports people believe they have a | :07:26. | :07:30. | |
list of 100 genes they think is important. Theoretically they could | :07:30. | :07:36. | |
all be manipulated and tuned up or down, using these epigenetic | :07:36. | :07:45. | |
methods. He thinks rogue athletes might one day be able to turn these | :07:45. | :07:49. | |
up or down by taking a pill. Scientists at the Olympic testing | :07:49. | :07:56. | |
lab say they have made it harder to cheat, and authorities have banned | :07:56. | :07:59. | |
genetic manipulation. Whether it is being done I think is unlikely. I | :07:59. | :08:03. | |
would show the evidence occurring from gene therapy, where we have | :08:03. | :08:09. | |
tried for over 20 years to make it work and cure diseases like cystic | :08:09. | :08:13. | |
fibrosis, and it is very hard. In practice we know how to do it, | :08:13. | :08:16. | |
actually making it work is very hard. | :08:16. | :08:20. | |
In the end, as other swimmers have said today, it is perfectly | :08:20. | :08:26. | |
possible for a young swimmer to suddenly shine in this way. | :08:26. | :08:33. | |
I'm joined now by Ruta Meilutyte, a bio ethicist in Scotland, and one | :08:33. | :08:36. | |
of the first to write about gene doping. | :08:37. | :08:44. | |
And a Professor of human geneology. And from Stratford, by the former | :08:44. | :08:49. | |
world champion swimmer Karen Pickering, who has competed at four | :08:49. | :08:55. | |
consecutive Olympic Games. First of all, that tremendous performance | :08:55. | :08:59. | |
from Ye Shiwen, as we have said, she has been absolutely cleared. Is | :08:59. | :09:04. | |
it inevitable that there will be talk of manipulation, when there | :09:04. | :09:09. | |
has been such a stunning victory, taking five seconds off her record | :09:09. | :09:12. | |
on Saturday. It is a bit of a shame, actually. I watched that | :09:12. | :09:15. | |
performance, my first thought was what an incredible swim it was by a | :09:15. | :09:18. | |
young girl that we have watched swim for a couple of years now, we | :09:18. | :09:22. | |
have been waiting for her to do something quite impressive. It is a | :09:22. | :09:26. | |
shame, and slightly cynical of some people, that they will look at that | :09:26. | :09:31. | |
performance and think that it's not quite legitimate. That wasn't my | :09:31. | :09:35. | |
first thought. We have seen a lot of amazing performances in the pool. | :09:35. | :09:40. | |
Some much more spectacular than her's was. But I think part of the | :09:40. | :09:44. | |
problem is that it was a little bit of sterotyping and a little bit to | :09:44. | :09:48. | |
do with China's history of doping, the reason why she is being singled | :09:48. | :09:51. | |
out. Do athletes expect it? We just heard in the film there, athletes | :09:52. | :09:59. | |
are being tested all the time, so the whole atmosphere round | :09:59. | :10:05. | |
enhancement is very live? I think that we know, unfortunately, there | :10:05. | :10:09. | |
are always going to be some athletes who want to get an unfair | :10:09. | :10:12. | |
advantage, whether that is through doping or through this new idea of | :10:12. | :10:17. | |
gene doping, you know, there is always going to be some people who | :10:17. | :10:21. | |
will try. You have been in the fifth Olympics, | :10:21. | :10:26. | |
seventh, you are watching it very closely this idea that the very | :10:26. | :10:29. | |
thing Karen said, there will always be athlete who is want to get ahead, | :10:29. | :10:34. | |
for all sorts of reasons. That desire to get ahead is legitimate, | :10:34. | :10:40. | |
can it be legitimately met through genetic engineering, or is it | :10:40. | :10:43. | |
always something that will be banned? The challenge for athletes | :10:43. | :10:46. | |
is we put them in a position where they are expected to go faster, | :10:46. | :10:49. | |
higher and stronger, yet restrict the means by which they can do this. | :10:50. | :10:54. | |
I think it is revealing that in 2006 the British Government | :10:54. | :10:58. | |
launched an inquiry into human enhance. Technologies into sport, | :10:58. | :11:04. | |
not anti-doping. It speaks to this broader culture of human | :11:04. | :11:07. | |
enhancement that surrounds the world of sports. The give us an | :11:07. | :11:10. | |
idea of something that would enhance an athlete's performance if | :11:10. | :11:15. | |
it was genetic engineering? Not so much genetic engineering, but the | :11:15. | :11:20. | |
kinds of enhancements are similar. Endurance and power are the two | :11:20. | :11:24. | |
main things. Laser eye surgery is an example, it is one of those | :11:24. | :11:28. | |
modifications that the world of sport can't really ban, but you and | :11:28. | :11:33. | |
I can use them and athletes can use them, it could enhance its | :11:33. | :11:36. | |
performance. That is the bigger challenge sport face, there will be | :11:36. | :11:41. | |
an explosion of enhancements athletes can use. Test or not test, | :11:41. | :11:46. | |
ban or not ban? Medically supervised enhancements is the way | :11:46. | :11:49. | |
to go. I disagree with that, it is fundamentally against the nature of | :11:49. | :11:54. | |
sport. That is why we have the Olympic here in London to sell rate | :11:54. | :11:58. | |
that. The world anti-dope -- celebrate that, the World Anti- | :11:58. | :12:03. | |
Doping Agency is clear about it, it has added gene doping to its list | :12:03. | :12:08. | |
of banned substances for a good reason. Can you test for gene | :12:08. | :12:12. | |
doping, there are 100 different genes said to possibly enhance or | :12:12. | :12:15. | |
improve an athlete's performance, how do you test? The first question | :12:15. | :12:20. | |
is, is anybody doing it, do we have any evidence that anybody is | :12:20. | :12:26. | |
actually using, what effectively is, gene therapy techniques. Do you | :12:26. | :12:31. | |
have the tests to know? The tests are being developed. There are | :12:31. | :12:35. | |
developments in analytical chemistry, sell later and molecular | :12:35. | :12:38. | |
biology, developing all the time. In eight years time, with a blood | :12:38. | :12:43. | |
sample, there are likely to be genetic fragments, traces of the | :12:43. | :12:50. | |
investigateors used to get genes into sis -- vectors that are used | :12:50. | :12:55. | |
to get genes into systems. It might be possible. I look forward to the | :12:55. | :13:00. | |
future in seven years when all the medals will be distributeded to the | :13:00. | :13:05. | |
true winners. It seems to me that is the scenario athletes could face. | :13:05. | :13:09. | |
Tell me, if there was something like the laser eye surgery, which | :13:09. | :13:14. | |
actually makes an Archer see better, and it is open to everybody else on | :13:14. | :13:18. | |
the planet. Do you mean to say athletes can't take it because it | :13:18. | :13:23. | |
will give them an unfair advantage? There is a clear distinction | :13:23. | :13:27. | |
between medal exemption for different conditions. What about | :13:27. | :13:29. | |
actively trying to make your performance better? It is a grey | :13:29. | :13:33. | |
area. We could have the same debate about someone, for example, who has | :13:33. | :13:39. | |
a mutation in their mystaten gene, for example, which we know, | :13:39. | :13:42. | |
enhances muscle mass. Do you ban these individuals, who, through no | :13:42. | :13:46. | |
fault of their own, have a genetic mutation. I think you don't. I | :13:46. | :13:50. | |
think actually the future of sport will wrestle with this problem, and | :13:50. | :13:54. | |
find it very difficult to restrict people from participating. On that | :13:54. | :13:57. | |
point, you were saying that there will always be some athletes who | :13:57. | :14:02. | |
want to get ahead. What if the advances in genetic engineering are | :14:02. | :14:09. | |
such that athletes can get a -- ahead in a legitimate way. Using it | :14:10. | :14:13. | |
to repair muscles and make them stronger. Do you think that should | :14:13. | :14:18. | |
be outlawed? I think it is up to WADA, the IOC, for governing bodies | :14:18. | :14:22. | |
to look at what those roles r it is our duty as athletes to abide by | :14:23. | :14:26. | |
those rules. We have to hope and know that our governing bodies will | :14:26. | :14:32. | |
do what is ried right, will make the right decisions and -- right, | :14:32. | :14:36. | |
will make the right decisions and clear up that grey area and we | :14:36. | :14:40. | |
stick to the rules. It is unfair to athletes if there is a grey area. | :14:40. | :14:44. | |
If things are changing all the time. Athletes, through no fault of their | :14:44. | :14:48. | |
own, could fall foul of the rules there must be a fear about that? | :14:48. | :14:51. | |
Absolutely. But never going to be black and white. There will always | :14:51. | :14:55. | |
be situations. You have had now in terms of medications as well. If | :14:55. | :15:00. | |
you just have to take, for instance, athletes who are asmathic, and | :15:00. | :15:03. | |
legitimately need some medication, that may be banned in being taken | :15:03. | :15:06. | |
in other ways. I think that there iss always going to be areas that | :15:06. | :15:09. | |
need to be looked at, and unfortunately it is never going to | :15:09. | :15:14. | |
be black and white. But we just have to hope that, with the | :15:14. | :15:18. | |
advancements in technology, and the science behind, and as well, using | :15:18. | :15:21. | |
intelligence testing, as much as possible, to understand what is | :15:21. | :15:25. | |
going on out there, because athletes do hear about things, | :15:25. | :15:30. | |
people do talk, and the knowledge is spread, we just have to hope | :15:30. | :15:34. | |
that using all those techniques we can catch those people and stop | :15:34. | :15:38. | |
them. You are talking about the knowledge being spread, one of the | :15:38. | :15:42. | |
many legacies of the Olympics, is this testing lab for dopg, and | :15:42. | :15:46. | |
presumably for gene testing, is going to be something that will be | :15:46. | :15:56. | |
used, not only for athletes, but for the general population. The | :15:56. | :15:59. | |
point is, science is moving so fast and coaches know, athletes are | :15:59. | :16:09. | |
always on the look out for these things, is it policable? The bigger | :16:09. | :16:15. | |
challenge is five years from now it could cost less than �1,000 to map | :16:15. | :16:19. | |
a genome. There will be such a strong public argument by then from | :16:19. | :16:27. | |
everybody, to have their genome map, that conceivably we will all have a | :16:27. | :16:31. | |
24-hour look at it. And presumably for parents if your kids are going | :16:31. | :16:36. | |
to be good at eightly thes. If there is genome therapy, you can't | :16:36. | :16:40. | |
ban that? Athletic performances are such a beautifully integrated | :16:40. | :16:45. | |
performance, so many factors are involved, it will be incredibly | :16:45. | :16:50. | |
complex to tease out the genetic factors, we don't have gene that is | :16:50. | :16:54. | |
can accurately predict performance, they are only loosely associated | :16:54. | :16:57. | |
with performance. A long way to go. We will see what happens over the | :16:57. | :17:01. | |
next seven years and look at those testings. | :17:01. | :17:05. | |
Anorexia is a killer and dreadful death. It is not too harsh to say | :17:05. | :17:12. | |
it has been dismissed in the past that it is a disease that affects | :17:12. | :17:20. | |
self-obsessed teenage girls. We have news that eating discords are | :17:20. | :17:24. | |
costing billions. And anorexia sufferers are presenting younger, | :17:24. | :17:30. | |
even below ten. And brain scans intricates a strong predisposition | :17:30. | :17:36. | |
to the disease. Doctors are warning that budget constraints are | :17:36. | :17:40. | |
preventing people being referred early enough to get to the root of | :17:40. | :17:45. | |
the problem. This report contains some explicit images. | :17:45. | :17:49. | |
One of the saddest things that my brother, who is 16 now, doesn't | :17:49. | :17:54. | |
remember me without this illness. I feel I have lost my innocence, it | :17:54. | :17:58. | |
has taken everything. Ffion Jones last had a birthday cake when she | :17:58. | :18:04. | |
was 11, that is when she developed anorexia. Now 22, it stole her | :18:04. | :18:08. | |
childhood. At first I felt like I was in control, I felt like it was | :18:08. | :18:12. | |
something that I could have as my own. That I was good at, because | :18:12. | :18:15. | |
nobody else could not eat. I felt quite invincible and powerful at | :18:15. | :18:20. | |
that point. That changed really quickly. I just felt like | :18:20. | :18:24. | |
completely consumed, I got taken over. Not only did she stop eating, | :18:25. | :18:30. | |
to the alarm of her family, she refused to drink. I developed all | :18:30. | :18:35. | |
these obsessive tendencies, I was a compulsive exerciser, I would make | :18:35. | :18:41. | |
myself run in the snow when I had chillblanes, I wouldn't eat or | :18:41. | :18:45. | |
drink, I became phobic of food, I wouldn't touch food in case it got | :18:45. | :18:51. | |
be a surbed through my skin. She is being treated at one of the | :18:51. | :18:55. | |
specialist centres at Cotswold House, intensive support is helping | :18:55. | :19:01. | |
her eat regularly. The latest research suggests a strong genetic | :19:01. | :19:05. | |
predisposition of anorexia, she will always have to live with its | :19:05. | :19:11. | |
consequences. I have a lot of long- term implications which I was quite | :19:11. | :19:14. | |
ignorant of and didn't want to acknowledge as part of the illness. | :19:14. | :19:18. | |
They are a lot of serious side- effects, it is not a case I will | :19:18. | :19:28. | |
:19:28. | :19:28. | ||
not eat for a while and put on weight. I got diagnosed with | :19:28. | :19:36. | |
osteoporosis at 18. I went for an X-ray on my spine, my back is | :19:36. | :19:39. | |
crumbling because of calcium depletion, and my spine is | :19:40. | :19:44. | |
crumbling. I'm not sure if I can have children or note. By the time | :19:44. | :19:48. | |
people are diagnosed with anorexia, their weight is so low, their | :19:48. | :19:51. | |
general health is severely compromised. They are at risk of | :19:51. | :19:55. | |
organ and heart failure. This is especially true in younger patients. | :19:55. | :19:59. | |
Newsnight has seen new figures from the charity, Beat, which reveal the | :19:59. | :20:05. | |
true costs. In the UK more than 1.5 million people suffer an eating | :20:05. | :20:09. | |
disorder. Most cases start in adolescence, affecting seven out of | :20:09. | :20:18. | |
1,000 girls, and one in a thousand boys. In England their ill-health | :20:18. | :20:22. | |
costs �1.26 billion, a figure expected to double over the next 20 | :20:22. | :20:28. | |
years. Of all the psychiatric illnesses, anorexia is the most | :20:28. | :20:31. | |
deadly. It kills more people than depression, and alcohol and drug | :20:31. | :20:35. | |
addiction. Half the people who get it doesn't recover, while a fifth | :20:35. | :20:42. | |
will die from it. This is a few years later. | :20:42. | :20:48. | |
This is rosary Marston, during her 30 -- Rosemary Marston, during her | :20:48. | :20:52. | |
30-year struggle with the illness. I thought I was living a lifestyle | :20:52. | :20:57. | |
that suited me. Today she says she's finally recovered. In one | :20:57. | :21:02. | |
crisis, when her funding support specialist treatment was withdrawn, | :21:02. | :21:08. | |
she expected to die. I saw my reflection in the mirror, and took | :21:08. | :21:14. | |
photographs of my reflection in the mirror. I thought this is what I | :21:14. | :21:19. | |
want to leave behind, that people know that this illness isn't just | :21:19. | :21:24. | |
about vanity, it is not about looking good on the beach. This is | :21:24. | :21:33. | |
serious. I then went into a coma. I was taken into hospital that day. | :21:33. | :21:38. | |
Stopping the symptoms themselves, damaging the brain more, is very | :21:38. | :21:41. | |
important.... Her consultant, a world renowned | :21:41. | :21:45. | |
expert in eating disorders, explains why people with anorexia | :21:45. | :21:50. | |
are simply unable to think straight. The symptoms themselves, because | :21:50. | :21:53. | |
they interfere with nutrition, that means the body and brain are | :21:54. | :21:58. | |
damaged, because the brain is one of the hungryist organs in the body. | :21:58. | :22:05. | |
It uses more calories per gram than muscles even. If you are depriving | :22:05. | :22:14. | |
the brain of calories, it doesn't function as well. The brain is the | :22:14. | :22:20. | |
focus of ground-breaking research into possible genetic causes for | :22:20. | :22:26. | |
the illness. Professor Bryan Lask says photo imaging technology, has | :22:26. | :22:32. | |
allowed his team to study part of the brain, the insula, which in | :22:32. | :22:34. | |
anorexic patients is not working properly, changing our | :22:34. | :22:37. | |
understanding of the disease. so long people thought this was | :22:37. | :22:42. | |
just people choosing to go on a diet and rather manipulating people | :22:42. | :22:46. | |
around them, by saying they are footoo fat. It was seen as this -- | :22:46. | :22:50. | |
they are too fat. It was seen as spoilt middle-class girls getting | :22:50. | :22:54. | |
it. It is not like that at all. It is not a choice. You inherit a | :22:54. | :22:59. | |
particular profile of genes, not one gene, there isn't an anorexic | :23:00. | :23:04. | |
gene, but a combination of genes, that render you vulnerable to the | :23:04. | :23:09. | |
development of anorexia, when exposed to other factors. | :23:09. | :23:13. | |
Figures for those with anorexia are stable, but clinicians report they | :23:13. | :23:19. | |
are seeing younger patients, some below the age of ten, making | :23:19. | :23:25. | |
earlier intervention and treatment vital. It is definitely not taken | :23:25. | :23:29. | |
seriously enough. You could talk to any number of parents who have a | :23:29. | :23:32. | |
daughter with anorexia, and they will tell you about the struggle | :23:32. | :23:35. | |
they have, not only with trying to help their daughter themselves, | :23:35. | :23:39. | |
which is another story, it is so difficult for parents, but getting | :23:39. | :23:44. | |
informed help. They so often get palmed off with it is just a phase, | :23:44. | :23:48. | |
or they will send her to a dietician, they are wonderful if | :23:48. | :23:52. | |
you need one, but this isn't about what you eat, it is about what you | :23:52. | :23:55. | |
can't eat. We are really depriving our children of an essential | :23:55. | :23:59. | |
treatment. This specialist centre is run by | :23:59. | :24:04. | |
the private sector for younger patients. Traditional treatment of | :24:04. | :24:08. | |
anorexia involves restoring a sufferer's weight. But it is | :24:08. | :24:13. | |
recognised it takes far more to restore a healthy attitude to | :24:13. | :24:18. | |
eating. To avoid the disruption anorexia brings to a young person's | :24:18. | :24:23. | |
life. Eating will have left them with a lot of high emotions, high | :24:23. | :24:28. | |
levels of anxiety, feeling very angry, post-meal support is about | :24:28. | :24:32. | |
sitting with a young person after a meal, for a period of time, so they | :24:32. | :24:39. | |
can go past the most dangerous part of that anxiety. But the most | :24:39. | :24:44. | |
complex cases require long-term treatment. This centre include an | :24:44. | :24:48. | |
Ofsted-approved school toe try to replace the education that is -- to | :24:48. | :24:51. | |
try to replace the education that is sometimes otherwise lost. The | :24:51. | :24:56. | |
average stay at this home is about 20 months. Such specialist centres | :24:56. | :25:01. | |
are, of course, expensive, it is worth it, say staff, if repeated | :25:01. | :25:07. | |
hospital admissions can be avoided. But the pressures on health budgets | :25:07. | :25:10. | |
means people are much more ill, their weight much less, before they | :25:10. | :25:15. | |
can be referred to places like this. Clinicians warn of a revolving door, | :25:15. | :25:21. | |
where patients are pushed into and out of treatment, to save money. | :25:21. | :25:26. | |
will see more revolving door cases because we're not getting to the | :25:26. | :25:30. | |
root of the problem, we are addressing the symptoms quite | :25:31. | :25:36. | |
effectively, but we're doing so over and over again. In turn, as I | :25:36. | :25:41. | |
said, that will mean that a certain percentage of those cases will keep | :25:41. | :25:48. | |
coming back, and I think that actually a well intended strategy | :25:48. | :25:55. | |
to keep people out of hospital, will actually lead to more chronic | :25:55. | :25:58. | |
and severe and enduring cases. People say you are not thin enough | :25:58. | :26:04. | |
to need specialist services, and that's awful, that, you know, | :26:04. | :26:08. | |
people have to get more ill before they warrant specialised services. | :26:08. | :26:15. | |
So I think that needs to be changed, the fact that early signs and | :26:15. | :26:19. | |
intervening before people need intensive care, such as in-patient | :26:19. | :26:24. | |
care, is very important. Last year, Bryan Lask noted a | :26:24. | :26:28. | |
dramatic fall in referrals for in- patient treatment, caused by cuts | :26:28. | :26:34. | |
in spending. He was alarmed by the effect on patients. So the cutbacks | :26:34. | :26:39. | |
are leading to really deteriorating patients? Absolutely. The cutbacks | :26:39. | :26:42. | |
have not only deprived the children of treatment, but they have | :26:42. | :26:47. | |
actually made them worse. As a young woman, Rosemary Marston | :26:47. | :26:53. | |
didn't recognise she had an illness. This is her at 37. By then, | :26:53. | :26:59. | |
anorexia had her in its grip. would go into hospital, my weight | :26:59. | :27:03. | |
would be restored, but I left not feeling too much better about | :27:04. | :27:07. | |
myself or my prospect. And so, it was only a matter of time before I | :27:07. | :27:12. | |
would be back in hospital again. As I got older, the periods of time | :27:12. | :27:18. | |
between admissions were shorter and shorter. I think I worked out that | :27:18. | :27:28. | |
:27:28. | :27:30. | ||
in the last 20 years of the illness, I spent 18 years as an in-patient. | :27:30. | :27:36. | |
Tests like this one, used by Bryan Lask's team, are used to identify | :27:36. | :27:42. | |
some of the characteristics associated with anorexia, like a | :27:42. | :27:45. | |
tendency to obsessiveness, and attention to tail. They hope it | :27:45. | :27:49. | |
will lead to new treatment -- detail. They hope it will lead to | :27:49. | :27:52. | |
new treatment, and prevent the illness becoming chronic, | :27:53. | :27:58. | |
interrupting people's lives. Even now, those of us who work in the | :27:58. | :28:02. | |
area of eating disorder, with this younger population, we are | :28:02. | :28:05. | |
struggling with the idea that once their weight is restored they are | :28:05. | :28:10. | |
cured, it is nonsense, they are not at all. I realised how rich an | :28:10. | :28:15. | |
illness it had been. Rosemary describes the process of recovery | :28:15. | :28:20. | |
as being harder than the illness, she works as a mentor with others | :28:20. | :28:25. | |
with eating disorders. I know there are God knows how many other people | :28:25. | :28:29. | |
out there going through exactly the same thing that I did. I'm no | :28:29. | :28:35. | |
different to them. If all I can do is offer them the hope that | :28:35. | :28:42. | |
whatever they see in me, as being recovered, and something that they | :28:42. | :28:50. | |
would like, then it is doable. It is possible. | :28:50. | :28:54. | |
Ffion is planning to go to university next year, to train as a | :28:54. | :29:00. | |
psychiatric nurse. I want to be able to order a take-away, or have | :29:00. | :29:05. | |
a meal, without a panic attack in the toilet. I want to be able to | :29:05. | :29:08. | |
eat a box of popcorn without having to count out how many of them are | :29:08. | :29:13. | |
in my hand. I don't want to be a rocket scientist, or rich, I just | :29:13. | :29:19. | |
want to be "normal", I suppose really, if there is such a thing. | :29:19. | :29:25. | |
Joining me now are Stephen dor reel, the chairman of the Select | :29:25. | :29:30. | |
Committee, and the Times columnist who suffered from anorexia, author | :29:30. | :29:36. | |
of An Apple A Day. First of all, recovering from | :29:36. | :29:42. | |
anorexia, do you recognise that you genetically had a predisposition? | :29:42. | :29:45. | |
didn't develop anorexia until I was about 19. I certainly wasn't born | :29:45. | :29:49. | |
with it. But I think that the genetic predisposition must come | :29:49. | :29:54. | |
into it, having seen obviously the research from Professor Lask. It is | :29:54. | :29:58. | |
absolutely fascinating for someone like me. I think that there is a | :29:58. | :30:04. | |
variety of things that come together, the stresses and the live | :30:04. | :30:08. | |
expeerences and then going on a diet, and starting to lose weight, | :30:08. | :30:13. | |
and then I think the genetic thing is part of that. I don't think it | :30:13. | :30:18. | |
is you are born with anorexia, but when we see the brain imaging, | :30:18. | :30:25. | |
there are cognative differences in people's brains with anorexia. That | :30:25. | :30:30. | |
does not change after you have restored your healthy weight. That | :30:30. | :30:36. | |
insula, there is still abnormal blood flow to the insula after the | :30:36. | :30:41. | |
weight has been restored. It proves it is not a lifestyle choice. | :30:41. | :30:45. | |
fundamental difference with this research is it shows, often | :30:45. | :30:51. | |
anorexia has been dismissed as a teenage girls obsessed with their | :30:51. | :30:55. | |
looks, narcissism and so forth. This shows it is a mental disorder? | :30:55. | :31:01. | |
Yes, and indeed to a degree, a physical disorder, an identifiable | :31:01. | :31:04. | |
one, according to Professor Lask's research. This is relatively new | :31:04. | :31:08. | |
research, we have to work through the implications from a policy | :31:08. | :31:11. | |
perspective. The thing that strikes me about this from a health policy | :31:11. | :31:18. | |
point of view, is how similar it is to other conditions, where the | :31:18. | :31:22. | |
opportunity is there to identify a condition early, to intervene early, | :31:22. | :31:25. | |
and to deliver care that is not only better from the point of view | :31:25. | :31:31. | |
of the patient, because it avoids the acute incidence of the | :31:31. | :31:34. | |
condition, but it is better value for the taxpayer, because it | :31:34. | :31:40. | |
doesn't cost as much in pounds. It is a win-win. Actually, the policy | :31:40. | :31:44. | |
is wrong at the moment, because Bryan Lask is saying the cutbacks | :31:44. | :31:47. | |
are not only depriving children of treatment, they are making them | :31:47. | :31:52. | |
much worse, and that Professor Janet Treasure, saying people are | :31:53. | :31:56. | |
not referred to specialists because of the cuts because they are not | :31:56. | :31:59. | |
thin enough. You are stoking up far more problems financially, because | :31:59. | :32:03. | |
you haven't the right policy to intervene early, and have, as it | :32:03. | :32:08. | |
were, a holistic approach, to dealing with anorexia. It is a | :32:08. | :32:13. | |
familiar problem in the health service, that you put it off. | :32:13. | :32:17. | |
just to press you on this, as a result of this fairly new research, | :32:17. | :32:22. | |
very new research, you do think there should be a change in policy | :32:22. | :32:25. | |
towards anorexia? I absolutely think that in anorexia and other | :32:25. | :32:30. | |
conditions as well, there ought to be ach greater emphasis on | :32:30. | :32:33. | |
identifying the tell tale signs that show where a condition is | :32:33. | :32:38. | |
going to rise, interintervening early, that is where you deliver | :32:38. | :32:42. | |
better care and better value care. Later you deliver savings later, | :32:42. | :32:46. | |
but tell me about the importance of early intervention? I always say to | :32:46. | :32:49. | |
people, you know if you have a problem. And deal with it as soon | :32:49. | :32:55. | |
as you can, because if you wait ten, fifteen years down the line, it | :32:55. | :33:00. | |
becomes part of you. It becomes part of your identity. Did you, you | :33:00. | :33:04. | |
were quite, in a sense you were quite old at 19, did you know, were | :33:04. | :33:10. | |
you able to go for help quite early, I imagine if you are 10, 11, 12 it | :33:10. | :33:14. | |
is a really difficult thing for parents? That is the problem with | :33:14. | :33:17. | |
early intervention. Teenage girls go on diet, young girls | :33:17. | :33:22. | |
increasingly are worried about their weight. The majority of them | :33:22. | :33:27. | |
won't develop anorexia. The 10% or less than that will develop | :33:27. | :33:33. | |
anorexia. There is a problem with early intervention. You need people | :33:33. | :33:36. | |
trained to know the real signs. didn't know, I didn't really talk | :33:36. | :33:40. | |
about it at all until I was, I started writing my column in my | :33:40. | :33:44. | |
early 30s, for the Times. That was coming out about it. I didn't get | :33:44. | :33:49. | |
help for the first couple of years. It is a terribly shameful illness, | :33:49. | :33:53. | |
there is something terribly hidden about it. Is there a way that | :33:53. | :33:58. | |
actually, you know, that anorexia, we know from the statistics, that | :33:58. | :34:03. | |
1.5 million, are suffering from it just now. Many more. It is | :34:03. | :34:06. | |
essentially hidden, and really not fully diagnosed. That actually | :34:06. | :34:10. | |
because it is such a dreadful thing, by and large that it hits younger | :34:10. | :34:13. | |
people, it should be a priority for this Government? I think it should | :34:13. | :34:18. | |
be a priority for any Government, and for the people who decide the | :34:18. | :34:20. | |
priorities within health expenditure, which is the | :34:20. | :34:24. | |
Government at a global level, but it is actually decisions taken at | :34:25. | :34:30. | |
the local level. The provision of service. The other key thing here, | :34:30. | :34:35. | |
is public health information. So that families and individuals can | :34:35. | :34:40. | |
identify with it. The revolving door is costing more. Can I tell | :34:40. | :34:46. | |
but the waiting lists, the waiting lists to get cognitive behaval | :34:46. | :34:51. | |
therapy for anorexia is absolutely horrendous. I have gone out of the | :34:51. | :34:53. | |
health service. The waiting lists would be different in different | :34:53. | :34:59. | |
parts of the country? I stopped having psychotherapy four years ago, | :34:59. | :35:05. | |
and started begin two years ago, I was able to get on a trial, and my | :35:06. | :35:09. | |
waiting list was only six months. It can be much longer than that, | :35:09. | :35:14. | |
six months to a year for people who are seriously ill. I agree with | :35:14. | :35:18. | |
that. The point is that if you wait and delay the intervention, it is | :35:18. | :35:24. | |
back to the resolving door. -- the revolving door is bad and expensive | :35:24. | :35:28. | |
care, it is unaffordably bad. You are on recess, but you will go | :35:28. | :35:32. | |
straight back to the health select in the new research? It is | :35:32. | :35:35. | |
something that will come up with the health Select Committee, it | :35:35. | :35:39. | |
doesn't meet when parliament is in recess. If you want details of | :35:39. | :35:43. | |
organisations which offer advice and support on eating disorders, go | :35:43. | :35:53. | |
:35:53. | :36:08. | ||
He could be the leader of the free world in matter of weeks. But after | :36:08. | :36:13. | |
a mini-three-country tour, gaffes and all, are we getting a flavour | :36:13. | :36:18. | |
of what Mitt Romney's foreign policy will look like. He upset | :36:18. | :36:22. | |
Palestinians by comparing their weak economic performances to that | :36:22. | :36:28. | |
of their Israeli hopes. On a visit to London he warned our Olympic | :36:28. | :36:32. | |
Games running the risk of becoming a flop. Beyond the insults, what of | :36:32. | :36:42. | |
:36:42. | :36:43. | ||
his grand vision, and how might he contain countries like Iran. | :36:43. | :36:47. | |
The Republican challenger has been racking up air miles, with a | :36:47. | :36:51. | |
foreign tour intended to bolster his credentials as a statesman. His | :36:51. | :36:54. | |
first stop was Britain, where a remark about preparations for the | :36:55. | :36:59. | |
Olympics was deemed insulting by his critics. It is hard to know | :36:59. | :37:04. | |
just how well it will turn out, there are a few things that were | :37:04. | :37:07. | |
disconcerting, the stories about the private security firm not | :37:07. | :37:11. | |
having enough people, the supposed strike of the immigration and | :37:11. | :37:14. | |
customs officials, that obviously is not something which is | :37:14. | :37:19. | |
encouraging. But that was a relatively minor | :37:19. | :37:23. | |
faux pas, the striking thing about the Romney campaign, is it's focus | :37:23. | :37:27. | |
on the US economy, and other domestic issues, has so far | :37:27. | :37:31. | |
prevented the world from getting much of an idea about how far a | :37:32. | :37:38. | |
Romney foreign policy might differ from President Obama's. Mitt Romney, | :37:38. | :37:41. | |
until last week, had had only delivered one foreign policy speech | :37:41. | :37:45. | |
of the campaign, that was nine months ago. He doesn't have a | :37:45. | :37:49. | |
senior staffer whose portfolio is solely foreign policy. He had had a | :37:49. | :37:53. | |
foreign policy spokesman who lasted just two week, this is not a | :37:53. | :37:57. | |
priority for Romney. It conveys a lack of seriousness, both on his | :37:57. | :38:01. | |
part, but also in tune with his party, when it comes to America and | :38:01. | :38:05. | |
the re- of the world. That, is quite a substantive difference with | :38:05. | :38:08. | |
Barack Obama. It was on the way to his second | :38:08. | :38:15. | |
stop, Israel, that things started hotting up. On board the flight, | :38:15. | :38:19. | |
Romney's spokesman told reporters that they would back an Israeli | :38:19. | :38:23. | |
strike against Iranian nuclear facilities. Once there, he | :38:23. | :38:28. | |
delighted the Israeli right with a pledge to relocate the US embassy | :38:28. | :38:32. | |
to Jerusalem. I think it is long been the policy of our country to | :38:32. | :38:36. | |
ultimately have the embassy in the nation's capital, Jerusalem. The | :38:36. | :38:39. | |
decision to actually make the move is one, if I were President I would | :38:39. | :38:44. | |
want it take. Perhaps the most revealing statement on his trip was | :38:44. | :38:48. | |
the candidate's observation that the disparities in wealth between | :38:48. | :38:58. | |
:38:58. | :39:03. | ||
Israelis and Palestinians could be One American politician said a | :39:03. | :39:06. | |
gaffe is when the politician tells a truth, a gaffe is when a | :39:06. | :39:09. | |
politician reveals what he really thinks. I think there was something | :39:09. | :39:16. | |
revealing in that remark of Mitt Romney, it did suggest a kind of | :39:16. | :39:23. | |
colonialist mentality that some how seemed to think that the oriental | :39:23. | :39:27. | |
people, Palestinians, were some how culturally inferior, to the | :39:27. | :39:30. | |
Israelis, who are more western and more like the Americans. | :39:30. | :39:35. | |
headlines from the Palestinian comment followed the candidate to | :39:35. | :39:37. | |
Poland. REPORTER: Governor Romney do you have a statement for the | :39:37. | :39:42. | |
Palestinians. The press vented their annoyance at | :39:42. | :39:48. | |
getting so little access to him. And quickly put down by Romney's | :39:48. | :39:52. | |
staff. This is a holy site for the Polish people, show some respect. | :39:52. | :39:56. | |
That was unfortunate, and has left even those on the right questioning | :39:56. | :39:58. | |
the achievements of Mr Romney's trip. | :39:58. | :40:05. | |
In terms of sending out very clear messages about what kind of foreign | :40:05. | :40:07. | |
policy president he would be, strong support of Israel, very | :40:08. | :40:13. | |
concerned about the Iranian issue, strong supporter of their allies in | :40:13. | :40:19. | |
Eastern Europe, strengthening that relationship. Strong believer in | :40:19. | :40:21. | |
the special relationship between Great Britain and the United States. | :40:21. | :40:25. | |
In terms it of the public relations and the press managment, it has | :40:25. | :40:31. | |
been utter and complete amateur hour. There are aspects of the | :40:31. | :40:34. | |
President's foreign policy over Russia and Iran, that provide | :40:34. | :40:39. | |
plenty of ammunition to the Conservative who say the incumbent | :40:39. | :40:44. | |
has made America look weak. But President Obama's stepping back | :40:44. | :40:48. | |
from foreign entanglements is part of a response to the American | :40:48. | :40:53. | |
crisis. It will be hard for a Republican challenger to campaign | :40:53. | :40:56. | |
on a world's policeman ticket, or concede the country can no longer | :40:56. | :41:01. | |
afford to do that. Mitt Romney has flown home to concentrate on | :41:01. | :41:04. | |
economic issues. But looking presidential requires a confident | :41:04. | :41:08. | |
grasp of world affairs too. If the Romney campaign doesn't raise its | :41:08. | :41:14. | |
game, it will simply give the President a key advantage. | :41:14. | :41:23. | |
Joining me now from Washington are my guests. | :41:23. | :41:28. | |
Good evening to both of you. What can we tell from the countries that | :41:28. | :41:36. | |
Mitt Romney chose to visit? I think when he planned the trip he chose a | :41:36. | :41:40. | |
deliberate theme. Going to one of our most important allies in Europe, | :41:40. | :41:48. | |
to the UK, go -- going to one of our most important allise in the | :41:48. | :41:51. | |
Middle East, and the focus of attention -- allies in the Middle | :41:51. | :41:58. | |
East, and the focus of attention for Iran, Israel, and Eastern | :41:58. | :42:06. | |
Europe allies, Poland. Is is it the danger that the gaffes overshadows | :42:06. | :42:10. | |
any coherent foreign policy direction? Absolutely. They | :42:10. | :42:17. | |
certainly do not help this trip, that was very finely crafted to be | :42:17. | :42:21. | |
a possibility and opportunity for Mitt Romney to show off his foreign | :42:21. | :42:25. | |
policy experience, and for him to appear presidential. He had plenty | :42:25. | :42:29. | |
of successes on the trips, he had great meetings and great photo | :42:30. | :42:33. | |
opportunities, he specially at the western wall in Jerusalem. But on | :42:33. | :42:36. | |
the way home here we are talking about some of the missteps over the | :42:36. | :42:41. | |
past few days, and the way he snubbed the Palestinian and some | :42:41. | :42:44. | |
British people. Tell me, do you think there has been something | :42:44. | :42:51. | |
emerging of the man that Mitt Romney might be in the White House. | :42:51. | :42:55. | |
Barack Obama was all about diplomacy, is Mitt Romney more | :42:55. | :43:00. | |
directional, there is more clarity in what he's saying in the | :43:00. | :43:04. | |
direction he will take America? has said there is. We don't know a | :43:04. | :43:08. | |
lot about Mitt Romney on the front of foreign policy. We know what he | :43:08. | :43:12. | |
has said and what he would do, which is calling out China on | :43:12. | :43:15. | |
currency manipulation, he has talked about bombing Iran, or | :43:15. | :43:19. | |
stopping that country from acquiring a nuclear weapon. He has | :43:19. | :43:26. | |
talked about Russia and it being our top geopolitical foe. He has | :43:26. | :43:28. | |
talked about all these issues and dealing with them within the first | :43:28. | :43:33. | |
days of office. We don't know exact low what he would do. What would he | :43:33. | :43:37. | |
do? We very well know at that America cannot be the world's | :43:37. | :43:40. | |
policeman, he has been slamming Barack Obama for not doing enough | :43:40. | :43:44. | |
about Iran, but, for example, if he's in the White House, and there | :43:44. | :43:49. | |
is still an issue in Syria, what exactly would a Mitt Romney foreign | :43:49. | :43:56. | |
policy in Syria look like, do you think? First of all, let me go back | :43:56. | :44:00. | |
to the question you just asked Dan. We are talking about this because | :44:00. | :44:07. | |
you, at the BBC, are asking another reporter for another news magazine, | :44:07. | :44:11. | |
Newsweek, what you think about the supposed gaffes that Mitt Romney | :44:11. | :44:14. | |
made on this trip. I think the media of not brilliantly managed on | :44:14. | :44:18. | |
this trip, but the notion that the American people are quite as | :44:18. | :44:22. | |
interested and obsessed on this as you are is simply ridiculous. | :44:22. | :44:26. | |
Unfortunately for me, and you know foreign policy is my business, | :44:26. | :44:29. | |
foreign policy doesn't enter into the top ten issues for the American | :44:29. | :44:35. | |
people in this election. The notion that this is some how doing to be a | :44:35. | :44:38. | |
dispositive question for him, as the American people look at him and | :44:38. | :44:42. | |
see how he questioned the Olympics and whether there was enough | :44:42. | :44:47. | |
security is a little bit ridiculous. Let's set that one aside. Doesn't | :44:47. | :44:52. | |
he have to appear presidential abroad? I think that he needs to | :44:53. | :44:57. | |
have a good trip, and I think in the large part he did. The notion | :44:57. | :45:02. | |
that he can't repeat things that the British press itself has | :45:02. | :45:06. | |
aggressively been putting forward about the Olympics is a little bit | :45:06. | :45:10. | |
silly. The reaction from both Mr Cameron and Boris Johnson were both | :45:10. | :45:14. | |
a little bit sensitive, let as say that. That being said, you never | :45:14. | :45:21. | |
want to get bad press, you want perfect press. On the other hand, | :45:21. | :45:25. | |
the only thing that leads to perpect press is glibness and lying | :45:25. | :45:28. | |
among politician, we have rather had enough of that. Let's talk | :45:28. | :45:36. | |
about Syria? Hang on, the man put out a foo plus, well, let's talk | :45:36. | :45:40. | |
about the foreign policy question, I'm happy to talk about Syria. The | :45:40. | :45:47. | |
plan put out a fifty-plus page White Paper, I don't go back and | :45:47. | :45:52. | |
refer to that eagerly, it is single-spaced and quite long, the | :45:52. | :45:55. | |
view that he hasn't put out his views on a variety of issues is | :45:55. | :45:58. | |
really not quite fair. The American people aren't interested in talking | :45:58. | :46:02. | |
about the Olympic, the Palestinians or Poland at the moment, what they | :46:02. | :46:06. | |
are interested in talking about is unemployment. Let me deal with the | :46:06. | :46:09. | |
fact that he has stated his direction, just briefly? He has put | :46:09. | :46:14. | |
some of these positions on the record. The problem is, none of | :46:14. | :46:19. | |
these have real beef behind them, he hasn't answered the question of | :46:19. | :46:23. | |
logistic, would you really bomb Iran if you could, or confront | :46:23. | :46:26. | |
China on currency manipulation. These are big promises to make, | :46:26. | :46:29. | |
once you become President, and get in the Oval Office, and get | :46:29. | :46:33. | |
classified security briefings, a lot of this is receiptor that he | :46:33. | :46:41. | |
said. We don't have a clear picture -- rhetoric, that what he said. We | :46:41. | :46:45. | |
don't have a clear picture. Foreign policy is not a major issue, with | :46:46. | :46:49. |