26/09/2014 World News Today


26/09/2014

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This is BBC World News Today. I'm Tim Willcox.

:00:08.:00:09.

Tonight - the British parliament overwhelmingly approves air strikes

:00:10.:00:11.

524 four yes, the noses, 43. The eyes have it. Faced unchecked, we

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will have a caliphate on the shores of the Mediterranean, with a proven

:00:36.:00:40.

determination to attack our country and our people.

:00:41.:00:41.

Meanwhile the US-led coalition continues to

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He was last seen in public three weeks ago - now North Korea has

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Former British Prime Minister, Middle East envoy and now -

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The emergency debate in the Commons was passionate and lasted six

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But this evening, after a huge majority of MPs voted in favour,

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RAF fighter jets are poised to join the US-led coalition in striking

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They could attack as early as tonight.

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It will be the first time British bombs have been dropped in Iraq

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Britain will become the latest to join the US lead

:01:42.:01:44.

coalition against Islamic State militants - but only in Iraq.

:01:45.:01:46.

Parliament will require another vote if they decide to strike in Syria.

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The Danish government announced it was sending seven F-16 fighter

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But, like Britain, they have also only committed to

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France carried out its first attack on Iraq a week ago,

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targeting IS positions near Mosul, while several other countries,

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like Australia, the Netherlands and Belgium, are also giving

:02:09.:02:11.

Meanwhile in Syria, the US-led coalition, supported

:02:12.:02:17.

by Arab states, continues to bombard IS targets, with Saudi Arabia

:02:18.:02:20.

and the Emirates each sending four F-16s into Syria earlier this week.

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The latest US air strike in eastern Syria.

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The target - a series of small oil refineries.

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The goal - to choke off a vital source of funding for Islamic State.

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Denmark announced its offer to give seven jets to join

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Last evening, we received a formal request from

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the United States for Danish fighter jets to take part in the fight

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The government is of the view that it should meet that demand.

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The government is therefore prepared to quickly send seven jets to

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The Danish fighter jets will be active in the airspace over Iraq,

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This shows the steady increase in countries lining up

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In recent days, Belgium and the Netherlands have

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A vote in the British Parliament has now given the green light for six

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This is not a threat on the far side of the world.

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Left unchecked, we will face a terrorist caliphate

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on the shores of the Mediterranean and bordering a NATO member, with a

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declared and proven determination to attack our country and our people.

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This is not the stuff of fantasy, it is happening in front of us

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These national contributions are small, but nonetheless significant,

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The key success of the US-led coalition is to have many Arab

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states as active participants, but Western military contributions

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are also vital, with France and Australia already on board.

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So far, despite much misleading commentary in the press, this is a

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The numbers of aircraft involved is not huge.

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But the problem for the coalition is to sustain this activity over time.

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This campaign against Islamic State could potentially go on for years.

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Each country's contribution, leaving aside the Americans,

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may be small, but together, they make up a force that could continue

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Our political correspondent Rob Watson is live outside Westminster.

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A huge majority in favour of the strikes in Iraq, but a different

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matter if the matter was put forward about Syria. Absolutely, and the

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Prime Minister went out of his way to be quite starkly open to say, if

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it was up to me, I wouldn't rule out using UK aeroplanes over Syria, but

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he said what was important now was a political consensus. A year ago he,

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he suffered a defeat over UK action in Syria, and he won't let that

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happen again, so he has gone for safety first. Passionate voices from

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some about why America, France and Britain shouldn't get involved in a

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rocket again. How much discussion was there about the exit strategy

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here and mission creep? There was discussion about all of these

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things. If you take this spectrum about this, on one hand, there were

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plenty of MPs saying, oh my goodness, here we go again. On the

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other end of the spectrum, people who support the use of air strikes

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in Iraq, but still say, look, we need something more comprehensive,

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something better thought out, there will have to be political

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improvement in both Iraq and Syria, otherwise air strikes on their own

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simply won't work. On that point, boots on the ground, everyone talked

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about that. They want to local forces to take on IS, but that will

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take months if not years to get them equipped with the right military

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hardware to take them on, wanted? Yes, two points there. The

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reluctance of Britain to put boots on the ground is not just because of

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political difficulties, they just generally think it would not be a

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good idea, one of the lessons from 2003. That we do want to the problem

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of, you will fill any vacuum left in a rack and in Syria if it Islamic

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State are dislodged? Even in a rack, that looks like a hard sell. It has

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been difficult to get the Iraqi forces to stand up, but in Syria, it

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looks like an even harder sell with no prospect insight of some kind of

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logical settlement there. Thank you. Well,

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on the ground in Iraq and in Syria, thousands of refugees continue to

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flee Islamic State forces. Many have described the beheading

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of captives, the torching of homes and the widespread use

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of rape by IS fighters. In the Iraqi capital,

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Shia leaders are recruiting local people to fight back, and say they

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don't need help from the West. The Iraqi government, though,

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insists that outside Our chief international

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correspondent Lyse Doucet sent this Britain is joining

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an air campaign that has already gone on for six weeks.

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It hasn't gone on for six weeks.

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on the streets of Baghdad. It hasn't stopped the funerals.

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This family mourns for a family member.

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He died in a battle against Islamic State fighters just south

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of the capital. Every death breeds defiance.

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Now all these women tell me they are ready to fight.

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So are these men. We get rare access to it

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powerful militia brigade. It fight in Iraq and Syria.

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This is how their leader has to travel.

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He is now recruiting more fighters, Shi'ite and Sunni, to take

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on this new threat and says Iraq doesn't need help from the West.

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America has proven it always comes to us with the face of the saviour.

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It hides in front of the people the ugly face of an invader.

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And what about Britain? We see that the British are

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the obedient slaves for America. In Iraq, the militias operated

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separately from the national army and police. That means a lot of

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checkpoints across Baghdad, but is still not stopping the violence.

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These Iraqis know that between 15 or 20 mortars landed in this area in

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the last week, a massive car bomb exploded at a checkpoint just behind

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us. They have lived with danger for many years, and now this threat

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posed by anti-Shiite group calling itself Islamic State makes their

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faith even stronger. But in their fervor is no match

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militarily for this new enemy. That is why the Government has asked the

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world to help, including Britain. We do need the United Kingdom here

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because the United Kingdom has a long history and a rack, they

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understand a very well, and they understand the region very well.

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They have the expertise. -- Iraq. This war will be won or lost, not in

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the air, but on the ground. Let's go to Irbil in Northern Iraq

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and speak to Clive Myrie. How has the British vote there been

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greeted today, and is there an understanding that air power alone

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won't be enough? Yes, to the first point of your

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question, it was greeted with relief, it has to be said, and the

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delight. There is no doubt that certainly as far as the Kurdish

:11:16.:11:19.

person murder forces are concerned, who have been fighting and taking on

:11:20.:11:24.

the forces of the Islamic State for the last few weeks and months, air

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power has helped them overrun the Kurdish area here in northern Iraq

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and take the capital of the independent region here in the

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country. They are very grateful, frankly, the regional Government

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here that there is another important Western power that will be taking

:11:47.:11:52.

parts in targeting Islamic State positions in Iraq. At the same time,

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the Peshmerga, the military here, and know that it is a battle that

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will only really be won on the ground militarily, it is not just

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going to be the result of air power alone, and as a result, they

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continue to make that call to Western nations to arm them with

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more sophisticated heavy weaponry so they can have an equal fight on the

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ground with the force of some 20,000, 30,000 fighters who were

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funded to the tune of millions of dollars a day to criminal

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activities, that gives them access to heavy weaponry and machinery that

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could make this a more equal fight. Presumably, there is no purely

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military solution here, there needs to be a political solution, bearing

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in mind what happened before in 2008, 2009 when America convinced

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the local people to rise up against Al-Qaeda. Is there any indication

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that those overtures are being met with any success? It is early days.

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It is very early days. What you have to be able to provide for those of

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Sunni tribes in the different provinces, the central belt of Iraq,

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which is predominantly Sunni and has been taken over by Islamic State,

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where they found a for title audience for their creed, because

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those Sunnis felt disenfranchised in this country after the invasion in

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2003, they have to be given an alternative to turn their backs on

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Islamic State in the same way they turned their backs on Al-Qaeda in

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2007 and 2008. That will stem from a much more inclusive Government in

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Iraq. The Prime Minister Alla body -- the Prime Minister here says he

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will give greater representation for the Government, and they could be

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part of the future for the country. Once that is established, the list

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can be pushed out to the Sunni community, after saying they have a

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future in the country and therefore should turn their backs on the

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extremist that came through Syria from the North.

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Jonathan Russell, of the Quilliam Foundation, is with me now. Thank

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you for joining us. Just looking at the vote in the Commons today, is it

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pretty clear that this is the first of several stages, and that mission

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creep really is inevitable average well, mission creep seems to be

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designed into the Government's strategy. It is pretty obvious that

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from the statements both made by the Prime Minister and by the many MPs

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who were supporting him that the question about the border between

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Iraq and Syria, which is virtually nonexistent, controlled by ISIS, is

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an artificial border. And so, I think that also we have heard from

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various MPs that the legal impediments are there, there are

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sufficient legal covers which would allow us. So I think the Prime

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Minister almost revealed the fact that he has only come to the House

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because all he felt confident of getting was support for Iraq at this

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stage, but that in due course, the possibility of strikes over Syrian

:15:25.:15:28.

territory would be considered. And again, this debate about boots on

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the ground will probably start raging now. It may result in a

:15:32.:15:36.

request for some limited ground Force assistance as well. Presumably

:15:37.:15:41.

there are special forces already on the ground anyway? Well, yes. Of

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course, the British devilment, as a matter of policy, does not comment

:15:49.:15:53.

on special operations, so we could assume that that may well have

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happened, and certainly could happen in the future. In terms of the force

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and potency of Islamic State, which is not a regular army, what are the

:16:04.:16:12.

dangers of radicalising them yet further? I think we have got to be

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aware of that danger, when we do engage in military. There are

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various things that can prevent that. Having Arab states in this

:16:25.:16:29.

international military coalition is one important way of doing that.

:16:30.:16:32.

Should there be boots on the ground, it is important that they are Sunni

:16:33.:16:38.

Muslim troops initially as well. But also, we should remember that the UN

:16:39.:16:44.

has a role. Very underreported was a resolution from the Security Council

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yesterday in flooring all of its member states, and passed

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unanimously, I might add, to redouble their efforts to prevent

:16:52.:16:53.

foreign fighters joining Islamic State. But individual countries have

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done that, haven't they? I think we have got a grass now showing the

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countries who have been providing fighters for Islamic State. Dr

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Ashraf, first of all, the largest contributor is Tunisia. Now, is that

:17:18.:17:33.

a surprise? Yes, this is something which the King's College centre has

:17:34.:17:36.

done, and it has been out on the streets, this information, for a few

:17:37.:17:42.

days. It is believed to be because of a combination of factors,

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political unrest, also economic depression. There is not a great

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deal but a lot of these young people can do, apart from join

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organisations such as this. The rest of the other countries seem to map

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areas where there is a combination of economic downturn as well as

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political instability. What binds fighters from all of these 70

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countries is the adherence to an ideology, and a belief in the

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narrative of Islamic State, and other similar organisations. So it

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is surely only by tackling this ideology at its root that we can

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have any effect of stemming the flow of fighters to the Islamic State.

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Just tell us a bit more about the philosophy of Islamic State, we are

:18:29.:18:34.

all aware of the brutality, but this idea of trying to create a society,

:18:35.:18:43.

people like plumbers and teachers and suchlike? The idea comes from

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the idea of political Islam, which started about 100 years ago. This

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particular branch is a subset, a violent Islamist strand, which was

:18:57.:18:59.

personified through Al-Qaeda's ideology. Ultimately, there is no

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ideological or theological difference between Al-Qaeda and ISIS

:19:05.:19:10.

it is a political and strategic difference, humming down to the fact

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that these people are primarily political. The religious overtones

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are just there for identity purposes, but the reason they kill

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each other, Al-Qaeda and ISIS have been killing each other, and the

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reason is purely political, because they have not a single difference

:19:30.:19:31.

theological or ideological. These are political movements, they have a

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lot more in common with the fascist and communist movements of the

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beginning of the last century than they do with old religious

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movements. Finally, are we looking at Gulf War three? It certainly

:19:45.:19:50.

looks like it, but we can learn the lessons of the first and second Gulf

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War. Can we? Yes, I think we can. I think the key difference is having

:19:56.:20:01.

Sunni Muslim countries in this coalition, and by thinking about the

:20:02.:20:04.

long-term problems of Islamic State as an idea, rather than as an

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organisation. So, more needs to be done to persuade Qatar and Saudi

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Arabia to stop the funding as well? That is one point which came out of

:20:16.:20:19.

the debate. Whether it is true that those countries are funding is

:20:20.:20:23.

irrelevant. What is true is that people believe that they have been

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supporting extremists. That point was made very powerfully today in

:20:28.:20:31.

the Commons, and they will have to respond to it.

:20:32.:20:38.

Now, where is the supremely dumb? That is the question on the Korean

:20:39.:20:44.

peninsula, after the disappearance of North Korea's leader, Kim

:20:45.:20:50.

Jong-un. He has been missing for a few weeks. It has prompted a flurry

:20:51.:20:56.

of speculation in South Korea about his health. Now, the north has

:20:57.:21:03.

admitted he is suffering from an uncomfortable physical condition.

:21:04.:21:10.

This report from Sol town. It is the empty chair which is significant.

:21:11.:21:15.

This is the supreme meeting of the rulers of North Korea minus the

:21:16.:21:21.

supreme ruler of them all. It is the first time since Kim Jong-un

:21:22.:21:26.

inherited power from his father three years ago that he has not been

:21:27.:21:30.

present. The North Korean authorities said he was feeling

:21:31.:21:35.

discomfort. How serious an admission of ill-health that is remains

:21:36.:21:39.

unclear. It is more than three weeks since he last appeared in public,

:21:40.:21:45.

with a limp. Kim Jong-un has been a thorn in the side of the West, as

:21:46.:21:48.

North Korea develops nuclear weapons, and the missiles to deliver

:21:49.:21:54.

them. He rules an isolated country squeezed by sanctions. In a way, he

:21:55.:22:00.

dominates the life of the people here in South Korea, issuing

:22:01.:22:07.

bloodcurdling threats. He is developing nuclear weapons, aimed at

:22:08.:22:11.

this country and that the United States, so this place buzzes with

:22:12.:22:16.

speculation. Having said all that, not too much should be made of that

:22:17.:22:20.

speculation. After all, he vanished from public view for two weeks last

:22:21.:22:25.

year. Kim Jong-un is not a man who shuns publicity. He usually travels

:22:26.:22:29.

the land he rules with cameras nearby. Here's a to be feared. Last

:22:30.:22:35.

year, his uncle and political mentor was executed. The official statement

:22:36.:22:46.

from North Korea about his illness says he continues as leader. But it

:22:47.:22:51.

must raise questions about the seriousness of the illness and his

:22:52.:22:53.

ability to continue. One of Britain's leading

:22:54.:23:07.

publications for the gay community is publishing a list of the top gay

:23:08.:23:12.

icons over the past three decades. Some probably do not surprise you,

:23:13.:23:17.

the likes of Boy George and Barbra Streisand. But one man on the list

:23:18.:23:21.

might - Tony Blair, the former Prime Minister. The obvious question is

:23:22.:23:32.

why? Let's have a look at Tony Blair's reaction to the accolade. It

:23:33.:23:37.

is something I am very proud of, he said. I consider it a significant

:23:38.:23:44.

part of my legacy. I disliked the hypocrisy where people had to

:23:45.:23:49.

conceal their own identity. We can discuss this now with somebody from

:23:50.:23:54.

the Daytimes. I think you said today that you do not need to be gay to be

:23:55.:23:59.

a gay icon. What has he done for the gay community? When you look back,

:24:00.:24:03.

you have got things like the equal age of consent, the repeal of

:24:04.:24:08.

section 28, being able to be openly gay in the Army, protection in the

:24:09.:24:13.

workplace, and his biggest introduction, civil partnerships, it

:24:14.:24:16.

was introduced ten years ago in October. That is what his interview

:24:17.:24:21.

was really to mark. Is this the choice of the publication, or

:24:22.:24:27.

according to a poll? We sat down and we looked at the past 30 years of

:24:28.:24:31.

issues we had done, and we had Tony Blair on the cover in 1997, and

:24:32.:24:35.

there were lots of questions about whether he would do what he had

:24:36.:24:39.

promised in that manifesto, and he did. We thought, he gets such flak

:24:40.:24:45.

for all sorts of things, but on this issue, I think we should recognise

:24:46.:24:48.

how much was done. Did he change the political weather, as far as the

:24:49.:25:02.

British establishment is concerned? Absolutely. When I interviewed Tony

:25:03.:25:06.

Blair a week last Monday about this, he said that he thought the most

:25:07.:25:09.

important thing about his political legacy in this respect was the

:25:10.:25:14.

Conservative Party, and how they have now come on board. He remembers

:25:15.:25:19.

in the latter half of his premiership, they were voting for

:25:20.:25:22.

gay equality, whereas previously that had been unimaginable. I think

:25:23.:25:28.

he is link. I spoke to David Cameron a few months ago, when same-sex

:25:29.:25:33.

marriage came in, and he said Tony Blair should take a lot of credit

:25:34.:25:37.

for changing public opinion. It seems strange to think back 20, 30

:25:38.:25:43.

is, where it was a story if a politician was discovered to be gay.

:25:44.:25:47.

It was. We used to do this thing called media watch, in the first 20

:25:48.:25:52.

years of Daytimes, and we would look at things which publications had

:25:53.:25:56.

printed, which you would not possibly see these days. In terms of

:25:57.:26:03.

his political legacy on other fronts, was that difficult,

:26:04.:26:10.

perhaps? He is controversial, but anybody who tough decisions ends up

:26:11.:26:21.

being a reversal. For Gay Times, and for me personally, you can have

:26:22.:26:27.

different opinions on different subjects, but on gay rights, he

:26:28.:26:32.

stood up for it, and he stood up for gay equality. Previous prime

:26:33.:26:38.

ministers had not done that. Thank you very much for joining us. That

:26:39.:26:41.

is all from the programme. Next, the weather.

:26:42.:26:58.

We are likely to see some patches of mist and fork forming overnight,

:26:59.:27:06.

particularly across some areas of southern England.

:27:07.:27:10.

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