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Here in the east: The changing face of our councils | :01:21. | :01:24. | |
as they make millions of pounds of savings again this year. | :01:24. | :01:27. | |
And the childcare costs that have risen higher here than anywhere | :01:27. | :01:37. | |
:01:37. | :01:37. | ||
Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2421 seconds | :01:37. | :41:58. | |
Hello, and a warm welcome to Sunday Politics East, I'm Etholle George. | :41:59. | :42:02. | |
Coming up later in the programme: We reveal how much more council tax | :42:02. | :42:06. | |
you're going to have to pay this year as our local authorities shave | :42:06. | :42:10. | |
millions off their budgets. And changes to childcare, will more | :42:10. | :42:13. | |
children looked after by fewer staff really make a difference to | :42:13. | :42:23. | |
:42:23. | :42:28. | ||
I am not knocking it down Number Ten's door because we do not get | :42:28. | :42:33. | |
Tax Credits. The only way we can get back on our feet is a small | :42:34. | :42:37. | |
people work. But first, let's meet our guests | :42:37. | :42:40. | |
for this week. Andy Sawford, the recently elected Labour MP for | :42:40. | :42:43. | |
Corby and Councillor Kilian Bourke, the leader of the Liberal Democrat | :42:43. | :42:45. | |
group on Cambridgeshire County Council. Let's start with this | :42:45. | :42:49. | |
week's 60th anniversary of the Great Flood of 1953. The storm | :42:49. | :42:53. | |
surge claimed the lives of more than 300 people in this region as | :42:53. | :42:55. | |
coastal defences were overwhelmed and sea water swept two miles | :42:55. | :43:05. | |
inland. Since then, there has been millions | :43:05. | :43:08. | |
of pounds spent on sea defences in this region, but it's still around | :43:08. | :43:11. | |
a tenth of what Holland, who suffered the same surge, has | :43:11. | :43:20. | |
prepared for. Is it enough? concern about flood defences in | :43:20. | :43:25. | |
this country have, especially in constituencies like mine, is that | :43:25. | :43:30. | |
we have not looked at all the evidence about how we are likely to | :43:30. | :43:34. | |
experience increased flooding. We cannot always deal with one of | :43:34. | :43:40. | |
events. We can look at what more can be done to prevent animal | :43:40. | :43:48. | |
flooding. We cannot legislate for these natural disasters. The is no | :43:48. | :43:53. | |
way that we can prevent a massive event. You cannot build a Great | :43:54. | :44:00. | |
Wall of China along the coastline. Progress has been made. Instead of | :44:00. | :44:04. | |
destroying marshland, we are building marshes on the coast. If | :44:04. | :44:11. | |
there is flooding, it will be directed into those. I do not think | :44:11. | :44:19. | |
we cannot prevent disasters. what we can expect in the council | :44:19. | :44:23. | |
tax bills. Three-quarters of councils in the east have given us | :44:23. | :44:29. | |
their figures. �338 million is to be shaved off council budgets in | :44:29. | :44:36. | |
the East with the loss of at least 1230 jobs. 29th of our authorities | :44:36. | :44:40. | |
of freezing their council tax, taking advantage of the | :44:40. | :44:46. | |
Government's financial incentive. 8 the forehead teas are increasing | :44:46. | :44:55. | |
their council tax. -- ate a authorities. -- 8. In December, we | :44:55. | :44:57. | |
learn that the government was reducing the amount it was giving | :44:57. | :45:04. | |
to almost every council in the east. Reducing services is a way of | :45:04. | :45:08. | |
making savings. A growing number of councils in our region are trying | :45:08. | :45:11. | |
to make up the difference by finding the ways of generating | :45:11. | :45:21. | |
:45:21. | :45:26. | ||
income. Local councils used to oversee | :45:26. | :45:30. | |
local planning, or provide towns and election or rubbish is | :45:30. | :45:38. | |
collected. The streets are kept clear of litter. Today's councils | :45:38. | :45:43. | |
do much more. This is the right Comp Centre which is part-funded | :45:43. | :45:48. | |
and owned by the local council. It provides office space for 55 local | :45:48. | :45:54. | |
businesses. Councils have a wonderful opportunity to regenerate | :45:54. | :46:02. | |
and bring goodness to the area. We are in a national economic crisis. | :46:02. | :46:07. | |
�50 million of inward investment is expected to Qamar here this year. | :46:07. | :46:10. | |
Renting out business units is not any good for the economy, it makes | :46:10. | :46:15. | |
money for the cancelled so we can keep council tax alone. This is the | :46:15. | :46:22. | |
latest money-making venture. 45 million new homes are being built. | :46:22. | :46:27. | |
It is very important. Government grants are being squeezed. Council | :46:27. | :46:32. | |
taxpayers paid too much tax. We have to raise income to subs detect | :46:32. | :46:38. | |
-- subsidise the TEC council tax payer. With less public money | :46:38. | :46:41. | |
available, councils have realised they have got to do the heavy | :46:41. | :46:48. | |
lifting and find ways of creating income. The council here offers | :46:48. | :46:51. | |
corporate membership at its leisure centres. But is also making money | :46:51. | :46:56. | |
from renting out business units, a man via authority to freeze council | :46:56. | :47:01. | |
tax for a 5th year and not cut frontline services. Half the say | :47:01. | :47:06. | |
this -- half the savings it has to make will be offset by new income. | :47:06. | :47:10. | |
It is about growing income. You have to think a measure of. We have | :47:10. | :47:15. | |
got a programme of growing income wherever we can. That is not by | :47:15. | :47:19. | |
increasing fears, it is by driving more people or more volume through | :47:19. | :47:24. | |
the council, treating it as a business. South Norfolk is making | :47:24. | :47:30. | |
money from the government's new homes bonus. So, too, is Uttlesford | :47:31. | :47:35. | |
in Essex. The government wants to see more councils generating their | :47:35. | :47:41. | |
own funding. But critics say it is not as easy as it sounds. It is a | :47:41. | :47:44. | |
very important feature of local government that we are there to | :47:44. | :47:48. | |
have a local approach, to meet the needs of our local communities. | :47:48. | :47:53. | |
They will be different. The ability to generate income will be | :47:53. | :47:57. | |
different. This council has found ways to generate extra income that | :47:57. | :48:03. | |
says it will not be an up to avoid cuts the two services. If you were | :48:03. | :48:08. | |
in a prosperous area, they -- they may not be the need for those | :48:08. | :48:11. | |
authorities to have any support from government. There may be a | :48:11. | :48:18. | |
continuing ability to generate even more income. The government wants | :48:18. | :48:22. | |
to see councils play more of a role in encouraging local growth and | :48:22. | :48:26. | |
wants them to be less reliant on the animal central grants. Some | :48:26. | :48:30. | |
have found a way to make this work, others fear they are being left | :48:30. | :48:39. | |
behind. I am joined by Brandon Lewis. Following on from the issues | :48:39. | :48:42. | |
raised in the film comedy you accept that some councils will find | :48:42. | :48:49. | |
it easier and to be more able to generate income than others? We are | :48:49. | :48:51. | |
already seeing some local authorities moving forward in that | :48:51. | :48:59. | |
way for a while. The forward- thinking councils take advantage of | :48:59. | :49:05. | |
what we have done with a local Act to give them more power. They will | :49:05. | :49:09. | |
get the most benefit and we will see more authority is looking at | :49:09. | :49:15. | |
best practice around the country are bringing back home. It is about | :49:15. | :49:19. | |
circumstances. Some councils do not have the space to build houses. | :49:19. | :49:23. | |
They have more elderly people or more deprived areas. That is the | :49:24. | :49:28. | |
reason you have to look at it as a whole package. We are moving into a | :49:28. | :49:31. | |
realm where we want to change the way local government is financed. | :49:31. | :49:35. | |
It is about what local authorities can do to help themselves. That is | :49:35. | :49:40. | |
also why we have changed the finance to take into account growth | :49:40. | :49:45. | |
in business rates. There is a incentive for local authorities | :49:45. | :49:54. | |
there. A isn't there a danger that you are creating two Tia councils? | :49:54. | :49:57. | |
All authorities have the same opportunities. Different | :49:57. | :50:02. | |
authorities will take advantage of the opportunities in different ways. | :50:02. | :50:05. | |
It is about giving the local councils the power for the people | :50:06. | :50:09. | |
who know their communities to deliver the best products for their | :50:09. | :50:13. | |
communities. What about the incentive to freeze council tax? IS | :50:13. | :50:21. | |
that not a private -- bright? central government do our best to | :50:21. | :50:25. | |
help the hard-working taxpayers. We are saying to people we have had a | :50:25. | :50:29. | |
freeze in council tax. We have frozen it for two years. We're | :50:29. | :50:36. | |
putting in place the opportunity for a freeze for a third year. We | :50:36. | :50:40. | |
want councils to take advantage and help hard-working taxpayers in our | :50:40. | :50:48. | |
communities. Andy Sawford, or your council has changed its mind. The | :50:48. | :50:52. | |
proposed 2% increase has gone and they are going for a tax freeze. | :50:52. | :50:56. | |
How are services going to be maintained? I have always | :50:56. | :51:00. | |
understood we were looking at a freeze because we recognise that | :51:00. | :51:04. | |
times are very tough for people. You have got to put these changes | :51:04. | :51:09. | |
into wider context. Lots of people are being charged to receive cancel | :51:09. | :51:19. | |
services. School transport costs more money. Social care services | :51:19. | :51:23. | |
are charging people. I do not think we should be taken away with the | :51:23. | :51:27. | |
Tory propaganda that they are helping ordinary people. The | :51:27. | :51:33. | |
poorest people in our country are suffering most, because of the | :51:33. | :51:36. | |
council tax benefit reduction, it is them that are going to be paying | :51:37. | :51:41. | |
the price for the Tory's failure to get the economy getting going and | :51:41. | :51:46. | |
keeping our services going. Let's talk about Cambridge are having to | :51:46. | :51:52. | |
make savings of �32 million. It looks set to cat 99 jobs. By you | :51:52. | :51:57. | |
looking to freeze cancel tax? council has already committed to | :51:57. | :52:05. | |
increasing council tax. I would say that the offer on the table from | :52:05. | :52:09. | |
central government is not a bribe, it is a con. The money that is | :52:09. | :52:15. | |
being offered, the equivalent of a 1% council tax increase this year | :52:15. | :52:20. | |
would disappear the following year. That is not how finances work. You | :52:20. | :52:27. | |
have to keep providing services. you want to come back on that? | :52:27. | :52:31. | |
that last statement, that is wrong. We have made it very clear that it | :52:31. | :52:37. | |
will not go after a year. It is there for the next few years. There | :52:37. | :52:45. | |
is a real issue. There are hard working people for we need to help. | :52:45. | :52:48. | |
The council tax freeze recognises that people are having tough times. | :52:48. | :52:52. | |
It is very good to be able to say that we are freezing council tax. | :52:52. | :52:57. | |
We had big rises under the last government and we have given all | :52:57. | :53:01. | |
the local authorities the chance to freeze it for a third year. Let's | :53:01. | :53:06. | |
talk about councils to what raising the council tax to a percentage | :53:06. | :53:14. | |
point just shy of the 2% that requires a referendum. Eric Pickles | :53:14. | :53:19. | |
this week has described the councils as democracy dodgers and | :53:19. | :53:23. | |
said they are treating residents with contempt. Do you agree? WHAT | :53:23. | :53:27. | |
he was referring to was more than that. They are rather a few Labour | :53:27. | :53:32. | |
authorities in the north shore are using a very technical system of | :53:32. | :53:38. | |
levies to avoid it and go at about 3.5% in reality and avoid a | :53:38. | :53:43. | |
referendum. That is simply not acceptable. With a authorities who | :53:43. | :53:51. | |
are looking at the opportunity to go at 1.95%, these people know that | :53:51. | :53:55. | |
at 2%, you have to have a referendum. If you are that close | :53:55. | :54:03. | |
to 2%, you are trying to dodge a referendum. This is a hypocrisy | :54:03. | :54:13. | |
:54:13. | :54:13. | ||
from central government. They do not have a referendum. They have | :54:13. | :54:17. | |
cut working tax benefit in my constituency. There is one role for | :54:17. | :54:21. | |
local councils, cutting them any year after year by huge amounts | :54:21. | :54:28. | |
with huge consequences for services, but then this little bribe, I agree | :54:28. | :54:32. | |
with Kilian Bourke, this is a con. What about the general principle? | :54:32. | :54:37. | |
What about the councils to what are raising council tax just below that | :54:37. | :54:43. | |
2% level? If central government says you cannot increase council | :54:43. | :54:48. | |
tax by a 2% or more without a referendum, that means that you | :54:48. | :54:51. | |
what I'll be allowed to increase council tax by a slightly lower | :54:51. | :54:57. | |
than that to raise funds. And to start attacking of authorities for | :54:57. | :55:02. | |
doing that is a complete nonsense. We need to take account of the | :55:02. | :55:07. | |
particular circumstances of different local authorities. | :55:07. | :55:09. | |
Cambridgeshire county council, Labour and Conservative | :55:09. | :55:15. | |
Administration voted for the best project. As a result, we are �70 | :55:15. | :55:23. | |
million out of pocket. That will wipe have -- that will wipe out | :55:23. | :55:27. | |
half of the council tax increase. That is a great example of public | :55:27. | :55:32. | |
transport where people are paying more. In my constituency, people | :55:32. | :55:39. | |
are paying a fortune. This week has seen Norfolk MP and | :55:39. | :55:42. | |
charter minister Liz Truss announce plans for nurseries and commanders | :55:42. | :55:47. | |
to be allowed to look after more children as part of Coalition | :55:47. | :55:51. | |
efforts to cut child care costs. Nursery cost in the east are higher | :55:51. | :55:55. | |
than the national average. The most striking increase is in shocker | :55:55. | :56:05. | |
:56:05. | :56:10. | ||
cost four under two euros. -- to read year old. We spoke to someone | :56:10. | :56:17. | |
facing those costs. Francis Camps has two children under the age of | :56:17. | :56:20. | |
four and used to work in financial services but had to give up work | :56:20. | :56:24. | |
because of the cost of childcare. went back to work full time after I | :56:25. | :56:28. | |
had my first child and put him into a mystery because the cost of one | :56:28. | :56:34. | |
was not too bad. It has about �45 a day. But when I had my second child, | :56:34. | :56:38. | |
it was too much at once. I was trying to get two children are | :56:38. | :56:43. | |
ready in the morning and getting them to nursery. I interviewed a | :56:43. | :56:48. | |
couple of nannies, considering taking that approach, but the cast | :56:48. | :56:53. | |
is so much higher. It was never going to happen. -- cost. It was | :56:53. | :56:58. | |
not worth doing it. We thought we would end up being divorced if we | :56:58. | :57:04. | |
went down that path. After much discussion, we decided one of us | :57:04. | :57:09. | |
had to take a step back from full- time work. I am more than happy to | :57:09. | :57:16. | |
pay for our own children. That is perfectly valid. As a tax payer, I | :57:16. | :57:19. | |
have contributed a lot to society and some of my taxes would have | :57:19. | :57:27. | |
gone to other services where people needed help. Now, maybe it is my | :57:27. | :57:33. | |
turn to have some help. Under the new plans announced by Liz Truss, | :57:33. | :57:38. | |
in nurseries from September, one adult will be allowed to look after | :57:38. | :57:42. | |
four babies under one instead of three. All six 2 euros instead of | :57:42. | :57:46. | |
four. But any of their qualifications meet new standards. | :57:46. | :57:51. | |
I spoke to her a little earlier. The idea of reducing the ratio of | :57:51. | :57:56. | |
carers to children has caused consternation to many parents. | :57:56. | :57:59. | |
the moment, we have a situation where parents are paying the | :57:59. | :58:03. | |
highest cost in Europe and staff in nurseries are paid six than 60 an | :58:03. | :58:11. | |
hour on average which is only just above the minimum wage. -- �6.60. | :58:11. | :58:15. | |
We can get better quality by moving to a system like they have in | :58:15. | :58:18. | |
countries like France where they give nurses more flexibility but we | :58:18. | :58:26. | |
also get better paid, highly qualified staff. The outcomes are | :58:26. | :58:31. | |
beneficial for children. That is the direction I want us to move in. | :58:31. | :58:34. | |
Nursery say it will not save money. You have said just add that these | :58:34. | :58:39. | |
people are not by any means highly paid. I think it is important that | :58:39. | :58:44. | |
we also need to raise quality. At the moment, there is patchy quality. | :58:44. | :58:49. | |
Some places are very good, others are not. It is not very good in | :58:49. | :58:53. | |
deprived areas. We need to make it more available for parents. But the | :58:53. | :58:59. | |
moment, it can be difficult to find a full-time nursery place. Our | :58:59. | :59:06. | |
plans are about improving the quality and availability. Britain | :59:06. | :59:11. | |
spent the same as France does on early years care. They have better- | :59:11. | :59:16. | |
paid staff, higher ratios, higher satisfaction and parents are paying | :59:16. | :59:21. | |
half the cast. We can do it better. By have spoken to a lot of | :59:21. | :59:24. | |
nurseries for are keen to take this approach. They are keen to at | :59:24. | :59:27. | |
school their staff to operate in different ways to look at the way | :59:27. | :59:31. | |
they do on the Continent. When parents say that, they will be | :59:31. | :59:39. | |
encouraged. Tu understand that families like the Kemps think it is | :59:39. | :59:43. | |
their turn to get support. We did announce in the mid-term review | :59:43. | :59:46. | |
that we want to help working parents with childcare. Along with | :59:46. | :59:49. | |
this reform to improve the efficiency of our system and | :59:50. | :59:54. | |
improve the quality, we are looking at helping working families. When | :59:54. | :00:00. | |
will we know what the government plans to do for tax breaks to help | :00:00. | :00:06. | |
with a child care costs? We will announce our plans soon. But the | :00:06. | :00:10. | |
moment, I am making sure we get value for money for the �5 billion | :00:10. | :00:13. | |
that we spend. Compared to other countries, we are spending as much | :00:13. | :00:19. | |
money, but we are finding that nursery workers are underpaid for | :00:19. | :00:22. | |
the important job they do and that families are paying too much. We | :00:22. | :00:29. | |
must be able to get better value for money. At least this is an | :00:29. | :00:34. | |
attempt to reduce the problem. You must welcome it. Sometimes, I | :00:34. | :00:38. | |
wonder. These ministers, you show them announce these policies and | :00:38. | :00:45. | |
say that everybody supports them. If Liz Truss can show me any | :00:45. | :00:48. | |
childcare organisation that has not come out about this, I would be | :00:48. | :00:52. | |
gobsmacked. Everyone thinks it is a bad idea. She cites international | :00:52. | :00:59. | |
evidence. The most comparable but - - example is Holland where they | :00:59. | :01:02. | |
changed the ratios and it was a democratisation of child care which | :01:02. | :01:06. | |
pushed the costs about go at quality. But better qualifications | :01:06. | :01:09. | |
for people working in the industry must be a good thing. It is | :01:09. | :01:14. | |
important that people providing childcare have good qualifications. | :01:14. | :01:21. | |
That is why they think it is absolutely wrong that the county | :01:21. | :01:24. | |
council and they are cutting the funding that is provided for people | :01:24. | :01:28. | |
who provide a child-minding to get the qualifications they need. The | :01:28. | :01:33. | |
other thing is that just the other day others were four local children | :01:33. | :01:38. | |
centres talking about what they do. That is a great legacy of the last | :01:38. | :01:41. | |
Labour government that made a great difference to the quality, | :01:42. | :01:45. | |
availability and affordability of childcare. Can the government | :01:45. | :01:51. | |
afford to help families? POPE fully. I think the government is doing | :01:51. | :01:56. | |
something good by looking very seriously at soccer as an issue. | :01:56. | :02:03. | |
From 20th April 13, there is going to be free childcare. -- child care | :02:03. | :02:07. | |
as an issue. There will be free childcare available to poor | :02:07. | :02:11. | |
families. They are redressing the issue of childcare. More widely, | :02:11. | :02:15. | |
there is the issue of the squeezed middle. If both parents have to | :02:15. | :02:21. | |
work, especially in affluent areas, like Cambridge, then we have to | :02:21. | :02:26. | |
provide local accessible and affordable childcare. But it is a | :02:26. | :02:30. | |
government that you are supporting that is cutting child tax Credits, | :02:30. | :02:35. | |
Child Benefit. All sorts of ways that we help working families to | :02:35. | :02:40. | |
pay for shocker and meet the other cost of raising children. -- pay | :02:40. | :02:45. | |
for child care. We will have to leave it there. Now for our | :02:45. | :02:49. | |
political round-up of the week. Someone found themselves on the | :02:49. | :02:59. | |
naughty stuff. -- step. It is unfair that sixth-form | :02:59. | :03:04. | |
colleges are forced to pay VAT when schools do not have to according to | :03:04. | :03:08. | |
this MP. Will my Friend agree to investigate whether this can be | :03:08. | :03:12. | |
corrected so they can be a level playing-field for sixth-form | :03:12. | :03:16. | |
colleges? RICHARD Bacon complained that many countries are still using | :03:16. | :03:20. | |
illegal methods of reading cakes and called for a ban on the import | :03:20. | :03:29. | |
of the meat from parts of Europe. - - and Derwyn Jones. So I'll us do | :03:29. | :03:33. | |
not think they will benefit from the downgrading of the coastguard | :03:33. | :03:37. | |
station at Great Yarmouth. It is the anniversary of the | :03:37. | :03:41. | |
reorganisation of this hospital which was taken over by a private | :03:41. | :03:45. | |
healthcare company one year ago. It has missed its financial targets by | :03:45. | :03:53. | |
of the �3 million. John Birt Coe's rabbit did not miss its mark. You | :03:53. | :03:57. | |
would not behave like that in the courts. Do not behave like that in | :03:58. | :04:04. | |
this chamber. What you make of the fact that some of the pig industry | :04:04. | :04:09. | |
in Germany and some of it in Portugal are simply not compliant? | :04:09. | :04:12. | |
The key point to make is that the legislation has only become | :04:12. | :04:17. | |
effective this month. The European Commission has already issued finds | :04:17. | :04:26. | |
in the process -- finds to the countries that are not compliant. | :04:26. | :04:32. | |
Those who do not comply. Is that why people are opposed to Europe? | :04:32. | :04:35. | |
ABSOLUTELY right. But there are rules that Britain is following, | :04:35. | :04:38. | |
other countries should be made to. That is why we need a powerful | :04:38. | :04:43. | |
government with a powerful Prime Minister who has influence across | :04:43. | :04:49. | |
Europe. That's all for now. You can keep in | :04:49. | :04:51. |