06/12/2015 The Papers


A lively, informed and in-depth conversation about the Sunday papers.

Similar Content

Browse content similar to 06/12/2015. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!



Now on BBC News here's Maxine with The Papers.


Hello and welcome to our Sunday morning edition of The Papers.


With me are former Treasury minister and corporate advisor,


Angela Knight, and James Rampton, features editor at the Independent.


The Sunday Express leads with Storm Desmond and reports it has claimed


its first victim in London - a 90-year-old pensioner who reportedly


died after the gale force winds blew him into the side of a moving bus.


The Observer says the Shadow Cabinet is bracing itself


for what MPs are calling a "revenge reshuffle", following Labour's


The Independent on Sunday also carries the claims, adding plans


And the Sunday Telegraph reports on a 'terrorist incident'


at Leytonstone Tube station after police tackle a knifeman who injured


three people while allegedly screaming 'This is for Syria'.


What would you like to start with? The Sunday Express and the killer


storm? Firstly, I am so sorry, I feel for that pensioner and his


family. Yesterday the winds were strong enough down here, let alone


in the North of England. Your conscience being buffeted around, to


keep your feet on the ground, if you are a bit frail, so a real tragedy


there. Some of the pictures in the newspapers today are pretty


impressive. You have water that has risen very quickly opt to the first


floor, waves, you know. This Israel Dagg the station staff. For a lot of


people it is not the first time as well. Absolutely. And it may come


quickly with a lot of wind and rain but it takes a long time for the


water to go down, the houses to dry and there is more rain forecast,


following on saturated ground so, yes, it is the same people and same


part of the country that had it, what, two, four years ago? These


awesome pictures again, quite frightening. I was speaking to some


people there, residents and shop owners and they said it was bad


enough last time but it has risen so fast this time. Since 2000 nine, the


last major time in this area -- 2009. But the floods have


overwhelmed those defences, so for the residents, they thought they


were safe, and now their homes have been destroyed again. Cumbria has


put out a call for extra doctors. 32 people have been marooned in a pub.


Worst places to be marooned! But not to sound too facetious, because it


is serious. And still, a man came on like a modern Bear growls, rescuing


people with his landowner, so extraordinary stories of heroism and


very frightening incidents in this flawed and it makes you think, with


the Paris conference coming on, is this another incident of global


warming, and the way that we deal with the world, because this will


change this town for ever -- a modern-day Bear Grylls. These


pictures here. Look at the size of that wave, it looks like it is


somewhere out at sea, rather than... This is Wales, of course. We


have been focusing on Cumbria but it has come down the Welsh course as


well. Pretty terrible in Ireland, too. Yes, and it was the severity.


This was a very severe storm, and certainly the amount of rain that


has fallen in such a short out of time. One report said they had had


in months's of rain in 24 hours, so this is the extreme conditions you


were speaking about, James. And we are in December, we have not even


got to spring, and spring tides, thinking of previous years. The


other aspect is which way the wind is blowing. It is coming from the


far south-west, and double figures there in terms of temperatures, so


we certainly have a climate change taking place. I think human spirit


is coming through as well? I love the story about this chap, calling


himself the modern-day Bear Grylls, rescuing many people from a flooded


car park in Carlisle. But you're right about the figures, eight


inches in the Cumbria and the monthly average is normally 3.4 so


it is no wonder the defences where overtopped with that incredible rush


of water coming so quickly, it is bound to overwhelm them. You cannot


do anything about it. It looks like we will be breaking the records on


this one. We did that three or four years before and it is quite


worrying because we do not know where we are going. No more records.


Now The Telegraph, this horrible incident at Leytonstone Tube with a


man attacking passengers on the platform? Not too far away from


where I live and like 6 million people go on the Tube everyday and


this is what terrorism is about, it terrorises you. Old people walking


past, people going to Christmas parties, people with children, 7pm


in the evening on Saturday before Christmas and this man allegedly


shouting, this is for Syria, running round slashing at slashing at people


at random with a machete, apparently. Very terrifying and the


good news is he was extremely quickly silenced by a Taser and he


was unable to inflict any more damage. It could have been much


worse. And the police who attended where Borough police who were not


armed and only had the Taser, so just showing you... The bravery is


extraordinary. They did a very good job. Many extraordinary things about


this as well. It was filmed, by a passenger, passer-by or whatever. I


am amazed someone would stand there filming it but in some respects at


least it gives a picture, because you know her so often after the


event, the police did this, the police did that, at least we have a


record taken at the time. The second thing is the phrase that some man,


shouted at the individual doing the shouted at the individual doing the


attacks, you ain't no Muslim, Bruv. And I think that tells us exactly


what is to be done, and that is that the Muslim community have to show


those in their community taking these extreme actions that this is


not what their religion, their faith, is all about. Let's look at


the Mail because it is also the headline there come on the front


page, and some pictures there. And you are right. It is extraordinary


when these happen and we see these pictures being taken. It was on


Twitter within minutes, and some of it was very shocking so I would not


recommend people look at it with all the blood and things but the police


have also been asking people to send in their footage, so probably there


were more people filming it who have not made their footage public, so it


is extraordinary, you are right, Angela. It is usually all down to


what happened, various incidents, and I think Rodney King was the game


changer, filmed by someone from an upstairs window 20 odd years ago and


that is when people fought, actually, you know, you cannot get


away with things. People will be phoning things -- people thought.


With all the brutality in America, and if this man, you know,


apparently from this footage, the court him in the act. We even have


the picture of the person taking the pictures. A telling story for today.


Let's turn to politics. The Independent. Furious, hitting back


at Corbyn's smears. Angela? Absolutely. This is quite


extraordinary. Isn't it extraordinary all this retribution


and infighting is taking place. It does show many of the MPs and others


did not accept his leadership in the first instance but, even so, this is


pretty strong stuff. Inside the paper it tells us that there is an


intention for a 3 pronged purge, as it were. One of the whip's office


because they see that as being instrumental in not having been


prepared to whip for that vote we had earlier this week on bombing


Syria. And the very fact that the Labour whip's office pressed for a


free vote. They are also speaking about the organisation, and this is


actually pretty interesting stuff, because of course we are heading for


that boundary review of constituencies where a number of


constituencies, something like 60, I think, will go. Who has the small


constituencies ends a predominately the cities is actually Labour so


there is a real Lord Bath in there. The third part is about this action


plan -- a real bloodbath. The reshuffling of the Shadow Cabinet


and I suspect that will come first, frankly. James, what you think tells


us? Without sounding too pretentious I think it is disastrous for


democracy. What is swirling around inside the Labour Party, the various


wings of the party. Rumours are circulating, furiously denied, that


Corbyn was unwell, that he passed out stress in his office last month.


That is absolutely denied by Corbyn's office but it describes the


vitriol swirling around. I speak not as a Conservative supporter but I


think it is extremely fortuitous -- fortunate for David Cameron he is


confronted with an opposition fighting itself and not the Tories.


That is bad for democracy because the opposition should be fighting


the Government, not itself. Looking at the Observer, the Corbyn critics


fearing what you mentioned, there eventually shuffle. Slightly more


damage, then? I think it is inevitable. Some would say Jeremy


Corbyn has actually had quite a good week because they had that free vote


and then also at the Oldham West while action, that was won. I am not


sure I exactly take that view, I have to say, but I would pick up


what James said. Every political party will always have its


reshuffles, it's different views on issues and it will have a bit of


factional eyes Asian. This is extraordinary, though. This is


faction fighting -- factional eyes. What you require for a good


democracy is proper decent challenge otherwise legislation goes through


where the principle may be fine but there are checks and balances in


this world and we rely on them coming out through our democratic


process. Let's move to the other end of the story, and the bombing raids


as a result, hitting the oil fields. James, what do you make of the


result of the vote and then leading into the raids taking place, almost,


people fought, within minutes? Angela used to be a very highly


regarded MP and it was an extremely difficult position for all those


memos of Parliament, we spoke about this earlier. The most difficult


decision in your political career, to send British people to go and


fight and potentially lose their lives for their country so I do not


envy those making the decision and nor do I told condone the attacks


made on mainly Labour MPs, female Labour MPs, actually. However I


think, and I had a big argued with my daughter yesterday about this, I


think it is right to go into Syria. IS does not see any distinction. It


views its territory as a caliphate to go into Syria. IS does not see


any distinction. It views its territory as a caliphate saw in


their eyes thought very powerful. If we had been bombed, as Paris was, or


attacked, as Paris was, and we had asked for their help and they had


said no, that would have been terrible. I think standing shoulder


to shoulder with France is the right thing to do however it is very grave


and I think it is right Parliament took it so seriously. It was the


right thing to do. Two other points to add. The first is that this is


about going for the oilfields as well. If you take out the oil, you


take out a source of finance. Only one source. Yes, only one source.


The other thing to look at in this argument is Libya. We are not


dealing with an organisation that is just in one place, in Isis or Daesh


or whatever we should call it. It has different parts, different


communities and groups associated with it and it can reform and


regroup and of course Libya is another place which is not under


control and where we can see what we may deal with in Syria reforming in


a different way. It is particularly scary because there is this


suggestion that possibly two or more of the French terrorists came


through Libya, and snuck in the back door, if you like, through Greece,


and that is very worrying. If they are seeing a way in to attack Europe


that is incredibly scary, terrorism in its true form, terrorising us. It


says Tunisia has closed its border to Libya and then the US is warning


that the town, and I may pronounce this wrong, Ajdabiya, is under


threat... Let's end on a lighter note. Greenhouse gases will fall.


Not a lot lighter. There has not been the greatest of continuation of


economic recovery. OK in the UK but not in other countries. This article


speaks about, this time, greenhouse gases not rising at the same time as


economic activity, so that is a critical point. I think it also


brings to the fore part of the whole greenhouse gases debate and how we


deal with them that we have not properly focused on. Most people, I


am sure, do sit very much in the camp saying we do need to do


something about our carbon footprint, our emissions and all


that stuff. Let's keep our countries, our world, as clean as


possible. Secondly, people do not then talk enough, in my view, about


all the practicalities and costs of dealing with it. Because we all can


have a really good policy, and idea, and emotional belief in something,


but unless we have the practicalities we will never get to


the right solution and hopefully that is where they are going now.


Absolutely, I agree with that. It is also tied in with this fall of coal


consumption in China. China produces 30% of these harmful emissions and


as their economy is relatively faltering that is the issue. But if


we do not press on with other renewable sources of energy we will


never solve this problem. I think most people saw the pictures from


China over the past week or two with the smog. The error is just


terrible. If you have been there, people wearing the masks. That's


right and that is why China has no bot into this because their own


population is suffering but you cannot put in a renewable without a


back-up, usually, because a renewable by its very nature can be


infinite soul it is about getting to the practicalities of the


engineering issues. That fantastic idea of putting a wind power turbine


in the air, in a sort of giant zeppelin thing, but if they could,


you know, find that to make it work, to catch the very strong wind at a


higher level, a fantastic idea. You have to transmit the power, of


course. And then... My chemistry or level is not standing up, perhaps.


Physics! I'm sure it would be done through Wi-Fi are something like


that. Physics, yes, you're right. I probably should not be in charge of


that policy. I will let you go off-mac and work that one out but


thank you both of you for coming in to join as on The Papers -- Go Off


And Work That One Out. Time for a look at the weather with


Phil Avery. A bit of jollity, we will soon put a


stop to


Download Subtitles