12/07/2014 Talking Business with Linda Yueh

compared to today. A bit more rain heads in after Monday and Tuesday ``

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agree to a recount. Now on BBC News, talking business.

The music industry has come a long way since the days when money

What is the new business model for artists, record label and managers?

I am Linda Yueh, in Singapore, these are my guests

The music industry has been transformed in ways that would have

been hard to imagine when vinyl ruled the radio waves.

Gone are the days when the money was made just by selling records.

Now, artists make their cash in a variety of ways.

Ranging from selling individual tracks and allowing listeners to

download select parts of records, through to live performances.

Bands like Radiohead have even allowed the fans to pay

Music streaming has also changed the industry

Here with me now are Rob Schwarz, Tokyo bureau chief of Billboard

Brian Message, one of the managers of Radiohead and founding member

founder of the Black Eyed Peas and label Boombox.

How has the music industry changed during

It has been the biggest changes since the start

In the early days, we had to prove ourselves to record companies.

In LA, it was predominantly rap music.

So we were more into hip`hop, break`dancing, free styling.

So we would shop our demos to Sony, and you them it was not tangible

So back then, I don't want to reveal my age, but there was no e`mail,

So we would get everyone's address on the way out of the show

and we would mail them flyers and get them to come to the next

And then the record company started smelling the coffee ` "Oh,

Nowadays, it is like artists have an easier way to present their music.

YouTube, Instagram and Vine and all the social media.

My take is that nothing has changed in having to be smart.

Back in the day you had to be smart to get the record exec's attention

so you went out with a strategy to be interesting.

Nowadays you have to be smart because there's so much noise

and you have to be smart smart to get attention.

Also, everyone can just upload a video of music

but you have got to have something unique to capture the viewers.

The gatekeepers have really been removed.

All the tools are in the hands of everyone who wants to use them,

It is a fantastic era but the huge profits

People do still sell millions of albums.

Taylor Swift had one of the fastest selling albums ever.

But that is not the main way to make money from music, selling albums?

Only for the really, really big stars.

You can be a big star but you have to do shows

It gives you exercise, you get exercise in performing on stage.

You can see stars and then when they do shows, you are like, "OK...

Brian, is that a big change and will it continue that to make

money from music, it is not just about the album sales, it is

about the album that it is about the live tours, all the parts.

Not to go and sound like a broken record, the game really is

It is a rich engagement between your artist and Goffin.

And sometimes it can be monetised, sometimes it will not get monetised.

But it is about the tapestry of everything together.

And after that, you work out a strategy to monetise it.

Sometimes you give your music away for free in order to

Other times you might get involved in a free gig.

It depends on your strategy but is it is a mix of a lot of things.

Radiohead famously allowed fans to pay whatever they wanted

What was the thinking behind that and would you do it again?

I think the band at the time were empowered, they has

just left their record label and looking at how the landscape

of the world was, and for them it was making that decision at that

There was mass piracy online, so that idea of being,

just charging what we thought was the right price from the website

of Radiohead did not necessarily fit well with what was giving that

So we could let's be democratic, let's let the fans choose

Nowadays, the landscape as it evolved considerably.

You have more legal opportunities whether ins Bossi five or YouTube,

A nice place for us is that your artist plays in different ways

`` your artist has different ways to look at what they do.

Will it be `` what I will bring you in here.

Will this freewheeling for the mid``` music industry in the future?

Artists giving away albums, free concerts,

I think there has to be a way to monetise the music.

Nobody used to think that way in the past.

The monetary consideration used to be first.

Now, it is get your music alba and develop the relationship

and afterwards figure out how to monetise it.

But there has to be some revenue streams that has to

Spotify has not come through and it may do in the future and Brianmy

point is that it is about scale, once they have more revenue they can

But it is yet to be determined whether streaming can be

Brian, this sounds as if it is a very difficult business

If you are managing acts and you are working out how much to sign them

Spotify for, how much to invest in them, how is this playing out?

Because in the days, you got a DJ to play your song...

Going back to what's point in the old days,

Your record company got you on the radio and if you got through

Nowadays, because of the distribution

collapsing or proliferating into many, many ways.``, you have

But it is not dissimilar to other businesses in other industries.

The same rules still apply, we work on building artists as a business.

So when you are a young artist with no

firm `` with no fan base whatsoever, you have to find some traction.

If you need a relevant capital, you might have to get that from friends.

Globally, it must be so hard to stand out unless you are

The contribute `` the competition has increased a thousandfold.

But in the old days, the recording industry was really

People toured to promote their records.

Since recorded music has collapsed, now touring is one of

So people do not tour just to promote themselves.

Maybe ticket prices have gone up but it is good for bands to tour

You have unique suffered utilise social media is.

You come up with unique stuff and utilise social media. I see Viner

stars now. They can have seven seconds of crazy

videos and so they get traction. So as an artist, you have got to

utilise all those platforms to gain The world now is that technology has

allowed everybody to make technology The differential is

going to be quality. It is going to be what do people or

consumers or fans get out of its? If you can deliver that

as an artist or film`maker, then you I'm going to ask you

guys to make a prediction. Has the MP3 meant the death of the

CD? Can I go first? There is a big misconception about the CDs. People

think they do not exist any more. They are worth billions of dollars

in America and in Japan. You still can buy CDs across the United

States. It is just that they are discounted. You will pay a much

lower price for them. All you can find a huge huge stars, Taylor

Swift, Katy Perry, that is all that you can find. The indie bands have

been pushed out of the CD market. It still does exist. When you say MP3,

you have to be careful, Brian would be knowledgeable about this.

Downloading is a new revenue stream is not as strong as it used to be

and is probably not going to get stronger. We are looking to

streaming to replace that and it has not arrived yet. We are in limbo. Do

you agree, Brian? Yes. Streaming is giving fans all over the world is an

opportunity to do something. It is a great way for fans to interact.

People like watching YouTube. People like to use Spotify. It is still in

its mass and form. But it is not that downloading will go away, but

we will see streaming continuing to run a pace, provided that we can all

pull together to drive better subscriptions and more use of those

models. I will ask you to do

something old`fashioned. There was a time when some bands

went on TV , they showed a bit of their wares , so I will ask you to

rap us out, to finish the segment. Since I am in Asia,

I will break it down . I will do it in the Filipino

language. That was Rob Schwarz ,

Brian Message and Apl.de.ap One genre that has got through

the global music is K`Pop. Korean pop music has been

a hit with music lovers around the world, cutting through

where others have failed. Artists like Psy have used YouTube

to create a fan base Korean bands have fans as far

as Mexico. A multi`billion dollar industry that

has been growing in double digits. Joining now to discuss why Korean

pop has succeeded in going global are a Korean pop

star and Bernie Cho. Welcome.

What is the appeal of Korean pop? I think the language. It is quite

different from English or Chinese or Japanese. It has a different

pronunciation and when it comes to music the pronunciation of Korean

makes it more attractive, somehow, I think. Do you agree? Why has K`Pop

gone global? Many don't. I think she had it on the head. It has the do

with language. One reason K`Pop has travelled well is the fact that

K`Pop is very accessible. The courses are catchy. They're often in

English. `` definitely, K`Pop is not just

exclusively for careers. I see you agreeing. When you look

into your own music, how much of it is Korean question `` exclusively

for Koreans. I lived in Canada and grew up listening to pop music,

hip`hop, so I think the global music influenced me. In my music, some

people feel differently. I think it is all mixed up when you see my

music. Bernie, when a lot of Korean pop stars want to break through,

what do you advise them? Not everyone will have their chance to

be international. Before Psy came along, a lot of artists were

frustrated about how difficult it is to cross over. But I took a lot of

inspiration from Latin music of the 90s. What made their music so fresh

was the fact that they retained an element of their culture. I often

tell artists, making great music is first and foremost. If language for

you is an instrument to get that message and that music out there, so

be it. But I do emphasise and I think Psy was proof of concept

that, depending on the market, language is important in interviews

so that you can hook the audience and fans into your music. People

want to know more. When they want to know more, you need to speak the

language. We tell artists to try to express yourselves in interviews in

English, if you can. More importantly, don't worry about the

accent. If anything, they will probably think it is endearing. When

I show them French DJs, I say look at these guys, people love it. I

think in many ways, a lot of Korean artists, language barriers have come

down. There is a wave of Korean artists who are happy to express

themselves in different languages and it makes Korean artists right

now, not only very versatile but more importantly it can travel

further. Where are your fans? I thought that only Korean fans

existed. But when I came here to Singapore or even Europe, I went

recently and this girl recognised me, somehow, and I was really

surprised that people from another country are actually loving my

music. I don't know. I don't know where my fans are, but it is

interesting to find them. Bernie, you touched on the new wave of

Korean artists. The earlier waves seemed more manufactured. More

reminiscent of some of the talent shows that we see around the world.

I think for a lot of people, when they are injured used to K`Pop or

hear about K`Pop, there has been a stereotype that act two is boy bands

and girl bands. `` that K`Pop. But K`Pop is a diverse scene. If you

look at the charts now, you find more singer songwriter is, more

artists, producers, solo artists. More so than ever, more of them are

being discovered on TV audition shows. My fellow interviewee was

very successful on one of those shows. The kids that went through

the sort of boy band, girl band system, it could take seven years to

debut. Because of the new talent on TV are already talented to begin

with, that debut time has gone from seven years to maybe seven months.

One of the criticisms of people that come to audition shows is that more

established artists will say, you guys are not the real deal. What

would you say to that? Going through the programme was a process, but it

was shorter than other people's. Some people can say that, I think,

but I don't want to deny it. But I am growing up. I think it is a great

process to experience. Bernie, when you are working with acts, what are

the biggest sort of obstacles in pushing a Korean act to going

global? Such as making them a star in America? When we look at a Korean

act, whether that is rock or electronic or urban, first and

foremost is that language is not the priority, it is having an amazing

live show. That translates across`the`board. If the live show

is amazing, everything else falls into place. One of the things that

Korean artists have been very good at... When you talk about digital

and youth culture, it is one and the same with pop culture. A lot of

management companies have been very savvy and using social `` and have

used social media to reach out to fan bases. You may not know where

they are, but they are out there. The feedback that a lot of these

artists are getting, we now have the analytics, we have the numbers, we

have the stats to say, look, our fans are in North America, Europe,

and as a result we are seeing Korean acts targeting these markets.

Surprisingly, many of them are either appearing at major music

festivals or selling out world tours. I think the fact that, for

whatever reason, career's timing was very good in terms of using social

media to get where everyone is act. `` its at.

Money for a music is now made from streaming and touring and it has

made artists global. But it has made standing out even more challenging.

For as consumers, we benefit from lower prices and access to a larger

variety of music than have before. Check out our website. Join us for

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