30/06/2016 Thursday in Parliament


30/06/2016

Highlights of proceedings in Parliament on Thursday 30 June, presented by Alicia McCarthy.


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Transcript


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Hello there, and welcome to Thursday in Parliament.

:00:13.:00:14.

Still in a holding pattern - the Transport Secretary says there'll

:00:15.:00:20.

be no decision on airport expansion before the summer.

:00:21.:00:25.

Fresh calls for a second referendum on our EU membership.

:00:26.:00:28.

And fury in the Commons at the performance

:00:29.:00:30.

I'm getting people writing to me who are being late for work every day,

:00:31.:00:41.

and their bosses are giving them written warnings now.

:00:42.:00:44.

But first - outside the Commons chamber, it was another day full

:00:45.:00:47.

of surprises as the Conservative leadership challengers

:00:48.:00:49.

announced their intention to stand for the top job.

:00:50.:00:51.

The Work and Pensions Secretary Stephen Crabb had

:00:52.:00:53.

There was confirmation from former Defence Secretary

:00:54.:00:57.

Liam Fox and Energy Minister Andrea Leadsom.

:00:58.:01:00.

The Home Secretary Theresa May had long been touted as a contender,

:01:01.:01:03.

But the big surprise was that this man, Michael Gove,

:01:04.:01:10.

currently the Justice Secretary, was launching a bid -

:01:11.:01:13.

and that this man, Boris Johnson, was not.

:01:14.:01:17.

Inside the Commons, as MPs chatted and absorbed

:01:18.:01:20.

the somewhat unexpected line-up, the Transport Secretary had

:01:21.:01:22.

an announcement of his own to make about the airport expansion

:01:23.:01:25.

I had hoped that we would be able to announce a decision on airport

:01:26.:01:34.

Clearly any announcement on airport capacity

:01:35.:01:36.

would have to be made when the House is

:01:37.:01:38.

in session, and being realistic, given recent events,

:01:39.:01:40.

I cannot now foresee an announcement until at least October.

:01:41.:01:46.

Heathrow and Gatwick have been vying to get approval

:01:47.:01:48.

Last July, the Airport Commission recommended Heathrow be expanded

:01:49.:01:55.

with a third runway at an estimated cost of ?18.6 billion.

:01:56.:01:59.

But in December, the Government delayed its decision,

:02:00.:02:02.

saying further work on noise, pollution and compensation

:02:03.:02:07.

MPs on all sides lined up to condemn the further delay.

:02:08.:02:13.

It's another boring day at Westminster.

:02:14.:02:15.

I was rather hoping that the Secretary of

:02:16.:02:17.

State might inject some excitement into it for me.

:02:18.:02:21.

No one can accuse the Secretary of State of rushing this decision.

:02:22.:02:26.

But post-Brexit, with a number of countries now banging on the door

:02:27.:02:29.

of the UK to do trade deals, doesn't he agree with me that

:02:30.:02:32.

increasing airport capacity both at London City,

:02:33.:02:35.

London Heathrow and Gatwick is going to be vitally important

:02:36.:02:38.

to British businesses throughout the whole of United Kingdom?

:02:39.:02:42.

Well, Mr Speaker, I can say I would have liked to have been

:02:43.:02:46.

in a position of asking the House to make a decision and

:02:47.:02:49.

We are not going to be in that position.

:02:50.:02:55.

He may regard this a boring day in the House of Commons,

:02:56.:03:00.

but it's certainly not a boring day in Westminster.

:03:01.:03:02.

Yet more dithering on a decision on whether to expand Hub capacity

:03:03.:03:06.

at Heathrow will harm the regions of this country and

:03:07.:03:09.

What recommendation will be Secretary of State be making

:03:10.:03:16.

Well, I think one step at a time, Mr Speaker, if I don't mind saying

:03:17.:03:25.

to the honourable lady she's assuming a number of events

:03:26.:03:27.

But what I would say to the honourable lady

:03:28.:03:38.

in all seriousness as chairman of the Transport Select Committee

:03:39.:03:41.

is that I think this is a very important and the decision

:03:42.:03:44.

for the United Kingdom, and it is not an easy one.

:03:45.:03:46.

The simple fact is, whichever options we choose will impact

:03:47.:03:49.

a number of people's lives, and therefore it is right to make

:03:50.:03:52.

sure that we do all the work and the preparation for this,

:03:53.:03:54.

all around air quality and the other issues.

:03:55.:03:56.

But I very much hope a decision can be made later this year.

:03:57.:03:59.

His answer is exacerbating the profound uncertainty

:04:00.:04:01.

about the future of essential transport projects, including HS2

:04:02.:04:03.

Hundreds of thousands of jobs and apprenticeships

:04:04.:04:11.

Does he not understand that delaying these plans adds to the wider

:04:12.:04:16.

economic shock that was triggered last week, and that public

:04:17.:04:19.

and private investment in our transport networks

:04:20.:04:22.

When she talks about airport capacity, there was an airport

:04:23.:04:28.

capacity issue for 30 years of which her party

:04:29.:04:30.

was in Government, of which they did nothing.

:04:31.:04:32.

Can the Secretary of State not accept that kicking this decision

:04:33.:04:35.

into the long grass yet again is simply and utterly unacceptable?

:04:36.:04:42.

Well, Mr Speaker, we are accused of kicking something

:04:43.:04:45.

I've said that I hope to see a decision by the end of the year.

:04:46.:04:52.

What we've not seen yet is a position which has been

:04:53.:04:57.

expanded from the opposition benches as to which of the options

:04:58.:05:00.

On airport expansion, he has achieved one thing.

:05:01.:05:04.

He's made the Leader of the Opposition look

:05:05.:05:05.

Does he not believe that he owes the select committee,

:05:06.:05:10.

this House and businesses across the UK an apology

:05:11.:05:13.

for the fudge that has become a farce?

:05:14.:05:21.

Well, Mr Speaker, I have often thought the members of the SNP

:05:22.:05:24.

If he thinks I've made the Leader of the Opposition look decisive,

:05:25.:05:28.

he has proved that this morning in spades.

:05:29.:05:29.

I stand by the statement I made earlier on.

:05:30.:05:32.

I would have liked to have been in the position to do it,

:05:33.:05:35.

but realistically that is not possible at a time when the House

:05:36.:05:38.

is not sitting, and therefore I have informed the House this morning,

:05:39.:05:41.

While another MP thought there'd be repercussions well

:05:42.:05:46.

The third runway for Heathrow would allow some 16 billion

:05:47.:05:51.

of private investment at a time that the economy needs it most.

:05:52.:05:54.

The chief executive of George Best Belfast City Airport

:05:55.:06:00.

has said that the Heathrow Hub is vital in making Northern Ireland

:06:01.:06:03.

accessible to business and leisure passengers from all

:06:04.:06:05.

It is really important for Belfast city.

:06:06.:06:08.

Well, the Davis Report made very clear the importance of collectivity

:06:09.:06:13.

in the south-east to the regions, the North of England,

:06:14.:06:18.

to Ulster, Scotland and elsewhere, and we are very mindful of those

:06:19.:06:21.

issues that have been raised by colleagues from

:06:22.:06:23.

There have been calls in the House of Lords for a change in the way

:06:24.:06:31.

allegations of historical child sex abuse are investigated.

:06:32.:06:34.

Some peers were critical of the way the police and the Church of England

:06:35.:06:37.

have treated a number of accused individuals.

:06:38.:06:42.

Conservative Lord Lexden said it was time for a code of conduct

:06:43.:06:45.

for the police and public authorities, with the presumption

:06:46.:06:47.

This month has brought a powerful reminder of some of the principle

:06:48.:06:53.

causes of the disquiet that has arisen.

:06:54.:06:57.

Sir Cliff Richard has been told that he is not to face charges

:06:58.:07:00.

arising from the investigation of allegations relating to purported

:07:01.:07:02.

The allegations were made two years ago,

:07:03.:07:10.

in a blaze of publicity created by the police

:07:11.:07:14.

and the BBC, acting in grotesque collusion

:07:15.:07:16.

before he had even been interviewed.

:07:17.:07:18.

Such a media circus should never have occurred.

:07:19.:07:23.

Could it have been the fact that the initial

:07:24.:07:26.

complainant was under 16 at the time

:07:27.:07:29.

of the allegation which created the temptation that led

:07:30.:07:31.

these two public organisations to take action at Sir Cliff's expense?

:07:32.:07:34.

How can we ensure that nothing of this kind happens again?

:07:35.:07:39.

He said there were other examples of what he called

:07:40.:07:41.

The manner in which Field Marshal Lord Bramall

:07:42.:07:46.

So did the distress inflicted on Lord Brittan

:07:47.:07:55.

during his final illness, and the additional pain suffered by

:07:56.:07:58.

The sight of a senior police officer standing outside Sir Edward Heath's

:07:59.:08:05.

former home in Salisbury and exhorting those who had allegations

:08:06.:08:08.

Lord Dear is a friend of Lord Bramall, who retired

:08:09.:08:12.

When it comes to carrying out an investigation,

:08:13.:08:19.

it surely is totally inappropriate to turn up at his house

:08:20.:08:24.

in a small market town with marked police cars with 20,

:08:25.:08:26.

no less than, 20 officers in white scenes of crime

:08:27.:08:30.

suits to carry out a search

:08:31.:08:32.

of his property and a blaze of publicity.

:08:33.:08:37.

It seems that we have lurched as a society from the

:08:38.:08:39.

extremities of the mishandling of the Savile case into the extremes

:08:40.:08:44.

identified in the current cases, and we need to

:08:45.:08:59.

put the balance point back where it belongs.

:09:00.:09:01.

My Lords, I, too, and very troubled by the ease in

:09:02.:09:03.

which complaints going back years can trash, tarnish and destroy

:09:04.:09:06.

Without evidence, in recent years, as we've heard, with the accusations

:09:07.:09:10.

against Lord Bramall, Lord Brittan, Paul Gambaccini, the DJ, and Sir

:09:11.:09:12.

Last October, the Church of England settled a claim from a woman

:09:13.:09:17.

who said she was abused by the late Bishop of Chichester, George Bell,

:09:18.:09:21.

So Bishop George Bell was judged a paedophile

:09:22.:09:26.

The crushing of his memory and magnificent career

:09:27.:09:35.

The man described by Ian Kershaw, the leading historian of

:09:36.:09:42.

the war years, as the most significant English clergyman of

:09:43.:09:48.

the 20th century, is now being ruined, in the words of supporters

:09:49.:09:55.

of George Bell, by an anonymous, unpublished claim upheld by

:09:56.:09:59.

a non-court which won't explain this decision.

:10:00.:10:04.

The Bishop of Chelmsford defended the church's handling of the case.

:10:05.:10:07.

The legal advice was that, had the claim been tested by a court,

:10:08.:10:12.

on the balance of probabilities, Carol would have won her claim.

:10:13.:10:17.

In those circumstances, the proper thing to do was to settle

:10:18.:10:22.

the case rather than putting a survivor through

:10:23.:10:24.

the harrowing process of giving evidence.

:10:25.:10:30.

A Home Office spokesman, Lord Keen, said it was for the police

:10:31.:10:33.

to investigate abuse allegations and the College of Policing -

:10:34.:10:36.

which was independent of Government - issued guidance on best practice.

:10:37.:10:42.

He said the College did have powers, though, to put that guidance

:10:43.:10:45.

You're watching Thursday in Parliament with me, Alicia McCarthy.

:10:46.:10:57.

The mass resignations from Labour's frontbench have thrown up

:10:58.:10:59.

perhaps none more so than the appearance

:11:00.:11:02.

of Paul Flynn, serial rebel and veteran backbencher,

:11:03.:11:05.

speaking as Shadow Leader of the Commons.

:11:06.:11:09.

He served for a year as shadow health spokesman

:11:10.:11:12.

You may be a tad surprised to see me in this position, because

:11:13.:11:24.

for the past 26 years I have been a backbencher by choice.

:11:25.:11:29.

That wasn't just my choice, it was the choice of

:11:30.:11:33.

But today, for very positive reasons, as part of a diversity

:11:34.:11:43.

project in my party of which we have done splendidly,

:11:44.:11:45.

we have a far more women on the front bench in

:11:46.:11:48.

but a total absence on the front bench of octogenarians.

:11:49.:12:01.

post will be a trailblazer which will lead to all

:12:02.:12:08.

short-listed in the party and lead to the wealth of experience and

:12:09.:12:14.

wisdom among fellow octogenarians being available to the House.

:12:15.:12:17.

He turned to Brexit - there should be a second

:12:18.:12:20.

referendum, he said - people had voted on "false agendas".

:12:21.:12:28.

Where is the emergency budget? The public are rightly outraged by the

:12:29.:12:37.

missed truth they were told by the propagandists on both sides. It is

:12:38.:12:42.

not a surprise we have a petition of historic dimensions, as big as the

:12:43.:12:47.

chartists and suffragettes put before this House. 4 million

:12:48.:12:52.

signatures and counting of people who say they were deceived by the

:12:53.:12:58.

vote, the propaganda and which was largely determined by the

:12:59.:13:01.

proprietors of the daily newspapers rather than a sensible realisation

:13:02.:13:05.

of the horrors to come. The Commons Leader,

:13:06.:13:07.

a Leave campaigner, If we have a general election

:13:08.:13:08.

and our side loses, we do We had a four-month debate,

:13:09.:13:18.

arguements on both sides, huge amounts of information

:13:19.:13:24.

for the country and they It is our job to follow

:13:25.:13:26.

that decision to And I have to say

:13:27.:13:30.

it is nice after four months of hedging my

:13:31.:13:34.

bets on these benches, Government to be back in a clear

:13:35.:13:41.

way, speaking for the whole government in saying that we now

:13:42.:13:45.

need to get on with the job Scotland will not be taken out of

:13:46.:13:57.

the European Union against their will. We were forced to choose in a

:13:58.:14:01.

Referendum, we have given that decision and it is very clear what

:14:02.:14:05.

Scotland wanted. When will he respect the decision of the Scottish

:14:06.:14:11.

people? Scotland voted to be part of the United Kingdom. The United

:14:12.:14:17.

Kingdom voted to leave the European Union. I am afraid that is

:14:18.:14:21.

democracy. fun at the Tories and Labour

:14:22.:14:23.

over their leadership troubles. Can we have a week long debate

:14:24.:14:26.

on political backstabbing? want to take part, but they are rank

:14:27.:14:29.

amateurs compared to the Right Honourable member for Surrey Heath,

:14:30.:14:42.

the Lord Macbeth of this today is despatching

:14:43.:14:44.

the Prime Minister's greatest rival. What makes the leader of the House

:14:45.:14:53.

think Lord Macbeth's dagger will not soon be turned to him and

:14:54.:14:56.

the Home Secretary? Chris Grayling is supporting

:14:57.:14:58.

Theresa May for the leadership - The Right Honourable member

:14:59.:15:00.

for Surrey Heath has been in my view an excellent

:15:01.:15:08.

education Secretary, excellent chief whip

:15:09.:15:09.

and is now doing an excellent job in

:15:10.:15:10.

the role I used to perform

:15:11.:15:12.

as Lord Chancellor. He has friends and confidence

:15:13.:15:19.

on this side of the House. And for the Scottish National Party

:15:20.:15:21.

he is a formidable adversary. A Labour MP returned

:15:22.:15:24.

to Paul Flynn's appointment... Can I take leave of the House

:15:25.:15:26.

that the contribution of my somewhat younger parliamentary

:15:27.:15:29.

colleague is an illustration of how the army here is always willing

:15:30.:15:38.

to give whatever assistance is necessary when firm leadership

:15:39.:15:42.

at the moment is on both sides? The Speaker, John Bercow,

:15:43.:15:45.

wished Mr Winnick a happy birthday. Could there be health effects

:15:46.:15:47.

of Britain's departure from the EU? Well, a Labour peer has

:15:48.:15:56.

suggested the fight to combat Type 2 diabetes develops

:15:57.:15:59.

when your body can't If untreated, it can cause very

:16:00.:16:02.

serious health problems. It's long been associated

:16:03.:16:09.

with being overweight. In the Lords, peers wanted to know

:16:10.:16:12.

what action the govt was taking. Is it possible he could give

:16:13.:16:18.

a statement, or at least write about, following Brexit,

:16:19.:16:25.

the breakdown in the work that is being done across the whole

:16:26.:16:27.

of the European Union with our United

:16:28.:16:39.

Kingdom colleagues in research to defeat the obesity and indeed

:16:40.:16:45.

diabetes, as director of the European Commission

:16:46.:16:47.

on the Today programme? It is still our intention

:16:48.:16:55.

to announce the Clearly, other events

:16:56.:16:58.

have happened which may But we will be announcing that

:16:59.:17:02.

strategy has soon as possible. I am arranging a meeting

:17:03.:17:09.

for the noble Lord and Lord Morris to meet the research

:17:10.:17:14.

community and discuss the outlook for research

:17:15.:17:16.

for diabetes, and the impact

:17:17.:17:23.

Brexit might have. People can reduce their weight and

:17:24.:17:38.

take modest exercise and in a significant number of cases the

:17:39.:17:42.

effect of diabetes can be put into long-term remission with reduction

:17:43.:17:48.

on the pressure on the NHS resources and capacity, but less than 10% of

:17:49.:17:54.

people with diabetes get any such help in reducing their weight and

:17:55.:18:00.

increasing exercise and having the option and opportunity of turning

:18:01.:18:09.

off their diabetes. She is clearly right. Weight reduction can reverse

:18:10.:18:13.

diabetes. My own father, for example. He has lost weight and his

:18:14.:18:18.

diabetes was effectively put in remission. There is no question it

:18:19.:18:23.

works. It is very difficult to lose weight. Once you are overweight. I

:18:24.:18:29.

think the figure is only one out of 210 people who have a BMI above 30

:18:30.:18:35.

can reduce it down to a normal level, hence the emphasis the

:18:36.:18:40.

Government is putting on explaining to children, young people, before

:18:41.:18:44.

they get fat, that is the critical phase to aim but I'm timely agree

:18:45.:18:48.

that making greater access to structured education programmes is

:18:49.:18:54.

very important. In endorsing that reply from the Minister, can I ask

:18:55.:18:59.

into also make sure the guidance includes recognition of emerging

:19:00.:19:04.

research, that in children if they never become a beast, they have a

:19:05.:19:08.

different type of fat, a brown fat, which keeps a higher metabolic race

:19:09.:19:17.

and decreases their diabetes, so the importance of avoiding obesity in

:19:18.:19:20.

the first place, especially in children and women, in preference

:19:21.:19:24.

eight and afterwards, means that is the only way we will stop this

:19:25.:19:30.

ever-growing curve of diabetes associated with adult obesity?

:19:31.:19:35.

Back in the Commons proposals that could lead

:19:36.:19:38.

to the privatisation of the Land Registry have faced

:19:39.:19:40.

The registry records and keeps details of property ownership

:19:41.:19:43.

The Labour MP, David Lammy, who had secured a backbench debate

:19:44.:19:47.

on the future of the Land Registry, said ministers were selling off

:19:48.:19:50.

the family silver in a bid to make their sums add up.

:19:51.:19:56.

There is no economic rationale for the privatisation.

:19:57.:20:00.

If the Land Registry were making a loss

:20:01.:20:02.

and being subsidised by the taxpayer, I could

:20:03.:20:04.

understand the Government's enthusiasm for privatisation.

:20:05.:20:13.

But it has made a surplus in 19 of the last 20

:20:14.:20:19.

years and returned over 100 million to the Treasury last year alone.

:20:20.:20:22.

Any doubts over it or the possibility of

:20:23.:20:24.

conflict of interest or misuse of information could affect

:20:25.:20:27.

what is a central part of our capitalist system.

:20:28.:20:32.

We must also recognise the Land Registry is a natural monopoly.

:20:33.:20:35.

Like the police and other such institutions, which do not lend

:20:36.:20:38.

Such monopolies which are of such importance

:20:39.:20:40.

to the very fabric of the

:20:41.:20:42.

system must be treated with great care.

:20:43.:20:46.

Public ownership has been ruled out from the start.

:20:47.:20:51.

If the Government is foolish enough to press ahead with

:20:52.:20:54.

this privatisation, it must be defeated.

:20:55.:20:58.

This delicate and vital work must be entrusted to

:20:59.:21:02.

civil servants, working for our public service, where trust and

:21:03.:21:04.

It is right that as a responsible government we

:21:05.:21:10.

do keep under review the questions about

:21:11.:21:16.

whether and how we have, we

:21:17.:21:21.

can take those functions currently the monopoly and responsibility of

:21:22.:21:24.

the state and see if they can be financed better, if they could be

:21:25.:21:29.

liberated and thrive better under new freedoms and to see whether

:21:30.:21:35.

indeed, I will give way in a moment, whether indeed we could in so doing

:21:36.:21:39.

put the public finances on a stronger footing.

:21:40.:21:41.

Back to transport questions, where MPs claimed

:21:42.:21:45.

commuters are being given written warnings by their bosses

:21:46.:21:48.

because they are consistently late for work as a result

:21:49.:21:51.

of the "shameful" service provided by Southern Rail.

:21:52.:21:55.

Southern Railway services, including those

:21:56.:21:58.

into London Victoria, have been disrupted for weeks

:21:59.:22:00.

because of industrial action and high levels of staff sickness.

:22:01.:22:02.

The Transport Minister was asked what economic impact

:22:03.:22:04.

There is no formal economic assessment, surprisingly.

:22:05.:22:16.

But I am in no doubt, I would agree that a

:22:17.:22:24.

disrupted railway is not good for the economy and passengers.

:22:25.:22:27.

That is why we are committed to returning it

:22:28.:22:29.

This shambles we have seen is turning into a crisis.

:22:30.:22:33.

People are writing to me and they are late for work

:22:34.:22:37.

every day and their bosses are giving them written warnings.

:22:38.:22:40.

The government seems to expect people to

:22:41.:22:41.

turn to their bosses and say, do not worry,

:22:42.:22:43.

Can the Minister tell us when this crisis will

:22:44.:22:49.

end and people can go to

:22:50.:22:50.

their bosses and say things will get better?

:22:51.:22:52.

The honourable gentleman and I talk about this a lot.

:22:53.:22:58.

He knows there was disruption because of this

:22:59.:23:03.

investment, that things were getting better.

:23:04.:23:05.

In April we were getting up to an 84, 83.8% PPM.

:23:06.:23:08.

bosses, may I suggest they write to the union bosses involved, who I

:23:09.:23:15.

think are doing their members a grave disservice by bringing them

:23:16.:23:18.

This is about who presses the buttons

:23:19.:23:28.

operating the doors and the change in the role of the second member.

:23:29.:23:31.

There are no job losses and changes in terms and conditions.

:23:32.:23:34.

This shameful performance is affecting commuters.

:23:35.:23:38.

Across the south coast, going to the airport

:23:39.:23:47.

and heading up to Gatwick, flights are being missed and jobs are

:23:48.:23:50.

Can the Minister say the big impact this failing franchise is

:23:51.:23:58.

Again, everybody understands this railway

:23:59.:24:00.

That is why the money is being spent and so much

:24:01.:24:09.

much work is going on but I say again that there are ?2 billion of

:24:10.:24:12.

new trains coming from the production line now which the

:24:13.:24:15.

company would like to be running on these routes

:24:16.:24:17.

and the introduction of

:24:18.:24:18.

those trains is being held up and it is not just on GTR,

:24:19.:24:21.

it is the same in Scotland, it is a nationwide

:24:22.:24:23.

dispute about who presses the buttons opening the doors.

:24:24.:24:26.

It is no good having more rolling stock if they

:24:27.:24:28.

It isn't good enough blaming the unions on

:24:29.:24:31.

Her department has got to get a grip.

:24:32.:24:34.

They are paying through the nose for an appalling service

:24:35.:24:41.

threatening jobs, robbing them of time with their family and the CEO

:24:42.:24:44.

of Go Ahead is on a pay deal rising to over ?2 million last year.

:24:45.:24:49.

Will she get a grip, stop defending the

:24:50.:24:51.

failing private sector, remove the franchise

:24:52.:24:53.

and put the service into

:24:54.:24:55.

transparent and accountable public hands now?

:24:56.:25:00.

She accepted a very large donation from the RMT before

:25:01.:25:08.

the last election and the union have awarded themselves a 16% pay

:25:09.:25:11.

They need to stop objecting to the introduction of new

:25:12.:25:15.

technology which benefits constituents and constituents right

:25:16.:25:16.

Which brings us to our final stop for this edition of the programme,

:25:17.:25:24.

but do join me on Friday night at 11 for The Week in Parliament

:25:25.:25:28.

when we look back at a tumultuous few days,

:25:29.:25:30.

as MPs, peers and the UK's other legislators get

:25:31.:25:32.

And we hear from a former Clerk of the Commons

:25:33.:25:41.

will start to unpick British laws from the EU.

:25:42.:25:46.

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