27/11/2011 The Politics Show North East and Cumbria

Here: MPs call on the BBC to protect

services as it looks to cut 2000 jobs.

And is this nurse right to join public sector workers in strike

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2018 seconds

Hello, and a very warm welcome to your local part of the show. Coming

This Cumbrian nurse will be among tens of thousands of people

striking on Wednesday over their pension. But is industrial action

really justified? First, it is clear that the BBC has

to make cuts. A five-year freeze in the licence fee means the

corporation needs to save 20% of its budget, and shed 2,000 jobs.

Some of those cuts are planned for local stations like Radio Cumbria,

BBC Tees and Newcastle. Local weather presentation and regional

current affairs will also be hit. And that threat has pushed North

East MPs into action. They have warned the BBC chairman that

coverage could be reduced to a "bare minimum". But in an age of

austerity, shouldn't the BBC share in the pain?

Good morning, Peter. Breakfast on BBC Tees. Pick listening time and a

programme where the audience plays a big part. We reflect their

passions for living here, sometimes their frustrations, disappointments

and successes. The relationship that we have with people who listen

to BBC Tees is essential and hope Felipe is a very strong one.

BBC says cuts should not affect the show, but afternoon, evening and

some weekend programming will be shed regionally or across the whole

of England for all local radio stations. We have got less money

and what we are doing as a business is thinking, where shall we put the

money so listeners do not suffer? Breakfast, mid-morning, drive-time

and sport is where 86% of the audience spend their time. Where we

have less money, if we can protect that side of the business, it is

more important than spending money on off-peak times such as

afternoons. That is certainly not the News Brian wants to hear. He

has been tuning into BBC Tees for 40 years. Since his wife died, it

has become a lifeline. He says the changes are unacceptable. It no

longer became the local radio anymore, you were getting

programmes from Manchester, Leeds, Newcastle. It loses its identity,

so I think Teesside, North Yorkshire and Durham will be short-

changed. The problem for stations like BBC Tees, Newcastle and

Cumbria if it is not just about sharing programmes. They all stand

to lose 20% of their budget under the cuts. For somewhere like teas,

it means 10 jobs will have to get. There are some who believe if that

goes ahead, a local radio stations will never sound the same again.

Sharing programmes in the afternoon would save perhaps two jobs on the

station that did not have its programme, but they are talking

between 7 and 9 so where are the other jobs coming from? They have

to come from the other programmes, so of course they will be affected.

It is simple mathematics. And there are other cuts are causing concern.

The region's Inside Out team has won awards for investigations into

the likes of Southern Cross but faces a 40% cut in its budget,

something that was raised in Parliament this week. It is really

important that investigative journalism has the scale and the

presence locally to be able to identify a issues of such

significance to local people's lives such as Southern Cross.

families up and down the country are trying to manage their budgets

as well, it is not the right time to substantially increase the BBC

licence fee. What the BBC does have which no other media in this

company has, and indeed very few companies around the world have,

his certainty of funding until March 2017. That is certainly a

luxury that commercial radio would kill for. They rely and adverts to

pay for their programmes and depression in that market has hit

many stations hard. But this station believes it has found ways

to stay local and improve what it offers. I think we have how are now

have, we have got a strategy that is clear, that is all about local,

-- we have held our nerve. It would have been wrong to consolidate all

go down the network grid because that is not what we're about, and

it has enabled us to sustain and grow audiences. The BBC is also

convinced it will still serve local audiences well even after the

cutbacks. Some MPs and listeners beg to differ. But in the current

can natural climate, is there really any choice? -- in the

current economic climate. With me now to talk about that is

the Conservative Euro MP for Yorkshire, Timothy Kirkhope, who

has a keen interest in local broadcasting. Also with me,

Labour's Joyce McCarty, the deputy leader of Newcastle Council whose

cabinet this week discussed the BBC cuts.

Timothy Kirkhope, the Government appears, if you listened to Ed

Vaizey this week, to back the cuts. Is the BBC doing the right thing?

It is not right to said the government are backing these cuts.

P indicated the possibility of certain cuts in certain areas.

There is currently a consultation going on in the BBC to which I know

we have all contributed, I have contributed by her own views as to

how the BBC might economise, might keep within its budget that it has

now, and I am very much hoping that the regional and local side of the

BBC's output will be as affected as little as possible. But Ed Vaizey

went on to say, the director general has broadcasting at his

heart. The kind of defended the BBC. I suspect ultimately isn't that

because the licence fee freeze, the burdens based on the BBC, were put

there by the government to. Don't they share the blame in the cuts?

The alternative was to increase the licence fee for consumers in

difficult economic situations at the moment, so I think it is quite

right that the BBC should be required to examine its budget and

should be able to come up with savings and economies, but I think

it is a question of where does fall, and I and a lot of my colleagues,

and I speak also as a Euro MP, I don't want to see, for instance,

projected cuts in coverage of the European Parliament and wider world

right issues, we have our own priorities, I'm sure my colleague

has her priorities, I have mine, but local and regional television

and radio seemed to be now to be more important than ever,

particularly with the demise of local and regional coverage from

ITV and the pressures now on the commercial radio broadcasters

themselves. Joyce McCarty, I am sure you will not vastly disagree

with that, but the BBC is where it is what the money it has got, but

it is trying to protect the programmes that are most important,

even news programmes like Look North are protected. Is that the

right approach? It is party the right approach. I think we also

should be doing our best to protect local radio because local radio has

a major impact in this region and getting my colleagues and I have

huge concerns about losing some aspects of that and as the report

showed, the investigative journalism aspects. What the BBC

says is, if you have got a limited amount of money, you invest in the

programmes people listen to, breakfast, drive time mid-morning.

The afternoon programmes are less important. If they have to make

cuts, that is where they should make them? I guess we would have

some sympathy with that because it has to be based on audience figures,

but I think the key concern for us would be the loss of local jobs as

well and there are a number of jobs going in Newcastle based on these

proposals and clearly that race is concerned. In a way, what you said

was almost certain the BBC an impossible task. You want to

protect local services, one to protect world news. Other Net

website radios 2, 5 Live, taking similar hits to local radio. The

Conservatives wanted a smaller BBC, you can't man about it? I don't

think the Conservatives wanted a smaller BBC. I think a lot of

Conservatives do. I am not talking for all Conservatives, we value the

BBC, but we want it to economise in the same way as everybody else is

having to at the moment. What I would say if it is interesting

talking about having syndicated material during parts of the day

for different radio stations. I must admit I am nervous about that

one if it takes the character of the radio station away. I remember

when BBC Radio Durham came in. The first radio station the BBC set-up,

no longer there now, but the key point of the BBC radio stations has

been a character and localism of what they do and I hope the BBC

will consider that when they come to their decision. Joyce, you run a

council which has had to go through this process and I am sure he will

say the council is not a worse council. I am sure the BBC can do

the same? They have to consider all of the options and that big in the

consultation, when we respond to that, we will do as much as that to

protect local radio -- we will do as much as we can. We like to hear

from local residents in phone-in programmes, opportunities for us to

listen directly to residents which are important and indeed the Inside

Out programme, the investigative work around races and in Sunderland,

the Southern Cross issues, they are important -- around or races and in

Sunderland. Thank you Deri much.

-- thank you very much. And there is more on the BBC cuts

on my blog. The address in on the screen now.

There is little doubt what next week's big story will be. It is the

strike action being planned by around 2 million public sector

workers on Wednesday. The level of disruption is likely to be high.

Many schools have already announced they are closing. The Tyne and Wear

Metro will be suspended, while most council services will also be

affected. In a moment, I will be asking my guests whether such

action is justified. But first our Cumbria reporter Emily Unia has

been talking to two people about their pensions, the issue right at

the heart of this dispute. Next Wednesday, Liz Walsh will not

be going to work. She will be on the picket line like thousands of

public sector workers across Cumbria and the north-east. She has

been a nurse for 20 years, attracted back to the NHS from the

private sector by better pay and prospects. But government proposals

to change public sector pensions will leave her significantly worse

off. I feel very angry that something that was agreed, to me a

contract, it stands in law, that ministers feel they can just take

that away from the and change that, and I feel sad that things that I

had planned for my retirement are not likely to happen, and I am sad

that I have got to keep on working when physically I may no longer be

up to the job. Liz Burns �34,000 a year. Government changes means she

needs to pay �1,000 more each year into her pension scheme and will

also have to work longer, retiring at 66 instead of 60. This is an

agreement that was made that they are trying to turn around, and

instead of a strapping our standards we should all be working

together to increase the standards for the people who work in the

private sector -- in the public sector. Strike action is the last

port of call, and investigations are ongoing and we hope they will

be successful but we feel we have been backed into a corner by the

ministers and this is the only way of getting our voices heard. But,

for many, refusing to work for a day is not an option. Emma Barnes

runs a cake-making company from her home in Carlisle. It seems a little

unfair that they have that power to hold us to ransom and strike and

cause a disruption when there is nothing more that we can do. It

affects me on a personal level because my children will now be off

school, that means a day off work for me. I don't know whether I

would have a bit more sympathy if it wasn't affecting in that way. It

is a difficult situation. I can appreciate what they are striking

for but I am not sure whether the strikes are going to have the

effect that they are hoping. As a self-employed worker, Emir should

be planning for the future, saving money each month into a private

pension. She isn't. My personal circumstances don't allow me to put

anything away. I was on a really good salary, recession hit, it was

cut drastically, and then I had to look for a job, which was half the

salary I was on before. I have still got the same financial

commitments that everybody else has, I have set up working from home, I

barely make a salary from the products that I sell because people

are just not able to spend that amount of money, but, as I say, I

cannot hold anybody to ransom. We just have to get on with it and

hope that the economy picks up. there is no sign of that happening

any time soon. The pensions issue divides opinion, and so will next

week's strikes. But with more than 20 union set to walk out, it will

be hard to avoid the destruction. - - disruption.

Thousands of council workers your employee will be on strike next

Wednesday. Do you support their cause? That is a difficult question.

The leadership of the city council will not condone industrial action

because we want to be responsible employers, but we also have

sympathy with the issues that the staff of the city council are

raised in. Do you think they are wrong to go on strike? It is their

right as workers, the rules allowed them to take industrial action.

They have been offered an improved deal, are they wrong to go on

strike? They have been offered pensions that are still better than

many peoples and the private sector. The public sector-private sector

issue is tricky, because we should not be saying public sector workers

get, as the government have called them, gold-plated pensions. The

average pension for most workers is 3,500 to �4,000, that is not gold

plated. Some people in the private sector will get more than that.

What the Government's issue should be is to help people in the private

sector to improve their pensions. The nurse we saw in the film does

not want to strike but feels she has a commitment, a contract on her

pension, that the government is Rene Dean Mumm. I don't think that

is true, -- that the government is backing out on. Having listened to

the recommendations of a considerable number of people

including trades unions representatives... People will not

take a situation lying down to pay �1,000 extra a year and were it

gets to six years when they cannot plan for it. The truth is we are

all missing longer and will have to work longer because of bad -- we

are all living longer. We would be very envious of the public sector

situation, I am concerned we will have a dispute which is going to

cost the economy, we cannot afford it at the moment, another half a

billion pounds for one day. Only a quarter of the member of the unions

who bothered to turn out in ballot in favour of having a strike, and

the people of this country should be very concerned about that. We

simply cannot afford it. But in the middle of negotiations we are going

to have this incredibly disruptive strike. That is not right. We saw

Emma, she might be justifiably furious about this, she was quite

calm, but it will cause disruption to people who have to keep their

children off school. We accept that, but it is the right of the workers

to take that action, and the workers tell us they are soaked

frustrated about negotiations that there is nothing new on the table,

the negotiations we are hearing this week is that nothing more will

be offered. That does not sound like continuing Nick associations,

it sounds like we are not negotiation and of -- not

negotiating enough. We have predicted people within 10 years of

retirement, people in lower pay, the people we should be most

concerned about, the lower paid workers will not have a

deterioration, they will have an improvement in their pension. The

things that have come out should be more than enough to make the union

leaders think again, they should think again and there should not be

a strong. Is it fair that people like Emma, in the film, when they

pay taxes will be effectively subsidising people who have

perfected the God Pensions when she has not got a pension herself?

who have effectively got pensions. We are doing a lot of support

people in am a's position to get a pension. It costs �100,000 to

secure a pension of around three and a half �1,000. And it costs

Emma Moore to get her pension because in terms of age people now

live longer. The government's focus seems to be on undermining public

sector pensions. Should and the focus be helping people like Emma

get their own pensions? government is responsible for

public sector pensions, not for private sector pensions.

Individuals are, small business people are. The Government should

help those people who have to get their own pensions but they have a

duty to look at the nature of pensions for the people for whom

they are responsible. What is being done for someone like Emma? We have

to look at the tax system to see if we can help people who invest in

their own pensions. The situation is clear, she cannot afford it.

Everybody is having a problem. The economy has been in difficulty for

a while, we want to get it going again, that is the main priority,

and it will help them and everybody else. But the public sector is the

direct responsibility of government and the government cannot afford to

give in to the sorts of demands which the unions are demanding at

the moment. Joyce, Ed Miliband has been warm about this, saying they

should be striking in the middle of negotiations. -- they should not be

striking. Should and Labour be supporting this? We are taking a

motion to city council in November in support of the discussions to

encourage the government to continue those discussions and work

with trade unions to ensure this issue is sorted. We have to leave

in there. Thank you very much. And if you would like to have your

say about the industrial action, my colleague Mark Denten will be

getting views in Durham next week. All you need to do is turn up at

Market Place from 10am on Wednesday morning, that is the day of the

strikes, and you can put your question face-to-face to the trade

unions and the politicians who will be in the hot seat. You never know,

they might even answer them. Watch Look North that night to see what

happens. Before that, of course, it is the

Chancellor's autumn statement on Tuesday. You can follow it all in a