Browse content similar to 21/04/2016. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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President Obama lands in London, on the next leg of his foreign tour. | :00:00. | :00:07. | |
But is anyone listening to a president with | :00:08. | :00:09. | |
And will those who come after him cement the deals he's made | :00:10. | :00:14. | |
As the race to replace him fast approaches, we ask our Atlantic | :00:15. | :00:19. | |
facing guests what they think American foreign policy | :00:20. | :00:21. | |
# This is what it sounds like when doves cry... | :00:22. | :00:36. | |
We remember the artist now forever known as Prince. | :00:37. | :00:41. | |
We'll be joined live by singer Mica Paris | :00:42. | :00:47. | |
And, in her 90 years, has the Queen witnessed or even prompted the quiet | :00:48. | :00:59. | |
death of the republican movement? Where are they now? Tony Blair | :01:00. | :01:06. | |
expelled me from the Labour Party and she agreed to come and open City | :01:07. | :01:09. | |
Hall. The Queen is above politics. President Obama has arrived at the | :01:10. | :01:27. | |
US Embassy in London bringing the British leg of his foreign policy | :01:28. | :01:30. | |
tour and a meeting with David Cameron. Don't be surprised if the | :01:31. | :01:35. | |
air is frosty. This bilateral will mark the first full meeting between | :01:36. | :01:40. | |
the two metres since Obama, in a candid interview, accused Cameron of | :01:41. | :01:44. | |
failing to pull his weight in the Libyan crisis of 2011, words which | :01:45. | :01:49. | |
may have gone deeper than publicly acknowledged. His expected | :01:50. | :01:52. | |
intervention on Brexit may have soothed some quarters but the | :01:53. | :01:58. | |
meeting is also expected to address Libya, counterterrorism and a future | :01:59. | :02:03. | |
strategy to counter Isis, but could what is sealed to day be completely | :02:04. | :02:09. | |
torn up in a post Obama world? Mark urban looks back at his foreign | :02:10. | :02:13. | |
policy legacy and asks how much of it will stick. | :02:14. | :02:22. | |
You would expect a president to rack up the air miles. Barack Obama is no | :02:23. | :02:29. | |
exception. He is in Britain for the fifth time as president to talk | :02:30. | :02:32. | |
about the challenges facing Europe and with time running out for him to | :02:33. | :02:42. | |
add to his list of legacies. In the past hour, he landed at Stansted, | :02:43. | :02:45. | |
flying in from Saudi Arabia, where he'd been discussing tackling the | :02:46. | :02:51. | |
Islamic State group. One of those issues he could never having | :02:52. | :02:56. | |
dissipated when elected. Barack Obama had all kinds of ideas of what | :02:57. | :03:01. | |
he was going to do when he came into office, only to see the financial | :03:02. | :03:06. | |
crisis develop, you know, literally during the transition. It was | :03:07. | :03:13. | |
completely absorbing. George Bush thought he would have one kind of | :03:14. | :03:18. | |
presidency and suddenly he had 9/11. The world has a way of confounding | :03:19. | :03:22. | |
what every new president wishes to do. That battle taking US forces | :03:23. | :03:29. | |
back into Iraq is just one area where events have conspired to | :03:30. | :03:34. | |
frustrate the agenda he set out at the start of his presidency. The | :03:35. | :03:43. | |
world, as Obama wanted to remake it, involved a pivot Asia, not just | :03:44. | :03:48. | |
China but south-east Asia as well. That meant repositioning, diplomacy, | :03:49. | :03:51. | |
trade and the military, away from the Middle East, a path that was to | :03:52. | :03:56. | |
be smoothed by winding down the war in Iraq and we setting the | :03:57. | :04:01. | |
relationship in Iran. There was to be less Europe as well. A military | :04:02. | :04:06. | |
drawdown and another reset, this time with Russia, to soothe | :04:07. | :04:11. | |
remaining tensions. That isn't how it turned out. Only some of these | :04:12. | :04:16. | |
aspirations proved realistic. We will give him credit for a number of | :04:17. | :04:21. | |
things, although they are unfinished business, for example, the Iran | :04:22. | :04:26. | |
deal, getting the millstone of an unsustainable Cuba policy of our | :04:27. | :04:35. | |
neck, making a pre-deal with China on climate before the Paris climate | :04:36. | :04:42. | |
summit. Those are some of the high points. How did Obama's world | :04:43. | :04:47. | |
actually turn out? A list of presidential trips still shows | :04:48. | :04:51. | |
Europe way out front. His most visited country, whisper it in | :04:52. | :04:56. | |
Whitehall, has been France. But the UK and Germany also figure highly. | :04:57. | :05:03. | |
Today, US troops are going back into Europe at Russia reset failed, and | :05:04. | :05:08. | |
back into Iraq as well. Much the same has happened in Afghanistan, | :05:09. | :05:15. | |
visited four times, while China has figured just twice, with a third | :05:16. | :05:20. | |
trip planned. There has been the nuclear deal with Iran and, late in | :05:21. | :05:27. | |
his term, Cuba has been written in as a dark horse diplomatic coup. But | :05:28. | :05:32. | |
even these achievements could be rehearsed and, indeed, a hostile | :05:33. | :05:36. | |
Congress and presidential challenger have said they will do just that. We | :05:37. | :05:41. | |
will totally dismantle Iran's global terror network, which is big and | :05:42. | :05:52. | |
powerful but not powerful like us. Perhaps the greatest challenge for | :05:53. | :05:55. | |
President Obama has been a custom in Americans to the limits of their | :05:56. | :06:00. | |
country's power, when so much of their political discourse emphasises | :06:01. | :06:04. | |
its greatness. These are not things that are easily accepted by a large | :06:05. | :06:14. | |
nation with a very rich history, particularly the history of the | :06:15. | :06:18. | |
post-war period. And, you know, it is tough, too, against the backdrop | :06:19. | :06:22. | |
of American partisan divides right now, where one side of the aisle is | :06:23. | :06:30. | |
defining greatness in largely military terms. President Obama has | :06:31. | :06:34. | |
acknowledged his foreign policy is a work in progress and much will | :06:35. | :06:39. | |
depend on his successor. Given the possible choice between Trump and | :06:40. | :06:42. | |
Clinton, the question of how much of a legacy would remain would not be | :06:43. | :06:44. | |
much darker. Joining us now, Bruce Jentleson, | :06:45. | :06:46. | |
who worked at the State Department under Hillary Clinton and is now | :06:47. | :06:49. | |
Henry Kissinger Chair in Foreign Policy at the Library | :06:50. | :06:51. | |
of Congress, and David Graham, who covers the US election | :06:52. | :06:54. | |
and global news for the Atlantic. Welcome. Thank you. It was | :06:55. | :07:05. | |
interesting hearing Mark calling this a work in progress. Bruce | :07:06. | :07:10. | |
Jentleson, how different do you think American foreign policy would | :07:11. | :07:15. | |
look under a Clinton presidency? There would be elements, a fair | :07:16. | :07:20. | |
amount of continuity, and there would be some change. When Hillary | :07:21. | :07:25. | |
Clinton was secretary of state for President Obama, they worked | :07:26. | :07:28. | |
together and agreed on any number of issues, and there have been some on | :07:29. | :07:32. | |
which they disagreed. Let me use Syria as an example. In late 2012 | :07:33. | :07:38. | |
after the presidential election, Secretary Clinton was among those | :07:39. | :07:42. | |
pushing for the United States to establish a safe haven and a no-fly | :07:43. | :07:46. | |
zone, to give more aid to the opposition, while at the same time | :07:47. | :07:52. | |
pursuing aggressive diplomacy. That remains her position. President | :07:53. | :07:56. | |
Obama has chosen not to do that. In some respects, I think she would be | :07:57. | :07:59. | |
looking for a different balance point between the use of force and | :08:00. | :08:04. | |
diplomacy. That is one issue that illustrate it. Let me make you more | :08:05. | :08:09. | |
candid. When you are looking at something like Mosul under Isis, | :08:10. | :08:14. | |
Libya, the next one on the map, are you saying basically she would go in | :08:15. | :08:20. | |
way he would fear to tread? Not at all. This isn't about mass American | :08:21. | :08:24. | |
ground troops like George Bush in Iraq. It is a question of how you | :08:25. | :08:29. | |
mount a course of diplomacy strategy, in which you raise the | :08:30. | :08:35. | |
pressure in Syria on Assad, and to a certain extent on the Russians, to | :08:36. | :08:38. | |
try and come to the table with them and get a political transition. | :08:39. | :08:42. | |
There is no way there is a military solution to Syria but a bit more | :08:43. | :08:47. | |
coercion can help. How successful do you think Obama has been with his | :08:48. | :08:51. | |
relationships and where is there room for improvement in terms of | :08:52. | :08:55. | |
what comes next? I think it varies a lot from region to region. His | :08:56. | :09:00. | |
relationship with Israel has not been as strong as some craziness -- | :09:01. | :09:05. | |
some previous presidents. Many will tell you that is positive, others | :09:06. | :09:10. | |
will say it is negative. Use the ups and downs with David Cameron, with | :09:11. | :09:14. | |
Angela Merkel with surveillance issues. And you see some bright | :09:15. | :09:19. | |
spots, improvement with Iran, opening to Cuba, so across the globe | :09:20. | :09:23. | |
you get a real range of stronger and weaker positions. If we are not | :09:24. | :09:28. | |
talking about a Clinton presidency, let's say, about a Trump or a Cruz | :09:29. | :09:34. | |
presidency, how much of this would stick Mr Mock would we see the Iran | :09:35. | :09:39. | |
deal torn up all the Cuba bingo? Is this primary talk? With Donald | :09:40. | :09:46. | |
Trump, it is clear we would be seeing something different, but what | :09:47. | :09:50. | |
exactly is a bit unclear, because he speaks in such generalities. He says | :09:51. | :09:55. | |
for example that he would not care up the Iran deal but he would | :09:56. | :09:59. | |
renegotiate it. What exactly that means it's hard to tell. We know he | :10:00. | :10:05. | |
would take a hard line with China. He seems to want to have a close | :10:06. | :10:09. | |
relationship with Russia. But he speaks with so few details it is | :10:10. | :10:13. | |
hard to tell exactly what the pivot away from Obama would be. Do you see | :10:14. | :10:19. | |
a Republican presidency as being more isolationist than a democratic | :10:20. | :10:25. | |
one? I think it is worse than that. It isn't isolationism if the United | :10:26. | :10:32. | |
States comes home. It is bullying. Build a wall and make Mexico pay, | :10:33. | :10:37. | |
but 45 increase on imports from China... Do you really believe that | :10:38. | :10:45. | |
rhetoric in your heart? That is what he said and we can only go on that. | :10:46. | :10:49. | |
It has been sufficiently credible that over 120 Republican foreign | :10:50. | :10:54. | |
policy professionals said they would work for him. He might try and | :10:55. | :10:58. | |
strike various deals as he tries to go to the election, but that is his | :10:59. | :11:02. | |
attitude. Fundamentally, it is his temperament. There is a ready, fire, | :11:03. | :11:10. | |
aim to Trump but I think would be very dangerous on almost any foreign | :11:11. | :11:13. | |
policy issue. Where'd you think the European relationships would go? | :11:14. | :11:20. | |
Obama seems to like France more than the UK, perhaps. Do you think there | :11:21. | :11:24. | |
is work to do in repairing the relationship with Cameron, and do | :11:25. | :11:28. | |
you think that Hillary Clinton would be interested in putting Europe | :11:29. | :11:34. | |
higher up the priority list? My sense is that she would like to | :11:35. | :11:36. | |
repair those relationships. The Russian ship may be a bit stronger | :11:37. | :11:46. | |
during his first term, which she was running the state department. -- the | :11:47. | :11:49. | |
relationship. Obama has this deep scepticism of what the US can do, | :11:50. | :11:53. | |
and I think you see less of that with Clinton, so you might see a | :11:54. | :11:55. | |
different engagement with the world. "Dearly beloved, we are gathered | :11:56. | :11:59. | |
here today to get through this The lyrics of Prince's Let's Go | :12:00. | :12:01. | |
Crazy have bolted back into the music world's collective | :12:02. | :12:05. | |
consciousness tonight after his death was | :12:06. | :12:08. | |
announced at the age of 57. He became one of the most | :12:09. | :12:11. | |
pioneering, popular, inimitable voices of the '80s | :12:12. | :12:12. | |
and '90s and beyond. His music could be haunting, | :12:13. | :12:16. | |
his stage presence He redefined gender | :12:17. | :12:19. | |
and his own identity, most notably changing his name | :12:20. | :12:24. | |
to a symbol to remove himself from contractual obligations | :12:25. | :12:27. | |
with his record label. Put aside, for a moment, | :12:28. | :12:31. | |
your concerns about what on earth is happening to our artists | :12:32. | :12:33. | |
in the year 2016 and remember just There was Elvis in his jumpsuit, | :12:34. | :13:03. | |
James brown in a cape, but nobody looked, sounded or, dare I say, | :13:04. | :13:09. | |
smells more like a rock star than Prince. You would call him Snape | :13:10. | :13:13. | |
kept that he would probably save that made him sad fact. | :13:14. | :13:18. | |
# She's never satisfied # Why do we scream at each other? | :13:19. | :13:24. | |
# This is what it sounds like when doves cry... | :13:25. | :13:32. | |
He sold 100 million records, he won seven Grammys and an Oscar, and he | :13:33. | :13:36. | |
went through names rapidly, jettisoning them when they didn't | :13:37. | :13:47. | |
suit him any more. # You've got the butterflies... Most | :13:48. | :13:56. | |
people don't get famous with one name and then change it. What is the | :13:57. | :14:04. | |
story? Well, I had to search deep within my heart and spirit and I | :14:05. | :14:10. | |
wanted to make a change and move to a new plateau in my life, and one of | :14:11. | :14:14. | |
the ways I did that was to change my name. It sort of divorced me from | :14:15. | :14:19. | |
the past and all the hang-ups that go with it. | :14:20. | :14:25. | |
# I only want to see you laughing in the purple rain | :14:26. | :14:34. | |
# Purple rain, purple rain # Purple rain... Prince, or whatever | :14:35. | :14:41. | |
alias he happened to be serving under, right, he could he could | :14:42. | :14:50. | |
play. -- he could write, he could sing, he could play. An older | :14:51. | :14:53. | |
generation of tax legends took notice. At a time when I thought | :14:54. | :14:58. | |
that rock and roll was dead and then I went to see Purple Rain and that | :14:59. | :15:04. | |
was it. It is a reincarnation of Little Richard and Jimi Hendrix in | :15:05. | :15:07. | |
one and I thought it was what the world needed. Controversial, but I | :15:08. | :15:11. | |
love him dearly and I think he is a genius. | :15:12. | :15:18. | |
Is that Britain's?! Reckon executives might not agree but | :15:19. | :15:28. | |
Prince was a total pro. Loose Women was never like this. Giving away | :15:29. | :15:34. | |
free tickets on a chat show. I love you, Prince! I love you back. You | :15:35. | :15:41. | |
are going to be at Madison Square Garden? We're doing a wonderful | :15:42. | :15:46. | |
series of concerts with an array of special guests and a bands that | :15:47. | :15:49. | |
played like a jackhammer. You have to come and check it out. And what | :15:50. | :16:04. | |
about this for a work ethic? # Oh, no, let's go. The only time it is of | :16:05. | :16:07. | |
a half-time in the Super Bowl and the smallest guy on the field is the | :16:08. | :16:16. | |
most valuable player. -- it has ever arraigned at | :16:17. | :16:25. | |
half-time in the Super Bowl. # You don't have to be beautiful... | :16:26. | :16:33. | |
To the premature end, he was always writing, playing impromptu | :16:34. | :16:35. | |
performances and a long run of dates in London. | :16:36. | :16:48. | |
# 2000, party over, out of time. For better or worse, the star who had | :16:49. | :16:56. | |
its oil -- had it all, even point his own epitaph, the artist formerly | :16:57. | :17:01. | |
known as Prince. Steve Smith, remembering Prince. And joining us | :17:02. | :17:03. | |
now: and Oscar-winning director Steve | :17:04. | :17:08. | |
McQueen. Mica, you shared a manager with | :17:09. | :17:18. | |
Prince. Tell us the story of how you first met him. It is very strange. I | :17:19. | :17:22. | |
was a huge fan and I was given a golden ticket for a private show at | :17:23. | :17:27. | |
the Camden Palace. Everybody was there. I was 18, standing in the | :17:28. | :17:32. | |
audience, looking at my hero and thinking, I cannot believe I am | :17:33. | :17:35. | |
actually watching him. And he called out and said, I think your name is | :17:36. | :17:43. | |
Mica, Singh. I was just blown away. He gave me the mike and I just | :17:44. | :17:51. | |
started singing ust My Imagination by the Temptations. I have lived it, | :17:52. | :17:55. | |
because I was terrified. He was very instinctive. And then he called me | :17:56. | :18:04. | |
up and asked me to come to Minneapolis, to Paisley Park, and he | :18:05. | :18:10. | |
wrote a song for my next album. So you literally sang from the | :18:11. | :18:15. | |
audience? How old were you? 18. And the next thing you knew, he was | :18:16. | :18:20. | |
writing songs with you and for you? For the second album, yes. It was | :18:21. | :18:24. | |
amazing. It was shocking for me at the time, obviously. But it was | :18:25. | :18:30. | |
surreal. Because he was like that. If you liked you, he would find a | :18:31. | :18:35. | |
way to contact you and work with you. Because that is what he is | :18:36. | :18:40. | |
like. He knows what he likes. Steve McQueen, what was it for you, the | :18:41. | :18:48. | |
pool of Prince? What was it that drew you in? It was the freedom. | :18:49. | :18:53. | |
There was a black artist totally and utterly free. And inclusive. He | :18:54. | :18:58. | |
wrote, produced, arranged, played all the instruments. And he was sexy | :18:59. | :19:05. | |
and religious and free in every single aspect of his life. And he | :19:06. | :19:13. | |
portrayed what he did in such style, and with such funk, you had to go | :19:14. | :19:17. | |
along with Prince. Prince was Prince, there is only one Prince. | :19:18. | :19:22. | |
You wanted to make a film with him, or about him. What did you want to | :19:23. | :19:31. | |
say? The camera would have been shaking if I was making a movie with | :19:32. | :19:36. | |
Prince. I met him after I won the Oscar and we talked. He was just | :19:37. | :19:41. | |
extraordinary, a very generous person. He took off his shades and | :19:42. | :19:44. | |
met my mother and I thanked him for what he had done for black artists, | :19:45. | :19:50. | |
and black people, because he was just a megastar. He was the best, | :19:51. | :19:54. | |
there was no one who could touch a guitar, dancing, writing, singing. | :19:55. | :20:02. | |
Who has all of those talents, all of those gifts? Helped me to unpick | :20:03. | :20:07. | |
that. I would come back to you, Mica, with the same question in a | :20:08. | :20:12. | |
minute, but when you say, Steve, all he did for black artists, what did | :20:13. | :20:16. | |
he do for black artists? What did he give them? I would not say black | :20:17. | :20:24. | |
artists, I would say young black people, for them it was the first | :20:25. | :20:32. | |
time the shackles of an industry... I mean, he was free. To put out an | :20:33. | :20:37. | |
album every year, to tour when he wanted, to do and aftershow, this is | :20:38. | :20:45. | |
a real artist, with no boundaries. And I think that... I mean, he is so | :20:46. | :20:50. | |
influential. Look at all the albums that came out in the 80s and all the | :20:51. | :20:53. | |
people who copied Tim, from George Michael and so on. The 80s and | :20:54. | :21:00. | |
beyond. Everyone copied Prince. Because he was the way. Mica, did he | :21:01. | :21:07. | |
feel like that, did he see himself in that way or did he see himself as | :21:08. | :21:12. | |
a man constantly struggling to change or Dumora? I never got that | :21:13. | :21:20. | |
from him. -- change or do more. What I got was he was music. He lived it, | :21:21. | :21:24. | |
breathe that, every aspect of him was music. I mean, I would be in the | :21:25. | :21:30. | |
studio with him and it would be like until six or 7:00am, he was still | :21:31. | :21:35. | |
going, like it was the daytime. He was a workaholic, it was all about | :21:36. | :21:40. | |
music. And he worked incredibly fast. Some of the songs, they are | :21:41. | :21:44. | |
alleged to have been written in ten minutes. Yes. And loads of them as | :21:45. | :21:50. | |
well. I remember him telling me that he has bolts of songs that go on and | :21:51. | :21:58. | |
on. -- vaults. Constantly working time. Amazing. Steve, do you think | :21:59. | :22:04. | |
there is untapped music that we are only just coming to? Is there a lot | :22:05. | :22:10. | |
of stuff that did not see the light? I don't know about that. All I want | :22:11. | :22:17. | |
to say is that what he did, in his unfortunately short lifetime, it is | :22:18. | :22:20. | |
just incredible. There is enough music that he has produced for three | :22:21. | :22:27. | |
or four lifetimes. He has done so much musically. It is just | :22:28. | :22:32. | |
incredible. He moved into movies, of course. What do you think his | :22:33. | :22:37. | |
influence was there? It is not everyone who can make that | :22:38. | :22:45. | |
crossover. Well, I think Spike Lee said it best, at that time, when he | :22:46. | :22:51. | |
did Purple Rain, that was hugely influential, as a black artist, | :22:52. | :22:56. | |
having a movie about himself, which he produced, and he was financially | :22:57. | :23:02. | |
involved in and it was a hit, it was unprecedented. What was it, 1984, | :23:03. | :23:09. | |
85? I think it was 1984. Amazing. And he directed the second one, | :23:10. | :23:16. | |
Under The Cherry Moon. I mean, he was a pioneer. It is as simple as | :23:17. | :23:24. | |
that. And he was such a contradiction of figures. He was | :23:25. | :23:28. | |
someone who felt deeply religious but deeply sexual onstage as well | :23:29. | :23:34. | |
and outwardly sexual. Yes, when I got into Prince, before I met him, | :23:35. | :23:38. | |
what happened was I had his album and he had suspenders on. And I come | :23:39. | :23:44. | |
from the church, so I used to have to hide the album in the house from | :23:45. | :23:47. | |
my grandparents, who were ministers, because everyone was saying, you | :23:48. | :23:52. | |
cannot have that, that is wrong. And it did not matter that he had | :23:53. | :23:55. | |
suspenders on because when you heard that funky beat, I mean, it was just | :23:56. | :24:03. | |
shocking. The way he fused all of those styles as well, you have to | :24:04. | :24:08. | |
remember the fused funk, soul, jazz, classical, and then he mixed it with | :24:09. | :24:13. | |
technology, the way he was so ahead with technology as well, he was | :24:14. | :24:18. | |
definitely an enigma. The news today has come... I was quite sad, | :24:19. | :24:27. | |
actually, before I came on the programme but hearing Mica talk | :24:28. | :24:29. | |
about Prince and human memories, there is so much joy, there is so | :24:30. | :24:37. | |
much to what he did, the artistry, it is pretty incredible when you | :24:38. | :24:42. | |
think back. What's Mica was saying, it gives me lots of warmth in my | :24:43. | :24:47. | |
chest. I was feeling sad before I came on and now I think, he knocked | :24:48. | :24:53. | |
the ball way out of the park. Was there a moment where you remember | :24:54. | :24:57. | |
thinking, this man is changing my life, this man is going to have a | :24:58. | :25:01. | |
profound effect on who I am from now on? I mean, this guy came out with | :25:02. | :25:09. | |
an album every year. It was just incredible. I remember my friend | :25:10. | :25:18. | |
Mark gave me, what was it, excuse me, what was the album? I am losing | :25:19. | :25:23. | |
my train of thought. I was listening to this album and every track was | :25:24. | :25:28. | |
revolutionary. If I was your girlfriend, hello?! Speeding up the | :25:29. | :25:38. | |
vocals. Whole idea of him being male, female, inclusive, black, | :25:39. | :25:46. | |
white, number one, Prince. No one could touch him. I think the best | :25:47. | :25:59. | |
one was Sign o' the Times, because it was sparse, and the message was | :26:00. | :26:07. | |
so powerful. That was the one! For me, that was the pinnacle. We have | :26:08. | :26:13. | |
only just begun the reliving. Before we go, Sign o' the Times, you were | :26:14. | :26:17. | |
one of the few who spotted some of the warning signs over the last | :26:18. | :26:21. | |
year, but maybe all was not well with his health. I saw him last year | :26:22. | :26:30. | |
and I thought he was a bit thin, that was the only thing I thought. | :26:31. | :26:33. | |
He was the slimmest I have seen him in all the years I have known him | :26:34. | :26:37. | |
and it was something I thought he looked a bit thin but I think he | :26:38. | :26:41. | |
worked so hard. This is a guy who was constantly touring, constantly | :26:42. | :26:47. | |
working and hardly slept. He loved his job. Great to have you both. I | :26:48. | :26:50. | |
appreciate you joining us tonight. As beacons blaze across the country | :26:51. | :26:53. | |
this evening to mark the Queen's 90th birthday, | :26:54. | :26:56. | |
she enjoys what feels like unclouded popularity, | :26:57. | :26:59. | |
garnering respect even from those who don't see themselves as dyed | :27:00. | :27:01. | |
in the wool monarchists. So has she properly seen off | :27:02. | :27:07. | |
the Republican movement in On double time tonight, | :27:08. | :27:10. | |
here's Stephen Smith again. You could be forgiven for thinking | :27:11. | :27:19. | |
that Republicans hadn't taken such a pasting since their battles | :27:20. | :27:22. | |
with the Royalists Today, though, the sovereign | :27:23. | :27:25. | |
reigns unchallenged, enjoying a popularity to make other | :27:26. | :27:35. | |
establishment figures Will you be stocking this with | :27:36. | :27:52. | |
newts? The newts are in there already. I had two badgers | :27:53. | :28:02. | |
frogspawn. -- two batches of frogspawn. | :28:03. | :28:04. | |
Labour's Ken Livingstone pours his energy into | :28:05. | :28:05. | |
But didn't he once hoped to live a bit like the French | :28:06. | :28:10. | |
Do you still describe yourself as a Republican? | :28:11. | :28:16. | |
Yes, theoretically, but I don't think it will be an issue | :28:17. | :28:19. | |
I don't think it will arise because if you say we're | :28:20. | :28:27. | |
going to get rid of the monarchy, then who are you going to have? | :28:28. | :28:30. | |
I don't think we want to move to a presidential system | :28:31. | :28:33. | |
like America, we want to keep a prime ministerial one. | :28:34. | :28:35. | |
So you would need a head of state, largely ceremonial, | :28:36. | :28:38. | |
and people don't want some clapped-out old politician. | :28:39. | :28:41. | |
What you might get is celebrities running for it, | :28:42. | :28:45. | |
I was really struck because when Mrs Thatcher | :28:46. | :28:53. | |
was abolishing the TLC, the Queen agreed to come and open | :28:54. | :28:55. | |
And then when Tony Blair had expelled me from the Labour Party, | :28:56. | :29:05. | |
she agreed to come to open City Hall on the very day he was | :29:06. | :29:08. | |
I think the Queen is just above politics, and politicians come | :29:09. | :29:17. | |
and go, and she is there to serve the people. | :29:18. | :29:20. | |
Has the bell tolled for a British Republic? | :29:21. | :29:33. | |
But what about after the Queen's reign? | :29:34. | :29:36. | |
A recent hit play, King Charles III, imagines rocky times | :29:37. | :29:39. | |
And some Republicans see it that way, too. | :29:40. | :29:50. | |
Republicanism used to be the R-word that could not be mentioned, | :29:51. | :29:54. | |
it could not be talked about, right up until 15 years ago. | :29:55. | :30:01. | |
Now it's quite acceptable to talk about it, think about it, | :30:02. | :30:04. | |
And I think that is what has happened, but of course the Queen, | :30:05. | :30:09. | |
because of her world celebrity status, really, | :30:10. | :30:13. | |
she is a celebrity rather than anything else, | :30:14. | :30:19. | |
while she's there, the political class in this country, in my view, | :30:20. | :30:21. | |
In a room over a pub in Birmingham, members of the pressure group | :30:22. | :30:37. | |
Republic look forward to what they hope will be | :30:38. | :30:39. | |
They claim to have 5000 members and many more sympathisers. | :30:40. | :30:53. | |
Graeme Smith is Republic's full-time salaried CEO. | :30:54. | :30:58. | |
If it is not her, if it is not the Royals, then we get | :30:59. | :31:02. | |
President Blair or President Stephen Fry. | :31:03. | :31:07. | |
You never would, the point is, well, you would get someone | :31:08. | :31:09. | |
who is quite serious and ultimately has been chosen by the people, | :31:10. | :31:14. | |
so it is going to be someone that is going to have that kind | :31:15. | :31:18. | |
Sorry to interrupt you, but it seems we are about to name | :31:19. | :31:30. | |
a research vessel Boaty McBoatface, so are you sure you have | :31:31. | :31:33. | |
that much confidence in your fellow citizens? | :31:34. | :31:35. | |
The point is, we are about to elect a new Mayor of London and we have | :31:36. | :31:39. | |
elected governments of different stripes across the country | :31:40. | :31:41. | |
in Scotland, England and Wales and so on. | :31:42. | :31:43. | |
If you look at the Republic of Ireland, they directly | :31:44. | :31:45. | |
elect their head of state, who has a very similar | :31:46. | :31:49. | |
They are accountable and certainly in the last decade and a half | :31:50. | :31:53. | |
they have enjoyed levels of popularity equal to that | :31:54. | :31:55. | |
The Queen has been quite clever in not being ostentatiously wealthy. | :31:56. | :32:04. | |
The next couple of generations are much more open about going | :32:05. | :32:07. | |
on holiday all the time and all that kind of thing. | :32:08. | :32:11. | |
And I think what is going to happen is it is going to be evident how out | :32:12. | :32:15. | |
We are not all in this together if you happen to be a Windsor. | :32:16. | :32:23. | |
If that has doused the Royal braziers a little, Tracey Emin, | :32:24. | :32:26. | |
who met the Queen at the Turner Contemporary Gallery | :32:27. | :32:28. | |
in Margate, says she is a convert to monarchism. | :32:29. | :32:32. | |
When I was younger, I did not feel for the Royal family | :32:33. | :32:35. | |
And then, when I was about 20, in my 20s, I saw a royal procession | :32:36. | :32:43. | |
coming from Victoria Station and I had to get off | :32:44. | :32:46. | |
the bus and stand and wait, and then when the Queen went past | :32:47. | :32:49. | |
in her golden coach, my hand went up and I just | :32:50. | :32:53. | |
started waving and cheering like everybody else. | :32:54. | :32:57. | |
I am going to do the right thing, I thought, I am going to make | :32:58. | :33:05. | |
Her Majesty a very nice birthday card and send it. | :33:06. | :33:21. | |
Yesterday, this woman was elected as the first black female president of | :33:22. | :33:27. | |
the NUS. Her election has sparked controversy as she has been accused | :33:28. | :33:34. | |
of anti-Semitic remarks, including -- including Colin Bernd Neumann | :33:35. | :33:37. | |
university as I missed out let. She says her comments have been | :33:38. | :33:43. | |
mis-represented, she isn't racist, and she emphasises the difference | :33:44. | :33:47. | |
between being anti-Zionist and anti-Semitic. She has been accused | :33:48. | :33:50. | |
of not supporting a motion condemning the so-called Islamic | :33:51. | :33:55. | |
State, but the NUS says this is because she disputed the wording of | :33:56. | :34:00. | |
the motion, not the principle. But students from at least seven | :34:01. | :34:02. | |
universities of voting to disassociate from the NUS. Harry | :34:03. | :34:09. | |
Samuels, an Oxford NUS delegate who wants to disassociate, joined us. | :34:10. | :34:14. | |
You are campaigning to disassociate your university, Oxford, from the | :34:15. | :34:19. | |
NUS. Yes, we disagree with the direction of the NUS. My delegation | :34:20. | :34:24. | |
was elected on a reformist slate and we went to the conference over the | :34:25. | :34:29. | |
last few days to see what it was like, to try and put forward some | :34:30. | :34:32. | |
reformist emotions and to see if there was any way to change the NUS | :34:33. | :34:38. | |
for the better. This is about the NUS or her in particular? Not hurt | :34:39. | :34:44. | |
in particular. Her election enshrined the fact that the NUS no | :34:45. | :34:49. | |
longer represent all students and there are other grievances we have | :34:50. | :34:53. | |
lived with the rest of the organisation, and it is the mixture | :34:54. | :34:56. | |
of those reasons and the culmination that we saw in this conference is | :34:57. | :35:03. | |
why we are campaigning to leave. Looking in, she won it, she got the | :35:04. | :35:08. | |
mandate, more than 50% of the vote, and that is how democracy works. Are | :35:09. | :35:13. | |
you saying, we just don't want that any more, we don't buy into it, or | :35:14. | :35:18. | |
are you saying the NUS doesn't account for at least seven of these | :35:19. | :35:25. | |
universities? I would dispute that she was elected democratically. The | :35:26. | :35:27. | |
only people allowed to vote for the NUS president of the senior | :35:28. | :35:34. | |
delegates. She was elected with I think 372 votes, so 372 people out | :35:35. | :35:40. | |
of 7 million students represented by the NUS voted for her. That isn't a | :35:41. | :35:46. | |
mandate. It is still the process by which the NUS elects its presidents, | :35:47. | :35:52. | |
and she won it. She did, and we are saying that we disagree with that | :35:53. | :35:56. | |
process and we want the elections for the people who represent the | :35:57. | :36:00. | |
entire student body to be opened up to all students. There was a motion | :36:01. | :36:05. | |
on that today which was one member, one vote, and that was defeated. You | :36:06. | :36:10. | |
want to pull yourself away from the NUS for good. What happens when they | :36:11. | :36:14. | |
get their next president and it is somebody that you agree with? Do you | :36:15. | :36:21. | |
opt back in? No, we need to make this clear. We are not seeking to | :36:22. | :36:26. | |
disaffiliate simply because we disagree with this particular | :36:27. | :36:29. | |
president. For the last few years, we have seen an increasing level of | :36:30. | :36:34. | |
things we disagree with, increasing evidence that the organisation can | :36:35. | :36:37. | |
no longer be reformed, and it is the election of this president that is | :36:38. | :36:42. | |
the straw that broke the camel's back. Why do you think there is this | :36:43. | :36:48. | |
shift? A variety of reasons. A lot has to do with the fact that the NUS | :36:49. | :36:54. | |
fails to engage with the student it seeks to represent. In my election, | :36:55. | :37:00. | |
as I was elected as a delegate, only 14% of people eligible to vote in | :37:01. | :37:04. | |
Oxford turned out to vote for me. It is similar across the country. The | :37:05. | :37:10. | |
NUS fails to engage with people, it fails to go beyond the cliques that | :37:11. | :37:15. | |
remit, and we think it should be a broad organisation, an organisation | :37:16. | :37:18. | |
representing all students. We have tried to reform it but they are | :37:19. | :37:21. | |
simply not able to be reformed any more. The NUS knows it has got a | :37:22. | :37:26. | |
right of reply and we are happy to speak to them about this and other | :37:27. | :37:32. | |
issues. Thank you for coming on. Let me take you through the papers. That | :37:33. | :37:37. | |
story is the top of the Times, Oxford threatens to dump student | :37:38. | :37:42. | |
union in anti-Semitism row. The topline alongside that picture of | :37:43. | :37:48. | |
Prince is from Obama, an opinion piece he has written for the Times. | :37:49. | :37:54. | |
The topline is, don't turn away from the EU, Obama tells Britain, anger | :37:55. | :37:59. | |
over President's intervention no doubt will come. The Independent as | :38:00. | :38:04. | |
this silhouette, the black and white Prince with the dates, no words. The | :38:05. | :38:12. | |
Sun has, the Purple Rain is over. Prince dies on Queen's birthday. | :38:13. | :38:16. | |
Something that is hard to miss. The Daily Mail has got the Queen herself | :38:17. | :38:23. | |
with a birthday smile saying, she is loving every -- she is loving every | :38:24. | :38:25. | |
minute. Two years ago we paid our own | :38:26. | :38:27. | |
tribute to the artist formerly known as Prince when he played a gig | :38:28. | :38:30. | |
at Ronnie Scott's nightclub in Soho Newsnight went down to the very long | :38:31. | :38:33. | |
ticket queue to see what a hardcore I'm not doing it. No, it's cool. | :38:34. | :39:04. | |
# I only wanted to be some kind of friend... | :39:05. | :39:10. | |
# Baby, I could never steal you from another | :39:11. | :39:17. | |
# It's such a shame our friendship had to end | :39:18. | :39:27. | |
# Purple rain, purple rain # Purple rain, purple rain I've got | :39:28. | :39:36. | |
a dodgy throat. # Purple rain, purple rain. Purple | :39:37. | :39:44. | |
rain, purple rain. It was a bit less predictable. No. | :39:45. | :39:53. | |
# I only want to see you laughing in the purple rain. | :39:54. | :39:57. | |
Some of us have had lovely print -- spring sunshine and warmth recently | :39:58. | :40:10. | |
but things are set to | :40:11. | :40:12. |