02/12/2015 The Papers


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against Islamic State targets. That is the very latest from Westminster.


Let's see how it's all going to be reported in tomorrow's papers.


Hello, and welcome to our look ahead to what the papers


With me are Beth Rigby, the media editor of the Times, and the writer


Tomorrow's front pages are dominated, as you'd expect,


by tonight's vote on airstrikes in Syria.


The Times leads with what it describes as the huge majority -


of 174 votes - that David Cameron won from MPs for his plans


The Express claims the RAF could be ready to strike


The Sun is even more specific, "Tornados at dawn," it proclaims.


The Mirror calls it "Cam's War," and reports that Labour leader


Jeremy Corbyn has accused the PM of rushing into battle.


The Telegraph carries an excerpt from Shadow Foreign Secretary Hilary


Benn's Commons speech on its front page, we must "confront


The Mail looks further forward, asking the question, "After


And the Independent says the vote the is a step on the "road to


Raqqa," the unofficial capital of the self-proclaimed Islamic State.


Well, we are going to begin with the Telegraph, which quotes what Hilary


Benn had to say. Yeah, he met the Shadow Foreign Secretary and made a


very powerful speech in the Commons -- verse Shadow Foreign Secretary.


He talks about being faced by fascists, the fact that these people


hold us and our values in content, and he gave this very powerful


speech on the floor of the house, with Jeremy Corbyn sitting next to


him, the leader of the Labour Party, who deeply disagrees with him, and


sat down to the applause of both conservatives and many on his own


band, which is very unusual in the House of Commons, to hear applause


-- bench. Interesting that even at the weekend we were talking about


whether he could get the numbers for this vote, if he would try to whip


his MPs, even a month ago that he thought he could not bring ever to


the House of Commons because he would not be able to get the


numbers. And then we end up tonight, he has landed 174 majority,


a very definite majority. And interestingly, I don't know if this


was to do with Hilary Benn's speech, but in terms of Labour Tom this


morning we were talking about 45-50 voting with the Government to vote


for air strikes, up to 67 tonight -- Labour, this morning. They have to


be seen in the context of Labour's incredibly pained history. Labour


has always seen itself as an internationalist party. And Tony


Blair, when he came into power, fortified walls in six years.


Everyone thought it was just right. It wasn't. -- Fortt five wars. --


fought. With regard to Bosnia, it led to Tony Blair to intervene in


Kosovo and Sierra Leone, then the air strikes, the original ones, in


Iraq and then Afghanistan. So far, relatively uncontroversial, then


Iraq, the dodgy dossier, all of the lies, if that is what you want to


call it, stretching the truth, Chilcott eventually will come out


with it, but pretty much everybody knows that the case was manufactured


a year beforehand. We see this in the context of public opinion and a


party that has been absolutely traumatised by that year. And then


absolutely torn asunder by what's gone on over the last several days.


Jeremy Corbyn versus the parliamentary party that has never


reconciled itself. And then here comes Hilary Benn using a sort of


refashioning, that sort of Blairite, quasi- Churchill, we have to beat


the fascist, I am getting around of applause in the House of Commons. In


some ways it has turned full circle. It is also extraordinary to see


debate -- V debate ending with the Shadow Foreign Secretary and the


Foreign Secretary both in agreement with each other -- the debate. It


was incredible and actually, it says here in the Telegraph story, Philip


Hammond called Hilary Benn's speech one of the truly great speeches in


parliamentary history. It was a very painful night for


Labour. Those on the benches were whipped and to Jeremy Corbyn would


have wanted to whip that vote but he couldn't in the end corral his party


into backing him. We saw figures on Twitter earlier that said 11 of his


shadow cabinet members voted with the government. What some of the


shadow cabinet have said to me in the run-up to this vote was that


Hillary Benn had been working very hard behind the scenes to make the


case to colleagues to support the airstrikes where Jeremy Corbyn


hadn't made that case in the same way. He went on television to make a


public appeal and direct action has been happening where MPs have


reflectively been hounded and bullied by some members and Labour


activists. Just pausing for a moment because we have been told by the


Ministry of Defence that two Tornadoes have taken off from Cyprus


but they're not saying what their destination is. It could still be


the preplanned activity in Iraq. It must be said, it is very interesting


to me in these moments, and people who have been long enough around


camera member these occasions of the parliament voting on military


action, what didn't happen two years ago with the first voting on Syria,


the government hasn't always given its consent and things have gone


wrong. Most recently, Libya and we're not even talking about the


most famous intervention in Iraq. Libya, David Cameron turns up and it


is the first phase of intervention which often seems to carry a certain


amount of public opinion along with it. That was deemed OK when it first


happened. If it hadn't happened, would there have been a massacre in


Benghazi? Out and out opponents about this military action may come


together if Daesh gets more strongly hit but then there is the question


that is already being discussed tonight, what happens in six


months? As we move through the papers, let's just stay with the


Sun. It tallies what I have just said to some extent about the


Ministry of Defence. It is clearly not going to take along now, given


the vote, before some kind of military action takes place. It is


quite interesting the way the papers have divided. The Telegraph is very


much covering the political debate in the house and the Sun, the Daily


Mail and the Times have moved into what happens next, with the


airstrikes beginning. The Daily Mail is asking what happens next. Let's


move on to the Daily Mail. It quite often takes positions that you would


think are atypical for a political viewpoint. It has been quite


sceptical of David Cameron's attempts to make the case of the


last several days. Interestingly, however, once the vote has been


declared, the results, here we just get a snippet of the leader's


comments praying for the safety and success of the RAF. They are


basically saying, now that it has happened, they will no longer


criticize but they have been criticizing up until now. We also


have people talking about the use of specialist ground forces. They have


some very specialist security forces who have been deployed in


reconnaissance missions or something. Rather than actually


having troops. The whole debate in the House of Commons, a lot of it


was about the 70,000 troops on the ground and whether they were local


forces. I think any sense that troops from the UK will be deployed


in Syria will get MPs extremely concerned. It has been hard enough


to bring the country around to airstrikes and what... Let alone


with ground troops, and I think what has been the most interesting part


of the Daily Mail's coverage is that the country is extremely divided on


airstrikes, literally split down the middle. I think that is partly why


they have taken a more nuanced position, because they are trying to


reflect both sides. It and so many papers in the road to Iraq were


fully behind it. So many journalists, so many newspaper


editors were unbelievably credulous. And again, people forget,


the first six months of the actual invasion in Iraq was extremely


successful militarily. The forces got to Baghdad incredibly quickly


and the first few months were pretty successful, toppling the statue 's.


It was only when you got to about August that things start to go wrong


and then they never found the WMDs that didn't exist. It was not only


the Daily Mail, but all of the papers at the time. I think there is


an element of papers having been learned, and hedging bets and being


more circumspect. What did you think of the debate today? I think Iraq


lurks in our minds. But the fundamental difference,, --


difference, is that the main political and parliamentary lessons


learned from Iraq, are that any action needs to be endorsed


militarily. And there is a much greater sense of transparency and


process now, which certainly wasn't the case with Iraq, whether or not


you agreed with it on principle. The Daily Mirror are obviously saying


very clearly, this is now the Prime Minister's for, they are


traditionally not a big fan of David Cameron. It goes back to Tony


Blair's wars, Pjanic on him if it goes wrong -- pin it on him. The


point of this vote is that David Cameron was very burnt when he went


to the house in 2013 and asked for airstrikes in Syria and was voted


down. I think it's sort of scarred him in some way, that defeat. So


what the government have tried to do is build a coalition across the


House. They were clear that they were not going to come back to the


commons to take a vote on this unless they had cross party


agreement and could get that vote through. He was not going to risk


another defeat. You can call it his war, he is the Prime Minister, and


ultimately he brought the vote but ultimately, this has been a cross


party decision and to the fact that 67 Labour MPs have voted for it


against the shadow of Iraq and against the wishes of their leader


makes it feel more cross party, and also the Lib Dems backed as well.


But the much more recent piece of history or present news where the


bombings in Paris, -- were. If they had not happened, this would not be


happening today. It seems terrible to say, but there would have been


something somewhere else because that just seems to be what is


happening at the moment. It would have been in Belgium or Germany, it


could have happened in Britain. Seven were foiled in 12 months


according to David Cameron. It could have happened in any major European


city but it was the catalyst for all of this and the fact that the French


were absolutely involved. That UN resolution was very important to the


Labour Party. I thought Margaret Beckett gave a very powerful speech


as well and the Daily Telegraph quote her where she said, they had


been asked to agree precisely because that is what Daesh do. She


asked how we could turn our back on the French when they asked for our


help. The Independent have called it the Road to Raaqa. They have a


strange picture. It is a picture of a demonstrator who has rolled under


a lorry. It doesn't quite capture the drama of the evening. Although


it certainly gets marks for being different. But that is the other


part of it, which we have mentioned. The extent of the


opposition. Protests are likely to be daily or very frequent all the


way through. If I had been a picture editor, I would've taken a picture


of the people physically lying down on the road outside Parliament with


all the cars being stopped but that was quite a spontaneous moment,


where these protesters basically completely blocked Parliament


Square. One other story to mention. Sadly this is the one that has been


emerging throughout the evening here. The front of the Times


features it. A photograph of one of the victims being wheeled away to to


an ambulance from California. Very strange phenomenon of the elasticity


of news on any day of the week. This would have been blanket coverage in


every single paper, but the only paper that gives that any coverage


at all in the first additions we have seen is the Times. Obama has


been on the airways in the past hour, grim faced again over another


massacre, saying this sort of gun violence has no parallel anywhere


elsewhere in the world. Every time this happens, he comes out, grim


faced, and appeals to his citizens to deal with it and it just keeps


happening. When two people died in a recent massacre in Oregon in


October. Colorado was just a few days ago. Really sad. You get the


feeling that it is his one piece of unfinished business before he goes


and he knows he is not going to make any progress. On that note, thank


you very much indeed. Coming up, the latest headlines but before that the


weather. Wright good evening. It has been


very mild across southern parts of the evening


No need to wait to see what's in the papers - Clive Myrie presents a lively and informed conversation about the next day's headlines.

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