22/08/2014 Newsnight

Self funded and generating $40 million a month, why the finances of

ISIS make it such a powerful en After the death of James Foley, the

rights and wrongs of paying a ransom. We talk to a host age negoti

or. The Yazidi Swire who escaped ISIS bullets and the pit he was

buried in but found his entire village had been massacred. And why

would a football manager in this day and age have to say this? I am no

racist. I am no sexist. I'm no home ophobe and no anti-Semitic. Good

evening. ISIS terror tactics are well known. Their strategies brutal

and publicity seeking. What is less understood is how this terrorist

group grew into a working business virtually the size of a small state.

They have a glossy annual report, a business plan, and generate a

revenue of - conservatively - $40 million a month. Their money comes

from oil and also from extortion and kidnap ransom. But what makes the

group so terrifying is how contained they have become, insulated from

sanctions as they are no longer dependent on foreign funds or

governments. Our economics correspondent, Duncan Weldon, looks

at where its money comes from and how the self

at where its money comes from and it such a powerful enemy.

at where its money comes from and State is an unusually well organised

terrorist group. Everything from me till louse record keeping to slickly

produced videos suggest it. Floss better illustration of the their

approach than the annual publication of a report detailing their

activities. Complete with graphics detailing their success on things

like suicide bombings and kidnappings. They are the most well

funded group of their ilk we've ever seen. Like most terror groups

Islamic State first relied on donors. Since 2011 Islamic State's

fighting in the Syrian civil war reportedly received donations from

Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Kuwait. Much of this cash apparent ly flowed

through Kuwait. One of the traditional ways the Governments

seek to combat organisations like IS is through cutting off the flow of

finance, identifying and sanctioning is through cutting off the flow of

donors and related firms. But IS is is through cutting off the flow of

no long er dependent is through cutting off the flow of

funds. It raises is through cutting off the flow of

firmly rooted into the local is through cutting off the flow of

regional economies of is through cutting off the flow of

Iraq. IS's biggest source of revenue is isle. There's been a large black

market in oil in the Middle East in decades. It was used by Saddam

Hussein in Iraq to get round sanction,s. And it has been

exploited by the complots IS has controlled several fields in Syria

since 2012 and this year added four small fields in Iraq. Some of this

oil is transported to Turkey, Jordan and Iran and sold on the black

market for $50 to $60 a barrel. Some of it is transported to refineries

in northern Syria. As these pictures show, this is dangerous work. The

refined fuel is used in IS's only vehicles and sold in petrol stations

in areas under their control. Taken together, crude and refine. Oil

sales are currently worth around $1 million to ?3 million per day to

Islamic State. There's more to Islamic State's revenue an oil. It

extorts cash from local businesses in areas it controls, behaving like

a Mafia protection racket. Before the capture of Mosul extortion

wassest mated the capture of Mosul extortion

million a month. It has almost certainly increased significantly

since then. There have been reports that IS is selling captured women

and girls to people traffickers. The sale of hostages is another means of

cash. It asked for goods 250 million for the release of James Foley. The

average price paid for the release of James Foley. The

to 5 million. What are they spending all of this cash on? IS's revenues

are in the region of at least $40 million a month and possibly much

higher. Manchester of it goes on fighting their enemies, but not all

of it. In areas they control, IS is subsidising food and water,

providing basic public services and dolling out charity. This attempt to

win over hearts and minds is a crucial part of their strategy. They

are by far and away the best funded group of their ilk we've seen. With

the funds they've got they are in a cycle that allows them to attract

fighters, to buy weapons, to take more territory and more financially

attractive assets. That's a psyche hall the West needs to try and

break. Through conquest, extortion and oil trading IS have managed to

make themselves financially self sufficient. It is increasingly

looking less like a financed terror group and more Plaid Cymru a poor

state. The brother of murdered hostage James Foley said today he

believed the US Government could have done more to help his brother.

His ransom, the unimaginable sum of $132 million, never seemed remotely

realistic. I spoke to a hostage negotiator. He goes by the name of

Jan. He wishes to remain anonymous. We work for anybody who has been

kidnap ed. Whether that's a family, an individual or a company, a

corporation, an aid agency for instance as well. How often is a

ransom part of the ultimate negotiation? Quite often. It depends

on the country and the area and the profile of the victim and the

kidnappers. What we would always do is do our utmost not to pay a

ransom, if there is another way of getting somebody released by

providing some sort of concession for instance, which is not money. We

would have a go at that. Quite often with aid agencies in south Asia

particularly, then the aid agencies are sufficiently well liked by the

local communities that if one of them is kidnapped, they can use that

community leverage in order to pressure the kidnappers or persuade

them to release them for no money. Ostensibly there's a real

discrepancy between the way, say, British and US Governments deal with

ransoms with hostages and the way the French Government deals with

them. The French is more likely to pay money. Is that a good thing?

Governments, particularly the Europeans, have got a very bad

record now for paying far too much and far too quickly and feeding the

kidnappers, the terrorists, with money. Governments are poor

generally at countering kid naps, because they are seen by the

kidnappers to be a bottomless pit of money. And they are also seen as

being very subject to political, domestic political precious, so they

pay very fast and quickly, which is exactly what kidnappers like. But

essentially you're saying if the Government says we are not paying,

but here's a negotiator who will work it out for you, you are still

paying the ransom. You are still increasing the likelihood that more

hostages will be taken. I think it is right that you try to save

people's lives, innocent people who've been caught up with let's say

aid agency workers on journalists who just somebody who is travelling

and is kidnapped. The UK and US Governments tell us they don't pay

ransoms. Is the that true? I think it is true that the US and the UK

don't. I think the Europeans or some European governments have been for

fairly sure. But I think what the US and UK are doing now is trying to

stop people, families and corporate or companies from paying rans Oms.

They are trying to ban the payment of rans Oms to terrorists. I think

that is wrong. That is wrong to take out of the hands of people their own

way to get their loved ones back. You can see why they are doing it,

because they want to cut down on the incidence of kidnap-taking. You can

and I sympathise with that entirely but I think there are more direct

ways of bringing security to these areas. Again I just think it is

wrong. I think legally it is very dubious to be trying to ban people

from trying to save their loved ones. Jan, thank you. Joining us now

is a research fellow from RUSI, the think-tank. He said it is legally

dodgy ground for the Government to stop people. His explanation is

dubious. He says bring security instead. That's effectively a call

for world peace. We would all like to see Iraq, Syria stabilise, but

that isn't going to happen. His points about not incentivising

further kidnappings or funding terrorist groups, which they can use

to grow. Whoever pays the ranges, pays the ransom, it makes no

difference to the long-term effect of the market for hostages. You

can't say if no ransom were ever paid there would be no host age

taking. No, if you go back to Al-Qaeda in Iraq, they murdered many

hostages brutally for pure propaganda purposes alone, so we can

concede there'll certainly be hostage taking for political

reasons, propaganda purposes and blew bloodshed, which is barbaric

group like ISIS desires. We are not talking a bit of spare change or

bonus money, but the core funding for Al-Qaeda over recent years and a

significant source of the growth of this plague, the Islamic State. And

yet you could say, and you could never quantify a human life in terms

of money or money paid, but you could say that the response to the

killing of James Foley may now be war. May now be military

intervention, maybe a hardening of public opinion which is clearly

going to be way more costly than paying for his release. That's an

interesting argument but we know the structural conditions in Iraq and

Syria point in that direction anyway. The growth of Islamic State,

there are over 500 British fighters with the Islamic State, all of this

means a form of confrontation with the ITV, military or otherwise, was

coming. So you are saying the beheading of this hostage had very

little bearing on American policy now? I think American policy has

been gearing up slowly. I think it would have made a difference to

Chuck Hagel's sweeping statement about ISIS being a luge threat yet,

but it is inevitable they will expand air strikes. Before Foley. I

think after Foley that's how it is. Clearly this is something the

Americans haven't stated is explicitly, but we know our Foreign

Secretary said, we will not go into business with Assad. Air strikes on

Syria are presumably going to do Assad's work for him? Assad will be

the beneficiary but so will those fighting Assad or the Islamic State.

The Free Syrian Army or whatever we wish to call them, they've been

under the Islamic State cosh. They will benefit and the question is not

just does Assad benefit or not, parents by being seen to overtly

work with Assad, what effect does that have on the tens of millions of

disenfranchised Sunnis who support we need to ultimately defeat the

Islamic State? That's a bigger issue. Not does Assad benefit but is

this going to help us peel Sunnis away from the Islamic State? I think

overt active co-operation with Assad doesn't fulfil that objective. Thank

you. What about those who survive ISIS but find themselves narrators

of the terrible events they've witnessed with. One Yazidi man from

northern Iraq tells Newsnight of the day his vic near Sinjar was

surrounded by ISIS militants. They rounded up the men, shot them and

buried them en masse. Rafid Said Amu fled but a thousand of his fellow

villagers disappeared. He told his story. Hospitals in northern Iraq

are struggling to cope with the influx of both wounded

are struggling to cope with the military personnel, as Kurdish

are struggling to cope with the Iraqi soldiers tried to push back

against the IS offensive here. There are daily skirmishes. We are in the

largest hospital in Dahuk, where many of the wounded are brought.

This is the emergency room. I've seen a number

This is the emergency room. I've being treated. This is also where

they brought victims of a recent massacre.

they brought victims of a recent five times during the massacre of

non-Muslims by ISIS militants in a village near Sinjar. At least 80 men

each the minorityies sect were rounded up and shot dead. Women and

children were abducted. When they were surrounding you in

your village, what was happening, what were they telling you?

He told me he walked for about 12 hours, finally reaching Mount Sinjar

in the dead of night. He says between 40 and 50 of the villagers

rounded up with him died in the massacre. Where are the rest of the

family? Do you know what happened to your

wife and your children? Yalda Hakim speaking to the sole

survivor. To give Malky Mackay credit,

his text messages suggest he was indiscriminate

in his discrimination. His racist, sexist, homophobic,

anti-Semitic comments suggest he Today came a full-scale apology

and a reminder that anyone who had their personal texts scrutinised

would probably be in But it was the phrase that followed

the texts, a plea to dismiss them as friendly banter, which some

found most offensive of all. A new term has been added to the

offensive language Mexican and that word may just be banter -- the

offensive language lexicon. The text stream was between Malky Mackay and

Iain Moody. Markey Mackay apparently covers the full gamut of offence,

racist, anti-Semitic and sexist. It was something that was

unacceptable, but as far as I am concerned, I have been in a

multicultural football environment for 20 years. I love British

football. I am no racist, I am no sexist, I am no homophobe, I am no

anti-Semitic. The text messages have been condemned but a lone figure let

to his defence. Show me someone who has never made a mistake and I will

show you a liar. He has not murdered anyone, he is not a rapist, he is

not a paedophile. He has made a mistake, a big mistake, but it

should not finish his football career. The LMA has apologised for

its wording and accepted it is beyond argument that it was

discriminatory, a window has been opened onto the part of footballing

world that they have tried so hard to shut. Have things changed or has

the beautiful game managed to bury its beautiful side?

I am joined now by former footballer turned pundit,

Mark Bright, and the award-winning sports writer, Matthew Syed. Malky

When you have a manager saying, I am not anti-Semitic, I am not a

homophobe, it is a strange state of affairs. This is about far more than

Markey Mackay and Iain Moody. There are no black managers. No women

managers. No women working in youth team football. No openly gay

footballers. That is what the situation is in football. It hints

at a culture going way beyond one man, these two men. That is the

issue football has to address. It is deeper and wider. You were pretty

shocked. We talked on the phone. How wide do you think this goes?

Everyone in football condemns what they have said. No one can put up a

case with them. I have been in Iain Moody's company since he joined the

club, in the boardroom, travelling, he has never said anything untoward

to me. There have always been rumours and when it came out, the

content of the texts, I was shocked. I did not think in 2014 anyone is

going to write it down never mind think it. You said write it down,

the defence Harry Redknapp tried to put up was

the defence Harry Redknapp tried to away looking good if their text

messages were scrutinised. Any of us. I don't know. Would you be

comfortable someone going us. I don't know. Would you be

phone? Does he have a point? Depends what it says. Has

phone? Does he have a point? Depends their friends about their boss? That

goes on. But that is discrimination. It is wrong. Every box ticked. And

yet every time you go and watch a game, there are adverts and the

thing about combating racism and homophobia, is that just the surface

question might the reality is a disaster. The spin is good. Better

than it was. -- is that just the surface? Football lags behind. Why?

If you work at a big corporate institution, you are told by the

very very strenuous page our department that it is unacceptable

to use racist, sexist, homophobic terminology as banter. In football

clubs, on the training pitch, homophobic epithets used as terms of

abuse. It is just a group of young guys, a bit of banter. Let me

finish, if I made? This is a place of work. If there is a gay person

not out of the closet... They are not going to say, it is out of

order. They might not want to be identified. Think of the attritional

affected that will have. They do not understand that this is not just

banter, it is not just a group of guys having a kick around, it is a

place of work. They need to have the same rules as big companies. I have

heard players told the manager to F off on the training ground. Anywhere

else, you lose your job. In football, you don't. You can't down

on the manager comes down and you say sorry and move on. -- you calm

down. What is your point, it is not going to change? It is not banter.

It is an exchange on the pitch against each other and the manager

and the player, when you are in training... I mean, we were talking

before and I said, Jeremy Clarkson has come out with a couple of

things, close to the knuckle, he is still employed. You talk about

football having a problem... Really interesting. Thank you very much.

The Budleigh is the perky and hold of butterflies who seek out

The Budleigh is the perky and hold nectar but to government officials

and Network Rail it is a scourge smothering native plants and

damaging infrastructure with its restless pen draws. It has been

branded a non-native invader. In the late summer zenith, it is

unbelievably common. Here is Steven Smith. What could be more restful?

Yet we need to be on our guard against a threat on our very

doorstep. On the white Cliffs of Dover themselves. They comes in the

deceptively innocuous guys of a foreign invader. The buddleia. Is it

a case of us and then with the buddleia? You have to admire these

plants, but they are causing a lot of damage to wildlife. I think it is

wonderful and vibrant and colourful. Let buddleias rule. You may have

admired it from a railway carriage. In fact, you can hardly have missed

it. It flourishes where other plants shrivel. Dry soil, cracks in mortar.

It is a supreme opportunist, on the front, park rangers like this man

keeping watch under the famous chalky sentinels, the home guard. It

is a nature reserve that is protected for its very rare wild

flowers and particularly its very rare assemblage of insects. Hundreds

of insects that have been recorded here which are often not recorded

anywhere else in Britain. It is very dense. You could not force your way

through. This is what buddleia does. The shade kills off everything

growing underneath. All of the wild flowers, grass, the insects and

butterflies depend on them and they are not there any more. This is part

of the buddleia? The Jan has eliminated almost everything. -- the

buddleia. At garden centres like this one, customers are wild for

buddleia though it can smother some plants. Paradoxically it is also

known as a haunt of mature butterflies. We are up 20% on year

to date. People are passionate about wildlife because of the decline of

butterflies and ladybirds, they want to encourage these into their

gardens again. This is the perfect thing. It flowers all summer until

autumn and it is really pretty. Whitehall officials describe

buddleia as invasive and purge gardeners to deadhead the plants

before they can seed -- and they purge gardeners. The garden

centre's star employee spruces the place up in honour of gardening

royalty. Very nice to see you again. I hope you like the set we have

bowled for you. What about these plants, the name of which I have

momentarily forgotten, but I know you know what they are and they are

running riot all over the country at the moment. Buddleias. When you

think of a British garden, you think of buddleias and butterflies, maybe

an Edwardian wall space, what harm does the buddleia of suburbia do?

Genius! I see a range of gardening accessories. This could be huge. A

garden is a melting pot so many different cultures, so many

different places. Look how it combines beautifully and that is

what this country has always been good at. Towards the end of August,

do you have any gardening tips? Should they be deadheading anything?

Hydrangeas. Fine when I last checked them out. On a clear day, you can

look out to France across The Channel, the source of so many

earlier threats to this green and pleasant land. Meanwhile the French

can look back at us and see our buddleia. We leave you with a treat.

As part of Newsnight's Proms preview, we enter night with the

principal cellist with the London Symphony at playing the haunting

Linguae Ignis, or Tongues of Fire, by Peter Maxwell Davies. Good night.