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A century ago, the nation was two years into the First World War | 0:00:02 | 0:00:06 | |
but not everyone followed the call to fight. | 0:00:06 | 0:00:10 | |
This week, I'll be hearing from those compelled by their faith | 0:00:10 | 0:00:13 | |
to risk reputation and face ridicule as conscientious objectors. | 0:00:13 | 0:00:18 | |
Also, daring to be different - the college chaplain spreading | 0:00:18 | 0:00:21 | |
the word with Christian tattoos. | 0:00:21 | 0:00:24 | |
A good by-product of being tattooed is that it creates a conversation. | 0:00:24 | 0:00:29 | |
And I'm turning detective, discovering words from | 0:00:29 | 0:00:31 | |
the King James Bible found in famous reggae songs. | 0:00:31 | 0:00:35 | |
I'm in the city of York, | 0:00:44 | 0:00:45 | |
not at the Minster but at the former Rowntree chocolate factory | 0:00:45 | 0:00:50 | |
which, for generations, had faith right at its heart because of | 0:00:50 | 0:00:54 | |
the Quaker beliefs of its founder. | 0:00:54 | 0:00:57 | |
And right at the heart of the Christian faith is Christ himself, | 0:00:57 | 0:01:01 | |
and that's the focus of our first song today. | 0:01:01 | 0:01:03 | |
In two world wars, | 0:03:51 | 0:03:52 | |
Quakers faced an ethical dilemma - whether to follow the call to fight, | 0:03:52 | 0:03:57 | |
knowing that that might mean that they would kill for their country, | 0:03:57 | 0:04:00 | |
or to make the controversial decision | 0:04:00 | 0:04:02 | |
to be conscientious objectors. | 0:04:02 | 0:04:04 | |
That decision was passionately supported here at | 0:04:05 | 0:04:08 | |
the Rowntree factory in York, | 0:04:08 | 0:04:10 | |
famous for its chocolate but driven by Quaker beliefs. | 0:04:10 | 0:04:14 | |
Local MP Arnold Rowntree fought for changes to the Military Service Act, | 0:04:15 | 0:04:20 | |
giving Quakers the chance to serve their country without fighting. | 0:04:20 | 0:04:25 | |
Significant parts of the factory were given over to help | 0:04:26 | 0:04:29 | |
the war effort. | 0:04:29 | 0:04:31 | |
In fact, this building, that used to be the Rowntree staff canteen, | 0:04:31 | 0:04:35 | |
was turned into a hospital to treat the wounded. | 0:04:35 | 0:04:38 | |
Chris Lawson's grandfather worked for Arnold Rowntree, | 0:04:40 | 0:04:43 | |
and Chris is also a Quaker and a pacifist. | 0:04:43 | 0:04:47 | |
A good many Quakers would take the attitude that, | 0:04:47 | 0:04:49 | |
if they were going to be followers of Christ, you cannot resort | 0:04:49 | 0:04:54 | |
to the use of force and, particularly, fighting wars. | 0:04:54 | 0:04:58 | |
And that is a witness that Quakers have held from the middle of | 0:04:58 | 0:05:01 | |
the 17th century. | 0:05:01 | 0:05:03 | |
But that would have led to accusations of cowardice and | 0:05:03 | 0:05:07 | |
-much more, I imagine. -Yes. | 0:05:07 | 0:05:09 | |
There was immense social disapproval but, | 0:05:09 | 0:05:13 | |
at the beginning of the war, Arnold Rowntree was one of those who helped | 0:05:13 | 0:05:17 | |
to set up a service unit for young Quakers called | 0:05:17 | 0:05:21 | |
the Friends' Ambulance Unit and, in time, my father, | 0:05:21 | 0:05:25 | |
my uncle and I myself all became members of the FAU. | 0:05:25 | 0:05:29 | |
It, early on, sent out a team to France and they found | 0:05:31 | 0:05:34 | |
the first need was to help with soldiers being evacuated from | 0:05:34 | 0:05:39 | |
the front who were just lying in sheds. | 0:05:39 | 0:05:41 | |
And there were FAU people who were helping on ambulance trains. | 0:05:41 | 0:05:46 | |
My father was one of those. | 0:05:46 | 0:05:47 | |
-You are still a Quaker. -Yes. | 0:05:49 | 0:05:51 | |
If war was declared tomorrow and you were called up, | 0:05:51 | 0:05:53 | |
what would be your reaction? | 0:05:53 | 0:05:55 | |
I shall want to be a conscientious objector again. | 0:05:55 | 0:05:59 | |
Christ's form of service was a non-violent approach to | 0:05:59 | 0:06:03 | |
other people. | 0:06:03 | 0:06:04 | |
The University of York is home to some rare Rowntree archives, | 0:06:05 | 0:06:10 | |
and Chris has come to see it for the very first time. | 0:06:10 | 0:06:13 | |
-Hello, Alex. -Hello. Hello. -What have we got here? | 0:06:13 | 0:06:16 | |
Well, here we have some wonderful records relating to the work | 0:06:16 | 0:06:19 | |
of Arnold Rowntree. | 0:06:19 | 0:06:21 | |
Ah, this is so interesting to see Arnold Rowntree's name there and | 0:06:21 | 0:06:24 | |
the names of various other Quakers, some of whom I've actually met. | 0:06:24 | 0:06:27 | |
So here, we can see the Friends' Service Committee in 1915. | 0:06:27 | 0:06:31 | |
They say, "We see the sacrifices men around us have made, | 0:06:31 | 0:06:35 | |
"and are daily making, and we are conscious that many of us, | 0:06:35 | 0:06:38 | |
"for whom loyalty to Christ forbids military service, | 0:06:38 | 0:06:41 | |
"are giving far less to our country than those who have enlisted." | 0:06:41 | 0:06:44 | |
So they do want to serve but they don't want to bear arms. | 0:06:44 | 0:06:48 | |
And some of them feel that they really can do good and they're willing to die for their country, | 0:06:48 | 0:06:52 | |
they're just not willing to kill others. | 0:06:52 | 0:06:54 | |
That's very much the central feeling of the Quakers - loyalty to | 0:06:54 | 0:06:58 | |
Christ forbids military service. It's a religious conviction. | 0:06:58 | 0:07:02 | |
It's not a political one or a pragmatic one. | 0:07:02 | 0:07:04 | |
It's based on a deep spiritual conviction. | 0:07:04 | 0:07:06 | |
That hymn is a prayer for fresh inspiration to follow the call | 0:09:13 | 0:09:18 | |
of God and, later, | 0:09:18 | 0:09:19 | |
we'll be hearing from a 92-year-old Quaker who's done just that. | 0:09:19 | 0:09:25 | |
For some, a Christian calling means doing things differently, | 0:09:25 | 0:09:28 | |
and what could be more different than a chaplain covered in tattoos? | 0:09:28 | 0:09:32 | |
32-year-old Rob Popejoy has been the chaplain for four years and | 0:09:33 | 0:09:38 | |
enjoys challenging the stereotypes of what a Christian can be. | 0:09:38 | 0:09:42 | |
At first glance, | 0:09:43 | 0:09:44 | |
you wouldn't think Rob's faith influences the way | 0:09:44 | 0:09:46 | |
he looks at all but he uses his appearance, through the medium | 0:09:46 | 0:09:50 | |
of tattoos, to express his beliefs and tell the story of his faith. | 0:09:50 | 0:09:55 | |
My faith, and also my wife and child, | 0:09:57 | 0:10:01 | |
is the most important thing to me. | 0:10:01 | 0:10:03 | |
It's the meaning of most of my tattoos. | 0:10:05 | 0:10:07 | |
It's the biggest part of my life. | 0:10:07 | 0:10:10 | |
I've been getting tattooed for ten years and it's become | 0:10:10 | 0:10:13 | |
the story of my life, really. | 0:10:13 | 0:10:14 | |
It's kind of how I document the stuff that's gone on, | 0:10:14 | 0:10:18 | |
the questions I've asked of myself, the various life events. | 0:10:18 | 0:10:22 | |
Like a diary or a journal, I'm just going to put it on my skin. | 0:10:22 | 0:10:26 | |
I've got two Bible verses tattooed on my body. | 0:10:28 | 0:10:32 | |
The first one is EZ 37 on my fingers, and that means | 0:10:32 | 0:10:37 | |
the Book of Ezekiel, chapter 37. | 0:10:37 | 0:10:40 | |
And that is a story from the Bible where the prophet sees | 0:10:40 | 0:10:45 | |
a valley of dry bones. | 0:10:45 | 0:10:46 | |
God says, "I'll breathe life into those dry bones," | 0:10:47 | 0:10:51 | |
and then the prophet sees them waken. | 0:10:51 | 0:10:54 | |
And that's really poignant for me. | 0:10:54 | 0:10:57 | |
And that's because, between the ages of 15 and 18, Rob lost his faith. | 0:10:57 | 0:11:02 | |
And so, I found myself becoming more and more inward, more angry, | 0:11:02 | 0:11:07 | |
more aggressive, and that sorrow grew and grew and grew to | 0:11:07 | 0:11:12 | |
the point where I was questioning, is life worth it? | 0:11:12 | 0:11:15 | |
It was a really dark period of my life. | 0:11:15 | 0:11:19 | |
Rob turned his life around and rediscovered his faith, | 0:11:19 | 0:11:22 | |
which inspired his vocation - guiding students at Bath College. | 0:11:22 | 0:11:27 | |
My name's Rob Popejoy. I'm the chaplain here at the college. | 0:11:27 | 0:11:31 | |
Do you guys know what a chaplain is? | 0:11:31 | 0:11:33 | |
I am trying to make Christianity cool and I'm quite happy to say that. | 0:11:33 | 0:11:36 | |
I'm cool with controversy, obviously. | 0:11:36 | 0:11:38 | |
By being approachable, hopefully, people can see that there is | 0:11:38 | 0:11:43 | |
something slightly different, perhaps. | 0:11:43 | 0:11:45 | |
He's quite a cool person, isn't he? He's, like, full of surprises. | 0:11:45 | 0:11:49 | |
HE LAUGHS | 0:11:49 | 0:11:50 | |
I think he's kind of a breath of fresh air. | 0:11:50 | 0:11:52 | |
He's young and kind of knows what the young people think. | 0:11:52 | 0:11:58 | |
Obviously, he's different from what you consider a normal chaplain. | 0:11:58 | 0:12:02 | |
I'm a Star Wars fan, in case you hadn't worked out. | 0:12:02 | 0:12:04 | |
-Anyone a Star Wars fan in the room? -Yeah. | 0:12:04 | 0:12:07 | |
He's quite unique cos, from my perspective, | 0:12:07 | 0:12:10 | |
you never really see a Christian just covered in tattoos. | 0:12:10 | 0:12:13 | |
It's not what you see. | 0:12:13 | 0:12:15 | |
Whilst tattoos can alienate people, the positives I've found, | 0:12:15 | 0:12:19 | |
you know, a good by-product of having them is people want to | 0:12:19 | 0:12:22 | |
talk to you, people want to find out the meanings. | 0:12:22 | 0:12:25 | |
You attract people as a result of having them. | 0:12:25 | 0:12:27 | |
It creates a conversation. | 0:12:27 | 0:12:29 | |
What are those on your fingers? What do they mean? | 0:12:29 | 0:12:32 | |
Personally, for me, I mean, I don't believe in any religion but | 0:12:32 | 0:12:36 | |
when he speaks about it and then he really gets into detail of | 0:12:36 | 0:12:39 | |
what's gone on, and then you start to think, well, | 0:12:39 | 0:12:42 | |
that is quite interesting, actually. | 0:12:42 | 0:12:44 | |
I don't have any grades or anything like that or, you know, | 0:12:44 | 0:12:48 | |
qualifications so, literally, | 0:12:48 | 0:12:50 | |
all I have is who I am and what I've done and my experiences. | 0:12:50 | 0:12:54 | |
And if that can be used for good, then great. | 0:12:54 | 0:12:56 | |
Next, David is in Wrexham for a discovery of biblical proportions. | 0:16:06 | 0:16:11 | |
I'm here at St Giles' Church to meet a man who found some extraordinary treasure. | 0:16:13 | 0:16:17 | |
Ah! Great to meet you. | 0:16:17 | 0:16:19 | |
-Really good to see you, David. -Tell me about this Bible. -Come with me. | 0:16:19 | 0:16:23 | |
-So, here we are. -Wow! | 0:16:24 | 0:16:27 | |
Stored away for centuries, forgotten amongst a pile of old books, | 0:16:27 | 0:16:31 | |
unbeknown to everyone, lay something very special. | 0:16:31 | 0:16:34 | |
'When Jason found it during a routine inventory check, | 0:16:36 | 0:16:39 | |
-'it piqued his curiosity.' -So, this is it. -How heavy is that? | 0:16:39 | 0:16:42 | |
-It looks huge. -Yeah, it's quite a weight. | 0:16:42 | 0:16:45 | |
-You have to be a bodybuilder to carry this! -Well, you know... | 0:16:45 | 0:16:49 | |
-Goodness gracious! -It's quite a size, isn't it? | 0:16:52 | 0:16:55 | |
-First edition King James Bible. -Wow! | 0:16:55 | 0:16:58 | |
How did you feel when you discovered this? | 0:16:58 | 0:17:01 | |
Really excited, really excited. | 0:17:01 | 0:17:04 | |
As far as we know, it was bought by the churchwardens brand-new | 0:17:04 | 0:17:07 | |
in 1611, when it first came out. | 0:17:07 | 0:17:10 | |
And it's just been here for the whole of this time. | 0:17:10 | 0:17:14 | |
It's part of the stonework of the place. | 0:17:14 | 0:17:17 | |
This is the first one I've ever seen and it's amazing. | 0:17:17 | 0:17:20 | |
It is rather beautiful, isn't it? | 0:17:20 | 0:17:22 | |
For me, growing up in a Jamaican family, the King James version was | 0:17:23 | 0:17:27 | |
THE Bible, and its words became part of our everyday language and music. | 0:17:27 | 0:17:33 | |
I'm going to need a bit of equipment to help me explain more. | 0:17:34 | 0:17:37 | |
It's here... | 0:17:37 | 0:17:38 | |
..an authentic Jamaican sound system! | 0:17:40 | 0:17:44 | |
# Oh, yeah... # | 0:17:44 | 0:17:45 | |
The King James Bible's importance in the Caribbean goes back to | 0:17:45 | 0:17:48 | |
the time of slavery. | 0:17:48 | 0:17:50 | |
Slave owners and missionaries taught the Scriptures and, | 0:17:50 | 0:17:53 | |
by the time slavery was abolished, most of the Caribbean was Christian. | 0:17:53 | 0:17:57 | |
Every home had a King James Bible and they read it and understood it. | 0:18:00 | 0:18:05 | |
And it was that knowledge and understanding of the Bible | 0:18:05 | 0:18:08 | |
that influenced much of the culture, like this. | 0:18:08 | 0:18:11 | |
A familiar tune made famous by Boney M but it started out... | 0:18:13 | 0:18:16 | |
# By the rivers of Babylon... # | 0:18:16 | 0:18:19 | |
..as a reggae song. | 0:18:19 | 0:18:20 | |
# Where we sat down... # | 0:18:20 | 0:18:22 | |
A direct lift from Psalm 137, verses one through to four. | 0:18:22 | 0:18:27 | |
"By the Rivers of Babylon, there we sat down, yea, we wept, | 0:18:27 | 0:18:31 | |
"when we remembered Zion." | 0:18:31 | 0:18:33 | |
# But the wicked Carried us away in captivity... # | 0:18:33 | 0:18:37 | |
"How the wicked carried us away in captivity, requiring of us a song, | 0:18:37 | 0:18:42 | |
"but how can we sing the Lord's song in a strange land?" | 0:18:42 | 0:18:47 | |
And it's easy to understand how, | 0:18:47 | 0:18:49 | |
to the descendants of Africans who had been captured, transported | 0:18:49 | 0:18:55 | |
and enslaved, these words were a source of inspiration and comfort. | 0:18:55 | 0:18:59 | |
# Sing a song of freedom, sister! # | 0:18:59 | 0:19:03 | |
And we're keeping the reggae theme going with our next performance. | 0:19:03 | 0:19:07 | |
# Light of the world | 0:19:17 | 0:19:19 | |
# You stepped down into darkness | 0:19:19 | 0:19:23 | |
# Opened my eyes, let me see | 0:19:23 | 0:19:27 | |
# Beauty that made this heart adore you | 0:19:29 | 0:19:35 | |
# Hope of a life spent with you | 0:19:35 | 0:19:40 | |
# Here I am to worship | 0:19:40 | 0:19:43 | |
# Here I am to bow down | 0:19:43 | 0:19:46 | |
# Here I am to say that you're my God | 0:19:46 | 0:19:51 | |
# You're altogether lovely | 0:19:52 | 0:19:55 | |
# Altogether worthy | 0:19:55 | 0:19:58 | |
# Altogether wonderful to me | 0:19:58 | 0:20:03 | |
# Oh | 0:20:06 | 0:20:08 | |
# Yeah | 0:20:08 | 0:20:09 | |
# King of all days | 0:20:09 | 0:20:12 | |
# Oh, so highly exalted | 0:20:12 | 0:20:15 | |
# Glorious in heaven above | 0:20:15 | 0:20:20 | |
# Humbly you came to the earth you created | 0:20:21 | 0:20:27 | |
# All for love's sake became poor | 0:20:27 | 0:20:32 | |
# So here I am to worship | 0:20:32 | 0:20:35 | |
# Here I am to bow down | 0:20:35 | 0:20:38 | |
# Here I am to say that you're my God | 0:20:38 | 0:20:44 | |
# You're altogether lovely | 0:20:44 | 0:20:47 | |
# Altogether worthy | 0:20:47 | 0:20:51 | |
# Altogether wonderful to me | 0:20:51 | 0:20:56 | |
# I'll never know how much it cost | 0:20:57 | 0:21:04 | |
# To see my sins upon that cross | 0:21:04 | 0:21:10 | |
# I'll never know how much it cost | 0:21:10 | 0:21:16 | |
# To see my sins upon that cross | 0:21:16 | 0:21:23 | |
# So here I am to worship | 0:21:24 | 0:21:27 | |
# Here I am to bow down | 0:21:27 | 0:21:30 | |
# Here I am to say that you're my God | 0:21:30 | 0:21:36 | |
# You're altogether lovely | 0:21:36 | 0:21:40 | |
# Altogether worthy | 0:21:40 | 0:21:43 | |
# Altogether wonderful to me | 0:21:43 | 0:21:49 | |
# So here I am to worship | 0:21:49 | 0:21:52 | |
# Here I am to bow down | 0:21:52 | 0:21:55 | |
# Here I am to say that you're my God | 0:21:55 | 0:22:01 | |
# You're altogether lovely | 0:22:01 | 0:22:04 | |
# You're altogether worthy | 0:22:04 | 0:22:07 | |
# You're altogether wonderful to me. # | 0:22:07 | 0:22:13 | |
Did you notice the hints in that last song | 0:22:16 | 0:22:19 | |
that the Christmas season is not far away? | 0:22:19 | 0:22:21 | |
Because that's my cue to tell you about Songs Of Praise's | 0:22:21 | 0:22:24 | |
very own Christmas cards. | 0:22:24 | 0:22:26 | |
These are the ten winning designs from our recent competition | 0:22:26 | 0:22:30 | |
and they are now on sale. | 0:22:30 | 0:22:32 | |
Proceeds, of course, to BBC Children In Need, | 0:22:32 | 0:22:34 | |
and you can find out more on our website, which is... | 0:22:34 | 0:22:37 | |
Now, John Bell of the Iona Community has taken as his theme | 0:22:42 | 0:22:46 | |
for this next song, Christ's provocative challenge, | 0:22:46 | 0:22:50 | |
Will You Come And Follow Me? | 0:22:50 | 0:22:51 | |
ORGAN MUSIC | 0:22:51 | 0:22:53 | |
I'm a Quaker. | 0:25:09 | 0:25:10 | |
And Quakers have a history, over 350 years, | 0:25:13 | 0:25:16 | |
of not wanting to be involved in violence. | 0:25:16 | 0:25:20 | |
Peter Rutter is 92 and is a conscientious objector. | 0:25:20 | 0:25:25 | |
I attempt to be a Christian | 0:25:26 | 0:25:29 | |
and follow Jesus. There are the Ten Commandments. | 0:25:29 | 0:25:33 | |
I mean, one of them is, "Thou shalt not kill." | 0:25:33 | 0:25:37 | |
It doesn't say, "Thou shalt not kill if you're not in the army, | 0:25:37 | 0:25:40 | |
"or if you've got somebody you hate," | 0:25:40 | 0:25:42 | |
or something like that. Just, "Thou shalt not kill." | 0:25:42 | 0:25:46 | |
And Jesus didn't believe in violence to the ultimate extent. | 0:25:46 | 0:25:51 | |
Imagine not resisting when people are driving six-inch nails | 0:25:51 | 0:25:55 | |
through your hands to tie you to a cross. | 0:25:55 | 0:25:58 | |
Though Peter refused to fight in the Second World War, | 0:26:01 | 0:26:04 | |
he still chose to serve his country on the front line | 0:26:04 | 0:26:07 | |
and travelled across Europe with the Friends' Ambulance Unit. | 0:26:07 | 0:26:11 | |
We moved people, we took casualties. | 0:26:11 | 0:26:15 | |
When we got to Hamburg when the war was officially over, | 0:26:15 | 0:26:18 | |
I got to a position where we had to try and resuscitate | 0:26:18 | 0:26:24 | |
quite a large bevy of people who'd been in Auschwitz | 0:26:24 | 0:26:30 | |
in the most deplorable conditions and, I mean, it... | 0:26:30 | 0:26:33 | |
Well, I can only say it was a privilege | 0:26:35 | 0:26:38 | |
to be able to do so, but very harrowing. | 0:26:38 | 0:26:42 | |
Another man called Arthur Hinton and I, | 0:26:44 | 0:26:46 | |
I don't know who gave the orders, | 0:26:46 | 0:26:48 | |
but we were really asked to deal on a one-to-one basis | 0:26:48 | 0:26:52 | |
with a couple of sisters called the Shaleron sisters from Romania. | 0:26:52 | 0:26:57 | |
The youngest sister, Jutsi, | 0:26:57 | 0:27:00 | |
well, I've never seen anyone in such a state as she was. | 0:27:00 | 0:27:03 | |
I remember thinking, "I don't think she'll survive." | 0:27:05 | 0:27:08 | |
And I must say, | 0:27:10 | 0:27:12 | |
it was an extraordinary pleasure | 0:27:12 | 0:27:14 | |
to see them coming back to life | 0:27:14 | 0:27:16 | |
over a period of nearly six months | 0:27:16 | 0:27:19 | |
to the point where they could be repatriated to Romania. | 0:27:19 | 0:27:23 | |
What can you say? It's a real privilege. | 0:27:23 | 0:27:25 | |
Yeah. | 0:27:26 | 0:27:28 | |
I believe in searching one's conscience | 0:27:30 | 0:27:34 | |
and if you conscientiously believe that you've got to fight, | 0:27:34 | 0:27:37 | |
well, that's what you've got to do. | 0:27:37 | 0:27:40 | |
I mean, the acts of bravery that one sees left, right and centre | 0:27:40 | 0:27:44 | |
in the battlefield is staggering | 0:27:44 | 0:27:47 | |
and I have the utmost respect for them and also, it's a terrible loss | 0:27:47 | 0:27:51 | |
to lose people like that | 0:27:51 | 0:27:53 | |
and to feel that you've got to lose people like that. | 0:27:53 | 0:27:56 | |
What I'm saying is that the world doesn't have to be like that. | 0:27:56 | 0:28:01 | |
Swimming against the tide isn't easy. | 0:28:01 | 0:28:04 | |
If people were following Christ, | 0:28:04 | 0:28:08 | |
these situations wouldn't arise. | 0:28:08 | 0:28:10 | |
Well, we're almost at the end of this week's programme, | 0:30:33 | 0:30:36 | |
but next week David Grant will be at The Big Sing | 0:30:36 | 0:30:38 | |
at the Royal Albert Hall, introducing Michael Ball, Alfie Boe, | 0:30:38 | 0:30:42 | |
Keith and Kristyn Getty and The Priests, so it's quite a line-up. | 0:30:42 | 0:30:47 | |
But to end this programme, | 0:30:47 | 0:30:49 | |
here's a song that focuses on the ultimate sacrifice of Christ. | 0:30:49 | 0:30:53 |