19/02/2012 Sunday Politics South


19/02/2012

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In the South: Can underachieving schools be

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turned around by teaching a fourth R? Lessons in reasoning have been

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Apology for the loss of subtitles for 1730 seconds

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introduced with surprising results Hello. Coming up on the Sunday

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Politics in the South: It may not be on the national

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curriculum, but a school in Southampton says it has boosted its

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Ofsted rating from satisfactory to outstanding by teaching philosophy

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to five-year-olds. More on that later in the programme. First, let

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me introduce you to our two guests who will be with me for the next 20

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minutes. Sandra Gidley is the Former Liberal Democrat MP for

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Romsey and John Glen is the Conservative MP for Salisbury. Do

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you miss being an M P? Less as time goes on. I missed it at first.

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Obviously you don't want to lose your seat. But I am quite glad to

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be out of it at the moment. A lot of decisions are being made that I

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would feel uncomfortable with. It has been quite nice to be back

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doing a job where you have a higher -- high approval rating from the

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public. Will you stand again? don't know. I will wait until the

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boundary review is completed. were selected in an open primary.

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Has that made a difference? gives me more confidence that I was

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selected on a broader basis, but that was a couple of years ago. I

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think we should use them a lot in the run-up to the next election. It

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is a good way to engage with the local community and allow it all

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people to put his bid and make politics real. I was happy that it

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happened that way. You got some headlines a few years ago for

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saying you did not expect to be in line for a ministerial job any time

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soon. You rather put your foot in and. I am enjoying being MP for

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Salisbury. We will see what happens. It has been another bad week for

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the Health Secretary, Andrew Lansley. This e-petition calling

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for the government to drop the highly controversial Health Bill

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comfortably sailed past the hundred thousand signature mark, so it

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could now be eligible for a new debate in Parliament. There has

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also been debate amongst Nick Clegg and his deputy Simon Hughes as to

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how long Mr Lansley should hold on to his job. But it is not just Lib

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Dems at the top of the party who are divided over the bill.

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Grassroots members in Winchester have launched their own national

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online petition against it, urging the leadership to withdraw its

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support. Are you full square behind this

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bill? Absolutely. We need to take out lots of bureaucracy and waste

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in the NHS. We have to make sure that GPs and clinicians to deal

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with people on the front line have a greater role in commissioning

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services people want. That is not what is going to happen. Already,

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the bigger organisations are coming in and offering commissioning

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services. Your average GP has enough to do seeing patients and

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making sure they do right by them. There is a good reason why the

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Royal College of GPs have oppose these moves. Some GPs are

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interested in this but they are not yet trained. I think patients will

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lose out. This puts them in the driving seat for. It does not.

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Small committees of GPs have been elected in large areas so there is

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no relationship between the commissioning process and the grass

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roots. That is just not true. GPs will drive the Commission. You

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have to remember that PCT is account for nearly 70% of the

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deficit in the NHS -- PCTs. This is designed to take out bureaucracy in

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the NHS. The population is increasing. More cures are being

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found. We have to take out as much waste and bureaucracy as possible.

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This will be disruptive and costly. We have to get this legislation on

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the statute book. How have you read the local risk assessment? There

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are always big risks. I have read some of it. There will always be

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vested interests who will resist change. The BMA did not want the

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NHS in the first place. That old chestnut! It is true. It is

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unprecedented for doctors, nurses and health professionals to come

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out against this bill. Locally, my GPs are looking forward to this.

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They want more power. We don't know how it will work out. Many of these

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changes seem to be happening already. Surely everything that

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happens with the health service from now on will be blamed on this

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bill. On the Isle of Wight, operations have been cancelled due

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to lack of money and beds. reality is that Andrew Lansley is

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the right person to take this through and he has signed up and

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committed to these changes. Sometimes in government you have to

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find out -- take responsibility for difficult decisions. It is not

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about difficult decisions, this is the wrong decision. It is quite

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convenient to say that now. It was not in the coalition agreement or

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in our manifesto. Andrew Lansley went into the election on a two

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platforms. One that there would be no top down your organisation.

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became a coalition initiative. should not have done. This paper

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was written during the election. Most of the White Paper leading up

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to the Pill was written during the election. We managed to get some

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changes. Lib Dems will take the blame for this, once they? I hope

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not. I hope Andrew Lansley takes the blame for this. Nick Clegg can

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only answer for himself. Some of us came into politics to do what is

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right. Sordid dive. To try to claim some kind of moral high ground is

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ludicrous. The risk assessment is clear that everyone will be so

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immersed in the rear organisation and there is not enough

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commissioning expertise amongst GPs. Patients will suffer. Nearly every

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risk assessment that has been reduced has said that patients will

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suffer. The Government is refusing to publish the National risk

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assessment and we must ask why. With all changes, there are risks.

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It is about assessing potential risks and considering reality. It

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has taken a long time to get this legislation through. Now is the

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right time to press on with reforms to deliver better outcomes for

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patients. We will see what happens. Thank you.

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What is the best way of turning round the fortunes of

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underachieving primary schools? For the Education Secretary, Michael

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Gove, the answer is to transform them into state-funded but self-

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governing academies. One school in Southampton thinks it has found

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another way. Teaching philosophy to five year olds. Our reporter went

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Every school day, 1,000 children are suspended for abuse and assault.

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44 teachers were taken to hospital after being attacked by pupils.

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Those are the latest statistics from the Department of Education.

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Now one school in north -- in Southampton are addressing the

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problem by teaching Pollet -- by teaching philosophy. This school

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received a satisfactory rating in 2007. Attendance was not good and

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writing standards were well below average. Five years on, it is a

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different picture. The rating is now a good and the extent to which

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pupils contributed to their school and the community is described as

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outstanding. Much of the success has been put down to the emphasis

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on thinking skills and philosophy. It starts at the age of five. The

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teaching goes on to a much deeper level. 10 year-olds initiate and

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discuss philosophical questions. This end is good and this end is

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bad. If you think the word in your hand represents something good, put

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it here. The school is in a socially deprived part of

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Southampton. There are many ethnic minority groups and different

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languages spoken. We want children to be independent within school and

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with -- and outside school as well. We want them to develop these

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thinking skills. In an ever- changing world, you don't know what

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the future holds and these skills will be very important. There is

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such an emphasis on working together and thinking been a social

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activity, rather than Solidarity -- rather than solitary. The children

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are happy to agree and to disagree with each other without that being

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attention. They're learning to accept other ideas and that they're

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not all the is right themselves. Young people need all the help they

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can get to find work. Teaching them to respect other people's point of

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view should help make the world a happier place. I had a few problems

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with some students. I did not fit in with my class. I could not pay

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attention to the work so I used to get into a lot of trouble. But some

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teachers realise that they could help me with looking at other

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people's points of view. I thought about my future, so I aimed for the

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highest that I could. I believe in myself and I gave everything a shot.

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And joining us in the studio is Peter Worley who is the CEO from

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The Philosophy Foundation. There are different ways of teaching

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philosophy. Give me an example of the sort of things you pigeon

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across two children. I might say to children that there is a story

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about a minor tour which sails around the ocean for many years.

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During that time, the parts of the vessel get replaced over time.

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Eventually, all of them have been replaced. I give them a model on

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the floor and I say to them, when the ship has part replaced, is at

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the same shape as when it first went out and its journey? That is

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the starting question. Based on what they say, other concerns are

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coming in. It is reasoning rather than teaching facts. You get that

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sort of critical thinking in other subjects. Why do you need to use

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for loss of a? Well, the thing about philosophy is that -- why do

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you have the use philosophy? The thing about philosophy is that it

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is solely concerned with reasoning. In other subjects, reasoning is

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involved but it is not explicitly taught. You have do no science or

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history facts before you can consider them. Because philosophy

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is conceptual, it is often called conceptual engineering, you can

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engage with the thinking straight away without having to learn what

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are facts. Schools are busy and curriculums are packed. Is there

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room for philosophy? This is often said. Firstly, I would say that

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philosophy is another ad on subject approach. Actually, there is an

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argument to suggest that philosophy is Foundation will. This comes into

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our new campaign. We argue that reasoning is just as important as

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reading, writing and arithmetic. In the Cambridge Review, they said

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that reading and writing had not improved in 50 years because they

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had been teaching to the test and not the understanding. In our film,

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we saw that children were happier to disagree without causing rows.

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We could all learn something from that! Do you have any worries about

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this? You are right when you say that this underpins other subjects.

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This reminds me of something they did in Scandinavia with teenagers

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and sexual health. It was about getting them to talk about feelings

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and not just the mechanics but to respect how each other felt. Not

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quite philosophy, but anything which I think helps children to

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think about things from another perspective is a very good thing.

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What worries me is that colleagues at work said that they don't learn

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maths and English properly, so do we really need this? I think we are

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very much in danger of agreeing here! The basics need to be done

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properly first. Most people are concerned about getting the core

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knowledge right at an early stage. What we have to do is build on

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strong foundations. Within the three subjects and the way they are

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taught in terms of the general education in the classroom has to

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be taught separately. Isn't there a sense in which if you want to learn

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those things well, it is suggested from the research that we need to

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address an understanding. You could use that argument for many subjects.

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You could say that if you want to understand different cultures and

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religions, you should bring religious education in at an

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earlier stage. Where do you stop? That is where we have to stop, I am

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afraid! Now our regular round-up of the

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political week in the South in 60 seconds.

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The problem of metal theft has persuaded Surrey County Council to

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change road signs and manhole covers to be plastic. They cost

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more but they say it is necessary. Lots of other local authorities

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have already done this or will be doing this soon. People living in

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Salisbury, Southampton and Reading don't feel good about where they

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live. But Dorchester, Oxford, Brighton and Bournemouth do.

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Councils were setting budgets this week. The dispute in Southampton

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saw more demonstrations on the street. Unions start legal action

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against wage decreases soon. And Chris Huhne and his ex-wife were

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asked to sit next to each other in at the dock.

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People in Salisbury don't feel so good about where they love. I find

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that very difficult to believe. Most people I know come their from

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outside the area at and there happy to live there. I don't recognise

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that. I represented part of Southampton. It is a city with a

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lot going for it. I think this is a survey with homeowners and it is a

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difficult time at the moment. I think this is a north and south

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divide. People grumble, but I think we have many nice part in our

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region. I will be moving to Salisbury soon went it sits my

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children to move school. I wanted to move here, but had to do the

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