Eastern - Part 1 Flog It: Trade Secrets


Eastern - Part 1

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It's been well over ten years now since "Flog It!" first set up shop,

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and during that time you've come to trust us to value and sell

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your unwanted antiques and collectables.

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-GAVEL BANGS

-That is a fantastic result!

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Wow.

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And during that time, the variety of things you've brought in

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to show us has been absolutely astonishing.

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It's not easy to put a price on them all, but some things

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we know are guaranteed to sell and this is where you can find out more.

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Welcome to Trade Secrets.

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Europe has always been fascinated by the East.

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We've been trading with North Africa, Turkey

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and the Middle East for centuries

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But the furthest reaches of the Orient have been closed

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to all but a few intrepid travellers until relatively recently.

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But treasures from those lands are perennially popular,

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so today, we'll be finding out why Oriental artefacts exert

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a special kind of magic.

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-High order.

-GAVEL BANGS

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The hammer's gone down. £600.

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On our exploration of the exotic, we'll be stopping off

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in the Middle East and in India,

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before reaching our final destination, Japan.

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En route, Thomas finds the jewel in the "Flog It!" crown.

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The work in this is amazing.

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One of the best items I've seen on "Flog It!" for many, many years.

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We pinpoint the direction of future trends...

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There's a big market for Arab items and most Arab clients and buyers

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have got fairly deep pockets.

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..and Michael's tour around the best of Japanese art and design

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throws up some surprises.

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I'm going to go off now and have a look for some wonky pots.

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Who knows? One of them might be by a 16th-century master.

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As an imperial power, Britain once ruled the waves with military might,

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but it was trade that was the driving force behind our expansion

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and import and export were the mainstays of our economy,

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and many of the items that turn up at our valuation days

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are part of that legacy.

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We see a huge amount of Oriental items in Great Britain,

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probably much more than Middle Eastern items,

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but that's quite simply because China was a HUGE place

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and made a huge variety of items.

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There's a perception at the moment that everything is Chinese, Chinese, Chinese, Chinese

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and certainly the Chinese market is really, really strong,

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but the Islamic world

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equally, in my view, they're desperate to acquire goods as well.

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The Middle East, Persians specifically, there's less knowledge about it,

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so with a little bit of dedicated research,

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you can really get one step ahead of the market.

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The Middle East has its own appeal and collectability

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and definitely shouldn't be overlooked.

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We don't see many items from these parts at our valuation days,

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but when we do, they are intriguing and unique

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as James Lewis discovered.

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Christine and Steve, tell me the history. Where did you find it?

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-In a junk shop in Chingford.

-Did you really?

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I bought this 60-odd years ago, when I was a schoolboy.

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Well, this is Arabic, known as a janbiya,

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which basically is Arabic for a knife.

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This is from Yemen and the janbiya was used as a fighting knife,

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but today they are used more ceremonially.

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This is a hardwood handle and then we have overlay in silver

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and the silver overlays, the hardwood handle

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and also this leather scabbard. It's 19th century,

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it's covered in silver, it's ceremonial,

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but it's still something that has quite a good second-hand value.

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The value of them depends really on their hilt.

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They can be made from lapis lazuli, they can be made from wood,

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they can be set with precious or semiprecious stones

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and the case can be covered in gold filigree wire rather than silver.

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So the variety of coverings and styles and qualities is endless.

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I think an auction estimate of £100 to £150

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-and I think it will do jolly well.

-Great.

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And it was "Flog It!"'s own Will Axon, who took to the rostrum

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to sell this traditional piece of Middle Eastern culture.

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There we are. Where do you start me on that?

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Again, a bit of interest in this. I've got to start here

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-at 80, 90, 100.

-Wow.

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There's a big market for Arab items

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and most Arab clients

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and buyers have got fairly deep pockets.

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160, 180 I'm bid

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and 200 I have with me. At £200...

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-That was a quick jump, wasn't it, to £200?

-..at £200 now.

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Shakes the head at £200 on commission then. At £200.

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All done then? All the bidding is here with me. All done at £200?

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Hammer's up and selling at 200.

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-GAVEL BANGS

-Well done. That was good.

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That great result proves there's a big market for Arabic artefacts,

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but what other objects are worth looking out for?

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A good way to get into Middle Eastern antiques,

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I would suggest Eastern metalwares - copper, brass, that sort of thing.

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There are vases, ewers, plates, chargers,

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some of them more elaborate with silver inlay, gold inlay.

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They're produced in huge numbers and, I think, as an entry-level,

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that's a fairly good pointer

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and work your way up from there, really.

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But you have to understand what you're buying.

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There are so many fakes out there, so many modern tourist things.

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Just be careful.

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But Nick Hall threw caution to the wind and went ahead

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with the valuation of these rarely-seen shields

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from Persia, modern-day Iran.

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How on earth have these come to be in your possession?

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-They were left to me by a neighbour back in 1980.

-Right.

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And was she a collector of sorts or a traveller?

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No, her husband was a merchant. He was in the merchant Navy

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-and he used to travel a lot.

-So, he's travelled and collected on his travels.

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That explains it because they've come a long way, all the way from what used to be called Persia.

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At the time of the valuation day, we didn't see

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a lot of Persian items.

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We're starting to see a little bit more now with the growth

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of the Asian market as a whole, but Persian items are a little bit

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scarce and rarer so it was a great pleasure to see those walk in.

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Wonderful things.

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Date-wise, these are probably late 19th century.

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Nice decoration on them as well. They're not a pair.

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-They're very similar.

-Right.

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Same region, same date, same type of decoration.

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There's chasing on the metalwork, we can see here,

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even little bits of enamelling as well on the top there.

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-Some wonderful designs.

-Yeah.

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Almost too nice to be hacked to bits with a big sword. Lovely things

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and quite rare to see. We don't see a lot of Middle Eastern artefacts.

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It's always difficult to value things

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that you don't see that often. You've got to have a bit of market knowledge.

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You've got to constantly read up on the subject, study the subject,

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you've got to go through trade journals and follow other international sales,

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so that you are ready and prepared that when you do see them,

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you've got all that knowledge sat and ready. Not easy.

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It's hard work and dedication, but worth it when something like that walks in.

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So, we need to put a sensible price on them.

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I think each shield is worth in the region of 150-250,

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-there and thereabouts.

-Right, OK. No, that's good.

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Per shield, per shield.

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As they weren't a matching pair,

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Nick decided they should be sold separately.

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Come on, 100 to start. 100 I'm bid.

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I've got you at 100, 110, 120,

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130, 140, 150, 160...

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-This is good, isn't it?

-Yeah.

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..180, on my right. Selling at 180.

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Are we all done at 180? I've got you at £180 now.

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-Selling at 180.

-The hammer's going down.

-That's a good start.

-Yeah.

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-Let's see if we can get 180 for the next one.

-120, 130, 140, 150, 160,

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170, 180, 180 on my right.

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-Selling at 180.

-GAVEL BANGS

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-Not bad at all. Not bad at all.

-I'm very pleased with that.

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-Very pleased. That's great.

-That's a result, isn't it?

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Of course, they would have sold better if they had been a true pair

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rather than two very similar objects. Pairs always make more.

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Not just twice the price of a single one but often three or four times.

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So, if they'd been a true pair, they would have made considerably more.

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I suspect there would have been even more collectors on them

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because you just don't see them.

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What you are more likely to see in Britain are these - rugs.

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The Persian tradition of carpet making goes back thousands of years.

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Britain began importing them in the 1880s

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and some experts say, today, there are possibly more of them

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in Europe than there are in Iran itself.

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If you want to collect them, here are a few tips.

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I think the best thing to look for in Persian rugs are old rugs

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and it's quite easy, luckily, to distinguish an old rug

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from a new rug based on the fact that most old rugs are dyed

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using natural dyes, which fade over time.

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So, when you see variations in colour in a rug, you know that it's old.

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The first rug is a rug probably made for the European market.

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The flowers are very European.

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Look at the variations in the reds, for example.

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That's the indication of a natural dye.

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The rug is not very fine. It's more exuberant

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than it is a fine work of art, so it's not going to be of great value.

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The second rug, the design is much finer

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and there's a lot of attention to the colour and all the little details,

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but with fine rugs, you tend to cut the pile, which is the furry bit,

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closer so that you can see the design better and as a result,

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they tend to survive less well over time.

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And I think it's better to spend one's money on a rug

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in good condition than a beautiful fine rug,

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which was much nicer 100 years ago than it is today.

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You can buy a good quality antique rug for around £150,

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but the record for a Persian one at auction is for over £20 million.

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Carpets not your thing? Well, then Persian miniatures

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are also highly collectable but, once again, there's a lot to learn.

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This is a Persian one.

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If you look at the faces, they're usually not in profile,

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they're more rounded faces with more Asian eyes

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and this one, there's a little Persian inscription on the side.

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It says Khosrau and Shirin. They are two lovers.

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They're kind of the Persian version of Romeo and Juliet.

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But with values ranging from tens of pounds to millions,

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you need to be careful not to get caught out.

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This is a Mughal miniature from India and these are more common.

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The Mughal faces, which are almost always in profile,

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and usually the background is quite plain

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and the whole emphasis is on the figure that you're depicting.

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It's easy to confuse Persian with Indian as the Persian influence

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was strong in India 300 years ago.

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It's quite easy to tell if something is a fake.

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If there's a lot of writing in the miniature.

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One of the most common things with miniatures that you buy today

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is that they are actually an old piece of paper with a new painting,

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because what they do is get some old notebook and paint an elaborate scene

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in the centre of the page, so those are the things to watch out for.

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Also these are very delicate objects and they will show some signs of wear

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if they are original. Bear that in mind.

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The next country on our Eastern voyage is India,

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jewel in the crown of the British Empire for over 300 years...

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Wow.

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..and a country that adopted some of our most treasured traditions.

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Sophia, what a wonderful tea set! Do you know how old it is?

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-I think it's '20s or '30s.

-Very much. We've got pure Art Deco lines.

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-The Indians were very influenced by the Art Deco period.

-Right, OK.

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A huge amount of very, very poor quality items have come out of India

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as indeed the Far East, so if you're thinking of starting,

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go for quality.

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There are two things really that set it aside

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and make it absolutely obvious that it's not an English tea set.

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One is this very intricate Indian trace decoration in the panels

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and also this extraordinary very Indian-looking spout.

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You just wouldn't have a spout like that finishing off

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-an English teapot.

-Oh, I see.

-Of course, if it had a hallmark

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we would be able to tell you exactly where it was made

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and we would be able to tell you the date and who made it.

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None of that information is available here other than the bottom

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-where it says, "Made in Kashmir."

-It is a Kashmiri design.

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-It is a Kashmiri design, is it?

-Yes.

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A hallmark tells us a great deal about a piece,

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but a lot of Indian silver isn't hallmarked, making it difficult

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to know exactly what you've got

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but there are few exceptions to the rule.

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A lot of really good English silversmiths went to India

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and a nice piece of Indian silver made by an English silversmith,

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you will find marks on it that will enable you to date it.

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Now, I suppose, of all the pieces of silver that are least saleable,

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-it's tea sets.

-Yes.

-Simply because people don't use them any more.

-Yes.

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-So, you're really looking at a value of a few hundred pounds to £300.

-OK.

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Charlie's valuation of the Indian tea set was on the cautious side

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and reflected its scrap value.

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All hallmarked silver in the UK has a minimum 92.5% silver content,

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but without a hallmark to prove its purity,

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this tea set may contain a lot less.

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You just can't tell without having it tested.

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It's worth probably £500 in weight of silver

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if it was English sterling silver.

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-You've cottoned onto this, haven't you?

-Yes.

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You rang James up. I had a quick chat with the auctioneer

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just before the sale started.

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Sophia has now upped the valuation, we've got a fixed reserve of £450.

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-Yes.

-So, it just might struggle, but you don't know

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because you can't tell the quality of Indian silver.

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You don't know if it's equal amounts or slightly less.

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But in the end, it's all down to the bidders.

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I have two commissions on the book

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-and I start the bidding with me at £450.

-Yes! Worry over.

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460, 470, 480, 490,

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500, 520, 540, 560...

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-What do I know?

-..580, 600.

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At £600, with me on the book at £600.

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-Are you all done?

-...over.

-GAVEL BANGS

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-The hammer's gone down. £600. Well done.

-Thank you, thank you.

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I'm really pleased.

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The tea set's fine quality and exquisite Kashmir design

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definitely set it apart in the saleroom,

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but my advice is, unless you've absolutely fallen in love

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with a piece of silver, be cautious.

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If you're unsure of the silver content

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don't pay more than you have to.

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If it's not by a particularly well-known maker, yes,

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it comes down to the scrap value

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and you can follow the scrap value very, very easily online

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and it goes up and down like a yo-yo.

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As I sit here, it is at £11 an ounce.

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A few weeks ago, it was £16 an ounce.

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Two, three years ago, it was £4 an ounce.

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Quite extraordinary fluctuations.

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When Indian craftsmen are working at their best,

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the quality and the use of materials are beyond compare.

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One example is among the finest things I've ever seen on "Flog It!".

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Thomas was impressed, too.

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This piece of Anglo-Indian art would be the kind of thing

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-you would find in a house like behind me.

-Really?

-Yeah.

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-Wonderful.

-It's that sort of quality. Do you like it?

-I do, yes. I do.

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The Anglo-Indian chessboard and chess pieces,

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I called Anglo-Indian because of the work and the style of the piece.

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Anglo-Indian furniture, or colonial furniture,

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has its influence in us Britons going to India and asking craftsmen

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to create pieces of furniture, decorative items in our taste.

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-Where did it come from?

-It came from my late husband's family

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and he inherited it, I think, from his grandparents.

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It's got the use here of bone, ivory and tortoiseshell.

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The ivory in this was used and this was made well before 1947.

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Anything later than 1947, we cannot sell, we cannot touch,

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it's illegal to handle. But ivory made pre-then is OK.

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It's amazing that it's all complete.

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There's one or two nicks out of the rooks

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and we've got a bit of fret missing.

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Yes, this work needs to be restored and they can be restored,

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but it's not the end of the world.

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When looking at antiques,

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I have a thing in my head, "Keep on going.

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"Don't compromise on quality, don't compromise on quality."

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And when you see something of quality, you're thinking,

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"Is this really good? Is this something I've not seen before?

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"Should I compromise on it? Do I pick holes in it?"

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-The work in this is amazing, isn't it?

-It is. It's beautiful.

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You've got this tortoiseshell base and then this beautiful fretwork,

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with this amazing engraved and painted design around the octagonal,

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on this beautiful turned horn stem, with ivory roundels

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and again on a similar tortoiseshell and fretwork carved base

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on these paw feet. Now, these feet are bone.

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-Oh, they're bone? Not ivory?

-They're not ivory, they're bone

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-because you see the little black flecks in there?

-Yes.

-Those are little blood vessels.

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When looking at this Anglo-Indian chessboard, you can see the quality

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and the design. Also it did have that naive charm

0:18:520:18:57

of being Anglo-Indian, but that gave it a certain je ne sais quoi,

0:18:570:19:03

which was delightful.

0:19:030:19:06

You've got people who collect Anglo-Indian works of art

0:19:070:19:10

and you've got people who collect chess pieces.

0:19:100:19:13

But also you've got the emerging economies.

0:19:130:19:15

The emerging economy of India are collecting back some of the items.

0:19:150:19:19

-Really, are they?

-Yeah, of course.

0:19:190:19:21

Therefore, that will command a good valuation.

0:19:210:19:24

I think an estimate should be £500 to £700.

0:19:240:19:28

-I think that's pretty good.

-Yeah.

0:19:280:19:29

Personally, I thought the estimate was a bit conservative.

0:19:330:19:36

I'd like to thank you for bringing in possibly one of the best items

0:19:360:19:39

I've seen on "Flog It!" for many, many years,

0:19:390:19:42

that little Anglo-Indian chess set, which Thomas

0:19:420:19:45

had the pleasure of valuing.

0:19:450:19:47

-Lots of interest.

-Good.

-It's quality. Quality always sells.

0:19:470:19:51

The damage won't put anybody off. This is going to be exciting

0:19:510:19:54

because it's going under the hammer right now.

0:19:540:19:57

Fingers crossed. I hope it flies, I really do.

0:19:570:19:59

Shall we say 450? And 550,

0:20:010:20:05

650, 750, 850.

0:20:050:20:11

900 we're bid, 950 I'm bid for it.

0:20:110:20:15

1,000, I have 1,000. And 50.

0:20:150:20:17

1,100? I've got 1,100, thank you.

0:20:170:20:21

At £1,100, then.

0:20:210:20:23

-I sell for £1,100, thank you.

-GAVEL BANGS

0:20:230:20:29

-That's good, isn't it?

-It's very good.

-A very good result.

0:20:290:20:33

That Anglo-Indian chessboard and chest pieces was complete.

0:20:330:20:38

I don't think you'd find another one complete.

0:20:380:20:42

That's the reason why it made £1,100.

0:20:420:20:44

Now, we don't get that many Indian pieces at our "Flog It!"

0:20:470:20:50

valuation days, but if Barbara's spectacular chess set

0:20:500:20:54

was anything to go by, they're definitely worth looking out for.

0:20:540:20:58

Fine quality and craftsmanship will always draw in the bidders.

0:20:580:21:02

So, if you're interested in collecting such artefacts,

0:21:020:21:05

keep this checklist in mind.

0:21:050:21:08

The Arabic market is growing - don't overlook it.

0:21:080:21:11

Indian silver is unlikely to be hallmarked, so always be aware

0:21:120:21:16

that its silver content may be less than that of sterling silver.

0:21:160:21:21

If you can, get it tested and then you'll know its true scrap value.

0:21:210:21:25

But quality will always out,

0:21:270:21:28

be it beautifully decorated silver or the finest carved ivory.

0:21:280:21:33

Ivory was once widely used in European artworks.

0:21:330:21:36

It's now illegal to buy or sell pieces created after 1947.

0:21:360:21:41

Older items tend to be more yellow, but seek advice

0:21:410:21:45

and if any doubt, stay clear.

0:21:450:21:47

Michael Baggott has a particular passion for precious metals

0:21:510:21:54

and gems, and you can quite often see him at our valuation days

0:21:540:21:58

with a loop, a small magnifying glass, to his eye.

0:21:580:22:02

He's also fascinated by the Orient and everything from the Far East.

0:22:020:22:07

So, when he was invited to view a new collection of Japanese antiques,

0:22:070:22:11

he jumped at the chance.

0:22:110:22:12

Well, when I left Birmingham to go to college and study antiques,

0:22:200:22:23

I suddenly found a love or an excitement

0:22:230:22:27

of all things Chinese and Japanese

0:22:270:22:29

and, from that point on, I've been hooked.

0:22:290:22:32

Out of the whole scope of Japanese art and design, the ceramics,

0:22:320:22:36

the prints, I think my favourite has to be the little inro,

0:22:360:22:39

which are so collectable and so many different designs.

0:22:390:22:43

Hopefully, here at the Oriental Museum in Durham, we can see some.

0:22:430:22:46

So, Rachel, thank you for liberating these from the cases momentarily.

0:22:500:22:54

-You're very welcome.

-It's a wonderful display.

0:22:540:22:57

Obviously, you're very familiar with Chinese and Japanese art

0:22:570:23:01

and the fact that they share quite a lot

0:23:010:23:03

-of techniques and iconography.

-Yes.

0:23:030:23:05

What hints have you got for telling the difference

0:23:050:23:09

between Chinese and Japanese objects?

0:23:090:23:11

-That's the million-dollar question.

-It is.

-It's not easy.

0:23:110:23:15

Really, what it comes down to is just looking at as many things

0:23:150:23:19

as you possibly can.

0:23:190:23:21

Japan has always been heavily influenced by China

0:23:210:23:24

and by Chinese art, so a lot of Japanese art looks very similar,

0:23:240:23:28

uses the same motifs, the same colours.

0:23:280:23:30

But we've got a selection of ceramics here that are

0:23:300:23:32

more uniquely Japanese in design. Can you tell us about them?

0:23:320:23:35

I think this one at the front is the kind of piece

0:23:350:23:38

that people are most readily going to think of as being very Japanese.

0:23:380:23:41

This lovely porcelain, with these beautiful bright colours on it,

0:23:410:23:44

is the kind of thing that was made

0:23:440:23:46

specifically in Japan for export to Europe,

0:23:460:23:48

so it's the kind of thing that collectors are most likely to see here.

0:23:480:23:51

This piece here, dates to the 18th century.

0:23:510:23:54

And by great contrast, some people might have a five-year-old

0:23:540:23:58

-that's come back with something very similar to this.

-Yes.

0:23:580:24:02

But this is not the case. Tell us about this bowl.

0:24:020:24:04

No, this is an example of perhaps the most typically Japanese of wares.

0:24:040:24:09

This tea bowl dates to about 1600 and it's in a style

0:24:090:24:14

that's specifically designed to look simple and rustic and very rough,

0:24:140:24:21

but actually has taken a huge amount of skill,

0:24:210:24:23

a huge amount of thought has gone into it.

0:24:230:24:25

So, this is really, if we've got a chance of finding something

0:24:250:24:29

out there that's undervalued, it's going to be

0:24:290:24:32

-this class of Japanese tea wares.

-Yeah.

0:24:320:24:34

And this is a stark contrast to what we have in the West.

0:24:340:24:38

-We're buying the...

-Yes, we're buying these.

0:24:380:24:41

..the brightly-coloured fancy Arita wares.

0:24:410:24:43

But, moving on from that, they were also masters of metalwork as well,

0:24:430:24:47

-weren't they?

-Yes, they were.

-So, those aren't real, are they?

0:24:470:24:50

They're wonderful fun though, aren't they?

0:24:500:24:54

These kind of pieces were made by Japanese swordsmiths and armourers.

0:24:540:24:59

During the Edo period, so from 1650 and onwards,

0:24:590:25:03

when you've got peace in Japan, swordsmiths and armourers

0:25:030:25:06

are not so much in demand, so they're making these kind of pieces to show

0:25:060:25:11

the quality of their workmanship.

0:25:110:25:13

So, these are fully articulated. The snake all moves,

0:25:130:25:16

-the legs on the crab all move.

-It's an immediate effect, isn't it?

0:25:160:25:20

And, of course, when they're not doing that, they are making swords

0:25:200:25:23

-and they're making sword fittings.

-They are, yes.

0:25:230:25:25

We've got a collection of these here. These are tsuba.

0:25:250:25:28

So, this is the piece that fits at the base of your sword blade

0:25:280:25:31

and protects your hand when you're holding the hilt.

0:25:310:25:34

The more solid ones are the sort of thing that you think of

0:25:340:25:37

as earlier, more practical pieces.

0:25:370:25:39

During the Edo period, your sword can become much more decorative.

0:25:390:25:41

It's much more about showing off your status

0:25:410:25:44

and so these kind of sword fittings again become much more decorative

0:25:440:25:47

and obviously when Japan opens up to the West,

0:25:470:25:51

people were bringing back swords but swords are rather bulky to carry,

0:25:510:25:54

so something like a tsuba makes an ideal souvenir.

0:25:540:25:58

So these things came back to the West in large numbers.

0:25:580:26:01

Now, we move on from those to my favourite

0:26:010:26:05

-because I love inros and you've picked out four super ones.

-I have.

0:26:050:26:11

The inro is the compartments.

0:26:110:26:13

These were created first of all to carry medicines,

0:26:130:26:15

herbs and seals and then they hung from your belt of your kimono

0:26:150:26:20

and the netsuke is the toggle that secures it in place and makes sure

0:26:200:26:24

that you don't lose all your precious things hanging from your belt.

0:26:240:26:27

And I've tried to get a range of materials.

0:26:270:26:30

People tend to think of the lacquer ones, Japanese lacquer is wonderful,

0:26:300:26:34

but I also wanted to get a couple of different ones out,

0:26:340:26:37

so I've got this lovely wooden one, with these very playful monkeys.

0:26:370:26:40

So, in terms of what is attainable and collectable today, I think,

0:26:400:26:45

certainly if you look at the tsuba,

0:26:450:26:46

they're easily accessible. At the very bottom level,

0:26:460:26:50

you can buy a really simple example for £50, £100,

0:26:500:26:54

going up to, for the decorated ones, £2,000, £3,000, maybe even £10,000

0:26:540:26:58

for the very best examples.

0:26:580:27:01

My love are the inros. You can buy a very nice inro for £300 or £400.

0:27:010:27:06

When you get into the very better ones,

0:27:060:27:08

you're talking multiples of 10,000, but it just shows you that

0:27:080:27:12

if you want to collect Japanese art, it's accessible at every level,

0:27:120:27:16

isn't it? Marvellous.

0:27:160:27:18

I've had a wonderful day at the Oriental Museum.

0:27:210:27:24

I've see lots of wonderful objects, beautifully made.

0:27:240:27:28

I think if this has inspired you to collect Japanese art,

0:27:280:27:32

just be aware of the huge diversity of objects you can find,

0:27:320:27:36

but if you're on a budget, don't go for the obvious.

0:27:360:27:38

Maybe go and choose an obscure area of ceramics to collect.

0:27:380:27:42

That would be my advice.

0:27:420:27:45

After seeing that wonderful tea ceremony bowl, I'm going

0:27:450:27:47

to go off now and have a look for some wonky pots.

0:27:470:27:51

Who knows? One of them might be by a 16th-century master.

0:27:510:27:54

Oriental art and design are truly fascinating areas

0:28:000:28:03

and there's an enormous array of beautiful items out there.

0:28:030:28:07

If we've inspired you to start collecting,

0:28:070:28:09

my advice is to keep an eye out on emerging markets

0:28:090:28:12

and look out for items that are just that little bit different.

0:28:120:28:16

Well, that's it for today. I hope you have enjoyed the show.

0:28:190:28:22

Join us again soon for more Trade Secrets.

0:28:220:28:25

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