18/05/2016 Victoria Derbyshire

Hello, it's Wednesday, it's 9 o'clock, I'm Victoria Derbyshire,

Our top story today - the government's plans for the next

12 months are set out by the Queen this morning - including an overhaul

of human rights legislation and unprecedented new powers

An inquiry asks whether fear of abuse is preventing professional

sportsmen and women from coming out as gay.

We'll talk to athletes about their decision to be open

And - what's it like to be on board the world's biggest cruise ship -

with its 23 swimming pools and 20 restaurants - we take a look

at the billion dollar Harmony of the Seas ahead of her maiden

Welcome to the programme, we're live until 10.30 this morning,

when we'll bring you coverage of the Queen's Speech.

Do get in touch on all the stories we're talking

about this morning - use the hashtag Victoria LIVE

and If you text, you will be charged at the standard network rate.

Big changes to the prison service will be announced

in the Queen's Speech this morning, expected to include

increases in education programmes for prisoners.

Other bills will include measures on extremism,

an overhaul of human rights law, and changes to speed adoption.

Our political correspondent Carole Walker reports from Westminster.

The Prime Minister says he wants to turn prisons from warehouses

for criminals into places where lives are changed.

The Queen's Speech will include plans for six new reformed prisons,

giving their governors much greater freedom over how they operate

So, in a system where almost half of all inmates reoffend within

a year of release, will the changes make much difference?

I think success over time will be more and more individuals leaving

prison with the skills in order to secure proper employment,

and a determination on their part not to commit crimes again.

It's making sure that people are given a second chance, so that

prisoners turn from liabilities, who cost our

society, into assets, who can contribute to our national life.

So what else will be in the Queen's Speech?

Changes to the care system, with more support

for young people when they leave and efforts to speed up adoption.

A bill to tackle extremism, with measures to stop extremists

working with children and other vulnerable groups.

And a consultation on a British bill of rights to curb the powers of

The Prime Minister wants to show that he does have

a programme to tackle some of the deep-seated

problems of the country, but he knows that with a slim

And the fractured state of the Conservative Party, deeply divided

over the EU referendum, means it will be even

harder to get anything controversial through Parliament.

I think what we'll get this morning is all

the frothy, nice stuff, that appeals to everybody in the country.

And the moment the European referendum is over,

I suspect David Cameron will come in with the ideological,

right-wing stuff that we've had for the last six years of him.

It leaves the public sector strapped for cash, unable to meet

the needs of ordinary, working people in this country,

and it means that we're still missing every single economic target

The glitter and ceremony of the Queen's Speech may herald

a brief respite from the referendum debate, but the Prime Minister knows

his ability to deliver his programme will depend on the result

Our political guru Norman Smith joins us now from Westminster.

What kind of changes might we see the prisons in England and Wales?

The idea is to copy what has been done with screws, to give schools

more independence to decide how they run themselves, so the same thing

with governors, being given greater control over their budgets, they

stick by national contracts, more say over the day-to-day running of

residence. They will be able to shape the rehabilitation regimes,

the visiting hours, the thinking being that governors are best placed

to know what is going to improve their prisons rather than the

government simply telling them. Alongside that there will be an

attempt to encourage greater transparency, so we have a better

idea of what is going on in different prisons. So there will be

lead tables and was and will have to publish how many of their inmates go

on to jobs, how many reoffend, how many are involved in violent

incidents, so people can get a sense of what prisons are doing well, and

which prisons are doing badly. Hope is that might drive up standards in

prisons. The charities involved in rehabilitation of prisoners are by

and large quite supportive, they take the view that the big issue is

prison overcrowding. And unless you address that, you are not really

going to tackle the major problems. They say what you have to look at is

reforms the sentencing, we send too many people to prison who perhaps

haven't done such huge offences, and secondly, automotive is to custody.

Sending people to prisons, often they become embroiled in drug abuse,

they suffer from mental illness, self harm. Prisons are not good

place to be if you want to try and get people back into the mainstream

of society. What else should our audience look out for the day?

Demonstrate is presenting this as Mr Cameron's big social vision, his

attempt to tackle issues which politicians normally shy away from.

There will be stuck around care, trying to help people get into work,

staff around adoption, trying to speed up the whole adoption process,

more measures to crack down on hate preachers Ashgrove stuff around

adoption. I have had of the Queens speech, it is not really a big deal,

it is a bit of a minnow of a Queens speech, and the reason is because of

the hulking EU referendum which overshadows everything Mr Cameron is

doing now. All his political energy is going into that, because it is

the fight of his political life and he loses it, his legacy is

tarnished. It is everything by him. The name of the game for this

Queen's Speech is bluntly, to avoid trouble, aboard bust ups which will

cause even more grief, that is Downing Street's stance. So the

Queen's Speech is stripped of anything controversial or difficult

so it's kind of a Queen's Speech for a quiet life. If David Cameron loses

the EU referendum vote and a majority of voters decide they want

Britain to leave the EU, does that mean all bets are off for this

Queen's Speech, however uncontroversial it is? I suspect if

we vote to leave, this Queen's Speech will simply be overwhelmed by

the titanic challenges we face, of which, who succeeds Mr Cameron is at

the Lesser end of the scale. The bigger end of the scale is what on

earth is our relationship with Europe and the rest of the world, it

is a Titanic moment which makes this Queen's Speech almost irrelevant.

Coverage starts at 10:30 a.m.. Sophie Long is in the BBC Newsroom

with a summary of the rest The charity Age UK says the number

of people aged over 80 who provide It says there are now more

than 400,000 such carers - one in seven of what are called

'the oldest of the old'. Many of our elderly,

say the charity Age UK, are owed The charity claims that a growing

number of unpaid carers are aged over 65, with a substantial

minority in their 80s. The majority, they say, are looking

after partners, the rest caring Age UK's report is based on a review

of official figures. It says that the total number

of carers aged over 65 providing unpaid or informal care has risen

from 1.7 million to 2 million people Meanwhile, the number of carers aged

over 80 has increased by 39%, to over 400,000,

and that 50% of them provide unpaid It is really important

that the Government takes the opportunity,

with its new care strategy, to ask It is a partnership in many ways

between families and the state. At the moment families don't feel

like they are getting the backup from health and social

care services that they need. Britain's ageing population means

that the proportion of older Age UK say today that elderly carers

are already saving the Government They are calling on those

savings to be reinvested in support services,

to ensure that those carers do not suffer exhaustion, illness

or financial strain. In response the Government

has told us that it recognises the valuable contribution

made by older unpaid carers, and asks that they engage with

the Government in discussions over A headline in The Sun newspaper,

that claimed the Queen supports Britain leaving the European Union,

was "inaccurate", the Independent Press Standards

Organisation has ruled. Buckingham Palace

complained after claims were published in March

that the Queen criticised the EU in meetings with the former deputy

prime minister Nick Clegg. The press watchdog found

that the while the article itself did not breach standards,

its headline was The massive wildfires

in Canada's Alberta province have cost the region more than half

a billion pounds in oil sands An economic research organisation

says 1.2 million barrels of oil were lost every day

over two weeks. The oil producers affected

are said to be among the biggest in the world,

but efforts are continuing to get production up and running again

as soon as possible. The fires, around the city

of Fort McMurray, led to tens of thousands

of homes being evacuated. In the US, the two candidates

in the race to be the Democratic Presidential candidate have each

won another primary. while Hillary Clinton has declared

a narrow victory in Kentucky. Mrs Clinton remains the front-runner

to secure the nomination in July. But Mr Sanders again resisted

pressure to drop out of the race, saying he was "in until the last

ballot is cast". The US Republican hopeful,

Donald Trump, has said he's willing to meet the North Korean leader Kim

Jong-un. Mr Trump indicated

he would have talks about Pyongyang's nuclear programme

- saying 'I would have no Such a meeting would mark

a significant change of American policy towards

the politically isolated regime. Train conductors on Southern are

staging a second 24-hour walkout. There are no trains on some routes

and a limited service on others. The strike by the RMT union

began just after midnight and is part of a dispute over

the role of guards. The union opposes a new on-board

supervisor role and plans The operator, Govia Thameslink,

said there would be no job losses or pay cuts

and the action was 'unnecessary'. Talks to resolve differences over

a new contract for junior doctors It's the eighth day of discussions

since the British Medical Association and Department of Health

officials returned to The talks followed a wave of strike

action which saw thousands Do get in touch with us

throughout the morning - use the hashtag Victoria LIVE

and if you text, you will be charged And the English Premier League

season, finally over! Only two and a half months before it starts all

over again. This was the match was abandoned before kick-off on Sunday,

Manchester United beat Bournemouth 3-1, one of the best performances of

their season, a slick move saw Wayne Rooney give them the lead and stop

teenager Marcus Rashford celebrated his England call up with the second

goal. They finished in fifth, good enough to go straight into the Roper

league group stages next season, not really good enough for a club of

that stature. They do have the FA Cup final against Crystal Palace on

Saturday. Woodward in that be enough to keep the manager in the job? I

can only say I have a contract of three years, and I want to fulfil my

contract because the period is not over yet. Are you confident you will

be here next season? Yes, otherwise I'm not the manager anymore. But I

am still the manager. Remember all the fans from around the world who

travelled thousands of miles to Old Trafford, devastated on Sunday that

they would miss the match. One of them was Moses, who had never seen

his team play live and he was due to fly back to Sierra Leone on Monday

but he was at the match last night because Manchester United supporters

trust raised some funds for him to get a later flight. He is now going

back next week, and they have also found him a ticket to the FA Cup

final at! I have worked OK with that. He's an airport security guard

apparently. Liverpool could win the Europa League tonight, they are

facing the winners of the last two years, Sevilla. It is their first

European final in nine years. The bonus for the winners is a place in

next season's Champions' League, probably more important than winning

the trophy. Jurgen Klopp has told his players they can become legends

and says they only to their plans. We know how much they want to win

this cup. They showed us when we played at home, away from home. And

I can promise we will try everything, everything. The problem

is Sevilla will do the same. An open game, we have to play our best and

then we will see. The Wii will be live in Basel just

after ten a.m.. Still one more team to be promoted to the Premier League

next season. It will be either whole or... How made difficult work of a

game but made it through in the end. It was absolutely bonkers down in

Sheffield on Wednesday. -- in Leicester on Wednesday and now they

are being fated in Thailand. Cloud Errani area and his team worked

greeted by jubilant scenes in Bangkok, where they are spending two

days parading the Premier League trophy. It is the party that goes on

and on and on. I will be back in about 20 minutes with the headlines.

Prison reform, combating extremism and a possible increase

to university tuition fees - just some of the things the Queen

is expected to outline on behalf of the government

But as well as being an important day in the political calendar

with the opening of a new session of Parliament, it will also be a day

for a grand display of pomp and splendour, from the moment

Her Majesty arrives in her golden carriage.

And then there's the Sword of State, the Cap of Maintenance

One the most controversial announcements is expected to come

in the form of the Bill of Rights, but what is it?

For more than a decade the Conservatives have been talking

about scrapping the Human Rights Act - a law that came in under

is all about protecting a right to life,

liberty and security, a fair trial and respect

Its aim was to incorporate into UK law the rights contained in the

It meant if you felt your human rights had been breached,

you could hear your case in this country, rather than having to take

it to Europe, to the European Court of Human Rights.

So what's the government's problem with it?

Being bound by the European Convention on Human Rights has led

The UK's ban on prisoners voting,

was judged to have been unlawful, and there was anger over a ruling

that the radical Islamist cleric Abu Qatada shouldn't be deported

to Jordan to face trial on terrorism charges.

The European Court of Human Rights stated that under Article 6

of the European Convention on Human Rights the UK could not

lawfully deport Abu Qatada to Jordan, because of the risk that

evidence would be used which had been obtained by torture.

That was in 2012 - in the end though, Abu Qatada

WAS deported - after the UK and Jordan signed an agreement

preventing any evidence obtained through torture being

The Home Secretary Theresa May said last month,

"the European Convention on Human Rights can bind

Although interestingly it's thought a new bill here WON'T go

as far as pulling out of the European Convention on Human

There are plenty of people who don't think we need

A group of people in the House of Lords last week asked

the government to rethink its plans saying, from what it's seen

of the plans so far, a watered down Bill of Rights

won't actually be that different from the existing

Human Rights Act anyway and it might damage our standing

Meanwhile, some lawyers have argued scrapping the Act would be in breach

of the Good Friday Agreement, a major part of the Northern Ireland

So how could a Bill of Rights differ from the Human Rights Act?

Keelan Gallagher is a human rights Barrister who opposes the Bill

of Rights, Ann Thornber used the Human Rights Act to change

the law after her son's suicide in custody, Martin Howe QC put

together the most recent proposals for the Bill of Rights

and Dr Michael Pinto-Duschinsky is a Holocaust survivor who thinks

the Bill of Rights is nothing more than re-branding exercise.

Welcome all of you. Thank you for coming on the programme.

point having a new act - called a Bill of Rights,

unless Brtiain pulls out of the European Convention on Human

Do explain that clearly for our audience.

The rights themselves, at family life, liberty, freedom of the press,

are not in doubt. They wait to be watered down. The question is, who

has the final say? Should it be judges? Should it be foreign judges

or should it be Parliament? I think the view I hold is that the rights

should be adjudicated by judges but in exceptional circumstances, there

should be a Parliamentary override because we are a Parliamentary

democracy. I don't think we have two pull-out of the European Convention

on human rights. I am confident we can have an agreement on the court

-- with the court in Strasbourg. Where the real problem lies is the

imminent clash with the Court of Justice of the European Union in

Luxembourg and as long as we remain within the European Union, we are

going to find Parliament more and more constrained by this other

court, which hasn't really come into the news. Let me bring in Martin

Howe QC. As I understand it, you have helped to design the proposals

for the British Bill of Rights. Does it still contain protection

of family an private life, a right to life, liberty

and security, a fair trial - why do we need one -

what are the differences between the Human Rights Act

and a British Bill of Rights? We have a longer tradition of

protecting human rights than anywhere else in the world. Last

month was the 800th anniversary of the Magna Carta. That was just the

start of the protection of rights under our law both by actions of

people and actions of Parliament. The abolition of slavery was a

milestone that had to be celebrated. What has happened... I think the

problem with the European Convention, it isn't the convention

itself, that contains a whole series of rights which everyone agrees with

and I think there is no conception of threatening nose. The problem is,

when you come to interpret the scope of rights in marginal cases, where

they come up against other factors, like people's security or the right

to privacy conflicting with the freedom of the press. Do you think

British judges would interpret things differently to European

judges? Yes, they would. This Strasbourg court has developed

prudence over the last 40 or 50 years which has greatly extended or

gone beyond what the convention actually says in a number of areas.

And British judges wouldn't do that with a bill of rights? I think

British judges would be more careful with a Bill of Rights. Why? Because

I think they are much more prone to be cautious when it comes to looking

at the actual wording that Parliament has laid down. Is there

any evidence that British judges are more cautious? Indeed, absolutely

so. Both European courts, both the Strasbourg court which does with

human rights and the Luxembourg court which was just mentioned are

extremely aggressive in the way they extend their interpret and this

creates real conflict with democratic institutions. Let me

bring in and Thornborough. You lost your son Edward Heath years ago. He

was 17 when he took his own life after he was issued with a court

summons for having 50p worth of cannabis. You have since used the

Human Rights Act to change her 17-year-olds are treated in custody.

Tell our audience about that. First and foremost, we were an ordinary

family and if somebody had said to me years ago, you will be on the

Victoria Derbyshire talking about the Human Rights Act I would have

laughed, because I knew nothing about it. We were an ordinary family

leading an ordinary life. I knew nothing about it until we were

affected by our son's life. He went to Cornwall for a week's holiday, as

you rightly say he was arrested for being in possession of the deep

pence worth of cannabis. He was told by Devon and Cornwall police that he

would get a final warning. Through a range of systemic failures by Devon

and Cornwall police, he was issued with a court summons to appear in

court in Cornwall. Not only was he issued with a court summons to

appear in court, he was issued with a summons to appear in an adult

court, and when all the paperwork was given to him, in error by the

Greater Manchester Police, because they issued this to him while he was

17, and neither my husband or I were present, in the bundle of papers

with the two dates for different courts to appear in, what they

sealed envelope to myself and my husband informing us of what had

happened to Edward and that he was to appear in court. We never got

that. Edward was 17, he was very confused, he was told he'd get a

final warning and suddenly he had got to appear either in juvenile

court or the adult court. We knew nothing about it until the next day

when our son went to a local park and hung himself. At that age, at

17, at that time, Edward could not go into a pub and by an alcoholic

drink. He couldn't go to a movie and watch an X-rated film and he

couldn't vote because he wasn't an adult. I was getting child benefit

for my son. Child benefit. Not adult benefit. And yet, he was cheated --

treated as an adult by the police force. 3D Human Rights Act, myself

and my husband and another couple had the law changed so that

17-year-olds, when they are arrested and all in police custody, their

parents must be informed all the 17-year-old must have an appropriate

adult with them. It won't bring my son back but hopefully, through the

change, by the Human Rights Act, 17-year-olds are now better

protected. What I want to say is, we couldn't have done this without the

Human Rights Act. This was the lever for us to get the law changed. The

present government had been talking about changing this anomaly in the

law but they never did anything about it until they had to do it as

the outcome of the judge in the High Court. Do you think a British bill

of rights will replicate the Human Rights Act? I don't think -- I don't

know what the difference would be, in all honesty. It sounds like a

difference anyway judges would interpret it. Let me bring in K

Gallacher. And made such a good point. You don't really know about

the Human Rights Act until you need it. Can you give me some more

examples of where people have used it and whether you think a British

Bill of Rights could be used in the same way? First of all, I worked

with the families of 317-year-old who took their own lives, two sets

of parents of sons and one of a daughter, so at a low point in their

lives they are arrested, given no support that would have been

available to 16-year-olds and younger, and to all three of those

children, we know now that that felt like the end of their lives. They

had no support because their parents weren't brought into the equation

and unfortunately in all of those cases, they could see no way out.

One of the amazing thing is these ordinary families have done is they

have used the Human Rights Act to change the law. There are many other

examples. I work every day with bereaved families who need to use

the Human Rights Act to force the government to give them answers.

Poor example, I have just acted with a bereaved family at the

Hillsborough inquest and though they have the news, what isn't very clear

is that the only reason they got the second inquest is because of the

humans rights act will stop from article two, the right to life.

There is a proud tradition of human rights in this country for many

centuries but unfortunately, it wasn't until we had the Human Rights

Act that actually the old 1990 verdict in the inquests of

accidental death could be challenged effectively by those families and am

and Adrian and ordinary people knew nothing about it until they needed

it. They came together to do a poster campaign so that people here

and here about ordinary stories like that, because really, the people you

mentioned in your opening piece, Abu Qatada, prisoners voting, both of

those are widely misunderstood. They are the cases that hit the headlines

and people misunderstand what it does.

It is of course right that under the Human Rights Act, there is a right

against torture, which applies to everyone, including unpopular

people. It is wrong to say that the European Court of Human Rights

stopped Abu Qatada being deported or that the Human Rights Act stop him

being deported. He was deported as soon as Jordan gave a guarantee they

would not rather than evidence obtained through torture. It was

entirely right and possible to do it. In terms of a British Bill of

Rights if it replaces the Human Rights Act, presumably there will be

the right not to be tortured? Indeed. So the same thing might have

happened with Abu Qatada. There is a difference there because the problem

in his case was that his deportation was held up for years by continuous

changing of the goalposts by the Strasbourg courts. That decision

departed from previous Strasbourg court decisions. The issue there was

not to do with him being at risk of torture, it was to do with the

judicial process in Jordan and the safeguards there. Never before had

the Strasbourg court said that was a barrier against deportation and

suddenly changed. I think there is a misunderstanding from what has been

said on the screen and also by Martin because the suggestion is

that somehow the European Court of Human Rights, because of the Human

Rights Act, it undermines parliamentary sovereignty and UK

courts don't get to have the final say, and that's simply not right.

Under the Human Rights Act, UK courts do have the final say. One of

the things people find confusing is that first of all, as was said on

the screen, what we may be getting is a rebranding exercise which won't

make a difference. If it is to make a difference, the fact that and

relied on is the kind of right which would be undermined. A final word

from you are disagreeing that British judges have the final say?

Actually, that last remark was incorrect. But when Strasberg rules

according to our agreement with Strasbourg, it has the final say and

not Parliament. Because we are obliged to implement the Strasbourg

ruling. I am very much in favour of the Strasbourg judges in 99% of the

cases, I have very warm feelings towards them. But in the exceptional

case, Parliament must be allowed to have the final say. I'm going to

stop you there. I just want to say that the Human Rights Act has had a

lot of adverse publicity. Will talk about Abu Qatada, the right of

prisoners to vote but what people need to realise is that human rights

are there for everybody, for Joe Public and ordinary people like

myself, and we never know when we might need it. Let's keep the right

to read and remove the abuses. Thank you so much.

It looks like I'm standing in the gardens! No, I am on-board Harmony

of the Seas. She is big and heavy! She is long, more than three and a

half football pitches long. We are about to talk to the big boss, the

captain of the ship and find out what it's like to be in charge of

the world's biggest cruise ship. Also, looking at whether you would

be better or worse off if we voted to leave the EU.

It is thought a new Bill of Rights won't go as far as pulling out of

the European Convention on Human Rights. There will also be measures

on prison reform. A headline in The Sun newspaper,

that claimed the Queen supports Britain leaving the European Union,

was "inaccurate", the Independent Press Standards

Organisation has ruled. Buckingham Palace

complained after claims were published in March

that the Queen criticised the EU in meetings with the former deputy

prime minister Nick Clegg. The press watchdog found

that the while the article itself did not breach standards,

its headline was It's claimed there's been a steep

rise in the number of people aged over 80 in the UK

who are acting as carers. The Charity Age UK suggests that

numbers have increased by nearly 40 per cent in the last seven years,

to more than four hundred thousand. Talks to resolve differences over

a new contract for junior doctors It's the eighth day of discussions

since the British Medical Association and Department of Health

officials returned to The talks followed a wave of strike

action which saw thousands The dispute is over pay and weekend

hours. Train conductors on Southern are

staging a second 24-hour walkout. There are no trains on some routes

and a limited service on others. The strike by the RMT union

began just after midnight and is part of a dispute over

the role of guards. The union opposes a new on-board

supervisor role and plans The operator, Govia Thameslink,

said there would be no job losses or pay cuts

and the action was 'unnecessary'. More from me at ten a.m.. Now the

sport. The Premier League season is finally over, Manchester United beat

Bournemouth 3-1 last night in their rearranged match. Sunday's picture

was abandoned because of the bomb scare. Marcus Rashford scored the

second. They finished fifth in the table, good enough to go straight

into the euro per league group stages next season. Liverpool could

win that competition tonight, they are facing the winners from the past

two seasons, Sevilla. It is Liverpool's first European final in

nine years. The Championship play-off final will be between Hull

City and Sheffield Wednesday. Hull City lost 2-0 last night to Derby

County but made it 3-2 on aggregate. Maria Sharapova is in London for her

doping test. She can expect a suspension of up to 12 months. Five

more medals at the European swimming the big ships at London's aquatic

centre last night. I am back with that in Switzerland

just after ten. It's got 23 swimming pools,

20 restaurants and can hold up Harmony of the Seas

is the world's newest It will be based in

the Mediterranean during the summer Aaron Heslehurst is in Southampton

where she's berthed. Look at you with your funky glasses

on! You think we would be in the Caribbean! You have to send to

Southampton! It is bucketing by the way. This is a monster, to me six

hours to find this location this morning, I was lost on the ship, 24

innovators stop it doesn't look like I'm am on-board the world's biggest

cruise ship but believe you me, I am. 10,500 plants, 52 trees. 11,500

pieces of artwork. The numbers are staggering. You add that number of

passengers to 2100 Crew, you talking about a ship out at sea with nearly

9000 people on board. She is heavy, 227,000 tonnes. I did my mouth, it's

15,133 double-decker buses. I put along something we put together

earlier so you can have a look around the world's biggest cruise

ship. I've got about a minute to show

you some of the top features There's pools, there's jacuzzis,

there's water slides. You can even go

surfing on this ship. Now, the ship's not for everybody,

but I tell you what, if you like a little crazy golf,

it is on-board. Now, at the back of the ship

there is a monstrous slide. You see, I told you it was

a monstrous slide, quite literally. This thing takes you down from deck

17 to deck six in 12 seconds. Still doing some finishing touches

before she sets sail on her maiden voyage,

but you know there are 20 different You have got everything from fine

dining to buffets to, well, Mexican You've got burger joints,

you've got cafes, you've even got Yes, Jamie Oliver's restaurant

on this ship. Well, you're not going to go thirsty

on the world's biggest cruise ship. Oh, and of course, a good journalist

in the name of research, it has to be done, and this one,

you don't even have That is the tour on the world's

biggest cruise ship. It's time for me to settle

down in my state room. There are 2747 of them on-board

the ship and for me, See? A lot of research done! Let me

introduce Gus Anderson, the captain of the ship. You are Swedish. You

really look at this ship and say... Fantastic! How do you get to be

captain? You put in a knot of tickets! I have been at Sever 27

years and the last 15 with Royal Caribbean. I have been stepping up

on the different classes of ships and the last five years I have been

captain with Royal. Royal Caribbean, this is their sixth largest... The

sixth largest ship in the world. Do people really want this? 9000 people

at sea, do you really want to be on board ship like this? Absolutely. We

have a lot of demand for ships like this and if we didn't, we wouldn't

be building them. Some other competitors are building a lot of

ships. It is a big growing industry, going on cruises. What you do with

unruly passengers? Looks up, throw away the key! Not overboard! Family

people have you wait? Two. Being captain of the world's biggest

cruise ship, does that reflect in the pay packet? No, it disappears to

my wife just as fast. People will be surprised that when you are sailing

this ship and steering you are using a little file, and mouse? Yes, like

a little joystick, to control the autopilot, it's about two inches

high. That's it. We were talking later on! Thank you. Just to let you

know, people retire at cyclic costs you've $3500 for assisted living,

monthly rent on land, you can do it on CD for about $3000 a month. I

would hate to be at huge ship I think!

Have you decided how you're going to vote in the Referendum

on whether the UK should remain or leave the European Union?

Most people seem to have made up their mind -

if you haven't, you have five weeks to decide.

Every week in the run up to the big day we're looking at various issues

One of the main questions is - would you be better off or worse off

Stronger In, the official campaign to remain in the EU argues: Almost

one million UK jobs would be lost by leaving the EU.

The Treasury says the economy would shrink by 6% by

2030, the equivalent to ?4300 per household.

leading to ?36 billion shortfall in finances.

Quite a few people didn't question the maths behind that figure

To counter act that, the official campaign

to leave the EU, Vote Leave, says the EU costs us

The UK Statistics Authority says that figure is 'potentially

misleading' because it doesn't take into account the money Britain gets

back in the form of a rebate, grants for farmers and poorer

According to Vote Leave we spend 60 times more money

on Brussels than we spend on our NHS Cancer Drugs Fund.

Vote Leave also say that over half our laws are made by unelected

officials in Brussels - costing British tax payers

We now speak to the former Business Secretary Sir Vince Cable

who is campaigning to remain in the EU and James Cleverly,

Conservative MP for Braintree who is campaigning to leave.

Welcome, both of you. Why do you say how audience would be better off

debate to stay in the EU? In terms of the boat -- the comments you have

just made, and the large amounts of jobs, I spent five years dealing

with huge companies in Britain and these companies, American, German,

Japanese, the rest of it, they all told me that they invested their

money in the UK, creating large numbers of jobs both to the supply

companies and themselves, partly because they liked Britain and

thought we were a good place to be, but also because they have

unrestricted access to operate within the European Union and the

single market. They worry that if we left, those arrangements would be

put at risk. Some of them are saying they would run down their activities

and some are not. There are a lot of livelihoods at stake. Why would

people watching be better off if they vote to leave? Britain has

always been a trading nation. We have always traded successfully with

the whole world. The new countries are some of the slowest growing

countries in the world and we could and should be doing business

globally with all these fast growth economies but we are limited in our

ability to do that because of our membership of the year. If we want

to trade with the world, we would be better off as a country. Vince

Cable, if we stay in, how do we control immigration? The reason I am

asking that is because in the interests of posterity, when

immigration increases the working age population by 1%, that decreases

the wages of the lowest percent by one point 6%. The migration we had

from the European Union when I was in post was good for the economy and

didn't affect the wages of people here. Most of the people coming, the

young people who come to work, they pay tax, make very little use of

services and there is a very big contribution to the economy. Stuart

Rose, who everyone knows is the ex-boss of Marks Spencer 's, said

wages would rise if we left the EEA you. I would dispute that and one of

the almost certain consequences which mark Carney has been warning

us of is that if we did leave, there would be a lot of uncertainty.

Nobody in the business world would know what would happen for several

years and under those conditions, we are more likely to get a recession

and in a recession, a slowdown in the economy or a falling economy,

actually people's wages were dropped and that is a risk. James cleverly,

we mention the governor of the Bank of England, he has said that this

could drive up the cost of your mortgage if we leave the EU. It is

interesting saying that the heads of big business are saying one thing

and we should listen to them... This is the Governor of the Bank of

England. Yes, but you say Stuart Rose said leaving be you would help

with wages, and we are saying we should ignore that. One of the

things that strikes me is that these big institutions with our would-be

terrible to legally you are the same institutions who told us it would be

catastrophic for the economy if we didn't join the year row and the it

now. But some of them aren't. On peoples mortgages, the governor of

the Bank of England said leaving the EU could drive up the cost of your

mortgage. I don't agree. So when it suits you, you don't agree? One of

many multinationals... This is the bank of England. The bank of England

is an important institution but it has got its prediction spectacularly

wrong over and over again. That is fine if they have but why are your

predictions right? I am not making predictions. No, you said people

would be better off if we stayed in the EU -- if we left the EU. No,

what I said was that we have been our most economically successful

when independent. I cannot predict the future and neither can anyone

else. On that point, Vince Cable, it is really hard for anybody to give

fact because no one is able to do that. Because none of us know what

the future holds. We are having to make judgments. To take your point

about mortgages, why the Governor of the Bank of England said that, there

is an expectation in the city when dealing with foreign exchange that

one of the consequences of leaving is that the sterling exchange rate

would fall. In other words, you would get less year rose or dollars

for your sterling. That would push up the prices in the shops and in

order to stop that happening, the Governor of the Bank of England puts

up interest rates, meaning mortgages cost more. That was the logic he was

explaining. Not true, you say? You can't have it both ways. We are

saying Brexit would push down the value of sterling, and if that was

the case it would make UK exports cheaper and we would be better at

trading with the world. You can't have it both ways. Also, if interest

rates which have been at a record late -- a record low rate for a long

time, it is going to happen that interest rates will creep up. Many

of your viewers who are savers who have been getting nothing would find

they get more interest on their savings which they can then spend in

the shops. You can't have it both ways. You can't say are depressed

sterling is bad news when it can be good news.

And you are very welcome to take part in one of our big TV audience

In the first of all the TV debates, we're live in Glasgow on the 26th

If that's you and you can get to Glasgow from wherever

you are in the UK, do

email [email protected] to have your chance to quiz senior

politicians from the Leave and Remain campaigns.

The debate will be broadcast live on BBC One at 8pm.

And on the 6th June, we're in Manchester for another debate

It's open to everyone and will take place in our normal airtime

The latest figures show that unemployment has fallen a little bit

but there is evidence that the job market could be cooling off. We will

speak to Stephen Crabb in just a minute but first, Ben Thompson.

There is not a huge amount to get up site -- excited about at the moment.

The headline rate is staying stubbornly at 5.1%. The number of

people out of work fell by 2000 in the first three months of the year.

The bit we can get a little bit excited about is that earnings still

aren't rising very quickly. None of us have had pay rises in a very long

time. They are going up by 2.1%, not as quick as many expected. They

thought it would raise more quickly. We would have more money in our

pockets. Yesterday, we had inflation figures and inflation gives us an

idea of how quickly prices are rising. We want to be in a position

where prices are rising slowly and inflation is going up so that we

have more money in our pockets. That is one of the concerns. I keep very

much, Ben. Let's speak now to Stephen Crabb,

the Minister for Work and Pensions. How do you react to this fall in

figures? These are very in Courage Inc. It has been a challenging start

to the year with turbulence at the start of the year and people web

addicting we would see an increase in unemployment again, so seeing

that it is continuing to fall with record rates of people in

employment, that is really encouraging and we will take that,

thank you. It doesn't continue to fall. Last year -- last month we saw

that it raised by 20 1000. It has dropped 2000 by then. I said last

month that you can't take a single month as a snapshot of the trend.

Today's figures demonstrate that the UK continues to generate new jobs

and we are in a relatively healthy position. We are not complacent

about what the challenges are and as unemployment continues to fall, what

you are left with are people who are unemployed but a greater proportion

of them have got serious barriers to work. People sometimes with drug

addiction, alcoholism is, mental health barriers, so we need to work

to get people into work. There has been a lot of healthy movement in

the labour market over the last few years and certain parts of the

country have got almost full employment. We are not complacent.

There are still 750,000 unemployed people who could be getting jobs at

the moment, as the opportunities are there. We need to help them. Where

have we got zero unemployment? There are parts of England with very high

employment rates and when I travel around the country, one of the

common themes I get, particularly in the south-east, is that we need more

workers. There isn't a readily available pool of accessible labour

to fill the jobs which are created. That is one of the reasons we see an

increase in the number of foreign workers who come to the country

because the ECB economy -- the EU economy does have its shortages.

Last month, you told us you thought uncertainty linked to the EU

referendum could potentially be putting companies off

How angry are your side with Boris Johnson after he accused David

Cameron of collusion with big business? We are in a heated part of

the campaign. This is getting nasty between you and your colleagues. The

rhetoric is not healthy and doesn't add to the debate and a lot of the

people who have not yet made up their mind about what they think of

our membership log term of the European Union are looking for

high-quality debate. It is incumbent on those on both sides of the

argument to choose their words carefully and raise the tone of the

debate, drag it down. Thank you very much, Mr Crabb. Coming up now, the

weather. Wherever you are today, take your brolly. It is going to be

wet. Many of us are looking at heavy rain or heavy showers. This picture

belies the point. This is Herefordshire. Birds sitting in the

rain. You can see how wet the paving slabs are in Kettering. This one

really tells its own story from Nottinghamshire. A wet start to the

day for many areas. The rain will still be happy for a time, followed

by heavy showers. It is going to be wet and you will notice the showers

this afternoon will be slow-moving, some will be torrential and indeed

there will be some hail and thunder invented within them as well. This

is what has happened this morning. Bands of way moving -- rain moving

west to east. Surface water and spray on the roads as a result of

this. Followed by a lot of showers. The rain in the West of Scotland

continuing to edge northwards but the worst of the rain today will be

in the West, particularly in northern Ireland. -- the best of the

weather today will be in the West. It will still be some showers

around, with low cloud around the Murray that area as well. As we come

into northern England, it we are looking at some Sunnis files, but

with -- some sunny spells, but with heavy showers moving slowly and not

far away. For south-west England and for Wales, brighter skies this

afternoon, but still just a view showers here and there. Through the

evening and into the overnight period, most of the showers will

fade. However, we hang onto sun across northern Scotland and also

some patchy mist and fog. For England and Wales, we also see low

cloud developed and still some patchy mist and fog as well. Where

the cloud breaks, perhaps in the north-west, you might get lucky and

see the odd pocket of frost -- unlucky. The next Weatherford comes

from the Atlantic introducing quite a lot of rain across Northern

Ireland initially, getting into north-west England and the

south-west the date continues. Very dry for much of the day with

temperatures up to 20 degrees for parts, and as we head on free

Thursday evening, that rain eventually gets over to the east, so

the rush-hour will be fairly easy -- fairly wet. As we move from Thursday

into Friday, a lot of dry weather to start the day, showers in Northern

Ireland and England, some going into Wales, with temperatures up to 20.

Good morning. It is Wednesday, ten a.m., welcome to the programme.

Our top story today - the government's plans for the next

twelve months are set out by the Queen this morning -

including an overhaul of human rights legislation

and unprecedented new powers for prison governors

There are hardly any professional sportsmen and women

Is it because they fear homophobia from the fans

Here is what Tom Bosworth told me. In sport, I don't think being gay is

still a normal thing. Here's Sophie Long in the BBC

Newsroom with a summary of the news. The Queen will set out

the government's plans In an address to

Parliament this morning. They're expected to include plans

for a British Bill of Rights - though it's thought a new bill

WON'T go as far as pulling out of the European Convention

on Human Rights. There'll also be measures

on prison reform. A headline in The Sun newspaper,

that claimed the Queen supports Britain leaving the European Union,

was "inaccurate", the Independent Press Standards

Organisation has ruled. The press watchdog found

that the while the article itself did not breach standards,

its headline was There been another slight fall in

unemployment, dropped by 2000 to 1.69 million between January and

March. The ONS said the of people in work is at a record high of 74.2%.

The Work And Pensions Secretary told the programme it was welcome news.

It has been telling the start of the year with lots of turbulence in

global markets and had been eating we would see unemployed increase, so

seeing an opponent continues to fall and we still have record rates of

employment, people going out to work every day across the UK, that's

encouraging and we will take that, thank you.

The charity Age UK says there's been a steep rise in the number of people

aged over 80 who are acting as unpaid carers.

A study by the charity suggests that numbers have increased by nearly 40

per cent in the last seven years, to more than 400,000.

Most are supporting a spouse but others are looking after children.

Age UK wants the government to do more to support them.

Train conductors on Southern are staging a second 24-hour walkout.

There are no trains on some routes and a limited service on others.

The strike by the RMT union began just after midnight

and is part of a dispute over the role of guards.

The union opposes a new on-board supervisor role and plans

The operator, Govia Thameslink, said there would be no job losses

or pay cuts and called the action 'unnecessary'.

Talks to resolve differences over a new contract for junior doctors

It's the eighth day of discussions since the British Medical

Association and Department of Health officials returned to

The talks followed a wave of strike action which saw thousands

We are looking ahead to Europa League final for Liverpool. They

finished eighth in the Premier League but if they win tonight

against Sevilla, they will get a place in the Champions' League next

season. Let's cross live to lace macro in Switzerland. It has been

much maligned down the years, the Europa League, but it feels like a

big deal, just a shame that the stadium isn't a lot bigger problem

is Liverpool fans. Yes, good morning, the Liverpool fans have

started gathering here, it's going to be the main Liverpool fans's

meeting point in the middle of Basel, it's a small city, that

stadium just two miles from here has a capacity of just over 30 8000.

There were only be around 11,000 Liverpool fans inside the stadium,

only 7000 Sevilla fans, are very small stadium for a game of this

magnitude. Fans are being urged to come here to the centre of the town,

they have erected a big screen, they are gathering in the middle of town.

They are urged to stay here and not travel towards the stadium.

Checkpoints between here and the stadium, we remember the events in

Paris in November, things are serious in terms of security, fans

are being urged to stay in the centre of town if they don't have a

ticket. Liverpool are favourites but Sevilla have become experts in this

competition. Liverpool haven't had a great season, they go in their

finishing eighth in the league. They've already lost one cup final

this season. Jurgen Klopp has lost four of his last five finals,

including the League Cup earlier this season but Sevilla haven't had

a great season, they finished seventh in La Liga. For both teams,

huge magnitude, a place in the Champions' League. The Sevilla coach

said, one game to put yourself in the Champions' League doesn't come

along very often and you have to take it. Jurgen Klopp has urged his

players to go out and enjoy the experience, we know what a relaxed

character he is. He has told the fans, stay in Basel, it's a

beautiful town, enjoyed the experience. The police chief is

saying the same post he expects 40,000 fans will be in town but is

confident the police can handle 100,000 if they were here. If you do

run the game and put themselves in the Champions' League next season,

this place will erupt. It looks lovely there! The Premier League

season is over, this was the match abandoned before kick-off because of

the fake bomb scare on Sunday, Manchester United beat Bournemouth

3-1 last night, one of their best performances of the season. A slick

move so rarely given the lead and Rashford celebrated his England call

up with the second goal. They finished fifth, good enough to go

straight into the Europa League group stages next season. One

wanting to be promoted to the Premier League, Sheffield Wednesday

and Hull City will contest the play-off final at Wembley -- one

more team. Hull City was 3-0 up from the first leg but lost 2-0 last

night, but they went through on aggregate 3-2. That's all your

sport. The Queen will start speaking at

around half past 11, David Cameron has left Downing Street to make his

way there. Let's get more from Norman Smith. What is likely to be

in the Queens speech? An awful lot but at the same time, not much.

Basically, the Queen's Speech will be stuffed full of little bits and

pieces which aren't really that controversial, and aren't really

that large. Downing Street is visiting it as Mr Cameron's social

agenda, so they will be measures on prisons, they will be given more

independent, governors will have more powers to run their own budgets

and regimes, they will be stuff around the care system to provide

more support for people moving out of care, bits and pieces around

adoption to try and speed that up. But by and large, it's quite a light

Queen's Speech, and the reason for that frankly is that great big, dark

cloud hanging over Mr Cameron, the EU referendum, which means this

whole Queen's Speech has had to be gutted, frankly, that anything which

might stir up any more trouble over Europe. It's almost a first today,

there or tidying up today, we can see some of the ceremonial people

wandering in, even before it kicks off, the Queen's Speech is being

attacked by Brexiteers like Iain Duncan Smith, who has already

launched into it saying Mr Cameron has dropped key bits of legislation

because he is so desperate to get this EU referendum through. He

doesn't want any trouble, you just wants to get the referendum through.

You have the sense that today is almost part of the referendum story,

which is totally dominating all politics. And in part, it's become a

tussle between two men, between David Cameron and Boris Johnson, it

has become personalised around these two figures, in particular following

that extraordinary attack is today by Michael Russell time on Boris

Johnson, we suggested, given some of his remarks about Hitler and

suggesting that interventions by President Obama were Downing Street

hostage videos, Michael Heseltine said he didn't think he was fit to

be Prime Minister or lead the party. This morning Boris Johnson emerged

from his house to be challenged about Michael Heseltine's comments.

The most important thing is that everybody should cut out the

synthetic outrage about things I haven't said and stick to the facts,

which are the EU is now producing 60% of the law made in this country,

it is changed out of all recognition from what we signed up to in 1972,

making it impossible for us to control our borders. The only safe

option is to vote leave on June 23 and I'm sorry, I must go now. Can I

ask you cookie about what you said about Lord Heseltine's comments? We

have a short time for the public to get the facts, the EU basically

determines 60% of the laws in this country, it is costing ?350 million

a week, it is evolving into something completely unlike what we

signed up for in 1972 and becoming more and more like a federal

superstate which we will inevitably be comprised if we stay in. The

reason that Downing Street sent Michael Heseltine out to the bad

Boris Johnson was because there is real anger at Boris Johnson, not

just for his decision to support the Brexit campaign but because of the

things he is saying, the tone of his remarks and I think they sent

Michael Heseltine down to basically cut him off at the knees. But more

than that, I think they fear Boris Dunston. When you see him out on the

stump in towns, just doing his patter, he gets people going, and if

one person can swing this whole referendum campaign the way of the

Brexit campaign, it's Boris Johnson. So they are desperate to try and

take him out. Albeit that his style and his remarks are clearly causing

difficulty for his own side. Have a listen to Chris Grayling, another

sit here this morning, when he was challenged about Boris Johnson --

another Brexiteer. Boris was making historians can he is a historian...

What the European Union is trying to do... I'm asking you if he was right

to do so. Can we clear this up and then move on, was he right to draw

that comparison? Was a right for a historian to make a historian 's

comments? I'm asking you whether Boris Johnson, who is a politician

first, I very senior politician, was he right to draw a comparison

between the European Union and Adolf Hitler? As I said, he was making a

historian's comment about history. It seems to me that everything is

now totally overshadowed by this EU referendum, even this Queen's

Speech. Mr Cameron is having to devote all his energy and effort to

winning this referendum, it is a battle to his survival, for his

legacy. He believes it's a battle for the future of this country. The

Queen's Speech, which is normally a hugely significant day in which

shapes the course of the next 12 months for government, is almost

secondary now to this battle. Come June 23, if we vote to leave the EU,

no one will remember what was in this Queen's Speech, because we will

be into a totally new era where nobody knows what is going to

happen. He is right, thank you, Norman.

On this programme last year in an exclusive interview,

British Olympic hopeful Tom Bosworth came out as gay.

He told us he didn't want his preparations for this

summer's Games in Rio being overshadowed

He's one of only two British track and field athletes to come out.

Now the government's Culture, Media and Sport committee has begun

an inquiry into why so few professional sportsmen and women

feel comfortable talking openly about their sexuality.

Here's what Tom Bosworth told me about how unusal it still is for gay

In sport, I The don't think being gay is

I don't think I have an answer to that, because...

In most other things, now, it's very normal

to have a gay colleague, teachers, anything, any

sort of line of work, it's very common to be open.

I'm just trying to explore this with you.

Is it something to do with some kind of macho competitive culture,

In sport, you've got to succeed, you've got to look strong.

Individually, in athletics, you're out there on your own,

so any sort of weakness that people might be able to use...

And for me, it's not a weakness but some people might see it

like that, and so they don't want to be attacked,

think that they might be attacked for it or somebody might

use it against them, and that's a shame if they worry

I've had some negativity from a few athletes in the past,

a long time ago now, and they crop up occasionally,

I guess, cos not everybody sees the world through my eyes and

I got called some really nasty names...

Well, they wouldn't call me by my name, so they'd literally

There's plenty more you can go through, and that's how they would

direct a conversation to me, and they would find themselves

Let's talk to Matt Lister - he's a Team GB Canoe Slalom Athlete

and LGBT Ambassador for the British Athletes Commission,

Sophie Cook is the club photographer for AFC Bournemouth -

she's the first trans person to work in the Premier League

and John Nicolson is an SNP MP and a member of the Culture,

He pushed the Committee to take on the inquiry into

He's giving evidence to the inquiry today, mainly on the culture

why did you push for this enquiry? I think this was highlighted when

Tyson theory was put into his -- into the BBC's sports personality of

the year short list. He is a man who said he wanted to break his wife's

jaw and he wanted gay people to be shot. I thought that was the

horrendous decision. I said to my colleagues, I think the BBC has a

problem with this, I think society has a problem with this, let's have

an enquiry. Sophie, tell that your experience? Before I came out, I was

terrified I would lose my job and get abuse from the fans. The reality

is at haven't that at all. I have had this amazing outpouring of love

and support from the fans and as we were about to kick off against man

city recently, a woman ran down from the back of the fans to tell me I

look amazing. People have been shaking my hand, saying, good on

you, I'm really glad you're happy. Happy you had any abuse? There have

been a few little incidents, mainly from kids who don't know better. But

it is not football's problem. It is society's problem. If there is

bigotry in society, it will be inside football. All season, I have

had four or five incidents but last year at Brighton's pride, I had ten

incidents in two days. Matt, what is your view about why there are so few

out professional sportsmen and women? I think a game, echoing what

Sophie has both, it is a problem within society, say footballers and

other athletes, not so much within my sport because we are not as high

profile, but within high profile, it can very much effect the way you

think about your training, the way you focus on the course or the

pitch. You don't want to be distracted from what the overall job

is. You are aiming for the gold medal, the number one spot, and you

do your best to make sure that is your focus. The do you think

football and sport lags behind society in general? I think that is

the principal problem. I am a gay man and I sit in Parliament and I

never get any abuse. Long before I was there, Parliament passed close

28. Imagine that happening now? My own parlay -- my own party is the

gayest party in parliament anywhere in the world. What is it about sport

that lags so far behind sport, politics? Let's ask Tony. You have

done research on this? We have found a decrease in attitudes of

homophobia, so if you think of the high homophobic period of the 1980s

through to now, suggesting that only one fifth of people have homophobic

attitudes, I find the same thing in the culture of football. Fans who go

to matches, in gauging discussions online and also media journalist,

and I find a change in circumstances. The culture in

football is not as bad as it was in 1990 when Justin Fashanu came out.

Do you think it is only a matter of time before a British footballer

comes out in the top echelons of the Premier League? The youngest Premier

League or the Scottish Premier League? I think there are Premier

League players who have come out. Unfortunately after retirement. I

meant was still playing. I think the role of the agents, clubs, support

to the players, the professional footballers Association, what is put

in place by the FA, because probably there are a number of sportsmen and

women who want to come out but don't have the confidence to do so. I

think the question needs to be asked to make it a more supportive

environment for those who want to come out. Sophie, was there much

support internally from your club? The club was amazing. They have

treated me exactly the same as I was before which really when you come

out is all you can ask for. And you were worried you wouldn't be going

back to your job as photographer once he came out? I was terrified. I

stood on the pitch at Charlton athletic when we were crowned

champions last year terrified it would be my last ever day with the

club and everyone has been wonderful. The player have been

wonderful. The culture for the players and sport, there is a thirst

for this. There is a first to make it right. The reason that this

matters is because we know that young gay men are the largest group

of suicides in the country. They must ask themselves when they are

being bullied in the playground and feeling desperate, if rich

successful footballers can't come out, what hope is there for me and

that is why it is important that we have role models coming out and

normalising the process of coming out so that kids feel they can go to

their teachers, stand up for themselves and say that the bullies

realise it is no longer acceptable because there he rose are openly

gay. What do you think about that, Matt? This idea that if people such

as Olympians or a professional footballer will really have an

impact on young adults? I totally agree. I have done some work with

the Stonewall support programme and I have talked to kids and the first

thing you say is, high, my name is Matt Lister, I am a Team GB person

and you hear them snigger. And you say, I am the world bonds medallist

-- bronze medallist and you see a view faces lean forward. -- my name

is Matt Lister and I am a gay Team GB person. It changes the perception

of what it is to be gay. People see it through the eyes of the bullies

because that is what they see in school. We have talked a lot about

football but I will ask this question. The argument always goes,

if a footballer in the Premier League came out, the abuse from

opposition fans in particular and possibly even home supporters would

be awful for them. Do any of us actually think it would be horrific

now in Britain in 2016? No. I don't either. I'm glad you think that

because people are fundamentally decent and kind. Everyone has a gay

cousin or brother or friend. They know gay people. Society has changed

and sport have got to grow up. Look at Tom Daley. Tom Daley came out and

his fan base has increased. We teenage girls still have pictures of

him on their walls and I understand his sponsorship has increased. There

could be financial implications is something that has been said before

but that has been disproved as well. Jamie, let me ask you about, I don't

know if you have done research into this, team-mates. If they Premier

League player came out, how would team-mates react? There have been

footballers who have gone on record to say they would support openly gay

team-mates. There must be footballers who are out to their

team-mates who are not out publicly. The culture of football and sport is

improving. There is still progress to be made. We have really improved

since the 1990s. What would you say regarding the abuse week in week

out, Sophie? The point is that people are inherently decent.

Players get abuse anyway from the opposition fans and their home fans.

That will not be any worse that they are gay. Their team-mates would be

so supportive because to be a professional footballer, you have

got to be a very focused, very committed person and inherently,

these are all very good men. I have got a lot of respect for them. We

have got to remember it is not just football. In the Olympic Games there

were only 23 out athletes out of thousands. It is a problem across

sport. It is a problem in rugby, cricket and elsewhere. I will ask

you about your colleague, Angus MacNeil... He is not gay. No, it is

whether he has been using tax payers funding to stay in a hotel in

London, has he done anything wrong? Do you know what the rules are as

Jamaat if you do, you will know that is cheaper for the taxpayer if you

stay in a hotel that went a flat. It is not a story. Thank you all very

much. Have a good day.