19/01/2017 Thursday in Parliament


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Hello and welcome to Thursday in Parliament.


Coming up on this programme: The Lords warn the Government


needs to be on its guard against an increase in hate crime.


There has been a 40% increase. This is not a spike, this is a trend.


A Ukip peer explains why he wants curbs on migration.


And a Conservative peer bids goodbye to Barack Obama.


Tomorrow we will be read of the most useless American President I have


ever seen in my lifetime. Labour has called on the Government


to head off a potential wave of hate crime, when the Supreme Court


makes its expected judgment An earlier ruling in


the High Court led to a backlash The latest crime figures


reveal a 40% increase in hate crimes in the month


after the referendum vote in England and Wales,


compared with the same month The leader of the Labour Peers


raised her fears about All of us want to maintain good


relations with our EU neighbours as we move forward on Brexit and we do


not want another spike in hate crimes that we saw


following the referendum, or the attacks on judges


following the court's decision. This week the Prime Minister said


every stray word and every hyped up media report is going to make it


harder for us to get the right deal Did the Foreign Secretary


Boris Johnson not get the And can the noble lady confirm


whether the Prime Minister has conveyed to the governments


concerned, to those sections of the media that she was alluding to,


that all agree that such histrionic reports can


damage the interests and the reputation of


the We all have a duty to behave


in a responsible way but it is in society being tolerant,


not just tolerant, but welcoming of the various communities


that live in our country that we will make progress, and the media


is part and parcel of that. Can she think of a single precedent


where we have been asked to ask a hypothetical question


in connection with a hypothetical Is it not extraordinary


that there is an order to ask a It is hypothetical


but I hope that I can reassure my noble friend


that in fact what this Government is is prepared,


and learnt the lessons from what we have seen


in the last year. The latest crime figures show


an increase of about 200 hate times per week, 2015-2016,


compared with the year before. There has been a 40%


increase in hate crimes This is not a spike,


this is a trend. Police action is


simply addressing the What assessment has the Government


made of the causes of these Does the Government believe


as we do that the increase in populism and nationalism is


behind the significant and worrying I heard various tales


post-referendum of the various Yes, and I will get


to the point about pre-referendum, because in fact


the numbers of hate crimes being reported


are now The reasons behind some


of the hate crimes What motivates people


to provoke hatred It is generally based on certain


characteristics of those people and of those communities


and it has gone down to pre-referendum levels


since As someone, and I declare an


interest in my work as chairman of Kick It Out, where we monitor and


have been monitoring for the last 23 years, hate incidents,


which are at the lower That is nothing new about the level


of hatred that exists within our society and we have got to tackle


the issue of prejudice which we are To blame Brexit as a


consequence of what we saw on June the 24th and since,


is actually delusional. abuse that we are witnessing,


disabled people who are being abused, you cannot blame that


specifically on Brexit in the So I ask you to consider


how we are taking action to effectively


tackle prejudice which Over in the Commons at Business


questions an SNP MP was also looking ahead to the Supreme Court


judgement due next week The court will give a final ruling


on whether or not Parliament should have a say on triggering Article


50 - the formal start Now we know now it is almost


certain that a vote will be required in order to


trigger Article 50. So will he confirm that this bill


will be subject to the maximum scrutiny, thoroughly amendable,


and properly debated, in this House? Can we have a debate about how


to win friends and influence people? Because the Foreign Secretary's


starting to look like a dodgy character out of Allo Allo,


doing his utmost to upset the very people that global Britain needs


to negotiate with to get a good deal We now know that this Government's


predominant obsession, everything that underpins its approach


to leaving the European Union, is immigration and freedom


of movement. The Government plans


a great repeal bill to move EU rules and regulations


into UK law. At Prime Minister's Questions an SNP


MP had asked whether the bill would be subject to a process known


as English Votes for English Laws or Evel -


where Scottish MPs are excluded from voting on legislation that


applies only to England. Will the Leader of the House


do what the Prime Minister failed to do yesterday


and that is to confirm that the Engslish Votes


for English Laws procedure will not be applied


to the great repeal bill? This bill will cut across many


devolved competencies. There is going to be so many


jurisdictions involved when it comes So will he do what the Prime


Minister failed to do The leader of the House turned first


to whether there would need to be a bill in Parliament to trigger


Article 50 beginning Until the Supreme Court has ruled


we don't know whether any bill But any bill if it is


to become law it to go through the full


parliamentary process through the full parliamentary


process in this chamber and the For any matter to be subject


to the Evel arrangement it It must refer to a matter


which is devolved The legislation here must refer


only to England or to And third, there must be


certification from Mr Speaker, that the clause or the


Bill, or the statutory instrument, Those tests would continue to be


the ones that would have to be met I think it is very clear to me


that if for example we look at a measure that is repealing


the European Communities Act 1972, clearly that has UK-wide


implications and is not just confined to one part


of the United Kingdom. Back in the Lords, a Conservative


peer has lambasted Barack Obama as the most useless American


president in my lifetime. Lord Blencathra was taking part


in a debate titled "the challenges to the liberal international order


posed by the development of populism Donald Trump is due to officially


take over as US President on Friday. Lord Blencathra made clear


he would be glad to see the end Tomorrow, my Lords, we will be rid


of the most useless American President I have ever seen in my


entire lifetime, whose only legacy He has withdrawn America


from the world stage and left a disastrous vacuum that's been


filled by Putin and China. He withdrew troops prematurely


from Iraq and allowed Isil He laid down red lines on Syria


on the use of gas in Syria and did nothing to enforce


them when they were breached. He turned a blind eye


to Russian hacking for seven years and nine months


but suddenly became concerned, about Next time I visit the United States


I will be able to use transgender I would say to the noble


Lord his time is over, it is No one can accuse the


Labour Party of not been I would never dream of doing


that because they are And the Independent of December


reported, the Labour Party is ramping up preparations to relaunch


Jeremy Corbyn as a left-wing Senior party officials


believe his unpolished authenticity could gather support from the same


anti-establishment that has heralded the popularity of Donald


Trump and Nigel Farage. So, my lords, I conclude


there you have it. Populism is a wicked


and evil thing if it is a right wing President Trump, but


a good thing if it is a socialist Nobody can do hypocrisy better


than the left liberal elite. But his world view was challenged


by a former Liberal Democrat leader who urged politicians


to leave their "tribes" and work together to counter the "dangerous"


rise of populism and nationalism. He compared the situation


today with the 1930s. The motto of the age you will recall


was if you are going to lie, lie big Stick it on the side of a bus


perhaps and send it around Our age bears horrible


comparisons with that. Nor do I say that this


was not a rational reaction I am not interested


in who to blame but what Spare a thought for the lost tribes


of Labour and the Tory party, If you are part of a Tory


tradition of internationalism you find yourself in a party that


has completely abandoned it? What do you do if you're


one of those Labour members of Parliament who believes


in the free market not as a master but as our servant and find your


party has extensively rejected it? It's extraordinary in


the last year how much politics has spun away


to the to build that central


consensus, that moderate liberal consensus,


on which I believe the only chance lies


of altering a very dangerous You're watching Thursday in


Parliament with me Alicia McCarthy. The best way forward


for the troubled region of Kashmir is a referendum,


some MPs have suggested, so the people can


determine their own future. The problems in Kashmir go


back to the late 1940s when the area was divided


between India and Pakistan. Both countries, which


are now nuclear powers, The dispute has led to two wars


and frequent conflicts and there has been an escalation of


violence in recent months. After 70 years of inaction


since the original resolutions were passed, requiring the conflict


to be resolved by peaceful democratic means, it is


easy to see why so many in the Kashmiri community think


the United Nations has lost He said he appreciated


the British Government had We wish to be friends


with both India and Pakistan, but a candid and true friend is one


who sometimes says things that the other friend


may find unpalatable. I support my honourable


friend's motion. This is not a question of supporting


either the Indian Government or the Pakistani Government -


it is about supporting Just as he and I campaigned for many


years for a referendum to decide whether our country should be part


of and governed by the European Union, surely the people


of Kashmir should be afforded the same liberty of deciding


how they want to be David Nuttall agreed that the people


of Kashmir should have the right A right so historically exercised


by the people of this country on 23rd of June last year


when a majority voted No-one believes that there


is an easy answer, but anything has to be better than having


a military-controlled line of partition between the two


neighbouring countries. Khalid Mahmood, the first MP


of Kashmiri heritage, When a man goes out of a house,


whether he be a father, a husband or a son, there is no


guarantee that he will come back We have seen videos on YouTube,


Facebook and other social media of people being summarily


beaten up in the streets. by a disproportionate number


of military personnel and beaten They are tortured and taken


away, people go missing. In some instances, when they go


missing, they do not come back. Another MP, whose parents came


to the UK from Kashmir, talked about the use of pellet guns


by Indian forces. They spray and maim


through a six-foot circle. It is impossible to limit


the number of casualties These are not precision weapons


or defensive weapons, and their use in open public


places must constitute That is why we see images


of soldiers across Kashmir. They are there to protect


citizens of all stripes. People who want to go to work,


school, or university are allowed to do so only under the protection


of the Indian army. Without the protection of Indian


troops, we can see all too The National Human Rights Commission


of India has freely criticised and called for punishments


when the rule of law has not been That is not a level of freedom


allowed to those residents in Pakistan, which is recognised


as the world s leading The Foreign Office Minister Alok


Sharma said he was very concerned" about violence


in Indian-administered Kashmir and that pellet guns had been


replaced by chilli powder shells. But he said the UK could not


prescribe a solution to the situation in Kashmir


or act as a mediator. MPs have been holding


their annual debate to mark Holocaust Memorial Day,


which falls on Friday Conservative former Cabinet minister


Sir Eric Pickles recalled a visit to the Nazi extermination camp


Treblinka in Poland - and criticised sinister deniers


for continuing to say the Holocaust The best estimate is that somewhere


between 700,000 and 900,000 Jews and around 2000 Roma were killed


in Treblinka's gas chambers. More Jews were killed at Treblinka


than at any other Nazi extermination There is a dignified


monument and carefully laid stones remembering


the different communities. I laid a wreath at the site and,


following the visit, as most politicians do,


I tweeted my observations. Within minutes, I received


a tweet that said, "No one died at Treblinka,


it was a transit camp. There were no gas chambers,


no crematoria, no mass graves." I have no idea whether the person


who sent me that tweet believed it or not, and it is too easy


to dismiss this as yet another example of our post-truth world's


fake news, which is all too prevalent on social media,


but I think there is something To forget or belittle


continues the holocaust. This month sees the release


of the film Denial, which depicts one of the most


infamous libel trials of the past 20 years involving


the American historian, If one looks at the trailer,


and at the comments made beneath it, there are thousands


of abusive comments claiming Only a few days ago,


David Irving claimed a new generation of


holocaust sceptics - a fancy way of dressing


up holocaust denial. Lord Pearson, has told the House


of Lords that, "We don't want to go on letting in Bulgarian


and Romanian gangsters He was speaking during a question


about housing provision where a minister had been asked how


many new homes would be needed to accommodate


people coming to the UK. The higher migration


scenario of the department's household projections shows


that there are projected to be an average of 243,000


new households forming each year Net migration accounts


for an estimated 45% of this growth. In the main scenario,


there are projected to be an average of 210,000 households forming


per year, of which 37% A crossbench peer put


the figure differently. It would mean building a home every


five minutes, night and day, for new arrivals until such time


as we get those numbers down. I know there is a strong view


in the house that there is a lot All I'm pointing out is that it also


calls. -- costs. It's a two-year cycle. We will next review it at the


end of this year when some of the scenarios may well change because of


the impact of the period of Brexit. The noble lord is absolutely right


about the challenge of building more houses. That is certainly true. Most


of that, as I said, is not to do with migration.


My Lords, do the Government believe our National Health Service


and our social care arrangements can survive...?


That heckle coming from Labour's Lord Foulkes.


My Lords, I have never denied that we need migrants, it is just


that we do not want to go on letting in Bulgarian and Romanian


Does the Government believe our NHS and social care can survive this


sort of increase with their present funding arrangements,


or do we have to consider something more radical for the longer term?


My Lords, if I may try to address the joint


question asked by the noble lords, Lord Pearson and Lord Foulkes,


it is certainly the case that, across broad sections of public


life, certainly including the NHS, we are heavily dependent on people


Net migration will probably fall as a result of Brexit,


but it will be some time before that happens.


Still, we face all sorts of challenges in seeking


Does the coming to power of Donald Trump in the US mean


we could end up eating inferior food in the UK?


That was suggestion at the start of the day


The Commons was looking at how Britain's departure from the EU


will impact on food, farming and the rural


President-elect Trump spoke last week of the UK securing a very quick


trade deal with the US once it has left the EU, which has led to fears


that that could mean harsh compromises on issues such


as the environment, animal welfare laws and food safety.


Will the Secretary of State today reassure the house and people


across the United Kingdom that any trade deal with the US will not


involve such compromises, which would jeopardise our food


Will she reassure us that she understands that a very


quick deal is not necessarily the same as a very good deal


The party on this side of the house is the only party that made a


commitment to reflect animal welfare standards


in trade negotiations, and that remains a commitment


of the Government. There are opportunities for our


agricultural sector in the US, particularly in sectors such


as dairy, and possibly in sectors My colleagues in the Department


for International Trade will obviously lead on these matters


once we leave the European Union, but there will be potential


opportunities for UK 90% of our beef and lamb export in


this country are to the EU. So, the Prime Minister's threat to walk away


from the single market with no deal for them would not be bad, it could


leave them facing tariffs of up to 20% and that could be catastrophic.


What assurances will there be to the farmers and crofters that the


Government will not leave them exposed in this way? Well, I think


the Prime Minister gave the assurance that we are seeking a good


deal and no deal is better than a bad deal, which I then think anyone


can disagree with. As the free ourselves from the Common


agricultural problem that has added so many your graphic burdens to our


farmers, what assessment has my honourable friend made of the


financial burden that our farmers are facing as a result of the common


agricultural policy and what extra freedom will this mean for our


farmers any future? Unnecessary rules cost farmers millions of


pounds and up to 3 million -- 300,000 man hours. I will be paying


very close attention to these in the coming months as they look to better


solutions for us rather than 28 EU states. Full Andrea Leadsom.


And that's it from me for now, but do join me on Friday night at 11


for a round up of the week here at Westminster -


including a lively debate between Conservative,


Sir Bill Cash and the Lib Dems Lady Ludford


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