02/03/2016 Wednesday in Parliament


02/03/2016

Highlights of Wednesday 2 March in Parliament, presented by Alicia McCarthy.


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Hello and welcome to Wednesday in Parliament.

:00:15.:00:15.

David Cameron faces questions about Europe while the Labour leader

:00:16.:00:19.

accuses him of not delivering on education.

:00:20.:00:24.

One third of families promised 30-hours free childcare now won't

:00:25.:00:30.

receive it. This is a broken promise.

:00:31.:00:32.

While David Cameron mocks Labour for taking economic advice

:00:33.:00:34.

from the former Greek Finance Minister.

:00:35.:00:37.

That is Labour's policy in two words.

:00:38.:00:42.

We're used to arguments about rich versus poor,

:00:43.:00:44.

A committee of MPs looks at the idea of intergenerational fairness.

:00:45.:00:51.

There's outrage in the Commons as an MP discovers that British

:00:52.:00:54.

Imagine it, you open your distinguished service order or CBE

:00:55.:01:04.

it says made in France. Every day at Westminster brings

:01:05.:01:06.

a new salvo in the debate On Wednesday morning,

:01:07.:01:10.

the Government published an analysis of the UK's options if it left

:01:11.:01:13.

the EU, suggesting they would all be worse for the economy

:01:14.:01:16.

than staying in. But Iain Duncan Smith -

:01:17.:01:19.

one of five Cabinet ministers campaigning in favour

:01:20.:01:23.

of a vote to leave the EU - said the Government was "in denial"

:01:24.:01:26.

about the risk of remaining a member, adding that, "this dodgy

:01:27.:01:30.

dossier won't fool anyone." It was the SNP's Westminster

:01:31.:01:34.

leader who raised Europe Millions of UK citizens live

:01:35.:01:48.

elsewhere in the European Union. European decisions have helped the

:01:49.:01:55.

environment. Relations between 28EU member states happens often

:01:56.:01:59.

imperfectly but through dialogue and agreement which surely is a huge

:02:00.:02:03.

improvement on confrontation and wars of the past. Will the Prime

:02:04.:02:07.

Minister concentrate on the positive arguments for EU membership and

:02:08.:02:13.

reject the approach of Project Fear? My arguments about being stronger in

:02:14.:02:17.

the reformed European Union, safer in the reformed European Union, and

:02:18.:02:21.

better off in the reformed European Union are all positive arguments. I

:02:22.:02:25.

would add the point he makes, that of course things like pollution

:02:26.:02:28.

crosses borders and so it makes sense to work together. I think the

:02:29.:02:31.

fundamental point he makes is one worth thinking about. He and I are

:02:32.:02:37.

both post-war children. But we should never forget, when we sit

:02:38.:02:40.

around that table, just 70 years ago, these countries were murdering

:02:41.:02:44.

each other on the continent of Europe. For five or six years,

:02:45.:02:48.

national insurance numbers issued to EU migrants have been hundreds of

:02:49.:02:53.

thousands higher than the official immigration figures. This emplies

:02:54.:02:58.

the official immigration figures may a dramatic underestimate. We can

:02:59.:03:02.

only know the truth of the matter if they release the data on active EU

:03:03.:03:07.

national insurance numbers, they have refused to do. Will the Prime

:03:08.:03:13.

Minister instruct HMRC to release the statistics immediately so we can

:03:14.:03:17.

understand the truth of EU immigration? You can get a national

:03:18.:03:21.

insurance number for a short-term visit. People who are already here

:03:22.:03:25.

but without a national insurance number can apply for them. These

:03:26.:03:30.

numbers are complex. The HMRC has given greater information I will

:03:31.:03:33.

continue to make sure that continues to be the case.

:03:34.:03:35.

Away from Europe, the Labour leader focussed on childcare

:03:36.:03:38.

for three and four-year-olds in England.

:03:39.:03:43.

The national audit report confirms one third of families promised

:03:44.:03:48.

30-hours free childcare now won't receive it. This is a broken

:03:49.:03:54.

promise. The report also warns that many childcare providers are not

:03:55.:03:59.

offering the new entitlement due to insufficient funding. There are

:04:00.:04:04.

41,000 three-year-olds missing out on free early education as a result

:04:05.:04:08.

of this. Will the Prime Minister intervene and ensure those children

:04:09.:04:11.

get the start in life that they deserve? We want all of these

:04:12.:04:14.

children to have the start in life they deserve. I'm glad he mentioned

:04:15.:04:19.

the National Audit Office report. Let me read him some of the things

:04:20.:04:24.

it says. "The department has successfully implebened the

:04:25.:04:30.

entitlement to free childcare with three or four-year-olds with almost

:04:31.:04:35.

takeup." We should be congratulating the Secretary of State.

:04:36.:04:36.

David Cameron turned on Jeremy Corbyn's economic strategy.

:04:37.:04:43.

I can announce to the House, his adviser, he was the Greek Finance

:04:44.:04:52.

Minister who left his economy in ruins. That is Labour's policy in

:04:53.:04:55.

two words. Acropolis now. Jeremy Corbyn moved onto the number

:04:56.:05:00.

of teachers in England's schools, accusing David Cameron of being

:05:01.:05:03.

in denial over teacher shortages. When 70% of Head teachers warned

:05:04.:05:12.

they are now having to use agency staff to staff their classrooms,

:05:13.:05:15.

isn't it time the Government intervened and looked at the real

:05:16.:05:20.

cost of this, which is damage to children's education, but also 1.3

:05:21.:05:25.

billion spent last year on agency teachers? If you want to look at

:05:26.:05:30.

enkourageing people to go into teaching you have to know you have a

:05:31.:05:34.

good school system with more academies, free schools and higher

:05:35.:05:39.

qualifications making sure we have rigour and discipline in our

:05:40.:05:42.

classroom. All of which improved. That is only possible if you have a

:05:43.:05:45.

strong and growing economy to fund the schools that our children need.

:05:46.:05:47.

David Cameron. The Government has defended a review

:05:48.:05:51.

of the state pension age which will look at whether or not

:05:52.:05:54.

it will need to rise A former head of the CBI,

:05:55.:05:57.

John Cridland, will lead the first Experts have suggested people

:05:58.:06:01.

joining the workforce now may have to wait until their mid-70s before

:06:02.:06:08.

they can retire. Labour have said such a review

:06:09.:06:12.

could throw the plans of millions But the Work and Pensions Secretary

:06:13.:06:16.

told MPs there'd be no immediate change and ministers had to respond

:06:17.:06:22.

to rising life expectancy. Future generations would rightly

:06:23.:06:33.

expect that we should reflect those changes in the nature of how we set

:06:34.:06:35.

the pension. and they wouldn't thank us,

:06:36.:06:39.

I think - and we very rarely hear anybody talk about future

:06:40.:06:43.

generations - but they would not thank us if we didn't take the right

:06:44.:06:45.

decisions at the right time and have the courage to ensure

:06:46.:06:48.

pensions are sustainable, to avoid them having to pick

:06:49.:06:50.

up an increasing bill which would make their lives

:06:51.:06:53.

even more difficult. Finally, Mr Speaker,

:06:54.:07:00.

can the Minister tell us what he thinks the upper limit

:07:01.:07:02.

is for the state pension age? Is it 80, as his former colleague,

:07:03.:07:05.

the Pensions Minister, warned today? Isn't it the truth, Mr Speaker,

:07:06.:07:09.

that the new pension promise is not the 75p they're always banging

:07:10.:07:13.

about, it's the 75 years you'll have to work and wait under this

:07:14.:07:16.

Tory Government before Mr Duncan Smith reminded Labour it

:07:17.:07:19.

had agreed to regular reviews and described that response

:07:20.:07:28.

as "utter idiocy." Can I just say to the House that

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I think, sadly, he gives a bad That was so pathetic as a response

:07:50.:07:53.

to a u-cue that was asked from an opposition that has no

:07:54.:07:57.

policy, jumps around opposing everything, racking up

:07:58.:08:00.

spending commitments. No wonder they haven't a hope

:08:01.:08:01.

in hell of being in Government. Healthy life expectancy is not

:08:02.:08:04.

rising at the same speed In fact, the gap between

:08:05.:08:06.

the two is widening. Given the Government's reductions

:08:07.:08:09.

in support for sick and disabled people of working-age,

:08:10.:08:12.

indeed changes we're due to discuss later today, can we have any

:08:13.:08:14.

confidence that further increases pension age will not simply condemn

:08:15.:08:16.

thousands of older people with serious health conditions

:08:17.:08:19.

to an impoverished old age on state benefits prior to their

:08:20.:08:22.

official retirement? Inevitably, there are bound to be

:08:23.:08:24.

loud complaints from those who are so unlucky that they're born

:08:25.:08:26.

at a stage when they're just affected by the change,

:08:27.:08:29.

but a Government has a duty to proceed in the interests

:08:30.:08:32.

of the country and in the interests of future generations of working

:08:33.:08:34.

taxpayers who will not be able to afford to sustain our system

:08:35.:08:37.

unless we respond to reality. I'm not going to get angry,

:08:38.:08:40.

but I am going to gently point out to the Secretary of State

:08:41.:08:43.

that he Is quite wrong to say that there is a

:08:44.:08:49.

consensus about this. Indeed, he has broken the consensus

:08:50.:08:51.

he put in place with the excellent former Pensions Minister,

:08:52.:08:54.

Steve Webb, because that agreement was that the independent reviews

:08:55.:08:56.

that would happen every five years would look at life expectancy

:08:57.:08:59.

and fairness of those paying in. But he's now introducing

:09:00.:09:02.

affordability into that, which was not part of that,

:09:03.:09:05.

as well as bringing it forward. Will the Secretary of State rule out

:09:06.:09:08.

the prospect of the retirement age being increased to 84

:09:09.:09:11.

as a result of this review, as was predicted by the previous

:09:12.:09:14.

Pensions Minister, Steve Webb? Mr Speaker, is there any limit

:09:15.:09:17.

that this Government is prepared to set on the upper limit

:09:18.:09:20.

of the state retire am age? It is that somehow that her party

:09:21.:09:25.

opposes an independent and regular I hear the frontbench shouting

:09:26.:09:31.

"rigged." The only thing rigged

:09:32.:09:39.

here is the way that he got onto the frontbench to be

:09:40.:09:41.

the Opposition spokesman. Meanwhile, a committee of MPs has

:09:42.:09:54.

been looking at where the balance lies between making life better

:09:55.:09:59.

for young people and improving it The Work and Pensions Committee

:10:00.:10:01.

is looking at the issue Its first witnesses were two

:10:02.:10:05.

ex-ministers with an interest David Willetts is a former

:10:06.:10:08.

Universities Minister, who's recently written a book

:10:09.:10:11.

on intergenerational issues, and Steve Webb is a former

:10:12.:10:13.

Pensions Minister. In terms of the two crucial assets

:10:14.:10:22.

people build up during their working lives, both owning a home

:10:23.:10:25.

and having a funded pension, much harder for the younger

:10:26.:10:27.

generation to get started When we look at someone who's 60ish

:10:28.:10:29.

and looks relatively comfortable, I think the wrong conclusion

:10:30.:10:34.

would be, therefore, because 20-year-olds are struggling

:10:35.:10:36.

to get on the housing ladder, and here's a comfortable

:10:37.:10:38.

60-year-old, therefore we must break the triple-lock on the pension

:10:39.:10:41.

or scrap the winter fuel Not recognising that the 60-year-old

:10:42.:10:43.

was probably 20, when we had 30, when we we had mass unemployment

:10:44.:10:48.

in the 80s. You know, if she's a woman,

:10:49.:10:57.

she may well have started work when there wasn't even legislation

:10:58.:11:00.

to stop discrimination against women So the challenge I think

:11:01.:11:03.

for the inquiry, is to see people over the course of their whole lives

:11:04.:11:07.

and I think then you get a rich Nowadays, those challenges that,

:11:08.:11:11.

I hope across parties we believe in, owning your own home,

:11:12.:11:18.

settling down, building up a funded pension,

:11:19.:11:20.

those things which were pretty much automatic are now massive policy

:11:21.:11:22.

issues and challenges. I think, in the long run,

:11:23.:11:24.

a society where people are getting into their 30s or older and don't

:11:25.:11:27.

have a place of their own and haven't got a funded pension,

:11:28.:11:40.

is one where the younger generation Feel that then they're getting

:11:41.:11:43.

a raw deal. So, just generally, your views

:11:44.:11:47.

on Government policies, have they helped or hindered this

:11:48.:11:49.

problem? We've had a decline

:11:50.:11:51.

in the number of mature students So in places where different

:11:52.:11:53.

generations mix, if you look at the UK kind of social attitudes

:11:54.:11:56.

evidence, we are more We're more likely to work

:11:57.:11:59.

alongside people our own age, study alongside them, have houses

:12:00.:12:02.

and accommodation alongside them. That does make it easier for these

:12:03.:12:04.

kind of pictures of a different age group to build up, including I think

:12:05.:12:08.

often very unfair caricatures Could I just add one point to that,

:12:09.:12:10.

if I may. Normally, the National Pensioners

:12:11.:12:16.

Convention gave people like me a hard time,

:12:17.:12:18.

but their strategy on this issue is really quite surprising because,

:12:19.:12:21.

rather than just bang on for pensioners, they have

:12:22.:12:23.

specifically allied themselves So that rather than have

:12:24.:12:25.

this kind of battle, they've sort of said, actually,

:12:26.:12:30.

our generation do care So do you think that

:12:31.:12:32.

intergenerational distribution of wealth of income is a more

:12:33.:12:37.

pressing issue than disparities I think that the danger of -

:12:38.:12:39.

I mean, at the risk... Someone said the other day,

:12:40.:12:45.

they were quoted as saying. At 64, I was a benefits scrounger,

:12:46.:12:48.

at 65 I was a national treasure. Suddenly, you know,

:12:49.:12:51.

all the pensioners we see Actually, we are hugely

:12:52.:12:56.

diverse within generations. There's been virtually no increase

:12:57.:13:00.

in employment for young There's barely been an increase

:13:01.:13:03.

for middle aged people. The surge in employment has been

:13:04.:13:08.

amongst the over 60s. There are lots of pensioners

:13:09.:13:10.

who are also working. That's where the labour market

:13:11.:13:13.

flexibilities have really Indeed, one quarter of all free

:13:14.:13:16.

pensioner bus pass journeys in London are older people

:13:17.:13:25.

travelling to work. Despite, you know, very vast

:13:26.:13:30.

and sort of deep intellectual argument about the intergenerational

:13:31.:13:38.

challenges, the bottom line is that the political imperative

:13:39.:13:43.

around propensity to vote amongst older people trumps any analysis

:13:44.:13:47.

that either of you have. I mean, we can discuss this as long

:13:48.:13:56.

as we like but you know, as well as I do,

:13:57.:14:00.

that's the imperative. The worst advice young people ever

:14:01.:14:02.

got was Russell Brand telling them That was such bad advice when,

:14:03.:14:05.

in reality, you're right, I do think older people worry now

:14:06.:14:08.

about their children and grandchildren and we partly got

:14:09.:14:12.

into this mess because we just We just didn't think when pensions

:14:13.:14:15.

were being regulated more and more heavily,

:14:16.:14:21.

does this mean that there won't be any funded company pensions

:14:22.:14:23.

for the next generation? So I think that when be you get

:14:24.:14:25.

people into this cast of mind, You're watching Wednesday

:14:26.:14:29.

in Parliament, here on BBC Parliament, with me,

:14:30.:14:40.

Alicia McCarthy. How should Europe respond

:14:41.:14:43.

to the migrant crisis? Thousands of migrants have amassed

:14:44.:14:46.

in Greece after neighbouring On Monday, hundreds tried to break

:14:47.:14:50.

through, but were blocked by Macedonian police

:14:51.:14:56.

who fired tear gas at them. The European Commission has

:14:57.:15:00.

announced a multi-million-pound emergency aid programme to help

:15:01.:15:02.

Greece and other countries overwhelmed by an

:15:03.:15:08.

influx of migrants. In the Commons, an SNP MP

:15:09.:15:10.

asked an urgent question. The International Development

:15:11.:15:13.

Secretary said there would be But as the Secretary of State agree

:15:14.:15:29.

that rubber bullets and tear gas does not amount to an appropriate

:15:30.:15:32.

response and Greece cannot manage the situation alone? This country

:15:33.:15:39.

has a proud and honourable tradition that is being honoured now. The EU

:15:40.:15:44.

response has been chaotic and the honourable gentleman is right.

:15:45.:15:48.

Rubber bullets and tear gas against children is not the answer. When my

:15:49.:15:54.

Mac and my right honourable friend seek to convene a European meeting

:15:55.:16:07.

to garner a holistic response. That would be a summit to come up with a

:16:08.:16:12.

more appropriate response. What is the Government doing to work with

:16:13.:16:16.

fellow members of the European family of nations to be more

:16:17.:16:22.

effective against the people traffickers? Provide a safe routes

:16:23.:16:28.

for refugees and above all how can we turn our backs on the people of

:16:29.:16:33.

Greece who risked being overwhelmed because of the absence of a

:16:34.:16:37.

strategic approach and humanitarian approach to this issue by all of the

:16:38.:16:47.

EU nations, including the UK? I think I would strongly disagree with

:16:48.:16:51.

her last statement because the reality is we are the largest

:16:52.:16:56.

contributor to the humanitarian response in Europe. We are working

:16:57.:17:01.

across the EU to ensure this humanitarian crisis is averted and

:17:02.:17:05.

the most vulnerable people are protected and given shelter. We are

:17:06.:17:09.

monitoring the situation closely and stand ready to meet other priority

:17:10.:17:11.

On the backbenches there were calls for the Government to take more

:17:12.:17:15.

of the migrants, including unaccompanied children.

:17:16.:17:21.

I remain convinced we have a greater leadership role to play in ensuring

:17:22.:17:28.

Greece is supported and not left to be abandoned by the rest of Europe,

:17:29.:17:33.

which is what is happening now. In the mix of all, sorry mess there are

:17:34.:17:38.

unaccompanied, let's call them what they really are, orphaned children

:17:39.:17:44.

who are still there and in need of our care and I believe the UK and

:17:45.:17:48.

other countries have moral obligation to house them. Blankets

:17:49.:17:58.

are not enough. Last year there were 19,000 unaccompanied children

:17:59.:18:01.

registered and applied for asylum in Europe. Does that not demonstrate

:18:02.:18:07.

the modesty of the col botanist country to take 3000? Surely this

:18:08.:18:12.

the time when the Government should say yes to that very modest call for

:18:13.:18:15.

say yes to that very modest call for political leadership?

:18:16.:18:18.

The Government's policy is to take migrants from camps in countries

:18:19.:18:21.

neighbouring Syria and not those who have fled to Europe.

:18:22.:18:26.

A number of Conservatives congratulated the Government

:18:27.:18:27.

The refugees we see from the Middle East are the victims of terrorists

:18:28.:18:38.

and traffickers and simply, to take refugees who have already made the

:18:39.:18:42.

safety of Europe into the UK is playing into the hands of those

:18:43.:18:48.

traffickers that are appallingly exploiting people.

:18:49.:18:51.

Down the corridor in the Lords, it was the turn of peers to debate

:18:52.:18:54.

the forthcoming referendum on our EU membership.

:18:55.:18:56.

In a wide ranging discussion, one former EU commissioner strongly

:18:57.:18:59.

supported the deal David Cameron had done.

:19:00.:19:00.

Once the die is cast, there will be no turning back.

:19:01.:19:09.

We cannot leave the European Union and for economic and trade purposes

:19:10.:19:16.

be treated as if we are still in it, that is the unescapable fact

:19:17.:19:19.

The case for getting out seems to me to rest on a strangely

:19:20.:19:35.

old-fashioned, almost Victorian, view of sovereignty -

:19:36.:19:37.

of Bagehot and Dicey, when all power rested

:19:38.:19:40.

I suspect that there is now more power resting on the global stage

:19:41.:19:45.

today that affects the lives of ordinary citizens than is vested

:19:46.:19:47.

in the institutions of nation states like ourselves.

:19:48.:19:49.

Nothing is-not our local councils, not our own families or football

:19:50.:19:58.

clubs, not even your Lordships' House.

:19:59.:19:59.

Does that mean we should opt out of them too?

:20:00.:20:02.

The EU does need reform, which is why we need to be right

:20:03.:20:09.

there on the pitch as a key player, not sitting in the stands,

:20:10.:20:12.

moaning as a spectator and suffering in cold isolation.

:20:13.:20:14.

The problem is that we are not and cannot be on the sidelines.

:20:15.:20:19.

Whether we like it or not, we are and will remain on the pitch.

:20:20.:20:23.

We therefore have a vested interest in helping to deliver

:20:24.:20:25.

Those of us who wish to leave the EU are asked to say

:20:26.:20:29.

what our alternative is to our membership,

:20:30.:20:31.

The alternative to being a member of the European Union is not

:20:32.:20:36.

being a member of the European Union.

:20:37.:20:40.

It may come as a great shock to the little Europeans

:20:41.:20:46.

in our midst, but most of the world, including significantly

:20:47.:20:49.

the fastest-growing countries in the world, are not

:20:50.:20:51.

I have come to the conclusion that in its present form the EU is a

:20:52.:21:08.

flawed project which is making its inhabitants worse off than they

:21:09.:21:12.

should be and because it is failing, contrary to what has been said by

:21:13.:21:17.

The Health and Safety Executive has censured the Ministry of Defence

:21:18.:21:25.

over the deaths of three soldiers in 2013 on an SAS training exercise.

:21:26.:21:28.

The Executive said that but for Crown Immunity,

:21:29.:21:30.

125 service personnel died on training exercises between 2000

:21:31.:21:34.

and 2015 and the Commons Defence sub committee is conducting an inquiry:

:21:35.:21:45.

During this enquiry we have heard some conflicting views. Improved

:21:46.:21:53.

design and delivery of training and better regulation of who is

:21:54.:21:58.

responsible has been expressed but we have also been told there is a

:21:59.:22:04.

higher rate of injury and fatalities while practising for war than in

:22:05.:22:10.

combat and we were told a blase attitude to attrition rates,

:22:11.:22:13.

particularly in training. How do these statements fit together? I

:22:14.:22:21.

would question some of those statements. I think, I can

:22:22.:22:26.

understand if you are trying to make a judgment about this why you might

:22:27.:22:31.

compare this on operations to those in training, but I would say that is

:22:32.:22:39.

not a helpful comparison. Clearly, though there will be undiagnosed

:22:40.:22:44.

heart conditions, things that arrives, you want to mitigate all

:22:45.:22:50.

deaths in training. I think one of the key point I would make is unless

:22:51.:22:57.

you have training that is rigorous enough and exposes people to the

:22:58.:23:01.

kind of thing they will experience in combat, you are failing in your

:23:02.:23:08.

duty of care to them. Nobody on the committee and not myself, we

:23:09.:23:11.

shouldn't waste time in stating the obvious. No one has a problem of

:23:12.:23:15.

arduous training. Everybody understands that in order to perform

:23:16.:23:20.

on operations you must have your training at the set levels. The

:23:21.:23:25.

problem I have got is some of that governors about that training,

:23:26.:23:28.

something has gone wrong and that is what we're trying to get to bottom

:23:29.:23:35.

of. We have had a number of concerns expressed to us about the ability of

:23:36.:23:40.

the MOD to police itself when it comes to Armed Forces in training.

:23:41.:23:46.

When I have looked at particular cases where there have been deaths

:23:47.:23:53.

and training it has been because policy has not been bowled, ought

:23:54.:23:58.

the wrong people have been carrying out particular training, a catalogue

:23:59.:24:05.

of feelings, and we need to look at why that happened, why it does not

:24:06.:24:13.

happen in other places and we must address that. I am confident that

:24:14.:24:20.

although there are still enquiry is going on into some incidents that

:24:21.:24:25.

have taken place, where we have identified why a particular thing

:24:26.:24:30.

wasn't followed or buy a particular individual wasn't conducting that

:24:31.:24:34.

aspect of training, those measures have been identified.

:24:35.:24:39.

Finally, Back to prime minister's questions,

:24:40.:24:40.

where a Labour Mp was outraged by the discovery of where British

:24:41.:24:43.

People in the Midlands are furious to learn that the Government have

:24:44.:24:47.

awarded a contract to make British medals to some French company.

:24:48.:24:50.

Imagine opening your Distinguished Service Order

:24:51.:24:55.

or your CBE to find "Fabrique en France" on it.

:24:56.:25:08.

I have visited Midlands' medal manufacturers in Birmingham's

:25:09.:25:09.

jewellery quarter, and they are the best in the world.

:25:10.:25:12.

The Prime Minister should go back to Downing Street,

:25:13.:25:14.

call in the Cabinet Office Minister and get this scandal sorted out.

:25:15.:25:19.

The only point I would make is that I am sure that all those

:25:20.:25:24.

in the Royal Mint in Wales would want to contest that claim

:25:25.:25:28.

and argue that they make the final medals in the United Kingdom.

:25:29.:25:32.

I am sure the competition between them and Birmingham is intense.

:25:33.:25:36.

I will certainly take away what the

:25:37.:25:38.

I was not aware of the issue, but where we can make

:25:39.:25:42.

something in Britain, we should make it in Britain.

:25:43.:25:52.

is it for now but join me at the same time tomorrow, including a

:25:53.:25:58.

debate on gangs and youth violence. Until then, goodbye.

:25:59.:26:03.

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