17/02/2013 Sunday Politics South

In the South... Are there too many high-stakes gambling machines in

deprived neighbourhoods? A nice little earner for the bookies, but

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2128 seconds

are they creating more problem Welcome to Sunday Politics South,

my name is Peter Henley. Today, high-stakes gambling machines in

betting shops. Are too many of them spreading into careers areas,

leading to hire rates of gambling by the punters who can least afford

it? -- poorer areas. More on that in a moment. First,

let us meet the two politicians who will be with me for the next 20

minutes. Tony Page is the Labour deputy leader of Reading Borough

Council and Chris Chope is the Conservative MP for Christchurch.

Chris Chope, you spoke in the Commons about ministerial

responsibility. Is this causing problems? It is, in relation to the

boundary review. The coalition agreement, in response to that baby

referendum, the Lib Dems would support the boundary report -- the

boundary review. -- the alternative fog referendum. They have reneged

on that. -- alternative vote referendum. The Liberal Democrats

could see you have not got your head around doing modern politics,

or do you think the coalition could break down? We could have

effectively two versions of one particular policy, the spending on

whether it is coming from the Liberal Democrats on the

Conservatives. I would have preferred us to have gone into

minority Government. But it is very hard to see, as we get closer to a

General Election, how you can keep one single Government comprising

two separate parties, which will increasingly want to express their

own separate identities. Tony Page, you have had coalition that Reading

Borough Council, the Liberal Democrats in with the Conservatives.

Do you think it is any easier at a local Government level? It is not

necessarily easier. But you have to define the areas where you are

currently together on an agreed part form, and identify the areas

would you can be lose that. -- agreed platform. Do the Government

understand? I think the public do it. The fact is, issues such as

press litigation were not understood it in their agreement

for the coalition. So you have to be more relaxed. There was an

excellent programme on BBC Parliament yesterday about the

Wilson years, when part of the party were allowed to campaign

diametrically opposed on Europe. There have been occasions when

parties can be a bit more relaxed. A possibly more give and take.

Fixed-odds betting terminals. Probably not something that reminds

-- not something that trips off your tongue on a regular basis. But

if you are a bookmaker, you will know exactly what they are. Money-

spinning machines that can make you up to �900 per week in profits. In

the 2005 Gambling Act, the Government limited betting shops to

a maximum of four machines. But according to the Campaign for

Fairer Gambling, the bookies are just opening more shops, often in

poor areas. Derek Webb founded the campaign and he joins me now from

Westminster. What is it that you are concerned about? What is the

campaign fighting to change? have started a new direction with

the campaign, wanting to stop they fixed on betting terminals. --

fixed-odds betting terminals. There are now about 35,000 of them, which

are very profitable, as you said. Betting shops are really going for

them instead of the sort of one's people used to. Is it that they are

taking too much money off punters and punters do not realise? I think

it is far deeper than that. The money is astounding. 1.4 billion is

the latest year's figures. That is from a gross amount gambled of

around 45 billion. They are really targeting prisoner areas.

Consequently, we are finding a lot of problem gamblers. -- targeting

poorer areas. There are a lot of economic consequences of gambling

that affect families, so it is a broader issue than just the profits

of the bookmakers. Gambling is gambling. People have different

opinions about it. For example, the roulette wheel, they take is about

15%? These machines, the pretender to his roulette, but your chances

of winning a much lower. Is that the bottom line? My not exactly.

You are talking about roulette as a casino game. The main difference

between at roulette in a betting shop and in a casino is the pace of

the game is about 4.5 times faster. So you lose your money for 0.5

times quicker. If you are not as wealthy as a casino player to start

with, then it really hurts and in Padua. -- you lose your money for

0.5 times Kaka. And the other in every community. -- 4.5 times

quicker. And psychological studies, the idea that you would almost win.

The near-miss element is greater with the machines than roulette?

Correct. It is the roulette content, and this applies to run out in

general, that its allows you to trade up your wager as you start to

get involved in the game. You have more spins, want to bet more

numbers, want to bed more on one number ban another number. But you

end up seeing players betting about 20 numbers. And the mind that even

win one that spend. This is where you see addictive behaviour coming

in. It is not just recreational, someone just playing a few numbers.

Let us speak to the studio. You are concerned about this targeting

poorer areas? I share those concerns. We have clustering in

Reading, real concern, and we have lost a planning appeal down Oxford

wrote in Reading for a new arcade. There is concern amongst the local

community. Particular a hours could use can be the concern. If they are

more conventional shop hours, for example. The original application

was 24 hours access. We have beaten that back. But we have lost the

principle of the loss of this particular shop, which is

regrettable. The case for regulation of public information?

People seem to be spending a lot of their money. Perhaps public

information about the real ones, which can be done by anybody. One

issue is problem gambling, the other is insuring that people who

want to engage in social gambling can do so. I have visited betting

shops and spoken to constituents in Christchurch, and people think of

it as a relaxation and part of recreation. We do not want to

prevent them being able to have a recreational activity, because

there are problem gamblers elsewhere. What is your response to

that, Derek? It is easy to visit a betting shop on a Friday or

Saturday afternoon, when the bookmaker invite you, when you are

taken to a shop with two or three staff, and no violent customers. It

is different going into a betting shop in a poorer area, where people

are damaging machines, single staff looking after premises, a big

difference between the casual visitor and the players who are

there every day. Maybe Christchurch has nice betting shops?

licensing regime should be able to deal with these issues. And it

could, couldn't it? The Gambling Act could reduce the maximum stake,

increase the time between spins? is not just the Gambling Act. The

Minister right now, Hugh Robertson, has the power today to do this and

he says, commonsense says there is a problem, he just needs the

evidence. That is why we have kicked up this campaign, because we

need more of evidence. We think we have adequate evidence, but we are

getting lots of stories from people, the problems they are experiencing,

lots of shop managers explaining what is happening on premises, so

we are building up anecdotal evidence, but the reviewers to

support the campaign -- but need reviewers to support the campaign.

Go to betting shops yourself, form your own opinions, watch the

players, watch behaviour and machines, see the numbers that a

bet, and you will understand they should not be easily accessible on

the high street. Thank you for introducing us to this.

The Eastleigh by-election moved up a gear this week, if that is

possible for a campaign that started at a high temple.

Nominations closed on Wednesday, so we now know who all the candidates

are. Tristan Pascoe has been taking 41 years ago this very week,

Eastleigh's most famous son was riding high in the charts. These

days, Eastleigh it is almost as famous for what it has lost. The

company that inspired his song has long gone, replaced by a shopping

centre. The railway works, once a major building Hub, is now a shadow

of its former self. The Mr Kipling bakery closed nearly ten years ago.

The nearby factory has been raised to the ground. At one of the

biggest local employers, the Ford factory, is switching production of

its Transit van to Turkey. Heaslip has only had four MPs since the

seat was created in 1955. -- Eastleigh. The Lib Dems snatch it

from the Conservatives in 1994. Ironically, given that history, the

Lib Dems and Conservatives are head-to-head, but this time, and

for the first time, in coalition. As part of Hampshire County

Council's waist and the narrow strategy, this former airfield is

being considered for between 2 million and 3 million tonnes of

gravel extraction. It is a historic picture postcard village in one of

the most beautiful parts of the country. The Tories want to what

end, read out the heart of it, it is just grotesque. I would not make

it my top issues. I will continue to support all action groups I have

worked with over-development and the gravel pits. I have been a

businesswoman for 31 years and understand what we need to do to

grow business. I will work on that in Parliament for the people of

Eastleigh. Party's candidate sees immigration as the big issue. --

party's candidate. If it was not so attractive for their benefits

system, we would not have eastern Europeans coming here, therefore

needing housing. -- party macro -- UKIP. We need more housing, council

housing. I think we need to regulate private rents as well.

the stage is set. The gloves are off and this could be a better and

So we can expect to see even more of the party bigwigs out in force

between now and polling day. There are another 10 candidates

standing from all across the political spectrum, making a total

of 14. You'll be able to see those candidates and a special programme

we will run next Sunday. More on that later will -- more on that

later. More details on all the candidates on the BBC website at

bbc.co.uk/news. It is facing tsunami of retirement,

according to one recruitment consultant. The farming industry

needs to be recruiting at least 5,000 people per year for the next

ten years to replace all those who will be reaching retirement age.

That will be almost a third of the workforce of nearly half-a-million.

With all the stories of poor harvests, crops costing more to

raise than they sell for and worries about what you are eating,

who would want to be a farmer? Trevor Cligg is a farmer in West

Dorset and joins us now. You are a happy farmer? Some of the time.

worried about people leaving the industry? I do not think so.

Although we probably do need 5,000 new recruits per year, there is a

significant number coming through every year, we have agricultural

colleges across the country, most counties have one. Those have

increased their numbers of places, uptake is always oversubscribed.

Whilst it is a problem, I do not think it is going to be a

catastrophe. Would you encourage your own children to go into

farming? I would if they wanted to. I would not push them into it,

because she should not push too hard. I know your daughters, they

are going into farming? Possibly agriculture to be related.

Agriculture relief related. It is an outdoor life, but you need to

understand a lot about science. As we saw what horsemeat, you need to

us -- you need to understand the whole consequences. That horsemeat

think is beyond our control, happening after everything has left

the farm and we have given up control of the product. But the

farm worker of the future is going to be someone who is highly

educated, they are going to be very IT savvy, but I think we need to

get away from this misconception that farming is a menial job.

Because whilst we do get our hands dirty, other times we are in the

office sorting things out, we are using robotic equipment, it is

becoming a high-tech industry and has a big future. I get the

impression that the way society sees farming is still very much an

urban view. Others horsemeat scandal seems to have reinforced

that. A sense we do not know where food is coming from. I sense that

is inevitable really, and the way I do not understand someone's life

who lives in a high-rise flat in inner-city London. They will not

understand my life. It is an educational problem, no one's fault,

and I do not know what the answer is. But people are starting to care

about where food is coming from. Is that a good friend? The definitely.

The horsemeat scandal... -- is that a good thing? Definitely. Horsemeat

scandal shows the need to increase UK production base. When you have a

good change which goes from Romania to Greece to France to Minerva and

ends up on tables in this country, it is so complicated. There is no

control. Chris Chope, is the time Laura by a British campaign? -- is

the time for a campaign to buy food that is British? Somehow the

consumer is not recognised? One of the problems is regulation. The

irony is that we introduced lots of regulation and the result of that

has been that it has pushed up the price of meat in the United Kingdom

and manufacturers have gone overseas to buy off all over there,

which is not regulated. That is the consequence of not having thought

through the consequences. Are you buying unregulated meat? I am not.

But some are. This is something that has been going on for a long

time. I think it was in the late 80s, early 90s, some crates were

banned in the UK, and yet it was illegal to produce it in this

country, but not illegal to import it. We have a recent other

incidents of something like this. Some stalls were banned and the UK

across ten years ago, but 17 countries across Europe have not

complied with that. And a metre in that way is coming in. European

regulations ought to have sorted this out and have not. I do not

know if we can blame it on Europe. The supermarkets themselves have a

lot to answer for it, they are all buyers, driving down the price of a

lot of these commodities, and farmers have rightly complained

about that. They cannot be surprised that some white boy

elsewhere decides to try and slip something into the process. -- wide

boy. Is the industry at fault? cannot see that. Where there is

criminal fraud taking place, and we see that endemic in so many aspects

of what happens in the European Union, it is not surprising that it

is contaminating the United Kingdom in his food processing. But can I

make the point that, in looking at the difference in what is they are

in perspective on farming and the rural perspective, one of my

farmers wants to have a herdsman and he wants to get that person an

agricultural tenancy. He cant, even in a Dorset local authority, get a

real understanding that, if you have a herdsman, you need to have

been close to the herd 24/7. are telling me you are advertising

for that? Yes. And he gets a house as well? Yes. What sort of money is

going into... I am not tell you what he will get, but a herdsman

will earn a minimum of �25,000- �30,000. Buses accommodation.

you very much for keeping us up to date. -- plus his of -- plus his

accommodation. Now the regular round-up of the

political week in the South in 60 seconds.

Councils have been setting budgets and announcing further cuts, �7

million and Southampton. Not what we are here to do, but we had to

act lawfully and legally. It is 7 million on top of �8 million and

Portsmouth, but they are trying to protect some services. Targeting

the money at the most vulnerable children. New cash to reopen at

Dorset Railway. It has been closed for 40 years, but got cash from a

pot to help coastal communities. Meanwhile, �6 million went to the

wrong bank account after a mistake back Oxfordshire County Council

staff, blaming a training issue and the money was recovered. The Thames

Valley Chief Constable has made 18 in the list of most powerful women.

And an MP told the Commons he is donating his powerful body to

science in recognition of his local NHS Trust when I am opened up,

inscribed on my heart will be there once, keep their General Hospital.

Would you do make your body to science, Chris Chope? I do not

think size would need my body. Page? I have by donor card, they

can have what they like. Local authorities squeezed, going on,

more than central Government? we were a sacrificial lamb offered

by Eric Pickles early on. Just a portion of large cuts, impacting

across the country. -- disproportionately large cuts.

There is the new Conservative West Berkshire, police commissioner,

this is real big cuts. Dorset being squeezed? It is, but in my

constituency, this seemed to have found a quarter of a million pounds

for a cycle track, whilst cutting others. It is an issue of

priorities. That is their public accountability comes in, elections

coming up, councillors accounting for their priorities. But cycling

initiatives will be funded from other areas. That is ring-fenced.

Meanwhile you have potholes? Take that are with Eric Pickles. It is

council priorities. And the Government's priorities, giving the

money Para-cycling. It is all about infrastructure, supposedly. That is

their Sunday Politics in the south. Thank you to my guests, Christopher

Chope and Tony Page. Next week, we have a special programme, an hour-

long debate between the candidates and voters in Eastleigh. Yet the

campaign so far is anything to go by, it should be lively. It will be