30/06/2013 Sunday Politics South West

In the South West: Our rural schools are told they'll get a fair

slice of the funding cake, but the Chancellor is yet to respond to

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 1927 seconds

calls for the police to get the Hello, I'm Martyn Oates. Coming up

on the Sunday Politics in the South West: The sun has got his hat on

and he's coming out to play. Ministers plan to give him more

solar farms to play with. Others say we're spoiling him with

too many toys - and spoiling the countryside as well. And for the

next 20 minutes, I'm joined by the Conservative MP Sheryll Murray and

the Labour peer Ann Mallalieu. The Chancellor's spending review is, of

course, the main event for us this week. But we're beginning with

Sheryll Murray's good deeds. According to a political magazine

she's one of the most courteous MPs at Westminster and a great one for

opening doors for her colleagues. Do you think you are unusual?

don't. Everybody I have come across in the House of Commons and the

House of Lords are the same as I am. You just automatically behave

courteously and sometimes I may not but I don't know. There may be a

few people who don't but I am very grateful to this particular group

of researchers who wrote to this magazine. But I don't think I

behaved unusually. And it is particularly civilised at the Lords

end, isn't it? But could you can meet somebody the other way and

very often they look straight through you and you are not sure

whether they are defective in vision or hearing but within the

chamber people are courteous and the staff are unfailingly courteous

even in the face of severe provocation. And we will not

mention the people who get black marks.

On Wednesday the Chancellor announced that the government is

finally planning to change the school funding formula to bring

more money to pupils in places like the South West. But council leaders

and police commissioners were disappointed to find their

financial concerns had fallen on deaf ears as Mr Osborne drew up his

latest spending review. Jenny Kumah reports.

Four years, Devon schools have been amongst the lowest funded in the

country. This year, the government will spend �4,000 educating a Devon

child but it will spend twice as much schooling a youngster in

London. But hope is on the horizon. The lowest funded local authorities

in this country will at last received an increase in their per

pupil funding as we introduce a national funding formula to ensure

no child in any part of our country is discriminated against. The day

after this review, the Education Secretary visited them and -- Devon

to hammer home the good news. the spring of 2015, the and --

historical unfairness will end. It is really good news that you have a

Coalition government determined to recognise the unique needs of

students, particularly the poorest students, in a part of the country

that has been under Sturt so far. But there was also disappointment

that the government has not recognise the unique challenges of

the police which is facing a cut. We are in a position which is

fragile over policing. If we have to take further cuts, it will drive

neighbourhood policing down and will result in further cuts in

policing. The force has to cope with high visitor numbers in the

holidays and the commissioner argues it is not just rural schools

that need a fairer slice of the cake. There may be a political

aspect to the reason Brits schools but I am here to look after the

effectiveness of our police and I will lobby as hard as education, if

not harder. Councils that look after rural areas are also feeling

rejected. We are not getting a fair share. If you live on the boundary

of our district with premise you are getting 178 - Mar �170 per head

worse off and that has not been reflected today. The Conservative

leader of Devon once the cut will be more painful here. Our concern

as the district council is that we may find the cut is bigger than 10%

because the Chancellor has given an undertaking that he will protect

the social care budget and that facility is delivered by unitary

authorities. To protect them, I suspect he will do something more

than 10% reduction. The Coalition MPs have been falling over

themselves to celebrate the score funding announcement and some are

already asking whether ministers will apply the same logic elsewhere.

So far, the Chancellor's answer has been brief. Yes.

The Chancellor ending that report. Isn't this evidence that the

Coalition government is delivering for places like the rural south-

west? They are promising to deliver and other promises haven't shown

results on the banned -- ground and high-speed broadband is one of them.

We were told it was all happening and it hasn't. I am encouraged by

what Michael Gove had to say and encouraged by what is said about

what will happen by 2015 and I hope it does. Everybody is squealing

about the cuts and the police obviously ask wheeling. As a former

lawyer I am squealing about the effective dismantling of the

independent Bar and the legal-aid system. But I hope that caps that

have to be made will be made in such a way that front line police

are preserved if at all possible. I do not believe there are

administrative cuts they could still be made. Looking at the

school funding issue, I can see there is an argument that it is

rather late in the day, but I am sure some would say it comes after

a decade of the Labour government doing nothing. When I am lucky

enough to be asked on this programme, you always take an

aggressive line... But you are right in that rural areas have been

ignored for years. Areas like the south-west have received a poor cut

of the cake and I think that particular piece of the

announcement yesterday is something we all celebrate and we hope it

happens. You must be quite relieved that something is being done on

schools because you have all of these other areas where the party

of the countryside, as you often present yourself, hasn't done

anything? I can remember being elected to Cornwall County Council

in 2001 and it was the last Labour government that changed the way the

funding was allocated. They took away the rurality payments for a

lot of things and looked at ethnicity or population. This is

the problem. I think there is broad consensus on that, but your

government has dragged its heels, hasn't it? This might squeak in, we

are told, before the next election. I fully believe that Michael Gove

will do this. We have started with the people premium but you have to

be fair to all schools and those having a massive amount of funding

for... You have to allow them time to adjust. I am delighted. I know

schools will be hard pushed between now and 2015 and I will press to

make sure that the pain is lessened. What about the pain for the police?

They have not got this sort of bright horizon to look forward to.

How many officers might we lose? have seen Tony Hogg in place for a

year. I am yet to be convinced, and die except that what he might be

saying is correct. If he can show me that he has cut every single

area of office savings that he has been able to make than I will go to

the Home Secretary. Are you sceptical? He has been in post for

a year, a short time but I am yet to be convinced there it isn't any

more fat that can be trimmed. We are in the middle of an economic

situation that is unprecedented. Everybody has to take pain. If Tony

Hogg can show me that he really cannot cut anything else I will go

to the Home Secretary and say, this is unfair. There is a challenge to

him then. I don't want to dwell on Labour's past, I want to look at

the future. The Conservatives and Lib Dems are saying what would you

do in this situation and stop talking about our record in

government? The reality is at the moment that, as the ministers when

they left said, There isn't any money and whatever government is in

power they will have to make cuts. There will be differences in

priorities. Under benefits, some things are happening that are

working very badly and wrongly and depriving people who are really in

need. But the bulk of these cuts would have been made, in my own

view, whoever would have been in power. On the issue of council

funding in general. Geoffrey Cox in Torridge and West Devon says he's -

- his two district councils are fighting to survive. Does that cut

the mustard? Eric Pickles is an expert in local government.

knows more about local council than they do themselves. He comes from

local government and there are brilliant examples of Conservative-

run administrations having made the savings and been a very good. What

I would say to people like West Devon, look at partnership working

and working with other councils. They already do in the South Hams.

These are your fellow Conservatives running councils disagreeing with

you and saying, we do that job and there isn't any more fat. I have

just spent three or four years with a Conservative lead council in

Cornwall and each individual portfolio holder was writing to me

saying, government have cut our funding. Actually, one of the

biggest problems is councillors have had a Labour government for 12

years who dictated to them out to spend their money. They have to get

used to working themselves. A let us step out of the time machine

finally. The day after the spending The day after the Spending Review

the Government tried to cheer us all up by talking about its

investment plans. There was good news for the region's renewable

energy companies with new guarantees on the price they get

for wind and solar electricity. But some, including both my guests,

remain sceptical about the impact solar farms are having on the South

West's landscape, as Janine Jansen reports.

Fields covered in plastic. Or are they? Actually, no. They are solar

panels. Solar farms are on the increase, especially in Cornwall.

They are controversial and they are making headlines. This week, the

government reiterated its plans to have renewables Paris 30% of that

energy by 2020. This Solar farm has sprung up outside weight bridge. It

is run by a German company, Belectrice Solar, and they play --

pay ground rent to the farmer. He says when it has been seeded he

will graze he/she pay. But locals say there has been a lot of

opposition to the solar farm. a blight. It is very sad. It is on

the ridge line and you can see it for about 10 mind -- 10 miles. It

is a terrific shame. It is prime agricultural land. The best to get

in Cornwall. So it is what is described as the best and most

versatile. The council's own policies were not to use it for

renewables but that was over ridden. At the time of need for food and

not imported food but locally grown food, it is a waste. I went to meet

the farmer who says he has not lost much agricultural land. I have

sheep in and under the panel's. It is midsummer now, but in the winter

when we are Lamming, the baby lambs are under the panels. It is lovely

for them. The baby ones are sheltered. It is all good. I don't

agree with the loss of farmland. They could be a very small loss,

maybe 5%, because we have a small workings and an electric house. But

in the context of loss, that is small. Andrew showed me around his

small solar farm at home. It powers or the electricity for his farm

cottages, but the new 36 acre site has yet to be grassed over. Land

management around the panel's is something scientists are keen to

explore. We are interested in looking how animal biodiversity and

flowers can be enhanced. You have seen animals crazy underneath some

and that is acceptable. But in a larger site, we could look at

creating habitat features that might encourage bees or pollinators

or floral diversity encouragement at no extra cost to the developers.

In the UK, about 75% of Solar panels are located on the rooftops.

But the south-west is different. Here, the ratio is closer to 50/50.

In the past three years, more than 150 Solar farms have been developed

in the UK and just over 100 in the south-west. Scientists say Cornwall

is the best place in the world for Solar energy as it has sun and rain,

vital to keep the panel's clean and working efficiently.

And we're joined by a director from the company which owns the 36 acre

solar farm we saw in the film, Toddington Harper.

I will begin with you. You are sceptical, to say the least. It is

a difficult position for a Cornish MP, isn't it? A lot of poor people

in the Cornish county think it has huge potential to improve life.

am sceptical of Solar fields. I turned on a Solar a raid at a major

employee and retail outlet in my constituency a few weeks ago and it

is on the roof of the building. Nobody knows it is there and it

produces one-third of its energy consumption. When he needs it

during daylight hours, that is and that is ideal. What we shouldn't be

doing is to actually cover it green fields with sober panels, unless it

has local by Ian. We should introduce the same restrictions as

far as planning in -- is concerned as we have seen for wind turbines.

Would you accept the best place for them is the rooves of buildings?

would agree that putting panels on rooves is a good idea. It is

something our company is involved in as well. To briefly correct the

comment. I am a UK individual and Belectrice Solar is a company which

has a German to parent company. It is important to bring into context

why people build solar farms in the UK. The headlines have been clear

this week. By 2015, the UK faces blackouts and we have lost 5% of

our generating capacity and we are losing a further 20%. By generating

capacity, there is almost no margin. Can you understand are planning

concern though? In a situation where you have to jump through all

kinds of hoops to build a small extension to your house but you can

shove these spreads over a huge areas of countryside? It is not as

simple as that. It is relatively easy to do it. And that is the

point. The committee has to agree they won the solar farm to be given

permission. It has been overturned in a number of circumstances around

the country so it is not as straightforward as you suggest to

get planning permission. Mallalieu you are sceptical as well.

Do you accept there are a lot of checks and balances? I'm very

sceptical about the whole business of the announcement yesterday and I

expect it is a sop for Hinckley Point, the nuclear plant that will

now get the go-ahead. We are in the mess we are because people did not

have the courage to grasp what was essential, they need for... You are

concerned about the development of these farms on greenfield areas.

You are the President of the Countryside Alliance. It was

striking looking at the that report to see sheep grazing under these

apparently insubstantial panels. It looks like agriculture and solar

energy can work side-by-side, doesn't it? I wonder how long they

will stay up when the sheep start rubbing themselves on them. It was

interesting to see and I wonder... Clearly, and she can praise below

and around. The argument that it is dealing agricultural land doesn't

apply. People's perception of the countryside is important in an area

where visitors come here for that reason. They complain already about

Fields of plastic and I have sympathy with farmers who want to

maximise the return of their land in any way they can but I think

local communities, because they have to look at it, have to be

accepting of it to. You have to listen to them before you do this.

What is in it for the farmers? could add another piece as well. I

will come back to that. What is in it for them is that farming is a

difficult industry, particularly over the last... How much money do

they get? They would get a percentage of revenue which would

be slightly more than they were typically get from farming.

Certainly, not a radical amount more than they would get from

farming. In different areas of the country, if it is sunnier you can

get more money than at their areas of the country. Coming back to the

point on planning, it is important for everyone to be Clear that we

are not actually physically taking away any land. Only 3% of the land

on a solar farm has anything attached to it. The panels are put

on thin pulse. The other percentage of land is used in the same way as

before -- they are placed on thin poles. We are running out of time,

I'm afraid. I would be interested to know whether Toddington agrees

that local people should have a say. OK. We have to go, I'm afraid.

Now our regular round-up of the Delight from business leaders as

ministers talk about removing one of the region's biggest bottle

necks. We think it is great news. The government has been subjected

to significant overtures about the importance of a second artery into

the far south-west and we think it is a vital to our future economy.

But it is just a lot of hot air according to Labour. What is so

disappointing is, after the hype, there is no announcement. It is

looking at a feasibility study and we have done that before. Calls for

a proportion of newly built homes to be reserved for local people.

And another demand for second homes to be subject to planning

permission. And a last-minute deal is struck between insurers and the

government to protect people living with flood risk. Their premiums

will be capped and excess charges will be capped. It will be targeted

to make sure those least able to pay pay the least.

Will we ever see beat A303 duelled. I hope so. Particularly for the

Royal Navy, it is brilliant. Take 40 million of the waste of time