Jo Cox: Death of an MP


Jo Cox: Death of an MP

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This programme contains some scenes which some viewers may find upsetting.

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-MAN ON PHONE:

-'He's shooting everybody.'

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-WOMAN ON PHONE:

-'Who's shooting everybody?'

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-'A gunman.

-A gunman's shooting everybody?

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-'Yeah.

-OK, whereabouts?

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'Outside the library at Birstall.

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-'He's stabbed someone as well.

-He's stabbed someone as well?'

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It's a brutal attack, he is going to kill her,

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there is nothing going to stop him from doing so.

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There's rage, there's real rage.

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-NEWS REPORTS OVERLAP:

-Reports of a stabbing, reports of a shooting.

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The Labour MP Jo Cox, shot and stabbed in her constituency...

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..in a killing which led to the suspension of campaigning

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in the EU referendum.

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Police have charged Thomas Mair with the murder of the Labour MP...

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Even now, I don't think I'll ever be able to reconcile it,

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because it's not him. How can you know someone for nine years

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and not know that he's capable of doing that?

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We're asking you WHY you've done it?

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Jo Cox's family want to know why...

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she's dead.

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-Thank you, it's been nice to meet you.

-It's really good

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-that you're here. Hello!

-A wonderful-looking lady.

-Go, Labour!

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I can't remember anybody not liking Jo.

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We were really, really close. We were close all our lives, really,

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but particularly when we were kids.

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We grew up in Heckmondwike.

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We used to go up and play in the barley fields.

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There was a wild horse that used to chase us

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and there was a bull, so I remember, like,

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playing out for hours and hours and hours.

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We had a very good childhood, a very happy childhood.

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She was a hard act to follow, going through school,

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cos Jo was good at everything.

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She was academic, but she was also sporty.

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She was very popular, she'd got a lot of friends.

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She was a little bit too good to be true.

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2005 has been an unprecedented year for Oxfam,

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both in terms of the number and scale of the disaster...

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MAN: Jo and I were both were both working at Oxfam.

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She was very, sort of, well-known as being this very, sort of, effective,

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passionate advocate.

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People talked about her with a sort of mix of admiration and awe.

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We ended up having dinner together one night

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and she cooked me a very bad vegetarian lasagne, which she burnt.

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Cooking wasn't her strongest point,

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but it was a very nice meal anyway.

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We'd always lived on boats together.

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Every two weeks, we'd live somewhere different. It was beautiful.

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Amazing way to live, for a period, at least.

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One of the, sort of, defining things of her was that energy

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and that she just put into everything,

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from the most mundane tasks to the most significant.

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Therefore, made days exciting and interesting

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even if they weren't necessarily going to be so,

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and particularly with the kids.

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She put such an energy into them.

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There was once a banana, and it was a cheeky kind of banana.

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Do you know what it did?

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What Jo did, she passed on to both of them,

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her excitement and her, sort of, joy at life.

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People said, "I quite fancy eating a banana."

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-SING-SONG:

-"You can't catch me, I'm a banana!"

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Thomas Mair was eight years of age when his mum and dad separated,

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and he came to live in the Birstall area,

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which is where his grandmother lived.

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His mum and his grandma, Tommy, and his younger brother, Scott,

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all in lived in the same house.

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You might see Tommy now and again,

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I don't think he ever played out, really.

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He spent every evening reading or writing stories.

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His mum described him as an intellectual child.

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Quite gifted at school, certainly sat Mensa exams. In his teens,

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not interested in girls, not interested in going to the pub.

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All the regular things that you would expect from a teenager,

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Thomas wasn't interested in.

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His mother remarried and had another son.

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I know that his mother formed a relationship with

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an African-Caribbean man, and from that time onwards,

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their relationship deteriorated.

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Mum left and got her own place, so it was just Tommy and his grandma.

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About 20 years ago, the grandma died

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and Tommy was left in the house on his own.

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Very cold, very impersonal.

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Clearly he was a very well-ordered individual.

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Single bed, very, very neatly made.

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Everything had its place.

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He had a very well-structured lifestyle,

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in terms of his daily routine.

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It was evident that he ate the same things.

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There's an obsessive compulsiveness about him.

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The tins are facing the right way.

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It's that classic OCD-ness.

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He'd wash his hands with the use of Brillo pads.

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His mum described them as blue, almost, his hands,

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cos they'd basically taken the skin off.

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His face and forehead were red, but not as bad as his hands.

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Apparently, he had a thing about germs.

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Nobody has come forward to say they've ever been in any form of

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relationship with him at all.

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Just not communicated on any level with anybody, really.

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Lived a solitary life and, in fact,

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some witnesses have described him as almost being a hermit.

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So, first of all, I'm standing for the Labour Party in Batley and Spen,

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which is quite a large constituency around here

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and many of your listeners, I think, live in that constituency.

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I grew up in Batley and Heckmondwike...

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She got a call letting her know that the MP from her hometown

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was standing down.

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For me, it was so obviously the thing that she wanted to do next

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with her life, and I knew that she'd be incredibly good at it,

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and I knew that this chance wouldn't come up again.

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So we said, "Let's go for it."

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You'd be here five years?

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Five years. But, hopefully, I'll be here for 20 years.

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-You'll be getting tired of seeing me.

-So once you're in...

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Jo was driven by a desire to help people

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and I think she had become very politically aware

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whilst at university, and since,

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that politics was a means of helping people,

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and politics was a means of creating a difference.

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APPLAUSE

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The Conservative Party candidate, 15,769.

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This was where we grew up, she wanted to be our MP.

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She wanted to be the MP for Batley and Spen.

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It was never just about getting a constituency.

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It was getting her home constituency,

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with the people that she cared about

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and the area that she knew and loved.

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Cox, Jo, Labour Party,

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-21,826.

-CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

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-Jo, how do you feel right now?

-I'm elated, but I'm humbled that

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the people of Batley and Spen have put their trust in me

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to be your next Member of Parliament.

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But I'm very excited.

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My husband and I have been up all night.

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I remember lifting her up into the air and giving her a hug and, yeah,

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just being really excited, and her, sort of,

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bounding with enthusiasm and excitement about it.

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Thank you, Mr Speaker.

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It's a great privilege to be called to make my maiden speech.

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Batley and Spen is a gathering of typically independent, no-nonsense,

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proud Yorkshire towns and villages.

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Our communities have been deeply enhanced by immigration,

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be it Irish Catholics across the constituency,

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or Muslims from Indian Gujarat or Pakistan,

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and whilst we celebrate our diversity,

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the thing that surprises me

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time and time again as I travel around the constituency is that

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we are far more united and have far more in common

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than that which divides us.

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From getting elected, she just really threw everything into it.

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She was so determined.

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-JO COX:

-It's been a busy year. You know, we hit the ground running.

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I've probably dealt with about, oh,

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4,000 or 5,000 individual families already across Batley and Spen.

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Jo picked up hundreds of issues

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during the campaign, so we had a lot to go at, to start with.

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You know, the ability to stand up in the House of Commons and actually

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really challenge the Government to make sure that its policies reflect

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what local people are worried about...

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She was just like Tigger.

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She'd just bounced around all over the place.

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Sometimes I felt like I was just trailing along in her wake

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and she'd be bouncing off somewhere.

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She just had so much energy, and just keeping up with her,

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mentally and physically, was hard work.

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You know, we've helped people get discharged from hospital faster,

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get better compensation, get new houses.

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She just had this unbelievable gift to bring everybody on a journey

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with her. She was very, sort of, down-to-earth, very humble,

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and I think she had a very, sort of, um, friendly, sort of,

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informal, sort of, approach with people.

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Just to repeat to any of your listeners, if anyone does have

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a problem they're really grappling with,

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where they think me and my team can help,

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they just need to come to one of my surgeries.

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They're all on the website. Give my office a ring...

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Thomas has never worked,

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and that's because he's been signed off due to his anxiety.

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But what that did allow Thomas to do was to work voluntary.

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It would be around 2007,

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and Tom came to increase his confidence, his IT skills.

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Which, you know, that is what we do.

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We're there to work with people that have got physical disabilities,

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mental health, learning disabilities.

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You know, there are a lot of people out there that can do more,

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if they're given the opportunity,

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and given the right guidance, and the confidence.

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He would sit there...very solitary, he would not engage with anybody.

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He wouldn't chat with the person next to him.

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If he was stuck with something, in the work that he was doing,

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he would not ask,

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he would just stare at the screen, waiting for someone to go to him.

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If you tried to engage in a conversation,

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it was like trying to extract teeth, getting him to actually talk.

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He then left us to go and volunteer -

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volunteer as a gardener.

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"I can honestly say

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"it has done me more good than all the psychotherapy

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"and medication in the world.

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"Many people who suffer from mental illness..."

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Indeed, there's an article,

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I think in the Huddersfield Examiner, going back some years,

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where Thomas is interviewed, and describes the fact

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that those types of groups were far more beneficial

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than anything that medication could ever do for him.

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"Feelings of worthlessness are also common,

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"mainly caused by long-term unemployment.

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"All these problems are alleviated by doing voluntary work."

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Tom came back to us, wanting to be a volunteer.

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He wanted to help people.

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And he did just short of five years volunteering.

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He would come to me with ideas, erm, for example,

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at Christmas he said,

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"Can we make balloon animals, you know, in the group?

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"Can I get some balloons?" And...fine.

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I've got to say, it was one of the loudest,

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most chaotic groups that I've ever seen.

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We were just giggling all afternoon.

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I think Tom was a bit of a show-off, as well.

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Because, you know, it was something he could do.

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And I think it was, really, he wanted to be liked.

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He was treated with respect by those learners,

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he was liked by those learners.

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And he wanted to give them something back, because he'd been accepted.

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Nobody knew this guy.

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His own mother didn't really know him.

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-HITLER:

-Ich face der fuhrer!

-CHEERING

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HITLER CONTINUES IN GERMAN

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Almost on a daily basis, Thomas Mair was looking at web pages

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relating to the Nazis.

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HITLER SPEAKS IN GERMAN

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He volunteered at the libraries in Batley and Birstall.

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And that gave him access to the internet.

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There was no online activity going on at his home address.

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There was no iPad, iPod, laptop, or anything like that in his own home.

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-Ich liebe Deutschland!

-CHEERING

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He spends the majority of his spare time in the library.

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His internet search history, which we were able to access,

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would indicate that he'd been using that facility since 2012.

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Anything far right,

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he appears to have had an interest in for some time.

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He wasn't in chatrooms with other people in political groups,

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he wasn't on any online forums

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engaging in any healthy social debate.

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Hitler! Hitler aber ich Deutschland...

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He was able to immerse himself in this hatred and this ideology,

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and nobody knew about it.

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DAVID CAMERON: I will go to Parliament

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and propose that the British people decide our future in Europe,

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through an in-out referendum on Thursday the 23rd of June.

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Get our country back!

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Get our country back, absolutely! We're there.

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Our economy is better if we're inside...

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-No, it isn't.

-Yes, it is.

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-No, it isn't.

-Yes, it is.

-All right...

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We need to think about the younger generations,

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the people that are going to bring this country forward in the future,

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-but you're not.

-If we want to vote to leave this organisation,

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let's vote to leave it,

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but let's not do it on the basis of three things

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that are completely untrue.

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If we leave the European Union, the world's our oyster.

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We can do what the hell we like.

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Yeah!

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Many businesses in Yorkshire also want the security and stability

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of Britain's continued membership of the European Union,

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a cause I look forward to passionately championing

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in this place and elsewhere.

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Jo was very strong to Remain.

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She did market stalls.

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She did a column in the paper about it.

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She went to talk to groups about it.

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But she was very adamant that she would be voting to Remain,

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and she tried to encourage other people to do the same.

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Very quickly, in or out?

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I'm in. We should definitely stay in Europe.

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Good for jobs, good for security,

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I don't want Scotland to leave England...

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The Remain vote was one of the things that she was working on,

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she was out, busy campaigning and knocking on doors,

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engaging with people.

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But it wasn't the only thing that she thought was important.

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She was very interested in Syria, and the problems going on there.

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Very, very passionate about trying to improve things

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for the Syrian people.

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-JO COX:

-It's how history judges us.

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I believe that Syria is our generation's test.

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She genuinely believed

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that it was the biggest humanitarian crisis of our time.

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And I think, having worked for Oxfam for so many years,

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she felt like she couldn't ignore that.

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You know, she wasn't prepared to just shy away from it

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because it was a contentious issue.

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She felt very strongly that the people who needed to come here

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should be allowed to come here

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and that we should help to look after them.

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On refugees,

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what further can the UK do to get the most vulnerable people

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out of harm's way, and surely,

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isn't it time to end the Government's shameful refusal

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to give 3,000 unaccompanied children sanctuary here in the UK?

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CHEERING

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Is it not time we took back control of our immigration policy?

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And on the subject of immigration,

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I think their campaign is verging on the squalid.

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-Where are these...?

-Stop shouting!

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Where are these refugees going to go?

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Do you know what? Every month, I scrape, I scrape...

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NIGEL FARAGE: The opinion polls are astonishing.

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77% of the British public want cuts to the numbers coming into Britain,

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and over half the voters want a reduction to near zero.

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We're not big enough.

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We're over... We're overdone. We're full! We're full!

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The 7th of June is...kind of focal moment, really, for him.

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One of the searches that Thomas Mair did

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was a general Wikipedia search on Jo Cox.

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And then there is a whole section on her political career,

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and the causes that she was very, very engaged with.

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You can almost imagine him sitting, becoming quite angry.

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-JO COX:

-What has Europe done for Yorkshire?

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£7.8 billion worth of goods, exported to Europe.

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That is about 30,000 jobs dependent on our trade with Europe.

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And then he starts looking at an image of a .22 rim-fire rifle.

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And then a search on YouTube

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of some individuals in the United States test-firing one.

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GUNSHOTS

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HE LAUGHS

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I'm presuming that at that stage,

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he either knows how he's going to get hold of such a weapon,

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or in fact, at that point, has come into possession of that weapon.

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Around about that time,

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there would've been posters up in that library,

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saying Jo Cox will be here on the 16th of June,

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and she'll be doing a surgery on that day.

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It's where Jo's constituents could come and see Jo.

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People would come to the surgery,

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and then they would come in and speak to Jo

0:18:370:18:40

and tell them what their problem was,

0:18:400:18:42

and we'd tell them what we could do to help.

0:18:420:18:44

All around him, he will have been, "Right, motive, opportunity...

0:18:480:18:53

"Oh, opportunity, big-time opportunity."

0:18:530:18:56

VOICEOVER: It's highlighting a new report from a group campaigning

0:18:560:18:59

for tighter immigration controls,

0:18:590:19:01

which says a quarter of a million people

0:19:010:19:03

cannot face up to the big issue about immigration.

0:19:030:19:06

If you're at the bottom of the pile, you've paid the price...

0:19:060:19:09

If we've voted to leave, who's going to be happiest?

0:19:090:19:12

It's going to be Nigel Farage, Boris Johnson,

0:19:120:19:15

and a resurgent right that I think would spell disaster.

0:19:150:19:18

I only saw him on the Friday before.

0:19:220:19:25

We'd had a quick word - just, "Hi, how are you?"

0:19:250:19:28

"Yeah, all right." "What are you doing today?"

0:19:280:19:31

Erm...

0:19:310:19:32

There was very little said, that wasn't run-of-the-mill,

0:19:320:19:36

part of his volunteering.

0:19:360:19:38

If he was feeling that way, why didn't he say something?

0:19:400:19:43

What had changed from that Friday to the Thursday, when it happened?

0:19:450:19:50

It just doesn't make sense.

0:19:500:19:52

13th of June, he's researching -

0:19:560:19:58

"is a .22 shot to the head deadly?"

0:19:580:20:01

It's a very popular round, it's extremely useful,

0:20:010:20:05

and no serious...

0:20:050:20:07

There'd been some search history about the human anatomy,

0:20:070:20:11

locations of organs, etc.

0:20:110:20:13

So I have no doubt in my mind

0:20:130:20:14

that he'd planned exactly where he wanted to put that knife.

0:20:140:20:18

So, the day before, we'd got up,

0:20:270:20:29

the kids and I were going out on our little dinghy,

0:20:290:20:33

with the motor on the back,

0:20:330:20:35

cos Nigel Farage was coming up the river,

0:20:350:20:37

with a big "Out" flotilla.

0:20:370:20:40

Nigel, you're a fraud.

0:20:400:20:43

This campaign's gone way beyond the ordinary,

0:20:430:20:45

far past the usual insults and intrigue of politics.

0:20:450:20:48

A group of friends had decided that we'd go out with our "In" flags.

0:20:480:20:52

It was all very, sort of, er, light-hearted.

0:20:520:20:55

So we jumped onto the boats, and Jo had helped get the kids ready,

0:20:550:20:58

into their life jackets, and given them a flag to hold each.

0:20:580:21:02

Then I zipped off, and Jo was taking some pictures.

0:21:020:21:05

Then we all waved her goodbye as we came past the pontoon.

0:21:050:21:08

She then went up to the constituency,

0:21:080:21:11

and that was the last time that we...that we saw her.

0:21:110:21:14

The earliest point that we've got him within the library

0:21:260:21:29

is on the previous day, on the 15th,

0:21:290:21:31

when he's in, speaking to members of staff.

0:21:310:21:33

Specifically asking about the Jo Cox surgery

0:21:350:21:37

that was due to take place the following day.

0:21:370:21:40

Asking questions about the time,

0:21:410:21:43

asking questions about whether he needed to book an appointment.

0:21:430:21:46

He had a black holdall, sports holdall,

0:21:510:21:54

it does appear to be containing something heavy.

0:21:540:21:56

I think he's pretty much had hold of the weapon, wherever he's had it,

0:21:590:22:02

in his possession. You know, he's had it with him.

0:22:020:22:05

Every Wednesday evening, down at the centre,

0:22:110:22:14

we have a demonstration of mediumship.

0:22:140:22:16

We also have holistic therapies and massage.

0:22:180:22:21

Now, I was upstairs, when a gentleman came in,

0:22:220:22:26

wanting some more information.

0:22:260:22:29

He'd passed the centre on a regular basis,

0:22:300:22:33

he'd always wondered what it was about,

0:22:330:22:36

but never had the courage to come in.

0:22:360:22:38

He'd been suffering with depression and anxiety for a long time,

0:22:400:22:44

and was on medication.

0:22:440:22:46

He was looking at things to work alongside what he was taking.

0:22:470:22:51

As people started to arrive, he became more uncomfortable,

0:22:530:22:57

more restless, like moving side to side.

0:22:570:23:01

He asked if I would be there on Thursday morning, which I said yes,

0:23:010:23:06

and my colleague Suzanne would be there, as well.

0:23:060:23:10

And we could sit down and have a cuppa, and a chat,

0:23:100:23:12

and go through different therapies and things in more detail.

0:23:120:23:17

I asked him his name, and he said Tommy.

0:23:170:23:21

And I said, "I'll see you tomorrow, Tommy."

0:23:210:23:24

She had a sort of small cottage-type place,

0:23:330:23:36

and in true Jo form, she had no food, or milk, or anything.

0:23:360:23:40

SHE LAUGHS

0:23:400:23:41

She was so focused on the bigger picture,

0:23:410:23:44

that the day-to-day stuff just got forgotten.

0:23:440:23:47

She never had any food, so you always had to feed her.

0:23:470:23:49

She never had anything to wear, so you always

0:23:490:23:51

had to find her something to wear, and she never had any cash.

0:23:510:23:54

You always had to, you know, sort her out with some money.

0:23:540:23:56

So generally, Mum would feed her, she would borrow my clothes,

0:23:560:23:59

and Dad would sort out the cash.

0:23:590:24:01

She'd rang her mum at night, at about nine, half nine, saying,

0:24:010:24:05

"Mum, I've just got home, but I've got no food, no milk, or anything,

0:24:050:24:08

"and I'm really hungry."

0:24:080:24:09

So her mum had said, "Well, what do you want?

0:24:090:24:11

"Do you want a sandwich or a jacket potato?"

0:24:110:24:13

She said, "Oh, it's fine. I'll just have a cheese sandwich,

0:24:130:24:15

"but can you send some milk?

0:24:150:24:16

"Because I've got cereal, but I've got no milk",

0:24:160:24:18

so her dad, bless him, had gone out, half nine, quarter to ten at night,

0:24:180:24:22

to give her the sandwich, and food, or whatever, which, obviously now,

0:24:220:24:27

he's really pleased that he'd seen her the night before.

0:24:270:24:30

REPORTER: Immigration is the key issue for UKIP.

0:24:380:24:41

The party's latest posters feature a vast queue of people and the

0:24:410:24:45

controversial warning that the EU is reaching breaking point.

0:24:450:24:49

Jo came into the office,

0:24:510:24:53

and she said, "Oh, what an awful thing to do."

0:24:530:24:55

We were sort of saying, we can't believe

0:24:550:24:58

that he'd put something like that out.

0:24:580:25:00

Every one of these can get to Calais.

0:25:000:25:02

We know how bad our Government is at defending our borders,

0:25:020:25:06

and within a few years, all of these people will have EU passports.

0:25:060:25:10

We are much less safe as part of this European Union.

0:25:100:25:14

Thomas left his own home address around half nine in the morning...

0:25:260:25:30

..took himself up to the Birstall retail park, just by the M62...

0:25:320:25:36

..where he spent a large amount of time, simply, kind of,

0:25:390:25:41

window shopping. Went into WH Smith's, read a few magazines,

0:25:410:25:45

and looked at the local paper.

0:25:450:25:46

For want of a better expression, he's killing time.

0:25:480:25:50

Significantly, he's in possession of the bag containing the firearm.

0:25:500:25:55

Equally as important, he's wearing the two baseball caps - a black one,

0:25:550:25:58

underneath the cream baseball cap.

0:25:580:26:00

He doesn't make any purchases, and then leaves,

0:26:030:26:05

and basically tracks the same route back towards

0:26:050:26:08

his home address and indeed goes home for a short period of time.

0:26:080:26:11

Jo came to us at about 11 o'clock. I think,

0:26:190:26:22

initially, she was scheduled to be with us for about an hour.

0:26:220:26:26

Everyone wants to see the fire engines being built,

0:26:260:26:28

that's the bit they want to go and see.

0:26:280:26:30

Obviously, we were fast approaching the In/Out referendum.

0:26:320:26:36

She threw that pebble in the pond,

0:26:370:26:39

it was very much Jo said,

0:26:390:26:41

"So, go on, dare I ask,

0:26:410:26:42

"how are you all voting in here?"

0:26:420:26:44

The bulk of that office

0:26:440:26:46

was in favour of leaving the European Union,

0:26:460:26:49

so she had a tough job.

0:26:490:26:51

But it was really well-handled.

0:26:510:26:53

Jo was respectful of people's views.

0:26:530:26:56

She listened.

0:26:560:26:58

I just instantly felt a lot of warmth for Jo for that.

0:26:580:27:02

That we could have quite different opinions,

0:27:020:27:05

and yet, still, really,

0:27:050:27:08

clearly, get on and have a mutual respect for one another.

0:27:080:27:11

Interestingly, every time he seems to leave the address,

0:27:210:27:24

he's got a bag of rubbish with him.

0:27:240:27:26

It seems to be part of his routine, leaving his property,

0:27:260:27:28

he takes his refuse with him

0:27:280:27:31

and dumps it just around the corner.

0:27:310:27:32

Instead of turning left towards the retail park,

0:27:370:27:40

he takes the right-hand turn, and goes, effectively,

0:27:400:27:42

down towards Birstall town centre.

0:27:420:27:45

There's significant CCTV in and around Market Square,

0:27:490:27:52

from both the local authority systems,

0:27:520:27:54

and also from private systems,

0:27:540:27:56

and we can effectively track his movements.

0:27:560:27:59

It was the day of the England match, it was England v Wales.

0:28:030:28:08

And I said to my mum that I was going to meet a few friends...

0:28:080:28:11

..in the pub.

0:28:120:28:14

I got off the bus,

0:28:140:28:17

I seen Tommy stood at the bus stop.

0:28:170:28:20

I said hello to him.

0:28:210:28:23

He didn't say hello back, and I did a double-take,

0:28:240:28:27

noticed he had a suit jacket on, which was...

0:28:270:28:29

I'd never seen him wearing a suit jacket.

0:28:300:28:32

He was fiddling about with t'lapels, trying to make himself look tidy,

0:28:330:28:37

and I thought he just mustn't have heard me.

0:28:370:28:39

I didn't think anything else of it.

0:28:410:28:42

I thought he was getting on the bus that I'd just got off.

0:28:420:28:45

And I went into the pub.

0:28:450:28:47

His movements from the CCTV would indicate that he'd done some form of

0:28:490:28:53

reconnaissance before the incident, and therefore

0:28:530:28:56

knew what vehicle to look out for.

0:28:560:28:59

He's milling about, he purchases a chocolate bar,

0:29:000:29:04

and we see him eat the chocolate bar,

0:29:040:29:06

and dispose of the wrapper

0:29:060:29:07

just opposite the shop called The Vape Lounge,

0:29:070:29:10

where he's got a perfect vantage point down towards the library.

0:29:100:29:13

She was supposed to head back into the office for 12 o'clock.

0:29:190:29:23

But I knew Jo would never come at that time.

0:29:230:29:25

She was always late. Obviously,

0:29:250:29:26

we had the surgery booked for one o'clock, so we ideally wanted

0:29:260:29:30

to get to Birstall for about quarter to, ten to.

0:29:300:29:32

She came into the office at 12...I think about 35.

0:29:340:29:38

Jo burst into the office, as usual, "Hiya!"

0:29:400:29:44

And I said, "You're late!"

0:29:440:29:47

And she said, "Yes, I know I'm late, but I've had a fabulous morning.

0:29:470:29:49

"Come here and give me a massive hug, cos I haven't seen you

0:29:490:29:53

"for two weeks. Did you have a nice holiday?"

0:29:530:29:55

And then we said, "Look, we're going to have to go very soon,

0:29:550:29:59

"or we're going to be late for the surgery."

0:29:590:30:01

And she said, "Yes, I know, but I'm bloody starving."

0:30:010:30:03

I said, "We don't have time for you to get a sandwich,

0:30:030:30:06

"but I've got a pasta bake for you in the fridge.

0:30:060:30:08

"Heat it up in the microwave, and you can have it on the way."

0:30:080:30:11

She literally, like,

0:30:110:30:13

wolfed a whole plate of pasta down from the top of the steps to the

0:30:130:30:16

bottom of the steps, and left the bowl at the bottom, and said,

0:30:160:30:19

"I'll leave it here, then we'll take it up later when we come."

0:30:190:30:22

I locked the door, Jo and Fazila were walking up the marketplace,

0:30:230:30:28

and I just watched them, and thought

0:30:280:30:30

how sweet they looked, chatting away,

0:30:300:30:32

and Jo tip-topping along in her high heels.

0:30:320:30:36

And then we just got in the car to go to the surgery.

0:30:360:30:40

He's constantly looking down towards the library, and certainly,

0:30:420:30:46

on one occasion, he makes his way across,

0:30:460:30:48

as if heading down towards the library.

0:30:480:30:50

My view there is, it's a potential false call, if you like.

0:30:500:30:54

That something's drawn his attention, potentially

0:30:540:30:56

a vehicle arriving that contained Jo Cox, and then, clearly,

0:30:560:31:00

he turns around and comes back to his vantage point

0:31:000:31:03

at the side of the bus stop.

0:31:030:31:05

Birstall is quite a small little village,

0:31:090:31:11

and it's got quite limited parking,

0:31:110:31:13

and very rarely do we find parking outside the library.

0:31:130:31:16

But it just so happened that day there were two parking spots, and I,

0:31:160:31:19

sort of, even commented and said,

0:31:190:31:21

"Oh, look, we've found a parking spot right where we want it!"

0:31:210:31:24

Jo jumped out, and Sandra got out,

0:31:270:31:30

and Jo sort of walked behind my car towards the pavement,

0:31:300:31:33

towards where Sandra was.

0:31:330:31:35

I saw a man coming towards us.

0:31:450:31:48

And he just, erm...

0:31:480:31:49

..shot Jo in the head.

0:31:500:31:52

Just like that.

0:31:530:31:55

He didn't speak a word, didn't say anything.

0:31:560:31:59

Just walked down the road and shot Jo.

0:31:590:32:01

I heard a loud bang,

0:32:040:32:07

"Oh, dear, what were that?"

0:32:070:32:09

So I stood up and went to the door.

0:32:090:32:11

I was a bit shocked.

0:32:130:32:15

At first, I had this irrational thought

0:32:160:32:19

that it was some sort of publicity stunt about Brexit.

0:32:190:32:23

Just for a moment, I thought it couldn't be real.

0:32:230:32:26

It was surreal.

0:32:260:32:27

The gun seemed like it wasn't a real gun.

0:32:270:32:30

It sounded like a starting pistol or something.

0:32:300:32:33

And then Jo fell back on the floor, and...

0:32:330:32:36

erm, and I saw that there was blood.

0:32:360:32:39

And then, while she was on the floor, he started stabbing her.

0:32:390:32:43

I saw this bloke with a knife,

0:32:450:32:47

stabbing someone, so I went back into the library

0:32:470:32:49

and I said to anybody who'd listen,

0:32:490:32:52

"Call the police, quick, call the police."

0:32:520:32:55

I was trying to swing at him with my handbag,

0:32:550:32:58

unfortunately, I didn't, sort of, catch him.

0:32:580:33:00

And at that point, he pulled the knife out again,

0:33:000:33:03

and sort of went towards me,

0:33:030:33:05

and I sort of moved back towards the car then.

0:33:050:33:07

We were just shouting at him, and screaming, and...

0:33:070:33:11

There wasn't really a right lot else we could do.

0:33:140:33:16

Bernard Kenny sees the commotion, and goes to the scene,

0:33:180:33:21

effectively to try and jump on Mair's back.

0:33:210:33:25

However, before he gets there, Mair turns to face him,

0:33:250:33:28

and without thought,

0:33:280:33:30

plunges a knife directly into his abdomen.

0:33:300:33:33

I could see, in the corner of my eye, that he was coming back.

0:33:360:33:40

I mean, all I could do was say, "Jo, please get up.

0:33:400:33:42

"Think of Lejla and Cuillin," you know, "Just think of the kids,

0:33:420:33:46

"and please get up, please move."

0:33:460:33:47

And she was saying, "Fazila, I can't move, I'm hurt."

0:33:470:33:50

She shouted out to me and Fazila, and she said,

0:33:500:33:53

"Get away, get away, you two.

0:33:530:33:56

"Don't let him hurt you, let him hurt me."

0:33:560:33:59

He came back, went to his bag, and got a gun out.

0:34:010:34:05

He stood over Jo, just straddled her,

0:34:050:34:07

and aimed it straight to the head.

0:34:070:34:10

And shot her in the head.

0:34:100:34:11

Then he stepped back,

0:34:120:34:14

cocked his gun, and shot her in the midriff.

0:34:140:34:17

As he'd done that, he stood up and very calmly just said,

0:34:170:34:21

"That's for Britain first. Britain will always be first.

0:34:210:34:25

"Britain first!" And walked off.

0:34:250:34:27

He were just so calm, and...

0:34:300:34:32

Not even...

0:34:330:34:35

..concerned.

0:34:360:34:38

My whole focus was making sure that Jo wasn't on her own.

0:34:400:34:43

Obviously, she was in my arms, and, um...

0:34:430:34:47

Sorry.

0:34:480:34:49

Yeah, she just... I just had her in my arms, and

0:34:530:34:57

obviously, there was a lot, a lot of blood.

0:34:570:35:00

erm, and...

0:35:000:35:02

I just made sure that I stayed with her.

0:35:020:35:05

It did seem like a long time till the ambulance came.

0:35:060:35:10

It did seem like...a long time.

0:35:120:35:15

Like an eternity.

0:35:170:35:19

I got a call from somebody in Jo's team,

0:35:300:35:33

who told me that Jo had been attacked.

0:35:330:35:35

I sort of ran into the station, just thinking, you know, just...

0:35:350:35:41

"Just be OK."

0:35:410:35:43

And, you know,

0:35:430:35:45

"If you're hurt, you're injured, that's fine.

0:35:450:35:48

"We'll pull you back together, we'll look after you, it'll be fine.

0:35:480:35:51

"Just don't... Just don't die."

0:35:510:35:53

'Hello, yes, he's shooting everybody.'

0:35:560:35:58

-'Who's shooting everybody?

-The gunman.

0:35:580:36:00

'He's got a black bag in his hand.

0:36:000:36:02

'He's got a black bag in his hand?

0:36:020:36:04

'He's got a white cap on.

0:36:040:36:06

'He's walking now towards... If you get the helicopter,

0:36:060:36:09

'he's walking towards Huddersfield Road.

0:36:090:36:12

'He's walking towards Huddersfield Road?

0:36:120:36:14

'Near The Vaults pub.'

0:36:150:36:17

Thomas Mair turns onto John Nelson Close,

0:36:190:36:22

where he basically walks into the rear garden of a property

0:36:220:36:26

which was quite heavily overgrown,

0:36:260:36:29

where he makes efforts to change his appearance.

0:36:290:36:32

Basically, removed his outer clothing,

0:36:320:36:35

so he's now wearing a grey T-shirt,

0:36:350:36:37

and the black hat.

0:36:370:36:40

The overcoat was discarded, was forensically examined,

0:36:400:36:43

and contained blood of Jo Cox.

0:36:430:36:46

He discharges the spent cartridge in that garden,

0:36:470:36:50

and reloads the firearm,

0:36:500:36:52

placing that back in the bag, with the safety catch off,

0:36:520:36:55

effectively ready to fire again.

0:36:550:36:57

So having done that, he has then jumped back over the fence,

0:36:580:37:02

and comes, re-emerges out of the side of The Vaults pub.

0:37:020:37:05

-'I can see him again.

-You can see him again?

0:37:050:37:07

-'Looks like he's taken his hat off.

-Taken his cap off?

-Yes.

0:37:070:37:10

'He's got a black baseball cap, he's changed it from a white one

0:37:100:37:13

-'to a black one.

-And he's walking up where, love?

-Roundhill Road,

0:37:130:37:16

'which is up from Floyd Lane. If you get the police car to the top

0:37:160:37:18

'of there, when he gets to the bottom, you'll catch him.

0:37:180:37:21

I've got a marauding terrorist, at loose.

0:37:210:37:24

I didn't know if this individual was now shooting other people,

0:37:240:37:28

stabbing other people in the streets and the area.

0:37:280:37:32

We got told by the control room that

0:37:340:37:36

the suspect still had a gun, and to proceed with caution.

0:37:360:37:40

I see a gentleman, and he matched the description.

0:37:410:37:44

I just started running towards him.

0:37:440:37:47

He's put his hands towards his shirt.

0:37:470:37:50

I thought he was going for something in his waistband.

0:37:500:37:53

And, um....

0:37:530:37:55

I just rugby tackled him then to the floor.

0:37:550:37:57

Did he anticipate that the officers

0:38:040:38:06

who would engage with him would be firearms officers?

0:38:060:38:09

We see, particularly in the States,

0:38:090:38:12

we see this phenomena called suicide by cop.

0:38:120:38:15

Was that what he anticipated those two officers were going to do

0:38:150:38:18

to him? Was he intending to die in a blaze of glory, shot by the police?

0:38:180:38:24

If that was his intention, unluckily for him,

0:38:250:38:28

he was challenged by unarmed officers.

0:38:280:38:30

I started searching him.

0:38:320:38:34

I pulled out a bag of bullets.

0:38:340:38:36

I said, "Where's the gun?"

0:38:360:38:37

And he said, "It's in the bag."

0:38:370:38:40

I think Johnny had gone off to get a first-aid kit,

0:38:400:38:42

once we'd found that he had a bump on his head.

0:38:420:38:44

And he said to me, "I'm a political activist."

0:38:440:38:46

He wasn't the typical criminal I'd come across.

0:38:530:38:55

He was fairly quietly spoken, wasn't angry towards us.

0:38:570:39:01

He was fairly respectful to us.

0:39:010:39:02

He was just very calm, very placid, very peaceful, really, I guess.

0:39:060:39:11

I was one of the first senior police officers that arrived at the scene.

0:39:200:39:24

There was a real palpable sense

0:39:260:39:28

that something really horrific had occurred.

0:39:280:39:31

Jo had sustained three gunshot wounds about the head,

0:39:330:39:36

and 13 stab wounds.

0:39:360:39:39

Many of which punctured her heart, her lungs, and her liver.

0:39:390:39:44

And on her left hand, there was a through-and-through injury.

0:39:440:39:47

Which is consistent with, you know,

0:39:470:39:49

effectively holding her hand up to protect herself.

0:39:490:39:52

Basically, an injury through her hand into her head.

0:39:520:39:56

He is strong, he is savage, it's a brutal attack.

0:39:570:40:01

He is going to kill her.

0:40:010:40:03

There is nothing going to stop him from doing so.

0:40:030:40:06

There's rage. There's real rage.

0:40:060:40:09

She didn't stand a chance.

0:40:100:40:12

'Just before one o'clock today, Jo Cox,

0:40:150:40:17

'MP for Batley and Spen borough was attacked in Market Street, Birstall.

0:40:170:40:23

'I am now very sad to have to report

0:40:230:40:25

'that she has died as a result of her injuries.'

0:40:250:40:29

When I were at the police station,

0:40:310:40:33

I just said, "Have you heard anything?"

0:40:330:40:37

And he just said, "She didn't make it."

0:40:370:40:39

So then I knew she were dead.

0:40:410:40:43

You literally feel your heart breaking.

0:40:480:40:51

And it is, it's a physical manifestation of grief.

0:40:510:40:54

I've never known anything like it.

0:40:540:40:55

I thought I'd been upset before, I thought I'd been sad before,

0:40:550:40:59

there's absolutely no comparison to something like this.

0:40:590:41:03

It is utterly debilitating when it hits you.

0:41:030:41:06

The next step was all about, how do you tell your kids?

0:41:070:41:11

I mean, I was very much in shock.

0:41:110:41:13

But moved very quickly into the practicalities

0:41:130:41:16

of, how do I do Jo proud...

0:41:160:41:19

..in...

0:41:240:41:26

..in making sure that the kids are OK?

0:41:280:41:31

So, yeah.

0:41:320:41:34

KIDS: # You can hop, you can skip

0:41:360:41:40

# But don't stop, stop, stop

0:41:400:41:42

# Put your best foot forward... #

0:41:420:41:45

OFFICER: I was very interested in finding out all about Thomas Mair.

0:42:020:42:07

You know, immediately upon his arrest, the first question

0:42:070:42:09

I asked was, "Well, who is he? What do we know about him?"

0:42:090:42:12

Somebody does a check on the police national computer,

0:42:120:42:14

and we've never heard of Thomas Mair.

0:42:140:42:15

I mean, the question is, always, why?

0:42:170:42:19

Of course, his psychiatric history, for me, is very important.

0:42:210:42:26

The doctor who had seen him at the police station hadn't diagnosed him

0:42:260:42:30

with any significant mental illness

0:42:300:42:33

and said he is fit to be interviewed,

0:42:330:42:35

he understands what's going on.

0:42:350:42:37

-MALE OFFICER:

-You're here for two very serious offences -

0:42:400:42:44

murder...

0:42:440:42:45

..and attempted murder.

0:42:460:42:48

It's murder of an MP, going about her business, and attempted murder

0:42:500:42:55

of an elderly gentleman who comes to assist her.

0:42:550:43:00

The MP's been shot and stabbed.

0:43:040:43:06

A number of times.

0:43:070:43:09

And the elderly gentleman...

0:43:100:43:12

..has been stabbed.

0:43:130:43:15

That's why you've been arrested.

0:43:160:43:19

And that's why you're being interviewed.

0:43:190:43:21

And you're choosing to sit there, and say nothing at all.

0:43:220:43:26

Which is your right.

0:43:260:43:28

However...

0:43:280:43:30

..their families, they want to know what's gone on.

0:43:320:43:37

Are you prepared to give them anything as to why?

0:43:440:43:48

That's what we're thinking - why?

0:43:510:43:53

It's not uncommon for the police to sit in an interview room and listen

0:43:570:44:01

to somebody saying, "No comment."

0:44:010:44:02

But it is uncommon for us to sit and listen to somebody saying nothing,

0:44:020:44:06

and he just, simply, didn't react to anything.

0:44:060:44:08

-FEMALE OFFICER:

-Can you see that - that people want to know

0:44:110:44:14

why you've done it?

0:44:140:44:15

And this is your opportunity now, to tell us that.

0:44:210:44:23

So that we can make sense of it.

0:44:290:44:31

His interview, in total, possibly six hours, I think it was,

0:44:330:44:37

off the top of my head.

0:44:370:44:38

-What did he say in that time?

-Absolutely nothing.

0:44:380:44:41

The gun that was used is a .22 rim-fire rifle.

0:44:470:44:51

Generally used in the pest control world.

0:44:520:44:55

It was stolen in August 2015.

0:44:570:44:59

It has passed, I would presume, through a number of hands,

0:45:010:45:04

before it's got to Thomas Mair,

0:45:040:45:06

through the criminal fraternity.

0:45:060:45:08

I'd taken that firearm to bits, but we found no DNA, fingerprints,

0:45:090:45:13

or any traces of anybody else.

0:45:130:45:16

So, acquiring a firearm for a criminal purpose is not easy,

0:45:170:45:22

unless you are a criminal yourself, and you know how to get one.

0:45:220:45:26

As an adult male, in the 21st century, he is, like all of us,

0:45:280:45:32

an owner of a mobile telephone.

0:45:320:45:34

But in three years, has sent three texts.

0:45:340:45:37

And there is no call data.

0:45:370:45:39

So he's not somebody who is immersed in criminality, making calls,

0:45:400:45:44

wheeling and dealing, trying to get himself a firearm.

0:45:440:45:47

That begs the question, how on earth did you, Thomas Mair, get that gun?

0:45:470:45:50

It's an active line of inquiry, and

0:45:510:45:54

I will not rest until I find out how he got that gun.

0:45:540:45:58

The place he had been to immediately before killing Jo

0:46:030:46:06

was his home address.

0:46:060:46:08

We found lots of literature, books, magazines,

0:46:100:46:14

that all seemed to link back to the far right.

0:46:140:46:18

The Third Reich eagle...

0:46:190:46:21

..mail order-catalogues and brochures.

0:46:220:46:25

A lot of that material goes back as far as the early '90s.

0:46:250:46:29

Lever-arch folder, and within that

0:46:300:46:32

there were news clippings of Anders Breivik,

0:46:320:46:35

and other terrorist atrocities.

0:46:350:46:37

Also, Wikipedia pages of Jo Cox.

0:46:380:46:42

Thomas Mair's life meant that nobody else ever went to his home.

0:46:470:46:52

Nobody was able to say,

0:46:520:46:53

"Blimey, Thomas, this is a little bit unhealthy."

0:46:530:46:56

What are your political views?

0:46:590:47:01

You say you're a political activist.

0:47:010:47:03

There's chance for you now to tell me.

0:47:030:47:06

Tell me about your politics.

0:47:060:47:08

We know he stood above Jo as he was murdering her, and shouted,

0:47:100:47:14

"Britain first."

0:47:140:47:16

We asked him what he meant by it, and we didn't get an answer.

0:47:160:47:19

And so, an immediate line of inquiry was, right,

0:47:190:47:22

let's get into Britain First and find out, is he a member of yours?

0:47:220:47:25

-Britain First!

-Fighting back!

0:47:250:47:27

-Britain First!

-Fighting back!

0:47:270:47:30

But, no, he wasn't a member of Britain First.

0:47:310:47:33

It's simply the case that Thomas Mair just could not have coped

0:47:360:47:39

with a Britain First meeting.

0:47:390:47:41

He wouldn't have wanted to be in the company

0:47:430:47:45

of a large number of other people.

0:47:450:47:47

He just wouldn't have been able to function.

0:47:470:47:49

He's never been linked to any other far-right organisations

0:47:550:47:58

in this country. There is no evidence at all

0:47:580:48:00

to support the fact that he's been on any marches,

0:48:000:48:03

part of the EDL, part of the National Front,

0:48:030:48:06

part of Britain First.

0:48:060:48:07

So his own views and his own beliefs have been kept private.

0:48:080:48:13

"..110 years after the birth of the great one, Adolf Hitler,

0:48:190:48:24

"the dream of a white world finally became certainty,

0:48:240:48:27

"and it was the sacrifice of the lives of uncounted thousands

0:48:270:48:31

"of brave men and women

0:48:310:48:32

"of the organisation which had kept that dream alive

0:48:320:48:36

"until its realisation could no longer be denied..."

0:48:360:48:39

Well, this, weirdly enough,

0:48:390:48:41

is one of the books that Thomas Mair had on his own shelves.

0:48:410:48:45

Of course, I wrote it in order to

0:48:450:48:47

help academics understand fascism,

0:48:470:48:50

he obviously bought it because he was actually fascinated

0:48:500:48:54

by the texts that I'd put together in this volume,

0:48:540:48:58

all of which are written by fascists.

0:48:580:49:01

"As a cleansing hurricane of change swept over the continent,

0:49:010:49:05

"clearing away, in a few months,

0:49:050:49:07

"the refuse of a millennium or more of alien ideology,

0:49:070:49:12

"and a century or more of profound moral and material decadence.

0:49:120:49:17

"The blood flowed ankle-deep in the streets..."

0:49:170:49:20

This bookcase really has the function of a shrine.

0:49:230:49:27

We are looking here, not at academic books,

0:49:270:49:30

we are looking at sacred texts.

0:49:300:49:32

This is really high-grade literature,

0:49:340:49:37

some of which is archival stuff.

0:49:370:49:38

Stuff difficult to get hold of.

0:49:380:49:40

What fascism allowed Thomas Mair to feel,

0:49:430:49:48

when he was soaking himself in this literature,

0:49:480:49:52

was that his wormlike,

0:49:520:49:55

small, dysfunctional existence

0:49:550:49:57

was actually part of something much greater, which would outlive him.

0:49:570:50:01

Thomas Mair could feel, that in that moment, when he killed Jo Cox,

0:50:020:50:07

he gained immortality for himself.

0:50:070:50:10

REPORTER: 'Thomas Mair was swept

0:50:120:50:14

'into the court building in a police van,

0:50:140:50:16

'part of a convoy that had brought him from Yorkshire to this,

0:50:160:50:19

'the most important Magistrates' Court in London.'

0:50:190:50:21

Looking at Thomas Mair from the minute he stepped into the box,

0:50:230:50:27

it was evident that he had something on his mind.

0:50:270:50:31

He was asked to give his name.

0:50:310:50:33

The magistrate was shocked by what she'd heard,

0:50:330:50:36

and couldn't understand exactly what he'd said.

0:50:360:50:38

So he repeated it.

0:50:380:50:40

REPORTER: ' "My name is Death To Traitors, Freedom For Britain." '

0:50:400:50:45

He's saying, "I am killing the race traitors.

0:50:450:50:48

"I am killing the soft, left-wing, liberal, cosmopolitan,

0:50:480:50:52

"foreigner-lovers, who have created this situation.

0:50:520:50:57

"It's not the fault of the Pakistanis or the Romanians

0:50:570:51:00

"that they are here, it's the fault of the liberal elite,

0:51:000:51:04

"that welcome the free movement of peoples,

0:51:040:51:07

"and the mixing up of cultures,

0:51:070:51:08

"which is destroying everything that is good about the human race,

0:51:080:51:12

"which is its whiteness."

0:51:120:51:14

Even now, I don't think I'll ever be able to reconcile it.

0:51:200:51:25

There was never any indication that he was racist in any way.

0:51:250:51:29

Because the Tom that I knew was so kind, considerate, caring.

0:51:310:51:37

I'm quite sad that Tom didn't feel as though he could trust me,

0:51:370:51:41

or come and talk to me about it.

0:51:410:51:42

And I wish he could, because I would have tried to help him,

0:51:440:51:46

in any way that I could have done.

0:51:460:51:48

I wish I'd spent more time talking to him on the Friday.

0:51:510:51:54

And I wish we'd talked about more personal stuff, but then again,

0:51:560:52:00

you can't give that attention to everybody.

0:52:000:52:02

-PROFESSOR GRIFFIN:

-What it demonstrates to me

0:52:050:52:08

is something that I found in all the other cases of terrorism

0:52:080:52:11

by lone wolves, so-called, that have been well documented,

0:52:110:52:14

is that nobody is ever completely a terrorist.

0:52:140:52:17

He seems to have developed a complex personality, made up of two

0:52:180:52:23

almost separate people.

0:52:230:52:26

Domestically, he remained a loner, a recluse,

0:52:260:52:31

he didn't have intimate relationships or friendships

0:52:310:52:33

with people. And that was his base personality.

0:52:330:52:37

But what he obviously did, as well,

0:52:370:52:39

and this is really quite extraordinary,

0:52:390:52:41

is that he created another personality,

0:52:410:52:44

who was a really complete fascist, Nazi racist.

0:52:440:52:48

At a certain crucial point, the fascist self took over,

0:52:490:52:53

then there was violence on the agenda.

0:52:530:52:57

'Repeatedly stabbed and shot three times,

0:52:570:53:00

'in a killing which led to the suspension of campaigning

0:53:000:53:03

'in the EU referendum.'

0:53:030:53:04

'Tributes keep coming, so too do the accusations.'

0:53:040:53:07

'The paper says its polling shows the tragic murder of the Labour MP

0:53:070:53:11

'Jo Cox shifted opinions against Brexit.'

0:53:110:53:14

The Remain camp are using these awful circumstances to try to say

0:53:140:53:19

that the motives of one deranged, dangerous individual,

0:53:190:53:23

were similar of half the country, perhaps more,

0:53:230:53:26

-who believe that we should leave the EU...

-Who's saying that?

0:53:260:53:30

She will live on through all the good people in the world.

0:53:340:53:39

Through Brendan, through us...

0:53:390:53:41

..and through her truly wonderful children, who will always know

0:53:450:53:49

what an utterly amazing woman their mother was.

0:53:490:53:54

She was a human being, and she was perfect.

0:53:550:53:59

-CHILD:

-Let's lift it up.

0:53:590:54:01

The devastation I feel for the children,

0:54:010:54:04

there's no words to describe how horrendous that is.

0:54:040:54:06

But actually, what makes me more sad than anything is what Jo will miss.

0:54:070:54:13

The first time they do this, or the first time they do that,

0:54:130:54:16

you know,

0:54:160:54:17

and that a mum should be a part of.

0:54:170:54:20

That's by far the worst, the worst part of everything that's happened.

0:54:200:54:27

Amazing and deeply touching as all of this is,

0:54:320:54:36

I wish I wasn't here today.

0:54:360:54:38

I'd rather be...

0:54:380:54:40

I'd rather be with Jo.

0:54:410:54:43

We try to remember not how cruelly she's been taken from us,

0:54:450:54:49

but how unbelievably lucky we were

0:54:490:54:51

to have her in our lives for so long.

0:54:510:54:54

'The tensions, and the rhetoric

0:54:550:54:58

'about the country being at breaking point

0:54:580:55:01

'probably contributed to an atmosphere in which extreme people

0:55:010:55:06

'are more likely to do extreme things.'

0:55:060:55:09

I think it's very sad

0:55:090:55:13

that he was so consumed with hatred that he's destroyed his own life as

0:55:130:55:17

well as Jo's...

0:55:170:55:18

That he, you know, tried to do something to silence Jo,

0:55:200:55:24

but has, instead,

0:55:240:55:25

given her a much bigger voice, a much louder platform.

0:55:250:55:29

Jo's killing was political.

0:55:290:55:31

It was an act of terror designed to advance

0:55:320:55:35

an agenda of hatred towards others.

0:55:350:55:38

-DAVID CAMERON:

-The British people have voted

0:55:410:55:43

to leave the European Union, and their will must be respected.

0:55:430:55:46

BORIS JOHNSON: They have decided

0:55:460:55:49

that it is time to vote to take back control.

0:55:490:55:52

-NIGEL FARAGE:

-Let June the 23rd

0:55:520:55:55

go down in our history as our Independence Day!

0:55:550:55:58

CHEERING

0:55:580:56:00

Brexit did play a part.

0:56:040:56:06

The country was divided,

0:56:080:56:10

so that played a part in tensions within the community.

0:56:100:56:13

But Thomas Mair's a terrorist, there's no doubt about it.

0:56:150:56:18

His target was a political figure.

0:56:180:56:21

But is he different to other terrorists,

0:56:220:56:25

from other organisations that we see?

0:56:250:56:27

Why do young Muslim men and women take themselves out of society,

0:56:290:56:35

travel via western countries to Syria, and join Isil?

0:56:350:56:40

Why do they do that? Because they feel disenfranchised, in many ways.

0:56:400:56:44

Because, in many ways, they are brainwashed.

0:56:440:56:47

But there are comparisons and similarities between what they do,

0:56:480:56:51

and what Thomas Mair ultimately did,

0:56:510:56:54

and how became associated with his cause, and what he was engaged with.

0:56:540:56:58

So, although they are poles apart,

0:56:580:57:00

actually, they are very similar in many, many ways.

0:57:000:57:03

What are we doing as a society to engage with people like that?

0:57:070:57:12

And I suppose it's sad that if you are not interested,

0:57:140:57:18

or you are not able to interact...

0:57:180:57:20

..that you can be left to your own devices, to such an extent.

0:57:210:57:25

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