Browse content similar to Caught in the Crossfire. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Behind every crime lies a hidden story - | 0:00:02 | 0:00:05 | |
one that goes beyond the news headlines. | 0:00:05 | 0:00:09 | |
Tomorrow, Anders Breivik will be sentenced for his attack in Norway. | 0:00:09 | 0:00:14 | |
77 died, but what happened to the hundreds of survivors? | 0:00:14 | 0:00:19 | |
Last month, 12 were killed at a Batman film screening in Colorado, | 0:00:20 | 0:00:25 | |
but it's the ones who escaped with their lives | 0:00:25 | 0:00:27 | |
who have to live with the memory. | 0:00:27 | 0:00:30 | |
Once the cameras have moved on and the lights are down, | 0:00:30 | 0:00:33 | |
it's those who are left who have to pick up the pieces. | 0:00:33 | 0:00:36 | |
Here on Crimewatch we see hundreds of people who've been caught in the crossfire, | 0:00:38 | 0:00:43 | |
but what happens in the months and years after? | 0:00:43 | 0:00:45 | |
In this programme, I'm going to meet with survivors | 0:00:47 | 0:00:50 | |
as they share the moments when their lives were changed in an instant. | 0:00:50 | 0:00:54 | |
From the Cumbrian shootings by taxi driver Derrick Bird... | 0:00:54 | 0:00:58 | |
The sight of the explosion coming from the end of the barrels. | 0:01:00 | 0:01:04 | |
I remember the heat. | 0:01:04 | 0:01:05 | |
White. White hot, too. | 0:01:07 | 0:01:10 | |
..to the real IRA shooting of unarmed soldiers... | 0:01:10 | 0:01:13 | |
RAPID GUNFIRE | 0:01:13 | 0:01:15 | |
..ambushed as they collected pizza outside their barracks. | 0:01:15 | 0:01:18 | |
As I put my hand up, like this, | 0:01:19 | 0:01:22 | |
they shot through my hand and skimmed my head. | 0:01:22 | 0:01:24 | |
I'm dead. That's what I thought. | 0:01:24 | 0:01:26 | |
They'll share their journeys of recovery, | 0:01:28 | 0:01:32 | |
from the New Year drive-by shooting in Birmingham almost a decade ago... | 0:01:32 | 0:01:35 | |
It changed my life. | 0:01:35 | 0:01:38 | |
And it changed my life forever. | 0:01:38 | 0:01:40 | |
I just don't talk to anyone about it, I just keep it all inside. | 0:01:40 | 0:01:45 | |
..to the murder of toddler James Bulger. | 0:01:45 | 0:01:48 | |
I'll be meeting his mother to see how nearly 20 years | 0:01:48 | 0:01:51 | |
of fighting for justice has shaped her life. | 0:01:51 | 0:01:54 | |
I am a mum. I've got three boys there who need me. | 0:01:54 | 0:01:56 | |
I will not let Thompson and Venables | 0:01:56 | 0:01:59 | |
ruin what I've got in my life now because I HAVE moved on. | 0:01:59 | 0:02:03 | |
This is a story about human resilience, | 0:02:03 | 0:02:06 | |
our ability to fight back | 0:02:06 | 0:02:09 | |
and find new opportunity in the face of loss. | 0:02:09 | 0:02:13 | |
Can survivors of violent crime ever truly recover? | 0:02:13 | 0:02:17 | |
Sh... | 0:02:17 | 0:02:19 | |
What are you doing? | 0:02:19 | 0:02:21 | |
This programme contains some strong language | 0:02:21 | 0:02:26 | |
This programme contains some scenes which some viewers may find upsetting | 0:02:26 | 0:02:30 | |
'Good evening. The two soldiers killed in Northern Ireland | 0:02:30 | 0:02:33 | |
'over the weekend have been named as Sapper Patrick Azimkar | 0:02:33 | 0:02:36 | |
'and Sapper Mark Quinsey. Police investigating the murders | 0:02:36 | 0:02:39 | |
'have revealed that dozens of shots were fired in the attack...' | 0:02:39 | 0:02:43 | |
March 2009. Antrim, Northern Ireland. | 0:02:46 | 0:02:49 | |
These soldiers were about to fly to Afghanistan. | 0:02:51 | 0:02:54 | |
They'd stepped outside their barracks | 0:02:54 | 0:02:56 | |
to collect a pizza delivery, a final home comfort. | 0:02:56 | 0:02:59 | |
But moments after this CCTV image was recorded, | 0:03:01 | 0:03:05 | |
they were attacked by the Real IRA. | 0:03:05 | 0:03:09 | |
Two of them died at the scene. | 0:03:10 | 0:03:12 | |
Mark is one of the survivors. He was seriously injured | 0:03:14 | 0:03:18 | |
and discharged from the army on medical grounds, | 0:03:18 | 0:03:21 | |
but when he returned to his hometown in South Wales | 0:03:21 | 0:03:24 | |
it was the mental trauma that hit him the hardest. | 0:03:24 | 0:03:27 | |
There it is. | 0:03:27 | 0:03:29 | |
That blue door. | 0:03:29 | 0:03:31 | |
I lived up in that top left-hand flat... | 0:03:31 | 0:03:34 | |
..for about four months. | 0:03:36 | 0:03:38 | |
Where I spent my darkest days. | 0:03:41 | 0:03:43 | |
Mark witnessed the execution of his best friend, Pat, | 0:03:45 | 0:03:49 | |
and since that day he's been battling with survivor guilt. | 0:03:49 | 0:03:53 | |
After I got shot, I've put on four stone. | 0:03:53 | 0:03:57 | |
You know, I've had kidney problems, stomach problems. | 0:03:59 | 0:04:03 | |
I've had beards down to here, I've had...you know. | 0:04:03 | 0:04:07 | |
I just lost all control of myself | 0:04:08 | 0:04:11 | |
and, you know, I was just... | 0:04:11 | 0:04:13 | |
Just quite scruffy, really. | 0:04:14 | 0:04:16 | |
Whoever I thought weren't a nice person, I'd...you know. | 0:04:16 | 0:04:21 | |
I'd take the law into my own hands, which I shouldn't have. | 0:04:21 | 0:04:24 | |
-Do you think you may be felt that you shouldn't be alive? -Yeah. | 0:04:28 | 0:04:32 | |
I was walking around thinking I was like a ghost | 0:04:32 | 0:04:35 | |
for the first year or two. | 0:04:35 | 0:04:37 | |
I just didn't think I was...alive. | 0:04:37 | 0:04:40 | |
It was such a mad experience. | 0:04:40 | 0:04:42 | |
It brings so much... The physical stuff... | 0:04:42 | 0:04:44 | |
The mental side of it - why did I survive? Why me? | 0:04:44 | 0:04:47 | |
Why not one of the others, you know? | 0:04:47 | 0:04:50 | |
After the attack, Mark started getting into fights. | 0:04:51 | 0:04:55 | |
I was very afraid that night and, you know, I'm a man, | 0:04:56 | 0:05:00 | |
I've never been that afraid before and it took a dent out of my manhood. | 0:05:00 | 0:05:06 | |
I quite possibly wanted to prove to myself, you know, | 0:05:06 | 0:05:11 | |
that I was, you know...a man, like. | 0:05:11 | 0:05:15 | |
Five years I'd been in the army and I hadn't done anything, | 0:05:17 | 0:05:22 | |
you know, as a soldier I just wanted to get out there | 0:05:22 | 0:05:25 | |
and do what I was supposed to do. | 0:05:25 | 0:05:27 | |
Just in case, for instance, you don't come home, | 0:05:33 | 0:05:35 | |
you've got to pack all your boxes | 0:05:35 | 0:05:38 | |
into a military box and a civilian box, | 0:05:38 | 0:05:41 | |
so, like, you prepare for that. | 0:05:41 | 0:05:44 | |
We were doing, sort of, letters to your loved ones, | 0:05:45 | 0:05:49 | |
which wasn't to be opened unless you died. | 0:05:49 | 0:05:51 | |
Obviously it was dangerous, but you'd been training so long for it | 0:05:54 | 0:05:58 | |
you just wanted to get out there and get going, | 0:05:58 | 0:06:01 | |
but it ended before it began, really, for me, | 0:06:01 | 0:06:05 | |
but I was looking forward to it. I was. | 0:06:05 | 0:06:07 | |
Mark was about to embark on his first tour of Afghanistan. | 0:06:13 | 0:06:17 | |
His regiment, the 38th Royal Engineers, | 0:06:17 | 0:06:20 | |
was packed down and their flight only a few hours away. | 0:06:20 | 0:06:24 | |
We just thought we may as well get a final supper, | 0:06:24 | 0:06:26 | |
so to speak, before we went to Afghan. | 0:06:26 | 0:06:29 | |
But as Mark and his friends went to pick up the pizzas, | 0:06:30 | 0:06:33 | |
they walked straight into an ambush. | 0:06:33 | 0:06:36 | |
Well, I didn't actually see it - I just heard everything. | 0:06:41 | 0:06:44 | |
The minute you heard that sound, what did you think it was? | 0:06:45 | 0:06:48 | |
A falling tree or something like that. Because of the echo. | 0:06:48 | 0:06:53 | |
RAPID GUNFIRE | 0:06:53 | 0:06:56 | |
The Real IRA unleashed a hail of automatic weapon fire. | 0:06:57 | 0:07:01 | |
The soldiers were cornered and unarmed. | 0:07:01 | 0:07:05 | |
As Mark fell to the ground, his best friend, Pat, | 0:07:05 | 0:07:08 | |
landed on top of him, taking the initial gunfire. | 0:07:08 | 0:07:10 | |
I thought, "What the hell am I in?" You know? I didn't know what to do. | 0:07:13 | 0:07:18 | |
I seen they were executing people on the floor. | 0:07:18 | 0:07:21 | |
RAPID GUNFIRE | 0:07:21 | 0:07:23 | |
I knew if I'd run I'd get killed, | 0:07:32 | 0:07:35 | |
so I jumped in the car for cover | 0:07:35 | 0:07:37 | |
and the guy looked inside the car - he was literally by the bonnet. | 0:07:37 | 0:07:40 | |
-This is the killer? -Yeah. | 0:07:40 | 0:07:43 | |
He was by the bonnet and he just looked at me | 0:07:43 | 0:07:45 | |
and when I seen his eyes... Oof. | 0:07:45 | 0:07:48 | |
He just slowly, as if not a care in the world, | 0:07:49 | 0:07:51 | |
walked around to the driver's side of the window, | 0:07:51 | 0:07:54 | |
finished my best mate off. | 0:07:54 | 0:07:56 | |
I was trying to get out the other side of the door. | 0:07:59 | 0:08:02 | |
I managed to grip the other guy by his belt, pull him over | 0:08:02 | 0:08:06 | |
so just his, sort of, bum was showing | 0:08:06 | 0:08:10 | |
and he just shot through all the car, | 0:08:10 | 0:08:12 | |
shot me four times, shot him a couple of times. | 0:08:12 | 0:08:14 | |
I've been shot in the lung, I've been shot in the shoulder. | 0:08:17 | 0:08:20 | |
It was as if I got hit on the head with a shovel. | 0:08:20 | 0:08:22 | |
It was just constantly ringing. | 0:08:22 | 0:08:24 | |
As I put my hand up like this, | 0:08:32 | 0:08:34 | |
he shot through my hand and skimmed my head. | 0:08:34 | 0:08:37 | |
"I'm dead." That's what I thought. | 0:08:37 | 0:08:40 | |
I accepted it. It was as if... sort of, a weight had been lifted. | 0:08:40 | 0:08:44 | |
I just decided, you know, to relax and then I thought - | 0:08:44 | 0:08:49 | |
something came over me - | 0:08:49 | 0:08:50 | |
I just thought, "Not today," type of thing and I just got up. | 0:08:50 | 0:08:54 | |
At least, I was thinking, I'll die trying, innit? | 0:08:54 | 0:08:57 | |
As you ran away, was there time to think about your friend? | 0:09:02 | 0:09:06 | |
I glanced towards Pat just to... Just to... I don't know. | 0:09:06 | 0:09:12 | |
See if he was all right, but obviously I knew I weren't all right. | 0:09:12 | 0:09:16 | |
I knew the circumstances. | 0:09:16 | 0:09:18 | |
It's not as if I could have just stopped, you know? | 0:09:18 | 0:09:21 | |
I kind of expected - I knew - I'd seen bullet holes in him. | 0:09:21 | 0:09:28 | |
If I was stood in a different way to where the first gunshots happened, | 0:09:30 | 0:09:37 | |
I would have died, and say Pat or Mark was standing where I was, | 0:09:37 | 0:09:41 | |
it would have given them that chance to survive, do you know what I mean? | 0:09:41 | 0:09:44 | |
You know, like, Pat was my shield, type of thing. | 0:09:44 | 0:09:50 | |
I know he wouldn't have wanted me to die. | 0:09:53 | 0:09:56 | |
SIRENS WAIL | 0:09:57 | 0:10:00 | |
PANICKED SHOUTING | 0:10:00 | 0:10:02 | |
More than 60 bullets were fired that night in just over 30 seconds. | 0:10:27 | 0:10:31 | |
Despite having a punctured lung and four serious gunshot wounds, | 0:10:31 | 0:10:36 | |
Mark had escaped with his life. | 0:10:36 | 0:10:39 | |
But it's the loss he experienced that would have the greatest effect. | 0:10:39 | 0:10:43 | |
Obviously I was expecting maybe to get shot in wars, | 0:10:43 | 0:10:47 | |
something like that, but, you know, it was such a mad experience. | 0:10:47 | 0:10:52 | |
It still hasn't sunk in, to be honest. | 0:10:54 | 0:10:56 | |
It's made me not want to die alone. | 0:10:56 | 0:10:59 | |
-Yeah, it has made me... Sorry. -It's all right. | 0:11:01 | 0:11:04 | |
BABY CRIES | 0:11:16 | 0:11:19 | |
All right. | 0:11:19 | 0:11:22 | |
Do you want me to have him? | 0:11:22 | 0:11:24 | |
One year after the shooting, Mark met Sophie | 0:11:24 | 0:11:28 | |
and this year he became a dad. | 0:11:28 | 0:11:30 | |
Sh... | 0:11:30 | 0:11:32 | |
What are you doing? | 0:11:32 | 0:11:34 | |
CRYING STOPS | 0:11:34 | 0:11:36 | |
I knew you'd hit Daddy. He likes hitting me in the face. | 0:11:38 | 0:11:41 | |
BABY STARTS CRYING | 0:11:41 | 0:11:44 | |
Since we've had the baby we haven't had no bad dreams | 0:11:44 | 0:11:48 | |
or we haven't woken up crying, | 0:11:48 | 0:11:50 | |
cos, you know, he's not thinking about it, I suppose. | 0:11:50 | 0:11:53 | |
He's more thinking about the baby. | 0:11:53 | 0:11:55 | |
When I cry, I don't bawl my eyes out, like. | 0:11:55 | 0:11:58 | |
-I just... You know, I'm upset. -Yeah, OK. | 0:11:58 | 0:12:02 | |
-OK. -A bit teary. -Bit teary, yeah. | 0:12:02 | 0:12:05 | |
At first it was hard, because, | 0:12:07 | 0:12:10 | |
-you know, because... -I was a bit unpredictable. | 0:12:10 | 0:12:14 | |
I'd just go down the shop | 0:12:18 | 0:12:20 | |
-and all of a sudden I would end up drinking all night and day. -Yeah. | 0:12:20 | 0:12:24 | |
It was obviously frustrating for her. | 0:12:24 | 0:12:28 | |
-You're engaged. You've got a new baby boy. -Yeah. | 0:12:33 | 0:12:36 | |
Just a few weeks old now, how's he doing? | 0:12:36 | 0:12:38 | |
He's pukka. | 0:12:38 | 0:12:40 | |
He's crying a bit, but that's what you expect. | 0:12:40 | 0:12:43 | |
-You doing the feeds? -Yeah. | 0:12:43 | 0:12:45 | |
-I just do the day feeds. -OK. The easy shift. -Yeah. | 0:12:45 | 0:12:49 | |
-He's lush. -Perfect. | 0:12:51 | 0:12:53 | |
When she was pregnant, I never... | 0:12:53 | 0:12:56 | |
you can't get your head round having a kid, until he's actually there. | 0:12:56 | 0:13:00 | |
And then you think, "Whoa!" It's a baby, I've got to look after. | 0:13:00 | 0:13:04 | |
I think, when we going to give him back? But he's here for life! | 0:13:04 | 0:13:08 | |
It's bad, like. This is it now. | 0:13:08 | 0:13:11 | |
Which I'm happy with. | 0:13:11 | 0:13:13 | |
I was thinking about going to college in September, so, | 0:13:13 | 0:13:16 | |
I'm not sure yet, I'd best get a move on. | 0:13:16 | 0:13:19 | |
You know, get picking a course and that. | 0:13:19 | 0:13:22 | |
Pretty soon, I'll be, y'know... | 0:13:22 | 0:13:25 | |
I think, it's only work that's separating me from being, | 0:13:25 | 0:13:28 | |
not fully recovered, but back on... | 0:13:28 | 0:13:32 | |
the right path. | 0:13:32 | 0:13:34 | |
If you and I were to meet in ten years' time | 0:13:34 | 0:13:37 | |
and we were to sit down, what would you like to tell me | 0:13:37 | 0:13:40 | |
about your life, what would you like the next ten years to be? | 0:13:40 | 0:13:43 | |
I think, in the next ten years, y'know, | 0:13:43 | 0:13:46 | |
Blake would be a good kid, | 0:13:46 | 0:13:48 | |
I'd be married, | 0:13:48 | 0:13:51 | |
job, just like, a normal person. | 0:13:51 | 0:13:54 | |
He's called Pat, middle name, after my best friend that died that night. | 0:13:59 | 0:14:03 | |
It's like you lose one best friend and now I've got another. | 0:14:05 | 0:14:10 | |
Circle of life. | 0:14:13 | 0:14:15 | |
Family can be an inspiration. | 0:14:24 | 0:14:26 | |
They can give us purpose. | 0:14:26 | 0:14:29 | |
For Mark, they have helped him see a life beyond the tragedy. | 0:14:29 | 0:14:33 | |
And although people respond to trauma in unique ways, | 0:14:33 | 0:14:37 | |
the thing they have in common is their desire | 0:14:37 | 0:14:39 | |
to get back to normal. | 0:14:39 | 0:14:41 | |
'Tonight at 10. | 0:14:47 | 0:14:49 | |
'12 people murdered in Cumbria' | 0:14:49 | 0:14:50 | |
and 11 injured as a gunman goes... | 0:14:50 | 0:14:54 | |
I remember being in the crash room | 0:14:54 | 0:14:56 | |
and I remember being in some sort of neck brace, because I couldn't move | 0:14:56 | 0:15:00 | |
and I remember them talking about my arm and I came round and I said, | 0:15:00 | 0:15:04 | |
"I don't want to lose my hand and I don't want to lose my arm", and then I went back under again. | 0:15:04 | 0:15:08 | |
They said I could keep my hand. | 0:15:08 | 0:15:10 | |
It would be a living hand. | 0:15:11 | 0:15:12 | |
I wouldn't be able to use it for anything. | 0:15:12 | 0:15:15 | |
But it would just be there, y'know? | 0:15:15 | 0:15:18 | |
And I said no, | 0:15:18 | 0:15:20 | |
I'd rather it be taken off altogether. | 0:15:20 | 0:15:23 | |
Two years ago, Derrick Bird, | 0:15:24 | 0:15:27 | |
a taxi driver from Whitehaven, | 0:15:27 | 0:15:29 | |
went on a shooting rampage. | 0:15:29 | 0:15:32 | |
Without warning, he shot at random along a 52-mile corridor of West Cumbria, | 0:15:32 | 0:15:36 | |
killing 12 and wounding 11. | 0:15:36 | 0:15:40 | |
Among the survivors were a pub landlord and a taxi driver, | 0:15:43 | 0:15:47 | |
both of them left with serious injuries | 0:15:47 | 0:15:50 | |
and psychological scars. | 0:15:50 | 0:15:52 | |
But what separates them is how they've responded | 0:15:52 | 0:15:56 | |
and their individual struggles | 0:15:56 | 0:15:58 | |
to find a new kind of normal. | 0:15:58 | 0:16:02 | |
These are Terry and Harry's stories of survival. | 0:16:02 | 0:16:06 | |
My life has already, to a certain degree, been shortened. | 0:16:09 | 0:16:12 | |
I want time. Can you do me a favour, darling? | 0:16:12 | 0:16:15 | |
Can you get that sticker of that apple? I can't get it off. | 0:16:15 | 0:16:19 | |
Thank you. | 0:16:19 | 0:16:21 | |
And, it's just ridding the body | 0:16:21 | 0:16:25 | |
of all the nastiness. | 0:16:25 | 0:16:27 | |
When Harry was shot, the blast destroyed his right hand | 0:16:27 | 0:16:31 | |
and much of his arm. | 0:16:31 | 0:16:33 | |
He's had microsurgery to get it working again, | 0:16:33 | 0:16:35 | |
but, it's proving a slow and painful process. | 0:16:35 | 0:16:39 | |
There we go. Apple peeled, cored, sliced. | 0:16:39 | 0:16:43 | |
Ready to go. I decided to keep the arm. | 0:16:43 | 0:16:45 | |
I had probably about 700 stitches, in me, all over. | 0:16:45 | 0:16:48 | |
That was a complete rebuild there. | 0:16:48 | 0:16:51 | |
That all came from here, | 0:16:51 | 0:16:54 | |
the back of my legs, you know, all over, | 0:16:54 | 0:16:56 | |
I've got the scars all over the place. | 0:16:56 | 0:16:58 | |
It's very strange cos I got used to not having pain, | 0:16:58 | 0:17:02 | |
or I had the pain, then I got used to not having the pain for, | 0:17:02 | 0:17:05 | |
oh, over a year. Then, as the senses would come back, | 0:17:05 | 0:17:08 | |
total pain. But perseverance is the key. | 0:17:08 | 0:17:13 | |
Come on, dog. | 0:17:15 | 0:17:18 | |
Harry runs a pub with his wife, Paddington. | 0:17:18 | 0:17:21 | |
It's a young business which they've built up from scratch | 0:17:21 | 0:17:25 | |
but since the attack, she's had to take on most of the work. | 0:17:25 | 0:17:29 | |
There's been some interesting drunk moments | 0:17:29 | 0:17:32 | |
where he's become another person. Slightly lively at points. | 0:17:32 | 0:17:35 | |
It's just sheer hard work bearing in mind the business we're in. | 0:17:37 | 0:17:40 | |
It's a hotel, it's a pub and you've got to... | 0:17:40 | 0:17:45 | |
Well, we do enjoy it but if you don't enjoy it, | 0:17:45 | 0:17:47 | |
the whole thing's just going to disappear. | 0:17:47 | 0:17:50 | |
With two small children as well, you can't hide in a corner and cry | 0:17:51 | 0:17:57 | |
cos they're not really going to appreciate that. | 0:17:57 | 0:18:00 | |
That's not going to be good for them. | 0:18:00 | 0:18:02 | |
You just have to make it a really... | 0:18:02 | 0:18:06 | |
You just have to look forward, that's it. | 0:18:06 | 0:18:08 | |
With the knowledge that it's not going to be OK today. | 0:18:08 | 0:18:13 | |
I get very angry. Very angry. I have an incredibly short fuse. | 0:18:16 | 0:18:20 | |
I did before, but I don't think it was this short. | 0:18:20 | 0:18:23 | |
What sort of things make you angry? Is it physical frustrations? | 0:18:23 | 0:18:28 | |
I still suffer a very large amount of pain. | 0:18:28 | 0:18:32 | |
I have to keep active to stop that. | 0:18:32 | 0:18:38 | |
If I stop being active, I get pain, and if I get pain, I get angry. | 0:18:38 | 0:18:41 | |
Kids are always asking what happened to me, they're more interested. | 0:18:46 | 0:18:50 | |
I told some of them that it was because I was naughty as a child. | 0:18:50 | 0:18:56 | |
I didn't do what my mammy said so my arm fell off. | 0:18:56 | 0:18:59 | |
I think they're behaving themselves, them kids, now. | 0:19:02 | 0:19:06 | |
Despite losing his arm, | 0:19:10 | 0:19:12 | |
Terry went back to work just nine months after the attack. | 0:19:12 | 0:19:16 | |
I think he's brilliant. | 0:19:16 | 0:19:18 | |
I actually think he's amazing because he's at work every day with one arm. | 0:19:18 | 0:19:24 | |
Just rolling around in his car. | 0:19:24 | 0:19:28 | |
All my mates get in his taxi and they're like, | 0:19:28 | 0:19:30 | |
"Oh, my God. Just seen your dad." | 0:19:30 | 0:19:33 | |
"Have you?" | 0:19:33 | 0:19:35 | |
It's still sore. | 0:19:38 | 0:19:41 | |
You still get phantom pain in it, | 0:19:41 | 0:19:45 | |
where you think you can feel your fingers and what have you. | 0:19:45 | 0:19:50 | |
Taking tablets for all that. I'm taking tablets... | 0:19:51 | 0:19:55 | |
I don't know what they're for but they're certainly to stop me | 0:19:55 | 0:19:58 | |
from thinking about it, some of them. | 0:19:58 | 0:20:02 | |
Terry worked with Derrick Bird on the taxi rank | 0:20:02 | 0:20:05 | |
and since the shooting, | 0:20:05 | 0:20:07 | |
he's struggled to make sense of what happened. | 0:20:07 | 0:20:10 | |
I knew Derrick very well. | 0:20:10 | 0:20:11 | |
We used to go on holiday together and go out for a drink together. | 0:20:11 | 0:20:15 | |
Always have a craic, you know what I mean. | 0:20:15 | 0:20:18 | |
The not knowing, the not understanding | 0:20:18 | 0:20:19 | |
why somebody who you thought you knew so well | 0:20:19 | 0:20:22 | |
did something as awful as this, how do you cope with not knowing? | 0:20:22 | 0:20:26 | |
I wasn't going to come today because I hadn't slept at all last night | 0:20:26 | 0:20:30 | |
simply because of not knowing. | 0:20:30 | 0:20:33 | |
It just keeps coming back to you. | 0:20:33 | 0:20:35 | |
Sometimes you just don't sleep at all. | 0:20:35 | 0:20:38 | |
Other times, you'll go to sleep and you won't wake up. | 0:20:38 | 0:20:42 | |
It can work both ways. It's as if your brain's saying, | 0:20:42 | 0:20:46 | |
"Don't wake up, you don't have to think about it," | 0:20:46 | 0:20:49 | |
you know what I mean? It's crazy. | 0:20:49 | 0:20:52 | |
Tell me about the morning of that day. | 0:20:56 | 0:20:59 | |
How did that day begin for you? | 0:20:59 | 0:21:01 | |
It was a day that I needed to go to the bank, | 0:21:14 | 0:21:17 | |
I needed to go to the Post Office. | 0:21:17 | 0:21:20 | |
Two minutes before, and actually with the engine started, | 0:21:20 | 0:21:23 | |
the children closed the doors of the car and said, | 0:21:23 | 0:21:25 | |
"We're not coming, Dad. "We're going to stay behind." | 0:21:25 | 0:21:29 | |
With his children safely at home, Harry set off for Whitehaven. | 0:21:29 | 0:21:34 | |
Meanwhile, Terry had just picked up a passenger. | 0:21:34 | 0:21:37 | |
It was my second call when I picked Emma up. | 0:21:37 | 0:21:39 | |
She was going to the doctor's. | 0:21:39 | 0:21:43 | |
The first thing I heard coming over the taxi radio was, | 0:21:43 | 0:21:46 | |
"They've shot him." | 0:21:46 | 0:21:48 | |
To which I thought something had happened on EastEnders | 0:21:48 | 0:21:50 | |
the night before or something. | 0:21:50 | 0:21:52 | |
I didn't realise it was happening in our town. | 0:21:52 | 0:21:55 | |
People in Whitehaven and Egremont are being urged to stay indoors | 0:21:55 | 0:21:59 | |
following reports of a shooting... | 0:21:59 | 0:22:01 | |
By 10:30, Bird had already shot five people. | 0:22:08 | 0:22:13 | |
Now Harry and Terry were in his path. | 0:22:13 | 0:22:17 | |
There's a tunnel bridge in Seascale. | 0:22:17 | 0:22:20 | |
Could see a car coming down and I could see its taxi stripes | 0:22:20 | 0:22:23 | |
and thought, can't be bothered to argue with a taxi. | 0:22:23 | 0:22:26 | |
I could see a police car coming down with the lights on. | 0:22:37 | 0:22:39 | |
I was going, "What the Hell's that?" I noticed Derrick's car in front. | 0:22:39 | 0:22:44 | |
I said to Emma, "What's he been up to now?" | 0:22:44 | 0:22:48 | |
Them buggers are after him for speeding or something, you know. | 0:22:48 | 0:22:51 | |
He waved at me to stop. | 0:22:51 | 0:22:55 | |
I do shoot, and I saw just a pair of barrels. | 0:23:00 | 0:23:05 | |
As I turned round, | 0:23:16 | 0:23:18 | |
there was a double-barrelled shotgun right up against my window. | 0:23:18 | 0:23:22 | |
It was like a massive blowing sensation. | 0:23:34 | 0:23:40 | |
It was somebody throwing a cup of salt or pellets | 0:23:40 | 0:23:43 | |
or little pebbles in your face. | 0:23:43 | 0:23:46 | |
-Right. -It was the smell. Instantly, it was the smell. | 0:23:46 | 0:23:49 | |
It was the smell of cordite. I remember the heat, white. | 0:23:49 | 0:23:54 | |
White hot too. | 0:23:54 | 0:23:56 | |
I was so badly covered in blood, of course, | 0:23:58 | 0:24:00 | |
the police went under the car, | 0:24:00 | 0:24:02 | |
went to the passenger side to get Emma out. | 0:24:02 | 0:24:05 | |
She was shot in the arm, | 0:24:05 | 0:24:07 | |
she got some in the side of her face as well. | 0:24:07 | 0:24:10 | |
She was covered in me mostly, you know what I mean? | 0:24:10 | 0:24:14 | |
I can't stop thinking about your children who were not sitting... | 0:24:16 | 0:24:19 | |
Trust me. | 0:24:19 | 0:24:20 | |
If anything had happened to them, that would have... | 0:24:22 | 0:24:26 | |
I would never have forgiven myself, ever. | 0:24:26 | 0:24:29 | |
In fact, I'm not sure if anything had happened to them, | 0:24:29 | 0:24:32 | |
I'm not sure that necessarily I would have wanted to continue. | 0:24:32 | 0:24:35 | |
I just looked down, I seen bits of my hand were missing, | 0:24:37 | 0:24:43 | |
blood absolutely pissing out everywhere. | 0:24:43 | 0:24:45 | |
Mick, he put his belt around my arm. | 0:24:45 | 0:24:50 | |
-This was a policeman? -A tourniquet, yeah. | 0:24:50 | 0:24:53 | |
He sat me down and he held my arm up above me. | 0:24:53 | 0:24:56 | |
Slows the blood flow. | 0:24:56 | 0:24:57 | |
I was taken into a nearby shop, put on the floor in there. | 0:25:01 | 0:25:05 | |
I waited 90 minutes for the air ambulance to arrive. | 0:25:05 | 0:25:08 | |
-Which seemed like how long? -Oh, weeks. | 0:25:08 | 0:25:11 | |
Absolutely weeks, but also seconds, at the same time. | 0:25:11 | 0:25:16 | |
There was a lot of blanking. | 0:25:18 | 0:25:21 | |
There was a lot of thinking... | 0:25:21 | 0:25:24 | |
of things. | 0:25:24 | 0:25:26 | |
I never went unconscious. I did... I did want to. | 0:25:26 | 0:25:31 | |
Sometimes I could feel myself going. | 0:25:31 | 0:25:35 | |
There was people passing. | 0:25:35 | 0:25:37 | |
I was trying... I had some duck eggs in the car. | 0:25:37 | 0:25:41 | |
About four dozen duck eggs in the car I had brought down | 0:25:41 | 0:25:44 | |
for someone who wanted to buy them off me. | 0:25:44 | 0:25:47 | |
I knew I wasn't going to get to them so I was telling people | 0:25:47 | 0:25:50 | |
who were passing to take the eggs out of the car. | 0:25:50 | 0:25:53 | |
Don't let them go to waste, you know what I mean? | 0:25:53 | 0:25:56 | |
I do remember at one very drunken point turning around and saying, | 0:25:58 | 0:26:02 | |
"Listen, guys, I can't thank anybody here enough for what they've done | 0:26:02 | 0:26:05 | |
"but please will somebody just get me a fucking ambulance." | 0:26:05 | 0:26:09 | |
It was... | 0:26:09 | 0:26:11 | |
-That's hard, that bit. Just hold on a sec. -Sure thing. | 0:26:14 | 0:26:19 | |
-Sorry. -No, just let me know. | 0:26:21 | 0:26:24 | |
It's hard purely and simply because you don't realise | 0:26:24 | 0:26:27 | |
at the time what people are prepared to do to keep you alive. | 0:26:27 | 0:26:33 | |
You know, I was lucky I'd got my hand up in front of my head to start with. | 0:26:48 | 0:26:52 | |
End of. If I hadn't have got my hand up, I was gone. Simple as. | 0:26:52 | 0:26:56 | |
Good reflexes. Should have been a goalkeeper. | 0:26:56 | 0:27:00 | |
HE LAUGHS | 0:27:00 | 0:27:01 | |
We're only here for as long as we're allowed to stay. Then you go. | 0:27:04 | 0:27:10 | |
Everybody's number comes up. | 0:27:10 | 0:27:12 | |
Running a pub can be a physical job, | 0:27:22 | 0:27:24 | |
so the injuries to Harry's arm are a constant reminder of the attack. | 0:27:24 | 0:27:29 | |
Can't fry an egg, can't chop a log, can't pull a pint. | 0:27:29 | 0:27:34 | |
It's as simple as that. I cannot do anything and it's... | 0:27:34 | 0:27:38 | |
But I'm here. I'm alive and I'm not complaining about that, | 0:27:43 | 0:27:46 | |
but it is terribly, terribly frustrating. | 0:27:46 | 0:27:49 | |
Derrick Bird committed suicide in the woods | 0:27:54 | 0:27:57 | |
just a stone's throw from Harry's family home. | 0:27:57 | 0:28:00 | |
His name is the Devil incarnate, as far as I'm concerned, | 0:28:00 | 0:28:04 | |
and rather than swearing at the Devil, I swear at him. | 0:28:04 | 0:28:07 | |
I mean, he's my Devil. | 0:28:07 | 0:28:10 | |
But, you know what, | 0:28:14 | 0:28:18 | |
he's not here, so it's not an issue. | 0:28:18 | 0:28:22 | |
Terry and his friends used to go out on fishing trips with Derrick Bird, | 0:28:28 | 0:28:32 | |
or Birdy as he was known amongst the taxi drivers. | 0:28:32 | 0:28:36 | |
Despite having only one arm, Terry continues | 0:28:36 | 0:28:39 | |
to do the things he enjoyed, but it's not as straightforward. | 0:28:39 | 0:28:44 | |
Everything is back to front, than used by this arm, | 0:28:44 | 0:28:48 | |
whereas I'm now going to use it by my left hand. | 0:28:48 | 0:28:52 | |
Everything is upside down and back to front. | 0:28:52 | 0:28:55 | |
His friend Brian helps on the boat and since the attack, | 0:28:57 | 0:29:00 | |
insists that Terry goes out to unwind. | 0:29:00 | 0:29:05 | |
-You've got to. If you don't, you end up like Birdy. -That's right. | 0:29:05 | 0:29:10 | |
Your head would fill up with rubbish. You've got to let it out. | 0:29:10 | 0:29:15 | |
I don't blame him for what he done. | 0:29:17 | 0:29:19 | |
On a normal day, he wouldn't have done it. | 0:29:19 | 0:29:22 | |
Just something triggered in his head and he just wasn't him again. | 0:29:22 | 0:29:27 | |
But as I say, we've all got that demon somewhere. | 0:29:27 | 0:29:31 | |
Just need something to fire it off, isn't it? | 0:29:31 | 0:29:34 | |
What do you feel about the fact he took his own life at the end? | 0:29:34 | 0:29:38 | |
Well, why didn't he do that at the start? You know? | 0:29:38 | 0:29:42 | |
That's one thing that comes to mind. | 0:29:42 | 0:29:45 | |
It's a pity he did do it at the end because now we'll never find out. | 0:29:47 | 0:29:52 | |
Maybe if he'd left a letter or something before he had done it, | 0:29:53 | 0:29:57 | |
it would have helped everybody, I think. | 0:29:57 | 0:30:00 | |
But he didn't. He just took it with him. | 0:30:00 | 0:30:02 | |
For Harry, the fact that Bird is dead has made all the difference. | 0:30:07 | 0:30:13 | |
He ended his life 400 yards in that direction. | 0:30:13 | 0:30:16 | |
I've walked down there, take the dog for a walk, | 0:30:16 | 0:30:19 | |
go and walk the children, the children know where it was. | 0:30:19 | 0:30:23 | |
But they don't have to think about him | 0:30:23 | 0:30:26 | |
because I'm still here, that's number one to them. | 0:30:26 | 0:30:29 | |
Secondly, he's dead. Therefore, it's cut out. | 0:30:29 | 0:30:32 | |
Yeah, it's inside out. | 0:30:32 | 0:30:34 | |
'I'll never have to face in a court of law. I never have to see him' | 0:30:34 | 0:30:38 | |
being given a sentence that is reduced by half for good behaviour. | 0:30:38 | 0:30:43 | |
I'll never see that he's let out. | 0:30:44 | 0:30:47 | |
And my children will never have to know that person is still around. | 0:30:48 | 0:30:53 | |
And they are my inspiration. | 0:30:54 | 0:30:57 | |
And I don't want them to grow up with this sense of hatred, | 0:30:57 | 0:31:02 | |
of destructiveness, in their life. | 0:31:02 | 0:31:05 | |
And it's because of them that I will go to the length | 0:31:05 | 0:31:12 | |
that I am going to become as normal a dad as possible. | 0:31:12 | 0:31:17 | |
For them. Definitely. | 0:31:17 | 0:31:19 | |
Terry and Harry have shown incredible resilience | 0:31:20 | 0:31:24 | |
living through something most of us will never experience. | 0:31:24 | 0:31:28 | |
But actually surviving a violent crime is only the beginning | 0:31:28 | 0:31:33 | |
of the long road to recovery. | 0:31:33 | 0:31:35 | |
'Good evening.' | 0:31:35 | 0:31:36 | |
The police in Birmingham have got used to gun crime, but nothing like this. | 0:31:36 | 0:31:40 | |
In the early hours of this morning, they were called to a shooting | 0:31:40 | 0:31:44 | |
outside a party at a hairdressers' salon. They found two teenage... | 0:31:44 | 0:31:49 | |
The morning after New Year's Day 2003, | 0:31:49 | 0:31:53 | |
four girls were gunned down outside a party. | 0:31:53 | 0:31:56 | |
Two of them, Charlene Ellis | 0:31:56 | 0:31:58 | |
and Letisha Shakespeare, died at the scene. | 0:31:58 | 0:32:01 | |
But Charlene had a twin sister, Sophie, who was also shot. | 0:32:01 | 0:32:05 | |
And this is her story of survival. | 0:32:07 | 0:32:10 | |
"I remember having a brief conversation with one of the paramedics from the ambulance team | 0:32:10 | 0:32:16 | |
"who had brought me into hospital. | 0:32:16 | 0:32:18 | |
"She quietly told me that my sister had been shot too. | 0:32:18 | 0:32:22 | |
"And that she didn't make it. My whole body went numb. | 0:32:22 | 0:32:27 | |
"I heard her loud and clearly, but she said it to me | 0:32:27 | 0:32:32 | |
"and it did not register." | 0:32:32 | 0:32:34 | |
-Where you close? -Very. We used to argue a lot but we were very close. | 0:32:36 | 0:32:41 | |
We would argue one minute and then talk the next. | 0:32:41 | 0:32:44 | |
I'm lucky. She's a part of me. I think about her every day. | 0:32:44 | 0:32:48 | |
I still say I'm her twin. | 0:32:49 | 0:32:51 | |
Because I am. | 0:32:51 | 0:32:53 | |
It's hard to forget about someone that you was in the womb with. | 0:32:53 | 0:32:58 | |
I can't just forget about it. | 0:32:58 | 0:33:01 | |
Nearly ten years ago, | 0:33:12 | 0:33:14 | |
a Birmingham gang plotted a drive-by shooting of their rivals. | 0:33:14 | 0:33:19 | |
The Burger Bar Boys were seeking revenge | 0:33:19 | 0:33:21 | |
for the murder of one of their members. | 0:33:21 | 0:33:25 | |
The attack would have tragic consequences. | 0:33:25 | 0:33:28 | |
I'd like to ask you just to take me through the evening. | 0:33:28 | 0:33:33 | |
-What did you get up to? -We just were ready, excited to go, | 0:33:33 | 0:33:36 | |
had everything planned out, our clothes planned out, | 0:33:36 | 0:33:40 | |
we all had similar jackets and similar outfits. | 0:33:40 | 0:33:45 | |
We got to this party. I saw a particular person in there. He was... | 0:33:45 | 0:33:49 | |
To me, he was acting a bit weird, | 0:33:50 | 0:33:53 | |
which made me think something is not right. | 0:33:53 | 0:33:58 | |
Sophie had joined a private party at the back of a hairdressers'. | 0:33:58 | 0:34:01 | |
She had no idea | 0:34:01 | 0:34:03 | |
this was also the target location for the drive-by shooting. | 0:34:03 | 0:34:06 | |
The Burger Bar Boys were waiting for their chance to strike. | 0:34:09 | 0:34:13 | |
Rumours had spread that their rivals, the Johnson Crew, | 0:34:20 | 0:34:24 | |
would be at the party. | 0:34:24 | 0:34:25 | |
With a spotter in place, they waited for their cue. | 0:34:27 | 0:34:31 | |
Unknowingly, Sophie, Charlene and the others were about to walk into the line of fire. | 0:34:33 | 0:34:38 | |
TEXT ALERT | 0:34:42 | 0:34:44 | |
I didn't hear anything coming towards me. | 0:34:50 | 0:34:55 | |
I didn't hear like a gradual noise to say, this is happening, | 0:34:55 | 0:34:59 | |
get down on the floor. To me, it was in a blink of an eye, | 0:34:59 | 0:35:02 | |
and by the time I blinked, I was on the floor. | 0:35:02 | 0:35:05 | |
GUNFIRE | 0:35:20 | 0:35:23 | |
GUNFIRE | 0:35:30 | 0:35:32 | |
DISTANT SIRENS | 0:35:39 | 0:35:41 | |
I thought maybe everyone had a lucky escape. | 0:35:41 | 0:35:45 | |
Just thought that it was just me. | 0:35:45 | 0:35:48 | |
Bev - Sophie and Charlene's mother - | 0:35:48 | 0:35:51 | |
was fast asleep at home when the news came through. | 0:35:51 | 0:35:54 | |
I got a phone call at four o'clock in the morning. | 0:35:54 | 0:35:59 | |
When I heard "shot", | 0:35:59 | 0:36:01 | |
I thought - why would somebody want to shoot two girls? | 0:36:01 | 0:36:05 | |
When I got to the hospital, people was coming in the room | 0:36:07 | 0:36:11 | |
one by one to see me, like I was probably going to die. | 0:36:11 | 0:36:15 | |
Did any of the doctors, any of the surgeons, talk to you at the time? | 0:36:15 | 0:36:19 | |
-Did they explain to you what was happening? -A paramedic spoke to me. | 0:36:19 | 0:36:23 | |
I must have asked her the question about Charlene. | 0:36:23 | 0:36:27 | |
I must have asked where she was. She said... | 0:36:27 | 0:36:30 | |
Something along the lines of, "It's not good news." | 0:36:32 | 0:36:35 | |
She said she was injured too and she didn't make it. | 0:36:35 | 0:36:39 | |
She told me that | 0:36:39 | 0:36:41 | |
but it was like when she told me, I didn't believe what she was saying. | 0:36:41 | 0:36:44 | |
I felt like... I didn't accept it. | 0:36:44 | 0:36:47 | |
All I could see was blood. Just blood everywhere. | 0:36:47 | 0:36:50 | |
And then I was told to go into the other room | 0:36:52 | 0:36:56 | |
to identify Charlene's body. | 0:36:56 | 0:36:58 | |
I didn't want to do that | 0:36:58 | 0:37:00 | |
because that's something I didn't ever think I would have to do. | 0:37:00 | 0:37:04 | |
Charlene and Letisha were dead, three others seriously injured. | 0:37:06 | 0:37:11 | |
During the gunfight, over 30 rounds were fired. | 0:37:11 | 0:37:14 | |
The gang had used a Mac 10 submachine gun, | 0:37:14 | 0:37:17 | |
also known as a "Spray and Pray". | 0:37:17 | 0:37:20 | |
Yet no-one from either gang was hurt. | 0:37:20 | 0:37:23 | |
You were shot four times. You had very severe injuries. | 0:37:25 | 0:37:29 | |
The surgery was successful. How was your recovery? | 0:37:29 | 0:37:32 | |
-How long were you in hospital for? -Er... | 0:37:32 | 0:37:35 | |
I think I was in there for about four weeks in total. About four weeks. | 0:37:38 | 0:37:43 | |
And was there a point when you were in hospital that you did come to accept that your sister had died? | 0:37:45 | 0:37:51 | |
No. | 0:37:51 | 0:37:53 | |
Two years later, the case went to trial and four members | 0:37:57 | 0:38:00 | |
of the Burger Bar Boys were given life sentences, totalling 132 years. | 0:38:00 | 0:38:06 | |
But that wasn't the end for Sophie and her mother. | 0:38:07 | 0:38:11 | |
I think it was the day after the court case, a group of boys | 0:38:14 | 0:38:17 | |
came down and trashed Sophie's car and tried to put my windows in. | 0:38:17 | 0:38:23 | |
I felt fearful and scared because I'm thinking, | 0:38:25 | 0:38:28 | |
"What have I done wrong?" | 0:38:28 | 0:38:31 | |
I didn't do anything, so why are people trying to put my windows in? | 0:38:31 | 0:38:35 | |
There's been situations where I have been in church, for instance, | 0:38:36 | 0:38:41 | |
and some of the guys in there, relatives of the perpetrators, | 0:38:41 | 0:38:45 | |
saying things like, "There's the girl that got my cousin sent down." | 0:38:45 | 0:38:50 | |
And I'm thinking, "Well, I didn't do nothing." | 0:38:50 | 0:38:55 | |
For you, particularly, and what happened to your family, there were | 0:38:55 | 0:38:59 | |
very unusual circumstances, in that a half-brother of yours | 0:38:59 | 0:39:02 | |
was in the car belonging to the gang the shots were fired from. | 0:39:02 | 0:39:06 | |
That must have added an extra layer of complication to everything, | 0:39:07 | 0:39:11 | |
-I think. Would that be fair? -Yeah, I would agree with that. Yeah. | 0:39:11 | 0:39:16 | |
Just the whole story and people saying, "The brother killed the sister." | 0:39:16 | 0:39:20 | |
Things like that. It's quite disturbing, to be honest. | 0:39:20 | 0:39:23 | |
To actually think about, OK, that happened. | 0:39:23 | 0:39:26 | |
I don't like to think about it, to be honest. | 0:39:26 | 0:39:30 | |
Have you spoken to her over these past ten years | 0:39:30 | 0:39:33 | |
about her feelings about losing her twin sister? | 0:39:33 | 0:39:36 | |
Is it something you're able to discuss with her? | 0:39:36 | 0:39:39 | |
I haven't spoken to Sophie about it. | 0:39:39 | 0:39:42 | |
How she's feeling, or... No, I just haven't. | 0:39:43 | 0:39:47 | |
No. I think it's because... | 0:39:47 | 0:39:50 | |
I think it's because... | 0:39:51 | 0:39:54 | |
I haven't... | 0:39:57 | 0:39:59 | |
I don't want to... | 0:39:59 | 0:40:01 | |
I don't want Sophie to offload on me. | 0:40:03 | 0:40:07 | |
I don't think I'd be able to take her offloading on me. | 0:40:07 | 0:40:10 | |
I think it would be better if she offloaded on someone else, | 0:40:10 | 0:40:14 | |
but offloading on me, I think it's going to have... | 0:40:14 | 0:40:16 | |
..an impact on me. | 0:40:19 | 0:40:22 | |
I just don't talk to anyone about it. | 0:40:22 | 0:40:25 | |
I just...keep it all inside. | 0:40:25 | 0:40:28 | |
Maybe one day I will. | 0:40:30 | 0:40:32 | |
But I think it's a thing where I need to be ready to talk about it. | 0:40:32 | 0:40:36 | |
I don't think I am ready. | 0:40:36 | 0:40:39 | |
Losing her twin was devastating for Sophie. | 0:40:42 | 0:40:45 | |
And to this day, she hardly ever talks about what happened. | 0:40:45 | 0:40:49 | |
But over the past decade, she's continued to witness | 0:40:49 | 0:40:52 | |
the destructive impact of gang culture on others. | 0:40:52 | 0:40:57 | |
A lot of things have happened since the incident | 0:40:57 | 0:41:00 | |
where young youths have lost their lives to gun crime as well. | 0:41:00 | 0:41:05 | |
And you're thinking, look at that. | 0:41:05 | 0:41:08 | |
That person... Was that Charlene? Do you know what I mean? | 0:41:08 | 0:41:13 | |
And then... They've lost their lives. | 0:41:13 | 0:41:16 | |
You just don't know when you're going to lose your life. | 0:41:16 | 0:41:20 | |
I am wary and mindful. | 0:41:20 | 0:41:22 | |
Seeing some of the social needs in her community, | 0:41:24 | 0:41:27 | |
Sophie recently decided to start mentoring young women. | 0:41:27 | 0:41:32 | |
Her experiences give her a unique perspective. | 0:41:32 | 0:41:36 | |
I've started shadowing other mentors to try | 0:41:36 | 0:41:40 | |
and support vulnerable young girls. | 0:41:40 | 0:41:43 | |
-Right. -You know, a lot of them are young offenders. | 0:41:43 | 0:41:51 | |
Out of school, out of education. | 0:41:51 | 0:41:54 | |
And just, like, on the streets, really. | 0:41:54 | 0:41:57 | |
-Hi, Kirk. -How are you? | 0:41:59 | 0:42:01 | |
Retired police officer Kirk Dawes has also seen | 0:42:03 | 0:42:06 | |
the effects of gun crime in the area. | 0:42:06 | 0:42:08 | |
He is now training Sophie, giving her the skills to support others. | 0:42:08 | 0:42:12 | |
I've watched Sophie since those awful days years ago. | 0:42:12 | 0:42:18 | |
You can't buy that sort of experience | 0:42:18 | 0:42:20 | |
and to want to give it back is unusual. It is rare. | 0:42:20 | 0:42:25 | |
Sophie, I know, doesn't think in terms of retaliation and revenge, | 0:42:25 | 0:42:29 | |
but how she moves her life forward and indeed the lives of others. | 0:42:29 | 0:42:32 | |
For me, it makes me feel good to know that I'm actually getting | 0:42:32 | 0:42:38 | |
this person to look at something on a different perspective and change | 0:42:38 | 0:42:42 | |
their attitude and change their life, change the way they think. | 0:42:42 | 0:42:46 | |
So, yeah. | 0:42:46 | 0:42:48 | |
Hopefully, I will make a difference. | 0:42:48 | 0:42:51 | |
Unlike the gang which killed her sister, Sophie didn't seek revenge. | 0:42:55 | 0:42:59 | |
She decided to go after something positive | 0:42:59 | 0:43:02 | |
and become part of the support network in her area. | 0:43:02 | 0:43:06 | |
But for other people, it is the pursuit of justice | 0:43:06 | 0:43:10 | |
which gives them a sense of purpose. | 0:43:10 | 0:43:12 | |
'The One O'Clock News from the BBC. | 0:43:23 | 0:43:26 | |
'Police say the Liverpool toddler James Bulger | 0:43:26 | 0:43:29 | |
'was horrifically murdered before being hit by a train.' | 0:43:29 | 0:43:33 | |
Almost 20 years ago, James Bulger, a two-year-old, | 0:43:35 | 0:43:38 | |
was abducted from the Strand shopping centre near Liverpool. | 0:43:38 | 0:43:42 | |
The toddler was tortured in ways unimaginable by 10-year-old boys, | 0:43:42 | 0:43:47 | |
Robert Thompson and Jon Venables. | 0:43:47 | 0:43:49 | |
Two days later, his disfigured body was discovered on a railway track. | 0:43:50 | 0:43:55 | |
It was a crime that stunned the nation | 0:43:57 | 0:44:00 | |
and thrust James's mother into the spotlight. | 0:44:00 | 0:44:03 | |
I came here today because I felt my son James should be represented. | 0:44:05 | 0:44:10 | |
The loss she experienced drove her to spend almost two decades campaigning for justice. | 0:44:10 | 0:44:15 | |
It's about time I started getting answers. I am sick of them closing doors in me face. | 0:44:15 | 0:44:20 | |
So how has she coped with the years of continued hope and disappointment? | 0:44:20 | 0:44:25 | |
I would like to see them tried again in a court. | 0:44:25 | 0:44:28 | |
I would like to be in the courtroom while this is being done. | 0:44:28 | 0:44:32 | |
This is Denise and her story of survival. | 0:44:32 | 0:44:34 | |
I've done the best I could to be a mum to him. | 0:44:45 | 0:44:48 | |
Nothing was going to hurt him or happen to him. | 0:44:48 | 0:44:52 | |
You don't think for one minute that, | 0:44:52 | 0:44:54 | |
within a few hours, your whole life was going to be turned upside down. | 0:44:54 | 0:44:59 | |
In the days that surrounded James's killing, | 0:45:00 | 0:45:03 | |
you not only had to deal with an unimaginable | 0:45:03 | 0:45:06 | |
amount of personal trauma, you also had to deal with | 0:45:06 | 0:45:10 | |
an almost unprecedented amount of media interest. | 0:45:10 | 0:45:12 | |
Can you try to describe to me what a typical day was like? | 0:45:12 | 0:45:16 | |
In the beginning, | 0:45:16 | 0:45:17 | |
I refused to go outside the door, I locked myself in a bedroom. | 0:45:17 | 0:45:20 | |
The only time I came out was to use the bathroom. | 0:45:20 | 0:45:23 | |
When I did venture out, I had cameras shoved in my face. | 0:45:24 | 0:45:27 | |
You're wondering why people are not leaving you alone | 0:45:27 | 0:45:30 | |
and you're wondering why you haven't got that little boy around your feet. | 0:45:30 | 0:45:35 | |
It just feels like you're living in a total nightmare. | 0:45:35 | 0:45:38 | |
You just want to grieve, you just want to be by yourself, | 0:45:38 | 0:45:42 | |
you don't want the world seeing how you're looking. | 0:45:42 | 0:45:45 | |
I felt like I was living under a black veil, | 0:45:45 | 0:45:48 | |
underneath a massive black cloud that I couldn't shift. | 0:45:48 | 0:45:52 | |
I thought, this is my life now. This is what I've got to live with, | 0:45:52 | 0:45:55 | |
if I continue to live with it. | 0:45:55 | 0:45:57 | |
Denise was by then heavily pregnant with her second son Michael | 0:45:57 | 0:46:02 | |
and only attended court at the end of the Thompson and Venables trial. | 0:46:02 | 0:46:06 | |
My memories of the last day | 0:46:06 | 0:46:08 | |
was seeing Thompson and Venables stand in front of me. | 0:46:08 | 0:46:11 | |
They weren't too far. | 0:46:11 | 0:46:13 | |
I think if I stood up and reached out, | 0:46:13 | 0:46:16 | |
I would have been able to touch them. | 0:46:16 | 0:46:18 | |
I just remember their shoulders moving, they were sniggering. | 0:46:18 | 0:46:21 | |
I just thought, you find it funny, | 0:46:21 | 0:46:23 | |
you took a look young person's life and you think it's hilarious. | 0:46:23 | 0:46:27 | |
Thompson and Venables were sentenced to eight years in custody | 0:46:38 | 0:46:42 | |
until they reached adulthood, making them | 0:46:42 | 0:46:44 | |
the youngest convicted murderers in modern English history. | 0:46:44 | 0:46:49 | |
I thought it was an absolute joke. | 0:46:49 | 0:46:51 | |
I thought, my son's life was only worth eight years? | 0:46:51 | 0:46:54 | |
I thought, they've done an adult crime, | 0:46:54 | 0:46:57 | |
they should have done a lot longer sentence. | 0:46:57 | 0:46:59 | |
That's why I petitioned. | 0:46:59 | 0:47:01 | |
After the trial, Denise started lobbying for a longer sentence | 0:47:01 | 0:47:05 | |
and launched Justice For James. | 0:47:05 | 0:47:09 | |
It's time everyone started thinking about what they done. | 0:47:09 | 0:47:12 | |
They took a two-year-old's life. | 0:47:12 | 0:47:15 | |
They're just evil, in my eyes. | 0:47:15 | 0:47:18 | |
Determined, Denise launched a petition | 0:47:18 | 0:47:22 | |
and took thousands of signatures to the Home Office. | 0:47:22 | 0:47:25 | |
Their minimum jail term was raised to 15 years. | 0:47:25 | 0:47:29 | |
She had succeeded. For now. | 0:47:30 | 0:47:32 | |
On release, I would have said, they've done the time, | 0:47:32 | 0:47:35 | |
they have done time in an adult prison, there's nothing else I can do | 0:47:35 | 0:47:38 | |
and I would have been living a normal life now. | 0:47:38 | 0:47:41 | |
But the sentencing battle continued | 0:47:41 | 0:47:43 | |
until it was put back to the original eight-year term. | 0:47:43 | 0:47:46 | |
Throughout this period, Denise kept fighting. | 0:47:46 | 0:47:50 | |
Was there a point where you thought, "I've just got to leave this alone"? | 0:47:50 | 0:47:54 | |
-This is the justice system and I've got to get on with my life? -No. | 0:47:54 | 0:47:58 | |
No, because it was my son I was fighting for. | 0:47:58 | 0:48:01 | |
No-one else was going to do it. He's not here to speak out. | 0:48:01 | 0:48:04 | |
I'll do it for him. I've always said that and I'll always do it for him. | 0:48:04 | 0:48:07 | |
The pressure of campaigning had affected her marriage | 0:48:07 | 0:48:11 | |
and Denise split up with James's father, Ralph. | 0:48:11 | 0:48:15 | |
Three years later, she married Stuart. | 0:48:15 | 0:48:18 | |
Sometimes, things do get on top of me still. | 0:48:18 | 0:48:22 | |
And I do take it out on Stuart. He is a good runner! | 0:48:22 | 0:48:25 | |
And I run just as quick as him! | 0:48:25 | 0:48:27 | |
He does have to put up with a lot and I always say to him, | 0:48:27 | 0:48:31 | |
when I first met Stuart, once he realised I was James's mum, | 0:48:31 | 0:48:34 | |
I said to him, "You don't have to stay. | 0:48:34 | 0:48:37 | |
"I have got to go through a lot in life. It's up to you." | 0:48:37 | 0:48:42 | |
But Stuart chose to stay and we've been happy ever since. | 0:48:42 | 0:48:46 | |
It's a really big thing, to say to somebody, | 0:48:46 | 0:48:49 | |
if you were falling for him and he was falling for you, to have that conversation, to say I understand | 0:48:49 | 0:48:53 | |
if this is too much. It must have been a big moment. | 0:48:53 | 0:48:56 | |
I thought, I don't want you to go through what I've been through, just thrown in the deep end. | 0:48:56 | 0:49:01 | |
I did explain to him what type of a life he would be living | 0:49:01 | 0:49:05 | |
if he married me. And he was fine by it. | 0:49:05 | 0:49:08 | |
With her new husband, Denise continued to fight for justice. | 0:49:08 | 0:49:12 | |
But in 2001, Thompson and Venables were released on licence, | 0:49:12 | 0:49:17 | |
under a witness protection-style programme. They were also given new identities. | 0:49:17 | 0:49:22 | |
The case was a hot potato. They didn't know how to handle it. | 0:49:22 | 0:49:25 | |
But they've protected them the best way they can, whereas they basically told me to get on with it. | 0:49:25 | 0:49:30 | |
I do remember just before they were released, one of the judges | 0:49:30 | 0:49:33 | |
turned round and said, "She's moved on and gone on to have more kids now. | 0:49:33 | 0:49:38 | |
"We need to protect these two," which really wound me up big-time. | 0:49:38 | 0:49:41 | |
I felt like standing up and screaming out in the court that day. | 0:49:41 | 0:49:46 | |
I just think, it's all wrong. That's why I really hate them so much. | 0:49:46 | 0:49:51 | |
They took James's life - they took him away from me - | 0:49:51 | 0:49:55 | |
-but they're still getting the best of everything. -In light of the terrible thing that happened to you, | 0:49:55 | 0:50:01 | |
I wondered how easy it was to give your kids freedoms, to allow them | 0:50:01 | 0:50:05 | |
-to have that independence every kid needs. -Michael has just turned 18. | 0:50:05 | 0:50:09 | |
He is only just being allowed out now. | 0:50:09 | 0:50:12 | |
Thomas and Leon aren't allowed out unless me, Stuart or both of us are with them. | 0:50:12 | 0:50:17 | |
Michael's just left school now and he's going to be looking for a job soon. | 0:50:17 | 0:50:21 | |
I'm thinking, there's no way you're slipping through my fingers just yet. I'm keeping hold of you. | 0:50:21 | 0:50:28 | |
In 2010, Venables broke the terms of this licence | 0:50:28 | 0:50:31 | |
and was jailed for possessing and distributing child pornography. | 0:50:31 | 0:50:35 | |
He is due for parole later this year. | 0:50:35 | 0:50:38 | |
After almost 20 years of battling with the legal system, | 0:50:38 | 0:50:42 | |
Denise has finally reached a turning point. | 0:50:42 | 0:50:45 | |
All the fighting and campaigning, I've never got anywhere with it. | 0:50:45 | 0:50:50 | |
Once I realised I wasn't going to get that justice, I had to do something nice in his name. | 0:50:50 | 0:50:54 | |
Last year, having moved on from Justice For James, she launched | 0:50:54 | 0:50:59 | |
a charity, offering disadvantaged children a free holiday. | 0:50:59 | 0:51:04 | |
-The badge has now changed and I've got a charity badge. -What does the badge say? -It just says "For James". | 0:51:04 | 0:51:10 | |
Everything that I do in the future is just going to be for James. | 0:51:10 | 0:51:13 | |
Just to see James's name, I know inside, it gives me a huge plus. | 0:51:13 | 0:51:20 | |
I thought, at last, I've done something in his name. | 0:51:20 | 0:51:23 | |
He's not just a memory any more. I can also see his name in gold. | 0:51:23 | 0:51:26 | |
-I wonder when you had time to grieve because... -I never have. | 0:51:28 | 0:51:33 | |
I've never had... | 0:51:33 | 0:51:35 | |
I couldn't go out because the press were there | 0:51:37 | 0:51:41 | |
and when I was inside, I had Michael to consider. | 0:51:41 | 0:51:45 | |
I think what really got me through it was after the dark days, | 0:51:45 | 0:51:49 | |
I found out I was pregnant with Michael. | 0:51:49 | 0:51:51 | |
The dark days were still there but I had something inside me that I had to live for. | 0:51:51 | 0:51:56 | |
I needed this baby and this baby needed me. I had to be there for him. | 0:51:56 | 0:52:01 | |
I didn't want anything rubbed off onto him. | 0:52:01 | 0:52:05 | |
So really, I don't think I have ever grieved. | 0:52:05 | 0:52:08 | |
I've just had to push my way through it. | 0:52:08 | 0:52:11 | |
A violent crime can be committed in seconds, | 0:52:13 | 0:52:16 | |
but its impact can be felt for generations. | 0:52:16 | 0:52:20 | |
Denise lost James in a single moment, | 0:52:20 | 0:52:23 | |
but her sense of injustice may never go away. | 0:52:23 | 0:52:26 | |
Last month in America, 12 people were killed at a Batman screening | 0:52:31 | 0:52:35 | |
when a man dressed in riot gear opened fire on the audience. | 0:52:35 | 0:52:40 | |
And in the state of Colorado, the survivors are being consulted | 0:52:40 | 0:52:44 | |
about whether or not to seek the death penalty for the accused. | 0:52:44 | 0:52:48 | |
In Norway, despite calls for a similar sentence, | 0:52:48 | 0:52:52 | |
some of those who escaped last year's attacks have already faced Anders Breivik in court. | 0:52:52 | 0:52:59 | |
And there, the death penalty is not an option. | 0:52:59 | 0:53:02 | |
I have pain in my stomach. I was really... | 0:53:02 | 0:53:07 | |
I was worrying because I hadn't seen the man | 0:53:08 | 0:53:11 | |
who did this in live-action since Utoya. | 0:53:11 | 0:53:16 | |
Stine was one of around 600 that gathered on Utoya island. | 0:53:16 | 0:53:21 | |
When Breivik opened fire, she managed to swim away, | 0:53:21 | 0:53:25 | |
but many did not. | 0:53:25 | 0:53:27 | |
Like others, she's had concerns about attending the trial | 0:53:27 | 0:53:31 | |
and sharing a courtroom with the man who executed her friends. | 0:53:31 | 0:53:35 | |
So the first hour was really terrible, | 0:53:35 | 0:53:39 | |
but then it just... All the anxiety and everything just left. | 0:53:39 | 0:53:45 | |
And I found some kind of peace in seeing the man who did this | 0:53:46 | 0:53:52 | |
with handcuffs. | 0:53:52 | 0:53:53 | |
He was in the control of the court. He can't hurt me any more. | 0:53:53 | 0:53:58 | |
Bjorn was also on the island when Breivik started firing. | 0:54:00 | 0:54:04 | |
He managed to rescue two children as he fled to the mainland. | 0:54:04 | 0:54:07 | |
A natural reaction to what happened will be | 0:54:09 | 0:54:12 | |
to put the death penalty back in or torture the terrorist, | 0:54:12 | 0:54:16 | |
but I don't really think that's the way we should deal with this | 0:54:16 | 0:54:22 | |
in a democratic society. | 0:54:22 | 0:54:24 | |
The best way to get back at him is to stay true to the values we had. | 0:54:24 | 0:54:27 | |
Astrid hid behind some rocks when Breivik turned on her | 0:54:27 | 0:54:31 | |
and was there for two hours before being rescued. | 0:54:31 | 0:54:34 | |
I think it would be really good to be finished with it, | 0:54:34 | 0:54:38 | |
because then we can stop focusing on him | 0:54:38 | 0:54:40 | |
and start focusing even more on our future. | 0:54:40 | 0:54:44 | |
But, one year on, she still can't talk | 0:54:44 | 0:54:47 | |
about the things she saw that day. | 0:54:47 | 0:54:49 | |
These survivors all escaped physical injury, | 0:54:50 | 0:54:53 | |
but they continue to struggle with the horrors they witnessed | 0:54:53 | 0:54:57 | |
and the loss of so many friends. | 0:54:57 | 0:54:59 | |
My injuries are hidden, I mean, you can't see them on me. | 0:55:01 | 0:55:03 | |
And in some ways I think it's possibly easier | 0:55:03 | 0:55:06 | |
to deal with this emotionally if you have a physical scar, | 0:55:06 | 0:55:10 | |
if you have some sort of concrete mark that you were actually there and were injured. | 0:55:10 | 0:55:15 | |
A lot of people have gotten tattoos to get the physical mark | 0:55:15 | 0:55:20 | |
on themselves, that they have some relation to the terror. | 0:55:20 | 0:55:24 | |
Astrid was separated from her best friend during the shooting | 0:55:26 | 0:55:29 | |
and wasn't told she'd died for over a week. | 0:55:29 | 0:55:32 | |
You know, when you are 17 and you are speaking with your friends, | 0:55:32 | 0:55:36 | |
one of your best friends, you always have these future plans, | 0:55:36 | 0:55:40 | |
and I think it's really sad that she isn't able to be with us | 0:55:40 | 0:55:44 | |
when we are going to do those plans. | 0:55:44 | 0:55:46 | |
I really get a feeling that life isn't so sure, | 0:55:46 | 0:55:51 | |
it's not so sure that we will live till we are 80. | 0:55:51 | 0:55:55 | |
Despite the devastation, the people of Norway have shown | 0:55:56 | 0:56:00 | |
incredible strength and, like many caught in the crossfire, | 0:56:00 | 0:56:04 | |
it's friends and family that are helping them through the recovery process. | 0:56:04 | 0:56:09 | |
For me, it has been crucial to allow myself to welcome | 0:56:10 | 0:56:15 | |
the help that was offered, to realise that being strong | 0:56:15 | 0:56:19 | |
in this kind of situation is also realising that | 0:56:19 | 0:56:23 | |
you can't do it all by yourself. | 0:56:23 | 0:56:25 | |
I guess it's true that when you share your grief, | 0:56:26 | 0:56:29 | |
it doesn't become smaller, but it's easier to carry. | 0:56:29 | 0:56:33 | |
Violent crime can kill, devastate and destroy, | 0:56:36 | 0:56:41 | |
but the way survivors respond to trauma and grief varies. | 0:56:41 | 0:56:46 | |
I've met with people at different stages of recovery | 0:56:46 | 0:56:50 | |
and, although time has not always been a healer, | 0:56:50 | 0:56:53 | |
it has allowed for a change of focus. | 0:56:53 | 0:56:56 | |
What's clear is there's no defined path back to normality. | 0:56:56 | 0:57:00 | |
We live in a world where nothing is certain. | 0:57:00 | 0:57:05 | |
Everybody says, it can't happen to us, but it does happen to us, doesn't it, you know? | 0:57:05 | 0:57:09 | |
It does, no doubt about it, it does. | 0:57:09 | 0:57:11 | |
But, when faced with tragedy, | 0:57:12 | 0:57:14 | |
it's how we respond that makes all the difference. | 0:57:14 | 0:57:17 | |
This will always be with me, | 0:57:17 | 0:57:20 | |
but it will not put any boundaries on what I'm capable of doing. | 0:57:20 | 0:57:25 | |
I want to be able to use that hand, I want to be able to grip | 0:57:25 | 0:57:29 | |
a motorbike and I want to be able to twist grip the throttle. | 0:57:29 | 0:57:31 | |
That is my aim. | 0:57:31 | 0:57:33 | |
It's the people we allow into our lives that shape our future... | 0:57:33 | 0:57:37 | |
Sophie, my fiancee, she was the main reason, like, | 0:57:37 | 0:57:42 | |
cos she's a nice girl and I didn't want to be a nasty person. | 0:57:42 | 0:57:46 | |
I knew her niceness would rub off on me eventually. | 0:57:46 | 0:57:51 | |
..and the opportunities we embrace that give us hope. | 0:57:51 | 0:57:54 | |
To be able to help them want to be more positive about life | 0:57:54 | 0:57:58 | |
and not stray down the wrong road, for me, it's a good feeling. | 0:57:58 | 0:58:02 | |
Just to see James's name, you know, inside the caravan, | 0:58:02 | 0:58:05 | |
it did give me a huge buzz, because I thought, you know, at last | 0:58:05 | 0:58:09 | |
I've done something in his name, he's not just a memory any more. | 0:58:09 | 0:58:12 | |
Crime changes lives, | 0:58:12 | 0:58:14 | |
but over time we can learn to adapt and find a new kind of normal. | 0:58:14 | 0:58:20 | |
Survival is part of being human. | 0:58:20 | 0:58:24 | |
It feels like what happened is an eternity ago. | 0:58:24 | 0:58:28 | |
It feels like I've gone through a lot and I'm happy, like. | 0:58:28 | 0:58:33 | |
Happy with my life, at this moment in time. | 0:58:33 | 0:58:36 | |
Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd | 0:58:47 | 0:58:51 |