12/05/2013 Sunday Politics Northern Ireland


Andrew Neil and Mark Carruthers with the latest political news, interviews and debate, guests include defence secretary Philip Hammond.

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We'll hear Boris Johnson's advice to our politicians on Corporation Tax.


And we're discussing striking the right balance between protest and


Apology for the loss of subtitles for 1935 seconds


promotion at the G8. Join me in half say on Northern Ireland. He was in


Ballymena last week to pick up his Boris buses and business editor in


Fitzpatrick caught up with him to find out what he thinks about


Northern Ireland. You believe in devolution and more powerful London.


Should there be more powerful regions like this? I certainly want


London to be able to do what we need to do, especially buying new buses


like this one. They have done a fantastic job. You are campaigning


for extra powers for London, store mod is interested in that too. You


would have to look at the issues that the tax competitiveness


questions and the cost. I am not so much interested in things that would


be costing the Treasury money. What we need in London is stable and


continuous financing, it is more about certainty than quantum. We


need to predict that London will get �1.8 billion a year over a long


period to invest in transport infrastructure. The fatal mistake


has been that we do stop start, stop start. It is less about making money


off the Treasury and stability. What is your advice to store mod? I would


hesitate. It's important that if you want to persuade the Treasury of


anything, persuade them to save money. That's the only way forward.


Or that it is revenue neutral or the way to make the oven fly is to say


if you devolve us this power or this tax, we will grow the economy in


such a way to deliver more revenue. It is about getting the Treasury


more money. And one thing that has stalled progress on some issues like


devolution of Corporation Tax has been issues of Scottish


independence. Should Westminster worry about what is going north of


border? The Scottish independence thing will be radically revolt --


resolved in favour of the UK. think there is a case for devolved


government having the ability to raise locally what they spend


locally. That must make sense in a devolution settlement. You will not


persuade the Treasury of that, you will not persuade the Treasury of


that unless they can see it is revenue neutral or it will deliver


such a growth in revenues as to be positive for them. What about


Europe, the only part of the UK with a land border with the eurozone and


now a debate on Europe is hotting up. If things don't go well... You


need an exit strategy because you cannot go into negotiations where


the bottom line is surrender. need to be able to walk away. It has


changed in my lifetime. I do not feel that it is as much an


existential question for Britain whether we are members of the


European Union, we are part of the global economy. This us, to drag the


subject back to what matters, this bus we will sell to markets in Asia.


And that is where the growth is coming in the world and you should


think globally. What about for the Conservative party, not a big force


in Northern Ireland, hasn't had much success growing the base. Nor has


the Labour Party! They have tried a bit harder. What would you do to


energise voters here? I think there are long and complicated reasons why


that has never taken off. I don't want particularly to insert myself


into politics here in Northern Ireland except to say how pleased


and proud I am that we have been able to investment through DFL to


get the best bus in the world is coming from Northern Ireland, it has


British technology and is delivering jobs. Finally, London Olympics, a


huge success. We have a big event coming here. What is your advice? Do


not listen to the Gloomadon-poppers. I am sure it will go Apsley


swimmingly. It will go swimmingly. Let's get some reaction from my


guests, Alex Kane and Cathy Gormley-Heenan from University of


Ulster. Gloomadon-poppers seems to be a word Boris Johnson is


preaching, a one-man campaign. It is a pity because the word can mean


many things to many people. It would have been useful on Thursday night


to refer to the guests then as Gloomadon-poppers. It is something I


will pick up and try to run with. Will it make its way into your


column? I will try to claim it as my own! It is an interview where he


didn't say much at all other than buses but he inserts this word and


we have a conversation. No matter what he says, you come away and you


like the guy. That's what he's about. Hats off to write bus for


doing such a remarkable job so the buses on a global stage. Boris


Johnson is a huge ambassador. He is. That is valuable and it's a good


connection between Ballymena and Boris and London and the


Conservative party, good links. Sometimes I listen to Boris talking


about buses and I wish I could hear from the First Minister with the


same enthusiasm and same sense of fun about what business can be like.


The interesting thing is despite Jim Fitzpatrick's best efforts, Boris


Johnson did not say anything about Northern Ireland. I understand that.


He was here in his capacity as Mayor of London. There are things that


suit his own agenda, including the devolution of scat -- tax varying


powers. If he had tied that in better than he did into the


conversation and how it might relate to Corporation Tax, that might have


worked better but he was slightly caught on the hop anti turns the


conversation back to what he wants to talk about by being open. I


suppose the parallel is Corporation Tax if it happens, the reduction in


Corporation Tax comes at a price potentially to the grant, any


changes in taxation for London will also come as part of a risky


strategy. I think that's true. not sure what Boris Johnson is


running with this because Cameron has said nothing will happen until


the Scottish referendum is over. In terms of Northern Ireland, we've


been talking about this for five years. I do not see it happening at


all. More from you in a moment. a smokescreen for a major attack on


civil liberties or a terrific opportunity to showcase Northern


Ireland? Two contrasting views on the G8 summit which takes place in


county Fermanagh next month.This week the Chief Constable unveiled


details of how he's planning to police the expected protests


surrounding the summit... We are expecting demonstrations in


Belfast. There was one planned in relation to cracking. There will be


demonstrations voicing concerns about property and we expect


something in Ellis Killin as well. There will be a number of


demonstrations as is normal with any event. In terms of the numbers


coming and the size, I think that is a work in progress and we are


monitoring it carefully. Clearly the ridiculous planning draws upon the


experience of previous G8 summits and what that looked like and the


numbers. It looks at their current situation in terms of global issues


and protests and we have planned for every eventuality. So, our job is to


facilitate legitimate lawful protest, if others choose to come


here with a different purpose we will be prepared and equipped. That


is why we are working closely with the Met Police with their


experience. Matt Baggott. Business leaders welcomed the potential


benefits of the G8 predicting a significant boost for tourism and


investment. Had we ensure we get the balance between promotion and


protest, with me are Eamon McCann and Ian Coulter from the CBI. Ian


Coulter, why is the G8 good for Northern Ireland? In 2002, Alberta


in Canada generated 200 million US dollars to the local economy


short-term. 2005, Gleneagles 750 million sterling benefits. At the


moment, the numbers are not to be sniffed at. We believe there is good


short-term and long-term gains economic league and how we are


perceived. Were there signs of the investment in Northern Ireland with


less than a month to go? No, it is not as simple as that. The


investment comes over 12 months from tourism, retail and hospitality. It


starts from after the G8. In the run-up to the summit, any signs of


benefit to your members? I am sure there are small businesses in


Fermanagh seeing benefits -- seeing benefits already. Over time you will


see more. This is a mid-to long-term plan. How could you argue against


that? I question the basis of the figures. The main beneficiaries will


be hoteliers and hospitality industry and good luck to them in


the short-term. The figures for long-term improvement and economic


prospects are questionable. You quoted in Italy and Canada, you will


find that the calculations are off extra money and growth based on


media coverage. That is speculative as to whether it is a real figure or


not. People imagine the tourism industry will develop because people


will see the lovely lakes and landscapes, what they will not say


-- they will not see that. They will see it but they will not focus on


it. I am not sure they will see it because the news bulletins in the US


and Europe will focus on the policy matters and how to coordinate


austerity programmes and what they would do about arms spending,


probably nothing. It is policy matters which are the constant face


on the media not the beauties of Fermanagh. I do not think there'll


be a long-term improvement in the economy. I do not expect it. That's


interesting because if you look at Italy, who knows where that is?


don't disagree. It is a short-term initiative, is it better to have it


than not? Yes. Will it fix endemic problems? Of course not. On the


perception issue, if we think back, this is probably the most global


coverage Northern Ireland gets since the Good Friday Agreement. How sure


are you that Eamon McCann will spoil the party? They won't.There is


always protest at the G8. It will be managed. The G8 will come and go and


there will be a positive message going out. Are you happy for that


happen or do you want to try to spoil the party? It is not a


question of spoiling the party. believe there was a right to protest


and it is necessary to protest against the G8. They represent the


ruling classes of the world, they are most responsible for the


appalling state of the world is in, threats to environment, war zones,


and the RUC has obtained two drones without any discussion. Of


course... These are not the drones used in Pakistan. They will not be


used like that to drop bombs on Fermanagh as far as we know! There


is no suggestion of that. It is remarkable these measures, these


security measures are supported by a party which a week ago objected to


children's playgrounds opening on Sunday. It is better to be prepared


for a problem. It is forward planning in case of difficulty.


is overhyped. I was at Gleneagles, a vast security apparatus. There was


no violence at all. There were no raised fists. They were helicopters


overhead, drones, special courts open. The British police coming in.


I do not believe the measures will go away with Barack Obama. A couple


of points there but too much security is his charge and who knows


if it will all be dismantled at the end? The leaders of the world are


coming, of course there is security. We do not have the luxuries to talk


about -- we have unemployed people, anything that can be done to credit


jobs and opportunities should be grabbed and it will be grabbed. Stay


with us because I want to hear from our commentators. Do you think a


balance can be struck between protest and promotion? Absolutely


but what we are seeing is a diversion of focus away from what


the G8 is about, many people do not know what the key aims of G8 are.


Trade, transparency, tax, the agenda on the table. The local and national


media have not refocused in much on the issues that these world leaders


will be talking about and there's too much emphasis on the potential


benefits to the place or the threat of protest. It doesn't help the


economy or the tourist industry to say come to Northern Ireland, your


prison bed awaits having put the measures in place. I think if the


focus shifts to the key issues it will politicise people in a positive


way and we are not seeing that. Do you think it helps to sell Northern


Ireland and the G8 to people here and on a world stage to have Obama


coming? Or is it irrelevant? I fit into the Boris description of the


Gloomadon-poppers. I really don't see what the difference is. The big


issues should be discussing here in the local papers and they are not.


He is right, you should protest, these are big issues, these are the


eight most powerful men in the world who have made horrendous decisions,


morally and politically but also they bring trillions of debt and say


they will solve it and isn't Fermanagh lovely? It doesn't matter


what happens, MTV, YouTube, it is great to Northern Ireland but they


go away and nothing, the dreary steeples are back. You have to


remember the word, it is Gloomadon-poppers. I made up my own


word. Is Obama coming to Belfast helping from your perspective?


big point is we should not be trying to affect things we cannot control


globally, how can we leveraged the conference to grow Northern Ireland


and put it in the best place possible to get youth employment up.


You talk about Obama, 12,000 jobs from foreign investment, much it


from the US. Will we see that between now and the G8? Is a good we


have a US leader here in a positive light, it is positive. Let's deal


with it and grab the opportunity. Positive or reservations about the


Obama trip? Huge reservations about the trip. Obama has over 100 people


on hunger strike in Guantanamo Bay, more than half have been cleared for


release by the American authorities. They are being tortured, I hope


there will be placard saying support he hunger strikers. We will leave it


there. We will come back to this in the next few weeks. Politics is


often a fine balancing act as one minister found out, it is all in 60


seconds with Martina Purdy. The future of care homes and


children's heart surgery, the story that will not go away. Edwin Poots


showing the strain when he appeared before the health committee.


Together building a united community, the First Minister and


Deputy First Minister revealed community relations strategy. This


is the most ambitious set of proposals that have been brought


forward. But far from united, the other parties felt excluded by the


DUP and Sinn Fein. I didn't know anything about it until it was


announced today. The health Minister and his southern counterpart white


united in a search for cross-border solutions even if James Riley did


not look steady on his feet. And the new party, no name but high hopes,


Martina Purdy reporting on spills and drop catches for the


politicians. A final word from Cathy and Alex. Shared future was the big


issue at the end of the week, proposals from the ministers,


useful, did they move us forward? Did not move us anywhere,


integration and shared society to something else and every time they


change the make -- name they are in the same place. They have now


electoral dividend but they have a dividend financially in pretending


they are doing something. We have a new strategy, building a united


community together. You have written about this, you have talked about


this, you have recently compiled a report for the office of the First


Minister and Deputy First Minister, does it take us forward? And we're


not dealing with a critical issues will stop we will be and I don't


want to be a Gloomadon-poppers to keep the phrase going, I do think


anything is better than nothing. what we have is a start, we will see


the strategy into more weeks. We can look at the detail and have


something to build on, the fact Obama is coming, if there is one


positive thing, that can galvanise public sentiment and support for


moving things forward. I am not so fussy on the detail of 10,000 places


here and 100 students in summer placements, that sort of detail, I


am more interested in what will be independent chaired working group


look like and who will it be because it cannot be someone party political


and what they plan to do to push the agenda forward? Finally, Alex, the


Andrew Neil and Mark Carruthers with the latest political news, interviews and debate, guests include defence secretary Philip Hammond.

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