Browse content similar to 01/03/2017. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Hello. It's Wednesday. | :00:00. | :00:07. | |
I'm Victoria Derbyshire, welcome to the programme. | :00:08. | :00:13. | |
This morning, we'll hear about a so-called wonder drug | :00:14. | :00:18. | |
for Hepatitis C and claims that a charity that tried to force | :00:19. | :00:21. | |
the NHS to buy more of it received large amounts of money | :00:22. | :00:23. | |
The pills are 95% effective at curing the disease | :00:24. | :00:27. | |
You can't put a price on your life, can you? | :00:28. | :00:35. | |
REPORTER: You don't know if it is going to work. I couldn't go on like | :00:36. | :00:37. | |
I was so I had to make a decision. So why isn't it more widely | :00:38. | :00:42. | |
available on the NHS? We'll bring you that full | :00:43. | :00:44. | |
exclusive report shortly. If you live with Hep C | :00:45. | :00:46. | |
do get in touch. And give us an insight into what it | :00:47. | :00:49. | |
is like to live with it. Also on the programme, | :00:50. | :00:54. | |
tough new rules for motorists caught We'll speak to a woman who, | :00:55. | :00:56. | |
in an emotional meeting, met the man who killed her boyfriend | :00:57. | :01:01. | |
whilst driving on his phone. What would you say to somebody who | :01:02. | :01:09. | |
is going to pick up their phone behind the wheel today without even | :01:10. | :01:13. | |
thinking about it? Don't do it because picking up a | :01:14. | :01:20. | |
phone, no matter how nice you are or good you are, accidents like this | :01:21. | :01:24. | |
can happen to anyone on the road by using a phone. | :01:25. | :01:30. | |
And a test which is almost 100% accurate in telling mums to be | :01:31. | :01:33. | |
whether the child they're carrying has down's syndrome is being made | :01:34. | :01:36. | |
This morning there are yet more warnings it | :01:37. | :01:39. | |
could lead to an increase in the number of abortions. | :01:40. | :01:42. | |
Hello and welcome to the programme. We're live until 11am. | :01:43. | :01:54. | |
Throughout the morning, we'll bring you the latest breaking news | :01:55. | :01:57. | |
A little later in the programme we'll ask what's going on with Ukip | :01:58. | :02:04. | |
and hopefully speak to Nigel Farage who is annoyed that his only MP | :02:05. | :02:07. | |
allegedly tried to block him getting a knighthood. | :02:08. | :02:10. | |
Should Mr Farage get a knighthood? Tell me what you think. | :02:11. | :02:15. | |
Our top story today, drivers caught using their phone | :02:16. | :02:17. | |
behind the wheel will now face tougher punishments. | :02:18. | :02:19. | |
Fines in England, Wales and Scotland will double to ?200 | :02:20. | :02:21. | |
and offenders will get six points on their licence. | :02:22. | :02:24. | |
It will mean newly qualified drivers with less than two years on the road | :02:25. | :02:27. | |
face losing their licence if they're caught sending a text. | :02:28. | :02:33. | |
Our correspondent, Robert Hall joined one police | :02:34. | :02:34. | |
patrol in Cambridgeshire as it stopped offenders. | :02:35. | :02:38. | |
On a busy main road in Cambridgeshire police cameras | :02:39. | :02:40. | |
The evidence from around the UK is crystal clear, we've been warned, | :02:41. | :02:45. | |
The most recent report from the RAC found 31% of drivers admit | :02:46. | :02:53. | |
to using a hand-held phone at the wheel compared | :02:54. | :02:55. | |
She had it held in both hands so texting or whatever | :02:56. | :03:11. | |
This driver was spotted holding her phone to plot a route. | :03:12. | :03:17. | |
You had your phone in both hands on top of your steering wheel. | :03:18. | :03:20. | |
You may or may not be aware, it is going to change. | :03:21. | :03:23. | |
Six points and ?200 fine and no option of any sort | :03:24. | :03:25. | |
It's just how she was using her phone that makes it an offence. | :03:26. | :03:30. | |
It's more than just making a phone call. | :03:31. | :03:31. | |
Further up the road, a two minute call will have serious | :03:32. | :03:34. | |
You were on your mobile phone. You are aware that's an offence? | :03:35. | :03:43. | |
In the 20 odd years I've been on the road I've seen | :03:44. | :03:46. | |
I've seen phone in one hand, lap on the other, and knee | :03:47. | :03:50. | |
What just happened there, a minor indiscretion in relation | :03:51. | :03:53. | |
to the scale of things, but no, I should know better. | :03:54. | :03:56. | |
Unfortunately your mum has been killed. | :03:57. | :03:58. | |
Police operations will now run alongside a media campaign centred | :03:59. | :04:01. | |
Higher penalties are only part of the answer. | :04:02. | :04:04. | |
In the end, we must all be conscious of the lives we put at risk. | :04:05. | :04:08. | |
There is nothing that is so important it cannot wait. | :04:09. | :04:10. | |
Don't use your phone whilst you're driving. | :04:11. | :04:22. | |
Almost all of us have done it at some point, let's be honest. Is the | :04:23. | :04:28. | |
increase in the punishment enough to stop you doing it ever again? We | :04:29. | :04:32. | |
will talk to Meg Williamson later on. Her story is absolutely | :04:33. | :04:38. | |
devastating. She met the man who killed her boyfriend. The man was | :04:39. | :04:42. | |
using his phone. In fact, he was having an argument with his | :04:43. | :04:46. | |
ex-girlfriend and he went through the central reservation head-on into | :04:47. | :04:48. | |
her boyfriend's car as he was driving to work for a night shift on | :04:49. | :04:52. | |
a Saturday night. Please do listen to Meg. That's at 10.15am. That's | :04:53. | :04:56. | |
enough to make you stop ever using a phone again, I promise you. | :04:57. | :05:02. | |
Some messages from you. Bear with me one second. | :05:03. | :05:09. | |
Sorry. "My wife and two sons were killed by a motorist using his | :05:10. | :05:13. | |
mobile phone in 2002." Joanna Gosling is in the BBC | :05:14. | :05:16. | |
Newsroom with a summary President Trump has promised | :05:17. | :05:19. | |
a "new chapter of American greatness" in his first | :05:20. | :05:22. | |
speech to Congress. He appealed for unity, | :05:23. | :05:24. | |
saying the time for "trivial In an hour long speech he promised | :05:25. | :05:26. | |
extra spending on infrastructure, the military and pledged to tackle | :05:27. | :05:32. | |
illegal immigration and terrorism. Our correspondent Laura Bicker has | :05:33. | :05:34. | |
this report from Washington. Donald Trump's trip to Congress gave | :05:35. | :05:40. | |
them a few last moments APPLAUSE | :05:41. | :05:43. | |
P. This platform is new territory | :05:44. | :05:56. | |
for this political outsider. Donald Trump set out his vision | :05:57. | :05:59. | |
with emphasis on border control. We must restore integrity | :06:00. | :06:01. | |
and the rule of law at our borders. For that reason we will soon begin | :06:02. | :06:04. | |
the construction of a great, great APPLAUSE | :06:05. | :06:08. | |
APPLAUSE He softened his tone | :06:09. | :06:21. | |
on immigration, talking of reform I'm going to bring back millions | :06:22. | :06:23. | |
of jobs, protecting our workers also means reforming our system | :06:24. | :06:27. | |
of legal immigration. The longest and most bipartisan | :06:28. | :06:36. | |
applause of the night was saved And Ryan is looking down right now, | :06:37. | :06:38. | |
you know that, and he's very happy because I think he just | :06:39. | :06:43. | |
broke a record. There was much in the speech | :06:44. | :06:45. | |
for Democrats to like. A trillion-dollar investment | :06:46. | :06:54. | |
in infrastructure, talk of paid family leave, | :06:55. | :06:58. | |
but most stayed stony We all salute the same great | :06:59. | :07:01. | |
American flag and we all This was the most presidential hour | :07:02. | :07:07. | |
of Donald Trump's presidency and there will be some in his party | :07:08. | :07:17. | |
breathing a sigh of relief. A new non-invasive test to detect | :07:18. | :07:28. | |
Down's Syndrome early on in pregnancy will be rolled out | :07:29. | :07:31. | |
next year on the NHS. There are concerns that the test | :07:32. | :07:35. | |
could be misused to selectively abort babies on the basis | :07:36. | :07:37. | |
of their sex. Policy advisors at the Nuffield | :07:38. | :07:42. | |
Council on Bioethics also warn introducing it on the NHS could lead | :07:43. | :07:45. | |
to an increase in the number of terminations following | :07:46. | :07:49. | |
a diagnosis of Down's Syndrome. This programme has discovered that | :07:50. | :07:52. | |
a charity which tried to force the NHS to give more people | :07:53. | :07:55. | |
a treatment for Hepatitis C has received hundreds | :07:56. | :07:58. | |
of thousands of pounds Sovaldi can cure the disease | :07:59. | :07:59. | |
for good in as little as eight weeks but due to its high cost, | :08:00. | :08:09. | |
NHS England has limited its access The Hepatitis C Trust | :08:10. | :08:12. | |
fought that decision and while it did not take money | :08:13. | :08:17. | |
for the court case, we found it has accepted around ?200,000 | :08:18. | :08:29. | |
from the US drugs giant The charity denies taking | :08:30. | :08:31. | |
the money means it's less Lots of people try to influence us, | :08:32. | :08:38. | |
but we just come back to the same thing. What's right for patients? | :08:39. | :08:42. | |
And as long as we keep that at the fore front of what we're doing then | :08:43. | :08:48. | |
that's fine. If at the same time, as I say, what we're doing is in | :08:49. | :08:51. | |
somebody else's interest, fine. And we'll have more on that story | :08:52. | :08:55. | |
in just a few minutes' time. The boss of Uber, the taxi-booking | :08:56. | :08:58. | |
app, Travis Kalanick has been forced to apologise after a video emerged | :08:59. | :09:01. | |
of him swearing at a driver who complained he was not | :09:02. | :09:03. | |
making enough money. Mr Kalanick later sent | :09:04. | :09:06. | |
an email to his staff saying he was "ashamed" of his actions | :09:07. | :09:08. | |
and that he is seeking help to Unite claims the car maker Ford is | :09:09. | :09:20. | |
planning to cut more than 1100 jobs at the Bridgend engine plant in the | :09:21. | :09:23. | |
next four years. Workers meetings will be held at the site today in | :09:24. | :09:27. | |
what Unite said was a sign that strike action was one step closer, | :09:28. | :09:30. | |
but in a statement this morning, Ford said that levels of engine | :09:31. | :09:35. | |
production from Bridgend remain healthy and jobs in the up coming | :09:36. | :09:39. | |
years are expected to be similar to today's numbers. | :09:40. | :09:42. | |
Two women have been charged with the murder of Kim Jong-nam, | :09:43. | :09:44. | |
the half-brother of North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un. | :09:45. | :09:46. | |
The pair, one of whom is Vietnamese, the other Indonesian, | :09:47. | :09:49. | |
face the death penalty if found guilty. | :09:50. | :09:50. | |
Malaysian police believe they wiped the deadly VX nerve agent | :09:51. | :09:55. | |
on his face just over a fortnight ago in Kula Lumpur Airport. | :09:56. | :09:58. | |
The women claim they thought they were taking part in a video prank. | :09:59. | :10:02. | |
Scientists have found evidence of a strong link | :10:03. | :10:04. | |
The study, at Imperial College London, concluded that being obese | :10:05. | :10:14. | |
increased the risk of getting 11 cancers including stomach, | :10:15. | :10:16. | |
Researchers say maintaining a healthy weight is the single most | :10:17. | :10:20. | |
important way to reduce the risk of cancer after not smoking. | :10:21. | :10:23. | |
That's a summary of the latest BBC News. | :10:24. | :10:25. | |
Joe says, "Don't assume we have all used mobile phones while behind the | :10:26. | :10:38. | |
wheel. I have never done so." Lesley says, "The increase in fines is good | :10:39. | :10:42. | |
news, but it should include hands-free which is just as | :10:43. | :10:47. | |
dangerous." Another viewer tweets, "Don't use your phone. What do | :10:48. | :10:53. | |
people value more than their posh coffees, their phone." | :10:54. | :10:57. | |
Do get in touch with us throughout the morning - | :10:58. | :11:00. | |
use the hashtag Victoria LIVE and If you text, you will be charged | :11:01. | :11:03. | |
We're going to talk golf first and there are some changes | :11:04. | :11:09. | |
Would you say golf is one of the most complicated sports in terms of | :11:10. | :11:17. | |
rules of all the sport, I would say. I can't think of a sport with a | :11:18. | :11:21. | |
fatter rule book. The thinking behind the changes is we need to | :11:22. | :11:24. | |
make golf more simple because the numbers of people participating in | :11:25. | :11:27. | |
the sport have declined rapidly over the past 20 years or so and so the | :11:28. | :11:31. | |
people who are behind the rule changes say this is the biggest raft | :11:32. | :11:35. | |
of changes for a generation, designed to make the game more | :11:36. | :11:38. | |
simple and therefore, more attractive and get more people | :11:39. | :11:41. | |
playing. From the outside, they are not major changes. They are probably | :11:42. | :11:46. | |
just minor tweaks to rules for people who don't play golfment for | :11:47. | :11:49. | |
people who play the sport, it might make a lot of difference. I never | :11:50. | :11:57. | |
played golf. I've only ever done hitting a ball into a win mill and | :11:58. | :12:04. | |
down an elephant's trunk. Give me the rule changes? For people like | :12:05. | :12:10. | |
you and, a round of golf can take you four-and-a-half, five hours, | :12:11. | :12:13. | |
can't it? They are trying to say we should be playing a faster game. Sow | :12:14. | :12:18. | |
won't be able to look for your golf if you've lost it for more than | :12:19. | :12:21. | |
three minutes. That should speed things up. There is lots of | :12:22. | :12:25. | |
etiquette rules where you should wait for the player furthest from | :12:26. | :12:28. | |
the hole to play the ball first. That can slow things down a bit. | :12:29. | :12:34. | |
Anyone who is addressing standing next to their ball can play it. | :12:35. | :12:38. | |
That's a change that should speed things up and therefore, people | :12:39. | :12:41. | |
don't have to give up, four or five hours to get into the sport at all. | :12:42. | :12:47. | |
There is tweaks like new-style penalty drops. You will be able to | :12:48. | :12:51. | |
putt and leave the flag in the hole whilst you're putting on the putting | :12:52. | :12:57. | |
green. From outside the sport, it doesn't look like major changes, but | :12:58. | :13:01. | |
they are saying that they are the rule makers of golf, these are the | :13:02. | :13:04. | |
biggest set of changes for a generation. So will it make a | :13:05. | :13:07. | |
difference? Peu guess we will have to wait and see. The rules come into | :13:08. | :13:13. | |
effect at the start of 2019. The first in what they say will be a | :13:14. | :13:17. | |
raft of changes to make golf more simple and more enjoyable. Make of | :13:18. | :13:22. | |
that what you will. It's not going to be enough to make | :13:23. | :13:27. | |
me go and play a round of golf. I'm not waiting until 2019 to do it! | :13:28. | :13:30. | |
Football and Newcastle have taken a big step | :13:31. | :13:32. | |
They say it is the most lucrative promotion. The race is really | :13:33. | :13:44. | |
hotting up, Newcastle and Brighton, top of table clash last night to see | :13:45. | :13:48. | |
who would be in the position to go into the Premier League. Brighton | :13:49. | :13:51. | |
were leading for most of the match. They were 1-0 up for most of the | :13:52. | :13:55. | |
match, but Newcastle came back in the last ten minutes to score two | :13:56. | :14:02. | |
goals and they are four points clear at the top. That could prove to be a | :14:03. | :14:07. | |
vital win for them because Newcastle now have to face every other team in | :14:08. | :14:13. | |
the top seven over the next few weeks. So a really tough few weeks | :14:14. | :14:18. | |
coming up for Newcastle in that race for Premier League football next | :14:19. | :14:19. | |
season, Victoria. And finally Roy Hodgson | :14:20. | :14:21. | |
is being linked with a high Yes, big buzz around Roy Hodgson. | :14:22. | :14:32. | |
The last time we saw him in action was when his England team were | :14:33. | :14:35. | |
crashing out of the euros beaten by Iceland, but many people in football | :14:36. | :14:39. | |
today are saying he's the man with the integrity and the experience to | :14:40. | :14:44. | |
take over at Leicester City where Claudio Ranieri was, of course, | :14:45. | :14:50. | |
sacked last week. Yes, that's that moment when England were beaten by | :14:51. | :14:55. | |
Iceland at the Euros. Perhaps Roy Hodgson will never be able to shrug | :14:56. | :15:01. | |
off that horrendous experience, but maybe we will see him smiling again | :15:02. | :15:05. | |
as he leads Leicester, potentially, he has been lined up as the next | :15:06. | :15:09. | |
Leicester boss. All rumours, but we'll keep you up-to-date. | :15:10. | :15:14. | |
Hepatitis C is a debilitating illness. | :15:15. | :15:16. | |
Left untreated it can lead to cancer and liver failure. | :15:17. | :15:18. | |
A breakthrough drug taken once a day can now cure the disease for good | :15:19. | :15:22. | |
The problem is it's so expensive that NHS England has said it can | :15:23. | :15:27. | |
This programme has now found out that a charity | :15:28. | :15:35. | |
that tried to force the health service to give more | :15:36. | :15:37. | |
people the treatment has received hundreds of thousands | :15:38. | :15:39. | |
of pounds from the US drugs giant that makes it. | :15:40. | :15:42. | |
You know, it's hard, because there are days | :15:43. | :15:51. | |
There are days like today, when I sit down and think | :15:52. | :15:59. | |
So I'm cured of the Hepatitis C, and yay! | :16:00. | :16:06. | |
Hard to find, until recently even harder to cure. | :16:07. | :16:14. | |
215,000 people in this country are infected with Hepatitis C. | :16:15. | :16:20. | |
Spread by contact with infected blood, from dirty needles, unsafe | :16:21. | :16:22. | |
For the first time now there is a cure that works | :16:23. | :16:33. | |
The problem - it's so expensive that not everyone can get hold of it. | :16:34. | :16:40. | |
Healthcare should be a right for every person. | :16:41. | :16:57. | |
This is the story of what could be the most profitable drug ever made. | :16:58. | :17:03. | |
We've been looking into the company behind it and the funding | :17:04. | :17:07. | |
of a charity that tried to force the NHS to buy more of it. | :17:08. | :17:11. | |
You can categorically tell us that there was no drug industry | :17:12. | :17:14. | |
funding that went into the court case, this was supporting... | :17:15. | :17:17. | |
More on that claim later, but first, why are these new drugs | :17:18. | :17:22. | |
If I could speak to her now, then of course I would, you know, | :17:23. | :17:30. | |
give her different advice, but what's gone is gone. | :17:31. | :17:33. | |
Like many others, Zoe had been living with Hep C for years, | :17:34. | :17:37. | |
Most likely she was infected back in her 20s, when she took | :17:38. | :17:42. | |
30 years later, Zoe is now a qualified social worker, | :17:43. | :17:51. | |
Four years ago, she found herself sick and always tired. | :17:52. | :17:58. | |
I was struggling a lot, physically, but I put it down | :17:59. | :18:01. | |
I was working as a social worker full-time, a single mum | :18:02. | :18:09. | |
to three boys, you know, you kind of expect to be tired. | :18:10. | :18:11. | |
I was falling asleep in my office chair. | :18:12. | :18:25. | |
Also having problems with my digestion, feeling nauseous. | :18:26. | :18:33. | |
My diagnosis came along, and then I was able to go, OK, | :18:34. | :18:38. | |
this is why I've been feeling so rubbish for so long. | :18:39. | :18:46. | |
It's not often a drug comes along that can change the world - | :18:47. | :18:53. | |
antibiotics, the smallpox vaccine, HIV treatments maybe. | :18:54. | :18:55. | |
Then there is this, a drug called sofosbuvir or Sovaldi, | :18:56. | :18:57. | |
In combination with other drugs, it can cure Hepatitis C | :18:58. | :19:02. | |
in as little as eight weeks, with very few side effects. | :19:03. | :19:07. | |
That's because the pills that should be inside are some of the most | :19:08. | :19:14. | |
profitable and the most expensive ever made. | :19:15. | :19:19. | |
The official or list price for a standard course of Sovaldi | :19:20. | :19:22. | |
is ?35,000 in the UK, or more than ?400 for each pill. | :19:23. | :19:27. | |
The final price paid is confidential, but likely to be | :19:28. | :19:30. | |
In some complex cases it could be a lot more. | :19:31. | :19:36. | |
Nevertheless, in 2015 the medicines watchdog Nice ruled | :19:37. | :19:38. | |
the cure is cost effective, compared with older treatments, | :19:39. | :19:40. | |
So you're talking about vast profits here, tens of billions of dollars. | :19:41. | :19:53. | |
The academic Andrew Hill specialised in drug pricing. | :19:54. | :19:57. | |
We should have a plan to eradicate Hepatitis C from the United Kingdom | :19:58. | :20:00. | |
within a reasonable time, be it five years, maybe ten years. | :20:01. | :20:07. | |
It could be done if we tested and treated enough people, | :20:08. | :20:12. | |
but we have to be able do this for a budget we can afford. | :20:13. | :20:19. | |
But the new form of Hepatitis C drugs are so expensive that last | :20:20. | :20:22. | |
year NHS England did something it has never done before. | :20:23. | :20:25. | |
It capped treatment, restricting it to 10,000 people a year. | :20:26. | :20:28. | |
And that's despite spending an extra ?200 million | :20:29. | :20:30. | |
So, if like Zoe, your condition is not seen as serious | :20:31. | :20:38. | |
I knew that there was a lot of cuts and a lot of issues financially, | :20:39. | :20:45. | |
so to be told I wasn't sick enough, that because my liver | :20:46. | :20:48. | |
was not cirrhotic, I wasn't on the transplant list, | :20:49. | :20:50. | |
that I couldn't get treatment was absolutely | :20:51. | :20:51. | |
But I don't blame the NHS at all, just to be clear. | :20:52. | :21:03. | |
It was after that I kind of went, OK, what am I going to do? | :21:04. | :21:07. | |
Because I left the hospital in floods of tears, | :21:08. | :21:09. | |
just thinking, well, what next, you know? | :21:10. | :21:17. | |
Across the world, the US drugs maker Gilead has been | :21:18. | :21:20. | |
targeted by protestors, angry at the high price of Sovaldi. | :21:21. | :21:24. | |
Working people cannot afford the cost of these drugs. | :21:25. | :21:31. | |
International charities have been pressing the company | :21:32. | :21:33. | |
to reduce its prices and increase the number treated. | :21:34. | :21:38. | |
Nobody is saying that pharmaceutical companies shouldn't make profits. | :21:39. | :21:43. | |
Just not the extortionate profits they are making. | :21:44. | :21:45. | |
We are in a situation at moment where 350,000 people are dying each | :21:46. | :21:48. | |
year of Hepatitis C, completely unnecessarily | :21:49. | :21:50. | |
We are living in a world where life-saving medicine is taking | :21:51. | :21:54. | |
I don't want to live with the uncertainties of Hep C. | :21:55. | :22:01. | |
Gilead spent more than $140 millions in the US last year, advertising | :22:02. | :22:04. | |
A Senate investigation in 2015 accused the company of putting | :22:05. | :22:10. | |
profit over patients, something it denied. | :22:11. | :22:16. | |
The firm says it has now treated more than one million people | :22:17. | :22:19. | |
with Hepatitis C around the world, more than half of those | :22:20. | :22:21. | |
in poorer countries where the drugs are discounted. | :22:22. | :22:28. | |
In England, it is not the drugs industry | :22:29. | :22:45. | |
but the NHS which has taken the brunt of the criticism. | :22:46. | :22:52. | |
That's after it capped treatment at 10,000 people a year, | :22:53. | :22:54. | |
a fraction of the 215,000 living with the disease. | :22:55. | :23:00. | |
Charles Gore runs the Hepatitis C Trust, which represents patients. | :23:01. | :23:04. | |
This is not the most expensive drug by any means across the NHS. | :23:05. | :23:08. | |
That's the only bit I am railing against the NHS for doing, | :23:09. | :23:14. | |
is picking on people with Hepatitis C and saying you're | :23:15. | :23:16. | |
Everybody else gets the drugs that Nice say they can | :23:17. | :23:22. | |
Is it because it is associated with drug use? | :23:23. | :23:30. | |
Last year, the Hepatitis C Trust made the unusual decision to take | :23:31. | :23:33. | |
NHS England to the High Court, to try and get that cap lifted. | :23:34. | :23:36. | |
The charity lost, but it was unclear at the time how its case was funded. | :23:37. | :23:39. | |
The judge suggested it may have been the drugs industry, | :23:40. | :23:42. | |
which had a lot to gain financially, that was really behind it. | :23:43. | :23:50. | |
That's something the boss of the Hepatitis C Trust strongly denies. | :23:51. | :23:54. | |
You can categorically tell us that there was no drug industry | :23:55. | :23:57. | |
funding that went into the court case, this was supporting... | :23:58. | :23:59. | |
Categorically for precisely this reason, because we were | :24:00. | :24:03. | |
The fact that the drug companies stood to benefit | :24:04. | :24:10. | |
It was very important to us to get crowdfunding for it, | :24:11. | :24:16. | |
because this is patients going for what's good for patients. | :24:17. | :24:21. | |
It might not have taken money for the court case, but we have | :24:22. | :24:24. | |
Over the last three years it's accepted ?200,000 from Gilead, | :24:25. | :24:33. | |
the US drugs giant which makes Sovaldi. | :24:34. | :24:38. | |
Last year, a third of its income, ?335,000, | :24:39. | :24:40. | |
The charity denies that taking that money has made it less | :24:41. | :24:48. | |
likely to criticise Gilead or other drug companies. | :24:49. | :24:53. | |
Obviously people try and influence us, the NHS tries and influence us, | :24:54. | :24:56. | |
Pharma tries to influence us, lots of people try to influence us, | :24:57. | :24:59. | |
but we just come back to the same thing - | :25:00. | :25:01. | |
As long as we keep that at the forefront of what we're | :25:02. | :25:06. | |
If at the same time, as I say, interests intersect, | :25:07. | :25:09. | |
and what we are doing is in somebody's else's | :25:10. | :25:11. | |
The drugs company Gilead also said... | :25:12. | :25:30. | |
Zoe ended up doing what hundreds of others with Hepatitis C | :25:31. | :25:34. | |
She went online and bought a cheaper generic copy of a drug | :25:35. | :25:40. | |
from a developing country, in this case Bangladesh. | :25:41. | :25:47. | |
That's something the NHS cannot do without breaking international law. | :25:48. | :25:51. | |
In the UK, though, it is legal for personal use, and costs | :25:52. | :25:54. | |
How much of a gamble did you think it was? | :25:55. | :26:02. | |
It's still over ?1,000 you're spending, that's still quite a lot | :26:03. | :26:05. | |
a lot of money for something that could be a bit risky? | :26:06. | :26:07. | |
You can't put a price on your life, can you? | :26:08. | :26:10. | |
But you don't go know it's going to work? | :26:11. | :26:12. | |
I couldn't go on like I was, so I had to make a decision. | :26:13. | :26:15. | |
It was an informed choice, it wasn't, like, just throwing | :26:16. | :26:18. | |
How unfair do you find it is that you have to go through all this? | :26:19. | :26:26. | |
You know, these drugs are working, at a fraction of the cost | :26:27. | :26:29. | |
that the pharmaceutical companies are charging. | :26:30. | :26:31. | |
There's no reason why - I mean, we shouldn't have to pay, | :26:32. | :26:34. | |
but at the same time, you know, we are lucky enough | :26:35. | :26:37. | |
to have a health system in this country that was set up by, | :26:38. | :26:40. | |
you know, some very passionate people in the 1940s, that you know, | :26:41. | :26:43. | |
that gave everybody that equality, that right to health care. | :26:44. | :26:45. | |
Now lots of countries don't have that, but I think that's very | :26:46. | :26:48. | |
important that we hold on to that very dearly. | :26:49. | :26:50. | |
It's at such a big risk of being completely wiped out, | :26:51. | :26:53. | |
and everyone deserves the right to be well, if possible. | :26:54. | :27:29. | |
David e-mails, I had hepatitis C for around ten years. The part that got | :27:30. | :27:35. | |
to me was always having to be aware of not passing it on either through | :27:36. | :27:38. | |
sex or an injury where blood could spill. I have the treatment as part | :27:39. | :27:42. | |
of a trial and was successfully cured. It is a huge weight off my | :27:43. | :27:47. | |
shoulders. The treatment should be widely available, in my opinion. | :27:48. | :27:51. | |
Loads of comments on driving the tougher punishments coming in today | :27:52. | :27:54. | |
if you are caught using a mobile phone. Gene Sauers who do you think | :27:55. | :28:00. | |
you are when you talk to me and say almost all of us have use mobile | :28:01. | :28:04. | |
phones while driving. Adrian says I don't think the penalties go far | :28:05. | :28:09. | |
enough, we ban drink-drivers, why treat the victims of mobile phone | :28:10. | :28:15. | |
using drivers any differently? Their they should face the same penalties, | :28:16. | :28:21. | |
ban them automatically. When scissor don't goes far of how about 9-point | :28:22. | :28:27. | |
and a ?2500 fine to be paid within 30 days to stamp out this selfish | :28:28. | :28:31. | |
action. John reckons he sees three to four mobiles being used in cars | :28:32. | :28:34. | |
every day round here. I haven't seen a police officer in the last two | :28:35. | :28:38. | |
years either on foot or in a car. The correlation is obvious. No point | :28:39. | :28:42. | |
whatsoever having laws, however Draconian, if you don't them. More | :28:43. | :28:47. | |
government sticking plaster I'm sorry to say. Andy says I think the | :28:48. | :28:50. | |
penalties are being aimed in the wrong direction, not just their | :28:51. | :28:53. | |
vehicle they are using irresponsibly, but also their phone. | :28:54. | :28:57. | |
Take their phone from them, half of these idiots with Lars -- rather use | :28:58. | :29:05. | |
off lose the -- some of these idiots would rather lose their driving | :29:06. | :29:08. | |
licence than their phone the six months. | :29:09. | :29:14. | |
A new noninvasive test allowing pregnant women to screen for Down's | :29:15. | :29:18. | |
syndrome will be available on the NHS from next year - | :29:19. | :29:22. | |
Donald Trump calls for a new chapter in American greatness. We will ask | :29:23. | :29:29. | |
one of his supporters exactly what that means. | :29:30. | :29:31. | |
Joanna Gosling is in the newsroom of the rest of the day's news. | :29:32. | :29:35. | |
Punishments for using a mobile phone behind the wheel will double | :29:36. | :29:37. | |
from today in England, Wales and Scotland. | :29:38. | :29:39. | |
Motorists face getting six points on their licence and a ?200 fine. | :29:40. | :29:42. | |
New drivers caught within two years of passing their test | :29:43. | :29:44. | |
Donald Trump has promised a "new chapter of American | :29:45. | :29:57. | |
greatness" in his first speech to Congress. | :29:58. | :29:58. | |
He also appealed for unity, saying the time for "trivial | :29:59. | :30:01. | |
In an hour long speech he promised extra spending on infrastructure, | :30:02. | :30:05. | |
the military and pledged to tackle illegal immigration and terrorism. | :30:06. | :30:13. | |
We just need the courage to share the dreams that fill our hearts. The | :30:14. | :30:21. | |
bravery to express the hopes that share our souls and the confidence | :30:22. | :30:25. | |
to turn those hopes and those dreams into action. From now on, America | :30:26. | :30:32. | |
will be empowered by our as per rations. Not burdened by our fears. | :30:33. | :30:38. | |
A new non-invasive test to detect Down's Syndrome early | :30:39. | :30:40. | |
on in pregnancy will be rolled out next year on the NHS . | :30:41. | :30:43. | |
There are concerns that the test could be misused to selectively | :30:44. | :30:46. | |
abort babies on the basis of their sex. | :30:47. | :30:48. | |
Policy advisors at the Nuffield Council on Bioethics also warn | :30:49. | :30:50. | |
introducing it on the NHS could lead to an increase in the number | :30:51. | :30:53. | |
of terminations following a diagnosis of Down's syndrome. | :30:54. | :30:58. | |
This programme has discovered that a charity which tried to force | :30:59. | :31:01. | |
the NHS to give more people a treatment for Hepatitis C | :31:02. | :31:04. | |
has received hundreds of thousands of pounds | :31:05. | :31:05. | |
Sovaldi can cure the disease for good in as little as eight weeks | :31:06. | :31:12. | |
but due to its high cost, NHS England has limited its access | :31:13. | :31:15. | |
The Hepatitis C Trust fought that decision and, | :31:16. | :31:19. | |
while it did not take money for the court case, we found it has | :31:20. | :31:22. | |
accepted around ?200,000 from the US drugs giant Gilead. | :31:23. | :31:25. | |
The charity denies taking the money means it's less | :31:26. | :31:27. | |
That's a summary of the latest BBC News. | :31:28. | :31:36. | |
The boss of Uber, the taxi-booking app, Travis Kalanick has been forced | :31:37. | :31:39. | |
to apologise after a video emerged of him swearing at a driver | :31:40. | :31:42. | |
who complained he was not making enough money. | :31:43. | :31:44. | |
Mr Kalanick later sent an email to his staff saying | :31:45. | :31:46. | |
he was "ashamed" of his actions and that he is seeking help to | :31:47. | :31:50. | |
Two women have been charged with the murder of Kim Jong-nam, | :31:51. | :31:55. | |
the half-brother of North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un. | :31:56. | :31:57. | |
The pair, one of whom is Vietnamese, the other Indonesian, | :31:58. | :31:59. | |
face the death penalty if found guilty. | :32:00. | :32:01. | |
Malaysian police believe they wiped the deadly VX nerve agent | :32:02. | :32:03. | |
on his face just over a fortnight ago in Kula Lumpur Airport. | :32:04. | :32:07. | |
The women claim they thought they were taking part in a video prank. | :32:08. | :32:18. | |
An Appeal Court in Thailand has upheld the death sentences for two | :32:19. | :32:29. | |
men for the murders of two British holiday-makers in 2015 after a | :32:30. | :32:31. | |
controversial investigation which was marred by questions over the | :32:32. | :32:35. | |
quality of the DNA testing on which the conviction was based. | :32:36. | :32:41. | |
That's a summary of the latest BBC News. | :32:42. | :32:43. | |
Does Nigel Farage deserve a knighthood? There is a row about it. | :32:44. | :32:53. | |
Nick says, "Make him a lord and get him to campaign for the abolition of | :32:54. | :32:59. | |
the House of Lords." A few people have taken a peerage with the very | :33:00. | :33:02. | |
intention of getting rid of the Lords and the House of Lords is | :33:03. | :33:06. | |
bigger than ever as you know, over 800 peers now. Paul says, "Like him | :33:07. | :33:11. | |
or hate him, he has changed the face of UK politics, given that he | :33:12. | :33:15. | |
probably deserves a nighthood, individuals have been given | :33:16. | :33:19. | |
nighthoods for a lot less." Ian says, "Mr Farage does not deserve a | :33:20. | :33:25. | |
knighthood. We don't know what Brexit could bring. It could be a | :33:26. | :33:28. | |
catastrophe." Katherine Downes has | :33:29. | :33:30. | |
the sport headlines now. Last night Brighton or Newcastle | :33:31. | :33:32. | |
could have gone top of the Championship after their top | :33:33. | :33:34. | |
of the table clash last night, it is Newcastle who are top | :33:35. | :33:37. | |
of the tree for now. Brighton lead for most of the match, | :33:38. | :33:40. | |
but Newcastle scored twice in the last ten minutes to go | :33:41. | :33:42. | |
four points clear. The rumours are that Roy Hodgson | :33:43. | :33:45. | |
is being lined up to replace The former England manager | :33:46. | :33:48. | |
is bookies favourite to take over. Golf's rule makers are set to | :33:49. | :34:03. | |
announce what they are calling the biggest set of changes in a | :34:04. | :34:06. | |
generation. They are introducing new rules to make the game simpler and | :34:07. | :34:09. | |
quicker to play to try and encourage more people to pick up their clubs. | :34:10. | :34:15. | |
Rule change or no rule change you're unlikely to head out for a round. | :34:16. | :34:17. | |
That's true, I can confirm that. President Donald Trump says the US | :34:18. | :34:23. | |
is witnessing a "renewal of the American spirit", | :34:24. | :34:25. | |
as he delivered his first speech to Congress - | :34:26. | :34:27. | |
the American parliament. The Republican President spoke | :34:28. | :34:29. | |
in a measured way, he was upbeat, as he talked about a "new chapter | :34:30. | :34:32. | |
of American greatness". We cannot allow a beach head | :34:33. | :34:41. | |
of terrorism to form inside America. We cannot allow our nation to become | :34:42. | :34:44. | |
a sanctuary for extremists. That is why my administration has | :34:45. | :34:47. | |
been working on improved vetting procedures, and we will shortly take | :34:48. | :34:54. | |
new steps to keep our nation safe and to keep those out | :34:55. | :34:57. | |
who will do us harm. Tonight, I am also calling | :34:58. | :34:59. | |
on this Congress to repeal This is a $1 trillion | :35:00. | :35:02. | |
investment in infrastructure of the United States, | :35:03. | :35:12. | |
financed through both public and private capital, | :35:13. | :35:14. | |
creating millions of new jobs. This is a $1 trillion | :35:15. | :35:17. | |
investment in infrastructure of the United States, | :35:18. | :35:30. | |
financed through both public and private capital, | :35:31. | :35:32. | |
creating millions of new jobs. By finally enforcing | :35:33. | :35:34. | |
or immigration laws, we will raise wages, | :35:35. | :35:42. | |
help the unemployed, save billions and billions of dollars, | :35:43. | :35:44. | |
and make our communities We will look back on tonight | :35:45. | :35:46. | |
as when this new chapter We just need the courage to share | :35:47. | :35:56. | |
the dreams that fill our hearts, the bravery to express the hopes | :35:57. | :36:02. | |
that sear our souls, and the confidence to turn those | :36:03. | :36:05. | |
hopes and those dreams into action. Let's get some more reaction to that | :36:06. | :36:20. | |
speech from Scottie Nell-Hughes a Republican journalist | :36:21. | :36:23. | |
and commentator and Carmel Martin a Democrat from the centre | :36:24. | :36:25. | |
for American progress. Let me start with you, Scottie, what | :36:26. | :36:34. | |
does this renewal of the American spirit mean, do you think? Well, it | :36:35. | :36:39. | |
means, it is several things. It is a new programme of national rebuilding | :36:40. | :36:43. | |
that in a rare instance Republicans and Democrats and economists can all | :36:44. | :36:46. | |
agree about the question later on will be how do we pay for this | :36:47. | :36:51. | |
spending? But what we saw last night was President Trump delivering a | :36:52. | :36:56. | |
very vintage Trump message and Democrats having to tread lightly | :36:57. | :37:00. | |
because while they might not agree with the substance that President | :37:01. | :37:05. | |
Trump talked about, like the idea of rebuilding and renewing America. His | :37:06. | :37:10. | |
speech was much calmer and it was something based on patriotism and | :37:11. | :37:14. | |
you will see Democrats it will be interesting to see how they continue | :37:15. | :37:18. | |
to either criticise this message that seemed to at first, really | :37:19. | :37:27. | |
unify our country. Well, let's see. We can criticise the man's actions. | :37:28. | :37:33. | |
His rhetoric continues to have a very populist feel. He's governing | :37:34. | :37:39. | |
from the far-right. Let's look what he has done in little more than a | :37:40. | :37:45. | |
month. His action was to make it harder for middle-class Americans, | :37:46. | :37:47. | |
middle-class Americans to get away mortgages. He took away overtime | :37:48. | :37:52. | |
protection. He made it harder to save for retirement. He has enacted, | :37:53. | :37:56. | |
moved forward executive action that is line the pockets of corporations | :37:57. | :38:00. | |
and special interests. He reversed the rule that would bring | :38:01. | :38:06. | |
transparency around gifts to oil and gas companies internationally. He | :38:07. | :38:11. | |
made it easier... What about the things he mentioned in the speech? | :38:12. | :38:17. | |
The almost ?800 billion infrastructure package. You must | :38:18. | :38:23. | |
welcome that? Well, I would welcome investment, serious investment in | :38:24. | :38:25. | |
America's infrastructure. Well, you got it. We called that for a long | :38:26. | :38:30. | |
time. But if you look at the plan he put out it would be again, tax | :38:31. | :38:36. | |
breaks for people on Wall Street to be able to finance infrastructure | :38:37. | :38:41. | |
programmes instead of investments in infrastructure which the end result | :38:42. | :38:46. | |
is that projects that would already be funded will be funded, but there | :38:47. | :38:50. | |
will be subsidies given to Wall Street which will be paid back by | :38:51. | :38:56. | |
American consumers in the form of tolls and fees. If he is willing to | :38:57. | :39:01. | |
put forward a real infrastructure package like Democrats in the | :39:02. | :39:04. | |
congress put forward about a month ago then yes, I would welcome that, | :39:05. | :39:07. | |
but I don't think we have evidence that's what we will see from | :39:08. | :39:10. | |
President Trump or from Republicans in Congress. Scottie, he did talk | :39:11. | :39:15. | |
about massive tax relief for the middle classes. Is that going to be | :39:16. | :39:19. | |
paid for by poorer people? Absolutely not. Listen, I'm not | :39:20. | :39:24. | |
denying that both sides don't already have their talking points | :39:25. | :39:28. | |
prepared to combat as I just heard. It seems like many Democrats today | :39:29. | :39:32. | |
did not listen to last night's speech and exactly what President | :39:33. | :39:35. | |
Trump was saying and where his emphasis was going forwardment now, | :39:36. | :39:40. | |
we can talk about the details and how you're going to look at it, but | :39:41. | :39:47. | |
no president is going to put... Over the last eight years we have seen a | :39:48. | :39:50. | |
burden put on by the Democrats and the Obama administration on the | :39:51. | :39:54. | |
middle-class and at the lower class hence why you saw a successful | :39:55. | :39:58. | |
victory in November. So if the Democrats are going to continue to | :39:59. | :40:02. | |
spew this spin on, I guarantee you will see a win by the Republicans | :40:03. | :40:10. | |
going forward. I urge them to listen to President Trump's speech last | :40:11. | :40:14. | |
night. Put partisanship aside and work with us on the side as I | :40:15. | :40:19. | |
believe both sides have good points that we can together on. The | :40:20. | :40:22. | |
Democrats look look they want to continue this divide. Is that really | :40:23. | :40:25. | |
in the best interest of the American people? I will respond by saying the | :40:26. | :40:32. | |
things I ponted to are things Donald Trump has done since he has taken | :40:33. | :40:35. | |
the oath of office. These are not things that he said. These are | :40:36. | :40:39. | |
things that he has done. He has reversed overtime and made it hard | :40:40. | :40:43. | |
tore invest in retirement. These are not things that are beneficial to | :40:44. | :40:46. | |
middle-class people. At the same time he has packed his Cabinet with | :40:47. | :40:51. | |
billionaires and people who are pushing their own corporate | :40:52. | :40:53. | |
interests. The provision he talked about that allows oil and gas | :40:54. | :40:57. | |
companies to accept payments from foreign governments, for their | :40:58. | :41:01. | |
actions and in the provision just required transparency around that, | :41:02. | :41:06. | |
he reversed that. His Secretary of State, lobbied heavily on that as | :41:07. | :41:11. | |
the head of ex--on mobile. I mean during the campaign and even last | :41:12. | :41:16. | |
night, there is a lot of rhetoric about working for middle-class, | :41:17. | :41:20. | |
working Americans, but his actions, he's not walking the walk. He is | :41:21. | :41:28. | |
just talking the talk. When he starts walking the walk and puts | :41:29. | :41:32. | |
forward policies that benefit those at the top of the income scale and | :41:33. | :41:36. | |
not middle-class Americans, his childcare proposal would be great | :41:37. | :41:41. | |
for his daughter, it would allow people at the top end of the income | :41:42. | :41:47. | |
scale to put away thousands of dollars away each year for private | :41:48. | :41:51. | |
schools and private tutors. It is $10 a month for those at the lower | :41:52. | :41:55. | |
end of the income scale. Thank you, I'll pause there. Thank you both. We | :41:56. | :42:00. | |
appreciate it. Thank you. Coming up, we'll be speaking | :42:01. | :42:07. | |
to the mum of the youngest ever baby to successfully undergo surgery | :42:08. | :42:10. | |
after being born prematurely That baby weighed 500 grams. The | :42:11. | :42:24. | |
reason I've said it like that is because we brought a bag of sugar | :42:25. | :42:28. | |
which is 500 grams. But honestly, tiny. | :42:29. | :42:38. | |
Penalties for driving with a mobile phone today will be increased and | :42:39. | :42:45. | |
instead of three penalty points on your licence, you will get six. If | :42:46. | :42:48. | |
you are a young driver with less than two years on the road, you will | :42:49. | :42:52. | |
lose your licence completely. Lose it. Tell us if you think those | :42:53. | :42:58. | |
increased penalties go far enough. Meg Williamson is a 27-year-old | :42:59. | :43:02. | |
teacher. Last June, her boyfriend Gavin Roberts was driving to work on | :43:03. | :43:06. | |
the motorway when he was hit head-on by another car. The driver was | :43:07. | :43:11. | |
24-year-old Lewis Stratford who was on his mobile having an argument | :43:12. | :43:14. | |
with his ex-as he drove to her house. Mr Roberts died four days | :43:15. | :43:22. | |
after the accident. Meg Williamson asked to meet the man who killed her | :43:23. | :43:27. | |
boyfriend. He agreed. The BBC's Inside Out South was there to | :43:28. | :43:32. | |
capture their conversation. The consultant took the family into | :43:33. | :43:35. | |
the room and told them that there was nothing that they could do. | :43:36. | :43:47. | |
And I just remember my legs completely giving in. | :43:48. | :43:49. | |
I remember my mum grabbing hold of me. | :43:50. | :43:52. | |
And walking me through the intensive care unit. | :43:53. | :43:58. | |
It felt like I was watching, it happen to somebody else. | :43:59. | :44:07. | |
I was on my phone, I was making the calls | :44:08. | :44:09. | |
And yes, they were emotional calls, they were shouting calls, | :44:10. | :44:21. | |
high emotional calls, raging calls that shouldn't have | :44:22. | :44:23. | |
And I've got to live with that forever and ever and ever. | :44:24. | :45:28. | |
I know I've caused a lot of pain for a lot of people. | :45:29. | :45:32. | |
For something that could have waited till the next day, I know that. | :45:33. | :45:35. | |
I know what I've done, the lives I've ruined, | :45:36. | :45:39. | |
yeah, I've ruined a lot of people's lives, happiness. | :45:40. | :45:44. | |
I deserve everything I get from whatever | :45:45. | :45:47. | |
I am sorry, but I can't keep saying sorry because I know | :45:48. | :45:57. | |
Sorry's not going to make things better, I know. | :45:58. | :46:03. | |
What were you arguing with the ex-girlfriend about? | :46:04. | :46:14. | |
She was due to come up to me on the Friday night, | :46:15. | :46:19. | |
but she said no, and then we was arguing all day Saturday. | :46:20. | :46:29. | |
We were going to leave it to the Sunday, so I'd go | :46:30. | :46:32. | |
I got in on the Saturday night and I just drove down, angrily, | :46:33. | :46:37. | |
No one thinks it will happen to them. | :46:38. | :46:55. | |
It shouldn't take something like this for them to think, | :46:56. | :46:57. | |
"I'll stop using the phone", people should know before. | :46:58. | :46:59. | |
I learned the hard way, but it shouldn't have to be this way. | :47:00. | :47:03. | |
What would you say to somebody who was going to pick up their phone | :47:04. | :47:06. | |
behind the wheel today, without even thinking about it? | :47:07. | :47:11. | |
Don't do it, because picking up a phone, no matter how nice you are, | :47:12. | :47:17. | |
or good you are, accidents like this can happen to anyone | :47:18. | :47:21. | |
Something I have to learn from, pay a price for, | :47:22. | :47:30. | |
I don't want to hate you forever, I'm not that type of person. | :47:31. | :47:55. | |
And eventually I'll probably be able to forgive you. | :47:56. | :48:05. | |
But I just needed some questions answering first. | :48:06. | :48:14. | |
To be honest, I expected the hate and abuse. | :48:15. | :48:17. | |
I expect it from anyone that has seen me on the street. | :48:18. | :48:24. | |
If they want to have a go, then I listen to it and I accept | :48:25. | :48:29. | |
anything people have to say, like I was scared to meet you. | :48:30. | :48:32. | |
Thank you for agreeing to meet me, and answering my questions. | :48:33. | :48:35. | |
Wow, I meanwhile, Louis Stratford admitted the charges of death | :48:36. | :48:59. | |
through dangerous driving. That was astonishing. What was it like for | :49:00. | :49:05. | |
you? The initial meeting, even before I walk of the door, I was | :49:06. | :49:09. | |
very anxious, mostly because I did not know kind of how my emotions | :49:10. | :49:13. | |
were going to come out. I didn't know how Lewis was going to react to | :49:14. | :49:16. | |
me and religious making sure that I could get some questions answered. | :49:17. | :49:21. | |
So it was difficult because I did not want to put any more blame on to | :49:22. | :49:24. | |
him than he was overly filling himself. But my main focus really | :49:25. | :49:28. | |
was just thinking how else can I prevent anyone else having to go | :49:29. | :49:33. | |
through this? Why was it important for you to hear the answer to the | :49:34. | :49:41. | |
questions you had from the man who was responsible for the death of | :49:42. | :49:44. | |
your boyfriend? I think because of the beginning when I was originally | :49:45. | :49:48. | |
with Gavin in the hospital, I had a lot of anger, ifs and buts, and | :49:49. | :49:53. | |
questioned myself. And then as time went on and I started to realise | :49:54. | :49:58. | |
actually Lewis is a real person, it could have been anyone behind that | :49:59. | :50:04. | |
will on their phone. So it was important for me to hear from the | :50:05. | :50:08. | |
one Howard had impacted his life as well as mine and Gavin and his | :50:09. | :50:12. | |
family and friends. Let's talk about that on the way to work, Gavin was, | :50:13. | :50:17. | |
in a chipped on a Saturday night. Yes, one of his last night shifts. | :50:18. | :50:22. | |
He was working on the electrification of the railway cover | :50:23. | :50:25. | |
something he was so, so happy to be part of, and he was so passionate | :50:26. | :50:29. | |
about his job. We had just had dinner with my parents the previous | :50:30. | :50:32. | |
night, the first time they had met him. And then Saturday evening came, | :50:33. | :50:37. | |
he went off to work and I did not think anything of not hearing from | :50:38. | :50:40. | |
him because I assumed he had gone out on track. It wasn't until Sunday | :50:41. | :50:44. | |
morning when I got that phone cord to say that he had not made it to | :50:45. | :50:48. | |
work, he had been in an accident, that reality kind of hit hard. What | :50:49. | :50:52. | |
happened when you go to the hospital, what are they say to you? | :50:53. | :50:57. | |
They let me straightaway in the go and see him, I sat with him and talk | :50:58. | :51:03. | |
to him, and he said he had been responsible sometime coming to the | :51:04. | :51:05. | |
hospital, but the pressure in his brain had been building, so they | :51:06. | :51:08. | |
wanted to take him down, do a scan, and then they put a stint in to try | :51:09. | :51:13. | |
to relieve the pressure. But unfortunately it was not successful, | :51:14. | :51:16. | |
and so then we were told we needed to wait for a miracle. It was very | :51:17. | :51:23. | |
hard. What did you say to him? I held his hand as best I could, | :51:24. | :51:26. | |
because it was bandaged up and there were lots of tube similar way, and I | :51:27. | :51:32. | |
just said to him not to be scared, -- lots of tube is in the way. I | :51:33. | :51:37. | |
begged him to work up, I told him I would swap places with him, talked | :51:38. | :51:41. | |
about the plans that we had, and the holidays and the memories we wanted | :51:42. | :51:46. | |
to make. But time kept ticking by and there was nothing we could do. | :51:47. | :51:53. | |
It was very hard. Yes. Do you think Lewis understood? What he had done? | :51:54. | :52:01. | |
Yes, I think he did, he was very compassionate. He spoke to be very | :52:02. | :52:06. | |
openly about how he felt, he didn't want the sorrow and he didn't want | :52:07. | :52:09. | |
people to feel sorry for him because he knew that sorry wasn't enough | :52:10. | :52:11. | |
because it would never bring Gavin back. But then the compassion in me, | :52:12. | :52:16. | |
he has to live with this for the rest of his life. We can grieve and | :52:17. | :52:20. | |
we can remember Gavin positively and hopefully carry on a legacy of | :52:21. | :52:26. | |
changing people's views of using the mobile behind the will but ten one | :52:27. | :52:30. | |
will always have delivered what he did that night. When he asked you if | :52:31. | :52:37. | |
you were angry with him, you said a little bit. A little bit. Because | :52:38. | :52:41. | |
the anger had worn off. I had come to realise that he was a real | :52:42. | :52:46. | |
person, and it could have been me, my sisters, any of the friends or | :52:47. | :52:50. | |
family that were either in Gavin's position or in his position, and so | :52:51. | :52:56. | |
as I started to understand ten one, and saw how he was so emotionally | :52:57. | :53:00. | |
charged by the conversation I guess, I started to understand that he knew | :53:01. | :53:03. | |
he had done wrong and he was willing to accept the blame. What was really | :53:04. | :53:08. | |
striking is that you said you don't want to hate because you are not | :53:09. | :53:12. | |
that sort of person. Because hate can be a very destructive emotion, | :53:13. | :53:16. | |
can't it? Yes, it would break me apart, make him feel even worse if I | :53:17. | :53:21. | |
continue to hate him. He has told me he is sorry for what he has done, | :53:22. | :53:26. | |
and he has said he is willing to accept the penalty of the | :53:27. | :53:30. | |
consequences of his action. And, to me, if I can just start making | :53:31. | :53:35. | |
changes, then ten one was part of the programme remade, and so | :53:36. | :53:38. | |
ultimately people will be aware of what we have done at hopefully that | :53:39. | :53:41. | |
will be a deterrent for them so it will start to make the for people. | :53:42. | :53:46. | |
Lewis Stratford is now preparing to go to jail. He is. He has told me he | :53:47. | :53:51. | |
is scared, but he is willing to accept it. As part of iGas is coping | :53:52. | :53:58. | |
mechanism, he has looked into what he needs to do, and speaking to be | :53:59. | :54:06. | |
hopped. Let me read some comments from people who are reacting to your | :54:07. | :54:09. | |
meeting with Lewis Stratford, and also the fact the penalties are | :54:10. | :54:16. | |
increasing today. Steve said this man deserves some credit. There was | :54:17. | :54:23. | |
probably the hardest thing he has done. He knows it was wrong and he | :54:24. | :54:27. | |
accepted. This person says I think the public victimisation is a bit | :54:28. | :54:31. | |
sick, people don't concentrate 100% while driving all the time. It is | :54:32. | :54:35. | |
natural. The only difference with Lewis Stratford is that he was | :54:36. | :54:40. | |
having a full on argument with his ex-girlfriend on the phone, very | :54:41. | :54:44. | |
emotionally charged. And driving angrily towards her home. Which is | :54:45. | :54:53. | |
not just a little bit distracting, it led to that. Somebody has said we | :54:54. | :54:58. | |
are victimising him, it has not been like that at all. It certainly did | :54:59. | :55:03. | |
not come across like that at all. He agreed to do it, and as part of his | :55:04. | :55:11. | |
closure, it was something he wanted to work with to deter others. | :55:12. | :55:17. | |
Whether it is an emotionally detached conversation, or picking up | :55:18. | :55:23. | |
the phone and moving it to the other side of the car it can be the | :55:24. | :55:26. | |
difference between somebody getting to the end of their journey or not. | :55:27. | :55:30. | |
What do you think about the increase of the sanctions? Is it enough? I am | :55:31. | :55:43. | |
emotionally charged by this because of how wrapped up I am by Gavin's | :55:44. | :55:49. | |
event. I don't think it is enough. I think it should be increased. ?200 | :55:50. | :55:52. | |
is not a lot of money to some people if they can afford to have a car and | :55:53. | :55:57. | |
a phone. So I personally would like to see some sort of deterrent, some | :55:58. | :56:10. | |
sort of, and across Europe they have graphically the advertisements to | :56:11. | :56:16. | |
make sure -- TV advertisements to make sure people know the | :56:17. | :56:20. | |
consequences. I think increasing it to ?1000 and some ban or driving | :56:21. | :56:24. | |
awareness course would be more beneficial but it is about | :56:25. | :56:26. | |
re-educating people. We know it is illegal, we should not be doing it, | :56:27. | :56:30. | |
and yet most of society have probably done it at some point. I | :56:31. | :56:33. | |
suggested that earlier and one woman was cross from the two sewing, she | :56:34. | :56:39. | |
said actually not all of us have, some of us are pretty sensible. This | :56:40. | :56:44. | |
viewer says new penalties for driving with a phone are still too | :56:45. | :56:51. | |
small. If we drive of a car, the financial penalty needs to be around | :56:52. | :56:54. | |
?1000 and the points should go to the maximum 12 straightaway. Thank | :56:55. | :56:59. | |
you very much for talking to us. Appreciate the work you are doing. | :57:00. | :57:04. | |
We will bring you the latest news and sport, but first the weather | :57:05. | :57:07. | |
with Carol. If you are thinking of travelling | :57:08. | :57:13. | |
later this evening or overnight, it is worth flagging this up, very | :57:14. | :57:16. | |
strong winds, even inland across southern counties of England, Wales, | :57:17. | :57:20. | |
East Anglia and the Midlands, gusting 50 to 60 mph, more than that | :57:21. | :57:24. | |
of the coast. I will tell you more about that too as we go through the | :57:25. | :57:28. | |
forecast. What we have this morning is very much varied weather, it is | :57:29. | :57:35. | |
Saint Davids Day, the Sun in Wembley this morning. We have one or two | :57:36. | :57:40. | |
from Neath. You can see from the sky it is a fairly still day. Peter. To | :57:41. | :57:46. | |
the day in Edinburgh with lovely blue skies. In camera too just a | :57:47. | :57:52. | |
little bit of cloud but still a very pleasant start to the data stop as | :57:53. | :57:56. | |
we come further south, we have a set of weather fronts already bringing | :57:57. | :58:00. | |
whether -- raining. They will continue to push across southern | :58:01. | :58:03. | |
counties including the Channel Islands and move a little bit | :58:04. | :58:06. | |
further north and east with as we had through the day. North of that | :58:07. | :58:10. | |
again, we have some showers, particularly across parts of | :58:11. | :58:13. | |
northern Scotland, the Pennines. Some of them could be wintry in | :58:14. | :58:16. | |
nature but most of that will be with height. Some showers across the far | :58:17. | :58:21. | |
north of Scotland, some in the Highlands but a lot of dry weather | :58:22. | :58:26. | |
this afternoon. A fair bit of sunshine, Edinburgh and Glasgow | :58:27. | :58:27. | |
peaking at six Celsius. Coming south into the Midlands | :58:28. | :58:39. | |
through Norfolk and Suffolk, we have that sunshine, North Wales, | :58:40. | :58:44. | |
Cheshires Abu Dhabi Cheshire, a similar story. Then the rain in the | :58:45. | :58:48. | |
southern counties through parts of south Wales as well. Behind this | :58:49. | :58:52. | |
band of rain things start to liven up, we are looking at strong winds | :58:53. | :58:55. | |
tonight, and there will also be rain. As it engages with the cold | :58:56. | :58:58. | |
air further north some hill snow, and some at lower levels. The Gaels | :58:59. | :59:04. | |
coming about tea-time across south-west England. Through the | :59:05. | :59:07. | |
evening and overnight continued across southern counties of England. | :59:08. | :59:13. | |
And we're looking at gusts of 50 to 60 mph. On the coast 60 to 70. That | :59:14. | :59:18. | |
is enough to bring down branches of trees, have some flying baby for | :59:19. | :59:22. | |
example and some tricky travelling conditions for high sided vehicles | :59:23. | :59:25. | |
and light vehicles. At the same time, a band of rain continues to | :59:26. | :59:28. | |
migrate northwards, by the time it gets the parts of North Wales, the | :59:29. | :59:33. | |
North Midlands, northern England and the south of Northern Ireland, we | :59:34. | :59:38. | |
will see the snow not just on the hills but at lower levels. As we | :59:39. | :59:42. | |
drift north of that, for the rest of northern Ireland and Scotland, it is | :59:43. | :59:45. | |
a cold night. Some frost around and the risk of ice on untreated | :59:46. | :59:49. | |
surfaces. First thing in the morning it will still be extremely windy in | :59:50. | :59:53. | |
the far south of the country, but quite quickly the wins will ease. It | :59:54. | :59:57. | |
will still be a windy day, just not as windy as overnight. Then you can | :59:58. | :00:07. | |
see a lot of dry weather but there was to be showers of the North, some | :00:08. | :00:10. | |
of them wintry. We have another system which keeps changing | :00:11. | :00:12. | |
positions so keep an eye on this, bringing raining from the | :00:13. | :00:12. | |
south-west. Coming up, more on the so | :00:13. | :00:15. | |
called wonder drug that We'll find more about Sovaldi. You | :00:16. | :00:35. | |
can't put a price on your life, can you? | :00:36. | :00:37. | |
REPORTER: You don't know that it is going to work. I couldn't go on as I | :00:38. | :00:39. | |
was so I had to make a decision. Why isn't it more widely | :00:40. | :00:46. | |
available the NHS? We'll be talking to | :00:47. | :00:49. | |
a former health minister The coach who couriered a mystery | :00:50. | :00:51. | |
package for Sir Bradley Wiggins in a race he went on to win is due | :00:52. | :01:00. | |
to give evidence to MPs later. This was to cure a medical | :01:01. | :01:10. | |
condition, the world governing body said this was not about trying to | :01:11. | :01:15. | |
find a way to gain an unfair advantage. | :01:16. | :01:22. | |
A test for Down's Syndrome is being made available on the NHS from next | :01:23. | :01:26. | |
year. There are warnings it could lead to an increase in the number of | :01:27. | :01:28. | |
adorations. We'll get reaction. Here's Joanna Gosling | :01:29. | :01:35. | |
in the BBC Newsroom Punishments for using a mobile phone | :01:36. | :01:37. | |
behind the wheel will double from today in England, | :01:38. | :01:41. | |
Wales and Scotland. Motorists face getting six points | :01:42. | :01:43. | |
on their licence and a ?200 fine. New drivers caught within two years | :01:44. | :01:45. | |
of passing their test With us now is Robert Hall, who's | :01:46. | :01:48. | |
in Huntingdon in Cambridgeshire. Tell us what's happening there, | :01:49. | :02:04. | |
Robert? Yes, good morning, Joanna. This really simple message which is | :02:05. | :02:08. | |
redrivers have been warned, but too many of us are just not listening to | :02:09. | :02:12. | |
the advice. The latest survey from one of the large motoring | :02:13. | :02:15. | |
organisations suggests that more than 30% of us now admit to using a | :02:16. | :02:19. | |
hand-held mobile or some other device at the wheel. It is really | :02:20. | :02:24. | |
very simple. If you do that, you will get six months on your licence | :02:25. | :02:28. | |
and you will get a ?200 fine. What you won't be allowed to do anymore | :02:29. | :02:34. | |
is take a drier awareness course which was a softer option for first | :02:35. | :02:38. | |
offenders. So the clampdown starts today. Police forces across the UK, | :02:39. | :02:42. | |
including here in Cambridgeshire, we were out with them yesterday, are on | :02:43. | :02:47. | |
the look-out in marked and unmarked vehicles. The message is very, very | :02:48. | :02:51. | |
simple, you do not use if you're driving a vehicle any hand-held | :02:52. | :02:56. | |
advice. That means you don't text or take pictures or watch things and | :02:57. | :02:59. | |
you don't unless it is fixed somewhere, use it as a navigational | :03:00. | :03:04. | |
device. The core message is we have got to take responsibility. We can't | :03:05. | :03:08. | |
rely on enforcement. We can't rely on the police and we can't rely on | :03:09. | :03:15. | |
the courts. If you have got a mobile phone if belongs in the glove box, | :03:16. | :03:17. | |
Joanna. Thank you very much, Robert. Donald Trump has promised | :03:18. | :03:24. | |
a "new chapter of American greatness" in his first | :03:25. | :03:26. | |
speech to Congress. He also appealed for unity, | :03:27. | :03:27. | |
saying the time for "trivial In an hour long speech he promised | :03:28. | :03:30. | |
extra spending on infrastructure, the military and pledged to tackle | :03:31. | :03:34. | |
illegal immigration and terrorism. We just need the courage to share | :03:35. | :03:40. | |
the dreams that fill our hearts. The bravery to express the hopes | :03:41. | :03:43. | |
that share our souls and the confidence to turn those | :03:44. | :03:45. | |
hopes and those dreams into action. From now on, America will be | :03:46. | :03:48. | |
empowered by our as per rations. From now on, America will be | :03:49. | :03:51. | |
empowered by our asperations. A new non-invasive test to detect | :03:52. | :04:01. | |
Down's Syndrome early on in pregnancy will be rolled out | :04:02. | :04:05. | |
next year on the NHS. There are concerns that the test | :04:06. | :04:08. | |
could be misused to selectively abort babies on the basis | :04:09. | :04:11. | |
of their sex. Policy advisors at the Nuffield | :04:12. | :04:13. | |
Council on Bioethics also warn introducing it on the NHS could lead | :04:14. | :04:15. | |
to an increase in the number of terminations following | :04:16. | :04:20. | |
a diagnosis of Down's Syndrome. Victoria will be speaking to women | :04:21. | :04:31. | |
who had to make decisions about Down's Syndrome in the next few | :04:32. | :04:32. | |
minutes. An appeal court in Thailand has | :04:33. | :04:35. | |
upheld the death sentences against two Burmese men | :04:36. | :04:37. | |
for the murders of two The two men were convicted | :04:38. | :04:39. | |
of the murders of Hannah Witheridge and David Miller in December 2015, | :04:40. | :04:43. | |
after a controversial investigation which was marred by questions over | :04:44. | :04:45. | |
the quality of the DNA testing That's a summary of | :04:46. | :04:48. | |
the latest BBC News. There is a lot of respect from you | :04:49. | :05:03. | |
from Meg Williamson who was on the programme talking about the meeting | :05:04. | :05:06. | |
she had with the driver who was on the phone when he crashed into her | :05:07. | :05:12. | |
boyfriend. Gavin was driving to work and he died. A lot of people saying | :05:13. | :05:18. | |
how strong she has been. This police officer says, "Goodness | :05:19. | :05:23. | |
me, an amazing strength of all involved in what is a massive | :05:24. | :05:27. | |
restorative justice programme. Programme." Another viewer says, | :05:28. | :05:35. | |
"What a brave lady. This is strong journalism." Steve says, "What a | :05:36. | :05:40. | |
lady. It is easy for her to hate the man who did this, yet she doesn't. I | :05:41. | :05:44. | |
hope they both find their peace." Thank you very much for those. We | :05:45. | :05:47. | |
will talk to a Chief Constable in the next hour. The national chiefs | :05:48. | :05:54. | |
police council for roads policing. Some of you say there aren't enough | :05:55. | :05:57. | |
officers out there. Do get in touch with us | :05:58. | :05:59. | |
throughout the morning - use the hashtag #VictoriaLIVE | :06:00. | :06:02. | |
and if you text, you will be charged Here's some sport now | :06:03. | :06:05. | |
with Katherine Downes. Newcastle have taken a big step | :06:06. | :06:07. | |
towards making an instant return They are top of the Championship | :06:08. | :06:10. | |
and above Brighton after beating Brighton were leading | :06:11. | :06:14. | |
until Newcastle had a real piece Mohamed Diame levelled | :06:15. | :06:18. | |
when Christian Atsu's shot Ayoze Perez completed the comeback | :06:19. | :06:24. | |
for Newcastle in the 89th minute, who now have an eight point lead | :06:25. | :06:30. | |
over third placed Huddersfield. Rumour has it that Roy Hodgson | :06:31. | :06:33. | |
is being lined up to be the next Hodgson has been out | :06:34. | :06:36. | |
of a job since this - England's humiliating defeat | :06:37. | :06:43. | |
to Iceland at last summer's Euros. Leicester sacked Claudio | :06:44. | :06:46. | |
Ranieri last week. They have declined | :06:47. | :06:50. | |
to comment on the possibility More on the rules of golf now, | :06:51. | :06:52. | |
the biggest set of changes in a generation are to be announced | :06:53. | :06:59. | |
this afternoon, according Our golf correspondent Iain Carter | :07:00. | :07:01. | |
joins me now for more on this. The biggest set of changes in a | :07:02. | :07:08. | |
generation and announced at lunch time so we're not 100% sure what | :07:09. | :07:13. | |
they are. But you've got an idea. Can you talk us through some of | :07:14. | :07:16. | |
them? The idea is to make the game easier to understand. Quicker to | :07:17. | :07:20. | |
play and more enjoyable. So I think what you will see is decisions made | :07:21. | :07:25. | |
that will mean that you won't get two shot penalties for things, for | :07:26. | :07:29. | |
inadvertent mistakes and those kind of things. I think it will be made | :07:30. | :07:36. | |
simpler. If you're taking a penalty drop or a free drop you will be able | :07:37. | :07:42. | |
to do that in a much less procedural way compared in other aspects of the | :07:43. | :07:45. | |
game. At the moment you have to hold your arm up at shoulder-height and | :07:46. | :07:50. | |
drop from there. You will be able to drop from much lower over the ground | :07:51. | :07:55. | |
and the idea is to keep the ball moving, keep play going and get rid | :07:56. | :08:01. | |
of the feelings of injustice that so many of us golfers feel when things | :08:02. | :08:08. | |
go awry and we feel we've been unfairly punished by the rules. I do | :08:09. | :08:13. | |
play golf. In 2019 when the rules come into play, I will be thinking | :08:14. | :08:16. | |
about how they will affect me differently, how I will be executing | :08:17. | :08:21. | |
them dimply on the course, but I was talking to Victoria earlier, she is | :08:22. | :08:25. | |
not a golfer. She says that these seem very minor from outside of the | :08:26. | :08:28. | |
game and they're not likely to entice her to play the sport which | :08:29. | :08:33. | |
is what this is all about, do you think that these are supposed to be | :08:34. | :08:37. | |
simp fugue the game and making it more attractive and getting people | :08:38. | :08:40. | |
in and play it. Do you think they will make any difference? They will. | :08:41. | :08:43. | |
I think collectively they will make a big difference. Individually, they | :08:44. | :08:47. | |
are minor adjustments and the fundamentals of the game will remain | :08:48. | :08:51. | |
exactly the same. It will be a simple ball and stick game in which | :08:52. | :08:54. | |
you're trying to get the ball into the hole in the fewest number of | :08:55. | :08:59. | |
shots. The idea is that you don't get bogged down in complicated rules | :09:00. | :09:04. | |
and that sort of thing and attracting penalty shots and | :09:05. | :09:07. | |
generally having the game working against you. The idea of the US GA | :09:08. | :09:12. | |
and the RNA is to make it more enjoyable, to make that rule book so | :09:13. | :09:16. | |
much easier to understand. At the moment, if you get into a difficulty | :09:17. | :09:21. | |
on the golf course, you open up the rule book and I'm a golf | :09:22. | :09:23. | |
correspondent and there are times when I'm scratching my head look at | :09:24. | :09:29. | |
it and saying, "What should I be doing next?" They are trying to get | :09:30. | :09:33. | |
away from it. Ian Kaerter, thank you. Has that convinced you to give | :09:34. | :09:39. | |
it a go? The world divides into people who play golf and people who | :09:40. | :09:45. | |
don't. Maybe that's really harsh. Give it a go. I'm washing my hair. I | :09:46. | :09:49. | |
have got no time! Next this morning, we're | :09:50. | :09:54. | |
going to take a look at tests for pregnant women which can detect | :09:55. | :09:57. | |
whether or not a baby is going to be At the moment the test, | :09:58. | :10:02. | |
which is called non-invasive pre-natal testing is only available | :10:03. | :10:14. | |
privately - that will change next year when it's | :10:15. | :10:16. | |
rolled out on the NHS. The tests are 99% accurate | :10:17. | :10:21. | |
and promise to reduce the risk of miscarriages linked | :10:22. | :10:24. | |
to the invasive amniocentesis test, previously the only way | :10:25. | :10:26. | |
of accurately diagnosing Down's. But there are warnings this morning | :10:27. | :10:28. | |
that it could be misused to selectively abort babies | :10:29. | :10:30. | |
on the basis of their sex. Policy advisors at the Nuffield | :10:31. | :10:33. | |
Council on Bioethics also warn introducing it on the NHS could lead | :10:34. | :10:35. | |
to an increase in the number of terminations following | :10:36. | :10:38. | |
a diagnosis of Down's Syndrome. They're launching their report | :10:39. | :10:40. | |
with the actress Sally Phillips, Last year she made a documentary | :10:41. | :10:42. | |
looking at the ethical issues When Olly was diagnosed 11 years | :10:43. | :10:48. | |
ago, I never could have imagined that our family was going to end up | :10:49. | :11:29. | |
looking like this. But although Olly is the reason | :11:30. | :11:34. | |
I started making this film, It's not just about Down's | :11:35. | :11:44. | |
syndrome either, it's a film that asks the question - | :11:45. | :11:52. | |
what kind of society And who do we think should be | :11:53. | :11:54. | |
allowed to live in it? So will it lead to an increase | :11:55. | :12:00. | |
in the number of abortions Lucienne's eight-year-old son Billy | :12:01. | :12:03. | |
has Down's Syndrome, and Nursev Morris, whose | :12:04. | :12:12. | |
eight-month-old baby She has had the NIPT blood test | :12:13. | :12:14. | |
with Benjamin which showed positive. Julia Langdon had amniocentesis | :12:15. | :12:19. | |
in the early 80s and decided In a moment we're hoping to speak | :12:20. | :12:22. | |
to Holly Riseborough who is 21 and has Down's Syndrome, | :12:23. | :12:29. | |
she's been on our pogramme before. I think you were 32 weeks pregnant | :12:30. | :12:37. | |
when you found out. How did you react? I had amniocentesis because | :12:38. | :12:44. | |
of complications in my pregnancy. I chose to have it. It came back with | :12:45. | :12:48. | |
the initial screening as having a high chance of having a child with | :12:49. | :12:52. | |
Down's Syndrome, but I chose not to have am neo at that point because of | :12:53. | :12:56. | |
the risk of miscarriage and I knew I was going to have my child whether | :12:57. | :12:59. | |
it had Down's Syndrome or not, but when I was given a diagnosis, I was | :13:00. | :13:05. | |
shock. I didn't know anyone with Down's Syndrome. I had the outdated | :13:06. | :13:10. | |
notion that a life with Down's Syndrome would be devastating for my | :13:11. | :13:15. | |
child, devastating for me, changing my life, my whole family's life. I | :13:16. | :13:22. | |
like to say that now my son is seven actually, seven years down the line, | :13:23. | :13:27. | |
it isn't anything like the dismal life I expected to have at that | :13:28. | :13:32. | |
point of diagnosis. Billy has a very fulfilling life. He's doing very | :13:33. | :13:38. | |
well at school. And he enhances our family like any other child that, | :13:39. | :13:42. | |
our other son that we have. So yeah, I was devastated, but now, you know, | :13:43. | :13:48. | |
it's a joyous thing. It really is. How is Benjamin doing? He's thriving | :13:49. | :13:59. | |
as well as you can see. Absolutely. You had the test when you found out | :14:00. | :14:04. | |
that Benjamin was going to be Down's how did you and your partner react? | :14:05. | :14:08. | |
It was a big shockment we went through a type of mourning process, | :14:09. | :14:13. | |
you know, first of all, we had the gender because we had it privately | :14:14. | :14:19. | |
so we were looking forward to having a girl. It's another boy because we | :14:20. | :14:25. | |
have a seven-year-old boy who is an amazing big brother. Sorry, my | :14:26. | :14:31. | |
darling, come. For us, we went lieu this mourning process of what's it | :14:32. | :14:34. | |
going to mean for his life? Is he going to be able to get married, | :14:35. | :14:38. | |
have children, have a happy life, have a good job, all these things | :14:39. | :14:42. | |
you hope for your children. And for us, we were glad that we had the NIP | :14:43. | :14:47. | |
test because it gave us time to go through that process before having | :14:48. | :14:51. | |
Benjamin. Whereas if we found out after giving birth at that point it | :14:52. | :14:55. | |
would have been much more difficult to go through that process then to | :14:56. | :14:59. | |
build the bond, the relationship, and so we were glad we had it and | :15:00. | :15:04. | |
I've had it again with this new pregnancy. This time on the NHS, so | :15:05. | :15:10. | |
we weren't informed of the sex, but we got a low risk for Down's | :15:11. | :15:15. | |
Syndrome which again gave us peace of mind and now we can just focus on | :15:16. | :15:19. | |
enjoying the pregnancy and getting ready for our child to come. | :15:20. | :15:25. | |
We can talk to Holly Rice pro who has been on the programme before. | :15:26. | :15:31. | |
How are you? I think we need to open your microphone, just give me one | :15:32. | :15:36. | |
sect, can you hear me? Yes, I can. We can hear you now. How are you? | :15:37. | :15:44. | |
Fine, thank you. To keep talking to us again. I remember last time you | :15:45. | :15:47. | |
said that you love gymnastics, what is biggest achievement? I went to | :15:48. | :15:56. | |
America. I really enjoyed it, it was such a big achievement really. Very | :15:57. | :16:00. | |
good. Absolutely. You are telling us as well about working at Tesco, how | :16:01. | :16:04. | |
is that going? Really good thank you. I work on checkouts, and I am | :16:05. | :16:14. | |
really enjoying it at Tesco's. Is that one day a week at the moment? | :16:15. | :16:23. | |
Yes. That is it. And what would you say is the best thing about your | :16:24. | :16:31. | |
life? The best thing in my life, I am in college, acting, modelling, | :16:32. | :16:43. | |
acting, dancing outside of college. What about your mum and dad, how | :16:44. | :16:50. | |
supportive are they? Oh, mum... My mum has like really supported me | :16:51. | :16:55. | |
really, because she is there all the time, and my dad, he has always | :16:56. | :17:01. | |
dealt with me all the time, because he always can always looks after me | :17:02. | :17:07. | |
every single time. Wow. That is lovely to hear, Holly. Thank you so | :17:08. | :17:10. | |
much for coming on the programme, really nice to talk to you again. | :17:11. | :17:17. | |
OK. Thanks, Holly. Take care. Take care. Julie Comey you had prenatal | :17:18. | :17:25. | |
screening in the 80s, and you decided to have a termination I | :17:26. | :17:30. | |
think in 1982. Tell us a little bit about that. Well, I was 36, rising | :17:31. | :17:37. | |
37 at the time. I had become pregnant by accident. And I was not | :17:38. | :17:43. | |
in the position to look after a disabled child, and I asked for | :17:44. | :17:47. | |
amniocentesis and I was initially refused because at the time they | :17:48. | :17:56. | |
only started testing at 37. They said I was more likely to miscarry | :17:57. | :17:59. | |
from the tests than to have a Down's baby. I pointed out that if I | :18:00. | :18:04. | |
miscarried from the test I could get pregnant again, but if I had a | :18:05. | :18:08. | |
Down's baby I was in no position to look after it, I would have to quit | :18:09. | :18:12. | |
work, and not saying that open my work before my children, I wouldn't | :18:13. | :18:16. | |
of course, but I wasn't in the right circumstances. And my pregnancy was | :18:17. | :18:24. | |
proved to be Down's. And I realised then that actually I had taken the | :18:25. | :18:28. | |
decision already when I had asked for the test and successfully | :18:29. | :18:35. | |
secured it. I had to give birth. It was a very traumatic and difficult | :18:36. | :18:42. | |
time. My partner and I were very, very traumatised by it obviously but | :18:43. | :18:48. | |
we went on to have two lovely children when things were sorted | :18:49. | :18:53. | |
between us. Let me ask you all about this test that has been rolled out | :18:54. | :18:56. | |
on the NHS. At the moment you can only get it privately, as I said. It | :18:57. | :19:02. | |
is noninvasive, a much reduced risk of miscarriage. Do you think it is a | :19:03. | :19:09. | |
good thing, Lucienne, that it will be available more widely? I think as | :19:10. | :19:12. | |
long as it is handled with the enormity that it implies then it | :19:13. | :19:16. | |
could be a good thing, absolutely. But we need to Mitchell that if we | :19:17. | :19:20. | |
are talking about Down's syndrome... There are two things I want to ask | :19:21. | :19:25. | |
you about, firstly Down's syndrome, and termination is based on the sex | :19:26. | :19:29. | |
of the child, which this can show. In terms of down syndrome, they need | :19:30. | :19:34. | |
to make sure there is support out there if you are given a positive | :19:35. | :19:38. | |
diagnosis of down syndrome that you are given balanced information. It | :19:39. | :19:42. | |
is all about both sides of the story. So that the idea in my mind | :19:43. | :19:54. | |
of the NIPT for Down's syndrome is to give people time to prepare for | :19:55. | :19:58. | |
having a disabled child. They need to have both sides of the story of | :19:59. | :20:04. | |
life with down syndrome. It isn't easy, as you know, it does have its | :20:05. | :20:07. | |
difficulties, but doesn't parenting anyway? Yes. And you were not given | :20:08. | :20:15. | |
both sides, as you put it? No. I run a down syndrome support group | :20:16. | :20:19. | |
currently and I know the still goes on in the NHS. I was told, I'm | :20:20. | :20:25. | |
sorry, by my GP, that I have a child with Down's syndrome. I was given no | :20:26. | :20:29. | |
up-to-date information, no signposting to support groups, no | :20:30. | :20:32. | |
idea of what life with down syndrome would be full stop what about you, | :20:33. | :20:38. | |
were you? Exactly the same situation. I am still waiting for | :20:39. | :20:42. | |
counselling, he is a year. No support. They did not give us any | :20:43. | :20:46. | |
positive information, and it was the same actually when we paid privately | :20:47. | :20:50. | |
to have the NIPT. We received no information from them. And from the | :20:51. | :20:57. | |
NHS side, we were pushed to abort, were repeatedly asked are you still | :20:58. | :21:00. | |
committed to the pregnancy, I used committed to the pregnancy, at every | :21:01. | :21:04. | |
consultant appointment we were told I'm sorry... Do they not have an | :21:05. | :21:09. | |
application -- obligation to check your state of mind by asking that | :21:10. | :21:16. | |
question? Yes, maybe in the first meeting, but when we said we are | :21:17. | :21:19. | |
Christians, we have said from the outset we are not going to be | :21:20. | :21:22. | |
aborting our child, we are going to go ahead, we just need your support | :21:23. | :21:27. | |
now. What does it mean, having Down's syndrome? The explanation we | :21:28. | :21:32. | |
received from the consultant, well, you know, these days it doesn't mean | :21:33. | :21:36. | |
much, you know. They lived a bit longer so it's all right, and he | :21:37. | :21:39. | |
will never be a rocket scientist, he will never be Prime Minister, but it | :21:40. | :21:43. | |
is all right because Down's kids are good with music. Oh my gosh, are you | :21:44. | :21:50. | |
joking me? I wish I was. It happens time and time again. Through my | :21:51. | :21:57. | |
support groups, those who continue to have the pregnancy, they are | :21:58. | :22:00. | |
constantly reminded, are you sure, it is not too late? This has to | :22:01. | :22:05. | |
stop. There needs to be set protocols that professionals have to | :22:06. | :22:10. | |
follow if you continue to have a pregnancy with a child with down | :22:11. | :22:14. | |
syndrome. Let me ask you about the warning from the Nuffield council | :22:15. | :22:18. | |
about this test being more widely available and therefore there are | :22:19. | :22:21. | |
concerns it might lead to terminations on the basis of the sex | :22:22. | :22:25. | |
of the child. Sex elect of terminations. What do you think of | :22:26. | :22:30. | |
that? I don't think that is desirable at all. They're obviously | :22:31. | :22:33. | |
cultural issues here and I think that would be very alarming. My only | :22:34. | :22:40. | |
point is I think that women, parents, should be able to choose if | :22:41. | :22:47. | |
they want to raise a disabled child. I have two friends who have had | :22:48. | :22:56. | |
Down's babies, and they have had a very different, well, difficult | :22:57. | :23:08. | |
lives, but one has been very happy. The little girl is quite disabled, | :23:09. | :23:17. | |
quite severely disabled. So I do know and I understand, but I think | :23:18. | :23:23. | |
it should not be used for selective choice of what sort of baby you | :23:24. | :23:27. | |
want, designer babies as we call it, of course. Let me read the messages | :23:28. | :23:33. | |
from people around the country. The street from lose the label, defining | :23:34. | :23:36. | |
a person by their diagnosis is dehumanising. Please say a baby with | :23:37. | :23:43. | |
Down's or a person with Down's please. Joe says we should be | :23:44. | :23:49. | |
ashamed for introducing these Down's test, it's just that to say whatever | :23:50. | :23:54. | |
not worth living. Elisabeth says all NHS staff need to be educated with | :23:55. | :23:57. | |
up-to-date information on Down's syndrome. Kerry says who among us is | :23:58. | :24:03. | |
qualified to judge who is deserving of life and who isn't? Thank you | :24:04. | :24:06. | |
very much all for coming on the programme. Good luck with your third | :24:07. | :24:10. | |
one, good luck. Your own experiences are very welcome, as you know. | :24:11. | :24:20. | |
Voters in Northern Ireland will go to the polls | :24:21. | :24:22. | |
The assembly there collapsed in a row over the spiralling | :24:23. | :24:25. | |
costs to fund a green fuel incentive scheme. | :24:26. | :24:27. | |
But it's again highlighted how, despite years of peace building, | :24:28. | :24:30. | |
Our reporter Declan Harvey's been in Armagh to ask a group of young | :24:31. | :24:34. | |
mums what they'd like to see politicians do so the next | :24:35. | :24:37. | |
When the Good Friday agreement was signed to 20 years ago, pretty much | :24:38. | :24:46. | |
all of the violence on the streets ended. What about the promises of | :24:47. | :24:50. | |
bringing the community closer together again? Well, divides still | :24:51. | :24:58. | |
exist. Of course it is not a concern when there are dolls to be addressed | :24:59. | :25:02. | |
and blocks to be built, but their mums hope these toddlers will never | :25:03. | :25:05. | |
know the experiences they had growing up in the split community. I | :25:06. | :25:14. | |
remember the police standing at the back of our house, as you are making | :25:15. | :25:17. | |
your breakfast going to school, they were standing at the bus stop. It | :25:18. | :25:23. | |
was something where you kind of thought, not like there he has a | :25:24. | :25:27. | |
gun, it was just there are soldiers on the streets, that is what | :25:28. | :25:32. | |
happened. People in England thought whenever you see on the news, | :25:33. | :25:35. | |
wannabe went across the road there were bullets over your head, and it | :25:36. | :25:39. | |
was not like that. Going to school was a wee bit different because you | :25:40. | :25:43. | |
felt the Dubai there. We all went to one or the other, so when you with | :25:44. | :25:46. | |
your friends, you were probably that we get more -- we felt the divide | :25:47. | :25:51. | |
fair. There has been changes in the last 20 years from what the troubles | :25:52. | :25:55. | |
were. It has got a lot more liberated and mixed and peaceful but | :25:56. | :25:59. | |
it could still come on a good bit as well. Everyone in Northern Ireland | :26:00. | :26:05. | |
has taken large steps forward, but what signs are there these days? I | :26:06. | :26:12. | |
would say certain names, catholic names and Protestant names, certain | :26:13. | :26:14. | |
names would have certain backgrounds and they would not always certainly | :26:15. | :26:18. | |
go to a certain pub or bar if you have that name, because you might | :26:19. | :26:25. | |
just be singled out. Kerbstones painted, lamp posts painted just so | :26:26. | :26:28. | |
you know what area you are in generally. A common complaint about | :26:29. | :26:33. | |
politicians here is how they avoid talking about day-to-day issues and | :26:34. | :26:37. | |
instead focus on Northern Ireland's place within the UK. Politicians who | :26:38. | :26:42. | |
put leaflets through my door, I would like to have no flag on it, I | :26:43. | :26:45. | |
would like to have a list of what their policies are for health, | :26:46. | :26:49. | |
education, the environment. Because what comes through your door is | :26:50. | :26:52. | |
coloured one side or the other but you don't know what they are | :26:53. | :26:59. | |
actually going to stand for. These mums come from across the community, | :27:00. | :27:03. | |
but when we asked what is the one thing they would like to see changed | :27:04. | :27:07. | |
after the election, they all gave the same answer. Integrated schools. | :27:08. | :27:11. | |
Integrated education is where anybody no matter what religion you | :27:12. | :27:16. | |
are, what your background is, you grow up in the same school, all | :27:17. | :27:22. | |
religions are taught to all of the children, they don't know any | :27:23. | :27:26. | |
different. As it stands, 93% of schools available for these kids | :27:27. | :27:30. | |
identify as being either majority catholic or Protestant. In my own | :27:31. | :27:34. | |
peer group, there are still some parents who have that opinion of | :27:35. | :27:38. | |
them and us. Their children go here and our children do this. Their | :27:39. | :27:42. | |
primary school and our primary school and their secondary and | :27:43. | :27:45. | |
arrows. The first integrated school opened in the committee one but | :27:46. | :27:48. | |
growth has slowed, despite funding being promised. Existing schools are | :27:49. | :27:53. | |
offering schemes where students can collaborate on mixed projects. None | :27:54. | :27:59. | |
of the five biggest parties in Northern Ireland support more | :28:00. | :28:02. | |
division, but they vary in their appetite for abandoning religious | :28:03. | :28:06. | |
lead schools. A review is being held but it is one of the many things | :28:07. | :28:11. | |
delayed by this snap election. It is very frustrating. It could be all | :28:12. | :28:16. | |
talk. When I look through the leaflets that come through the door, | :28:17. | :28:20. | |
the first thing I look for is the politicians's view on integrated | :28:21. | :28:24. | |
education. Why does it have to be one-sided or the other? These mums | :28:25. | :28:28. | |
talk about how being taught in separate schools affected them but | :28:29. | :28:31. | |
they say the best thing that can be done now is to scrap the system | :28:32. | :28:34. | |
before their kids which the classroom. | :28:35. | :28:34. | |
That election is tomorrow - full results on BBC News on Friday. | :28:35. | :28:38. | |
Still to come in the last half hour... | :28:39. | :28:44. | |
about a new "wonder drug" for Hepatitis C and allegations that | :28:45. | :28:49. | |
a charity campaigning to get the NHS to provide it has received money | :28:50. | :28:52. | |
We will talk to the mum of a baby who was born 23 weeks early and | :28:53. | :28:57. | |
survived surgery in the first six days of her life. | :28:58. | :29:01. | |
Coming up to half ten, here's the latest news will stop punishments | :29:02. | :29:08. | |
for using a mobile phone behind the wheel will double today from | :29:09. | :29:11. | |
England, Wales and Scotland. Motorists face six point on the | :29:12. | :29:13. | |
license and a ?200 fine. New drivers caught within two years | :29:14. | :29:16. | |
of passing their test We just need the courage to share | :29:17. | :29:21. | |
the dreams that fill our hearts. The bravery to express the hopes | :29:22. | :29:49. | |
that share our souls and the confidence to turn those | :29:50. | :29:53. | |
hopes and those dreams into action. From now on, America will be | :29:54. | :30:00. | |
empowered by our asperations. Francois Fillon, who only weeks | :30:01. | :30:03. | |
ago was the frontrunner for the French presidency, | :30:04. | :30:08. | |
is to make a statement later after pulling out | :30:09. | :30:10. | |
of a key campaign event. Financial police have been | :30:11. | :30:15. | |
investigating allegations that he paid his wife and children | :30:16. | :30:17. | |
parliamentary salaries for bogus work, accusations | :30:18. | :30:19. | |
which they all deny. He's giving a news conference at | :30:20. | :30:26. | |
11am. Katherine Downes has | :30:27. | :30:38. | |
the sport headlines now. Last night - Brighton | :30:39. | :30:41. | |
or Newcastle could have gone top of the Championship - | :30:42. | :30:43. | |
after their top of the table clash last night, it is Newcastle | :30:44. | :30:47. | |
who are top of the tree for now. Brighton lead for most of the match | :30:48. | :30:50. | |
but Newcastle scored twice in the last ten minutes to go | :30:51. | :30:53. | |
four points clear. The rumours are that Roy Hodgson | :30:54. | :30:56. | |
is being lined up to replace The former England manager | :30:57. | :30:58. | |
is bookies favourite to take over. And golf's rule-makers are set | :30:59. | :31:04. | |
to announce what they're calling "the biggest set of changes | :31:05. | :31:12. | |
in a generation". They're introducing new rules | :31:13. | :31:14. | |
to make the game simpler and quicker to play to try | :31:15. | :31:16. | |
and encourage more people Having spoken about it for most of | :31:17. | :31:23. | |
the morning I haven't managed to persuade Victoria to pick up her | :31:24. | :31:28. | |
clubs and have a go. But we won't keep on going on about if! | :31:29. | :31:36. | |
The former British cycling coach who delivered a "mystery" package | :31:37. | :31:38. | |
to Sir Bradley Wiggins on the eve of his win at a big race in France | :31:39. | :31:42. | |
in 2011 will today give evidence at a government inquiry into doping. | :31:43. | :31:45. | |
He delivered it to a doctor called Richard Freeman who was also due | :31:46. | :31:49. | |
to give evidence at the Culture, Media and Sport Select Committee | :31:50. | :31:52. | |
inquiry this afternoon, but now says he's ill | :31:53. | :31:54. | |
Team Sky boss Sir Dave Brailsford says he was told the package | :31:55. | :31:57. | |
contained a legal decongestant, but MPs say they are concerned by | :31:58. | :32:00. | |
So what questions remain about Sir Bradley Wiggins | :32:01. | :32:08. | |
W Here is a padded envelope. On the last day of the cycle race in 2011, | :32:09. | :32:21. | |
it was delivered to Team Sky. Simon Cope, who worked for British cycling | :32:22. | :32:27. | |
from Manchester to Geneva before heading into France to hand it to | :32:28. | :32:32. | |
the Team Sky doctor, Richard Freeman. Shane Sutton says Richard | :32:33. | :32:36. | |
Freeman gave the contents to Bradley Wiggins. So what was in the package? | :32:37. | :32:41. | |
Its contents haven't been independently confirmed. Sir Dave | :32:42. | :32:45. | |
Brailsford, the Team Sky boss, told MPs in December that the package | :32:46. | :32:53. | |
contained a deacon guestant. There is the rules and then there is the | :32:54. | :32:57. | |
principle and our values and our values and our principles are very, | :32:58. | :33:00. | |
very clear. We race clean and that's it. (BLEEP). But there are some | :33:01. | :33:05. | |
questions outstanding such as why couldn't the team just buy the | :33:06. | :33:10. | |
deacon guestant local? Is there a paper trail to back up claims what | :33:11. | :33:14. | |
was in it, why did Simon Cope not bother to check what was in it and | :33:15. | :33:18. | |
if the contents were destined for Bradley Wiggins then why was he | :33:19. | :33:22. | |
taking a deacon guestant which is not meant to be used by atmatics as | :33:23. | :33:30. | |
Wiggins is one? It is not the first time Bradley Wiggins faced questions | :33:31. | :33:36. | |
about the way he used medication. This is was to cure a medical | :33:37. | :33:40. | |
condition and the world doping agency and everyone said this was | :33:41. | :33:43. | |
about, this wasn't about trying to find a way to gain an unfair | :33:44. | :33:47. | |
advantage, this was about putting myself back on a level playing | :33:48. | :33:53. | |
field. Despite what is known about the package, questions still remain | :33:54. | :33:57. | |
about its contents. A UK anti-doping investigation into the package is | :33:58. | :34:01. | |
still on going. There is no suggestion either Bradley Wiggins or | :34:02. | :34:02. | |
Team Sky have broken any rules. Let's talk now to MP | :34:03. | :34:09. | |
Chris Matheson a Labour MP who sits on the Culture, | :34:10. | :34:11. | |
Media, and Sport Select Committee who are conducting this inquiry | :34:12. | :34:14. | |
into doping and Matt Lawton, Chief Sports Reporter | :34:15. | :34:16. | |
of the Daily Mail who has been investigating what was | :34:17. | :34:18. | |
in the package. He's just won an award | :34:19. | :34:20. | |
for his journalism at the Sports Journalists' Association | :34:21. | :34:22. | |
Awards. Right, Chris, the only other person | :34:23. | :34:26. | |
apart from Bradley Wiggins who can tell you what's in the package is Dr | :34:27. | :34:30. | |
Rup ard Freeman. He can't now come to give evidence this afternoon. Why | :34:31. | :34:35. | |
not? Apparently, he's not well. We offered him the opportunity to give | :34:36. | :34:38. | |
evidence by video conference as well and he didn't want to do that. We | :34:39. | :34:42. | |
will be writing to him to get answers to the questions that we | :34:43. | :34:46. | |
still need answers to, but I would have preferred to see him at the | :34:47. | :34:50. | |
committee. Will you call him at another time? We will keep that | :34:51. | :34:53. | |
option open. How ill is he? I don't know. I haven't asked. Why is | :34:54. | :34:59. | |
Richard Freeman the only person who would know what's in the package? | :35:00. | :35:04. | |
123450 There was the third person. There is the physiotherapist at | :35:05. | :35:07. | |
British cycling who was asked to pull it off-the-shelf in the store | :35:08. | :35:11. | |
and package it up. So, but yeah, there are three people that would | :35:12. | :35:16. | |
know for sure that had eyes on the package if you like. And would know | :35:17. | :35:20. | |
which drug was administered. We believe a drug was administered | :35:21. | :35:24. | |
because Shane Sutton, who was Wiggins' coach told the committee in | :35:25. | :35:28. | |
December that Freeman told him the drug had been administered that day. | :35:29. | :35:33. | |
After the race. OK. And just explain why you would administer a drug | :35:34. | :35:38. | |
after a race when it has been won? Well, the reason that we have been | :35:39. | :35:42. | |
given is because Bradley Wiggins was ill towards the end of the race. | :35:43. | :35:46. | |
What is slightly troubling about that version of events that Dave | :35:47. | :35:49. | |
Brailsford presented to the committee in December is the fact | :35:50. | :35:55. | |
that British cycling then submitted Simon Cope's expenses documents to | :35:56. | :35:59. | |
the committee. Simon Cope was the man who through from Britain to | :36:00. | :36:02. | |
Geneva and drove to France with the package? Yes, but what we know, this | :36:03. | :36:07. | |
is a seven day race. Wiggins won the race, if he was ill, then he was | :36:08. | :36:12. | |
presumably ill mid-way through the race because Simon Cope was asked to | :36:13. | :36:17. | |
go and get the package and travel to Manchester to get the package on 8th | :36:18. | :36:24. | |
June 2011, he didn't arrive in France for Freeman to treat Wiggins | :36:25. | :36:29. | |
until 12th June. So what we have is a situation where he was given the | :36:30. | :36:33. | |
medication that they could have nipped across a road in France and | :36:34. | :36:38. | |
in a pharmacy bought. If Bradley Wiggins was ill, the doctor had to | :36:39. | :36:43. | |
tell Bradley Wiggins he would have to wait four days to treat him. For | :36:44. | :36:49. | |
you that raises question marks? I find that implausible. I find it | :36:50. | :36:54. | |
worrying. You will know that Sir Dave Brailsford has said over and | :36:55. | :36:58. | |
over again, we have done nothing wrong. The package contained this | :36:59. | :37:06. | |
deacon guestant, although Dave Brailsford had not seen what was in | :37:07. | :37:10. | |
the package, but that's what he told you in evidence. Why don't you | :37:11. | :37:16. | |
believe it was the deacon guestant? It is not that I don't believe. It's | :37:17. | :37:19. | |
the evidence. It's the evidence that we have. There was an allegation, | :37:20. | :37:23. | |
this began with an allegation which was a story I was told about the | :37:24. | :37:27. | |
package. I began to ask questions about the package. I directed my | :37:28. | :37:33. | |
questions to British cycling, Team Sky, and Bradley Wiggins' | :37:34. | :37:39. | |
representatives and then what followed was this attempt to | :37:40. | :37:43. | |
basically deny that there was even a trip with a medical package to | :37:44. | :37:48. | |
France because I was initially told by Sir Dave Brailsford that Simon | :37:49. | :37:52. | |
Cope did not travel to deliver a medical package, but to meet a | :37:53. | :37:58. | |
female British cyclist called Emma Pooley and that's why he was there. | :37:59. | :38:02. | |
We discovered that she wasn't even in France that day, she was in | :38:03. | :38:06. | |
Spain. So things didn't add up from what you had been told. However, | :38:07. | :38:11. | |
Dave Brailsford and Bradley Wiggins say they haven't broken any rules. | :38:12. | :38:15. | |
Well, look, all we've done so far Victoria is ask the question and all | :38:16. | :38:19. | |
I have done is report the responses to the questions that I've asked | :38:20. | :38:21. | |
based on the allegation that was made to me in the first place, you | :38:22. | :38:25. | |
know, it is the way we work as journalists. An allegation is made, | :38:26. | :38:29. | |
you ask the question and this is the response. The version of events | :38:30. | :38:35. | |
doesn't seem to add up because they went to this trouble where a guy | :38:36. | :38:39. | |
went on a train from the South Coast to Manchester and flew out three | :38:40. | :38:43. | |
days later and it is available over the counter in France for eight | :38:44. | :38:47. | |
euros. You had a two hour meeting with Dave Brailsford, the subject | :38:48. | :38:54. | |
didn't come up then, you weren't told then? No. My original | :38:55. | :39:00. | |
questions, there was something like, it was over a week between my | :39:01. | :39:06. | |
original questions and that meeting so no, that's not quite true. There | :39:07. | :39:09. | |
was four or five days between my original questions and that meeting | :39:10. | :39:14. | |
and no, the drug wasn't mentioned. There was over a week before we | :39:15. | :39:17. | |
prunted the story. So that meeting was on the Tuesday and it was the | :39:18. | :39:20. | |
Thursday the following week that we actually ran the story and at no | :39:21. | :39:29. | |
time in that period, were we ever given Flumasil as a reason. | :39:30. | :39:41. | |
Do you think Flumasil was in that package? It is not suitable to be | :39:42. | :39:47. | |
given to people with asthma and we understand that Bradley Wiggins has | :39:48. | :39:50. | |
asthma. At we have had more questions than | :39:51. | :40:10. | |
answers. Everything is murky. It could have been Flumazenil in | :40:11. | :40:13. | |
there. What questions do you need to ask? We need to ask Mr Pooley what | :40:14. | :40:19. | |
was in the package. It was him that was transporting it and taking it on | :40:20. | :40:22. | |
to planes, he should have known what was in there. Mr Pooley? Mr Cope. | :40:23. | :40:28. | |
Simon Cope. Mr Cope, we need to be asking him if he knew what was in | :40:29. | :40:34. | |
the package? Why didn't he know? Why was he doing this courier job when | :40:35. | :40:38. | |
he is supposed to be the manager of the women's team and where do his | :40:39. | :40:44. | |
responsibilities to Team Sky begin and his responsibilities for UK | :40:45. | :40:49. | |
cycling. Have you requested that Bradley Wiggins come before you? We | :40:50. | :40:53. | |
haven't yet. It would seem to be a no brainer. We will see what Mr Cope | :40:54. | :40:59. | |
has to say. Why not? We are following the evidence. He was the | :41:00. | :41:03. | |
person who received the drugs being administered so he would know? At | :41:04. | :41:06. | |
the same time, of course, we are talking about issues that might be | :41:07. | :41:09. | |
considered medically confidential to him. So we have to respect that | :41:10. | :41:13. | |
medical confidentiality, but at some point... We all know he has got | :41:14. | :41:17. | |
asthma? Indeed. These are the questions we will be asking today. A | :41:18. | :41:23. | |
final word. The key thing in December Sir Dave Brailsford and the | :41:24. | :41:25. | |
British cycling president agreed with the committee that there should | :41:26. | :41:32. | |
be a paper trail that proves this that the package contained | :41:33. | :41:36. | |
Flumazenil I believe today the UK Chief Executive, the UK anti-doping | :41:37. | :41:38. | |
Chief Executive will confirm there is no paper trail. Thank you very | :41:39. | :41:44. | |
much. That Select Committee hearing is | :41:45. | :41:49. | |
this afternoon. And just to reiterate Sir Dave Brailsford and | :41:50. | :41:54. | |
Sir Bradley Wiggins have consistently denied any wrongdoing. | :41:55. | :41:59. | |
Sir Dave Brailsford told MPs that that package contained a legal | :42:00. | :42:06. | |
deacon guessant. we'll be talking to a former health | :42:07. | :42:24. | |
minister about a new "wonder drug" for Hepatitis C and allegations that | :42:25. | :42:27. | |
a charity campaigning to get the NHS to provide it has received money | :42:28. | :42:30. | |
from the drug's manufacturers. Surgeons believe they have | :42:31. | :42:32. | |
operated on the youngest patient ever to undergo - | :42:33. | :42:34. | |
and survive - major abdominal St George's Hospital in London | :42:35. | :42:37. | |
operated on a premature baby who was born at just 23 weeks | :42:38. | :42:41. | |
and was just six days old. Patient Abiageal Peters | :42:42. | :42:44. | |
weighed only 1.3 lbs - or 0.5 kilograms - | :42:45. | :42:46. | |
that's the weight of This bag of sugar - | :42:47. | :42:48. | |
when doctors realised Her intestine had ruptured in three | :42:49. | :42:50. | |
places because of a severe condition of the gut called | :42:51. | :42:58. | |
necrotizing enterocolitis. We can speak to her | :42:59. | :43:07. | |
mum Louise Peters. And the surgeon who carried out | :43:08. | :43:09. | |
the operation is Mr Zahid Mukhtar Hi both of you. Good morning. Hi | :43:10. | :43:21. | |
Louise, how are you? Very well. How are you? I'm very well, thank you. | :43:22. | :43:29. | |
Tell us about the birth of Abigail. Well, it certainly didn't go how we | :43:30. | :43:35. | |
expected it to. I was over half-way through my pregnancy and I was at | :43:36. | :43:40. | |
home on a Monday and my waters broke and I kind of wasn't really sure | :43:41. | :43:44. | |
what was happening to be honest and was in denial hoping that wasn't | :43:45. | :43:50. | |
what it was. So I had to get an ambulance to hospital and when I got | :43:51. | :43:52. | |
there, they said that's what happened and I ended up two days | :43:53. | :43:57. | |
later I went into labour and she was born at 23 weeks plus three days. | :43:58. | :44:07. | |
How was she then? Oh, she was tiny. She, she just, just bigger than the | :44:08. | :44:13. | |
size of my hand. She was a very strange colour, translucent skin and | :44:14. | :44:17. | |
they had to put her on life support. So, put a tube down her throat which | :44:18. | :44:22. | |
took them a while to do. So we were just sat there waiting for an update | :44:23. | :44:27. | |
on how she was because they said she could come out looking very ill and | :44:28. | :44:31. | |
probably wouldn't survive or if she looked strong then they would work | :44:32. | :44:37. | |
on her and rush her off to help her. So fortunately, they were able to | :44:38. | :44:42. | |
help her, but very scary. I'm not surprised. Really a very tough time | :44:43. | :44:47. | |
for you as you were just hoping that she would survive. When did it | :44:48. | :44:52. | |
become clear that she was going to need major surgery? Well, on about | :44:53. | :45:01. | |
day five. We were at St peter's and we had a bit of a honeymoon period | :45:02. | :45:06. | |
and we thought she was doing really well and she was in the incubator | :45:07. | :45:10. | |
and seemed stable and about day five she just started to deteriorate | :45:11. | :45:17. | |
badly and needed more oxygen and her stomach was starting to look very | :45:18. | :45:21. | |
plaque and looked bad and the doctors explained it could be a | :45:22. | :45:24. | |
general decline and that she was giving up the fight or it could be | :45:25. | :45:28. | |
that she had a problem with her bowel. So the ambulance came and we | :45:29. | :45:32. | |
were rushed over to St George's in case she did need surgery which she | :45:33. | :45:38. | |
did end up needing, but it was, yeah, day five, really. | :45:39. | :45:44. | |
Let me bring in Mr Mukhtar, clearly you are a very busy man, so I am | :45:45. | :45:53. | |
grateful for your time, but I wonder if you could give an insight to our | :45:54. | :45:57. | |
audience about this very important and risky surgery on such a tiny | :45:58. | :46:04. | |
baby? Yes, thank you for having us here, Victoria. It is a very unusual | :46:05. | :46:13. | |
situation where we had Abigail born at 23 weeks gestation. Babies very | :46:14. | :46:16. | |
rarely survive when they are born that early. She was a real fighter | :46:17. | :46:19. | |
and had a lot of tenacity and was coming through but unfortunately | :46:20. | :46:22. | |
developed this competition where she had ruptured her intestines. That in | :46:23. | :46:27. | |
itself has a very high mortality, very few babies survive that. Then | :46:28. | :46:32. | |
the decision to operate on that was a really difficult and tough one | :46:33. | :46:36. | |
well had to talk to her parents and the rest of her team and make that | :46:37. | :46:41. | |
decision. We have operated on small babies born at 25, 26 weeks | :46:42. | :46:46. | |
gestation before, that this is really the list we have ever done. | :46:47. | :46:51. | |
There is a difference in that Abigail, not only was she very | :46:52. | :46:55. | |
small, she was very premature, so her tissues were very fragile, very | :46:56. | :47:01. | |
jelly-like. So the surgery was very difficult. Even getting her to the | :47:02. | :47:05. | |
operating theatre alive and stable was quite a challenge and that is a | :47:06. | :47:10. | |
testament to our anaesthetic team who can keep tiny babies alive in | :47:11. | :47:15. | |
that sort of situation. During the surgery, my goodness, you can | :47:16. | :47:18. | |
imagine she would not have very much blood to lose. So we were really up | :47:19. | :47:25. | |
against it. Every drop was very precious. Even her tissues, her | :47:26. | :47:29. | |
intestines, her liver was so fragile that whatever you touched, even with | :47:30. | :47:33. | |
our very fine instruments, it would start to break down, so it was | :47:34. | :47:36. | |
really challenging. We were up against time as well because we | :47:37. | :47:40. | |
could not keep her sleep under the anaesthetic to too long. But | :47:41. | :47:45. | |
thankfully she came through. It is a real miracle and testament to the | :47:46. | :47:50. | |
team at Saint Georges, a group of about ten people who, and we have | :47:51. | :47:56. | |
built this experience up over the last ten or 20 years to do this sort | :47:57. | :48:08. | |
of stuff. Louise, how do you think somebody like Mr Mukhtar and his | :48:09. | :48:14. | |
team? You tell me? I said the same thing to my husband. I said, how do | :48:15. | :48:19. | |
you think someone who saved your baby's life? I remember seeing him | :48:20. | :48:22. | |
in the corridor at Saint Georges with one of his colleagues, and I | :48:23. | :48:26. | |
walked past, this was a few days after the surgery, and I am sure Mr | :48:27. | :48:31. | |
Mukhtar operates on later babies, and I shook his head and said | :48:32. | :48:34. | |
Frankie Simic were saving my baby's life, and he looked me, you probably | :48:35. | :48:37. | |
thought I was mad. I didn't know what else to say. I bought the unit | :48:38. | :48:43. | |
a little present when I left, but nothing could thank them enough for | :48:44. | :48:49. | |
what they have done for our Abbey. When is your Judaic, Louise? -- when | :48:50. | :48:58. | |
is your due date? It was a week last Sunday. She is just over four | :48:59. | :49:04. | |
months. I can see that Abigail is really peaceful but I really want a | :49:05. | :49:08. | |
better look at her, is that possible? If you don't want to | :49:09. | :49:11. | |
disturb her I would totally understand! I will do it, that if | :49:12. | :49:16. | |
she kicks off, it's your fault. OK, no props. Oh my gosh, she is | :49:17. | :49:24. | |
absolutely adorable, wow. She is just perfect, isn't she? She looks | :49:25. | :49:29. | |
much like a normal newborn now. Much bigger. She didn't start like this, | :49:30. | :49:37. | |
that is for sure. We saw the photograph is is she doing | :49:38. | :49:42. | |
generally? She is great, all of the normal niggles of a newborn baby. We | :49:43. | :49:46. | |
have had very little sleep the last couple of nights, but otherwise she | :49:47. | :49:50. | |
is breathing fantastically, and she is breathing fantastically, and | :49:51. | :49:53. | |
everything's working. She is wonderful, a real little miracle. | :49:54. | :49:57. | |
That is so good to hear. Thank you very much, and Zahid Mukhtar, thank | :49:58. | :50:05. | |
you so much for giving us your time, really appreciated. Fantastic story, | :50:06. | :50:10. | |
it is so good to bring you a good news story. Kevin says baby Abigail | :50:11. | :50:13. | |
is so adorable, so happy she is on the mend, loved her and her parents. | :50:14. | :50:16. | |
Hepatitis C is a debilitating illness. | :50:17. | :50:17. | |
Left untreated it can lead to cancer and liver failure. | :50:18. | :50:20. | |
A breakthrough drug taken once a day can now cure the disease for good | :50:21. | :50:23. | |
The problem is - it's so expensive that NHS England has said it can | :50:24. | :50:32. | |
This programme has now found out that a charity - | :50:33. | :50:36. | |
that tried to force the health service to give more | :50:37. | :50:38. | |
people the treatment - has received hundreds of thousands | :50:39. | :50:40. | |
of pounds from the US drugs giant that makes it. | :50:41. | :50:43. | |
Our reporter Jim Reed has been investigating - | :50:44. | :50:45. | |
we played you his full film earlier - here's a short extract. | :50:46. | :51:05. | |
Social and had been living with Pepsi. She was most likely affected | :51:06. | :51:10. | |
in her 20s when she was taking heroin for a short period. I put it | :51:11. | :51:14. | |
down to being a single mum, was working as a social worker at the | :51:15. | :51:17. | |
time, single mum with three boys. But the fatigue was just would kill | :51:18. | :51:22. | |
us. For millions, this could be the answer. In combination with other | :51:23. | :51:27. | |
drugs, it can cure Pepsi in eight weeks. The medicine's watchdog -- it | :51:28. | :51:35. | |
can cure hep c. But a tent of thousands of pounds per treatment, | :51:36. | :51:39. | |
NHS England did something it has never done before. It capped a | :51:40. | :51:44. | |
treatment, restricting it to 10,000 patients a year. If your condition | :51:45. | :51:48. | |
is not serious enough, you miss out. I knew there were a lot of cuts and | :51:49. | :51:53. | |
issues financially, so to be told we could not get treatment was | :51:54. | :51:56. | |
absolutely devastating. Across the world, the US drugs giant Gilead | :51:57. | :52:01. | |
which makes the drug has been targeted by protesters angry at the | :52:02. | :52:06. | |
high price. Health should be a right for every person! In a statement, | :52:07. | :52:08. | |
Gilead said... Brendan In England, it is not the drugs | :52:09. | :52:42. | |
industry but the NHS which has taken That's after it capped treatment | :52:43. | :52:45. | |
at 10,000 people a year, a fraction of the 215,000 living | :52:46. | :52:50. | |
with the disease. Charles Gore runs the Hepatitis C | :52:51. | :52:53. | |
Trust, which represents patients. This is not the most expensive drug | :52:54. | :52:55. | |
by any means across the NHS. That's the only bit I am railing | :52:56. | :52:58. | |
against the NHS for doing, is picking on people | :52:59. | :53:03. | |
with Hepatitis C and saying you're Everybody else gets the drugs | :53:04. | :53:05. | |
that Nice say they can Is it because it is | :53:06. | :53:09. | |
associated with drug use? Last year, the Hepatitis C Trust | :53:10. | :53:13. | |
made the unusual decision to take NHS England to the High Court, | :53:14. | :53:16. | |
to try and get that cap lifted. The charity lost, but it was unclear | :53:17. | :53:19. | |
at the time how its case was funded. The judge suggested it may have | :53:20. | :53:23. | |
been the drugs industry, which had a lot to gain financially, | :53:24. | :53:25. | |
that was really behind it. That's something the boss of the | :53:26. | :53:28. | |
Hepatitis C Trust strongly denies. You can categorically tell us | :53:29. | :53:31. | |
that there was no drug industry funding that went into the court | :53:32. | :53:33. | |
case, this was supporting... It might not have taken money | :53:34. | :53:35. | |
for the court case, but we have Over the last three years it's | :53:36. | :53:41. | |
accepted ?200,000 from Gilead, last year, a third | :53:42. | :53:44. | |
of its income, ?335,000, The charity denies that taking that | :53:45. | :53:46. | |
money has made it less likely to criticise Gilead | :53:47. | :53:50. | |
or other drug companies. Obviously people try and influence | :53:51. | :53:52. | |
us, the NHS tries and influence us, Pharma tries to influence us, | :53:53. | :53:55. | |
lots of people try to influence us, but we just come back | :53:56. | :53:58. | |
to the same thing - With little chance of NHS treatment, | :53:59. | :54:00. | |
Zoe ended up doing what hundreds of others with Hepatitis C | :54:01. | :54:04. | |
are now doing. She went online and bought a cheaper | :54:05. | :54:06. | |
generic copy of a drug from a developing country, | :54:07. | :54:09. | |
in this case Bangladesh. I couldn't go on like I was, | :54:10. | :54:11. | |
so I had to make a decision. In Zoe Buckman case it worked and | :54:12. | :54:17. | |
she is now cure but there are still tens of thousands of others living | :54:18. | :54:19. | |
with the disease who can't access treatment. | :54:20. | :54:20. | |
We can speak now to Zoe Sharam, who we saw there in Jim's film. | :54:21. | :54:23. | |
She was given the all clear last week. | :54:24. | :54:25. | |
In Cardiff is David Cowley - a former Hepetitis C patient | :54:26. | :54:28. | |
who was one of the first treated with the new type of drugs as part | :54:29. | :54:31. | |
And here is the Labour MP Liz McInnes, who has recently | :54:32. | :54:35. | |
chaired a conference on Hepatitis C. | :54:36. | :54:36. | |
Zoet, how are you feeling? I am good, hugely relieved. Amazing, but | :54:37. | :54:45. | |
you didn't have the drug, you bought a generic version? I was told I | :54:46. | :54:50. | |
would not be able to get the drug, because of the limited ability to | :54:51. | :54:53. | |
treat patients in the south-west. So I kind of put the feelers out, and | :54:54. | :54:57. | |
one of my friends let me know about the generic drug. She had been | :54:58. | :55:03. | |
taking it. So I knew it was working. She had the all clear from her | :55:04. | :55:07. | |
treatment. And then from there, that is how I kind of researched it, and | :55:08. | :55:15. | |
got the drugs myself from Bangladesh from Beacon pharmacy. So the issue | :55:16. | :55:21. | |
here, David, is the cost of these strokes. It is a wonder drug. Does | :55:22. | :55:25. | |
the company that has developed it and spent all that money on it, does | :55:26. | :55:33. | |
not deserve to make vast profits? Yes, it does deserve to be | :55:34. | :55:36. | |
remunerated for its efforts but I think there should be some kind of a | :55:37. | :55:41. | |
cap on the amount of profit they are allowed to make on what is | :55:42. | :55:46. | |
essentially a necessary drug for many millions of people. Liz | :55:47. | :55:50. | |
McInnes, do you agree with David that there should be a cap on the | :55:51. | :55:54. | |
profits that a drugs manufacturer can make? I think drugs companies | :55:55. | :55:58. | |
should be more accountable and open about the profits they are making | :55:59. | :56:04. | |
because it is kind of shrouded in mystery. They are private companies. | :56:05. | :56:09. | |
I appreciate that. And they are not in it for the good of our health. | :56:10. | :56:16. | |
The incentive for researching a drug like this is it can cure people and | :56:17. | :56:22. | |
that will make them a lot of money. Maybe I am optimistic that I would | :56:23. | :56:25. | |
like to think that the research and development departments are | :56:26. | :56:29. | |
concerned with people's health. They have produced an amazing drug that | :56:30. | :56:33. | |
kills hepatitis C, and I think, I really do think NHS England have | :56:34. | :56:37. | |
made the wrong decision in trying to ration this drug. I think somebody | :56:38. | :56:41. | |
somewhere needs to do some work about how much it is going to cost | :56:42. | :56:44. | |
to keep treating patients with hepatitis C and the problems they | :56:45. | :56:49. | |
have because of their illness, and I'm pretty sure they would find it | :56:50. | :56:53. | |
was actually more cost-effective to likely just give them the cure. So | :56:54. | :57:00. | |
it sounds like you think it is down to the drugs companies to bring the | :57:01. | :57:05. | |
cost down rather than to say an organisation like NHS England or | :57:06. | :57:08. | |
politicians to lobby and say we need a bigger discount? Thing you have | :57:09. | :57:13. | |
just given me a job, because I think we do need to be raising the issue | :57:14. | :57:17. | |
about the profits that drugs companies are making. Obviously the | :57:18. | :57:21. | |
drug itself does not cost much the manufacture, because Zoe has been | :57:22. | :57:25. | |
able to buy it at a fraction of the price Bangladesh. But I do | :57:26. | :57:31. | |
appreciate their artists use about research and development costs, | :57:32. | :57:35. | |
about intellectual property, and I am not undermining what the farmer | :57:36. | :57:38. | |
Sonka -- the pharmaceutical companies do by any means, my | :57:39. | :57:41. | |
background is in health care science and I appreciate the amount of work | :57:42. | :57:44. | |
that goes into producing a drug like this. But I think a little bit more | :57:45. | :57:48. | |
openness from the pharmaceutical companies would not go amiss will | :57:49. | :57:52. | |
stop thank you all, thank you very much, Zoe, for coming on the | :57:53. | :57:55. | |
programme, I am glad you are all right. David thank you for your time | :57:56. | :57:58. | |
as well. Thank you very much. Joanna's presenting the programme | :57:59. | :58:02. | |
tomorrow and she'll talk to a man who spent 24 years locked up | :58:03. | :58:05. | |
in a tough American prison Fakir very much for your company | :58:06. | :58:15. | |
today, have a good day. Join us here tomorrow at 9am. -- thank you very | :58:16. | :58:19. | |
much for your company. The thing that's so clear | :58:20. | :58:34. | |
is that it's 100% honest. We're right in the middle | :58:35. | :58:37. | |
of the action. The remarkable story | :58:38. | :58:41. | |
of British photography. | :58:42. | :58:46. |