20/05/2016 Victoria Derbyshire

I'm Joanna Gosling, welcome to the programme.

More than 24 hours after it disappeared from radar

over the Mediterranean, there's still no sign

As the international rescue effort is stepped up, we'll

have the latest on efforts to find out what happened.

Handshake across the years - the moment two elderly men,

former child refugees in Europe, meet a new generation in peril.

If you can tell the people of the English government that, imagine if

these were your kids? Everyone has some form of trouble, we were forced

out. Think of your children, if they were in our position, how would you

feel? I'm more determined than ever, and you should be more determined

than ever, to do our best to help you.

And forced to travel hundreds of miles for care.

We'll be asking why some mental health trusts are failing to treat

Welcome to the programme. We are live until 11am.

Also Olympic gold medalists Tessa Sanderson on adoption

She's now 60, and her twins are only toddlers.

We'll be talking to her later and we'd love to hear

from you if you've adopted or fostered children later in life.

Do get in touch on all the stories we're talking about this morning -

use the hashtag Victoria Live and if you text, you will be charged

The international search for a missing EgyptAir plane is

intensifying, more than 24 hours after it disappeared from radar over

the Mediterranean. There had been reports that wreckage

had been found but the Greek authorities now say they don't

think its anything 66 people were on board Flight MS804

from Paris to Cairo. Trawling the Mediterranean

for clues. An international search of the area

where the aeroplane is believed There was one British man on board,

40-year-old Richard Osman from Camarthen, a father

of a two-year-old daughter and a new baby girl less

than a month old. Richard was a very kind person,

loving person, very focused. He never deviated

from the straight path. A very admirable person and I think

a lot of people admired him The Airbus A320 had

left Paris for Cairo. Its red tail speeding

across the Mediterranean and then It's believed this was more

likely to be a terror attack than an accident,

leading to concerns for the security After last year's Paris attacks,

70 employees at the airport had their security

clearance taken off them. A lawyer representing ten of them,

all Muslims, said his clients have been treated unfairly but accept

there's a problem. And key to the mystery may not

lie in Paris. On Wednesday, the same plane had

flown from Eritrea to Egypt, then on to Tunisia

and then back to Cairo. And from there to Paris on Wednesday

afternoon before taking From the airport in France,

many of those who had said goodbye to their loved ones have now flown

to Cairo to join relatives and investigators gathered

there as they all search for answers With us now is Jonathan Blake,

who joins us from Paris 24 hours on, are we any further on

in our understanding of what happened to the plane? In short, no.

There has been very little, if any, information overnight. It shed any

light on what happened to flight MS804, the French Foreign Minister

has spoken this morning, saying they are still keeping an open mind and

not pursuing one particular Ave. Suspicions are that it is some sort

of terror attack but that has not been confirmed in any way, French

authorities are doing what they can to assist Egypt who are leading the

investigation into what happened to the flight. Three members of the

investigation bureau have gone to Cairo to help, as well as a

technical advisor from Airbus, the maker of the plane involved. In

Paris, the focus is F Port Security and what may have happened at

Charles de Gaulle airport when the plane took off late on Wednesday

night -- airport security. With 66 people on board. There have been

concerns in recent months about the number of people with access to

their aeroplanes, some have had their security clearances revoked,

that will be in the minds of what happened today is investigating what

happened in Paris. At a device was smuggled on board the flight but 24

hours on, and more from the first reports of the plane going missing,

there is no information to suggest it was a terror attack, we are no

clearer, neither are the families of the 15 French people on board of the

flight here in France, to knowing what happened on flight MS804. Thank

you. To the BBC Newsroom

now for a summary of Figures due out later this morning

are expected to show an unprecedented deficit among

hospitals, and other It's thought it could be

more than ?2 billion Experts are warning

that the financial strain is putting pressure on care -

and economists have warned Tonka Bassi from the Institute of

Public policy research says that it is getting worse. It's a serious

position, with financial deficits getting worse. That is because it

impairs the NHS's ability to see and treat patients, waiting times are

going up, whether it is to go to accident and emergency, for planned

operations, to see a GP, across the NHS, waiting times are on the way up

which is bad news for patients. Psychiatric patients in England

are having to travel up to 300 miles because of a shortage

of hospital beds. Figures obtained by BBC News

and the online journal Community Care, show nearly 5,500

patients had to travel out of their local area

to get the nearest bed. Our Social Affairs Correspondent

Michael Buchanan reports. Jessica Wilson finds colouring

relaxing and settling. The 21-year-old has a range

of mental health conditions, including depression

and post-traumatic stress disorder. In December she fell ill

but there were no hospital beds available in her home

in Lincolnshire, so she was forced Roehampton was the only place

I could go so that made me feel even more scared,

more vulnerable, more alone Jessica's experience

is unfortunately Last year, nearly 5,500 psychiatric

patients were forced to travel due to a lack of beds,

that's a 13% increase Half of mental health Trusts

say they've seen a 230% Some patients had to travel nearly

300 miles last year. In January, this NHS Trust took

the unprecedented decision to declare a major incident due

to problems finding beds for more There's a lot of time spent focusing

on A and the crisis with A We had to really draw everybody's

attention to there's a crisis here within mental health and it

needed everybody to And coming up later

in the programme, we'll hear from all sides on this issues,

including a mother and son who were both sent over 100

miles from their home A second girl thought to be one

of more than 200 schoolgirls kidnapped by Boko Haram has been

rescued by Nigeria's military. Earlier this week, an activist group

saved a 19-year-old girl who is known to be one of the abducted

school pupils, and was found with a baby in north-eastern border a

carrying out more operations in the carrying out more operations in the

region against Boko Haram, rescuing 97 women and children and it is

region against Boko Haram, rescuing thought that one of them is victim

of the mass kidnapping which led to the bring back our girls campaign.

Jewish refugees who fled the Nazis on the eve of the Second World War

are calling on the government to do more to get children out

of the migrant camp in Calais - and be reunited with their families

Lord Dubs, the Labour peer who came to Britain as part

of the Kindertransport project in the 1930s,

is urging the government to speed up the processing of asylum claims

for unaccompanied children living in the Calais jungle.

And at 09:15, we will be talking to one of the people

involved in that campaign - Lord Dubs.

It's emerged that five prison officers were taken hostage

by an inmate with a bladed weapon at Highpoint prison

A report seen by the BBC shows the stand-off came a day

after another hostage incident at the same prison which

involved a prisoner taken hostage inside a cell.

Both ended without injury and are now under investigation.

Councillors in North Yorkshire will meet later to discuss

whether or not to approve fracking in England for the first time

since a ban on the technique was lifted in 2012.

They will consider plans by Third Energy to frack at a site

Many residents fear it will increase noise and pollution.

The company says its operations poses no risks to people

A man has been charged with trespassing at Buckingham Palace

after allegedly scaling a perimeter wall.

Dennis Hennessy, who's 41 and from Wembley in north west

He was found by officers seven minutes after an alarm was activated

There's a warning from the EU Remain campaign this morning that

infrastructure projects could suffer if the UK votes to leave.

It comes from the Manchester City council leader -

who says they would lose out on funding from

In Manchester the tram project there has had substantial

It would mean, in future, if we needed to do something on the scale,

we undoubtably will need to do more things on this kind of scale in

greater Manchester and it will make it very difficult, if not

impossible, to do so in a way that gives value to council taxpayers.

Scientists in the United States have developed a tiny,

flying robot that's about the size of a ten pence piece.

These buzzing drones are thought to be the world's

smallest winged robots - and they can be programmed to take

an energy-saving rest perched on a ceiling,

before detaching and continuing their flight.

Developers say they could do life-saving work, for example

by mapping out areas where natural disasters have hit.

That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 9.30.

Thank you. Coming up in a moment, two Jewish men who fled the Nazis on

kindertransport to Britain, meets children in the so-called Jungle

camp in Calais, we have an exclusive report. Get in touch with what we

are talking about this morning... Let's catch up with the sport, the

first tennis grand slam of the year starts at the weekend.

We are a few days away. We are talking tennis.

And while the news of Roger Federer's withdrawal

through injury is disappointing for tennis fans, it no doubt boosts

Let's talk live to fomer British Number One Greg Rusedski -

talk about seedings in a moment, but Andy goes into tournament

I'm shoring it comes to Andy Murray, he feels he can beat anyone on the

court, but talking about him in particular, great form on clay going

into the tournament now? Yes, he's been in brilliant form, getting into

the finals of Madrid, he lost a tough three set match to Novak

Djokovic and last week in Rome he was brilliant, beating Djokovic in

straight sets in the final. In the French Open, he's probably playing

his best ever tennis on this surface, I see a chance for him to

possibly win the French Open and make his first finals as welcome his

best he's done previously is the semifinals. The coach situation has

been interesting, it could be disruptive, you might say, but it

does not seem to have changed his play on the court, the fact that

Amelie Mauresmo is in? I think that Jamie has done a great job, with

him, he lives in the UK, when Andy wants a practice session he does not

have to worry about his coach being in Sweden, France, America, he's

always with him. He has a relaxed personality and the combination

works well, and if you look at Andy Murray's game recently in the last

few months, his second serve has got faster, he hits the ball from the

back of the Court and his movement looks better. Jamie is doing great

at the moment. What about the seedings? The fact there is no

Federer means that Rafa or Nadal, who beat him in Monte Carlo, he

moves up to number four. It means that he will not meet Rafa Nadal or

Djokovic and all the semifinals, if he gets there. So he feels like he

can beat anyone committee can build his momentum up to the semifinals

and feel like he is in best neck before he needs the big guns? Let's

not forget that Andy beat him in Madrid one-on-one, if he plays Rafer

in the semis or the quarters, he is confident. We talk about Roger

Federer missing a slam for the first time in 65 Grand Slams, an

incredible record, he is not a threat at the French like he once

was, she is not as strong physically. Andy Murray is playing

great tennis, I expect him to get to the finals. Prieto, the defending

champion, no one is talking about him at the moment. -- Stan Wawrinka.

Norbert what about the women? We talked about Johanna Konta.

She is world number 22. Her former little bit more indifferent. What

are her chances? A good result would be to get to the second round of the

French Open. She has got a great shot to do well. A great attitude.

Her coach is from Spain. She is getting better every single week and

likes the big occasion. I think she will have a great run. I know we

will be seeing a lot of you on the television. We will also be covering

the tennis on BBC Radio five Live. Great chances for the British

contingent in France. The draw is on in an hour. We will bring it to you.

On the eve of the Second World War, thousands of Jewish children escaped

Nazi Europe thanks to a rescue effort known as Kindertransport.

Two of those who benefited - Labour peer Lord Dubs

and Rabbi Harry Jacobi - are urging the Government to help

migrant children stranded in the Calais camp

This programme had exclusive access they travelled to France to meet

Dominic Casciani was there with them.

refugee children. It is so dangerous. Some of this group is

missing because they have been killed. There was a young Afghan boy

called Massoud. He fell killed. There was a young Afghan boy

and died. It is a shocking experience to see these people

without any hope. The conditions are intolerable for children to be on

their own. We should not as a civilised continent allow this to go

A handshake on for one

A handshake Separated by decades but connected

the Second World War. I was rescued and came to England as a refugee.

And like you, I was unaccompanied. And like you, I was unaccompanied.

again. But I hope you will see some of your family again. Labour peer

after orbs and Rabbi Harry of your family again. Labour peer

so much for coming. The settlement is home to

so much for coming. The settlement without family. More

so much for coming. The settlement ago Harry and Alf made their own

journey to safety. ago Harry and Alf made their own

to England, land of the free. They are

to England, land of the free. They As world War loomed, the British

government saved 10,000 children from the Nazis. The Kindred the

Department for Transport gave safe transport to Jewish children all

over Europe. My mother at some

over Europe. permission to leave. She got me onto

the transport. I can still see her standing at the station, German

soldiers with swastikas. When we crossed into Holland, the older ones

cheered. I knew it was significant but I did not know why.

Harry left his parents in Berlin and made it to Holland, only for the

Nazis to invade in 1940. A non-Jewish woman took us by

coaches to the Dutch border and prep -- persuaded a cargo boat captain to

take us away. Five days later, after leaving Holland, we arrived in

Liverpool. I have a picture here of the Liverpool paper to show you how

we arrived in Liverpool on the 19th of May, 1940.

So what has this got to do with Calais? This month Lord dubs led a

successful campaign to force the government to welcoming more along

children seeking asylum. It is stored there are 90,000

unaccompanied kids across the EU. In Calais, there are more than 400.

Citizens UK says 157 of them have a legal claim to come to Britain

because they already have a relative weighting. -- waiting for them.

Harry and Alf met two boys from Afghanistan.

I am a refugee. I came to England at the age of six. With the help of a

translator, the boys, ten and 12, explain what they have been through.

He is complaining that it has been eight months now and he is very

upset that no one has bothered are asked us how we are, if we are OK.

It is very sad. Have you any family in Afghanistan? They said they never

had contact with relatives, who paid smugglers to bring them to Europe.

One of them told the visitors what happened to his dad.

The Taliban killed his father. The bomb. Taliban. They made it to

France in car boot, the back of lorries and by walking over

mountains. Scared of older men, French police and tear gas, the boys

said they would keep trying to get onto lorries bound for England.

It is so dangerous. Right here we have had a couple of children killed

by moving traffic when attempting to get in lorries. We try to encourage

people to claim asylum in France because it is too dangerous to

attempt the crossing. None of these children are willing to make this

choice. They are too young. And they have been told by family at home to

go to the UK. Nobody denies that the Jungle is a

dangerous place. And the government has agreed to do more. Ministers

insist they are working as quickly and safely as possible in the best

interests of the children. But campaigners say it is not fast

enough. The legal process is too slow. There

is not enough happening and it is not happening fast enough. That

means children, because they are so young and alone, have no option but

to take their lives into their own hands. But is this really the UK's

problem? Critics say taking children from here encourages more people

smuggling. The local authorities cannot afford to pay for the huge

cost of housing and educating these kids. I am far more determined than

ever to push the British government to say these are young unaccompanied

refugee children. And in 1938, 1939, Britain took 10,000 unaccompanied

refugees from Germany, Austria and Czechoslovakia. It was not our

problem them but we did it. We were the only European country to do it.

I think in humanitarian terms we have a responsibility. Other human

beings are vulnerable. To see it is to believe it. I could not believe

it. It is a shocking experience to see these people without any hope. I

feel so furious. France has not done anything for them. I am

pro-European. What I am very much ashamed of the whole of Europe not

doing enough for the refugees here. The tinder transport is not just a

tale of her 10,000 children cheated the nasties. -- Nazis. 70 years on,

the veterans say the fate of thousands more children now hangs in

the balance. The circumstances are completely different. But they say

the question is the same. How we prepared to do today what we did in

the past? -- are we prepared? As the former refugees prepared to leave,

the children had a message for them to take home. If you can tell the

people of the England government, imagine if these were your kids.

Everyone has some form of trouble and we were forced out. Think about

your children. If they were in our position, how would you feel? I am

more determined than ever to do my best, R Best, to help you. Thank you

for your time. Good luck. We will do our best.

Thank you. We now talk to Lord Dubs,

who was in the so called Jungle, the refugee camp in Calais,

this week, and has recently How did you feel? Did it take you

back to being a little boy? In some ways it did. I talked to them and

one of them is about the same age as I was when I came here. The answer

is yes. I felt shocked. People are very resilient. They are determined

to have a future. I hope we can help some of them to have such a future.

The circumstances are different. They are in a safe European country

already. Why do they want to They are in a safe European country

the UK? Some have got family. Others do not but want to come. The

the UK? Some have got family. Others that young children are sleeping

wrath, sleeping in the Jungle in Calais, sleeping in railway

stations, in the streets, that is pretty shocking. They are not

escaping the gas chambers as happened in 1938. But it is still

pretty shocking that young people are left there. Britain should take

some. I think other countries should play their part as well, including

France. We have a responsibility to take at least some of them and give

them a decent life. Are you putting a number on how many you want to see

coming here? The government says the way the process works, it will only

take child refugees way the process works, it will only

Europe before the 20th of March, in order not to create... Needs to

speak to individual cup cancels around the

speak to individual cup cancels people different areas can host. --

different councils. We had an original number of 3000. Look, if

the government are as good as their word, and the Minister

the government are as good as their me the government will enter not

only me the government will enter not

of the amendment, they will be looking to local authorities to find

foster parents. I have had people offer to become foster parents.

There are plenty about, despite what some people say. Not in Kent, where

there is more pressure. The government have said they are

talking to government have said they are

March is quite a good date. What it means is that there are plenty of

children in the category. That is not a problem. The government says

the process will take time, possibly up to seven months. Can it be done

quicker? Yes it can. I have got details I'm going to send the Home

Office of 67 young people fully documented by voluntary

organisations working in Calais. So of course it can be done quicker. We

want to get some of them Britain in time for the school term. They have

missed a lot of education. Young people should be in school and start

developing their lives. Some pressure on the government it is

wanted. Why are you sure it can be done quicker? I talked to people in

Calais. I have not talked to people in Greece or Italy. They have

identified six or ten young people who would qualify by any standards.

Some have relatives in Britain, some do not. I will send that information

to the Home Office. With the political will it can be done. We

are going to go there, talk to the people, identify them, check their

background and make sure they qualify. You have written a letter

to the Home Secretary talking about the importance of education. You say

that enabled you to give something back to Britain. How passionately do

you feel about that? I feel very sorry. If these young people are

going to have any sort of life at all, it is important they get to

school and start catching up on the time they have lost. After all, we

are dealing with human beings who have got their lives ahead of the

man they want to have decent lives and save lives. If you can help some

of them, that is what you should be doing. I want to read you some of

the things viewers upset. And has said it touched her heart. Let's get

on with helping them now. Why the UK government? Should other governments

not to more? Shelagh on Facebook says it is nothing like your

situation. These kids have travelled through several countries to get to

Calais. Why not stop at the first safe country? Why Britain? Sam says,

these are at risk loan children. Why are we not swooping to help? Linda

says the government has done enough. They travel through safe European

countries just to get to us. Wrong people should come first. Why

Britain? I'm saying not only Britain but

others countries should play a part, and other countries in the Gulf,

they could also do more. The French should be doing more, we should play

our part, and if we set an example maybe we can persuade other

countries to do likewise? What about public concerns about pressure on

public resources? And generally increasing the population? When all

is said and done, we can provide more resources, both to help local

authorities in their day-to-day work, looking after other children,

and find money to help deal with these children, it is not beyond us.

We are one of the richest countries in the world, for heaven 's sake. We

have a strong humanitarian tradition, and we can handle it.

Thank you for coming in and talking to us, Lord Dubs.

We contacted the Home Office for its response.

Immigration Minister James Brokenshire said:

"The UK Government is committed to providing life-saving support

and assistance to the vulnerable children who have been unjustly

impacted by this ongoing humanitarian crisis.

And we are targeting our efforts to assist

Everyone wants this to happen as quickly and as safely

as possible, but we must ensure it is in the best

We are working with Local Authorities in the UK,

the UNHCR as well as with counterparts in Greece,

France and Italy to identify vulnerable children to bring

to the UK and make sure the support systems are in place

Thank you for your comments on that, keep them coming in and we will be

talking about it later as well. Also coming up...

More than 24 hours after the EgyptAir plane disappeared,

and relatives still don't know what's happened to those on board.

We'll talk to Barry Sweeney, whose son Liam died when the plane

he was travelling on was shot down over Ukraine.

More mental health patients are having to travel out

of their area for treatment - some are being sent over

100 miles away - we hear from a mother who had

to make a 300 mile round trip to see her teenage son

Here's Anita in the BBC Newsroom with a summary of today's news.

The international search for a missing Egyptair

plane is intensifying, more than 24 hours after it

disappeared from radar over the Mediterranean.

There had been reports that wreckage had been found but the Greek

authorities now say they don't think its anything to do

66 people were on board Flight MS804 from Paris to Cairo.

Figures due out later this morning are expected to show

an unprecedented deficit among hospitals, and other

It's thought it could be more than ?2 billion

Experts are warning that the financial strain is putting

Tom Kibasi from the Institute of Public Policy research says

Psychiatric patients in England are having to travel up to 300 miles

because of a shortage of hospital beds.

Figures obtained by BBC News and the online journal

Community Care show nearly 5,500 patients had to travel

out of their local area to get the nearest bed.

Our Social Affairs Correspondent Michael Buchanan reports.

Sorry, we don't have that report, let's move onto another story for

you. Jewish refugees who fled the Nazis

on the eve of the Second World War are calling on the government to do

more to get children out of the migrant camp in Calais -

and be reunited with their families Labour peer Lord Dubs

and Rabbi Harry Jacobi who came to Britain as part of

the Kindertransport project in the 1930s are urging

the government to speed up the processing of asylum claims

for unaccompanied children living Lord Dubs told this programme that

Britain has a responsibility to help young refugees. Young children are

sleeping rough, sleeping in the jungle in Calais, they are sleeping

at railway stations, that is shocking. They aren't escaping the

gas chambers, as happened in 1938, 39, but it is shocking with young

people left their Mac. I argued that Britain should take some of them,

there are quite a lot and other countries should play their part,

including France. We have a responsibility to take some of them

and give them a decent life. It's emerged that five prison

officers were taken hostage by an inmate with a bladed

weapon at Highpoint prison A report seen by the BBC shows

the stand-off came a day after another hostage incident

at the same prison which involved a prisoner taken

hostage inside a cell. Both ended without injury

and are now under investigation. Councillors in North Yorkshire will

meet later to discuss whether or not to approve fracking in England for

the first time since a ban on the technique was lifted in 2012. Third

Energy wants to frack in Yorkshire with many residents fearing

increased noise and pollution, but the company says its operations pose

no risk to people or the environment.

That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 10.

England's cricketers will be hoping to continue their fightback

when play resumes in their first test against Sri Lanka

Thery were floundering on 83 for 5 yesterday before Alex Hales

and Jonny Bairstow combined in an unbroken partnership of 88

before the rain ended play early at Headingley.

In golf, Rory McIlroy has urged Muirfield to "see

voted against accepting women members yesterday.

The decision means the club won't be allowed to host

Meanwhile, McIlroy is is back out on course at the Irish Open -

yesterday he carded a 5 under par round of 67 to put himself

Former French Open champion Roger Federer has pulled out

of this year's tournament with a back injury.

He hasn't missed a Grand Slam this century, but has been

The 17 time major winner says he hopes the rest will ensure

he can complete the remainder of the season.

Ross Murdoch's gold in the 200 metre breaststroke was one of five

medals for Great Britain at London's Aquatics

Murdoch won't be competing in the event at the Rio Olympics

though after failing to qualify last month.

Those other sport headlines, we are back later in the programme. --

those are the sport headlines. Thank you.

It's well over 24 hours since Egyptair flight MS804 vanished

from the radar screens - and still no sign of it.

Relatives of the French passengers on board have

As the investigation by Egyptian aviation officials continues,

we can get the latest from our correspondent

What is happening? French families are staying in a nearby hotel, not

far from where I am now, there are Egyptian families there as well, we

understand they will meet with officials from Egypt era, and the

French ambassador later today, to be briefed on the latest updates

concerning the accident -- EgyptAir. We went to the hotel and spoke to an

Egyptian man whose ex-wife was on the aeroplane, and he had the same

complaint about a lack of information. He said the authorities

were not telling them anything and they do not know what is happening

or what the fate of their loved ones were. We happened to speak to some

officials from EgyptAir who will be meeting with families later. They

have said they do not know what happened yet, they do not have solid

facts to give families, and we are trying to give them the latest that

they have, investigations are ongoing, search operations are

ongoing, we can't give them information that they do not really

have. The president has been speaking to the Egyptian military

units carrying out the rescue search operations in the Mediterranean, and

is asking them to finish the job as soon as possible, so that everyone

can have a clue about what exactly happened, and caused the plane to go

missing. There is a sense of frustration among families. I've

been speaking to them today and yesterday, they woke up to this

horrifying news, they don't know what has happened to their loved

ones, they say authorities aren't telling them anything. Sally, thank

you. One man who knows only too

tragically about the wait for news His 28-year-old son died in July

2014, when the Malaysian Airlines Flight MH17 was shot down over

Ukraine and all 298 Liam was simply heading

to see his beloved Newcastle United Thank you for coming in. How did you

feel when you heard this happened yesterday? Quite numb, when

something happens in the air, and what happened with Liam, it always

brings memories back. I woke up yesterday morning, I had a text on

my phone saying I'm sorry, I'm sorry about what has happened. I went and

put the telly on, and saw what happened. I went for a walk to

think. Obviously, very difficult, bringing it all back, what did you

think about it as you walked yesterday? The memories of what

happened nearly two years ago, it's not a nice feeling. I know the

families and friends of those on board, on MS804, they will be

devastated, obviously, they do not know what to do. I'm sure there will

be help for them, there was for me and my family. We were looked after

for a long time. It sounds like people around you are very

thoughtful, and know what you want is that connection, they got in

touch with you even before you knew about it, to say they were thinking

about you. Did it take time people to work out how to respond? No,

after yesterday, I expected someone to call, whenever there's a tragedy

I'm quite happy to speak about it. But, at the beginning, when the

plane came down and Liam was on it, people knew that you were going

through something unbearable. How difficult is it at that time for the

people around you to respond in a way that's best for you? It is

surreal at the time, it always happens to someone else, not you.

When it happened, I was at a funeral when Liam died, that was not nice. I

came home and said to my wife, I hope this is the last funeral we

will go to for a long time. Unfortunately, Liam was already

dead. It was the next morning when we found out. You just did not know

what was happening. The whole world was turned upside down. It was not

real. You are going to wake up, it is a nightmare, but everyone came to

the 4-straight Way, friends and family. The police, Foreign Office

-- came to the fore, straightaway. We had family liaison officers

working with us who were lovely, and kept us going through all of the bad

moments. Went over to Holland when we went to pick up Liam. They were

with us when the first set of coffins came in, everyone was

lovely. Do the same things always go through your mind? Do you manage to

move forward a little bit as time goes on? I would like to think that

I've been positive, I want to be positive and

's life. He had the chance to go to New Zealand to watch Newcastle

United, it's another story. He was so excited. It is really unfortunate

that it happened on the way there. I'm not saying it should have

happened on the way back, but if you got to New Zealand and lived the

dream, I would have been happier for him. You are wearing a colourful

ribbon, that is for other relatives, it was a black ribbon initially, but

that reflect what you are talking about now, it was changed to a

colourful one to remember the life rather than the death? It was the

Malaysia Airlines I got it from, I got it from a lovely man, Will

create a committee was with me when we went over, whenever something

happened, it was something to give out -- Will Kruger. I keep it on all

the time to remember. You have written a few lines of a poem for

the people who have tragically been caught up in the latest air

disaster. Would you mind reading it? I do not mind. Let me get my respect

and condolences for all of the family and friends, not just from

me, but for MH17 and from every decent person in the world, I will

read this. Another disaster in the sky. Another

tragedy, will we ever know why? Condolences to family and friends

from MH17, our love we send. It will mean a huge amount for people who

are going through this, knowing that you understand. When something

happens, and the loved one is far away, that is what happened to you

and what is happening to these people, it must bring another

dimension? Of the practical issues that must be dealt with? In Ukraine,

it was impossible, there was a war going on and no one could get in.

For the loved ones there, they were there for a few days before anything

could happen. Hopefully, with this flight, we don't know what has

happened. If it has disappeared, it is akin to MH370 and part of MH17 as

welcome we do not know what happened. If it is a technical foot,

don't get us wrong, I would rather it was that on a terror alerts -- if

it was a technical fault. It is difficult, we had to wait and find

out if and when. With Liam, it was not long before he was found, but it

was long enough. He was probably one of the first ones to be found at the

time. So we could begin to move on, whereas other families could not. It

is a horrible thought. Thank you very much for coming and speaking to

us. ! If you have got questions on the

search operation currently under way, you can put them to an air

crash investigator who will answer them live on newsroom live.

are still having to travel long distances from their homes

Figures obtained by BBC News and the online journal

Community Care - show the number of mental health patients

in England who had to travel outside their local area to get care

in moments of crisis to get the nearest bed.

Let's talk now to Laura Nuttall, who last year was sent

over 100 miles from home for mental health treatment.

And Sue Scarborough, whose son was sent more than 150

Sue Moore is chief operating officer of Lancashire Care

NHS Foundation Trust - the worst performing trust

In Norwich, Norman Lamb, former Health Minister

And Marjorie Wallace, Chief Executive of the mental

health charity, Sane, is here in the studio.

Thank you all for joining us. Sue, I will come to you first of all. Your

trust was the worst performing trust. In 2014-15, you sent more

than 2000 mental health patients trust. In 2014-15, you sent more

following areas Centre 751. Why is the picture so bad for you are? That

was the case in January. It was a terrible picture. We took really

strong action to correct that position. We have 17 patients out of

area today, which is not something we are proud of. We have opened

additional capacity. We declared a major incident to raise the profile

because we recognised it was not a satisfactory situation for our

patients, their carers. Who would want to travel that distance at a

time of crisis? The position in January was over

time of crisis? The position in out of area, today it is 17. Who

would want to travel far away when they are facing a mental health

crisis? Over the last five years, the numbers have got incrementally

worse in your area. I hear what you're saying about the fact you are

dealing with it now, but why was it not prioritised until that

cumulative annual statistic hit 751? It was being prioritised before the

statistic. I need to assure you of that. 751 people over that year were

sent out of your area? I am not trying to defend that. We have taken

the action. We have seen unprecedented demand. The recent

benchmarking for the whole of the NHS shows that Lancashire care have

40% more than any other mental health trust in England for

referrals. We are at the very highest end of referrals. We have

had to work with commissioners, with NHS England, with social care, to

build capacity within the system. We are seeing much more portly

patients. We are seeing the impact of legal and illegal drugs

permeating the system. A huge range of multifactorial issues that have

combined together. Yes, it did all manifest in patients having to go

out of area. It is an appalling situation and one that I do not wish

to repeat those patients. How many mental health beds do you have in

your county and how has the figure changed? In January, we had just

short of 270 mental health beds. Since January, we have opened 24

assessment beds. And six crisis support beds. And 12, what we

describe as step-down beds to enable patients to step down to a less

acute facility. We have also opened six additional psychiatric intensive

care beds. One statistic I found the Lancashire evening Post was that

there are 16 mental health beds for children across the county. Is that

correct? That is correct. That is commissioned separately by NHS

England. They have very recently agreed to commissioning additional

two beds. That will take the number 218. Is that anywhere near enough to

deal with the number of children you need to be dealing with in

Lancashire when you talk about the issues you are facing and the great

pressure on beds? With the exception of the very specialist type of beds,

yes, that would be sufficient. Let's talk to sue, whose son was sent more

than 150 miles for treatment. He was 15 when he was sent so far away.

What was that like? It was terrible, really. He just thought that I had

left him and I was not going to see him any more. He had never heard of

the place Northumberland. He did not know why he was there and what he

was being treated for, which was appalling, really. I could only

visit on a weekend because of the distance. I don't drive. It was just

disgusting. If I had lived in Newcastle, that would have been

great but I live in Hull. It was not good enough for me or for him. It

took five hours on a Friday morning to get to see him. It was only 12

o'clock that I got there to see him. Laura, you are joining us from

Lincoln. You had to travel more than 100 miles away from home for mental

health treatment. Talk this through the practical reality of having to

go so far away? As was just said, it makes the situation more scary and

confusing if you are unwell anyway. Going into hospital is scary enough.

But having to travel so far away is not good. In terms of

practicalities, I was very lucky in the sense that my family were able

to come and visit me, albeit inconvenient and difficult for them.

There were people in hospital with me who had also travelled from other

counties, were not able to get visitors, who were pretty much by

themselves. People who are not able to utilise their home leave as well.

They need to be able to go out in the community. They are sort of

trapped there in a way. Norman Lamb, how do the figures add up? Local

authorities do not have the beds because they do not have the

re-sources. And yet they spend a lot of money, presumably, sending people

further away for treatment? In Laura's case, she was sent off to a

private centre far away. It is not cheap, is it? What is happening with

the money? It is economic nonsense, as you rightly describe. It is an

intolerable practice. We have just heard the point that if you are in

that setting separated from your family, it actually prevents you

from recovering properly. It is not a therapeutic environment in which

people can properly recover and received treatment. I have made it

very clear when I was minister that I think the practice should just be

banned. We should set a time limit. I would say a year. The government

has said it will end by 2020. That, for me, is far too long. This would

never happen with a stroke patient or a patient with a heart problem.

It is discrimination at the heart of the NHS against people with mental

ill-health. We know also it is associated with an increased risk of

suicide. Given that we know that, given that we know it is not

therapeutic to do this to people, I have had a constituent taken off in

the middle of the night to a private centre in south London from

Norfolk... This is absolutely outrageous in this

Norfolk... This is absolutely There is a gap between the rhetoric,

pit the government is very clear about parity or equality for mental

ill-health, and the reality, which is that we are a very long way away

from treating people with mental ill-health with the same dignity and

respect as we treat people with physical health problems. Seu, if

you do not have the resources to have the beds in your area, how is

the money found to send people away? Why is the money not just used to

address the beds issued? That is Why is the money not just used to

what we did, actually. We made a decision to proceed in the first

instance as a trust to put the system in place,

instance as a trust to put the commissioners that it would improve

the situation. As a result commissioners that it would improve

that we made in this year. commissioners that it would improve

boiled down to actually just working out where the priorities lie. Mental

health having not out where the priorities lie. Mental

recently? That is part of it. It is about also testing new models

recently? That is part of it. It is care, challenging ourselves, talking

with our service users. I absolutely empathise with the issues that both

families have raised. It is not acceptable to be

families have raised. It is not somewhere in the middle of the night

hundreds of miles away. And we need to stop it. And it has to stop. It

is about much better community support. If you can protect and

is about much better community support people better at home,

prevent the admissions in the first support people better at home,

while they are in hospital and get them home as quickly as possible,

that is a better model of care than long-stays in institutions and

shunting long-stays in institutions and

everybody is united in long-stays in institutions and

from their area. The government says more money is being put into mental

from their area. The government says health, so this should be eliminated

by 2020. Listening to what you're hearing today and what you know

about what is going on and what the government is saying, is situation

changing? No, it is not. This has been going on for a long time. This

increase is not surprising. Patients are being literally shunted like

unwanted parcels. People can go from Kent to Manchester, down to

Weston-Super-Mare. And these unwanted parcels all depend on trust

and who is going to pick of the Extra cost. We have heard from

Norman Lamb. It is detrimental to a person's health. It is more costly

and the suicide rate is rising. In terms of dealing with it, we have

heard from Sue, whose trust came bottom in the table. She is talking

about how they are dealing with it. If that is the worst of the trusts,

does that give you heart? Not really. All this is because of a

relentless agenda to close down psychiatric beds and units because

they are the most expensive element of psychiatric care. To keep one

person on inpatient care, you can treat 44 people in the community.

Does that mean treatment? It often means home treatment teams are

overstretched, people are neglected. We get a call upon coal from people

say the crisis team has not visited them. When a crisis happens, then

they are put into a car. They do not know where they are being driven to.

The family are left with the financial burden of visiting and the

emotional heartbreak of leaving somebody they love. It makes no

sense. It is all to do with the government agenda close down

psychiatric beds. The government does say it is putting in more money

and this problem should be eliminated? They have not mentioned

beds except for eating disorders. They say that they are not actually

reopening the wards they closed. In areas like Cornwall there are

sometimes no psychiatric beds whatsoever. You cannot fix this in a

short time. You have to go back and look at the fact that in patient

care is as important as community care. We are right out of time.

Really good to talk to you all and hear your perspectives. I just want

to read out a statement. In a statement, the Minister

for Community and Social Care, Alistair Burt, said

it was unacceptable that too many patients suffering from mental

illness were receiving He added, "We have increased mental

health funding to ?11.7 billion. There is new funding coming

on stream, and we have already made ?400 million available

for crisis resolution and home treatment teams

which will help prevent people being admitted as inpatients

when they can be better We will be speaking later to Olympic

gold medallist Tessa Sanderson about life at 60 with adopted twins.

First, let's ketchup with the weather.

How is it looking? So far this month we have had a very warm weekend, we

have had a cold weekend. And this weekend we're sitting in the middle.

Average temperatures. Sunshine and some rain.

Is this the lot that we have now? I was almost going to go through a!

Are we going to have to get used to this ever-changing weather?

It is spring. It is transition time. You see big peaks and troughs in the

weather. Quite literally. You do get big variations in the weather from

one week to the next. Sometimes one day to be next. This is quite

normal. Before we get to the weekend, let's

look at the weather today. We have a bright and breezy day across many

parts of the country. But there is patches of rain coming into

south-west Wales and Northern Ireland. It turns heavier here. One

or two showers, chiefly in north-east England and Scotland,

they become fewer, sunshine here and there, similar temperatures to

yesterday. In the south-east and East Anglia, if you are lucky, 20

degrees. Rain moves in overnight, away from

Northern Ireland to Scotland, patches elsewhere in the UK, in mild

night, but breezy. We begin the day cloudy tomorrow,

with rain, coming up through Wales and Scotland, Northern Ireland and

later Scotland brightening with showers. For most of the day, East

England may be dry, then we find the highest temperatures, 18 or 19,

uncertainty on Saturday night into Sunday, rain is not far away.

Flirting with the south-east of the UK but for many parts, Sunday sees

sunshine, pleasant in the sunshine but there will be showers, they

could Hello, I'm Joanna Gosling,

in for Victoria Derbyshire. Welcome to the programme if you've

just joined us. 24 hours on and still no news

on what happened to the EgyptAir plane which disappeared from radar

screens early yesterday morning it's reported the Egyptian Navy has

found some passenger belongings. There is no sign of the black box.

We have the latest. Also on the programme,

a handshake across the decades - two men who were once refugees

fleeing the Nazis in the build up to World War Two,

meet children who've fled in the Calais Jungle.

and are now living on their own A non-Jewish woman persuaded a cargo

boat to take us and five days later, Those surviving members

of the kindertransport are now calling on the government do far

more to help children living on their own

in the Calais jungle. We'll speak to former unaccompanied

refugees. Olympic gold medallist

Tessa Sanderson tells us about the challenges

of adopting two young children. Here is Anita in the BBC Newsroom

with a summary of today's news. Three British air accident

investigators have arrived in Cairo to join the hunt for the cause of

the Egypt air crash over the Mediterranean. The search today Brea

Paris to Cairo flight has entered a second day with authorities

targeting a wide area south of the Greek island of Crete. Our Cairo

correspondent Sally in a bill says relatives of the 66 people on board

the plane want answers. The president has been speaking to the

Egyptian military units carrying out the rescue and search operations in

the Mediterranean. He's asking them to finish the job as soon as they

can, so everyone can have a clue about what exactly happened, and

caused the plane to go missing. There is a sense of frustration

among the families I've spoken to yesterday and today, they woke up to

this horrifying news and don't know what happened to their loved ones.

They say the authorities aren't telling them anything.

Egyptian military have found debris from the craft, including passenger

belongings in the sea off the coast of Alexandria. If you have questions

underway in the Mediterranean, on the search operation...

crash investigator who will answer them live on Newsroom Live,

here on BBC Two and the BBC News Channel, just use

Figures due out later this morning are expected to show

an unprecedented deficit among hospitals, and other

It's thought it could be more than ?2 billion

Experts are warning that the financial strain

Psychiatric patients in England are having to travel up to 300 miles

because of a shortage of hospital beds.

Figures obtained by BBC News and the online journal

Community Care show nearly 5,500 patients had to travel

out of their local area to get the nearest bed.

Our Social Affairs Correspondent Michael Buchanan reports.

Jessica Wilson finds colouring relaxing and settling.

The 21-year-old has a range of mental health conditions,

including depression and post-traumatic stress disorder.

In December she fell ill, but there were no hospital beds

available in her home in Lincolnshire, so she was forced

Roehampton was the only place I could go so that made me

feel even more scared, more vulnerable, more alone

Jessica's experience is unfortunately

Last year, nearly 5,500 psychiatric patients were forced to travel

due to a lack of beds, that's a 13% increase

Half of mental health Trusts say they've seen a 230%

Some patients had to travel nearly 300 miles last year.

In January, this NHS Trust took the unprecedented decision

to declare a major incident due to problems finding beds for more

There's a lot of time spent focusing on A and the crisis with A

We had to really draw everybody's attention to there's a crisis

here within mental health and it needed everybody to

Ministers say it's unacceptable that patients can't find beds

and have promised to end the practice within five years.

Jewish refugees who fled the Nazis on the eve of the Second World War

are calling on the government to do more to get children out

of the migrant camp in Calais - and be reunited with their families

Labour peer Lord Dubs and Rabbi Harry Jacobi who came

to Britain as part of the Kindertransport project

in the 1930s are urging the government to speed up

the processing of asylum claims for unaccompanied children living

Lord Dubs told this programme that Britain has a responsibility to help

Young children are sleeping rough and sleeping in the jungle in

Calais, they are sleeping at railway stations, it is shocking. They

aren't escaping the gas chambers as happened in 1938-39, it is shocking

with young people left there. I argue that Britain should take some,

quite a lot, and other countries like France should play a part. We

have a responsibility to take some and give them a decent life.

It's emerged that five prison officers were taken hostage

by an inmate with a bladed weapon at Highpoint prison

A report seen by the BBC shows the stand-off came a day

after another hostage incident at the same prison which

involved a prisoner taken hostage inside a cell.

Both ended without injury and are now under investigation.

Almost 300 actors, musicians, writers and artists have said

they back the campaign to stay in the European Union.

Benedict Cumberbatch, Bill Nighy, and Kiera Knightly are among stars

who have signed a letter in the Guardian saying

Brexit would "damage" the creative industry.

But House of Cards author Lord Dobbs said British success in the industry

Councillors in North Yorkshire will meet later to discuss

whether or not to approve fracking in England for the first time

since a ban on the technique was lifted in 2012.

They will consider plans by Third Energy to frack at a site

Many residents fear it will increase noise and pollution.

The company says its operations poses no risks to people

That's a summary of the latest BBC News - more at 10.30.

I just wanted to pick up on some breaking news about Reckitt

reportedly found as investigators search for the EgyptAir plane that

disappeared off the radar yesterday en route from Paris to Cairo. An

Egyptian army spokesman said plane wreckage was found 180 miles from

Alexandria. In Egypt. It is reported that Egyptian aircraft and Navy

vessels have found personal belongings of passengers and parts

of the wreckage around 180 miles north of Alexandria. So, that is

coming through, that is one of the boats in the area, that is involved

in the search operation for the plane that came down with 66 people

on board. We will keep you updated as we get more.

Thanks for your comments on children stranded in the so-called Jungle

Steph tweeted - It's sad that two survivors of Nazi Germany have

to witness the UK government again ignoring genocide.

But John emailed - We should not allow these child

refugees into the UK, if we do then it will open

Do get in touch with us throughout the morning -

use the hashtag Victoria Live and if you text, you will be charged

Let's have a look at the sport now with Ore.

Thank you. We are rattling through the guests here at the BBC Sport

Centre. Just four years ago -

when other teams were preparing for the European Championship -

Northern Ireland conceded six goals in a friendly

against the Netherlands. Fast forward to today and they're

now preparing for their first major tournament for 30 years

after qualifying for Euro 2016. It's been some transformation

and I delighted to say the man who's presided over it - manager

Michael O'Neill - joins me now... It is great to see you. Great to see

the smile still on your face. We will look forward in a moment, but

take us back to October last year, and the realisation after the win

over Greece, you and your boys heading to France? It was magical.

We had two chances really in the tournament, with Greece and Finland

play but it was great how we did on the night, 3-1, a great performance,

two Steven Davis goals. It was great to see the euphoria in the stadium

and what it meant to Northern Ireland. And that realisation of

going to the finals, its comrade quickly. You took those games on,

top of the group, three points ahead Finland as well. To know that you, I

would not say breezed through, but you went through so convincingly, it

gives you such momentum going through to the Tom Wood? That is the

most pleasing aspect, we wanted to give a chance on qualification and

when we got that, it changed and we wanted to win the group. We have

been unbeaten since publication in the friendlies we've played, the

momentum is up at this moment in time and it is nice to go through as

group winners. We are one of the smaller nations as well and

hopefully we can continue to surprise people when we get there.

You mention the goal-scorers, including Mr Davies, not more than

one-year-old when Northern Ireland were last in the major championship,

it is a huge occasion for the team and the country, when you get there,

is that going to play a part? Will that be something that you use as

motivation or will you want to play it down? I think we can use it as

motivation, this is a new experience for us, the players, and supporters,

a whole generation of Northern Ireland supporters, it is their

first experience in a major tournament. I think that it will

work in our favour, there's freshness about it, perhaps on

naivete, it could work in our favour. The big

nations go in every two years, players are asked to play in these

big tournaments but for our guys it is the biggest stage in their career

and I think they will make the most of it. Unfortunately we've run out

of time, we did not even get the chance to talk about Germany. We

will be talking more in about 30 minutes. But for the meantime, we

appreciate talking to you. Thank you. It is a

very busy programme today! Refugees who fled the Nazis

on the eve of the Second World War, are calling on the government to do

more to get children out Hundreds of unaccompanied children

are living in the Jungle, and charities say they are at

serious risk of harm and death because the government isn't

moving quickly enough This programme had exclusive access

as two former Jewish refugees - Labour peer Lord Dubs

and Rabbi Harry Jacobi - who came to Britain

as children in the 1930s, travelled to France to meet

the children stuck in the Jungle. A handshake across the years.

Separated across decades, connected by history.

The moment two elderly men, wants child refugees in Europe, met a new

generation in peril. The Nazis came to Holland, in the Second World War.

I was rescued and came to England. As a refugee. Like you, I was

unaccompanied. Let me introduce you to some of the team... Labour peer

Lord Dubs and Harry Jacobi have come here, the Calais jungle, home to 400

children there without a family. More than 70 years ago, they both

made their own journey to safety. As the world war loomed, the British

government saved 10,000 children from the Nazis. The kindertransport

gave safe passage to Jewish children from all over Europe, bringing them

to our shores by the boatload. Harry left his parents in Berlin, and made

it to Holland. Only for the Nazis to invade in 1940. After leaving

Holland, we arrived at Liverpool, and I have a picture here in the

Liverpool paper. That is the picture? To show how we arrived in

Liverpool on the 19th of May, 1940. Earlier this month, Lord Dubs led a

successful campaign to force a Gottman to welcoming more known

children seeking asylum in Europe. It is thought there are almost

90,000 unaccompanied kids across the EU. In Calais, there are more than

400. Charity citizens UK says 457 of them have a legal claim to come to

Britain because they have a relative waiting for them -- 157. Harry and

Alf met two of those boys from Afghanistan, aged ten and 12. They

wanted to remain anonymous will stop they walked over mountains and

stayed in car boots. Scared of older men and French police and tear gas,

they said they would keep trying to get onto lorries bound for England.

Nobody denies that the jungle is a dangerous place, and the government

has agreed to do more. Ministers insist they are working as quickly

and safely as possible and in the best interests of the children. But

campaigners say it is not fast enough.

The kindertransport is not just a story of how 10,000 children cheated

the Nazis, it is about how a nation responded to the great moral

question of its time. 70 years on, those veterans say the question has

come back. The circumstances are different but they are asking

Britain, are we prepared to do today what we did in the past? In 1938,

39, Britain took 10,000 unaccompanied child refugees from

Germany and Czechoslovakia. It was not our problem then but we did it.

As the former refugees prepared to leave, the children had a message

for them to take home. Think about your children. If they were in our

position, how would you feel? Thank you for your time. Good luck, and we

will do our best. Thank you. In a moment we will talk to a

humanitarian worker in Calais, and a man who came to the UK a few years

ago as an unaccompanied child. First, we are going to speak to

Roger Gale. You took in a refugee. Why did you do that? At the time I

felt it was the right thing to do. My wife and I discussed it

carefully. One thing we have to understand is that when we talk

about the children we are talking about people under 18. A good number

already are under 14. Taking on a teenager is not easy. It is not easy

taking on a teenager if they speak your own language. If they don't,

and they have been traumatised, it is not something anybody can do.

This idea that there is an army of people waiting to take and foster

children is a myth. I have a very high regard for Alf Dobbs. He is a

close friend. But I'm afraid he is wrong on this respect. The Jewish

community in the United Kingdom under talk and did, to take in

children, to bring them up and to pay for them throughout their lives

until they were adult. That is what they did. Alf had his own father

here. The people we are talking about have no fathers here. The

children who do have families here, we need to process them faster. But

for the rest of them, you are comparing apples and pay is. Are you

saying it is difficult because these kids have issues? That they should

not come here at all? First I believe the PM are's policy remains

right. That is to take refugees, approved and vetted, from the camps.

That way we can control the process. We know they have been checked out.

We can provide properly for them. But the second thing that we have to

be very careful indeed, is that we make absolutely certain that any

young people that do come from anywhere, actually, have the right

and proper homes to go to. What we do not want to see our children, Inc

from one danger zone to another danger zone in the form of, and I am

sorry I have to say this, paedophilia or whatever. Not

everybody wanting to take children in his doing it for the right

motives. Checks and balances have to be in place. It is important we

remember that. I know this sounds harsh, but I fear that as a result

of what has been changed by pressure, and the fact the

government has to some extent given way, it will encourage people

traffickers to encourage children to make the very dangerous journey

across the seas of Greece and across Europe. Some of those children will

die because some of those boats will sink. The people promoting this

course of action will have some of those -- that blood on their hands.

Thank you very much. We talk to Iona Lawrence,

who is a humanitarian worker She is sobbing children come to the

UK. What is the situation as far as you're concerned? Hi, there. I just

wanted to start by saying I am sorry to hear about the difficult

situation that you find yourself in, Roger. I work for a Citizens UK in

Calais and we have been working here offer in excess of seven months to

reunite the children here will have a legal right to be in the UK, with

their families. There are seven -- 150 or so here who have a legal

right to be in the UK. As we heard from Roger and in the piece

beforehand, these are children who currently, due to their not being an

effective, efficient system for them to be reunited with their families,

are left with no option but to take incredibly dangerous decisions every

day to reach their families through their own means. Children have died

doing this and they will continue to die until there is an effective

system for them to be transferred safely. Ultimately what Citizens UK

are calling for is for them to be transferred as soon as possible,

safely and effectively, so that they can join school in September. It is

only through joining school they can regain a semblance of the childhood

they have lost through conflict and the dangerous journey to Calais.

What are your thoughts as you see the children in the refugee camps

but obviously hear the perspective of Roger Gale and others, who think

the UK should not be doing more to help bring more people here? Good

morning. It is dangerous when politicians like Roger make such

statements. His statement is based on an assumption as though these

children have a choice. I made this journey ten years ago and not by

choice but out of desperation. In difficult circumstances. Those

children who reached Europe last year are not doing it because they

thought Europe was easy, they were risking their lives for their

safety. We should be doing everything to show compassion and

welcome those children with the dignity and respect they deserve.

Citizens UK does an excellent job. The government should listen. Thank

you very much. We contacted the Home

Office for its response. Immigration Minister James

Brokenshire said: "The UK Government is committed

to providing life-saving support and assistance to the vulnerable

children who have been unjustly impacted by this ongoing

humanitarian crisis. And we are targeting

our efforts to assist Everyone wants this to happen

as quickly and as safely as possible, but we must ensure

it is in the best We are working with Local

Authorities in the UK, the UNHCR as well as with

counterparts in Greece, France and Italy to identify

vulnerable children to bring to the UK and make sure the support

systems are in place There is confusion over whether a

second Nigerian schoolgirl has been located. We will have the latest.

Let's talk to Olympic gold medallist Tessa Sanderson. She has said age

should be no barrier when it comes to adopting.

The 60 year-old former javelin thrower and

in six Olympic Games, has now adopted two young children

with her 54 year-old husband, Densign White.

Thank you both have seen a picture of your gorgeous

children. It has come later in life, hasn't it? Before the children came

into your life, had you given up hope of having kids? I had,

actually. I had two IVFs and it did not really work. I was quite

actually. I had two IVFs and it did it not happening. I thought,

actually. I had two IVFs and it did I do? I more or less gave up hope.

But then I thought, I really love I do? I more or less gave up hope.

children, there are so many children in my family. My sister has kids, my

brothers... Then I met my husband and had a chat with him again and we

thought, fantastic, let's go forward and do this.

thought, fantastic, let's go forward in your 50s. Obviously that is not

an easy undertaking because that potentially means children coming

into your life and having to move on again? Yes, but I think for us and

for myself, the age did not come to mind because I thought we are fit

enough. We are healthy enough. We have been active in our sporting

career. Irony wanted to children. Why should that be a barrier? I knew

there would be a lot of medical things we would have to go through

but I did not let the age frightened me and it did not you either, did

it? Not at all. I cannot believe you are 60. You look amazing. You'll are

thank you. I tried to keep as healthy as possible. When the

children came along, Cassius and Ruby May, you thought they were

coming as foster children. That is how they came. But when they came

into your house, how did you feel? What difference did they make? Made

an enormous amount of difference. Even beforehand when we went to see

the children, because they were born prematurely, they fitted on your

hand. They were very tiny and very ill at the time. They were born

premature. We have some video of you playing with them. Her recent is

this? About two years ago. Cassius? I have put them in a little box in

the park. Keep them quiet. Don't eat the box! They look adorable. They

have grown a lot since then. Now we have introduced them to running and

all that sort of this thing. When they came to was it made an enormous

amount of difference because we knew they were very poorly and we knew

they -- we had to undertake things with medication and all that.

Hospital visits and all that. It did not deter us. How did the situation

change? Obviously they were being fostered. You find yourselves able

to adopt them. The local authority made it known to us the long-term

plan for the children was for them to be adopted and not for them to

stay in fostering. And then at that point, we had more or less decided

that we could not let them go. We kind of bonded with them. And so we

spoke to the social workers and said that we would like to be considered

as adoptive parents. They were quite happy to let that go forward. There

were so many rigorous tests we had to go through. Things like social

workers calling ad hoc. I know people say things about social

workers but they have a job to do and they were absolutely brilliant.

It did not matter whenever they called. If you are not up to speed

about recording daily things, you have to do all of that as well, to

make sure that things are good. The background of families. Make sure

you have a close-knit family. For me it was great because Denzel's mum,

although she is in Wolverhampton, she is always here. My sister, my

niece. You have to have that family bonding back-up in order. It does

not just happen overnight. Those are things anybody goes through when

fostering or adopting? Absolutely. Did you ever feel the age was a

concern? Not for you what I mean for the social workers who were looking?

I think at first they thought, is this going to be a problem? But once

they sort of met us and were speaking on the terms of, this is

what is required etc, how would you feel? They looked at us and saw that

we were out with the kids a lot. They mentioned that the kids need to

go out and be active. I don't think it became a factor really in the

long run because they could see that we were on the ball. There are

probably people You are both Olympians, do you hope

the kids follow in your footprints? It would be great if they do that

but we would support them in whatever career they choose to

pursue. Whether it be sport, or something else professionally. It

would be fantastic. Sport gave us something else professionally. It

great pathway but the thing is, Cassius, he loves edgier and to

death, Cassius, he loves edgier and to

time, Ruby is into dancing and being active, -- Ed Sheeran. But I know

the confidence that sport can give you, there are challenges but it is

a great part. I would encourage them to do that. Is it rejuvenates in?

Not that you need it! But talking about the music, I think of those

activities you do with young kids, it takes a lot to do them but it

gets you engaged? Yes, you learn about the things that they like to

watch on the TV, Peppa Pig, Frozen! about the things that they like to

It is fantastic. It's been about the things that they like to

learning curve. It has kept me even about the things that they like to

fitter, and you are the same, it is great. It's a new challenge every

day, they are at nursery great. It's a new challenge every

I'm thinking, OK, in the morning, they play all of these jokey thing

is to get them ready in time! You don't have as much time for yourself

to relax as we may have wanted to have at this age, you come home from

work and you want to put your feet up... You had that time

-- before though, didn't you? think that fostering is a great

thing to do, it's an encouraging, if think that fostering is a great

child as a whole something secure, it is good. Fostering is a very good

thing, there are a lot out there who need that help. Kayla says that you

are 60 and you look good, keep it up! I'm trying! I will be doing

that! Someone else says how amazing you look at 60. They are by that you

became parents. Jess has tweeted "Amazing".

became parents. Jess has tweeted Thank you. Still to come...

schoolgirls is found - of the 218 missing Nigerian

making one in in every six albums sold worldwide.

Let's go over to Anita in the BBC Newsroom.

There are reports from the Egyptian military that wreckage and luggage

has been found of the EgyptAir plane that disappeared

Egyptian aircraft and navy vessels have found personal belongings

and plane debris off the coast of Alexandria in Egypt,

Flight 804 went missing en route from Paris to Cairo

The Egyptians have said terror is more likely than technical

failure but the French foreign minister has this morning pulled

TRANSLATION: We are looking at all possibilities but none are being

favoured over others because we have absolutely no indication on the

causes. We continue to search for plane debris, and have already

dispatched one search aircraft, another is on the way, as well as

one ship. We had to look at the wreckage and black boxes and analyse

them because we want to find the truth, the whole truth.

Two Britons living abroad have lost their Court of Appeal battle

over the right to vote in June's EU referendum.

The legal challenge was brought by World War Two

veteran Harry Shindler, 94, who lives in Italy,

and lawyer and Belgian resident Jacquelyn MacLennan.

Under law, UK citizens who have lived abroad for more

Parliament has determined the scope of the referendum franchise in

section two of the 2015 act. The common law right to vote does not

take precedence over an act of Parliament. The order of this Court,

therefore, is the appeal is dismissed, the appearance to pay the

costs of the appeal, subject to a cap of ?15,000. The appearance

application to appeal to the Supreme Court is refused.

Figures due out later this morning are expected to show

an unprecedented deficit among hospitals and other

It's thought it could be more than two billion pounds

Experts are warning that the financial strain

Psychiatric patients in England are having to travel up to 300 miles

because of a shortage of hospital beds.

Figures obtained by BBC News and the online journal

Community Care show nearly 5,500 patients had to travel

out of their local area to get the nearest bed.

There's a warning from the EU Remain campaign this morning that

infrastructure projects could suffer if the UK votes to leave.

It comes from the Manchester City council leader -

who says they would lose out on funding from

In Manchester, the tram project there has had substantial

It would mean, in future, if we needed to do something on this

scale, and undoubtably we will need to do more things on this sort of

scale within greater Manchester, it would make it very difficult, if not

impossible, to do so in a way that gives good value for council tax

payers. That's a summary of the latest news,

join me for BBC Newsroom Time for a look at

the sport with Ore. England's cricketers will be hoping

to continue their fightback when play resumes in the first test

against Sri Lanka They were floundering on 83-5

yesterday before Alex Hales and Jonny Bairstow combined

in an unbroken partnership of 88 before the rain ended play

early at Headingley. Rory McIlroy has urged Muirfield

to "see sense" after the club voted against accepting

female members yesterday. The decision means the club

won't be allowed to host Meanwhile, McIlroy is is back out

on course at the Irish Open - Former French Open champion

Roger Federer, has pulled out of this year's tournament

with a back injury. He hasn't missed a Grand Slam this

century, but has been Ross Murdoch's gold in the 200 metre

breaststroke, was one of five European medals for Great Britain

at London's Aquatics Murdoch won't be competing

in the event at the Rio Olympics though after failing

to qualify last month. That's all the sport for now.

Joanna, back to you. Thank you. There are conflicting reports

as to whether a second schoolgirl - one of more than 200 seized

in the Nigerian town of Chibok by Islamist group

Boko Haram 2 years ago - An army spokesman said Serah Luka

was among 97 women and children rescued by troops in operations

in the north-eastern Borno State. This comes just two days

after the rescue of the first Chibok schoolgirl Amina Ali Nkeki

who spent Thursday meeting Amina and her four-month-old baby

were found by an army-backed vigilante group in the huge

Sambisa Forest, close She has since been

reunited with her family. In all, more than 200 girls remain

missing after their abduction by Boko Haram gunmen

from a secondary school dormitory The abduction led to

a world wide campaign - which was supported by US

First Lady Michelle Obama and The last time the group of girls

were seen was in April this year, when a video broadcast by CNN showed

15 girls in black robes. They said they were being treated

well, but wanted to be back Joining me is our correspondent,

Tulip Mazumder, and Virginia Comolli, author of Boko Haram:

Nigeria's Islamist Insurgency. Tulip, tell us why it is taking so

long to be able to get these girls out? Well, this is a huge and

difficult task that's been going on for many years now. I travelled to

north-east Nigeria last summer, and met some of the girls who had been

held alongside the Chibok schoolgirls, they described

unimaginable situations inside of the Sambisa Forest. I spoke to a

girl called Miriam, who was 16 years old when I met her. She was seven

months pregnant and was forced to marry a Boko Haram fighter and is

carrying his child. She managed to run away, she was not rescued, she

ran away and found someone who helped her. But, there are hundreds,

probably more than 2000 and missed you and say other girls like her, a

minority of them are the Chibok schoolgirls. It is known where they

are, it is just difficult... You got to them, what is the issue? Well, we

got to a certain point but even we had to turn back because of security

problems further up the road to Chibok. These are very difficult

areas. A few years ago you could not get anywhere near them, because Boko

Haram were in charge of the areas but now the Nigerian military has

made some forward marches into these areas.

They've rescued a few hundred girls, but these have been notoriously

difficult militants to pin down and the Grubman has been heavily

criticised as to why it is taking so long. -- the government. The girls

are pregnant, one of the girls long. -- the government. The girls

Boko Haram... Why they'd do this and take them, presumably to take them

as wives? Yes, absolutely, the Chibok girls are a comparatively

small group Chibok girls are a comparatively

number of civilians, it can be men, children and women kidnapped

number of civilians, it can be men, Haram in the insurgency. The girls

number of civilians, it can be men, are forced to marry

number of civilians, it can be men, Smuggling goods for insurgents. We

fear the number of them have become pregnant, it raises an

fear the number of them have become and difficult question that even if

these girls are rescued and managed to escape, how easy is it for them

to be integrated within to escape, how easy is it for them

communities, given the stigma that they will have once they come back

to their own communities. In all, how many have been taken? We had

reports of over 2000 people how many have been taken? We had

been kidnapped by Boko Haram. how many have been taken? We had

this area, how much power do Boko Haram actually wield? Over the last

several months, Nigerian forces have made significant

several months, Nigerian forces have that nowadays Boko Haram only

operate in the far north of the Borno State in the north-east of

Nigeria. much smaller, nonetheless, it is a

fairly large area. much smaller, nonetheless, it is a

and it is hard for the military to penetrate this area. Even if the

and it is hard for the military to exactly where the girls are,

launching an operation to rescue them would be a very dangerous one

because there would be a high risk that the girls would be killed

because there would be a high risk during the operation. And actually,

Boko Haram would kill them to show the Nigerian military, as a threat

to the Nigerian military. Tulip, you said Amnesty International were

working to help the girls, some had been rescued. The journey was

talking about the difficulties of integrating the girls into normal

society when they are rescued, what happens with the girls who have been

taken out of these situations? The help seems to be very limited, from

what we saw. We were walking along in a village that had been affected

and had people taken. I met a 66-year-old woman under a tree with

the clothes she escaped and, she escaped Boko Haram and from the

forest, she had nothing. She had not been seen by psychologists, she wept

in front of me. I think I was the first person she'd spoken to and she

escaped months ago. When I went there, I did not see anyone

receiving help from the government, people were still in displaced

people camps, there was not enough food and no psychological support.

In terms of how you integrate the women back into the community it is

a huge question. The years or months of trauma that they have endured is

unimaginable, and being released, or being rescued, that is the start of

a very long journey for them. Tulip and the Junior, thank you very much.

Two Britons living abroad have lost a battle for the right to vote in

the EU referendum. 94 year-old Harry Schindler

is a World War Two veteran living in Italy - he's fighting his case

with Jacquelyn MacLennan, who moved to Belgium

more than 25 years ago. We can listen to part of the

judgment. Parliament has determined the scope of the referendum

franchise in two of the 2015 act. The common-law right to vote does

take precedence over an act of Parliament. The order of this court

therefore is that the dismissal -- the appeal is dismissed. The

appellants would play the cost subject to a capped at ?15,000. The

application for permission to appeal to the Supreme Court is refused.

They have lost their case. They have not been given permission to appeal.

Well, we can speak to Jacquelyn MacLennan in Brussels.

She's been fighting this case with Harry Schindler.

John Little os an expat living near Palma in Majorca.

He's been watching developments in the case closely.

she's from the Netherlands and came to the UK,

but she's not allowed to vote in the referendum either.

Jacqueline, your reaction to the ruling? Obviously I am very