10/06/2012 Sunday Politics North East and Cumbria

In the North East and Cumbria: Can police budgets really be cut

without crime rising? In Cumbria they are stopping the public going

into their local police stations. Will it work? Find out more at

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 1704 seconds

Hello and a warm welcome to the local part of the show.

Coming up: Is it time to set up a network of North East banks to help

drive investment into the region's businesses? Local banks work in

Germany so was it a model we should follow you? Hexham MP Guy Opperman

is one of those who believes in breaking the stranglehold of the

big four banks. He joins me in the studio. And also you to talk

through the week's political news is the medals for up South MP Tom

Blenkinsop. First - how do you maintain a frontline policing when

budgets are being dramatically cut back? Well in Cumbria one solution

is to stop members of the public going into the local police

stations to report a crime are handover loss proper date. The

police stations will remain, but the so-called front counter service

used by the public will be moved elsewhere, perhaps to the town hall

or fire station. It is all because Cumbria's forces need to save �20

million by 2016, the equivalent of 20% of its budget. The Chief

Constable says this is one a way of doing it without affecting

frontline policing and Crump -- and crime funding. -- crime far to --

crime fighting. No stone is being left unturned. We are looking at

everything. What we're trying to do is to provide affair facility, that

matches people's needs. But at the same time we are ensuring we are

much more available through the telephone and internet so people

can talk to us at a time that suits them and we can get to them as

quick as possible. The trade union Unison represents

the civilians who work in the police station. Re Brown is a nurse

studio now. What are your concerns about this? The Chief Constable has

to say that it will not affect frontline police. That is his job.

In reality if you are going to close frontline services, how will

it not affect the public? They don't just do with the public as

they come through their door, they deal with lost property, found

property. Especially in the tourist area, they get tourists coming into

ask for directions. The elderly sometimes have communication issues

so dealing with them on the telephone or a computer can be

difficult. They like to going to the local station, they know the

people behind the counter and trust them. They have already now saw

some frontline services in Carlisle, there are already issues arising

there because if you have none police staff delivering police

services it is a grey area. Our staff have access to all sorts of

systems. What do they share a what do they not sure? I can understand

why it might appeal to some. At a time when finances are tight, it is

a luxury. What it does not affect his crime-fighting. The frontline

staff don't just do customer or services. The deal with petty cash,

they deal with their calls they provide many services. If they are

not there to do that, if you want to pay over �30,000 for an officer

to d'Administration, fine. I am not happy with my money being spent a

way. The police are going to as the public about this. The priorities

are bobbies on the street, it is not frontline staff. They are a

good employer and the make the best of a bad job. They do not want to

be doing this. I think it is important to get that point across.

The public have this misconception that there is a big divide between

the front line and the back of us. Without the back office, the

frontline end up doing that work. That is not good use of money are a

resource. Thank you very much. Guy Opperman, I will make it clear, it

is not just Cumbria we're talking about. All police forces are being

faced with tough decisions. Northumbria Police have lost more

than 200 last year. Guy Opperman, is it possible to do that, to take

those officers that without affecting levels of crime? We have

done that in North Cumbria. You look at the statistics for a 2011

and 2012. She has cut our budgets and cut crime, in excess of 10% for

burgle rate, criminal damage and overall crime is down 8%. It is

possible to be done. Speaking for myself, I would far rather have

officers out on the beat and stuck behind a desk, sitting there all

day waiting for a few people to comment. Tong Blenkinsopp, do you

agree that it is possible to cut services without having an effect

on frontline services? -- Tom Blenkinsop. This was a Government

that promises evidence led policy. What we have as an ideologically

altered policy, a 20% reduction which will reduce offices across

the area. Her is there evidence that that will lead to an

increasing crime? Within 2009 and 2010 crime was reduced under Labour.

-- between. By 2015 you will see a 16,000 reduction in police officers

in England and Wales so you will take officers out of 21st century

levels. He thinks cuts will affect in his area. I would like to see

why we can do things in North Cumbria. We have achieved constable

who can deal with their cuts and deal with the crime. I would

suggest a Lancashire officer he has will do what he is doing and ask

why others can do it. Cutting front counter services, it is not just

about frontline staff. Some of the staff take important burdens of the

hands of those police officers. If you remove them, it is not as

simple effect of reducing them. Tom Blenkinsop, you're shaking her head.

You don't agree. By 2015, we will have 1000 less officers. We have

already seen frontline officers in response teams been reduced across

the country. Crime of when the person is up 11%. -- crime on the

individual person. His policing worse in Newry area than it was

before these cuts? Mine has improved. I would say the standard

of policing has always been exceptional. We can always do with

more police officer are maintaining those numbers. You can do more with

less resources. I would argue by 2015 across England and Wales when

you have less than 16,000 officers back to 1997 levels, you're going

to see the effects on crime. speak to their Chief Constable of

North Cumbria, she is sorting this out. Chief constables for all the

sake, with the exception of Lancashire, they will always say

that they will be able to do the job? No, I'd love you look at the

statistics. You see that with the reductions that have taken place,

crime has come down. This is the point that has been raised in the

film. They are the ones that will save the objectives are going

forward. Chief constables have dealt with these matters locally.

Your Government has talked about dealing with these locally. How

does it help the public? He there are good examples of the police

going to that committee and holding some of their Texels ability --

their accessibility counters in and supermarkets. We hold or surgeries

in supermarkets. Thank you are more very much. It is the big players

like Barclays, HSBC and Lloyds that continued to dominate her banking

system. And they have come up and for some serious criticism, not

least for failing to align to businesses during the recession. So

is it time for a banking revolution in the creation of new local banks

owned and run in the North East and Cumbria?

This woman felt trapped by her debts. She signed up to local

credit union in South Shields. you cannot pay then you go to the

credit unit and tell them. They sorted out and another arrangement

with you. Whereas the doorstep arrangement can get nasty with you

if you cannot pay it. So it is very good. Thousands like her have

credit -- benefited from joining Credit Unions. The Government is

keen to see it expand. The Government has given credit

unions more freedom. For the first time they can now pay interest on

people's savings. They are also no longer restricted to one

geographical area. So in theory the credit union here can compete for

business anywhere. The Government's hope is that credit unions let this

could be local bites in more than just name providing serious

competition to that high street big names. Could they help hard-up

businesses as well as individuals? I think it is. But it depends on

where you are starting from. Some of the bigger credit unions already

offer a full range of financial services. In Ireland they do in

particular. If you go to Canada, they are indistinguishable from the

banks. So it is possible but it is a very high mountain to climb from

where we are at present. With many credit unions intent on survival

rather than expanding it might be worth looking at alternatives. So

why not at look at other alternatives. The Post Office ran

Girobank until it was sold off. Some believe it is time to go to

the back and make. As his local bank branches. We have over 100

years of trust. People do not trust big bangs. We know the local people,

we know why a local businesses, we know our local customers for. So

we're not someone who's sitting down anonymously and saying we

cannot do this are that. Government has no plans to

reintroduce a full banking service back into the Post Office. Someone

suggested racial abroad for inspiration to what the Germans do.

-- suggested we look abroad. Most towns and cities have one.

Many economists think they have kept German small business is

healthy during the recess and -- recession. The big banks withdrew

from their engagement in providing loans, especially to the smaller

business sector. The co-operative banks and the savings banks which

operate very locally, we're talking here about towns, cities, districts,

counties not more than that. The provided access to finance and kept

these companies running. The idea of German-style local banks is

beginning to appeal to business leaders here. The head of this

company thinks they could get vital finance flowing again. The existing

banks, it is a tick box system for businesses. Often the computer says

not. That personal knowledge and action between a business and that

bank manager, no longer exists. That has disappeared. A new

institution has the opportunity to build afresh. For the moment there

High Street remains dominated by multinational names. Some believe

the economy could be more -- could benefit from being a bit more

German. You are enthusiastic about the idea.

Will it make a difference? Yes. You could have a local bank run by that

local community on behalf of that local community, lending solely to

the local community, with profits going back to the local community.

It is going back to how banking should have been. That is a bike

that will be more responsive, more accommodating to that community

lending and small businesses would thrive. In Germany, 70% of local

planning -- banking is through local banks. Let's look at some of

the potential sources of local banks. Credit unions, many are

struggling to survive let alone taking on banks. There was a report

this week that said many are on the edge. Hey yes, but they have an

opportunity to expand and to be able to have a greater degree of

products. My local credit unions are doing better. The Government

has given a more opportunity to expand. The problem I have got was

when the Government had an opportunity to launch another

service. We saw the relaunch of the Green Investment back but that

cannot lend or borrow until 2016. We're a moment of a three-year

contraction in manufacturing when we have seen 1% of manufacturing

contract and the Greenbank has missed an opportunity to put it

near industrial clusters. We are setting up local banking

organisations. Hampshire Bank has been set up by the local authority.

You have our organisations that can do this because we have passed the

Financial Services Act. That is breaking up the old system and

providing more opportunities. one to be a long haul. Until

Germany, -- talking about Germany, those banks have been established

for 70 years or more. There is tremendous interest and there is

tremendous opportunity to do this. It would be fantastic. You could

have but a local bank in Northumbria which could lend

locally and can be part of that the community. And banking was someone

you can know and trust instead of a faceless nobody. I hope there is an

immediate improvement to lending for small businesses at this moment

in time. We have seen 11 pound reduction in lending. That is

having an effect on small businesses. -- �11 million

reduction. The Government had an opportunity to use not just

localise banks but using their model of using societies around the

corporate of model. There was a missed opportunity with the

Northern Rock sale. There is the Post Office and there, Labour have

plans to reintroduce banking there. In addition when it came to

Northern Rock, it was sold off. It was turned into what you would like

to be a local bank. A more interesting one is the Royal Bank

of Scotland. When that his address, I would like it to be given -- have

the individual branches given back to the community. Realistically, do

you think that will happen? I think it is a real possibility. Everybody

can see that the big banks are not lending as they should be lending,

so therefore you need to address the problem from the other end of

the telescope. A uni to get that capital back into the community to

allow businesses to create that demand. More than 50% of small

businesses had rejected over drafts. And rejected loans. That is due to

the decisions of the Government now it and compounded by Europe.

wanted to ask you about the credit unions and urea, could they be an

alternative to banks? Potentially end their long-term. But that

problem is now creating the problem now. -- in your area.

It is the existing banks that we need to put a boost on. These banks

are being set up. Local banks are being set up. I am talking about

the high street banks. They are is tremendous pressure being put on

them to lend. The likes of us to are going to individual bank

managers to make sure those things are happening.

Perhaps you have misstep that there was a certain Jubilee that has

attracted all the attention of the last rigours. But some politics has

also been happening. And once Emily Unia was packed away -- has packed

away her bunting and finish of the last of a Union Jack cupcakes, she

came back with this. The Week in 60 seconds.

Sellafield in Cumbria is to close in 2018. It is hoped many of the

hundred workers will be found other jobs on the site. Drivers on the

Tyne and Wear Metro to crack -- strike action on Thursday after

rejecting a pay offer. Unions said -- local MPs said union should have

been balloted. They union leaders need to make decisions. As a was a

revised offer I would like to see the union leaders themselves to

make the decision on that. It seems rash. How many council should there

be in Cumbria? The leader has invited the six districts to

discuss the issue. He questions whether their current structure

provides the best deal for residents. Quite a week for our one

Newcastle MP. She is having her place stage this week.

That is about it for us now. You can keep any tap -- you can keep in

touch at any time through my blog. You can find that on at

bbc.co.uk/richardmoss. You can get in touch by the wonders of Twitter.

Those details are on the screen now. Next Sunday we will be talking