Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie - Author HARDtalk

militants. Now on BBC News, it's time for

HARDtalk. Welcome to HARDtalk. How should we make sense of Nigeria's

21st century identity? Newly anointed as Africa's number one

economy, it is an oil`rich emerging power. But it is also beset by

corruption, poor governance and a wave of internal conflict that could

threaten the very unity of the state. HARDtalk speaks to the highly

acclaimed Nigerian novelist Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie. Her

fiction explores her country's troubled past and current

challenges. How does this writer see Nigeria's story unfolding?

Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie, welcome to HARDtalk. Thank you. You have

described what Nigeria is going through today, the security crisis,

is the most violent period in our nation 's existence since the Biafra

war. Do you feel the crisis matches Biafra in terms of its challenge to

Nigeria? No. Why? It is strange to compare what was a civil war with

two clearly armed sides and in some ways clear sides which largely knew

what they were fighting for, whether or not that was a good thing. What

is going on now is more and more force and more... I don't think I

can compare it. I can't draw parallels. Since then, I don't think

that anything else has shaken our sense of security as a people.

Before we get to what is happening today, I want to speak about what

happened with Biafra, which has shaped you're creative life and your

personal life, your family history. We should perhaps start by reminding

people exactly what happened in that period in the war of '67`'70. The

eastern region of Nigeria fought for secession, for independence, wanting

to be a new nation, Biafra, to leave the young Nigeria behind. Your

family was caught up in that. My parents lived through the war. My

grandparents died in the war. As fighters? They died in refugee

camps. They died because there was no medicine in refugee camps. My

father was one of the many academics who supported the secession, and who

fought for the cause in his own way. He worked in a directorate. At the

time, everyone was invested in the war effort. In the beginning,

secession was a cause that crossed classes. Towards the end of the war,

that wasn't the case. Many people were just in the war... The war

hadn't only destroyed lives. I would like to say that the war robbed a

generation of its innocence. I suppose it also raised questions

about the fundamental integrity of this very new state of Nigeria. It

was in some ways a postcolonial construct. I wonder if, as a young

girl learning about it with your family, whether you were encouraged

to feel Nigerian or whether you were Igbo. I think the idea of being

mutually exclusive with a nationalist identity doesn't apply,

at least, not in my life. I don't know how committed your grandparents

and parents were to the idea of an independent Biafra, but many Igbo

wanted no part of Nigeria. That was because of political things that

happened. Ethnicity has been politicised for so long in Nigeria.

The political decisions that have been taken, targeting ethnic groups.

I was both Nigerian and Igbo. Identity is something that shifts,

depending on where you are. And, depending on what you are doing.

There are times when I am more Igbo than anything else and there are

times when I am more Nigerian than anything else, but I have never

thought of either as being mutually exclusive. Chinua Achebe, one of the

great writers of Nigeria said before he died that he was very

disappointed that Nigerians weren't any longer learning enough about the

reasons for the war of 67`70. I think he felt that important lessons

weren't being learnt. Your book, Half of a Yellow Sun, is all about

what happened in tracing a family through what happened. Do you share

his feelings? Yes. It isn't something new. Nigeria as a country

has never really engaged with Biafra. That isn't surprising.

Countries hide parts of their history the they are ashamed of or

that they are uncertain about. There is a lot of unresolved issues from

that period in history. I don't think it is surprising that I didn't

learn much about the nature of Biafra at school. Having grown up

the daughter of people who survived the war, who were deeply wounded by

the war, I didn't know much either. They didn't talk about it. It is

interesting to imagine what your father made of you committing so

much of your time and effort as a young writer to exploring that past.

I wonder what he made of the end product. My father is a lovely man

and I am a daddy's girl. Both my parents didn't talk about that

period because they... It was difficult for them. They didn't talk

about it until I asked questions. I cannot explain intellectually why I

was haunted by that period they have been since I was 13. I would ask

questions endlessly. My father was generous enough to tell me what he

went through. Many of the stories he told me formed the basis of the

novel, Half of a Yellow Sun. I remember when it was finished, I was

worried about what he might think. I was at home with them and I left the

manuscript on his study table and the next day I left and went to

Lagos. And ran away? Yes. I asked my brother to check on my dad and see

what his expression was like when he was reading it. My father approved.

He said that he was taken by how I had used the details that he had

provided. The movie version of Half of a Yellow Sun, which is out in the

UK and many Western countries, hasn't been certified, given a

certificate for release in Nigeria. Is that because again Nigerian 's

and the authorities don't want to be confronted with the divisions, the

fragmentation that lies within the country? Our leadership is very much

aware of the fragmentations in Nigeria. They don't need a film to

remind them of that. Why? I don't know. Everybody is on edge in

Nigeria at the moment. Really, because of Boko Haram. It isn't

surprising that, because we are on edge, people overreact. The film is

about Biafra, based on a turbulent part of our history. Certain people

in certain positions get frightened and think that maybe we should let

people see this. ``shouldn't. It is a shame. The film isn't very

political. The novel is much more political than the film. It is

really just a beautiful, romantic film. What is sad is that by doing

this, they have politicised it, and now people who watch the film will

be looking for something to be offended by. That was then and

Biafra did so much to shape that early period of Nigerian history.

Today, as you have mentioned, Boko Haram is the biggest challenge to

Nigeria's unity and stability. Would you yourself, as you live at least

part of your life in Nigeria, would you look at Boko Haram and think

that there is something there, which is an expression of alienation,

inequality, of deep socio economic problems in your country? Or, is it

an expression of something else? I don't think the answer is that

simple. I don't think social inequality is the only problem, it

is part of the problem. Poverty cuts across the country. It is not

something that is particular to the north`east. If you look at the

figures, it is striking the degree to which absolute poverty is clearly

highest in the north and north`east. I think we should ask the question,

why? Nigeria is a common federation. We have an interesting revenue

allocation formula, meaning that northern states get more money than

southern states. While we talk about poverty in those areas, it is

important to talk about there being poverty, but perhaps why the

northern government's unnecessarily poor. Then, one needs to ask why.

Part of the narrative, which is something that exists outside of

Nigeria more than it exist inside Nigeria, is that Boko Haram is part

of a socio economic neglect in that part of the country by the country.

When you look at the way Nigeria works and the way that the states

get their money, it is not true at all that the area should be much

poorer. The other way to look at Boko Haram, apart from the socio

economic factors, is to take seriously their specfic message,

which is against modernity, literally meaning, against Western

education. Clearly, with the most high profile, shocking tactics,

abducting schoolgirls, particularly in Chibok, they seem to be

delivering a direct message against the education of females, and

against any progressive, liberal view of gender equality in Nigeria.

Is that at the heart of what they are about? I don't think so. I think

they are delivering a message about Western education. I don't think it

is as gendered. You don't see it as a gendered issue? No. If it was,

they wouldn't have murdered innocent boys. This group has attacked both

boys and girls. The abduction of the girls, there is something cynical

about it. We live in a world where gender matters very much. You make a

bigger point if you abduct girls. And, more cynically, you can use

them as sex slaves. I don't think Boko Haram is necessarily about not

educating girls, I think it is about Western style education being a bad

thing. What of the reaction to the abducting of the girls? We know that

Boko Haram, anyone who follows Nigeria, knows they have been around

a long time, five years, and the violence has been endemic in certain

parts of the country for a long time. Something about the event has

captured the imagination of the world. With the #Bring Back Our

Girls campaign and everything else which began in Nigeria and gained

traction when Michelle Obamagot involved. Do you know what the west

sees in this particular event? I want to know how you see it. I am

not a member of the West, so you might have to ask the West. You have

a unique position because you spend half your time in the US and a lot

of time in Nigeria and in a sense you have a foot in both worlds.

It is a story that fits into certain expectations of what should happen

in a place like Nigeria. It's also a story that is easy to connect to

emotionally without knowing the political context. One of the things

that has happened is because of the emotional weight of the story, it

has been constructed in ways that I find interesting, such as the idea

that it is just like the Taliban. That fits a prefabricated box. It is

not. It is complex in its own way. But at the same time, the attention

that has created, in some ways it was useful. It did make the Nigerian

government sit up a little bit more. I think it made

abductions less as a local political thing, which is what I think they

had seen it as, if that will bring the girls back,

then it's a good thing. You say you do not see it through the prism of

gender, but I want to pursue a bit of a gender discussion with you. You

have made a clear point of saying you are a feminist. You rather

amusingly said, I am a happy African feminist and some African women

assume that cannot be the case. You tell me, how easy is it in today's

Nigeria to be a feminist? I don't know about easy. It is what I am and

I will die as a feminist. The idea that feminism is somehow a Western

import is very troubling to me. It is untrue. But you have said, a

Nigerian academic came up to you and said, that is not our culture. That

is true, because feminism is limited by a single story. There is a

stereotype of feminism. People think it means you do not shave and you

burn bras and that kind of nonsense. I was a child who didn't understand

why boys were supposed to be more important than I was. I didn't read

any books, I just found it silly. I was doing better than the boys, and

somehow a boy had to be the class monitor. I thought it did not make

sense. We should focus on ability. But in general, it is not an easy

thing to talk about gender. I think that is the case everywhere in the

world. It is something I think is important because it is important.

To what extent does it automatically make you a campaigner? Again, an

interesting quote from you, if it is true that the full humanity of women

is not in our culture, then we must make it our culture. It suggests to

me that you have a real commitment now to changing Nigeria. That sounds

very grand. I do not think my ambitions are that... I think I have

a bit of a messiah complex, I have to admit to that. I want to work for

a better world. Justice is one way to do that. Where do you start? Here

is one thing I think is doable. People have used culture as a way.

People have said, it is not our culture, so women have to accept it

as their lot. My position is that culture is constantly changing. If

you had twins 100 years ago where I'm from, twins would be killed.

Culture felt that twins were abnormal. 100 years later, people

would be horrified at the thought of killing twins. That is fascinating.

Let me tell you another question that might be relevant, female

genital mutilation. Across Nigeria, that has been pervasive. Not in my

part. Not in my part. I am not familiar with it. My mother did not,

my grandmother did not. I noticed looking at the figures that across

eastern Nigeria the figures were 50%, women going through that

experience. Here is the question. If that to some Nigerians still

represents tradition and culture, do you feel that there is an absolute

right here for a modern Nigerian woman to say, no, that is just plain

unacceptable and wrong? Of course. Because culture changes. What I

believe very much is the idea that change has to come from within the

culture. There are many women in those societies who object to it and

are working to change it. I do not believe that culture can be used as

a reason for any form of injustice. What is the point of culture? It

should be aboubt preserving the continuity of a people. Today, if we

continue to exclude women from many positions of power and many cultural

institutions of power then at some point we just will not survive. I

said that you live half and half. You said you spend most of your time

in Lagos. The fact that you had a university education in the US, you

have spent a lot of time in the US, and I believe your partner is in the

US, does that make you, when you come back to Nigeria and you have

written a book about Nigerians who go away and come back from the US,

does it make you a harsher critic of your country or a more passionate

defender? That is interesting, both. Where would you put the emphasis? In

both. That is a cheat. No, I refuse. I think both come together. Leaving

home made me realise how much I love Nigeria. How invested I am in

Nigeria. But also how we can do better. I was looking at it from the

outside. The most intelligent, innovative people I know are

Nigerians. Looking at it from the outside, I think, why are we

underperforming? That makes me more likely to complain, which is what I

do when I am at home. It is the complaining that comes from a belief

that we can do so much better. I think we can do so much more. I am

deeply, deeply Nigerian. It is not the only country you have. You do

have ties in the United States now. You have written a lot about America

and talked about how, as an African women going to America, it was odd.

There you were defined by your race in a way that you had never been

defined by it back home. I wonder, having lived in both cultures and

societies, whether you just feel more comfortable in Nigeria than you

ever could in the United States? Absolutely. My sensibility is

Nigerian. I look at the world through Nigerian eyes. I like

America very much, it is not mine. Is that partly because race is a

problem? I do not think so. If I had been born and raised there, maybe I

would consider it mine. Partly, African`Americans sometimes find it

troubling the way in which Africans do not adopt their perspectives.

Many Africans don't get it. There is an assumption that if you are a dark

skinned person, you automatically understand race. That is the way

race functions in America. But that is not true. When I went to the US

to go to college and I had no idea what it meant, really. But to be in

the US and suddenly hear jokes about watermelon and fried chicken and

this was supposed to be offensive, I was utterly confused. It was

disorienting. I get it all now. At the time I did not. We have to end

there. Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie, it has been a pleasure. Thank you.

We should see an improvement in the weather over the next couple of days

before some heavy rain and thunderstorms by Saturday. During

today, there will be rain mingling from northern areas but in some

looking drier in the