14/04/2013 Sunday Politics West Midlands

Banned in the Midlands: Public sector jobs Darin, private sector

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2190 seconds

jobs up. What would Margaret Hello from the Midlands. We are

reflecting on the influence Margaret Thatcher had on our part

of the world. We will be joined by a variety of guests from our main

parties. This week we have the Labour MP for Stoke and Trent South

and the Liberal Democrat from nearby. Countless tributes to

Margaret Thatcher, this one comes from the MP from Stone who visited

her just six months ago. If you remember when we obtained the

victory in 1979 we had just previously had the winter of

discontent. People remained and buried. There was rubbish mountain

in every street and she turned it around and created the right to buy,

the enterprise economy. In my own constituency she created an

enterprise agency on the back of that which is still going. Bogof

you were conspicuous absentees during the recalled House of

Commons on Wednesday. Why did you decide to give it a mess? I thought

there should have been a system of protocols and that would be a good

system to have. With Churchill there were three speeches, one from

each party leader and one from the leader of the house which I think

it's a good way of dealing with it. At the end of the day we are

dealing with human beings, somebody's mother, somebody's grand

mother. As to her track record, I always find it interesting looking

at the to what extent Tony Benn created these seeds of her success

in the work he did developing North Sea oil. She by the same complement

almost said her greatest achievement was the election of the

Blair Government. She made that change for Labour. Did you not go

because you could not trust yourself not to speak ill of the

dead? I think rightly at this time family and friends but I was not

going to go because of the damage she did, the pain of many of my

constituents still suffer. I decided I would stick to another

commitment I had at the NEC. British disease, the sick man of

Europe, all of that? The you look famously when Thatcher took office

she quoted the words of St Francis but actually she created division

and disappear. Never mind creating hope, she created the opposite. She

created literally brother verses brother in communities. You wear a

child of the Thatcher years, in 1983 you set up your business. You

are a Liberal Democrat but you should have been a Conservative.

was successful to be a millionaire by 1987. You have got to look at

what the success of the economy was built on then. The problem is we

are talking about someone who has recently died. We should be

respectful of her family. She did some positive things and some less

positive things. There were impassioned contributions on

Wednesday, the Stourbridge MP told the Commons how she had been

inspired as a teenager growing up in Coventry by the then newly

elected opposition leader. She told me how her meeting with Margaret

Thatcher in 1975 had helped fulfil her father's deepest wish. He said

if you ever meet Margaret Thatcher tell her there are only to

politicians to have made a difference, Winston Churchill and

Margaret Thatcher. We have a picture. Little did we know oh,

little did she know, you would eventually become the Conservative

MP for Stourbridge, do you think this is a moment when you brought a

bit of the Thatcher factor to the Black Country? I hope so. She was a

great exponent of boosting opportunities for young people.

That is one of my main priorities to. They is still a lot of work to

be done. You were such an admirer I gather that when Dee party dumped

her from the leadership Utah up your party membership? Yes, I did.

I was very saddened by the whole experience. I did resign my

membership the next day. I felt it was such a betrayal. Her critics

pointed out she presided over the collapse of much of the

manufacturing base in our country, tripling unemployment. This is a

complete mess. It is one I tried to dispel in the debate this week. --

a myth. It was already receding before she came in. But it went

under on her watch. First of all, employment was better at the end of

her period in office than it was in the beginning but I do accept that

in the early years, in the 1980 resection, then you are right,

unemployment did go up. She did inspire you in those teenage years

of years. Did you ultimately be inspired to follow in her

footsteps? I think not if you mean towards the party leadership. I

have to accept my limitations and I do not have that big a job in me. I

was inspired by higher, particularly because in the 70s,

you will remember this, people had given up hope in this country. We

were the sick man of Europe and nobody had any confidence that

anyone could change it. I was amazed Mrs Thatcher did what she

did. I did not expect it when I voted for her, I did not vote for

her in the beginning because I was too young but my parents did bought

for her. I did not expect her to achieve the amazing turnaround she

did. I was around in the 70s and I still am! I am joined also today by

the Conservatives who defected to the UK Independence Party. He

subsequently stood for UKIP at the last election. Shortly after what

must have been a very traumatic decision to leave the Conservatives

you met Baroness Thatcher I gather. Did she tell you you had made the

biggest mistake of your life? she did not actually say anything

about it at all but I knew if she wanted to make something she would

make the point. I used seeing in effect she gave you her classic

approval? -- saying. In effect, yes. You had given up the membership of

a major party that really can do something about the European debate

whereas UKIP, despite all the pushed, shoved and shout in power

it is not going to be elected to Government to make the big

decisions, is it? I think it could in time. UKIP will, in time, be at

party to be reckoned West. Maybe not instantly for the next

Government but membership is over 25,000. That was the last figure I

cared, we are a growing party. heard Margaret Thatcher talk about

the inspiration, what are you reflections? I would not stand for

any of the flimflam of politics. Margaret Thatcher was very direct,

she did what was right for the British people. I'd do not think

that is as the others said that she would have liked the tributes on

Wednesday, there would be nothing wrong with having the tributes on

Monday. I think it was David Cameron trying to shore up his

credentials with his own backbenchers rather than anything

else. We have cared from Margot about how she inspired, she was a

woman of great conviction. Although you don't Tidby we are being led to

expect a low turnout in the shire elections. -- a boy you don't agree.

I do not think it is bland politics. In terms of ideological politics it

is something I am absolutely behind. I think it is the right thing. You

have sometimes to temper ideology and I think one thing Margaret

Thatcher did not do was take advice, consider things and be persuaded to

change opinion. We have heard time and again people over recent days

saying that one thing they would have changed about her was actually

the intransigence that once she had made her mind to something she

would not be swayed. Sometimes actually having a little humility

and being able to listen to what other people are saying and taking

that into account is important. did not like coalitions! So what

would you say about the passion? There is an argument for a sort of

politics where you listen to people and if the argument that you were

getting is that things are wrong then you change policy. I do not

think Government should be about deciding centrally what they think

is right, ignoring everybody and forcing it on everybody in the

country. There is some merit in listening to people. And tackling

it as you go. So, what, I wonder, with the Iron Lady have made of the

services and concentrate on growth in the private sector? Recent

figures have shown us how the economy is changing. Our reporter

has been investigating in Hereford and Worcester. The public sector.

Under Labour it grew until it was almost half of the UK economy. In

previous decades during a visit to JCB in Staffordshire Margaret

Thatcher championed a private sector. Whenever I go I am asked

where the jobs are coming from, they come from successful companies

like this. 20 years on, the Conservative argument has not

changed. The way to grow the economy is to shrink the State.

This man saw the writing on the wall at the MoD. He joined at 17

and spent the next 23 years working his way up through the army ranks.

taxpayer. Today he is a private sector employees at this small

security firm. The way I saw it was this shrinking of the public sector

and taking on some of that work in the private sector meant there were

more opportunities out there. bosses have taken on 12 workers

from the public sector in the last 12 years. They say employing people

like him makes good business sense. It gives us access to skills and

expertise we might find difficult to acquire elsewhere. They also

come with an understanding of how the public sector works. And they

are not alone. According to the latest figures, last here 72,000

jobs were created in private sector firms. At the same time, 16,000

public-sector jobs were lost. But the regional unemployment stays

stubbornly high and above national average. The upheaval of the last

few years have led to scenes like these in our towns and cities right

across the Midlands. Public-sector workers angry at job losses,

frustrated by changes to their pensions, and worried about the

Government's economic policy. absolutely clear that the austerity

measures are feeling. We have gone into a double-dip recession and are

knocking on the door of a triple dip recession. Public or private

sector, the argument will continue. In the end the only thing that

really matters are the jobs themselves. Now, Margaret Thatcher

was a great fan of GCB then and presumably still would be today as

a private sector developing jobs as an antidote to be over-dependence

on public sector jobs as your party had done. You do not grow the

economy by reducing dramatically the public sector. You do not get

more people into work in the private sector simply by sacking

countless people from their public sector jobs. Firms like GCB can

generate money the public simply spends it. -- JCB. But it is about

enabling. By having a strong response of effective public sector

which looks after hospitals and education, it also has an enabling

role to make sure workers are workforce and we can grow the

private sector that way. Yes we have big success stories like JCB

but there are areas of structural long-term unemployment so you have

a divergence. Some good examples like these signs sector in Malvern

but there is some decline. thing is the reduction, gradual

reduction in unemployment. That is not fast enough from my point of

view. I am concerned about my constituents. At the end of the day

the economy is to serve people. I am just quoting figures from my

constituency. At the end of the day the job of the economy is to serve

people as a whole and if we have an public sector, we are achieving a

balance. You are looking for a job at the moment. Where do you think

the prospects are? I started off talking about Mrs Thatcher at a

coal mine. I have had experience in the public sector in the air in and

nationalised industry which we do not have any more or. The

nationalised industries have gone, British Leyland for example. The

public sector that is left seems to be very effective. You have got

things like the NHS brand which are being used to market services

abroad. That is generating income. Putting it all together, doesn't it

suggests there is maybe a crumb of optimism that the economy might be

economy might come right and what I am seeing in my constituency is

more people are becoming unemployed, there might be jobs being created

down in Malvern but in Stoke and trend there are jobs being lost.

telling people they must travel around the country to find jobs?

The areas like North Staffordshire are losing employment and not just

in the private sector -- not just in the public sector but private

sector jobs are being lost as well and there are no other jobs to go

to in this area so do we end up with a situation in a few years'

time we are really the only jobs are in the south of the country and

anything north of Watford is a sort of waste land. We are certainly

still in the days of enterprise zones. Economic policy is rooted in

the same thinking, is it not? We do need to make sure places like Stoke,

obviously Malvern is doing very well. We need to make sure there is

success across the country. Enterprise zones are ludicrously

high. This causes an economic problem. It always does. It is not

easy to solve. Now here is our political reporter in Shropshire.

Be well remember them. The names of soldiers killed in duty were etched

in stone. Two resignations in Sandwell. The councillor and

chairman in charge of Children's Services. The county's first

official flag is flown. An investigation into the death of a

woman in hospital, she slipped into a diabetic coma in 2007 at the

hospital. And a legal challenge against Government changes to

disability benefits. That on top of a threatened judicial review into

the housing benefit changes as well. If you put it together this whole

project starts to unravel. It is a fundamental disaster for the

Government. I think charging council tax to people on

jobseeker's allowance is wrong and complex. I do not like to comment

on the details without seeing the claims forms. I understand the

details. You can create a judicial review. Do you think this whole

raft of changes to the benefits system will go through as the

Government want them to? They have gone through. People are going to

argue about it. I was looking today for instance at the issue of how we

help people with budgeting, with the six towns credit union. Those

are important things to do for everybody. A quick final word for

you. We spent 23 billion on housing benefit with only 10 billion more

on defence. You have got to get on top of this. If things are

Government is taking us back not to the 1980s but the 1880s where