04/07/2014 Politics Europe

Vanessa Feltz, who alleges she was assaulted by Rolf Harris, live on

Welcome to Politics Europe, your at Politics Europe.

Welcome to Politics Europe, your regular guide to the top stories in

Brussels and Strasbourg. On today's programme: as Jean`Claude Juncker

prepares to take the reins of The European Commission, is it time to

ease off on austerity? MEPs take their seats in the new European

Parliament, where there is not so much left versus right, as

Eurosceptics versus Europhiles. What do other European politicians think

of British Britain's stance on the EU? We have been asking MEPs in

Strasbourg. The bowler hatted British civil servant is famous the

world over, so why are there so few working for the EU?

All that to come and more in the next half`hour. First, newly elected

members of the European Parliament have been meeting in Strasbourg for

the first of their regular sessions. So, what have they been getting up

to, and what else has been happening over in Brussels? Here is our guide

to the latest in Europe in just 60 seconds.

The week's most awkward phone call, as the PM congratulates Jean`Claude

Juncker on his new job, despite spending weeks trying to stop him.

The new European Parliament began its session with a blast of

Beethoven's Ode to Joy, the EU's anthem. Not exactly one direction,

more like two. Most members faced one way, Ukip's the other. While

Ukip think the EU is rubbish, it is official. The European Commission is

talking rubbish. The Committee has proposed that councils will have to

recycle 70% of household waste by the end of the next decade. Better

news from the anti`Angela people this week, after Germany backed

plans to ban migrants sending benefits abroad. And Matteo Renzi is

the new Italian PM, and says the continent is moving at half of the

speed of the rest of the world. So, time to get a wriggle on, pronto.

And with us for the next 30 minutes, I'm joined by the Conservative Ian

Duncan, and Labour's Jude Kirton Darling. Let's pick up on one of the

comments made by the Italian Foreign Minister, Matteo Renzi, that we saw

on the clip. That it is time to end austerity. Is it? Is it going to

happen? I think it is really fundamental that we see a change in

direction at European level. If we look across Europe, austerity has

been counter`productive. Francois Hollande wanted to bring an end to

austerity, and it was meant to be the seachange. France is now

probably in a worse state than any other European economy. Figures

suggest it is on the deflation rate precipice and there is no growth at

all. Why did it fail? Partly because we have not seen the seachange at a

European level. We saw one PM elected, president, sorry, in

France, but we didn't see a change in the European strategy at a

European level. What we need to see is a change in the EU strategy, and

we need to see it push much more in terms of investment and growth. That

is what Labour is pushing for a European level. We are calling for

concrete steps forward on growth and job creation, because we still have

catastrophic levels of unemployment across Europe. That is what we

should be focusing on. Would that make a difference? The real issue is

that causing real problems across Europe, but it is the Eurozone

itself, the restrictions that are in place, that are causing problems.

There is youth unemployment above 50%. Unless there is serious

adjustment, generations will be lost. What should the adjustments

be? What I don't think you can do is keep people trapped inside it, you

have to allow people some freedom. Decoupling, devaluation, countries

focusing on building themselves back. You can't have devaluation

unless you leave. Decouple from the Eurozone and then revalue. I think

the results will be starvation otherwise. We are all used to a

left`wing right`wing dividing politics, but after the recent

European elections, in which antiestablishment begins, the new

division is between Europhiles and Eurosceptics. The European

Parliament is still dominated by the two big traditional parties. One is

the EPP, the European People's Party, they have 29% at

centre`right. And the S, a progressive alignment of socialists

and democrats, centre`left, they have 25%. While these groupings are

different on the political side, they have one thing in common. They

are both very pro`European. In some cases, almost federalist. The

European love`in faces a threat, after voters returned a significant

number of MEPs from Eurosceptic parties, like Ukip, France's

National Front, and even the British Conservatives could be in there. The

traditional rivals have got together and negotiated a grand coalition

with themselves and another liberal pro`European group, to prevent the

EU's programme being derailed. The dividing lines in the European

Parliament were shown from the very first debate a few days ago.

We, the Eurosceptics, are the progressives. These two gentleman

had nothing to say today, it was the usual, dirge like, dull, looking

back to a model created 50 years ago, we are the ones that want

democracy, nationstate, we are the ones that want a global future for

our countries, not to be trapped inside this museum.

What are you doing here? What we heard was the speech of the Leader

of the Opposition in the House of Commons. If you want to be

considered as the leader of a European political group, then make

speeches of a European political leader, thank you. We're joined now

by the Ukip MEP Jim Baker, and our two guests are still here. Is it

europhile and eurosceptic? Is that now the important dividing line in

the European Parliament? It is business as usual. The big blocs

have got together, and there are some who challenge it. Despite Dan

Hannan's best efforts. You could hear they're the applause for what

Nigel was saying. There is a movement away from the old, more

Europe, more immigration. It is coming on in stages, but I think it

is a trend we will see continue in the next elections and so on,

because it can't go on. The centre`left grouping is now in a de

facto coalition with the centre`right group, because although

you disagree on individual policies, what unites you is a strong

pro`European feel. What we are there to do in the European Parliament is

to defend the people who have elected us the to go there. We are

going to work to implement the programme we are committed to. In

the north`east, where I stood, it was about drawing investment into

the region and creating jobs, in a situation where we have the highest

employment in the country. We had to build alliances, the European

Parliament is not opposition government style, it is built on

alliances. We need to build those alliances to work. You have joined a

group that is federalist. Are you federalist? I believe we have to

make the EU work for the people of Britain... Sure, but are you

federalist? Not especially, but I think we are stronger together. That

is not the issue. You have joined a group that is explicitly federalist,

are you federalist? I would say that I believe that Europeans working

together are better off than nationstates trying to pull behind

national lines. So in most terms, I am quite pro`European and I'm quite

proud of that. But you haven't answered my question. I think it is

a false debate. The notion of federalism. Federalism is not a

dictatorship, as Ukip presented. Where are the Conservatives in this

at all? You are not in either of the two main groups. We are part of the

third largest group. A group that believes in reform, it is in our

title. We are the only opposition to the stitch up whereby Jean`Claude

Juncker got the presidency of the commission, and Schulz got the

presidency of the Parliament. None of your natural allies in Europe are

in your group. The reality is that right now they believe in reform,

and we are the only ones who can deliver that reform. Have you seen

some of the people in your group? Have you had dinner with them? I

have, several times. Shouldn't you choose your company more carefully?

They believe in reform. When it comes to a battle between the

Eurosceptics on the one side, and the strongly pro`European

federalists on the other side, where do you fall? Ukip is going to turn

their back on Europe. Federalism is not what we are for. We believe we

can make Europe work, that is what has to be available. But it has to

be serious reform, and we are the only party in the UK that can

deliver a referendum to give people the choice on this. Where does Ukip

go? Although the anti`European parties did very well in the

European elections, when you add together the three centre groupings,

the centre`right, the centre`left, and the liberalists, you are still

way out and you don't agree with each other. We were taken to task,

if you oppose this, what are you doing here. That is the mindset of

the whole European project, the big parties. We don't want anything to

do with the Parliament, we would rather be out of it. You got a

hundred votes, there are 70 members in the group, and we actually pulled

beyond our numbers. You are so isolated at the European level. You

have seen David Cameron lose 36`2. You are not able to build alliances,

and at your level you have to build alliances. By building alliances,

you are willing to give up. If you are willing to give up on your

principles, you can do exactly what you did. It was a free and open

election, but there was no EPP candidate, it was a cosy stitch up.

There were five candidates and it was a secret ballot, and anyone

could have run. It was a cosy, stitch up deal. You are still

outnumbered in the European Parliament substantially. You are

part of a group that the British Labour Party doesn't really agree

with the policies of, and you are not part of anything. We are the

third biggest group. You can't sway anything, you are outnumbered by the

three groups in the centre. The challenge will always be, for as

long as the Labour Party believes we should be federalist minded, we will

have a problem. We believe it is about reforming the EU. Building

a... Don't you agree... It is what you define as reform. Name your most

important reform. I would like to see a real commitment, youth

unemployment put at the top of the programme. It is about reform, it is

about the direction... How would you like to reform Europe? It is about

redressing the balance. Employment issues in the last commission for

over the last ten years have been right at the bottom of the pile. It

has all been about tight fiscal matters. If you are looking at

reform, start in your own house. Rather than hiding behind this

circus that travels down to Strasbourg once a month. There we

agree. It is in the treaties... Did you vote for Shulz? He's the leader

of my political group in the European Parliament. I wouldn't have

voted for a communist, I didn't vote for a conservative, he was the

candidate who was the leader of my group. After that defeat that was

referred to in the election of Jean`Claude Juncker as president,

and Ukip's success in the parliamentary elections, what does

the rest of Europe think of Britain and its prospect as a member of the

EU? With the magic of television, we have been able to talk to MEPs in

Strasbourg. If you reflect on it, the idea of Britain having an

in`house referendum on membership of the European Union has not been

conjured up out of anywhere. And how warped does the debate get

sometimes? The thing is, not only do lots of countries think it is a

difficult trick to pull off, but also it has been kind of magic. I

think it is very important that Britain will stay in the EU, and in

Austria we think it is only a threat from Britain that it will leave. Mr

Cameron will show us how important he is in Europe, and we take it as a

joke. After the European election results, nearly half the old MEPs

have transformed into new ones, and as a result of attitude here and

elsewhere, it is worth flagging up for Britain and many of the other 28

member state their contingents are now more Eurosceptic than ever.

Debating outlets it is a good thing, and also very revealing. It is not a

joke, it is a big issue, whatever Britain decide to do. It is

significant for all here. I don't think it is harmful for the EU, it

is healthy for the EU to understand that we are not locked in, we can

exit if we want to. It is better that a big country like Britain has

taken up these issues of reform, and even possible except, if the EU

continues on this part of federalism. Many Europeans see

Britain as descending into the dark arts, the official awkward squad

making tactical threats. Then they think, maybe they are blackmailing

us, is it worth it? Or maybe, can we conceive of EU without the UK? The

answer to that is, if you ask often enough, yes. The costs would be very

high, both ways round. A terrible loss of prestige. What that really

reveals to those who want to map out Britain's future, is that if we can

do without Europe, they can live without us. When everyone finally

sees the gap it has left for both, everyone may want to reconsider. I

am mindful to say to people, I think it is all bad and it doesn't work. I

think it could work better to say, be careful what you wish for. Be

careful of removing something that has taken wars to create and

stabilise. Do you want to be the political group that pulled it

apart? Others look to Europe as being the envy of democracy and free

movement and liberation. For those who are transparently pro` European,

the structural debate appears to distract, and Eurosceptic voters

should know where that leaves those who want out. They need to

understand that they have no influence in the concrete daily work

of the Parliament, because they are not part of the discussions in the

committees. When we are talking about creating roads and financial

sector stabilisation and so on, there is no participation of these

extremist groups, so they are getting money for doing nothing here

on a European level. In one sense, it doesn't really matter what other

countries think, because if we have a referendum, and if we vote no,

then like that, we are gone. We haven't seen him since.

How big an issue is it with other Europeans in the European Parliament

of the possibility of Britain's departure? I think it has been

disgust. This Parliament is one that is different from the past, the

general consensus is different. There is a mood now for reform and

change, and also the recognition that Britain is pushing for that. It

is not just about what Britain wants, it is about what the rest of

Europe wants as well. We need to listen to the people who put us into

the Parliament, because frankly we are not just voting for the same old

same old, they want something different. If everyone is shouting

for reform, why can't a consensus emerge and we proceed? I think

fundamentally it's about different kinds of reforms. There are some

things would be clearly agreed. Stopping the kind of charade of us

all tripping down to Strasbourg and making one seat for the family, that

makes a lot of sense. That would take David Cameron going into a

negotiation with other leaders and actually being able to build an

alliance for that kind of reform, because it is prime ministers that

make... But the alliance wouldn't make any difference, the French

would just stop it. You find ways of finding a compromise that would work

for the French. Many of those things in the hands of the European

Council, things like more policy reform. Like I said, redirecting

with the focus is in terms of growth and investment, in terms of

employment. Could you get... For example, the single biggest spending

is still common agricultural policies. Not as big as it was, but

still biggest. Would reform include getting that money being spent on

infrastructure and job creation and modernising Europe? How big a chance

is that? You put your finger on it. If you look at how the negotiations

over the budget took place, money was subtracted from things that

would affect things like broadband, to shore up other issues like

farming. We need to do what is best for Europe, we have to get things

more focused. Maybe one day it will happen. Adam Fleming has been

continuing his sojourn through the A to Z of Europe. Today he is on B.

Maybe he's not doing it in alphabetical order. He has been

visiting British civil servants working for the EU to find out

whether they are an endangered species.

The biggest thing that surprised me on my travels in Euroland is the

number of British people I bumped into. In The Hague, the head of

Europol, in Switzerland, the EU's ambassador, and in Brussels, Lowri

Evans, the top civil servant in the directorate that overseas fish. When

people are talking to you, they don't say, she is a British person,

they are actually talking to you as your function. She is in charge of

fish policy. Oh, she is a British person. It is not really the primary

thing. Is it useful for you having Whitehall, is there any backchat?

There is no backchat, and I will talk to anyone who wants to talk to

me. The problem is, there are a lot of Lowris, senior people reaching

the end of long EU careers, and not enough Joannes, who are just

starting out. Since I started out, I am one of a handful of Brits who I

have known in the last 18 months. Mainly my colleagues from lots of

different European countries. Of course, that was part of the appeal

of coming to work here, was the mix of people and cultures, and I find

that very interesting. That is the story the statistics tell well. For

simplicity, let's look at one of these departments, the Commission,

where Joanne works. The number of UK internationals who work there has

fallen by 24% over the last seven years, which means now just 4.5% of

the staff are British. And the UK makes up 12.5% of the population of

the EU, so as a nation we are seriously underrepresented. A

situation one British EU official told me is a catastrophe. And that

is kind of how they see it here at the Foreign Office in London, too.

So much so that earlier this year they launched a new drive to get

more people thinking of careers as EU civil servants, and there is a

whole office dedicated to getting people who work in Whitehall to go

and work in Brussels. For anyone tempted to keep the British end up

over there, what is the EU really like as an employer? Do you find

yourself going back home and being an advocate for the EU at dinner

parties and the pub? Absolutely, 100%. But I am very happy to. Is

this a fun place to work? It is, we don't have fun, you know. We have

jobs satisfaction. We have neither here. There is one job that a Brit

is more or less guaranteed to get, which is a position as European

Commissioner working for Jean`Claude Juncker. Cognac is free, who will it

be? I put my money on Malcolm Rifkind. Malcolm Rifkind? I think we

would be able to win a by`election in Kensington, and I think he would

be up for the job. He is not up for the job? I have heard his name

mentioned several times. That is news to me. From our perspective, it

is the government who decides. Because Nick Clegg wants a platinum

balloon out of the Coalition, I would guess that it would be a Tory.

In any case, whoever it is, we hope that somebody who is able to help

build those alliances at a European level, and we will be working with

them. What will be a good portfolio for them to get? There is quite a

choice, isn't there? The British have always gone for internal

market. We have not managed to get it due to our position from other

countries, up until now. There are big issues in the future around

energy, climate change. There are lots of key issues. Which one would

you like them to get? Trade would make a difference. Internal markets,

I think trade would make a big difference. If we are going to start

trading. They haven't been going far, they have been bogged down. It

is time to get them moving again. If that can happen in the next five

years we can create growth, then we create jobs. Mandelson took the

trade portfolio quite seriously, didn't he? He did, and he is

regarded quite well in Brussels as a result. The key thing is that we

have to have a commissioner who is willing to do the hard work, and is

willing to put themselves into the job fully. If that is the case, then

I think the UK will be in a good position. I think the key, it is

interesting in the report, we have to be encouraging younger people to

apply to work in the institutions. And that is also about changing and

informing back to the British public about what the institution is about.

We have to leave it there. Thank you to my guests. Goodbye.

For most of us, today turned out to be a pretty decent day, with some

sunshine around and a few showers across western areas. Through