29/01/2012 Sunday Politics South West

Hello and welcome to the Sunday Politics in the South West. Coming

Taking away free bus travel from pensioners, the leader of Cornwall

Council will be here to defend his controversial proposal.

This week we are joined by Anne- Marie Morris, the Conservative MP

for Newton Abbot, and the Labour MP for Plymouth Moor View Alison

Seabeck. Anne-Marie is currently on the look out for musicians in her

constituency interested in entering the annual parliamentary music

competition Rock the House. She has been rocking the house herself this

week with a debate devoted to microbusinesses, a cause that is

close to her heart. Not a great week for businesses for

the economy with the GDP figures. They were disappointing but not

disappointing. I think that we have to focus on what we do now to

ensure that we keep this growth steadily growing. We need to ensure

that we keep regulation, which is a real problem, and we need to see

what we can do on the tax front. While the Prime Minister was

defending pairs of figures, there was a tweed from Alison pointing

out that Eton mess was being served. It is quite easy to point across

the government benches and say that regardless of the eurozone crisis

we have been making a better job of the economy. Yes, but that is not

what we should be doing. I have worked behind the scenes and of

what you have to do is ensure that you do not over promise. -- and

what you have to do in his ensure that you do not over promise.

Bodies like the IMF have concerns about the level of austerity

measures which are being imposed on the British people. By the time I

scurried across the road to get the Eton mess all of the meringue were

gone. UN Tuesday, the Health Select

Committee has said that -- on Tuesday, the Health Select

Committee has said that his ability to safeguard its future is being

compromised. The Lib Dem MP Andrew George is

urging the government to listen to medics and their mounting

opposition to the planned changes to the NHS. There has been hardly a

day this week when the Health and Social Care Bill has not been in

the headlines, with a critical report saying the overhaul was

getting in the way of finding savings to safeguard the future of

the service. The medical profession has been uniting in its opposition

to health care changes but there is a feeling in Cornwall that

ministers are not taking any notice. I do not have any trust in the

government about the NHS. I say that varies subtly. Unfortunately -

- I say that very sadly, because they have not been listening to the

Royal College of Nurses or any of the GPs who are leading the reforms,

and they certainly have not listened to patient. The NHS is

going through the biggest reorganisation in its history.

Under new plans, but it will be managed in local areas, a job that

used to be done by primary care trusts. There will be competition

from charity and private providers. At the same time, �20 billion in

savings have to be found by 2015. Some patients believe it that

digger will see to be played in commissioning the services. -- some

patients believe that there needs to be more accountability when it

comes to commissioning these services. But it is the idea of

private sector in the NHS that were raised this doctor. The remain just

of this Bill is -- the main gist of this Bill is that doctors will have

concerns that this will lead to all sorts of inequalities and we are

worried about services being fragmented and broken up and

providers coming in and cherry- picking the best services.

Ministers say they will safeguard against privatisation. They also

say that financial pressures caused by a Labour and disapproval of

pension changes are the real reasons for the backlash.

The South West has been a focus for rebellion against the plans, what

Adrian Sanders and Andrew George among cost only for her MPs against

the Bill -- among cooler four MPs against the Bill. This is the

largest amount of money we have ever had to cut from the NHS and we

have to do more things and use less money but you need stability and

uncertain -- certainty. You do not need to have a catastrophe going on

in the NHS at the same time what the whole world being turned upside

down. But despite backbench unease over

the Bill, this week, David Cameron continued to defend it. The error

thousands of GPs across the country -- the there are thousands of GPs

across the country who are implementing these reforms. Last

year Nick Clegg claimed victory after the Government backed down on

some of the reforms. Next month, the Bill will return to the Lords,

and attention will return to the Lib Dems to see if any of them will

make renewed attempts to block the Bill.

Emery, this is turning into a I do not think I would agree that

this is a disaster. I think the real challenge to the NHS is that

it is a centre at issue and we need to make sure that we communicate

but we are doing in an appropriate way and that is one of the problems.

I think that is why we are where we are. We have an ageing population

and we have to make sure that we have an NHS for the future. A lot

of people are saying it is not doing very badly and does not need

to be turned upside down. reality is that the costs are

soaring and there have been changes as far as what is available. We

have an ageing population and if we do not address this now we will put

ourselves in a difficult position for the future. When you talk about

change, up most of the change is taking place. These new

commissioning bodies are already there and working and a budget is

being held by the PC 80s. If I can give you a personal example, I used

to chair a committee when I was a councillor, and I used to find that

having a PC tea meant that I did not get the same focus on the real

local means that I believe these counselling groups can do at a

reduced cost. Alison, Labour is the last -- Labour is saying the last

thing the NHS needs his reorganisation. There is a lesson

to be learned. We were saying this in the last Parliament. A number of

people were saying that we do not need any more reorganisation and

the Prime Minister felt the same way. He pledged that there would be

no reorganisation and the first thing they did was re organise it

at a time when the economy is in a downward spiral and morale is

damaged. Morale is at rock-bottom. We are seeing waiting lists going

up and we have bodies like the BMA and the Royal College of midwives,

who I was only with this week, and they are all saying this is wrong.

I suspect that when it is discussed in the house we will see very

strong opposition to it from a number of different angles. I hope

the Government does listen. Murray, Andrew George says that GPs

are were accountable and the coalition was proposing elected

board members who would be elected by the Government into primary care

trusts. I think the answer is that they are not accountable. They are

responsible to the overall commissioning Board. There is

accountability and responsibility. At the end of the day, what are we

trying to deliver? A good service that we can afford. We have got

4,000 new GPs' and the waiting list time has come down. There has been

some significant benefit. It has only been a few years since

the over-60s bus pass was added to a list of life's certainties. But

now there its an idea that there could be a charge of 50p per ride.

Cornwall cows will's idea to charge pensioners 50 p per ride has were

fired some. -- Cornwall Council. This is bad. It has to be stopped

now. It will be back across the country if they get away with it.

The free bus pass was brought in by Labour, and from the start,

councillors from across the region have complained about its funding.

Government initially said they would be funding this scheme. They

have introduced a scheme that does not work and his leading places

like Exeter very short. Now, in Devon and Dorset, councillors are

having to cut around �1 million from their annual budgets.

Transport campaigners have said that that is because funding has

been cut by nearly one-third. Government cuts the funding and the

it has been squeezed, the budget, and some ministers are saying they

have had to put their hands into other parts of money which should

be used to help fix roots and other parts of the transport service.

Cornwall Council says it will have to start cutting bus services in

two years' time unless it is a large -- allowed to charge

pensioners 50p per ride. Some pensioners think it is a sensible

idea. I would rather pay full fare and have a bus then lose a bus.

Such tinkering with the over-60s scheme would need a change in the

law, and that does not look likely. In East Yorkshire, a voluntary

charge was tried out, but it did not work out. Ministers say that

some councils are planning to deal with the cuts using a little bit at

imagination, but it seems the, all idea is not quite what they are

looking for. I understand the idea. It is not an unreasonable idea. We

think we could put people off travelling by bus if we use this

idea. The Government has just put �90 million into a national

community transport fund and says that pensioners like Thomas need to

be confident that the free bus pass they get today will be the same as

they get next year. But others worry about how useful that pass

will be if writs are shut down to pay for it. -- if it runs are shut

down. We cannot speak to the reader of

Cornwell Council. One man said -- we can now speak to the leader of

Cornwall Council. One man said this was mad and bad. This was a

suggestion that came from the very pensioners who were using these

buses. How representative is this group? The big question in people's

minds, knowing that the government funding is coming down to support

this scheme, is that bus routes are threatened. People do not want to

lose theirs. What is the point of a free bus pass it there is no bus to

use it on? We are hearing this from all over the country, that people

would rather pay a small amount they have no bass. What do you make

of your own government's answer to this? We have to use all of the

imagination and solve this in different ways. We are suggesting a

pilot scheme at the moment. It does not look as though it will happen,

does it? We will be pushing for it. There is a strong argument to keep

pushing for it because Cornwall is in a stronger position than most

local authorities. We sat a four your budget strategy and we have

put money into reserves. We will be using reserves to support our bus

services in the short term for the next two years. That is exactly

what we are going to do. Government is not very welcoming of

this proposal. Emery, you have got local government experience. There

is no doubt that you sympathise. Is the government right to say that

they should use their imagination? I think they should go away and

think about it. The honest answer is that we are in different times

and have a significant that that we have to deal with and we have to be

creative. There has been a lot of cross working in Devon between the

local authority and local charities and local people. I think there are

creative ways. The Isle of Wight has come up with a very creative

way. This is creative. Yes, it is creative, and I empathise with what

people are saying. But I just feel that you could not differentiate

between those in need and those not in need. If I was going to do

something on a voluntary basis, I would create a charity. There could

be a bus pot. I know it has been tried in other areas. There had

been a areas that have tried it and have not been allowed to continue.

This will have to be addressed in a number of ways. We will be able to

buy some time in Cornwall to be creative. We need to roll out

community schemes. Other authorities will not be able to do

that. They do not have at the level of reserves and they have not

budgeted the way that we have. I see bus services Britain all over

the country, particularly in areas that will affect the coalition

government, and I think the Government will have to look at all

of the options. The primary legislation at the moment is too

restrictive. Another localism agenda, we should be allowing local

people to find their own solutions. Before the recession, Labour

brought in an agenda at that authorities said, the Government

has given us the responsibility but not the money. If it was an

affordable then it will be an affordable now. Local authorities

and pensioners are Between a Rock and a hard place on this one. They

have had their tax benefits cast -- cut. It will hit some areas hardest.

Pensioners and charities like a UK are deeply worried. I understand

why you were thinking about this. But this will hit the most of

marble and poorest the hardest. I would be surprised if the treasurer

changed his mind. We will have to look for exemptions where we can.

Now for a round-up of the political week in 60 seconds.

And the Academy of Royal Medical Colleges is holding a summit. We

have It's been a thoroughly energised Week as the South West

was declared Britain's first Marine Energy Park.

Anti-nuclear campaigners have been getting their teeth into plans to

expand Hinkley Point. The sun broke through for people

hoping to get generous subsidies to generate solar power. The

government wanted to slash the payments by half from last December.

Now the Appeal Court says the Energy Minister will have to think

again. Or will he? We were disappointed with this result,

clearly. The Secretary of State is now clear that we will take this to

the Supreme Court. The economic prospect was decidedly

cloudy as the Centre for Cities declared Plymouth one of the worst

places in the country for losing private sector jobs.

In Exeter, though, one of the city's oldest trades,

ecclesiastical tailoring, proved it's still as vibrant as ever.

have been having a clerical fashion crisis!

But about the way this has been handled, Anne Marie? I believe that

this is a great scheme but the way it was handled in terms of the

termination at such short did us, I agree with you... It should have

been foreseen. It could have been done the from the. We need to get

help for energy because it has to be one of the most important

sources going for it to solve our problem. Labour set it up, should

they have foreseen that this would have been unaffordable? I think

governments always have a responsibility to look for word

when it comes to the cost of a programme. It is an incredibly

valuable programme. There have been small set-ups and some large

proposals. I am surprised that the Government is going to spend even

more tax payer money on taking this right to the bitter end, to the

wire. I think it makes more sense now to say, let's go with it,