Stair Lift Don't Get Done Get Dom

I've been fighting your consumer battles for years now,

but the same old problems just keep flooding in.

And it's all the usual suspects.

Poor customer service, faulty goods, and hidden small print.

No wonder some of you are fed up with the way you're being treated.

The most frustrating thing about being a customer in the UK is the lack of customer service.

You know what really grinds my gears?

When I place an order, and the company get it wrong,

I have to call them back and then tell them they've got it wrong.

You know, it just...

I couldn't agree more.

Things need to change,

and we're on a mission to get companies to treat us better.

I'll be taking your cases and fighting your fight with the big companies.

Once he realises exactly what I'm fighting here,

I'll be very surprised if he wants to argue with me.

And I'll be showing you how to shop smart and stay one step ahead.

-This is one of those few things that you need to look out for.

-Yeah.

And you, you should probably keep hold of all your clothes

so your daughter doesn't sell them.

-So remember - Don't Get Done...

-Get Dom.

Coming up on today's programme -

a pensioner who wants his cash back on an unwanted stairlift

and has called me in to help...

I couldn't understand why you couldn't get in touch with anyone.

..our industry insider dishes the dirt on dodgy mechanics...

Took the parts out, cleaned them up, sprayed them black,

put them back in, and that could potentially lead to fatal consequences.

..and Rani Price hits the streets

to find out where you're wrong about your consumer rights.

-Ah! Did you know that?

-I didn't know that.

Lovely. Thanks ever so much.

You know, buying something new can be very, very exciting.

Sometimes, a little bit further down the line,

you realise you've been caught up in the moment

and you might possibly want to change your mind.

But if you don't know your legal rights, you might live to regret it.

Ouch!

Meet 81-year-old pensioner Bill Baker from Essex.

In May 2012, he paid a hefty £850

over the phone to RJ Mobility

as a deposit for a stairlift, but, with no paperwork to seal the deal,

Bill decided to back out three working days later.

It worried me all over the weekend so on the Monday, I rang to cancel the contract.

Although the company agreed to cancel the contract,

they refused to refund Bill's money and six months later,

he is still high and dry with no new stairlift and a big dent in his wallet.

I haven't heard from no-one, apart from the letter saying

when I cancelled.

But to speak to, no,

because I've never been able to get through to talk to anyone.

After waiting five months for a refund from RJ Mobility,

Bill is at his wit's end and that's where I come in.

Sounds to me like Bill's stairlift has landed him

in a little spot of bother.

Which brings me to my favourite county, Essex,

to have a little chinwag with him.

-Morning!

-Morning, Dom.

-You must be Bill.

-Yeah. Pleased to meet you.

-And you too.

-Come in.

Bill hadn't started out wanting a new stairlift.

He'd been quite happy with the second-hand one which had

served him and his late wife well for many years.

If I have to take anything upstairs I put it on my lap and take it up.

It saves me climbing up the stairs. And yeah, it's very useful actually.

However, in May 2012, it broke down.

I was halfway up the stairs, I heard this click, and I saw this

white strip coming out and I didn't know what was going to happen.

Bill was keen to get the stairlift fixed as quickly as possible,

and called a freephone number for a company called RJ Mobility.

But I want to know how he found them.

Let's hear it from the horse's mouth, and I hope you don't mind me saying that.

-No.

-What happened?

-Well, neighbour round the corner, we swap newspapers.

-Right.

So I was round there and he said, "Oh, Bill, by the way,

"I found a number in the local paper," he said, "mobility,"

he said, "and it's an 0800 and it's nearer home."

-The company was closer to you?

-Well, as far as I knew.

Anyway, I phoned this number...

and I got the "all our operators are busy but if you'd like to, after the tone you leave a message

"and we'll get back to you at the first working day."

RJ Mobility had an address based in Central London

and the response to fix Bill's existing stairlift was very

prompt when their engineer came to sort out the problem.

I phoned them to come out, which they did,

and he put it back and that's when I said to him,

"I might be interested in another stairlift."

The engineer repaired Bill's stairlift for £69.

Did it all work OK then?

Yes, it went all right. I said, "If it gets any...

"if I get any more bother," I said, "I might think about another one."

"It's fitted now," he said, "but it will break down again."

Bill's old stairlift potentially breaking again meant

the idea of a new one was attractive to him.

And it wasn't long before RJ Mobility presented him with an offer.

Tell me about the next day, when this guy phoned you up.

He just said about the stairlift, it was £1,850 and then he went

and saw the manager and then he come back with £1,700.

And that's when I gave out £850.

-And you paid with your debit card?

-Yes.

-So the money, gone.

-Yes.

Let me get something right.

They came round on Tuesday to fix it,

Wednesday they sold you a new one over the phone,

took a deposit, Thursday they came round to measure up.

Did the guy who came round on Thursday give you

-receipts, contracts, anything else?

-No.

-Nothing at all?

-No.

-Right.

Well, straightaway that's not right,

because you paid a deposit over the phone

so you've entered into a contract now, as has the company,

who's told you they're going to supply the goods.

But at some point you need to be given a contract,

or a receipt or an invoice, you need to have something, don't you?

You don't give someone 850 quid and that's it,

just trust what they're going to say.

-Did you ever receive any paperwork?

-No, no.

The only paperwork Bill has received from RJ Mobility has been

a receipt for the repair he had done

and a letter confirming his cancellation of the stairlift.

Nothing for the purchase of it.

Maybe Bill should have taken the initiative and requested a receipt himself.

A day after paying, Bill told his nephew, Mike,

what had happened and Mike also expressed concerns.

He called me to tell me he had bought a new stairlift,

and I said, "Oh, that's great, what have you done?"

So he said, "Well, I've paid a deposit - £850." So I said to him,

"Well, how have they taken it?"

"I've given him my debit card details over the telephone."

So, there were some alarm bells started to ring to me,

so I said to him, "What's on the contract?"

And he said, "I haven't got a contract."

So I thought, "That's rather strange."

So I said to Bill, "You're telling me that they've taken this money

"and they haven't given you a contract?"

So he said, "No."

So I said, "Well, if I was you I would go down to the bank

"and just see if it's possible you can actually stop that deposit."

On the Friday, two days after purchase, Bill went to his bank,

but unfortunately the deposit had already been paid out

through his debit card and just a day after this money had been taken,

an engineer from RJ Mobility came round to measure Bill's stairs.

Now to my mind, that's the time when he should have

got his contract, and at least, and a receipt for the deposit.

Nothing.

All the engineer said was, "Yes, we've taken the measurements

"and we'll be in touch."

As far as the law's concerned, this doesn't seem right to me.

What happened next?

It worried me all over the weekend,

so I got to them on the Monday but they were busy.

So I left a message to say phone me back, which they did,

and that's when I told them that I wanted to cancel

because my finances weren't what I thought they were.

So you got this letter from the manager. What did it say, just roughly?

It just said, sorry that you've cancelled your contract

but we can't refund your deposit.

They must have given you a reason why they were saying they weren't going to refund you it.

Yeah, because the stairlift had already been cut to my measurements.

They said that you can't have your deposit back because

they made changes to the one they were going to install.

-Yes.

-And it's in their warehouse, and it's tough,

you're not going to get any of your money back, did they say?

He said that if someone comes in with the same

measurements as yours, they pay, and then you'll get your deposit back.

It's from May till now.

And I've never heard a word from them since.

Bill's waited just over six months to get his deposit back

and potentially, he could be waiting a lot longer for someone with

exactly the same measurements.

-Your nephew got involved and started speaking to them.

-Yes.

He's the guy that wrote to me. So what did he say?

He came up to the Citizens Advice with me.

Good for you. That was a good move, yeah.

Cos I went up there on my own...

And they tried to gain contact with them, and they couldn't get any response.

So they ignored the Citizens Advice Bureau?

Well, as far as I know, they never heard a word from them.

Bill, you're 81 years old, you're obviously living on a pension.

-How important is £850 to you?

-Very important. Very important.

-Can you afford to lose it?

-No.

-I don't think you've been a fool,

I don't think you've done anything wrong,

I just don't think the company has done what it's legally

obliged to do, and I'll be really interested to find out why.

-Have you any idea who the boss is?

-No.

All you know is this company,

RJ Mobility in Regent Street with a freephone number.

OK, that gives me plenty to go on.

-Just before I go, what would you like out of this?

-Money back.

-As simple as that, really, isn't it?

-Bill, it has been lovely meeting you.

-Thank you very much. Cheerio.

Bill is 81 years old. Like most pensioners, he can't afford to throw away £850.

I want to find out why RJ Mobility have ignored his

and the Citizens Advice Bureau's request to return his money.

More importantly, do they plan on doing the same thing to me?

Now, this sort of case, when you're talking about somebody particular vulnerable,

really gets my goat.

Before I get in touch with the company I always find out more.

To my surprise, I find three RJ Mobilities.

One in the US, not them, one in North Yorkshire, also nothing to do with them

and finally, the one I'm looking for in London.

It appears they are actually part of a bigger company.

Scooter Rescue Services, trading as RJ Mobility.

When I had a look at their order pad,

the first thing I noticed is they have a very prestigious head office address.

It's on Regent Street in London. Nice.

But this is just a virtual office

and Scooter Rescue Services Ltd are listed as being in Biggin Hill, Kent.

They state that they've been around since 1988 and specialise

in selling and servicing quality used stairlifts, scooters and power chairs.

Their motto is "close enough to care."

So, let's see if I can get them to start caring again.

VOICE MESSAGE: Welcome to RJ Mobility.

We are temporarily occupied on the phones right now.

So, please leave your name, telephone number and short message and we will call you back.

Everybody is tied up.

What's the chances of not having anybody to answer the phone?

Slim, isn't it?

But don't worry - I shall keep ringing until I get through to somebody.

'Sadly, getting hold of someone isn't as easy as I'd hoped.'

PHONE GOES DEAD

I'm hoping that was an accident.

I'm Rani Price and there is nothing I like better than helping you

through the minefield of regulations to make sure you stay savvy shoppers.

Now, consumer law can be very confusing.

You've got your Sale of Goods Act, Distance Selling, Right to Return and it doesn't stop there.

But knowing a few of these laws can not only save you money, but a lot of hassle.

Hello, you! Would you mind chatting to us for a couple of minutes?

'I'm out on the streets armed with questions to put to you, the buying public,

'to find out if you know your consumer rights from your consumer wrongs.'

Many of you enjoy shopping and selling on internet auction sites,

bagging yourself a bargain or making a few extra pounds on unwanted goods.

But how savvy are you when it comes to your rights

and protection whilst you're clicking?

-We're asking people about shopping on auction sites.

-Sorry.

-Do you ever do that?

The only thing that worries me about buying online is giving over your debit or credit card details.

Why is it terrible? Have you ever used it?

Oh, come and chat, that's what we are trying to find out. Oh, no!

She said it's terrible, they take your money.

There seems to be some fear on the street.

Time to speak to an expert, to find out what to watch out for

when buying from an online auction website.

A common mistake that buyers make when on internet auction sites

is how little protection they have against the sellers,

who could be operating from anywhere around the world.

The internet auction sites can give or convey the picture

of that business being far more professional than is the case.

So, first up, I want to know how much you know about your specific rights

when buying from an online auction site from a trader or an individual seller.

-Buying or selling?

-Buying.

Have you ever got it back and gone, "not for me!"

-A couple of times, yes.

-Then, what do you do?

Erm, normally, not very much.

What do you do when you get them and they are not what you want them to be?

I think it's hassle, so you just leave it.

I've got these trainers but they were meant to be size 5 adults

but they were baby shoes.

I think they are still laying around in the house.

So, none of these guys even bothered sending unwanted goods back to online auction sites.

They're going to be throwing money down the drain.

If you are buying them from a private seller,

you would have to swallow it and get on with it.

But if it's from a trader, you still have seven days to send it back.

-Did you know that?

-I didn't.

You have far more rights against a business than you do against a private individual.

If you are transacting with a business,

your goods have to be as described, a satisfactory quality and fit for their intended purpose.

Whereas if you are buying from a private individual,

the goods only have to be as described.

And what about selling?

Many of you decide to make a bit of extra cash

getting rid of unwanted items on online auction sites.

But what's the safest way to do this?

By cash or using an online money transfer service?

Would you wait for the money to clear?

No, money definitely to clear first or if it was cash on delivery.

-What do you think would be better?

-Payment through the bank.

When you sold your table and chairs,

-I presume you didn't wrap it up and take it to the post office.

-No.

How did you decide when it would be safe for the people to come and collect it, moneywise?

-How did they pay for it?

-A couple of them were cash.

-What did you sell?

-A car.

-A car? Did you do it cash?

-Yeah, yeah.

You're a sensible man.

When selling small items, sending them in the post means you can obtain proof the item was sent.

But with larger items that need to be collected, you need to be careful

as a buyer can reverse an online money transfer,

leaving you with a bill to pay to the transfer service.

-It's better to go down the cash-on-collection route.

-I didn't realise that.

There are some ways of buying and selling that offer more financial protection than others.

But how much do you know about the systems in place for when things go wrong?

I bought a cover that was supposed to be for the parasol

and it was supposed to be for a certain size, and when it came, it wasn't.

When I e-mailed the woman, she refunded me straight away.

The Pokeman cards came from America and when I got them, they were fake.

-So, that was a bit of a...

-What did you do, then?

I complained to her and sent them back and that was the last I've heard of it.

If they've got any marks, you have to let people know that they've got marks and holes.

So, a mixed bag of expectations and experiences

when it comes to problems using online auction sites.

Let's see what our expert can tell us.

The best advice is to contact the other party first to resolve the dispute.

If that fails, in some circumstances,

it might be appropriate to go through the dispute resolution process that the site might offer.

In other cases, particularly

if you are concerned that the item was misdescribed or unsafe,

it may be appropriate to contact your local Trading Standards service.

So, there are systems in place to support those of you who buy and sell from online auction sites.

But there are also steps you can take to stop problems developing in the first place.

I've been investigating the case of 81-year-old Essex pensioner, Bill Baker,

who decided to buy a stairlift from RJ Mobility

and paid an £850 deposit over the phone.

Three working days later, he changed his mind but as RJ Mobility

had already started making the stairlift to his specifications,

they're saying they have to hold on to his deposit

until someone else places an order with the same requirements.

Bill's been battling for a refund.

I couldn't understand why you couldn't get in touch with anyone.

And even efforts by his nephew, Mike, have been futile.

We've sent numerous letters, e-mails and phone calls, but had no response.

It's an abuse of his trust and I feel upset that a company can act this way to a vulnerable person.

It has worried me because no-one can afford to lose that money.

They've been chasing RJ Mobility,

not to be confused with other companies of the same name,

for a refund, for just over six months.

But you know me, I love a challenge so I'm trying a difference tack.

I've just taken the 0800 number and put it into an application

and it's given me a landline number.

It should take me through to people behind this company.

PHONE MESSAGE: Welcome to RJ Mobility.

Voicemail again.

I tell you what,

all this long distance communication is beginning to drive me bonkers.

Give me a good old high street shop any day -

at least you can go in and collar someone.

But, it certainly got me thinking.

Bill initially decided to buy the refurbished stairlift from RJ Mobility

without going anywhere near a shop or a showroom.

I had a phone call to say that they'd had this stairlift.

And it would be, as I say, half now and half when it's fitted.

And that was it, really.

How it was done over the telephone was how the alarm bells started ringing with me.

It was the way the deposit was taken

and the fact that he had no paperwork.

That's called distance selling.

What are your rights when you're buying something from your own armchair

and how can you be sure you know exactly what you're getting?

I think it's time Bill and his nephew, Mike,

got some personal service from Trading Standards,

to make sure they are fully in the picture

when it comes to their rights when ordering goods away from a shop.

What did they tell you about the lift?

What did they say about it? What information did they give you about it?

None, as far as I can gather, no.

Nothing comes to mind what they told me.

And the reason that they took to deposit from you,

what reason was given?

That's part of the rules, I suppose, that sort of thing.

It was 850 now, and 850 when the job was done, so I paid that today.

If it's fitted tomorrow, I have to pay the other 850.

When you do agree to something over the phone,

you should be given a fair amount of information about the product

and about your rights and that information should be in writing,

so it should either by an e-mail or a brochure, something like that.

And generally speaking, when you do agree to something over the phone, you are entitled to

a cooling-off period, which is normally around seven days.

So, once you receive that information about the fact that you can

cancel a contract, then you would normally have seven days.

With regard to the seven-day cancellation period,

is that from when the money was taken,

or from when the customer receives the paperwork?

-It starts the day after the customer receives the paperwork.

-OK.

So, you should have something in writing to say what it is

you're buying and your right to cancel.

However, Bill says he didn't receive any receipt or invoice.

So, how could he have avoided this mess?

One of the things you could have said was,

"Well, I don't want to give a deposit now.

"Can you send me something in writing to say, what I getting?

"Is a refurbished unit? How old is it? How long is the guarantee?

"Can I pay in instalments?

"Have I got to pay a deposit up front?"

And then, chances are, you would have had something to say,

"By the way, once we start cutting this to measure,

"you're not going to be able to cancel because it's a made-to-measure unit."

That's a case of being wise after the event, innit?

Well, it is, but it's also a case of you as a consumer being given

-all the relevant information.

-That's right, yeah, yeah.

That's what all these regulations combine to try and protect you from.

Simple, really, when someone tells you. It sounds...

-Well, hindsight is a great thing.

-Exactly.

It's important to remember that if you do find yourself in a situation like this again,

the first people to turn to would be your family,

because they will know what to do to help you.

But you can also contact your local Trading Standards

and you can do that through the Citizens Advice Consumer Helpline

and they will field all the calls for referring the cases

to Trading Standards and they'll give you some advice about what you can do.

But you have to act quickly, because if you have got

a seven-day cooling-off period, then the longer you let it go,

the worse it gets and the window of opportunity will be gone.

So, you must speak to someone really quickly so that you can cancel

in writing in good time, and be able to withdraw from the contract.

I knew you had time to cancel, but I didn't know

they had to tell you it was in writing and you've got seven days.

I've learned more this morning than I've learnt all my 81 years being on this Earth!

Crikey! It seems like Bill's very happy with this morning's lesson.

It's not uncommon for someone of Bill's age, or any age,

not to know that you have these basic rights

when buying goods outside of a shop environment.

So it's really important that people know what their rights are

so that they can exercise those rights

and be given an opportunity to get good deals and change their mind.

Thanks, Rob.

There's nothing I like better than helping you guys get to grips with your rights.

Let's hope we're all now a lot clearer about buying

goods from the comfort of our own home.

Let me give you an update on where I am with RJ Mobility.

I said, "These are the problems with William Baker,"

or Bill, as he likes to be called.

And they sent me an e-mail back saying,

"Yeah, you're right, but we think we've got a bit of an argument."

The e-mail from their MD, Lawrence Wright, reads...

Having initially offered nothing, RJ Mobility are now making

a partial offer of £750, which is better but still short by £100.

Not exactly small change to Bill.

They don't basically want to give the full deposit back. Wrong!

That's not the law. I'm about to tell them.

Seems like I've still got a battle on my hands.

VOICE ON PHONE: "I haven't really done anything wrong. What did we do wrong?"

Wouldn't life be easier if we had a little insider knowledge?

If we knew exactly how industries operate?

So, for once, we as consumers could be ahead of the game?

Well, I'm about to meet somebody who is fed up of keeping quiet

and they're about to let you in on the tricks of the trade.

With around 35 million drivers on UK roads,

keeping your car in tip-top condition is essential.

So, a visit to a mechanic for maintenance or

when things go wrong is a must.

Today, we get some shock information on bad practice that all

drivers could be affected by.

I'm meeting up with the man who has run

an award-winning garage for 22 years.

He's about to dish the dirt on dodgy mechanics

and to protect him from industry backlash, we have concealed his identity.

How do mechanics rip people off?

Common scams can be when you go to a fast-fit operation

and they say, "Let's check your car."

Take the car up and then pull you over

and show you a wet patch on the shock absorber, for example.

It could be that you've got a shock absorber that's leaking,

but sometimes, if he wants to earn his commission for that day,

he could have sprayed some liquid on there, like WD-40,

so it looks like your shock absorber is leaking.

It's £80-£100 for a shock absorber,

of which he might get commission of £10.

Are there any situations where people say they have fixed something,

and it could lead to being dangerous to me?

And I'd worry about that, you know, with kids, driving around all the time.

There was one situation where one of my guys had gone

to work for another company.

He gave me the story about a Saturday afternoon.

They got a car in, the brakes needed doing.

And the manager couldn't get hold of the parts so he took the parts out,

cleaned them up, sprayed them black, put them back in.

If you look at, you'll see a nice, shiny pad,

and although it's not the new one, is the used one, but if you

see a shiny, black part sticking out, you would obviously

think it had been changed,

and that could potentially lead to fatal consequences.

So, how could he justify that, then?

The manager, the technician, the mechanic,

they all get commission on a sliding scale and in this case, obviously it

needed doing, but he couldn't get a hold of it,

he didn't want to lose his commission, so he just sprayed them black and said it had been done.

Just the same as if the car has been said to have been serviced

and it hasn't been serviced, you think the service has been all checked over,

and it's all good, and a lot of times it has not been done.

Having a car serviced is something all car owners should do regularly.

But it can be a sure-fire earner for car mechanic cowboys.

The problem with the word "service",

-it doesn't have any legal definition.

-Right.

When I bought my car brand new, I'd let them do one service on it, got a big bill, got the car back,

and when I actually sat down and read the bill,

all they had done was an oil and filter change.

They hadn't even taken the wheels off.

And that, potentially, could be very dangerous.

So does that mean every garage has a different definition of service?

Most definitely.

So for you, if someone says, "I want a full service on my car,"

what would that include?

Engine flush, flush the engine out.

Change the oil, change the oil filter.

Two hours of labour, VAT, and the parts.

Those are the bare minimum things that you need to do.

But it's not just during a standard service

when you have to keep your wits about you.

Other scams. Have you ever heard of any with the cars?

There are some cars that have a clutch cable fitted on

and when you're driving the car you can feel the clutch isn't right

and it's a simple process of adjusting the clutch,

which will take 10 minutes and should cost pennies and pounds.

Whereas what can happen is that the clutch can be adjusted

and the garage can say to you,

"We've taken the gearbox out, we've put a new clutch in," and charge you £300.

So, it's a very easy scam that can happen.

What kind of problems occur when it comes to paying the bill?

I think the customer can often be hoodwinked at the end of the job,

when they're given a piece of paper that has gobbledegook on it.

You have part numbers on there, codes,

the customer doesn't understand, and he'll see a pound sign with a figure

and that's the only thing he will understand on that bill.

The paper that you get should be very clear,

and should itemise everything.

Of course, most mechanics are trustworthy.

But there are some steps you can take to protect yourself from being

fleeced or driven up the wall by one that isn't.

Do you have any advice, then?

How people can avoid being ripped off when they take their car into a garage?

The garage should offer you to take the old parts away if you want them.

They won't give you the messy things like the oil filter,

but the other parts, they should give you.

Look at the review websites,

see if they are members of any trade bodies or associations.

The RMI, which is the Retail Motor Industry Federation, can offer you advice.

Another body is VOSA, the Vehicle And Operating Services Agency,

which is a government body that runs the MOT scheme.

One of the ways they do this is by doing a risk assessment

on every garage that does MOTs.

So you could go into a garage that does MOTs and ask them,

"What's your risk assessment score?"

So, next time you take your car into a garage for a service or any other

problem, do your research and know what common scams to look out for.

And you won't get done.

I've been battling the case of 81-year-old pensioner Bill Baker.

Bill lives in a friendly neighbourhood

and does have family support but he needs some help sometimes

with getting up and down the apples and pears so he uses a stairlift.

I use it of a night, when I go to bed,

and if I've got to take my laundry up, when I've done my washing.

Put that on my lap, take that up.

Or I've got to take something up to the cupboard upstairs.

When his stairlift broke down, he was tempted with the offer of buying

a new one from RJ Mobility and paid an £850 deposit towards one.

But then he changed his mind

and although he cancelled his order

within the legal seven-day cooling-off period,

six months later, RJ Mobility still hadn't refunded his money.

Whether you're 20 or 80, like I am, no-one wants to go through it.

Not the way the finance situation is now,

you can't afford to lose a shilling.

All I want to know is

I want to see a contract I've signed for that stairlift.

Show me a stairlift and a quote that once you've done it you've had it,

fair enough, I'll accept that.

But I've not signed a contract.

Bill and his nephew Mike have spoken to a Trading Standards expert

about distance selling regulation and what rights they're entitled to.

But how then are our rights affected

when we're sold a product face to face?

It's time to paint a really clear picture

of the differences between buying at home or in a shop.

Let's assume I sell you something over the Internet.

That's a very good point, actually. Let's give it a try.

Purchase.

Wow! Speedy delivery!

Well, because I wasn't able to actually view that item in person,

it is covered by distance selling regulations, which means

if I change my mind about it,

for whatever reason in the world, I can send it back.

Go on, off you go!

Right.

What about if I sell you something, let's say, on the telephone.

Yep, no problem. It's on its way right now.

Crikey! Very speedy delivery. But do you know what?

The same rules apply.

OK.

What about, though, if you come into my shop

and buy it from me in person?

Ah. Now the law changes.

Because I was able to view the item, see it and even touch it

before purchasing it, it means if I don't like what I bought,

it's tough. I shouldn't have bought it in the first place.

So bear in mind that when buying from a shop,

you can't cancel a purchase

but you are still protected by the Sale of Goods Act.

As Bill spoke to somebody from RJ Mobility on the phone

and he had a visit from an engineer, which category does he fall under?

Our legal expert Andy Millmore is just the person to clear

things up when it comes to Bill's particular case and his rights.

Bill's case is an interesting one because it may well be the case

that his situation is covered by both sets of regulations.

That muddies things slightly

but one thing is clear with both sets of regulations.

They should have given Bill written information about what was

going to happen and one of the things he should have been told

was he had a seven-day period to cool off or to change his mind.

We know Bill says he wasn't given any paperwork

and that confirms he was well within his rights to cancel when he did

and to expect a full refund.

But how about with tailor-made products like his stairlift?

There are cases where your entitlement to a refund is reduced

if they're going to start work.

But in that case, you've got to be told in advance,

in writing, that that's the case

and you've got to put your request in writing to the company.

So you've actually got to say,

"I understand this is eating into my cancellation rights.

"Go ahead anyway." That didn't happen.

You're right. It didn't.

But the company may have just made an honest mistake,

not knowing the law.

That's fairly typical and may well be the case

but it makes no difference. Ignorance is no defence.

Bill has the same rights, as does any consumer.

If you're a business, you have to know the law

and you've got to comply with it.

And that's good to know.

The more you're informed, the better off you'll be

when it comes to all your buying and selling.

Armed with this information, I'm even more determined to get through

to Lawrence Wright of RJ Mobility to let him know

that his e-mail offer of less than a full refund just isn't good enough.

Here goes.

Oh, hi. Can I speak to Lawrence Wright, please?

'I'm told he's not in the office at the moment.'

It's Dominic Littlewood from the BBC.

Have you got his mobile number, please? Thank you. 'Great.'

'The person I'm speaking to is looking for Lawrence's mobile number

'and asks me to bear with him.'

DIAL TONE

I'm hoping that was an accident.

'Do you know what, I'm beginning to think it's me.

'I'm not having much luck here.

'But there's no way I'm going to give up.'

-Hello, good morning.

-Oh, hi. Was you the guy I was speaking to?

You was getting me a mobile number for Lawrence and I got cut off.

No, it's Lawrence speaking now. I'm here.

'Result at last! Through to the man himself.

'You see? Tenacity does pay off.'

-Lawrence, you know the reason I'm ringing, about William Baker.

-Yes.

There's a couple of things I'd like to query.

I know at the moment you're saying you're prepared to refund him £750

-of the £850 so keeping £100 back for the modifications you've made.

-Yeah.

The reason I'm calling, Lawrence, and I've got to put it bluntly,

is you're not legally entitled to keep that £100.

Well, my understanding is that if it's,

if the product has been specifically tailored

to the customer's specifications,

then my understanding is the law is slightly different.

Is that incorrect?

What happens is, the law does state that if the customer

requests modifications to be made to something,

they waive their right to a seven-day cooling-off period.

However, the thing which you probably aren't aware of,

you then have to inform in writing or any other medium,

confirm to the customer that that is what will happen.

You have to give it to them in writing that they are waiving

their right and Mr Baker didn't receive that.

Lawrence says he was unaware you had to put the information in writing

and continues to suggest it would seem fair to keep back

something of the deposit when something has been tailored for a

customer and the company has pulled out all the stops to do it quickly.

I just would have thought, from a fairness perspective,

that would have been a reasonable thing to ask for but, you know,

I'm not going to, I don't want to draw this thing out for ever

-and ever just because of £100.

-There is no point, is there?

No, you're right.

'Too true.

'And the rest of our conversation is pretty positive

'and Lawrence now understands my point.

'But he still seems to be defending the company's actions.'

We don't want any bad feeling with any of our customers

but in terms of right and wrong, I haven't really done anything wrong.

What did we do wrong?

You weren't entitled, legally, to keep the 850, nor even the 100.

So even though you feel you have done everything right,

there is quite a few errors there which you shouldn't have done.

I'm not trying to dig you out for this, Lawrence,

because if you're running a busy business,

a lot of people don't know the consumer law 100%.

-You haven't done things 100% right.

-OK.

-Nice talking to you, Lawrence.

-Thanks, Dominic.

-Thanks, bye-bye.

After talking to Lawrence, I totally understand where he came from

but he doesn't seem to recognise the fact

that there is a law in place to protect consumers

and he hasn't abided by it.

And after all these weeks,

I definitely feel like Lawrence has got it.

So it's time to break the news.

Time for me to catch up with Bill again.

Believe me, it's not as warm as it looks right now.

I've forgotten my coat so I'm rather hoping he's got the kettle on.

Good to see you again, Bill. Nice to meet you, Mike.

Let me tell you what's happened about the company.

There's a gentleman called Lawrence Wright who runs the company

and I did get to speak to him and I've got to say,

he seemed like quite a nice guy.

And from what he said to me, he felt that you should be paying

for this stairlift because of the fact materials had been altered.

What he didn't seem to understand is that by consumer law,

he shouldn't have started work on that without informing you

that he was doing that

and that will affect your rights to cancel the agreement.

So what he's done is sent me a statement.

And he has asked me to read this out.

"Dear Mr Baker.

"Please find enclosed the cheque for £850,

"being the refunded deposit in full

"for Mr Baker's cancelled stairlift order."

Here's your money.

£850. Full refund.

Fantastic. There you go.

You're winding me up, ain't ya?

You're holding it - how can I be winding you up?

-Oh, God!

-That's fantastic, isn't it?

-Did you know this?

-No! No!

-Not at all. This is the first I've heard of it.

-By God!

I'll have to go and sit down, I think.

-You're not going to collapse on me, are you?

-No, no.

-But I just don't know what to say.

-Seems like a dream, doesn't it?

It does. It really does. It really seems like a dream.

-What would you like to say, Mike?

-Well, fantastic. Thank you, Dom.

Thank you. All of you, thank you very much indeed.

We'd written the money off, to be perfectly honest.

We were getting nowhere with the company.

"I appreciate the opportunity to state our case

"by means of a short statement which follows.

"Mr Wright, Managing Director of RJ Mobility said,

"We have to take a deposit with stairlift orders

"as it enables us to cover our cost of buying and preparation."

That's fair enough.

"However, he regretted retaining the deposit

"and admitted he needed to brush up on consumer protection regulations

"to avoid the situation happening again.

"Specifically as he now has one cut and prepared stairlift

"surplus to requirements.

"By way of making amends for the confusion,

"Mr Wright did say that if Mr Walker's current lift gives him

"any more trouble or packs up completely,

"then his company would fit a brand-new lift free of charge."

I've got to say, for anybody who does that,

take it on the chin and take the blame as he has, I respect that.

-Yeah, I was going to say.

-I respect that as well.

-Yes, yes.

All I can say is thanks a million. Fantastic result.

Right.

I think at this point I'm going to love you and leave you both.

-Pleasure to meet you, Mike. Bill.

-Appreciate it.

The honour has been mine, mate. Honestly.

-Thank you very much indeed. Yeah.

-My pleasure.

You can have a chat now and have a sit down before you collapse, hey?

-That's great.

-I'll see myself out. See you later, guys.

-See you, mate.

I can quite honestly say there is something very satisfying

about turning up at an 81-year-old pensioner's front door

and giving them a cheque for £850

which they thought they would never see again.

You know what, it's been a really good day in the office.

It won't happen again, I can assure you!

I can assure you it won't happen again but if I do,

I can know that I'm in my rights to ask for a written statement

or a written contract

and I've got seven days to cancel

and take it from there.

But, no. I'm more than impressed. Very impressed, yeah.

Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd