17/02/2013 Sunday Politics North East and Cumbria

Welcome to the Sunday Politics. The gloves are off, it's all guns

blazing as the parties fight it out In the north-east and Cumbria, a

rethink on Newcastle's cuts. We talk to the council leader. And are

disabled people being treated fairly by the Government's will for

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2156 seconds

First up: there's been many local council cuts - and many protests.

But nothing has made headlines quite like Newcastle Council's

decision to axe 100 per cent of its arts budget - along with ten of its

public libraries. But after a ferocious spat with leading lights

in the arts world and some unwelcome national publicity, comes

a re-think. The leader of the council, Nick Forbes, joins me now.

You have now found �600,000 to go into a fund to help the arts groups.

Was this a massive No -- massive miscalculation? There has been an

intervention from Harriet Harman. It is quickly -- pretty humiliating,

isn't it? A no one questions the value of the arts and culture. The

question is about how to fund them when the arts are competing for

funding with things like rubbish collection and social cool for the

elderly. What we have come up with is an innovative and creative way

of funding the arts from switching from revenue subsidy to Capital

Investment model by setting up an investment fund for culture and the

arts in Newcastle. Nothing to do with that, was it, Harriet Harman,

telling you to get your act together? I spoke to run a week

before their Nisbet to tell them what we were doing. She was

absolutely delighted with it. This is work that has been in progress

for a very long period of time. We have been discussing this with arts

organisations and the Arts Council since last December. There seems to

be a pattern with this Budget. Some libraries and swimming pools of,

closing, some not, but you seem to have no choice to cut these, and

now it seems there is a choice. What are we to believe? The reason

why we have had a three-month consultation is to allow people to

think of alternatives. We have not said that we are going to pass on

the cuts down the line. We have said this is what will happen if we

do not do something different. And communities have responded

magnificently over the last three months. Where we had, for example...

There is not any extra money. What people have come up with his

creative solutions and ways of doing things like delivering

libraries in partnership. One for every respite care centres for

disabled children? The threat to close them caused families

immeasurable stress. A Labour MP in the city has said that you could

have stopped families having that stress. During the consultation

process similar units have closed in North Tyneside and in Hexham.

We're not think it is appropriate to abandon families at a time when

there is no other alternative. it that you have to put those

families through this? The families have come up with good ideas about

how we could extend the building and market the service is better

and get better use out of the existing capacity. What we're doing

is committing to exploring all the alternatives. That is the

responsible thing to do at a time when we are facing unprecedented

cuts. You make embarrassing cost to the Government, dramatic cuts, then

you think again. The sky has not fallen in. Newcastle still faces

�100 million worth of cuts. We have had an honest, opulent conversation

about what those cuts mean in practice and how the City can work

together to mitigate against the worst excesses of them. These cuts

are still damaging in many ways, and there are further cuts down the

line which the Government says it is going to announce in future

years, and that fills me with fear for the future of our public

services. This is exactly what Eric Pickles and the Government one, big

cuts from government making council leaders having to get all the blame.

They have to make difficult decisions. I wish that there had

not been as political grandstanding going on before the decisions are

taken. It sounds to me as if to save a number of services which the

City would clearly like to save, the council is at long last looking

at alternative ways of funding them. That is the very thing that has to

be done when you have economic pressures of the kind that we

currently have. That is not good enough. It is �100 million. He says

that there are still huge amounts of cuts that have been passed on by

the Government. It is exactly what the Government wants, to pass the

blame along the line, to pass the buck. We all know that this country

has had a very tough time. We know that the last government left us

with a massive debt, and that applies to Labour-run authorities

as well as others that they might have got to cut their cloth

according to what is there. But, grandstanding like has been going

on in Newcastle, taking it to the brink and worrying people

unnecessarily, when other ideas could have been brought forward

sooner is, in my view, unacceptable. This is damaging to the region. We

have had talk about other councils "not doing a Newcastle". It is not

a great advert for the north-east. I have great sympathy with local

authority leaders over the cuts they have to make. They have got to

find �174 million worth of cuts over four years. That is a slash to

the bone of services and will clean air. Things are very difficult that

local authorities are having to do. I have got a lot of sympathy for

the decisions being made, because they are very difficult. The cuts

that we are facing in the North East are far worse than some of the

local authorities down south. I would say to him that some of the

cups and the South of England, Tory councils, not as bad as the ones

we're being asked to make in the north-east. There are lots of

council cuts and savings going on. Does it surprise you that the

biggest fuss was about cuts to the arts, and not cuts that affect

vulnerable people? Local authorities are having to make

unbelievably difficult decisions. You try to make cuts that or save

money in the short term. Lots of places round the country are

cutting leisure centres, because that is seen as an easy way to save

money. You wake up again social care or respite homes or old

people's homes, those are things that you absolutely cannot cut

without causing massive difficulties. It is a tough time

right now. I do not end the anyone having to make those decisions. --

envy anyone. Disability Living Allowance has long been the most

common benefit paid to disabled people - both in and out of work.

But that's about to change - and the North East and Cumbria will be

one of the first parts of the UK to be affected. Our correspondent Mark

Denten reports. There are just over 3 million people in the north-east

and Cumbria. Among the crowds, there are six in with a 60,000 of

us with disabilities. In a time of squeezed budgets, how do retarget

many of those who need it most? Karen is an occupational therapist

to became disabled through a back injury. Since then, work has become

even more crucial. Without work I think I would not function. There

are lots of disabled people who want to work. They would probably

do anything just to be given that opportunity. Caroline faces extra

costs getting around. The Disability Living Allowance helps,

but a shake-up is coming. Disability Living Allowance

claimants get up to �526 a month, but in the last year, the benefit

cost that in �13.5 billion. Ministers say that that money could

be targeted better solar system called personal independence

payments is coming in. That will mean new assessments to decide what

people get. That worries Karen. She is partially sighted, and she lives

in Newcastle. When the weather is fine, she's out and about. She will

be reassessed to see if she qualifies for the new benefit, as

she has an unchanging condition. She does not understand why. It is

not like having a bad back. If you have a bad back, you can have

treatment and you can get better. Therefore, these are the people who

should be targeted to get off Disability Living Allowance. Not

people who have got an ongoing condition. Disabled people in this

region will be among the first in the country to be affected by these

changes, because by April, under a pilot scheme, new claimants will

have to apply for that new benefit, personal independence payments, but

eventually, all Disability Living Allowance claimants will be

reassessed to see whether they qualify for the new benefit. Round

here, that means thousands of people. Diane is not convinced

those people will be fairly assessed. GS Employment Support

Allowance and Disability living Allowance. After being diagnosed

with breast cancer she had more bad news. I received a letter stating

that I was fit for work along with my p 45. A how did you feel about

that? The devastated and shocked. They cannot get that right, how can

we expect them to get the Sea Benefit right? Diane is appealing

against the assessment carried out by the private company, at odds.

They say they works Whitley to Gately is given to them by the

Government. Opposition MPs are concerned about the disability

benefit changes. It is being driven solely by getting the finances

stunned. But we also have to look after people properly. This benefit

has been around for 20 years. But the % of people who have caught it

do not have any corroborating medical evidence. Fear of targeting

or blunt instrument? The Government begins phasing in the new system in

just seven weeks. Everyone is in favour of people with genuine

disabilities in getting the benefits they deserve, but only

sure assessing people, there might be people who just do not need or

deserve it. We have to again cut money from the welfare budget, but

many concerns from disabled people are around the testing process. A

lot of people have conditions that will not change and only ever get

worse, and there is an argument about whether you have to be

assessing all of those people. The new criteria for personal

independence payment is much stricter. The Government said

400,000 people will not make the transition from Disability Living

Allowance to personal independence penis. And we're not going to know

the real effect for another couple of years. A but you want more

disabled people being given the opportunity to work and not rely on

benefits. The Government always says it wants support to go to the

people with the most need, and I have no difficulty with that, but

the difficulty is with people who need that little extra bit of help

and support. Disability living allowance gets disabled people rice

to live in society, because it costs more to be disabled, to get

to work, to have extra heating, or extra support at home to carry out

daily tasks. The danger with slashing those benefits is, that we

just push costs further down the line and we have people who need

temporary residential care, much more help, and I would like to have

seen a cumulative impact assessment, which did not happen, but we will

find out in the next two years. this is short-sighted, if you're

looking just to cut the welfare bill, have disabled people put into

stress, losing benefits and ending up in crisis, so be it?

Disability Living Allowance has been in place for 20 years. All the

major parties agree that the kids to be reformed and reviewed,

particularly with the changes in attitudes. Do you need to reassess

people like Karen, who has a sight problem that is not going to

change? I understand that. It is a sensitive area. But, the people who

are currently on Disability Living Allowance, the vast majority of

them are not going to be assessed or have changed or at least two

years. While we see what happens with the new personal independence

payment, which is concentrating on helping people live independent

lives, concentrating on those in greatest need of help. What will

happen is, this will come in in 2014, the Government are going to

review his progress before we do anything brother with those who are

currently on Disability Living Do you think the Government is

having to clear up the mess that you left? When we left the benefits

bill had gone down by �7.5 billion. With Disability Living Allowance,

the Government is saying that it is going to a regime that is going to

save us, 500,000 people not been able to migrate on to that. They

have decided to make cuts, so the assessments have got to match that

cut. I think they might have got it the wrong way round. The people who

are going to suffer are those who are the most adorable. But the

welfare bill is huge. -- the most vulnerable. Every single change,

you will pause. Nobody is saying that there should not be some kind

of assessment regime for Disability Living Allowance, but do the

assessments and fit the budget accordingly. You do not make a cup

of �2 billion, and say to 500,000 people, they are not going to be

able to have the personal independence payment. Tanni Grey-

Thompson, have you got evidence that the Government is picking on

people, on David disabled? It is not as simple as that. The system

has to be simplified, it has to be better, it has to save money. I do

not think they have got the assessment process correct. 40% of

appeals are successful. We need to do more to get the assessment right.

Although one in six of the population has a disability, only a

handful of our MPs are disabled. And it seems despite the success of

the likes of Jack Ashley and David Blunkett, their political

representation hasn't really improved substantially in recent

years. The same appears to be true in our town halls. So what would it

take to persuade more disabled people to put themselves up for

election? Lynne Jefferies is a well-known face around York. She

has campaigned on disability issues for 20 years. Labour offered her

the chance to stand for the city council two years ago. After some

thought, she said yes. I thought that if I was a councillor, that

might make a difference, been part of the party machine rather than

something outside. But last year, she quit the Labour group. She felt

she was not being allowed to speak up on the issues she cares about.

There was an attitude that disabled people are people that you do

things for. And that is what councillors generally miss,

people's experience of being a disabled person is so valuable. In

terms of policy making. She remains on the council as an independent.

But she's one of only a smattering of disabled councillors in the

north. Steve Wilkinson is that kind of person you can imagine entering

politics. A campaigner on disabled access, but as for running for

office, he is not interested. of a first-past-the-post system.

You're either going to hear the concerns of the Lib Dems or UKIP,

or you will become independent and if I did, I would not be elected. I

would not be able to represent the people that I did. Some believe

that change is possible. I think that the person has got to be there,

got to be supported, and in certain areas of their home life, but over

the years, things will change, and we will get a much better mix.

Those who have made it into politics believe attitudes to

disabled people amongst parties will be harder to overcome than any

physical barriers. What's of the barriers start because councillors

do not engage properly with disabled people and unless we tried

to do that we will not get people wanting to be councillors, to be

honest. Tanni Grey-Thompson, you got into politics in any unusual

way, but what do you think stops more disabled people getting into

politics? A number of things. Often they do not know how to go about it.

I am a crossbencher. I am in a privileged position to be able to

see my mind and nobody can tell me off, for that. I was not elected.

When we had a debate about how the Lords would be reformed, the only

way I would be able to stand for election is as an independent and

that is almost impossible to do. But many of the public are switched

off by politics in general because it seems to be quite antagonistic.

And most people want to be more collaborative, I think. It would

you accept that political parties sure some of the blame? -- share.

They share some of the blame but should also share some of the

credit. Since I became an end p 35 years ago things have changed

dramatically in terms of the attitudes displayed towards

encouraging people with disability to get into public office. I have

seen a dramatic change in that is all for the good, but we have got

lots more to do. I think there are some good, positive sides to this,

and a major party should do everything possible to encourage

people to join us. What about all disabled shortlists, like you are

all-women shortlists? It is something to consider. You want to

see as many people from as many canes of backgrounds to be involved

in politics, not just party politics. Do you think the party

system is feeling? I think we have got to think on both sides of the

House of Commons were you have got David Blunkett and Ann Begg on the

Labour side, and you have others on the Conservative side making a

great contribution to parliamentary life. Now it's Sunday lunchtime and

I don't know about you but I just fancy one of those delicious beef

ready meals I keep hearing all about on the news. But first let's

tuck into the feast that is the week of politics in 60 seconds.

Full of quality ingredients and not North Cumbria University NHS Trust

and Carlisle is to investigate high mortality rates fall in the

investigation at Stafford hospital. With concerns over horsemeat, when

Newcastle MP asks what is in beefburgers? She says that poorer

families worry most. Is he saying that in some of Fry's a beefburger,

they have to research the entire supply chain rather than relying on

the Government and the Secretary of State? Sedgefield MP Phil Wilson

could be investigated in a row of a Petacci assembly plant. The

Conservative MP says he did not declare �5,700 in donations before

speaking about the project. Ian livery once the Football

Association to give a more to the non-League game. And the Prime

Minister praised Cumbria at a special event in the Commons. David

Cameron said that Cumbria brought back happy memories of swimming in

Ullswater. I bet he was freezing. Let's talk about this complaint

that has been picked in. -- put in. About accepting money from Petacci?

We had a anniversary dinner in November and Petacci agreed to be

one of the sponsors. That edition was accepted in accordance with

parliamentary rules. The parliamentary authorities were

advised, every step of the way and it is fully transparent. What has

happened is the Conservative headquarters have heard about it

and tried to create some mischief. The complaint is that you asked

questions in the Commons. I have made one speech. On 30th January,

on Europe, in which I mentioned Petacci, and before I made the

speech by spoke to the parliamentary authorities about,

should I make a declaration, and I was advised not to. And that's

about it from us. We're off for our half-term break next week but we'll

be back on March 3 - when the MPs for Hexham and Easington will be