27/10/2017 The Papers


27/10/2017

No need to wait to see what's in the papers - tune in for a lively and informed conversation about the next day's headlines.


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LineFromTo

Hello and welcome to our look ahead

to what the the papers will be

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bringing us tomorrow.

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With me are Susie Boniface,

columnist at the Daily Mirror

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and Public Affairs

Consultant Alex Deane.

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Good evening.

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Tomorrow's front pages.

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The Financial Times has more

on Spain's move to sack Catalonia's

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regional government as the fallout

over independence deepens.

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The i is leading

with the same story.

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It says the police are ready

to intervene following Catalonia's

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declaration of independence.

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The Telegraph reports on warnings

from the European Commission

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president, who says the EU

doesn't need more cracks

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following Catalonia's

declaration of independence.

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The Daily Mail reports nine British

servicemen have been taken off

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a nuclear submarine amid sex

and drug allegations.

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The top story in the Daily Mirror

is the release of newly-declassified

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files related to the

assassination of JFK.

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Many of us have been looking through

them, trying to find something. And

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some people have, you have?

I have

found stuff that wasn't in it.

Very

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interesting. We will get to JK

shortly, everyone is talking about

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it again. But we will start with the

big story of the day -- JFK shortly.

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The crisis in Spain, it escalates,

that is the pretty blonde headline,

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it has been escalating for days, in

all fairness -- pretty blunt.

This

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is the latest drawn-out stage of the

catastrophe, chaos, goodness knows

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what is going to happen next, and

every day there seems to be a new

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disastrous thing that someone has

decided to do that will move things

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further towards some sort of reward

them. -- some sort of horrible

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event. The Catalan leader was

challenged in a way to declare

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independence after the referendum,

he said we will not declare

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independence, we want talks with

Spain, which were refused, and then

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he batted it over to the Catalonian

Parliament, and said you can decide.

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If he had decided it would have been

the chopping block for him, but he

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shouted over to the Parliament of

Catalonia and they said they would

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have independence, and the Madrid

Madrid -- government has said, no,

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you are going to have direct rule,

and what is going to happen next?

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Are we going to have a free and fair

election in which everyone in

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Catalonia votes for independence and

everyone accept the result? Do we

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have the kind of election which the

Catalonian independence movement is

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not going to approve of?

52-48 is a

decisive margin, anyway... I derive

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my view from the way people have

behaved, and the Madrid government

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could hardly have played this worse,

they sent people with riot shields

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and batons and beat grandmothers

away from polling booths, legal

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polling booths or not, they seized

ballot boxes.

The scenes in early

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October.

Exactly.

The Spanish police

are moving in and there is concern

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expressed about what you are talking

about.

How could you not fear that

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what happened when they conducted

the referendum in Catalonia, which

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no doubt would have passed off

peacefully if Madrid had not

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intervened, will be repeated, and

everyone remembers that Lincoln

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suspended habeas corpus in the

American Civil War.

Yeah, I remember

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that LAUGHTER

If you have studied American

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history, you will remember that. My

point is, that is what is happening

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here, the Catalonian Parliament

wants to secede from Spain and the

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government of Spain is sending in

the militia to stop them from being

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able to do so and imposing direct

rule, the stakes are that high.

Is

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it not the case of another part of

the world that is becoming

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antiestablishment and anti-austerity

and would like its own sake?

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Nationalism is on the rise? -- phone

said. It is the world order of today

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-- its own say.

The stakes are high,

because it is determining whether a

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country stays together or parts

ways, Lincoln won the fight and is

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regarded as a hero, but the criteria

for deciding whether a country is a

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country is very obvious, you have

defined borders, Catalonia has

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those, you have a defined population

and you are able in to enter into

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discussions with other states, and

clearly there is enough of a GDP

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here, this is the richest part of

Spain and there is enough activity

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that it could be a state, bigger

than some European states, so what

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is to stop them?

Let's move on to

The Daily Telegraph,. As with all of

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these claims of independence or a

change of world order, it affects

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everybody.

Yes, we live in a global

world.

The Telegraph are focusing on

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the potential ramifications for the

EU.

Much of the thrust for

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independence is based upon the fact

Catalonia feels they are in a strong

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position, not just supporting the

population, but they have a fit of

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the Spanish population and an awful

lot of their GDP and they feel they

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would be strong on their own. Across

the EU, every nation has a

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separatist breakaway movement

somewhere. Cornwall, Wales,

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Scotland, parts of Belgium and

France, Corsica and Venice. If that

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was to repeat across the EU, you

would have to have I suppose those

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states that wanted to have some kind

of independence, they would have to

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feel they also likely to wealth and

success on their own. Many of them

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will feel that is not the case, so

you won't have all of the EU

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splintering apart in the same way

and I doubt that other nations after

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watching Spain will have it in the

same way.

I put this to both of you,

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although I want to move on to other

stories. The Prime Minister of Spain

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has put this to a vote, whether this

can be trusted or not, remains to be

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seen, but he has put this to a vote

to the people of Catalonia.

It is

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hard to imagine the people who voted

for independence last time in the

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face of riot police won't do so

again, and the relatives and friends

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of theirs won't follow their

example. Madrid has made a real mess

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of this. If it was just an advisory

referendum they should have ignored

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it.

If you are going to have a

referendum that is this important,

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if you're going to call a vote, it

should be a proper referendum, not a

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revote in Parliament, it should be a

proper referendum with a binding

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turnout, you have got to have this

many people that will agree with you

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before you can achieve it.

Dialogue,

as well, which didn't happen. Now to

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another story on the front page of

The Daily Telegraph. This is in

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relation to a report in The Sun

newspaper about allegations of

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sexual harassment in Westminster by

researchers and other staff of the

I

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suppose this is relating to the

Harvey Weinstein scandal, moving

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into other areas of life and the

situation in Parliament, if you are

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an MP and you have an office with

staff, they are your employees and

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they are not Parliament's employees.

Parliament has its own employees,

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and what this story is about,

Parliament's standards boss, the

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Parliamentary authorities, asked

that the same rights should be given

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to all the people who work in the

Houses of Parliament, so MPs

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personal office staff have the same

implement rights as everyone else in

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the Houses of Parliament, and uses

MPs pushed back against that and

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they refused. -- and it says. That

is not what any of us would expect

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in a place where we work, and it

means that if you have a problem

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with your boss come there are only

three or four people in your boss

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and the boss has done it's you, --

and the boss has done it to you,

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then it is hard to know who to go

to, and that is the problem.

There

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is a help line.

Number ten has said

the right things, but it is

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impossible to imagine

parliamentarians could resist the

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pressure to have this properly

investigated and revealed if there

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are things to reveal, I think the

current climate will have the truth

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come out and those who say it

shouldn't our daft. -- are.

The

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truth came out about Donald Trump,

he admitted it, and he is still the

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leader of the free world.

Now to the

Financial Times. Maybe a story that

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makes the world look a bit better.

This is something we were warned

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about after Brexit, Humvees were

going to flee the country. --

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companies.

We were told everything,

and as they say, we haven't left

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yet, but as someone who is a

Brexiteer and who thinks that our

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future will be bright, I must be as

sceptical about stories like this as

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I should be about stories when it

says such and such a company is

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going to leave, and the fact is, all

these company 's posturing to seek

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the maximum advantage for their

company, so if someone moves in

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their direction, they say,

fantastic, more likely, but if they

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don't get the noises they want, they

say, I had a nice trip to Frankfurt

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and the weather was lovely. We have

got to be sceptical on those kind of

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announcements, and the same way we

have got to be sceptical about the

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press conferences we see happening

after the negotiations because we

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might think we have lived with

Brexit for ever but we are still in

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the Eddie stages. -- early.

Exactly,

we have got to be sceptical about

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everything we heard about Brexit,

because there wasn't that much that

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was clear about what Brexit

involved.

I don't believe that.

If

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it was clear, the negotiation would

be over?

What was clear was the

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decision, we would be able to govern

ourselves, and negotiate with others

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on our own esteem and control our

own borders, and elation ship with

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other countries is complex, but the

way we weather turning the won --

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and the relationship with other

countries is complex, but the way we

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were determining our own future,

that was clear.

And now we have got

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a highly critical report which is

the NHS was hit by the Wannacry

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attack, because of cyber security

failings. It goes into more detail?

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It says the same thing.

It does a

bit. The National Audit Office says

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one in three NHS trusts were hit by

the cyber attack, because they

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updated things less than most. With

attacks like this it is seeking the

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weakest victim, like the burglar who

goes along the street, the dummy

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camera over your house might not

protect you from a determined

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burglar but they might move onto the

next house. The point is not that

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the NHS security systems were bad,

the point is that they were amongst

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the worst and that is why the NHS

suffered so badly.

I'm determined

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Susie can talk about the next story.

These are allegations regarding nine

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sailors. What do you know from the

front page question not they will be

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court-martialed, probably, standard

operating procedure that if someone

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is accused of something, they are

removed from their operating vessel.

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They might not all go to court

martial, but the allegations are

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that nine sub Mariner 's were found

to have tested positive for cocaine,

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some or all of them while on duty,

and one man is said to have sex with

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a prostitute in a swimming pool.

What a difficult place to have sex

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with anybody, really. The

interesting thing is that not that

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this happened with the military,

because there are thousands of

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people in the military, but the fact

you had nine from one vessel, one

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vote. -- one vote.

Allegedly.

It was

carrying the nuclear deterrent, and

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they are also sub Mariner 's, they

are the most highly trained and most

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carefully selected people within the

senior service and that is because

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they have to be able to be the kind

of people who can operate under

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water for six months at a time

without soap and deodorant or raises

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and an extremely high pressure

situations, part of their training

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is you have two escape from an

underwater submersion situation, but

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you can't do that if you are someone

who panics and if you go on shore

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and takes a load of class a drugs.

There may be more to it?

Yes. But

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whoever was in charge of the

submarine training school, they

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might have a quick look at how on

earth these people, if they are

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found guilty, got through the

training process.

We have had a

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statement from the Ministry of

Defence which confirms nine British

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servicemen have been dismissed from

duty from HMS vigilant which carries

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the Trident deterrent. The tests

moved positive. The Royal Navy says

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they don't tolerate drug misuse by

service personnel and those found to

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have fallen short of their high

standards face being discharged from

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service.

Drug testing is fairly

regular in the service, as well, so

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you have got to be pretty dumb to do

that.

Most people pass these things

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with flying colours, so this is an

outlier, if true.

The big talking

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point, even if there is nothing that

much new, the JFK files, and many

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papers have gone pretty big on this,

look at The Daily Mirror. The front

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page. You have been looking through

this, is there anything we are

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learning which is new?

This is the

most fascinating and gripping

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mystery that has been for most of my

lifetime, and people will always

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talk about this, which is why the

tabloids will be doing it, but

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business solution or answer to the

conspiracy theories. This is a

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re-stoke in and putting the fire

underneath everything to keep people

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asking questions.

It shows a few

things, like most people who look at

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the evidence, it is difficult to

believe one shooter conducted the

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assassination of JFK. Weird things

happen, the magic bullet theory

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might be true, that is what the

bullet did in the path of all that

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damage to the president, but the

papers reveal that the FBI revealed

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at the time -- that the FBI at the

time did not think that Lee Harvey

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's bald acted alone. -- Lee Harvey

Oswald. The point is, pretty

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understandably and predictably, at

the time the FBI had people who are

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questioning what was determined to

be the ultimate truth, and also they

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reveal that J Edgar Hoover came down

very heavy and very early in his

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decision to say, we just need to say

that the Harvey Oswald was the

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killer and was the only shooter, and

that might have been true in the

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end, but it was like one of those

uneasy things, you have no right to

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know that at the time.

What you did

have the time, total panic. Complete

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panic within the FBI and CIA,

everyone else around the no one

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knowing what happened, and what you

won't have in these files, any kind

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of memo that says, there seems to be

some kind of wing nut responsible

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for this, who we noticed six months

ago and we should have collared him

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and he has gone and done some

stupid. We can think of terrorism

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incidents in the last 12 months ago

where police have known about

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someone but he has got lucky and

done something anyway, it is that

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scenario. That doesn't suit the

conspiracy theorists.

That is right.

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The one thing I thought, many of the

files mentioned the conspiracy

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theories, as well, as lines of

investigation.

Yes, it started very

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early.

The dead express now. British

newspaper got tipped off before the

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Kennedy assassination Ash the Daily

Express. Someone got in touch with a

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Cambridge newspaper reporter.

25

minutes before the shooting, a

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senior reporter at the Cambridge

news got a phone call saying there

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was going to be big news from the US

embassy. And then it happened. I

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think the person at the CIA who was

doing the whole conspiracy dialled

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the wrong number.

It depends on the

person reporting, these things very

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quickly cement into truth, they fit

a conspiracy theory and are

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constantly challenged if they don't,

and it is just as likely that

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someone got the time wrong.

Alex and

Suzy, thanks for joining us.

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That's it for The Papers tonight.

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Don't forget you can see the front

pages of the papers online

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on the BBC News website.

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It's all there for you -

seven days a week at

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bbc.co.uk/papers - and if you miss

the programme any

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evening you can watch it

later on BBC iPlayer.

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Thank you Susie and Alex.

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Goodbye.

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