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Debbie Reynolds, Actress

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treading the boards again. Her life, however, has been touched by scandal

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and Hollywood has changed dramatically in the youth she has

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been involved. Guest today is Debbie Reynolds.

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Debbie Reynolds, welcome to HARDtalk. What are you still so

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driven to carry on? If I was and, if I was not having a wonderful time I

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would be bored to than sitting at home and I would not know what to do

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it myself. I have always been busy and active and home in the States I

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travel 42 weeks a year and that is just constant. I never stopped

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working since I was 16. I am used to it. I get quite nervous if, let's

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say I had a two week vacation then I am nervous. I must keep busy. When

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you started at 16 years old, and could you have imagined you would

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still be doing it at 78 question now, I thought I would of been dead.

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Is why I named the tour alive. When they called me they said, Debbie,

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what should be named tour? I told I did not really know some people say

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Debbie Reynolds, is she still alive? They went with that. OK, we will

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call the tour alive and they added fabulous. And when people see me

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they will see I am. You say you are driven but it is more than that,

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isn't it? You have to do this financially. It has not been an easy

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life for you financially. When I so driven, it is what you want to do.

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Do I have to work, or as force that everybody needs to work. I raised

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five children. They all went to university and they all always had a

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mother who work. They had the cars, colleges, you know. I think all

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parents work. Don't they? Especially as they have a divorce. That is the

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thing. Your third husband left you bankrupt, didn't he? The second one

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with the bankrupt first stop and the third husband, he just left with all

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the money. That must be very difficult because as a Hollywood

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star you had amassed a huge amount of money until your second and third

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marriages. I know, but husband spent a lot of money. I called shop all

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day on what they spend. Do you regret that you trusted your husband

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is so much financially and in the end it just didn't work out that for

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one reason or another in the case your second husband he gambled a

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lot, didn't he? In the second husband, the hotel complex it didn't

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work out? As a woman, I must answer you honestly. When you fall in love

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you do not really ask the man in love with me? You think that he is.

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Otherwise you would not get married. You just really do believe. I am

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rather Victorian and I think of a man says he loves me and he wants to

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marry me and be with me for the rest of alive, you must believe him walk

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you wouldn't marry him. I'm not a complete fool until after the fact.

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Then I was. Yes, I have been married three times. Twice, to settle and

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went bankrupt and the third one went bankrupt but he didn't get

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everything. He took all the money and ran but he did not get anything.

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In a great resilience, you know? They do not tackle me on the way out

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they just leave me fall in like a good punch. Back in 1988 it look

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different. You were quoted as saying two more years than you would have

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enough money to retire. That was prior to the marriage crumbling and

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leaving you penniless again. I always say you can make it back. I

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give myself not really a two-year period, a five-year plan. I always

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say there is a light at end of the tunnel so I can get through because

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if there is a tunnel there is a light. I can make it. I never give

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up. What the bankruptcy mean? How did it affect you? The government

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gets all the money. That is what bankruptcy means to me. It is a big

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setback but you didn't do it, your husband does it. And in California,

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California taxes community property so the government steps in and you

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have to pay it back what your husband I was. Some people wonder

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how this could happen. We always hear the stories about Hollywood

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stars with people to protect their business interests. Someone doing

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everything for them. But clearly there is not? No, there is often

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someone stupid like me. Did you not get advice? I had great lawyers.

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That is holed up in bankruptcy court. Somehow there is a different

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thing with community property. So they win. And you are still working

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as a result. The good fortune I have was to be in show business. In show

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business if people care about you and if you have a good show and you

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work hard your entire life and you have learnt to sing and dance and do

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mimicry and just be good at your craft, people want to come and see

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you. Cast your mind back to early days when you were first discovered

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at the age of 16. What did it feel like to be on the verge of a

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Hollywood career? Who knew? I was 16 and in school. Aged local beauty

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contests for fun. This way he did it? Win a free scarf? A silk scarf.

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I never had a silk scarf. Or a beautiful blouse. Did you want to be

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an actress? No-one in my family was in acting and I wanted to be a gym

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teacher. I wanted to go to college and I could go as I went to a

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scholarship. So I kept my grades up and that is what I wanted to do what

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I hope to be. But a harbour have a local contest in Burbank and I won

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the contest. There was a talent scout there and they took me to

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Warner Brothers and they did a screen test and they asked me why I

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wanted to be in the movies and I said I don't. That must have shocked

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them because every young girl in those days wanted to be an actress.

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Especially in California. I truly had no thought about it. I liked to

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go to the movies but why would you think you would be in the movies? It

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is one thing to go and to see movie stars but why would you think you

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were ever going to be there? If no-one in your family was, if you

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were not exposed to it, I no dream of that. All of a sudden, I guess,

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it was crazy but I fit into show business. You have to be able crazy

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to be in show business. I have decided that. You came from a poor

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background. My family were poor. We have enough food on the table but my

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father did not make enough money. He worked for the railroad and there

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was very little to go around. We didn't have furniture. We have a

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little home my father built and I can't say that we knew we were poor

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because everybody else was poor. So there was no-one to guide you to

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say, do you feel terrible? We did not feel that we were different to

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anybody else because everybody was poor. You have made some fantastic

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films including the one that sticks in everybody's mind, Singin' In The

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Rain with Gene Kelly. A wonderful musical. When you are making it at

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the time did you think was going to be a great film that people would

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remember the decades afterwards? I didn't know that because I was only

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17 and will goal. They put me in the picture and I had never danced and

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then the head of the studio said Gene Kelly, this is Debbie Reynolds.

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Mary Francis was my real name. That said this is Debbie. They changed to

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Debbie. They said she will be your new leading lady. Gene Kelly said it

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really? Do you dance? I said, well, no. And I'm sure he was aghast. And

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there are complicated dance scenes, aren't there? Absolutely. As

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difficult as you could get. How did you tackle it? I could do the basic

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steps. And then... A maxi forward is a dance step. So then Jean knew that

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he had to teach me how to dance. So I did and I worked like a dog. I had

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five different teachers and in six months they prepared me to work and

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I worked really hard because if the taskmaster and a great dancer and

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this was his idea. And then Gene Kelly and Fred Astaire and Stanley

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Donnan, they were the creators. Henri LeConte could dance to drop

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dead. His family were orphaned soakers. It was great. He could run

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up the wall around backwards. They say all the taskmaster and some were

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saying he was tough on you. Not always very nice. Now, he was tough.

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You have the right idea. Did he shout at you? He had a microphone

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and he used to yell at you. Gene Kelly? He would tell me smile, the

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bigger, be louder. He was always coaching. You were his love interest

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in the movie and you fought off quite another actresses who are in

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the friend to get the role originally. People like Leslie Caron

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and Judy Garland and in the end it was the unknown, Debbie Reynolds. It

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was supposed to be an innocent virginal will goal and I was fat and

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I think it was a tough deal for porting to be stuck with me who had

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never danced. It would have been far better for him to have a great

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dancer and I worked so hard that I think in the end when a look at the

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performance of our little girl I think I did a good job. It must have

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been a fantastic time in many ways in the 1950s. You also hanging out

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with Frank and the rat Pack a great mob and there were you with your

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innocent will girl image. How did you fit in with the rat Pack was to

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mark I was not having a wild time when I started. I was just a

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teenager. But then I did my first nightclub act and I did a movie with

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ring Sinatra called a tender trap. He adopted me like a little sister

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and he is the one who advised me to never marry a singer. And you did in

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the end. Your first husband was Eddie Fisher, one of the best-known

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singers of that time. A massive star. 20 gold records. Why should I

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start off right? Why didn't you listen to Frank Sinatra? That

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marriage ended in disaster after Eddie Fisher and run-off with

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Elizabeth Taylor. I had to make these mistakes. I did wrong the

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first time, I did wrong the second time and then the third time. I

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called myself out. Your daughter said that she thought the courtship

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between you and Eddie Fisher was a press release. They were riding the

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wave of being a media couple more than having any real compatibility.

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She said she probably didn't have much in common with Eddie Fisher.

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Probably but I did not know that. I was in love, young love. What did I

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go? I really didn't know anything. I thought it was terrific. He was

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dialling, he was handsome he was a wonderful looking fellow at the

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start and here I was a young star and... Quite a scandal when he ran

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off with one of the world 's best-known actresses, Elizabeth

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Taylor. We went to school together at the MGM lot. We were good

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friends. She is the most beautiful woman in the world. I certainly was

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not. And woman. I certainly was not. You could say we Eddie Fisher wanted

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her but why would Elizabeth Taylor what Eddie Fisher? What did you mean

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by that? She wonders to as well. Of course she found that out right

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afterwards. I told Eddie, I told him that what would happen was that in

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1.5 years he would realise that she was really nothing and she will

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throw you out. That's what happened. She met Richard Burton and he was

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our stop a lot of scrutiny when that story broke. It must have been

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unbearable. At one stage it said it was an bearable when a man walk out

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but the fact that the public took it as an affront of was watching, that

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was unbelievable. It was played out in the public gaze, wasn't it? Isn't

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everything in pub show business question mark everything in the

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public. Terry said that mother is like Ratten Angelina and Jennifer

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Aniston today. You and Eddie and Elisabeth. It was a similar story. I

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always make a joke of it. I said that Elisabeth went down the Nile.

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Eddie Fisher has always challenged your version. She knows I didn't

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leave her for Elisabeth, we were apart long for that. Poor boy. I

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feel so sorry for him he has to make up some story. He was even less

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generous about you. He said that you were the next door but only if you

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lived next door to a self is driven insecure woman. It was good that he

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could read. Have you forgiven? I cared about but yes I have four

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given Eddie I have never really understood a man leaving his

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children. I can understand leaving the woman but he never really came

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back around to be a very good father. So I don't particularly

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admire that. I have wonderful children and I am their parents. So

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if you ask if I have four given him, I say that with a bit of anger

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because I have a son, his only son and he misses having a good father.

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So when Eddie left he really left. Keating Collie would has changed a

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lot? These days, is probably more frenetic. -- do you think Hollywood

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has changed. The world has changed. When I came into films, the studios

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owned the films and Congress took it over and they could no longer

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release the film is so than television entered the scene so that

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the film industry was cut in half, their power. Television took over

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and then movies, the Golden era ended, nobody was under contract,

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they dropped Greta Garbo, all the stars were let go, I was really the

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only one left under contract was up you spent 17 years under contract.

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In those days, they told you write, this week you will be in this film,

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next week that film, it was a controlled life for an actress and

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it's not the way these days. Now it's much harder. You have to raise

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the money, buy the book, it's much harder. Were produced. They were

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finding the movies for you. We were owned, we were under contract. It

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was a wonderful life, though. We went paid very well, though. Today

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they get $20 million per picture. What you think about that? I think

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they should save their money. Some people say that they produced bad

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movies big so they found bad movies. They are not all good today but I

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think they made some very good pictures and some good ones today. I

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think they are very fortunate in the salaries that they make. I wish to

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all of the stars great success and I hope that they give a lot of their

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money to charity because they have a great opportunity to help people

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will stop most of them are doing that. I admire that very much. We

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made $700 a week in the beginning I made 65 dollars a week or stop them

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a $20 million. There is a great deal of difference. Other differences,

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they talk about the Golden age of Hollywood that it was an innocent

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time in some ways. I think that's why your breakup with Eddie Fisher

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was such a scandal that played out that the films were more innocent

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too, when they? Boy meets girl, they fall in love and meet -- live

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happily ever after. Jono Donna Reed, Andy Griffith, corny pictures. There

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is too much violence and pornography, really, I call it

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pornography, today. The innocence is gone. I think a body can look

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beautiful through a veil, it doesn't have to be boom, I don't really want

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to see a man's frontal or a woman. It is not appropriate for children.

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All young people. If it wasn't that type of movie, you could see it but

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I don't beget should be the general public for every film. You think

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Hollywood is dictating the product or the audience? Television has gone

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much too far. Television. I don't think the films necessarily but they

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have but really, television is pushing it because it's so popular

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and there is so much cable today. You have hundreds of programmes.

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Before, we didn't even have television. He had two stations,

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then for stations and now it's... To fill that, if an octopus. To give

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the public what they want is very difficult. It's difficult for all

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the networks, the competitions are real. The paparazzi is only. -- the

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competition is unreal. The paparazzi is unreal. What about your breakup

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with Eddie Fisher, it was back then but what if it was today? You

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watched it with Angelina with Brad, they follow them everywhere. I feel

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sorry for them but I went through that. I had hundreds of press on my

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front lawn and the backyard, the swimming pool. All around. It is

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difficult and it's not something that one likes to have happened. It

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won't happen to me again. I'm just going to be here and the UK and play

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at the Apollo Theatre, I'm just going to have a good time and be

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live on stage and do what I like to do but my life can be easy now

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because I've been in the business of 63 years and I've had 63 wonderful,

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glorious years. I'm very happy with my life, I've been through all of it

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now and I've done all of it and I've had a great life and a great time

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and I'm still having it, that's what I like. You always make very pithy

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comments, you are a very direct person that she made pithy comments

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about why you stopped making films. Maybe it is realism that its artist

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Bill, I don't like making -- taking my clothes offer supportive think

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about Hollywood today? I do think it's glamorous, pretty. I think

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there are ways to make things exciting and and mysterious at the

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same time, that's no need. I'm a religious person, I don't need to go

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that way. I don't believe in that example for the young people. You

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can be a good entertainer and a good actress. If you want to, go ahead

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but it's not something I ever wanted to do and therefore I never did it.

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The clock will never be turned back to the innocent age. I think not. I

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think this is it. We don't have to go... I don't really have a comment

:19:54.:19:57.

about it because we are here and today is today and so we have to

:19:58.:20:01.

face, that we can handle ourselves well. We can handle ourselves with

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class and dignity. We don't have to fall down amongst the masses, so to

:20:07.:20:14.

speak, meaning, if you want to be trashy, you can be trashy. There is

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really no need, it is much more fun to have little dignity in life. You

:20:20.:20:23.

have always been open about the mistakes you made in your love life

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and picking the wrong man. What about the mistakes you made

:20:29.:20:31.

professionally? One time in the late 60s you had a row with NBC over the

:20:32.:20:36.

Debbie Reynolds show because you decided to make a stand over tobacco

:20:37.:20:40.

advertising. What happened then? Everyone could smoke on camera and

:20:41.:20:44.

you could advertise cigarettes. I didn't know Congress would pass a

:20:45.:20:47.

law that you couldn't within six months and I had a new show, the

:20:48.:20:53.

Debbie Reynolds Show and it was out like the Lucille Ball, show. A

:20:54.:20:59.

two-year contract at a lot of money. I was having a great time but then

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the show came out and they were advertising cigarettes. I got very

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upset because I said, I'm not advertising cigarettes. You promised

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me that I wasn't. That was quite a stand to take it that pick --

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particular period. They work at you don't have to advertise it for the

:21:25.:21:28.

young people and I didn't want to do it. I told them I didn't want to

:21:29.:21:32.

have a cigarette sponsor and they said well, that's too bad, that's

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what you have. And I told them it wasn't in my contract and they read

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the contract and that was the truth. Your thinking was ahead of the game.

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Banning in cigarette advertising in many countries didn't happen until

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later. I lost millions for that stand but I'm happy I did it but I

:21:51.:21:58.

think it was foolishly it was foolish for me financially but then

:21:59.:22:02.

my husbands would have then had more money to spend. One thing that has

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always got you through and we have seen it in the past few minutes is

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your sense of humour. How important is it in show business? Life itself

:22:11.:22:18.

is hard, it is not just show business. Rough and tumble in

:22:19.:22:23.

whatever form. It doesn't matter if you sell bicycles or work in the toy

:22:24.:22:29.

store. Life isn't easy. Life is what we can make of it and with a sense

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of humour, a faith in whatever faith, it doesn't matter, as long as

:22:35.:22:38.

we are good to other people and we are kind and we look around our

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lives and we do unto others, I think we will make it through. Debbie

:22:43.:22:47.

Reynolds, thank you so much for appearing on HARDtalk. Good to see

:22:48.:22:52.

you, good to see you, thank you very much.

:22:53.:22:54.

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