18/01/2017 Wednesday in Parliament


18/01/2017

Highlights of proceedings in Parliament on Wednesday 18 January, presented by Alicia McCarthy.


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Hello and welcome to Wednesday in Parliament.

:00:18.:00:19.

Coming up: After her Brexit speech the Labour leader challenges

:00:20.:00:23.

Can't night urged her to stop the threats of the bargain basement

:00:24.:00:40.

Brexit? I have a plan, he does not have a clue.

:00:41.:00:41.

MPs demand the Government do more to help a persecuted

:00:42.:00:44.

According to reports the minority group have been subject to arson,

:00:45.:00:49.

rape and murder. MPs try to find out why

:00:50.:00:51.

we waste so much food. And: Pretty much everyone

:00:52.:00:53.

hates theirs - but could we be about to enter a new era

:00:54.:00:56.

for the passport photo? Any of us can send essentially a

:00:57.:01:08.

selfie to the passport office for our passport.

:01:09.:01:10.

But first: There'd been mutterings in the Commons on Tuesday

:01:11.:01:12.

after Theresa May decided to make her big Brexit

:01:13.:01:14.

speech not in the chamber but to an outside audience.

:01:15.:01:17.

So Prime Minister's questions was the first chance for MPs

:01:18.:01:20.

to grill her directly on her 12 point plan.

:01:21.:01:22.

In her speech Theresa May made clear that the UK would not stay

:01:23.:01:25.

in the single market, that MPs and Peers would get a vote

:01:26.:01:28.

on the final exit deal and insisted no deal was better than

:01:29.:01:32.

The Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn began with a swipe at

:01:33.:01:37.

the Prime Minster for not setting out her plans in Parliament.

:01:38.:01:41.

Restoring parliamentary democracy while sidelining Parliament.

:01:42.:01:45.

Not so much the Iron Lady as the Irony Lady.

:01:46.:01:55.

Yesterday the Prime Minister finally provided some detail.

:01:56.:02:09.

Can I urge her to stop her threats of a bargain basement

:02:10.:02:13.

Brexit - a low-pay tax haven on the shores of Europe?

:02:14.:02:20.

It would not necessarily damage the EU, but it would certainly

:02:21.:02:23.

damage this country - businesses, jobs

:02:24.:02:24.

She demeans herself, her office and our country's

:02:25.:02:31.

What I set out yesterday was a plan for a global Britain,

:02:32.:02:41.

bringing prosperity to this country and jobs to people, and spreading

:02:42.:02:44.

Yesterday we learned a little more of the right honourable

:02:45.:02:51.

He said: "She has said, 'leave the single market,'

:02:52.:03:05.

"but at the same time says she wants to have access to the single market.

:03:06.:03:09.

"I'm not quite sure how that's going to go down in Europe.

:03:10.:03:12.

"I think we have to have a deal that ensures we have

:03:13.:03:15.

I've got a plan - he doesn't have a clue.

:03:16.:03:30.

Last year the Prime Minister said that leaving the single market

:03:31.:03:33.

would make trade deals "considerably harder," and that

:03:34.:03:37.

"while we could certainly negotiate our own trade agreements,

:03:38.:03:42.

"there would be no guarantee that they would be on terms as good

:03:43.:03:48.

"as those we enjoy now," but yesterday she offered us

:03:49.:03:51.

I also said it reported to leave the sky would not fall in and look at

:03:52.:04:16.

what has happened to our economic situation since we voted to leave

:04:17.:04:17.

the EU. Gentleman talks about

:04:18.:04:18.

the future of the economy. I want us to be an outward-looking

:04:19.:04:24.

nation trading around the world, and bringing prosperity and jobs

:04:25.:04:27.

into the United Kingdom. The one thing that would be bad

:04:28.:04:29.

for the economy is the answers He wants a cap on wages,

:04:30.:04:32.

no control on immigration That would not lead to prosperity -

:04:33.:04:37.

it would lead to no jobs, Will the Prime Minister provide

:04:38.:04:41.

a commitment today that no part of the Great Repeal Bill will be

:04:42.:04:45.

subject to English The honourable Lady knows full well

:04:46.:04:48.

that if any part of proposed legislation brought before this

:04:49.:04:54.

House applies only to England, it will be subject to English

:04:55.:04:57.

votes for English laws. It was quite clear from

:04:58.:05:00.

the Prime Minister's speech yesterday that she seeks to build

:05:01.:05:03.

a Brexit consensus and to bring our To that end, and indeed

:05:04.:05:06.

to strengthen the Prime Minister's negotiating hand, before Article 50

:05:07.:05:13.

is triggered, will she please at least consider publishing

:05:14.:05:17.

all those 12 objectives in a White Paper so that we can

:05:18.:05:20.

debate them here in this place I absolutely understand

:05:21.:05:24.

my right honourable Friend's point about Parliament's

:05:25.:05:39.

desire to be able to debate the objectives that I set out very

:05:40.:05:42.

clearly in my plan yesterday. One of the objectives

:05:43.:05:45.

and principles I set It continues to be the Government's

:05:46.:05:48.

intention that we will provide clarity whenever it is possible,

:05:49.:05:55.

and we will ensure that, at appropriate times,

:05:56.:05:58.

both the public and Parliament are kept informed and are able

:05:59.:06:00.

properly to consider Member for Broxtowe,

:06:01.:06:03.

the Prime Minister talked about her desire to give clarity

:06:04.:06:12.

around our exit from the EU. Many of my constituents are European

:06:13.:06:14.

citizens who are paying tax What assurance can she give

:06:15.:06:17.

them about their future, particularly if they change employer

:06:18.:06:22.

or are freelancers? One of the objectives I set out

:06:23.:06:27.

in my speech yesterday was something I have said before

:06:28.:06:31.

about the guaranteeing of rights for EU citizens

:06:32.:06:33.

living here in the UK, but I also want to see the rights

:06:34.:06:37.

of UK citizens living in the I remain open, and I encourage

:06:38.:06:42.

others across Europe to agree with me that this is an issue

:06:43.:06:47.

we should look at as early as possible in order to give people

:06:48.:06:50.

the confidence and reassurance that the honourable

:06:51.:06:53.

Lady is looking for. How can abandoning membership

:06:54.:06:59.

of a customs union that takes 68% of Wales's exports,

:07:00.:07:05.

including, crucially, 90% of our food and drink exports -

:07:06.:07:08.

and that supports 200,000 jobs What we will be doing

:07:09.:07:12.

is negotiating a free trade agreement with the European Union

:07:13.:07:20.

to get the best possible access for trade with the EU,

:07:21.:07:23.

but we also want to be able to negotiate trade agreements with

:07:24.:07:28.

other countries around the world. A number of countries have

:07:29.:07:33.

already expressed interest We want to do that to open up

:07:34.:07:35.

new export markets being delivered for businesses

:07:36.:07:39.

here in the United Kingdom, including the sort of trade

:07:40.:07:41.

in Wales that the honourable On the question of customs

:07:42.:07:43.

with the European Union, we want an arrangement that

:07:44.:07:47.

will involve the most The arguments on Brexit continued

:07:48.:07:49.

on the committee corridor, where there were calls

:07:50.:07:53.

for the Government to immediately guarantee the rights of EU

:07:54.:07:55.

citizens to stay in the UK. During the latest session

:07:56.:08:01.

of the Exiting the European Union committee that demand was made by EU

:08:02.:08:03.

nationals living here and by British We do not want to be

:08:04.:08:06.

these bargaining chips in the renegotiations and we

:08:07.:08:10.

feel we have been taken hostage. That is a very strong

:08:11.:08:14.

feeling people really feel in the communities

:08:15.:08:16.

that we are This is a political issue but not

:08:17.:08:18.

granting our rights... The Prime Minister

:08:19.:08:28.

has said she wants to achieve this soon,

:08:29.:08:36.

but in She tried to get agreement to

:08:37.:08:40.

discuss this last council meeting, a lot of European countries wanted

:08:41.:08:47.

to but Germany and others refused. Are you putting any pressure,

:08:48.:08:51.

or you tell me what pressure you are putting on your home governments

:08:52.:08:54.

to ensure they put pressure on the rest of the EU to

:08:55.:08:59.

settle Our position is we want the British

:09:00.:09:01.

Government to make the first move because the UK

:09:02.:09:08.

is leaving the EU, not the other way round,

:09:09.:09:14.

and that decision can only come

:09:15.:09:16.

from the British Government because in the EU the national

:09:17.:09:20.

governments have been told by the Commission

:09:21.:09:25.

they cannot open any talks or negotiation before

:09:26.:09:28.

Article 50 is triggered, Kafkaesque situation, as a result,

:09:29.:09:30.

because no one wants No-one in the EU can make any move

:09:31.:09:34.

because Article 50 You do not look up the Polish

:09:35.:09:41.

or Romanian or other governments at I would say we are focused on the

:09:42.:09:46.

British Government because we really believe they are the party that can

:09:47.:09:52.

make the first move. We live in the UK, our Government

:09:53.:09:55.

is the British Government. We want something to

:09:56.:10:08.

be done immediately, in line with the Prime Minister's

:10:09.:10:09.

speech yesterday. I think there should be

:10:10.:10:11.

a resolution on the day I think there should be a resolution

:10:12.:10:14.

in place by both houses of parliament calling on the other

:10:15.:10:20.

member states to make Of course, this can be prepared

:10:21.:10:22.

by diplomatic channels There is time between now

:10:23.:10:25.

and the end of March Do you agree with the Prime Minister

:10:26.:10:28.

that she should await for agreement from the other EU

:10:29.:10:33.

countries to protect British citizens living abroad before giving

:10:34.:10:36.

the rights to EU citizens here? It is the UK triggering

:10:37.:10:39.

this process, it is Therefore it would be a magnanimous

:10:40.:10:41.

gesture on the part of the Prime Minister and a good way

:10:42.:10:48.

of opening negotiations. you are negotiating you should try

:10:49.:10:52.

and offer benefits I think it would be an extreme

:10:53.:10:57.

magnanimous gesture by saying, look, nationals in the UK,

:10:58.:11:01.

we call upon you to do the same. These people cannot wait for it to

:11:02.:11:23.

be happy is to get a resolution. I would prefer she acted unilaterally

:11:24.:11:27.

now and that would encourage other countries to reciprocate, it would

:11:28.:11:32.

improve relationships at the start of the negotiations and I cannot see

:11:33.:11:38.

any reason why the 27 countries would not reciprocate.

:11:39.:11:42.

You have a huge displacement crisis in terms of 1 million people, the

:11:43.:11:48.

population of Birmingham, who are we can assume and I imagine are working

:11:49.:11:53.

in the shape form and our people that may have to look at returning

:11:54.:11:58.

to the UK or other arrangements, that does not include the May be

:11:59.:12:03.

married to foreign spouses, like myself. If that happened to me, how

:12:04.:12:08.

would my Italian wife and my son get the chance to stay in the UK? We're

:12:09.:12:12.

talking about splitting families as well.

:12:13.:12:14.

A foreign office minister has told MPs that Boris Johnson will raise

:12:15.:12:17.

concerns about allegations of human rights abuses in Myanmar

:12:18.:12:19.

when he meets the country's leader Aung San Suu Kyi shortly.

:12:20.:12:21.

Thousands of Rohingya muslims are said to have fled

:12:22.:12:23.

to neighbouring Bangladesh amid allegations that the Burmese

:12:24.:12:25.

army has carried out human rights abuses.

:12:26.:12:28.

Troops took control of the region after armed men raided police posts,

:12:29.:12:33.

The Minister Alok Sharma came to the Commons to answer an urgent

:12:34.:12:39.

While we condemn the attack and recognise the right of security

:12:40.:12:42.

forces to carry out security operations to root out

:12:43.:12:45.

the perpetrators, we remain deeply concerned by the conduct of the army

:12:46.:12:48.

Although restrictions on media, diplomatic and humanitarian access

:12:49.:12:54.

make the facts difficult to ascertain, we have been worried

:12:55.:12:57.

by numerous reports alleging widespread human rights violations

:12:58.:13:01.

As I said, we continue to monitor the situation closely.

:13:02.:13:08.

The Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs

:13:09.:13:11.

will visit Burma soon and will reiterate our

:13:12.:13:12.

It is very difficult to get accurate information for what is happening

:13:13.:13:19.

in the current states or in order to get to the truth beyond false

:13:20.:13:22.

reports, will he call for access for independent observers

:13:23.:13:26.

and journalists to visit displacement camps in this state?

:13:27.:13:33.

The asked about UK support for an international commission,

:13:34.:13:36.

I assume a UN type commission, and I just say that a UN-led

:13:37.:13:41.

commission and enquiry can be established in one of three ways,

:13:42.:13:44.

either by the UN Secretary-General, by the UN Security Council

:13:45.:13:47.

Establishing and enquiry in this way would acquire broad international

:13:48.:13:51.

support which we assess does not exist in the current

:13:52.:13:53.

The Minister rather sidestepped the question of action in the UN

:13:54.:14:01.

by saying that the government's opinion was that there

:14:02.:14:05.

was not a sufficient consensus at the present time

:14:06.:14:08.

Will the government commits to try and build that consensus

:14:09.:14:14.

as opposed to merely remarking that it doesn't exist?

:14:15.:14:19.

Will the Minister made very clear to the Burmese authorities

:14:20.:14:21.

that the welcome re-entry into the international community

:14:22.:14:25.

will not be helped if they fail to protect minorities

:14:26.:14:28.

and particularly this second community?

:14:29.:14:32.

A conservative returned to the plight of the Rohinga.

:14:33.:14:35.

Hundreds are being attacked, many are being murdered.

:14:36.:14:37.

The villages are being systematically burned or destroyed,

:14:38.:14:41.

many are being sold into slavery with the complicity

:14:42.:14:43.

The very authorities that treat the Rohinga.

:14:44.:14:50.

My honourable friend the Minister has avoided the challenge

:14:51.:14:55.

from the right honourable member from Gordon and my honourable friend

:14:56.:14:58.

It is not sufficient for the government to cooperate,

:14:59.:15:04.

the government needs to lead UN support if these reports are true.

:15:05.:15:08.

Since the Burmese security forces started the campaign in October it

:15:09.:15:12.

has been estimated that around 65,000 Rohinga.

:15:13.:15:15.

According to reports, the minority group have

:15:16.:15:22.

been subject to arson, rape and murder at the

:15:23.:15:24.

Such allegations are incredibly serious and it is for that reason

:15:25.:15:30.

I ask the Minister for the fourth time I believe if he will continue

:15:31.:15:34.

to call for the establishment of an independent investigation

:15:35.:15:37.

I hope Mr Speaker that I have made clear today that there are a huge

:15:38.:15:46.

number of avenues that we in the UK are pursuing in terms of getting

:15:47.:15:49.

humanitarian aid and making the case for minorities and actually making

:15:50.:15:53.

very clear that we care very deeply about these matters and at the end

:15:54.:15:57.

of the day that is something we will keep doing.

:15:58.:16:00.

Going back to the point about the approach from a UN

:16:01.:16:04.

perspective, as I have said, there are a number of areas

:16:05.:16:07.

in which the UN is already engaged and will continue to work with us

:16:08.:16:12.

to make the case that we must make sure there is resolution

:16:13.:16:15.

You are watching Wednesday in Parliament.

:16:16.:16:28.

Around 8 million tonnes of food, post-manufacture, as it is called,

:16:29.:16:30.

The environment, food and rule affairs

:16:31.:16:34.

committee is carrying out an enquiry into food waste in England and has

:16:35.:16:37.

been healing from a panel of supermarket chain representatives.

:16:38.:16:39.

One of the issues that get a lot of attention is what to do with

:16:40.:16:48.

misshapen fruit and veg that does not make the grade.

:16:49.:16:51.

Tesco has told the MPs about its Perfectly

:16:52.:16:53.

What we typically have done, and I know others have

:16:54.:16:58.

done the same, is we have widened our specifications to the point

:16:59.:17:01.

where that is still perfectly edible food and it can be sold either at

:17:02.:17:04.

discount, it takes account of the whole crop

:17:05.:17:09.

flash of a specific product we can then

:17:10.:17:14.

move extra product that would

:17:15.:17:15.

not make our specifications normally into this perfectly imperfect world

:17:16.:17:18.

and pretty much every customer who has ever bought one of those has

:17:19.:17:23.

come back and bought another on the basis

:17:24.:17:25.

that it works as a concept. Where the product is still outside

:17:26.:17:31.

the specifications then again, you will hear a slightly different

:17:32.:17:36.

story from Morrisons because of the

:17:37.:17:37.

vertical integration but in our world what we do is we facilitate

:17:38.:17:40.

for example potatoes that are too big or too small or into making our

:17:41.:17:43.

recipe dishes, so potato products made by one

:17:44.:17:45.

of her manufacturers are

:17:46.:17:47.

supplied with potatoes that we could not possibly

:17:48.:17:53.

sell within the stores because they would either be

:17:54.:17:55.

enormous and very tiny and they are utilised,

:17:56.:17:57.

165 tonnes or so loss but

:17:58.:17:58.

We take the manufacturing approach so anything that is the

:17:59.:18:06.

wrong shape or we could not sell goes into juices, smoothies, soups

:18:07.:18:09.

So we try to do the same thing but I guess in a slightly

:18:10.:18:19.

different way because we do not sell it in store messages in her basics

:18:20.:18:23.

Morrisons and said it sold 25,000 tonnes of wonky vegs last

:18:24.:18:29.

As of this year there will be 13 different types of fruit and

:18:30.:18:35.

vegetable that we sell which is out of normal spec, why we are selling

:18:36.:18:38.

more is because customers are more interested in the whole agenda and

:18:39.:18:41.

want to buy more of it so they can buy it at a lower price or any

:18:42.:18:45.

bigger back, but particularly because we have taken the extra step

:18:46.:18:48.

to market it it has driven that kind of interest in the customers and if

:18:49.:18:52.

you will pardon the pun, it is feeding the interest.

:18:53.:18:54.

But, said a Conservative committee member,...

:18:55.:19:04.

I wonder why you call these vegetables

:19:05.:19:06.

wonky or misshapen or less than perfect.

:19:07.:19:10.

They are perfect, they are just a different shape.

:19:11.:19:12.

And I think you are contributing, or I wonder if

:19:13.:19:15.

you are contributing by referring to them as some kind of weird

:19:16.:19:17.

Wouldn't it be better simply to sell them as they are?

:19:18.:19:22.

I think it helps customers to work out what the

:19:23.:19:29.

buying in store sold by designating them

:19:30.:19:30.

in a particular way it is

:19:31.:19:32.

So if you were to buy onions from our wonky range they might be

:19:33.:19:38.

more dirty, they may have more dirt on them and the sizes may be

:19:39.:19:41.

different, and if the customer is not aware that they are buying

:19:42.:19:44.

something slightly different to what they might ordinarily by typically

:19:45.:19:46.

they will come back and say is this the same product?

:19:47.:19:51.

And start to question what we are selling them.

:19:52.:19:54.

One of the things we are trying to do is to be clear about what it is

:19:55.:19:58.

customers are buying and provide choice.

:19:59.:20:01.

What we're trying to do particularly with the way the

:20:02.:20:04.

packaging is designed and in the way that we talk about it is to talk

:20:05.:20:07.

I don't think it is about saying that

:20:08.:20:14.

there is something we don't like or in fact

:20:15.:20:16.

it may not be perfect, but I

:20:17.:20:20.

don't think anybody around the table is sick guessing are trying to

:20:21.:20:23.

suggest in the way that the market these

:20:24.:20:25.

at the fruit and veg is

:20:26.:20:27.

anything other than perfectly good to eat.

:20:28.:20:29.

If you have that range, and most of us have a range which is

:20:30.:20:32.

usually three tiers or two tiers, if you

:20:33.:20:34.

introduce another part to the

:20:35.:20:37.

range and don't signal to the customers in some way what the

:20:38.:20:40.

purpose of that is, they find it pretty

:20:41.:20:41.

unhelpful and confusing, so

:20:42.:20:42.

we are adding to the choice, not just making it wider.

:20:43.:20:45.

The marketeers have kind of found this way and

:20:46.:20:47.

indifferent supermarket you will see different responses, it is the same.

:20:48.:20:51.

We let people reach their own conclusions.

:20:52.:20:56.

Millions of us have one and millions of us hate ours, I am

:20:57.:21:02.

The photo booth shockers are the embarrassment of many a seasoned

:21:03.:21:08.

traveller but couldn't be possible for people

:21:09.:21:10.

to their own picture, the

:21:11.:21:16.

so-called selfie, and send that in instead?

:21:17.:21:18.

As I understand it, the government is seeking to arrange

:21:19.:21:22.

that any of us can send essentially a selfie to the passport order

:21:23.:21:25.

The passport is the gold standard as far

:21:26.:21:34.

as identity assurance in this country is concerned.

:21:35.:21:36.

Why is the opportunity not been taken to

:21:37.:21:37.

prevent a situation in which people can afford to shop images to make

:21:38.:21:41.

sure there is proper certification of when an image has been taken,

:21:42.:21:44.

that it was duly carried out in the proper way

:21:45.:21:46.

secure and reliable basis on which we can prove your identity?

:21:47.:21:55.

The noble Lord is absolutely right, security standards are absolutely

:21:56.:21:58.

paramount whether it is under the old system, shall we call it,

:21:59.:22:01.

or indeed the new digital system and under

:22:02.:22:05.

both systems the security standards are exactly the same, let me

:22:06.:22:08.

Just by examples, both the USA and New

:22:09.:22:18.

Zealand allow people to take their own photographs.

:22:19.:22:25.

In terms of a selfie, a photograph that is

:22:26.:22:29.

identified as a selfie that does not meet those security standards

:22:30.:22:32.

and requirements are objected in the examinations process,

:22:33.:22:34.

but that gold standard as the noble Lord is right

:22:35.:22:36.

to point out is absolutely paramount as the robustness and confidence in

:22:37.:22:39.

this very important document going forward.

:22:40.:22:49.

Under the old system as it is called,

:22:50.:22:51.

someone has to certify on

:22:52.:22:53.

the back of the photograph that it is a true likeness of the passport

:22:54.:22:56.

holder, how is that going to be achieved if it is a completely

:22:57.:22:59.

My Lords, the current service that has

:23:00.:23:05.

been in place since April of last year actually is only available at

:23:06.:23:10.

this point in time to adults over the age of 26 who have previously

:23:11.:23:15.

held British passports, there is the rigour in the new process.

:23:16.:23:23.

What is the difference between a dodgy

:23:24.:23:25.

A dodgy selfie my Lords is one that does not meet the rigorous

:23:26.:23:36.

Finally, the Labour MP Tristram Hunt has made his last parliamentary

:23:37.:23:45.

As to Hunt, a historian, is leading the director of London's

:23:46.:23:50.

This decision will mean there will be a

:23:51.:23:53.

by-election in the Stoke-on-Trent Central constituency.

:23:54.:23:58.

Tristram Hunt said goodbye during the afternoon's

:23:59.:24:00.

debate on Brexit and its applications for security, one for

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It has been a profound privilege to represent

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Stoke-on-Trent Central in

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this chamber for six and a half years and I would like to place my

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thanks to the Speaker, the clerks of the house,

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the doorkeepers, staff, perhaps above all the library staff

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who I feel now face quite a drop in demand.

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It perhaps it seems particularly perverse to leave the

:24:23.:24:25.

house now and let me apologise to the political parties and people

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by-election upon them but it seems perverse to leave just as this place

:24:29.:24:36.

is about to enjoy the largest return of powers since the act of restraint

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In case you are wondering, an act of Parliament way

:24:40.:24:45.

It transfers powers from the Catholic Church to Henry

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Mr Hunt turned to what the impact of Brexit might be.

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And as power and sovereignty is returned to

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the UK Parliament I think the question we are debating today and

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you will be into the future is whether we see a Britannia

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unchanged, forging a new use of free trade, cultural exchange and

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innovation or whether the world today is my right honourable friend

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from Leeds Central suggested is so interconnected

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in terms of economy, security of political power that we

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have in leaving the EU expose ourselves to international headwinds

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that will batter rather than benefit us.

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And at this stage we have no answer to that.

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The outgoing Labour MP Tristram Hunt.

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And that is it from me for now but to join me again

:25:26.:25:36.

at the same time tomorrow for another

:25:37.:25:39.

round-up of the best of the

:25:40.:25:41.

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