Andrew Neil and Marie Ashby hear from the candidates for the Ukip leadership and look ahead to the chancellor's Autumn Statement.
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Morning folks - welcome to the Sunday Politics.
Theresa May says she'll deliver on Brexit but does that mean leaving
the EU's Single Market and the Customs Union?
Tory MPs campaign for a commitment from the Prime
The Chancellor pledges just over a billion pounds worth of spending
on Britain's roads but is that it or will there be
And in the East Midlands: 18 days in the job.
The jobs bust taking workers from struggling areas to find
Plus, the Derbyshire firm sdlling rice to the Chinese.
in London: Is the battle for Richmond Park based on the skies? Or
is it about a bigger conflict in Europe?
And with me - as always - and, no, these three aren't doing
the Mannequin challenge - it's our dynamic, demonstrative
dazzling political panel - Helen Lewis, Isabel Oakeshott
and Tom Newton Dunn they'll also be tweeting throughout the programme.
First this morning - Theresa May has said
"Brexit means Brexit" - but can the Prime Minister -
who was on the Remain side of argument during the referendum
Well, Leave-supporting Tory MPs are re-launching
the "European Research Group" this morning to keep Mrs May's feet
Are you worried that you cannot trust Theresa May until payment to
deliver full Brexit was Magellan like I totally trust Theresa May,
100% behind her. She has displayed a massive amount of commitment to
making a success of Brexit for the country.
We don't know that yet, because nothing has happened. Why, then
have you formed a pressure group? We were fed up with the negativity
coming out around Brexit. I feel positive about the opportunities we
face, and we are a group to provide suggestions. Who do you have in mind
when you talk about negativity the Chancellor? No, from the Lib Dems,
for example, from Labour MPs. This is a pressure group for leaving
membership of the single market and customs union, correct? That is what
we are proposing. It has a purpose other than just to combat
negativity. When it comes to membership of the single market and
the customs union, can you tell us what Government policy is towards
both or either? Rightly, the Government hasn't made the position
clear, and I think that is the right approach, because we don't want to
review our negotiating hand. What we're saying... I'm not asking what
you are saying. Can you tell us what Government policy is towards
membership of these institutions? The Government wants to make sure
British businesses have the right to trade with EU partners, to forge new
trade deals with the rest of the world. We hope to Reza may speak at
Mansion house this week. -- we had Theresa May speak at Mansion house
this week. She has been clear, saying it was not a binary choice.
And she's right. Let's run that tape, because I want to pick up on
what she did say. This is what she had to say about the customs union
at Prime Minister's Question Time. On the whole question of the customs
union, trading relationships that we have with the European Union and
other parts of the world once we have left the European Union, we are
preparing carefully for the formal negotiations. We are preparing
carefully for the formal negotiations. We want to ensure we
have the best possible trading deal with the EU once we have left. Do
you know what she means when she says being in the customs union is
not a binary choice? I think she's right when she says that. At the
moment, and you know this, as long as we are in the customs union, we
cannot set our own tariffs or rules, cannot have a free trade agreement
with the US or China. We need to leave a customs union to do that.
Binary means either you are in or you are out, self which is it? We
still want to trade with the EU and I think we can have a free trade
agreement with the EU. That is a separate matter, and it has to do
with the single market. What about the customs union? We need to leave
the customs union. We do it and properly. That is how to get the
most out of this opportunity. Summit is a binary choice? The Prime
Minister is right when she says it's not a binary choice. Both can't be
right. We can leave the customs union, get their benefits, and have
a free trade agreement with zero tariffs with the EU. So it is a
binary choice an either be stale really. Yellow like I am saying the
Prime Minister is right when she says it is not a binary choice. -- I
am saying the Prime Minister is right. We need clarity. Youth had
said -- you have said it is a binary choice. We need to leave the
constraints of the customs union. It pushes up prices. The EU is not
securing the right trade deals, and if we want to make the most of it,
we need to get out there and get some deals going. Do you accept that
if we remain in the customs union, we cannot do our own free-trade
deals? Yellow right 100%. That is why we have to leave. -- 100%. Do
you accept that if we leave the customs union but stay with
substantial access, I don't say membership, but substantial access
to the single market, that goods going from this country to the
single market because we're no longer in the union will be subject
to complicated rules of origin regulations, which could cost
business ?13 billion a year? I would like to see a free-trade agreement
between the UK and the EU. Look at the Canadian deal. I give you that,
but if we're not in the customs union, things that we bring in on
our own tariffs once we've left we can't just export again willy-nilly
to the EU. They will demand to see rules of origin. Norway has to do
that at the moment and it is highly complicated expensive. I think if we
agree a particular arrangement as part of this agreement with the EU,
we can reach an agreement on that which sets a lower standard, which
sets a different level of tariffs, which protects some of our
industries. Let's suppose we have pretty much free trade with the EU
but we are out of the customs union, and let's suppose that the European
Union has a 20% tariff on Japanese whisky and we decide to have a %
tariff - what then happens to the whisky that comes into Britain and
goes on to the EU? The EU will not let that in. That will be part of
the negotiation. I think there is a huge benefit for external operators.
Every bottle of Japanese whisky they will have to work out the rules
of origin. There have been studies that show there is a potential for
50% increase in global product if we leave. We're losing the benefits of
free trade. I understand, I am asking for your particular view
Thank you for that. Is it not surprising Mr Hannan could
not bring himself to say we would leave the customs union? It is
messy. The reason there is this new group of Tory MPs signing up to a
campaign to make sure we get a genuine Brexit is because there is
this vacuum. It is being filled with all sorts of briefing from the other
side. There is a real risk in the minds of Brexit supporting MPs that
the remaining side are going to try to hijack the process, not only
through the Supreme Court action, which I think most Brexit MPs seem
to accept the appeal will fail, but further down the line, through
amendments to the great repeal bill. This is a pressure group to try to
hold the Prime Minister to account. There is plenty of pressure on the
Prime Minister effectively to stay in the single market and the customs
union, and if you do both of these things, de facto, you have stayed in
the EU. She is in a difficult position because there is no good
faith assumption about what Theresa May wants because she was a
Remainer. There is all this talk about a transitional arrangement,
but she can't sell that as someone who voted to remain. The way Isabel
has characterised it is interesting. There is a betrayal narrative.
Everyone is looking to say that she has betrayed the true Brexit. Since
the Government cannot give a clear indication of what it once in terms
of the customs union, which sets external tariffs, or the single
market, which is the free movement of people, capital, goods and
services, others are filling this vacuum. Right. The reasons they
can't do this are, first, they don't know if they can get it or not. We
saw this with the renegotiation the last Prime Minister. What are they
hoping to get? The world on a stick, to get cake and eat it. You go into
a negotiation saying, let's see what we can get in total. Are they going
to ask the membership of the single market? Yellow I think they will ask
for a free trade agreement involving everything. You can demand what you
want. The question is, do they stand a cat's chance in hell of getting
it? They don't know. Welcome back. We will be back, believe me. It is
150 day since we found out the UK had voted to leave the EU, but as we
have heard, remain and leave campaigners continue to battle about
what type of relationship we should have with the EU after exit.
Leave campaigners say that leaving the EU
also means quitting the
Single Market, the internal European trading bloc that includes free
movement of goods, services, capital and people.
They point to evidence that leading Leave supporting
politicians ruled out staying in the Single Market during
Andrea Leadsom, for example, said it would almost
certainly be the case that the UK would come out of the Single Market.
When asked for a yes or no on whether the UK should stay
"No, we should be outside the Single Market."
And Boris Johnson agreed with his erstwhile ally, saying, "Michael
Gove was absolutely right to say the UK
They've released a video of clips of Leave campaigners speaking before
the referendum apparently saying that the UK should stay in the
Nigel Farage, for example, once said that on leaving
the EU we'll find ourselves part of the European economic area
Owen Paterson, the former Environment Secretary,
once made the startling statement that only a madman would actually
And Matthew Elliott, the Vote Leave chief, said
that the Norwegian option would be initially attractive for some
But do these quotes create an accurate picture of what
To cast some light on where these quotes came from we're
joined by James McGrory, director of Open Britain
Welcome to the Sunday Politics. . Your video has statements from leave
campaigners hinting they want to stay in the single market. How many
were made during the referendum campaign? I don't know. Not one was
made during the referendum campaign. Indeed, only two of the 12
statements were recorded after Royal assent had been given to the
referendum. Only one was made this year before the referendum.
Throughout the campaign am a leave campaigners lauded the Norwegian
model. Norway are in the single market but not in the EU. They went
out of their way not to be pinned down on a specific trading
arrangement they want to see in the future with Europe, when the
Treasury model the different models it was the EEA or a free-trade
agreement. I understand. Does it not undermine your case that none of the
12 statements on your video were made during the campaign itself
when people were giving really serious thought to such matters The
Leave campaign weren't giving serious thought to such matters
They did not set out the future trading model they wanted to see.
But you cannot produce a single video with somebody saying we should
stay in the single market during the campaign. Daniel Hanna had talked
about the Norwegian model as a future option. One comment from
Nigel Farage dates back to 2009 when we didn't even know if we would
have a referendum or not. Does it not stretch credibility to go back
to the time when Gordon Brown was Prime Minister? The overall point
stands. It is not supposed to be an exhaustive list of the options.
Daniel Hannan, described as the intellectual godfather of the Leave
movement is saying that no one is talking about threatening our place
in the signal market. I think it's legitimate to point out the Leave
campaign never came forward with a credible argument. We have
highlighted some of the quotes you picked out from leave campaigners
over time. Do you think you have fully encapsulated their arguments
accurately? I don't think in a 2nd video you can talk about the full
thing. -- a 90-2nd video. Some of them want to seek a free-trade
agreement, some to default on to World Trade Organisation tariffs.
There is a range of opinion in the Leave campaign. Let's listen to the
clip you used on Owen Paterson first.
Only a madman would actually leave the market.
Only a madman would actually leave the market.
It's not the EU which is
a political organisation delivering the prosperity and buying our goods.
It's the market, it's the members of the market and we'll carry on
I mean, are we really suggesting that the
economy in the world is not going to come to come
to a satisfactory trading arrangement with the EU?
Are we going to be like Sudan and North
It is ludicrous this idea that we are going to leap off a
What he said when he said only a madman would leave Europe, was that
we would continue to trade, we would continue to have access. Any country
in the world can have access. What the Leave campaign suggested is our
trade would continue uninterrupted, they are still at it today, David
Davis used the phrase, uninterrupted, from the dispatch box
recently. You misrepresented him by saying only a madman would leave the
Single Market and stopped it there, because he goes onto say that of
course we want Leave in the sense of continuing to have access. I don't
think he was about axis, he is talking
about membership. He doesn't use the word membership at all. He talks
about we are going to carry on trading with them, we will not leap
off, we will carry on trading. Anybody can trade with the EU, it's
the terms on which you trade that is important and leave campaigners and
Patterson is an example of this saying we can trade as we do now,
the government saying we can trade without bureaucratic impediments and
tariff free. The viewers will make up their mind. Let's listen to the
views of Matthew Elliott, the Chief Executive of Vote Leave.
When it comes to the Norwegian option, the EEA option, I think that
it might be initially attractive for some business people.
So you then cut him off there but this is what he went on to say in
the same clip, let's listen to that. When it comes to the Norwegian
option, the EEA option, I think that it might be initially attractive
for some business people. But then again for voters
who are increasingly concerned about migration in the EU,
they will be very concerned that it allows free movement
of people to continue. Again, you have misrepresented him.
He said the Norwegian model has attractions but there are real
problems if it involves free movement of people, which it does.
But you cut that bit out. I challenge anyone to represent them
accurately because they took such a range of opinions. I don't know what
we are supposed to do. You are misrepresenting them. He is saying
the Norwegian option is attractive to business, I understand why. It
might not be attractive for voters. But then he said if it allowed free
movement of people it could be an issue. You took that out. You are
saying this is a definitive position. I'm suggesting you are
distorting it. This is what you had Mr Farage say.
On D+1 we'll find ourselves part of the European economic area
This is what he then went on to say in that same clip that you didn t
run. There is absolutely
nothing to fear in terms of trade from leaving
the on D+1 we'll find ourselves part
of the European Economic Area and we should use our
membership of the EEA as a holding position from which
we can negotiate as the European Union's biggest export
market in the world, as good a deal, my goodness me,
if Switzerland can have one we So there again, he says not that we
should stay in the Single Market as a member, but that we stay in the EA
as a transition until we negotiate something. -- EEA. This whole clip
is online, how would you get away with this distortion? It is not a
distortion, the whole point is to point out they do not have a
definitive position, he is arguing for membership of the Single Market,
for a transitional period. For the transition. How long does that go
on, what does he want to then achieve? Not very quickly but he
does not say we should stay members of the Single Market and you didn't
let people see what he went on to say, you gave the impression he
wanted to stay in the one it. It would not be a video then, it would
be a seven-week long lecture. They took so many positions, and the idea
now that they were clear with people that we should definitely leave the
Single Market I think is fictitious. You are trying to make out they all
had one position which was to remain members of the one it. You see the
full clips that is not what they are saying. We are trying to point out
there is no mandate to leave the Single Market. The idea the Leave
campaign spoke with unanimity and clarity of purpose and throughout
the whole campaign said we will definitely leave the Single Market
is not true. That is the whole point of the media. We showed in the
montage in the video just before we came on, we said that then Prime
Minister, the then Chancellor, Boris Johnson, Michael Gove, being
categorical that if you vote to leave the EU, you vote to leave
membership of the Single Market What bit of that didn't you
understand? Under duress they occasionally said they wanted to
leave. Some of them wanted to leave the Single Market. All of the other
promises they made, whether ?35 million for the NHS, whether a VAT
cut on fuel, points-based system. You do not have a single quote of
any of these members saying they want to be a member. Daniel Hannan
has said consistently that Norway are a part of the Single Market You
spend the referendum campaign criticising for Rim misrepresenting
and misrepresenting and lying and many thought they did. Having seen
this many will conclude that you are the biggest liars. I think it is
perfectly reasonable to point out that the Leave campaign did not have
a clear position on our future trading relationship with Europe.
That is all this video does. It doesn't say we definitely have to
stay in the Single Market, it just says they do have a mandate to drag
us out of our biggest trading partner.
Now people have seen the full quotes in context our viewers will make up
their mind. Thank you. Now - voting closes next week
in the the Ukip leadership contest. The second Ukip leadership contest
this year after the party's first female leader - Diane James -
stood down from the role Since then the party's lurched from
farce to fiasco. It's a world gripped by uncertainty,
split into factions. Yes, 2, because they're
having their second Watch as the alpha male,
the Ukip leader at Nigel Watch as the alpha male,
the Ukip leader Nigel Farage, hands power to the new alpha
female Diane James. The European Parliament
in Strasbourg, October. Another leading light and possible
future leader, the MEP Steven Wolfe,
has been laid low after an alleged tussle with a colleague
during a meeting. A few days later he is
out of hospital and I will be withdrawing my
application to become I'm actually withdrawing
myself from Ukip. You're resigning from the party
I'm resigning with immediate effect. And this week a leaked document
suggested the party improperly spent EU funds on political
campaigning in the UK. Another headache for whoever takes
over the leadership of the pack One contender is Suzanne Evans,
a former Tory councillor and was briefly suspended for
disloyalty. Also standing, Paul Nuttall,
an MEP from Liverpool who has been by Farage's side
as his deputy for six years. There's another big beast
in the Ukip leadership contest, and I'm told
that today he can be spotted He's John Rees-Evans,
a businessman and adventurer who is offering members the chance
to propose policies via a website We've got really dedicated
passionate supporters who feel like they're not really
being listened to and are not even Typically what happens
is they just basically sit there until six months before
a General Election when they are contacted and asked to go out
and leaflet and canvas. Even at branch level people feel
there is not an adequate flow of communication
up-and-down the party. Are you not going to take part in
any hustings? He left a hustings saying
the contest was an establishment coronation and has
made colourful comments in the past. He's in favour of the death penalty
for crimes like paedophilia. I think there is a clear
will amongst the offences should be dealt with
decisively. But again, on an issue like that,
that is something that Our members are not
going to agree with me on everything and I don't believe that
I would have any authority to have the say and determine
the future What method would you use
for the death penalty? Again, that is something that could
be determined by suggestions made So you'd have like an online
poll about whether you use the electric chair,
or lethal injection? For example, arguments would be made
in favour of This is such a small aspect
of what I'm standing for. Essentially, in mainstream media
they try to by focusing on pretty irrelevant
details. This is one vote that
the membership would have. What I'm actually trying to do
in this party is to revolutionise the democratic
process in the UK, and that's really what your viewers should
be concentrating on. With him at the helm he reckons Ukip
would win at Meanwhile, in New York,
on a visit to Trump Tower, Nigel Farage admired the plumage
of the President-elect, a man he has described as
a silverback gorilla, a friendship that's been condemned by some
in this leadership contest. There are also elections
to the party's National Executive Committee, a body
that's been roundly criticised by And we're joined now by two
of the candidates in the Ukip leadership election -
Suzanne Evans and Paul Nuttall. We are going to kick off by giving
each of them 30 seconds to lay out their case as to why they would be
the less leader starting with Suzanne Evans.
Ukip is at its best when it is scaring the political establishment,
forcing it to address those problems it would rather ignore. But it
really change people's lives for the better and fast, we need to win
seats and elections right across the country. To win at the ballot box we
need to attract more women, more ethnic
minorities, and more of those Labour voters who no longer recognise their
party. I know how to do that. Ukip under my
leadership will be the same page about it, common-sense, radical
party it has always been, just even more successful. Thank you, Suzanne
Evans, Paul Nuttall. I'm standing on a platform of unity and experience.
I believe the party must come together if it is to survive and
prosper. I believe I'm the best candidate to ensure that happens, I
am not part of any faction in the party, and beyond that I have done
every single job within the party, whether that is as head of policy,
whether that is Party Chairman, deputy leader for Nigel for the past
six years. I believe Ukip has great opportunities in Labour
constituencies where we can move in and become the Patriot invoice of
working people, and beyond that we have to ensure the government's feet
are held to the fire on Brexit and we get real Brexit, not a
mealy-mouthed version. How will you get a grip on this? People have to
realise that the cause is bigger than any personality, we have to get
together in a room and sort out not just a spokespeople role but roles
within the organisation, Party Chairman, party secretary, and
whatnot. But as I say, Ukip must unite, we are on 13% in the opinion
polls, the future is bright, there are open goals but Ukip must be on
the pitch to score them. He says he's the only one that can get a
grip on this party. I disagree, I have a huge amount of experience in
the party as well and also a background that I think means I can
help bring people together. I have always said nothing breeds unity
faster than success and under my leadership we will be successful.
There is concern about the future of our National Executive Committee
going forward. Mr Farage called it the lowest grade of people I have
ever met, do you agree? I think he must have been having a bad day I
think we need to make it more accountable to the membership, more
open, more democratic. What would you do with the National Executive
Committee? I have been calling for the National Executive Committee to
be elected reasonably since 201 giving the members better
communication lines and make it far more transparent. Would you have a
clear out of the office? I wouldn't, I think the chairman of the party,
Paul Upton, the interim chairman, is doing a good job and the only person
who has come out of the summer with his reputation enhanced. Let me show
you a picture we have all seen of your current leader, Mr Farage, with
President-elect Donald Trump. Paul Nuttall, you criticise Mr Farage's
decision to appear at rallies during the American election and called Mr
Trump appalling. Do you stick by that? I wouldn't have voted for him.
I made it clear. Do you still think he's appalling now that he is
President-elect? Some of the things he said were appalling during the
campaign that he said. But he would be good for Britain, trade,
pro-Brexit and he is an Anglo file and the first thing he did was put
the bust of Winston Churchill back in the Oval Office. You, Suzanne
Evans, called Mr Trump one of the weakest candidates the US has had. I
said the same about Hillary Clinton. They cannot both be the weakest The
better candidate on either side would have beaten the other, that is
quite clear. Do you stand by that, or are you glad that your leader Mr
Farage has strong ties to him? I am, why wouldn't I be? For Ukip to have
that direct connection, it can be only good for a party. Were you not
out of step and Mr Farage is in step because it looks like your vote is
according to polling I have seemed like Mr Trump and his policies? Let
me finish. If I am the leader of Ukip I will not be involving myself
in foreign elections, I will because in trading here in this country
ensuring we get Ukip people elected to council chambers and get seats in
2020. The other thing your leader has in
common with Mr Trump is that he rather admires Vladimir Putin. Do
you? I don't. If you look at Putin's record, he has invaded Ukraine and
Georgia. I am absolutely not a fan. I think that Vladimir Putin is
pretty much a nasty man, but beyond that, I believe that in the Middle
East, he is generally getting it right in many areas. We need to
bring the conflict... Bombing civilians? We need to bring the
conflict to an end as fast as possible. The British and American
line before Donald Trump is to support rebels, including one is
affiliated to Al-Qaeda, to the Taliban. We need to clear these
people out and ensure that Syria becomes stable. This controversial
breaking point poster from during the referendum campaign. Mr Farage
unveiled it, there he is standing in front of it. You can bend it - do
you still? Yes, I think it was the wrong poster at the wrong time. I
was involved with the vote Leave campaign as well as Ukip's campaign,
and I felt strongly that those concerned about immigration were
already going to vote to leave because it was a fundamental truth
that unless we left the European Union we couldn't control
immigration. I thought it was about approaching those soft wavering
voters who weren't sure. I don't think I said it was racist, but it
was about sovereignty and trade and so forth. That was where we needed
to go. I was concerned it might put off some of those wavering voters.
People may well say, it was part of the winning campaign. It was Ukip
shock and all, which is what you stand for and what makes you
different. I said I would know how that I said I would not have gone
for that person and I thought it was wrong to do it just a week out from
the referendum. However, I believe it released legitimate concerns
with a deluge of people making their way from the Middle East and Africa
into the European continent. Where is the low hanging fruit for you,
particularly in England? Is it Labour or Conservative voters? I
want to hang onto the Conservative voters we have got but I think the
low hanging fruit is Labour. Jeremy Corbyn won't sing the national
anthem, Emily Thornbury despises the English flag. Diane Abbott thinks
anyone talking about immigration is racist. Not to mention John
McDonnell's feelings about the IRA. Labour has ceased to be a party for
working people and I think Ukip is absolutely going to be that party.
It is clear, I absolutely concur with everything Suzanne has said. I
first voiced this back in 2008 that I believe Ukip has a fantastic
opportunity in working-class communities, and everyone laughed at
me. It is clear now that we resonate with working people, and you have
seen that in the Brexit result. Would you bring back the death
penalty? It wouldn't be Ukip policy. Absolutely not. Would you give more
money to the NHS and how would your fanatic? You like it is important to
fund it adequately, and it hasn t been to date. We promised in our
manifesto that we would give more money. Where does the money come
from? It is about tackling health tourism. I think the NHS is being
taken for a ride at the moment. That may be right, but where does the
money come from? It is about scaling back management in the NHS, because
that has burgeoned beyond control. They are spending far more money on
management. Where would you save money? We need to look at HS two,
foreign aid. Now we have Brexit and we will be saving on the membership
fee. We need to cut back on management, as Suzanne says. It
cannot be right that 51% of people who work for the NHS in England are
not clinically qualified. The NHS needs money now - where would you
get it? From HS two. That is capital spending spread over a long period.
Where will you get the money now? OK, another one. We spent ?25
million every day on foreign aid to countries who sometimes are richer
than ourselves. Through the Barnett formula. You would take money away
from Scotland? Yes, I think they get far too much. PG tips or Earl Grey?
Colegrave. PG tips. Strictly come dancing or X Factor? Neither.
Strictly. I would love to be on it one day. There you go. Thank you
It's just gone 11:35am, you're watching the Sunday Politics.
We say goodbye to viewers in Scotland, who leave us now
Coming up here in 20 minutes, the Week Ahead.
In the East Midlands: What help for the people left behind
We are in what you could call the East
Midlands' coal dust belt, with a message
They keep saying about a northern powerhouse.
They're talking Manchester, Nottingham, place like that.
They're not talking about lhttle villages like here, Edwinstow.
And never mind calls to Newcastle, one East Midlands food
manufacturer is selling ricd to China, but what difference will
Making the UK stand alone as a power country
If our Government cannot offer an alternative scheme,
it would allow bogus products effectively into the
marketplace and that would `ffect our sales and potentially otr
So plenty for our guests to get their teeth into this week.
Heather Wheeler is the Consdrvative MP for South Derbyshire
and was appointed an assist`nt whip by Theresa May.
Labour's Anne Western is thd leader of Derby County Council.
First up, the news this week of course that the preferred route of
HS2 through the Midlands has been published.
It comes into our region from just north of Birmingham.
There are changes to the earlier proposals.
It was due to pass through the west of the region, but
Plans for a tunnel under East Midlands Airport, but that has been
The line passes around it to the east.
The route goes through the liddle of London, that is still
There could be a tunnel or a viaduct over the town.
And there is a boost for Chesterfield with the possibility of
a stop there as part of a spur up to Sheffield from the mainlhne.
Of course, don't pick your tickets to
us yet, it's not due to be tp and running until 2033.
Heather Wheeler, an awfully long time to wait for all of it.
with it is it really going to happen?
I'd like it to start not just at the south, but at
the north at the same time, because the point of this is about
conductivity between the south and north.
economy from the south to the Midlands and the north and H think
it's a fantastic opportunitx for economic regeneration in an area
that is we're going to see a little bit later on,
Because the planning side of it needs to be done.
There's more work already bden done in London on the first day `nd
now this is, literally, the second phase.
What I'm looking for is phase three as well.
Anne Western, great news for Chesterfield as we
have just heard, but a bit of a blow there for Long Eaton.
There is either going to be a tunnel around
it or a viaduct over it, but it s still going to go right through it.
It will do, because Long Eaton is so close to Toton station and it's
always been known that it would go through Long Eaton.
How do we deal with the potdntial roads being severed and the
Now we know, this very week, we now know what the
Now we can start working on how we deal with the detailed
We had an East Midlands HS2 board meeting this
morning and we've agreed that there is a whole new phece
That's looking at the route and working with the Governlent
and HS2 to say, these are the problems it's going to create.
How do we limit the damage that is going
Because as Heather has said, it's going to bring massive
opportunities for jobs and growth in a way that has been
We need to capitalise on that, but we also got
to be mindful that this will cut through communities and imp`ct on
people, sometimes in the most severe way.
So, we've got to deal with that
And then of course, Heather, there is phase three to
Just to echo what Anne has said, the local council
The terms and conditions about amelioration and compdnsation,
they are actually sorted out right now.
The good news is, there is an
excellent process to take this forward.
Big spending plans in the ftture for the East Midlands on
The Brexit vote and the election of Donald
Trump have focused attention on former industrial areas left behind
as factories and jobs have disappeared.
The Chancellor's Autumn Statement will be keenly
watched this week to see if anything will be done to help them.
Our political editor Tony Roe has joined workers on the new jobs bust
picking up people in our very own rust belt
and taking them to work in
It's 5am, ahead of a 12 hour shift, Lee and Fabian won't see daxlight
The job is only possible because the council
has laid on a bus to get them to Newark.
My first reaction was, Newark is a bit far?
But she said, we pay your transport there and back,
Without this bus, I wouldn't be able to
It would be too far, it takes too long.
And the bus is vital, because there is no
commercial route from places like this to Newark with thd
I think in the post-industrhal era, we've got a different skill set
required and a lot of the pdople who were living here and working
Lee and Fabian are working at the massive warehouse here.
Getting skills like operating forklift
trucks to help their chances in the future.
The two rich schemes of employment in Ollerton used the call
The mine went first and when it was cheaper for Marks
Spencer to get clothes made in the far east,
Chris from Edwinstow had worked there since she was 15.
We could do with people looking at the
area and thinking, yes, coming to the area,
area and thinking, yes, comhng to the area, we're here to work
16 years on, she is still using her skills working from home
and she believes the area has been let down.
They keep saying about in
They are talking Manchester, Nottingham,
They are not talking about little villages like
They are all going to want ` job sometime in their life.
They say kids today don't want to work.
They can't work if they can get a job,
One thing Ollerton really needs our jobs.
A big employer to come to the town, especially for a
new generation going into the workplace.
If it can't get jobs, it
needs better infrastructure to get people to where the jobs do exist.
There are now three generathons of some families who haven't worked.
When the pits shut, the Olldrton energy village toook root at
has recently located seasonal work for some.
My son has only just found a job and he's 22.
That's down at clipper and that is seasonal.
After Christmas, he is going to be out of work again.
In Newark one shift ends, another begins.
Back to what you could call the East Midlands
They have a message for the Government.
They need to concentrate more on getting
the people there in the first place and making jobs more accesshble to
If not, you're just stuck in one local area and obviously thdre
is only so much work for so many people.
With the influx of people into the country, there are only so
Without it, we would be stuck and probably end up
This is really such a simpld idea at heart, isn't it?
Taking people from areas whdre jobs have disappeared to areas where
there seem to be more and it's changing lives as well.
We've also heard that another 15 people have
actually been for an inducthon to get into work, so it is very
A lot of the work now that the job centres do I working in
partnership with bigger employers to see where
their needs for growth is
and the sorts of employees that they want and how that mirrors
to what people are in pockets around the
It's not new, but it seems to have come of age and I
hope other employers think about taking it on.
It's being done as a partnership led by the local council
and it is helping people in training like forklift truck driving, so
things can be done even on a small-scales to make more jobs
In Derbyshire, there are three things, like that story
from you, what we're doing in Derbyshire
is we are regenerating some of the
That is the start example of that at the side of
We are creating thousands of jobs there on a former pit site.
It has taken so long, though, hasn't it?
It has, it has, because that area was hit by the recession.
We are also, just this last fortnight, we
have started the clean-up of the former Coalite site.
The Avenue site in north-east Derbyshire is the same.
The first thing is that, thd second thing is public transport is an
issue, because these are semirural areas.
We create jobs, but people in
the surrounding villages can't always get them.
It's about that infrastructtre or lack of infrastructure.
We do need to invest in the infrastructure.
The third things about the type of jobs.
We need high-quality jobs that are well
paid, going back to HS2, thd boost to Chesterfield is not just about
high-speed trains stopping there, they would be the Staveley
maintenance depot, which will bring back
to that area a tradition of
high quality engineering jobs that we can take pride in.
Not low paid, low skill, seasonal jobs.
We need something with some substance that
people can look forward to further children,
that give people a sense of security and faith in the future.
The Autumn Statement is coming up this week.
What can we expect from the Chancellor?
Any help you for us in the Dast Midlands?
You can't possibly expect md as a minister
of the Government to tell you what is going to be in the Autumn
What I would like to look ott for is some nice plum infrastructure
opportunities, but also mord long-term things I could thd
There are over 200 firms around area that
are involved in the rail industry alone.
We have great news going on, more contacts only have ever had.
Rolls-Royce, more contacts than ever.
Thank goodness, we want that to carry on going.
It is the next step and the next step.
That's what I want to look out for out of the
infrastructure projects coming through.
All eyes on Philip Hammond on Wednesday.
Will there be much in his Autumn Statement far as
And will there be much vaunted Midlands engine
One of the region's experts on the economy says the
Chancellor's statement is a vital moment for that project.
I think the Autumn Statement is very important.
It think it's a crucial test of credibility, actually.
We've heard a lot said about the potential of the
Midlands engine, Theresa Max in the summer was very bullhsh
in sending out her support for that initiative,
but as yet, we've seen very little in the way of investment ch`nnelled
into the Midlands under that initiative.
It's a big contrast with wh`t we've seen in the north and the
northern powerhouse, whereas they estimated something
like ?7.8 billion worth of public money has
If you're asking the same qtestion of the Midlands, we're
struggling to identify more than a couple of hundred million.
That's quite a big gap, isn't it, between the
spending for the northern powerhouse in the Midlands engine?
Two things, first of all, we are going to get HS2
It's going to take time to have that.
But that is what he was really saying, that actually win the
northern powerhouse became Mr Osborne's key focus, it has then
taken five years for that money to come through.
We do not want that for the Midlands engine and I think
one of the things that is so good about us
and where we can go, we are
the beating heart of the nation that's what we do, engineerhng jobs,
You have just returned from a trip to China
I went on it thinking, I'm not really sure, like you, how
much substance is there to the Midlands engine.
I have come back absolutely enthused, because the prospdct of
bringing back investment from China are staggering.
The Government policy in Chhna is to
internationalise their economy and to look to invest, so wd are
There's massive potential to get investment in our
Post Brexit, we do need to look elsewhere other than
How will winning those cont`cts in China help us here,
As a starter, I think we can do a very
There is a growing middle class in China that
There are very interested in heritage.
Bringing them to Chatsworth, I was showing them photo
We can get tourism input straightaway.
Then we can get investment from manufacturing and so on.
We're not going to be able to rely on European
What was important about th`t trip was the folk from East
Midlands Airport went and that is absolutely key for us.
Birmingham is only down the road and lots of south
If we can get links between the regional
cities in China and East Midlands Airport
To be honest, I think there is more substance knowingly Midlands
engine then that is in northern powerhouse.
I think it is a bit superficial.
I think beneath that there is not an awful
I maybe wrong, I am the outside looking in.
Midlands engine, the local authorities
Midlands are now coming togdther anyway that I have seen before and I
certainly made it my business Derbyshire is in there, bec`use I
want us to get the maximum benefit from this.
Some cash would be good at Autumn Statement, wouldn't it?
I think that there are many, many opportunities to go and visit
I am lucky enough to be able to work in the
international trade Departmdnt, so I know the diaries the mhnisters
The Midlands engine has been trying to
boost exports to China, as we have just been hearing.
One Derbyshire firm is doing just that in
spectacular style, by selling rice to the Chinese.
Granny Mary's in Derbyshire says its winning contacts
around the world as the pound falls in value.
The company has welcomed thd Brexit vote and says it is good
news for the region's food producers.
Others are worried about wh`t life outside the EU will mean for our
speciality foods, which havd protected status.
However our relationship with the EU pans out,
we still need to eat and
food producers in the East Lidlands are already eyeing up new
opportunities here and abro`d - whatever the outcome of Brexit.
In Chesterfield, Granny Mary's produces
high-quality meat products to original family recipes.
They are a success, having recently secured an
They want a yellow rice in particular instead of whhte rice,
they can't produce good-quality yellow race in Hong Kong.
Most people eat away from home in Hong Kong.
They have a couple of stories in Hong Kong.
They fly by jet each day re`dy meals to their shops
Will leaving be used to help this firm?
For us, for export, it's made it so much easier
for people from outside of the UK wanting to buy, because of the
It has meant they can buy so much more for a
For us it has helped and I think making the UK stand
alone as a power country is only going to be of benefit.
Until 2003, the UK had its own stringent meat
and food production rules, then EU regulation came in and many local
food producers say that might not have helped consumers.
Labelling is being destroyed on food by the EU.
In 2003, they abandoned all the food regulations,
provided now you say somewhdre, you call it chicken
korma, that can only have 4% chicken in it.
That's all that's needed to qualify that.
If you put the list of
ingredients, 4% chicken, that is fine.
At Brocklesby, they rely on EU rules to
If our Government cannot offer an alternative scheme,
have some sort of protectivd status for a food
product, then it will effectively open the door to anybody who wants
to call their porkpie a porkpie to do so.
It would allow bogus products into the marketplace and th`t would
affect sales and potentiallx our livelihood.
Back in Chesterfield, they are looking beyond Europe to
sell traditional British me`ls, like chicken korma.
Granny Mary's there certainly showing us how you can
A company that is very sure we are better off out of thd EU
I think that it's just typical of Derbyshire
Let's find a solution to the problem.
I think there are people out there that will seize opportunities.
My ask to Government is to give us some certainty, given some certainty
about how long EU funding is going to continue
Provide us with openings into international markets and I'm sure
For the porkpie manufacturers, I can completely see
At the moment, those pies h`ve protected status, as you know.
Stilton cheese, take that away and anyone can just go and lake it
Well, take away that protected status, remove th`t
Why would anybody take the protected status away?
OK, are you saying that it would
Andrea Leadsom, who is a superb Secretary of State for
environment, food and rural affairs, understands to her fingertips were
the rural areas need and the farmers need
and the producers of food and
We actually import something like 75% of our
We need to get better at doing this anyway.
The Department of trade, we've taken on the UK TI.
The great brand is going all over the world.
These trade missions are going out there day
are launching in January a fantastic new website and my challengd to you
and all your wonderful viewers is, I want to see
a brand-new company in
every constituency, 650 odd new companies
Becoming new exporters, because they would get
every single assistance to
I admire your enthusiasm, but it do think the
I think David Cameron has a lot to answer for, because you
She has inherited a bit of a problem.
We need from the Government now they
like my certainty about how Brexit is going to play out.
Your Government cannot offer that right
Firstly, Andrea Leadsom has already given certainty to the
It is 2020 and beyond for the CAP funding.
That gets is not only over 2019 but beyond that.
Then it will be reviewed in line with what the actual producdrs want,
because at the minute, there are some parts that don't fit
very well for our country, compared to other
Similarly, when it comes to trade, the pound
being low doesn't buy too many bits and pieces.
It helps you with the product that you sell out.
Time now for a round-up of some of the other
political stories from the East Midlands today.
Controversial plans to carrx out tests drilling to assess
the potential for fracking hn Nottinghamshire have been ghven the
The county council approved the plans for a site at Misson
Valley are to be switched off to save cash.
The borough council says 55 cameras have recorded little or
Unite union has strongly criticised plans
to cut over a quarter of he`lth visitors in Nottinghamshire.
The candy bars make health care trust
A personal plea in the housd from South Leicestershire MP Alberto
He wants assurances his Italian parents will be able to stax
Canny Prime Minister assure me that she will never instruct me to vote
in a lobby to take away the rights of my parents and millions of EU
citizens? Theresa May told him she could not make any promises ahead of
the Brexit negotiations. Paroled Arbel through a cost rather worried
about his parents and their future. -- Alberto Costa. Think it hs
excellent use the Prime Minhster's Questions for that. It helps Theresa
May get the point of there that we have lots of UK citizens working
abroad and we need to make sure they are safe as well. She offerdd no
guarantees. It's a negotiathon. He is still worried about it. We are
always worried about her appearance. Of course, we are. You can see our
reports again on social medha pages. Thank you very much to our guest
this week, never happened and will not happen
in four years. It is subject we should spend more time on. Back to
you. What will the Chancellor have to say
in his first big economic statement? What impact will the forecasters say
Brexit will have on the economy And who will face the Front
National's Marine Le Pen in Well, the Shadow Chancellor
and the Chancellor have both been touring the television
studios this morning. Let's be clear, a lot of this
is going to be gimmicks and press As I've said, in the
pipeline, we've only seen one in five delivered
to construction, that's all. So a lot of this will be a repeat
of what I'm not going to reveal
what I'm going to say on We don't have unlimited
capacity, as one might imagine from listening
to John McDonnell, to borrow hundreds of billions of pounds more
for discretionary spending. That simply doesn't
exist if we're going to retain this country's hard-won
credibility in the financial markets if we are going to remain
an attractive place for business to We didn't learn very much, Helen,
but the papers were briefed this morning that there will be another
?1.3 billion for roads and things like that. ?1.3 billion is 0.08 of
our GDP. Not exactly an infrastructure investment programme,
is it? Yellow like I have to say, it was not thrilling to read the
details. -- I have to say... It is the first big financial statement
that is going to come and I think there will be a big row about the
OBE are forecast because they cannot set out a range, they have to commit
to one forecast. Everything they do is incredibly political. DOB are is
on a hiding to nothing. -- DOB are -- the Office for Budget
Responsibility. I don't know how they will square the circle. It is
an interesting week. It is all about the economy and public finances and
we don't have to talk about Brexit until next Sunday, but no, I have a
terrible feeling that by the end of Wednesday afternoon we will be
screaming and shouting about how Brexit is going to be for the
economy. Just imagine the Treasury comes out with his forecast that it
is going to collapse growth and collapsed Treasury takings, people
will be apoplectic. Until now, the economy has continued to grow
strongly. Pretty well. They cannot say, we have noticed it slowing down
and that will continue. They have to take a punt if they think it will
slow down. It affects the Chancellor's figures, because the
more they say it is slowing down, and I have seen that it will go from
2% down to 1.4%, the more the Chancellor's deficit rises even
without any more tax cuts and spending. Absolutely. I think Tom is
right. What we will see this week is a continuation of the debate we have
been having all along. If the Office for Budget Responsibility has
negative and gloomy predictions there will be howls of agony, and
rightly howls of frustration from Brexiteers who will say that all the
dire predictions from before the referendum have not come to pass and
now you are talking things down in a way that becomes a self-fulfilling
prophecy. The money for roads, you were dismissive about it, but every
little helps. I don't dismiss it, I say it doesn't amount to a fiscal
stimulus in macro economic terms. I'm sure if you are on that road, it
will be useful. They are going to build a super highway between Oxford
and Cambridge. I would like to see them go out to Japan and learn how
to fill a hole in two days. I would suggest the road from Oxford to
Cambridge is not for the just managing classes, even though it
goes through Milton Keynes, and that simply freezing due freezing fuel
duty isn't going to hack it, either. These just about managing people are
potentially quite a big band. With income tax rises, it means anything
you do to help them is incredibly expensive. The universal credit
freeze is an interesting example of that. Philip Hammond sounded
ambivalent about it after pre-briefings that it might not the
cuts might not go ahead. There are people who are in work but because
they are low paid don't have the number of hours, they require
welfare benefits to top up their pay, and these welfare benefits as
it stands, are frozen until 202 , and yet inflation is now starting to
rise. That's a problem for the just managing people. Correct. It is
worse than that, because we are talking about April 2017 when tax
credits become universal credits, so the squeeze will be greater. We will
get a small highway between a couple of university towns, but if he has
any money left to spend at all, it will be on some pretty seismic
jazzman for the just about managing people. I am so glad we're not
calling them Jams on this programme, because it is a patronising tone.
What the Chancellor and Shadow Chancellor did not confront is that
Mr Trump's election is a watershed in terms of being able to borrow
cheaply. The Federal Reserve is about to start raising rates. The
days of cheap borrowing for governments could be coming to an
end. You can feel a bit sorry for labour here because after having had
six years of being told that we need a surplus and these things are
important, we can't deny the deficit, we have switched now and
the first thing that Philip Hammond did was to scrap George Osborne s
borrowing targets. He has given himself more wriggle room than
George Osborne had. He has and it will cost them more. Debt servicing
will now rise as a cost. Where is the next political earthquake going
to happen? It could be Italy, or the French
elections coming up next spring Now, who will face the Front
National's Marine Le Pen in next year's French Presidential
elections? Well, France's centre-right
part, Les Republicans, are selecting their candidate
in the first round of Well, France's centre-right
part, Les Republicans, are selecting their candidate
in the first round of Let's speak to our correspondent
in Paris, Hugh Schofield. Welcome to the programme. Three main
candidates, the former -- two former prime ministers and Nicolas Sarkozy,
the former president. It is not clear who the front runner is.
Robbins it is quite an exciting race, because four weeks it did look
as if it was going to be Juppe. It is a two round race. Two go through
and the idea is that they rally all the support together. It looked like
the first round would be dominated by Juppe and Nicolas Sarkozy, and
there was a clear binary combination there, because Sarkozy was looking
for squeamish far right voters. In other words, veering clearly to the
right and far right on immigration and identity issues. And Juppe is
the opposite, saying we had to appeal to the centre. That was what
it looked like. But the third candidate has made this really quite
staggering surge in the last few days. There was a debate on Thursday
and he was deemed to have won it on television. He is coming up
strongly, and I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him go through
which would be interesting from a British perspective, because if the
becomes president, he will be the first president with a British wife.
His wife Penelope is Welsh. We will have to leave it there. I
would suggest that the reason it is fascinating is that whoever wins
this primary for the centre-right party is likely to be the next
president, and who the next president is will be very important
for Britain in these Brexit negotiations. Nothing will really
happen until it is determined. Then after the German elections in
October. I would add one more constituent part. The most important
thing about the race is who can stop Marine Le Pen. Marine Le Pen will
almost be one of the ones in the run-off. The Socialists don't expect
much. Francois Hollande is done There is too much of a cliff to
climb. Which one of these three centre-right candidates can stop
Marine Le Pen? We have had Brexit and Trump, but we could also have
Marine Le Pen. If it is Sarkozy it is the battle of the right. In some
areas, he has moved to the right of marine Le Pen. I suppose he feels he
has do in order to take the wind out of our sails. You wonder if she
could succeed later on if she does not this time. Talking to French
analysts last night, there was suggesting that she could not do it
this time but could win the next time. All the events in France over
the last year seemed to provide the most propitious circumstances for
her to do well, and particularly if you throw in Trump and Brexit.
Suppose it is Mr Sarkozy, and he goes through and wins the Republican
nomination, and he and Marine Le Pen go through to the second round, that
would mean, think about it, is that a lot of French socialist voters and
those on the father left would have to grit their teeth and vote for
Nicolas Sarkozy. They might not do it. We might see what we saw in
America, where lots of potential Clinton voters did not turn out You
got politicians like Melanchon on the far left saying there are
foreign workers taking bread out of French workers' mounts. We sometimes
forget, because we tend to emphasise the National of the National front,
but actually, there are economic policy is quite Bennite. Sarkozy is
the Hillary Clinton of the French elections. He is Mr establishment.
Juppe and the other third candidate are the same. You have to
re-establish candidates running against an antiestablishment
candidate. There are populist economic policies from the National
front. The other three want to raise the retirement age and cut back on
the 35 hour week, which are not classic electoral appeals. Mr Juppe
used to be the Mayor of Bordeaux. And we are the biggest importers of
claret, so that could have an effect. In 2002, it was Jack Shear
against John Marine Le Pen, and the socialist campaign slogan was, vote
for the Crook, not the fascist. We will see what they come up with this
time. The Daily Politics is back at noon
tomorrow on BBC Two, where on Wednesday I will have full
coverage of the Chancellor's Autumn But remember, if it's Sunday,
it's the Sunday Politics.