BP Confidential

MUSIC BOX TINKLES

The first edition of Blue Peter was broadcast on 16 October 1958 from the BBC's Lime Grove studios.

ORIGINAL THEME MUSIC PLAYS

It was aimed at five- to eight-year-olds.

It was the brainchild of producer John Hunter Blair and Gilly Reilly.

To present it they chose actor Christopher Trace.

My father said that, at the audition,

he was ready to talk about TV and children, but there was a train set.

He and John Hunter Blair were enthusiasts and they got on famously.

It was a foregone conclusion he'd get the job.

Onto the water...and start up. MOTOR CHIRRS

The programme was named after the flag raised

as a ship is about to set sail.

All the works are inside. MOTOR OFF

Pretty good!

Now it's time for 6-5's own popular discoveries, the Mudlarks,

with My Grandfather's Clock.

Chosen to join Chris was Leila Williams,

already a TV presenter and famous for being Miss Great Britain 1957.

I was told I was booked for a week definitely - possibly two weeks -

and I was to act as assistant to Christopher Trace.

It was more than we dared hope that it would last six months.

I expected to hear I wasn't needed the following week, but I didn't,

so I turned up to the next rehearsal and Gilly and John both met me

and said, "It's a success! We're on the air!" It was absolutely superb.

ANNETTE MILLS: # We want Muffin, Muffin the Mule

# Dear old Muffin, playing the fool... #

In the 1950s, programmes such as Muffin The Mule and Andy Pandy

were the staple diet of children's programming.

John Hunter Blair wanted Blue Peter to be completely different.

He wanted it to be like a magazine,

where you turned the page and there was something going on all the time.

That was what he was aiming at.

Also recruited in the early months was artist Tony Hart, whose cartoon strip,

Packi The Elephant, was recreated on screen.

I wrote the story, did the drawings and then I had to narrate it, you see.

I remember in those old studios - black and white, of course, then -

that I had a clock.

The clock told me when to start and exactly when I had to come out.

And Chris - dear old Chris - he was very naughty,

and towards the end,

he'd do this, which he wasn't supposed to do, because I could see my clock perfectly well,

and he would try and make me laugh.

Chris and I had a brother-sister relationship. That's the best way to explain it.

That's how we were. We got on really well.

And John gave me away at my wedding. It was just a little happy family.

Blue Peter WAS a family,

and I was extremely pleased to be allowed to be a cousin.

Two years later, Blue Peter was thriving.

But John Hunter Blair had to take sick leave.

One stand-in producer was Clive Parkhurst.

The Blue Peter family was about to break up.

We were like two raw wires and we just exploded.

I had a monthly contract, so at the end of the month, that was it.

What's on?

Auditions were held to find Leila's replacement.

-Hello, Caroline.

-Hello, everyone.

'I was interviewed by Christopher Trace.'

Christopher asked if I'd come far,

and I said, in a very high-pitched voice, "Only from Earl's Court."

Only from Earl's Court, about ten minutes away.

I didn't get it the first time. Someone else did.

I believe you started in Hollywood.

TONY HART: It was a most beautiful lady, and her name was Anita West.

She was brought into the studio by the producer one day,

and I remember all the men - there was a sort of move to get closer!

She really was a dish!

I was a Blue Peter presenter

between Leila and Val Singleton, but not many people remember me.

Anita West has never been publicly acknowledged as a BP presenter until now.

'I was in it for about six and a half months.

'You made your things, you told a story,'

you introduced somebody - I had some wonderful interviews.

One was the guy from Disney who drew The Sword In The Stone.

I thoroughly enjoyed it.

But her marriage to jazz musician Ray Ellington

was ending in divorce proceedings and Anita felt forced to resign.

I was upset, and I know they were with me, because they didn't know the background of why I was leaving.

'I didn't know how the divorce would go.

'A messy one could have embarrassed the programme.'

And I wanted to be there for the children.

I don't have any regrets.

Professionally I do, if I'm honest.

But privately I don't. My two children are the best thing I ever did in my life.

Let's join Christopher Trace and Valerie Singleton for Blue Peter.

THEME PLAYS

Second choice Valerie Singleton was asked back.

She stayed for ten years,

becoming the programme's longest-serving female presenter.

Decorating cakes isn't just a job for girls, as I found out last week.

Some of them don't look like cakes,

but believe me, it is all cake.

Another appointment in 1962 was Biddy Baxter.

This young radio studio manager was offered the job of editor

over other staff in the Children's Department.

I had a sleepless night, thinking, "I'm not capable of doing it.

"I'll have to say I can't take the job."

But in the morning, I thought, "If I do that,

"bang goes my career with the BBC, so I'd better plunge in."

We all had a terrible feeling Biddy would get it.

We weren't best pleased about it. She had an idea

about what children wanted before she was able to translate it into TV terms.

At last, the weather is kind enough to let us come to Chessington Zoo

to finish off our Blue Peter seal competition.

We're waiting for the prizewinner, and I can see the car coming now.

Edward and I wanted the programme to have a distinct identity.

He came up with the idea of a logo. Of course now it's called branding.

TONY HART: I thought perhaps a galleon shape, a simplified form.

There we are.

And now, in true Blue Peter style,

let me show you one that I did earlier.

That is the original Blue Peter ship

which I drew in 1963.

I put it to Biddy - "Could you see your way to letting me have a penny

"every time it's used?"

I think we paid him £100. If only he'd been on a royalty,

he'd have been a millionaire!

The logo led on to the famous Blue Peter badge, launched with a massive nationwide balloon release.

The badge was for programme material.

That's what children would win for sending in ideas for the programme,

so it was a very good way of becoming interactive.

And it rewarded children who were helping us, so everyone was happy.

You were shot at dawn with a rusty bullet

if you went out on location without a badge - it was a cardinal sin.

-VAL:

-You had to wear it. It annoyed us.

We should have had them like little Indian marks on our brows.

One should have seen it as the trademark.

It was perfectly valid, and we were stupid to be annoyed by it.

I never had any problem. I had badges on swimming costumes,

hard hats and everything - wherever you are, you must have your badge.

Even on pyjamas!

She was such a Pollyanna - sorry, Anth! She was SO good.

She'd WANT to wear her badge, like a good girl at school.

Putting it on today, I just think, "Hey! Back with the badge on."

It feels quite at home.

My father nicked some and took them home, which he shouldn't have done.

Unknown to him, I nicked a few and sold them in the playground.

It started my entrepreneurial life!

In 1963, Rosemary Gill joined Biddy and Edward Barnes,

forming children's TV's most influential team ever.

EDWARD BARNES: We all had something different to offer, yet we worked well as a team.

Chris Trace said it was like having a three-headed monster coming at him.

NEWSREEL FANFARE 'Commercial television is here.'

In the early '60s, the arrival of ITV had serious consequences for the BBC.

Ratings fell, and the BBC took drastic action.

The Children's Department was left with Watch With Mother and Blue Peter.

Those of us left

were angry because we believed in children's programmes.

There was a job to be done, and it needed people

with a specialisation to do it.

'And it obsessed us, you know.'

I'm in one of the children's wards of the Mayday Hospital in London.

We thought it would be fun to come down with the Blue Peter cameras

and play records for the children.

RECORD PLAYS: "Twist And Shout" by The Beatles

The team's obsession paid off - Blue Peter's audience grew,

and it was given a twice-weekly slot.

Now some news. From now on, you won't have to wait a week for the next programme.

Blue Peter will be on Thursdays

as well as on Mondays.

-BIDDY BAXTER:

-It was absolutely crucifyingly hard work!

Could I have some Extra Strong Mints, please, and some syrup?

It's hard work, doing the shopping with a lion!

-Five shillings.

-Thank you.

HE GROANS

Phew! Well, we got that out.

Today in Great Britain, we have some of the finest firefighters in the world.

It was too much for two presenters. There was one moment on Camber Sands.

They were filming. It was cold, and he'd been in swimming trunks, waist-deep in water all day.

He'd had enough. He said to Biddy, "It's too much. You have to bring in a third."

This is Steve.

Steve is a dray horse. He works for a brewery. ..Round, boy, round.

'I wasn't keen on horses because I'd never had anything to do with them.'

I thought, "What happens if he starts to run? What do I do?"

Of course I dried, but I got myself out of it.

He was a disaster when he came.

I've never known anybody dry so much on air as Noakie did to begin with!

There's the complete kite, all ready for frying. ..FLYING.

-BIDDY BAXTER:

-I think John Noakes has to be the most charismatic presenter of all time.

There's never been one like him before or since.

MUSIC: Overture to "The Marriage Of Figaro" by Mozart

Aaaaaaaaaaagh!

Ooh! Ow!

Grub is up.

Suddenly I feel awfully alone up here!

The hard thing for an actor is to be yourself and not put on a show.

I'm not stepping on John's toes if I say he continued to put on a show.

His invented character, John Noakes, was not really like John Noakes.

This is a trunk call from Ceylon to England.

I hope I don't get cut off!

I was never frightened going on stage. I used to get excited.

I used to laugh at folk who trembled in the wings on the first night.

"Why are you in the business? Go on and be whoever you're going to be."

But did I get my comeuppance!

Because that thing - that lens, that piece of glass - stripped me naked.

-Do you want a piece?

-Steady!

Whatever you do, don't drop this on your foot!

-That's for you.

-You don't do yourself justice. It's very light.

-Anyone got an electric saw?

-Let me...

'I then invented this idiot who I called John Noakes, who was not really the real John Noakes.

'I'm really a quiet person.'

It's got no cheese and onion in it!

Action Man's advent took away a bit of glory from Dad.

There was a BP Special Assignment in Norway where my father had rather more than a special assignment.

This got picked up. Not only did it sour the relationship with my mother,

but it also didn't help his reputation within the BBC, and he felt it was time to move on.

We weren't brokenhearted.

He knew he'd had enough and we felt it was time he moved on.

We made mistakes later, keeping on people for too long.

Chris's replacement was actor Peter Purves.

I saw it as a job for six months,

and then I could go back to the serious business of acting...ho-ho.

-Right in your ear'ole!

-Thanks(!)

You went all round the head, like this.

-It's not self-raising flour!

-Sorry.

Oops! I blew instead of sucking.

Special graded grains for you, Pete.

Instead of bellows, you could use something like this.

Holes in the top and flour inside and just sprinkle that on.

-The holes are rather large, I'm afraid.

-They are, aren't they? Oh!

It's on your uniform now!

We worked so well together and then they stopped us - we were getting too powerful.

We were like Laurel and Hardy.

-Keep an eye on him, Peter.

-Yes.

-Go to your tables.

Whatever you do, keep your bottles upmost.

-Here we go...to the woods...

-He said keep it UPMOST!

CUCKOO!

-Right, Bunnies, are you ready?

-WHISTLE PEEPS

Go on, faster!

Go... Oh, no, you don't! How dare you try it on me?! Wait, wait.

CUCKOO! PEEP!

Good. Next.

Johnny and I thought it was funny.

Self-indulgent, maybe, but funny. But that was when they decided not to make films like that any more.

-VAL:

-We re-name this locomotive

the 532 Blue Peter.

'The sad thing was that you worked FOR the Blue Peter production team rather than with them.'

When I moved into grown-up telly, for want of a better word,

you could talk to your editor like an adult about problems, or suggest ideas.

It wasn't like that on Blue Peter. We were like schoolchildren, really.

I didn't go to the office often. I tried to avoid it, to be honest.

Biddy ruled the roost, no question.

EDWARD BARNES: She'd resent "ruthless", but she was ruthless on behalf of the audience.

She would die for the audience.

Biddy never took "no" for an answer.

Denied money to launch the BP badge,

she confronted Assistant Controller Donald Baverstock.

Everyone was terrified of him. He hit the roof.

She said, "I've got something you need to know."

After the interview, he called in Joanna Spicer, the planning person,

and said, "Joanna, give her £500 for badges." She said, "You can't do that!"

He said, "I've just done it!" Donald liked that. He liked someone who'd take him on.

Was I frightened of Biddy? Most of the BBC was. It probably still is!

Great respect for her, but she was very demanding.

If people weren't living up to those standards or giving their very best,

or were cynical, God help them!

He doesn't need a monitor. He's looking at Jemima.

NEW SPEAKER: I loved her - I thought she was a one-off. I thought she was terribly astute.

I had a lovely relationship with her.

If you were introduced to Biddy as "editor", you'd absolutely assume

she edited Vogue or Harper's, or even Cosmo, actually.

SHE LAUGHS

Because that's what she looks like.

I'd imagined Biddy Baxter to be a cardiganed, grey-haired person.

Cardigan not on, but draped round her shoulders.

She was very glamorous. Big earrings.

-SARAH:

-Wearing black tights that you just knew weren't tights -

were stockings.

Who thought nothing of showing a little too much decolletage -

not for the scoutmasters, which was when she used it.

She could persuade any scoutmaster

to spend an extra hour in the cold in the garden to get the right shot.

I thought, "She'll be a challenge, but I'll enjoy working with her."

'My God, she taught me so much!'

You read the script.

-PETER:

-The thing everyone remembers about Biddy

is the sound of her - the sound of her approaching, for notes or to bollock somebody or whatever it was.

The sound of Biddy is stilettos down the steps from the gallery.

Click, click.

-Click, click.

-Down the metal steps.

You knew by the pace how bad you'd been or what had gone wrong.

We're knocking the Pompeii story on to another programme.

CARON: There was no autocue. You had to learn it.

At 4.50pm, Biddy would click down the steps and change it all anyway.

You'd go on air thinking, "I've got no idea what I'm about to say!"

"I'm cutting this. I'm changing that."

It took me a couple of years to acquire a discipline to cope with those changes.

'Initially, I didn't understand why there was this additional pressure.'

Can we swap the order of handing round lava? Hand it to Peter first.

-It's a bit odd...

-But it's funnier if he gives the small bit to me. >

-It's the way it works out...

-It doesn't matter. Stop panicking.

Because of the demands of the live programme, you would do all sorts of mischievous things.

If he'd done a cracking innuendo, coming out of a film, say,

those heels would be there, but he'd be out like a bat out of hell before she could catch him.

-SIMON:

-Hedges give the country a patchwork look, and it's good to know people are looking after them.

There's a lot to it, isn't there?

Yes. It's also the luck of the draw.

One of them said if you have a good length, you can manage a good lay.

Innuendo? What do you mean, matron?!

We never ever saw the programme as a whole until the dress rehearsal.

'You had this one time to put the thing together, to see if it gelled.

'Some items wouldn't be as good as you thought. We'd expand some and cut others.'

"Cut that page, darling..."

'Suddenly, your whole brain had to be changed.'

She was convinced...cos I used to back-comb my hair to keep it up, then spray masses of spray on it.

She was certain, when she did notes in the make-up room before the show, that I sprayed it to keep her away,

but I can't tell you if that was true or not!

'It was the only way to produce a programme that was really going to deliver to the audience.'

No, you get a cue to move, first of all.

Since you can hear the drum roll finish, do it after that.

-JANET:

-I think I'm very unusual in this.

I liked the last-minute changes -

"Cut that item, take five seconds out of that." I got off on that.

Janet Ellis could learn the telephone directory!

Charlotte died on March 31st 1859,

the last of the brilliant, tragic Bronte family who'd come to the Haworth parsonage 35 years before.

Until recently, we knew what she looked like from pictures like this.

But in 1984, the National Portrait Gallery made a discovery...

'If the programme had gone well, you'd be thinking, "Yeah, great!"'

She'd say, "What happened? It was 1848, darling. You said 1847. What happened?"

"In the middle of it all, I forgot!"

Um...now...where am I? I'm talking... Sorry.

-SIMON:

-'I think, if they're honest,

'all the presenters will admit

'that, at one time or another, we moaned about not having autocue.'

I'm completely lost. OK, let's start about darts again.

Most studio programmes already used autocue.

But it wasn't until 1987 that Biddy allowed it,

finally putting an end to the studio memory test.

There's just so much to learn, it's almost impossible not to have it.

But it can really dampen spontaneity in the studio.

That's why you tended to see more of the presenters' personality on film.

Faster!

Whoo!

SCREAMING

SHE SCREAMS

Wow! That is the best!

-Forget the fear.

-Yes.

What...? Oh!

He won't strangle me, will he?

-Keep your mouth shut.

-I will!

Blue Peter began travelling when Benidorm was considered a long haul.

The Summer Expedition became a regular fixture.

-VAL:

-We didn't stop at the Raffles Hotel, because we'd heard a glass of squash there costs 3s 6d!

'Showing them a new country and a new culture, meeting the people -

'I think most people enjoyed it.'

Can you guess what this is?

MUSIC: Mendelssohn's Violin Concerto, Third Movement

A detergent bottle.

This one is cheap and easy to make. I'll show you what to do.

CHRIS: Cut it off...

-We need a base for our island...

-The hat is an ice cream cone...

-JANET:

-Cut out a base from card.

Then two circles of sticky-backed plastic stuck together...

Here's some that I froze earlier.

CARON: This is Margaret's idea for 1986...

Mother-of-two Margaret Parnell first wrote to the programme over 30 years ago.

I sent an idea for a dolls' house to Valerie Singleton.

It was made out of crepe paper.

I put together the stages and the different bits.

She wrote back and said they were going to use it, much to my surprise, and had I got any more ideas?

She became a fixture. She was brilliant and enormously inventive.

I certainly didn't have any formal art training. I left school at 14.

That was it. But it was just that I enjoyed making things.

Terrible scissors!

It takes about a week to work it out

and try different ways to do it,

a week to do the different stages and get it ready - a fortnight on average.

Try it against your face...

'I still find, if I go to the shops and see the new containers,

'I get ideas like that.

'I have to twist them round to see if they look like an animal or a mask.'

I see the customers looking at me,

but I've also had a security guard looking at me once.

I decided to leave before it got too embarrassing,

and he followed me out.

So it is a bit dodgy sometimes!

Reacting to Thunderbirds fever in 1993

triggered Blue Peter's most famous make - Tracy Island.

ANTHEA: We knew it was going to be a very good make,

because everybody was so interested in Thunderbirds.

But we didn't know HOW big it would be. It was the talking point of the nation!

I haven't made a Tracy Island for five weeks!

700 makes later, Margaret is still finding uses for detergent bottles.

Live battles with sticky-backed plastic are not all the presenters have to contend with.

There was no turning back.

'I did the thing. I've got to say I was scared - no question about it. I'm proud that I didn't chicken out.

'It was total stupidity not to.'

Here I go!

'That was scary. I reached nowhere near the cars to cushion the blow.'

The second before you hit the ramp, you want to go back.

'At that point you think, "I'm going to die now."

'Then you didn't die and you think, "What am I moaning about?"'

Danger money! Never heard of it!

Not a penny!

I had fear...twice. Once was a kid's swing, would you believe!

Oh, dear!

Ahhh! This is painful!

I'm hitting the trees! Ahhh!

'The worst one

'was these three giant sway-poles, they usually went up to 80 feet

'but these just had 60 feet.

'Fear is probably the most terrifying emotion you can actually have.

'You freeze up, you can't think straight, your muscles don't work.'

At the bottom, there was a concrete block that was full of dirty water.

SQUEAKING

I was terrified! I really was!

My mouth is so dry I can hardly talk. Hang on, there's some water here.

I had to swill my mouth out in order to talk.

'That is fear!'

I would never like to go through it again.

It was heading along and then I heard a terrific crash!

I could only see a shattered hull - the remains of Val's boat.

'Later, I was told that when the engine had broken, it had flipped back and torn my seat'

to shreds - it was within that much of tearing my back to pieces!

INSTRUCTOR: Ready! Set! Go!

'I was hurtling earthwards at 120mph and it was fantastic!

'I'm a great coward and I also don't like heights.'

It was amusing to see me going, "How high? I'll go up!" because not in real life.

The real Janet Ellis came down to Earth with a bump -

she broke her leg while training for a record and wanted to give up.

Biddy said, "We'd like you to carry on. How do you feel?" I explained that I was reluctant.

She said, "I want to think of your courage like a ketchup bottle,

if there's only a bit left, turn it upside down and shake it. I'm sure some'll come out!"

It did, I suppose!

Enough to jump into the records.

She was the first civilian woman to freefall from 20,000 feet.

'We jumped nearly four miles above the ground.'

'I always felt, as a girl, that I wanted to do everything.'

I didn't see why girls shouldn't do everything.

We had role reversal on Blue Peter years before it became common in programmes.

MUSICL: You've Got To Roll With It by Oasis.

I'll give you the ingredients.

Can you imagine the postmen delivering this!

Careful!

You don't have to put it through the blender.

"Souflett" is what it's called!

Probably the most extreme example of role reversal was when viewers gained a TV brother.

'I thought it'd be a switch-off

for boys if Valerie Singleton was holding a baby.

So, the idea was that John and Peter would look after Daniel.

Ahh! Fat, hairy thing! Daniel, send them away!

But pioneering ideas

didn't prevent criticisms that it was old-fashioned - unlike its ITV rival.

Magpie was a show I watched as a kid.

Blue Peter didn't say anything for me growing up in Leeds as a working class kid.

It always seemed a little bit too middle class.

They always said, "Go up into the loft and find some crepe paper."

We didn't have a loft. I lived in a council house near Castleford.

There aren't enough middle class children to make up the viewing figures. We know that's nonsense.

That has been proved by the contact we've had from viewers.

These were sent in after the garden was vandalised.

Blue Peter wasn't above cashing in on other programmes' bright ideas - like the garden.

'I nicked it from Magpie.

'We always monitored the opposition.

'One of our great strengths was

that we saw things through - if we decided to do something, we did it.'

The Correspondence Unit has always played a crucial role.

A record is kept of every letter to avoid sending out identical replies if a child writes more than once.

Biddy began the system to avoid the disappointment she'd felt after writing to Enid Blyton.

'I remember going to my mother in tears.

'It was an identical letter to the first one. It was simply awful.'

Whenever a viewer writes, they receive a personal reply.

It is a truly interactive programme, with the target audience,

ie children, interactive before its time - before the word was used.

I've got some news about your letters because we've got an unusual programme today.

Nearly every item is hinged on your ideas and suggestions you've sent us.

'About 70% of the ideas

'in each programme came directly or indirectly from viewers' letters.'

"Vogue" by Madonna

When Caron Keating's desire to follow the '80s fashion trends brought in large numbers of letters,

the programme turned the complaints to its advantage.

They had a competition to design an outfit. They had 97,000 entries.

I chose, I think, the most inventive one I could find.

Most people who watch Blue Peter, at any point in their lives,

have not only sat and watched it - they've been involved in it.

They've contributed to an appeal,

made something they've seen, they've visited a place they've seen.

'The key to its success

'is the involvement that everybody has in the programme.'

We're calling it our Rags Appeal because that's what we want - rags. We want old wool and cotton.

We want you to collect them and send them to us. Every can will turn into money.

The philosophy of the Blue Peter appeals has always been for every viewer to take part,

not just to raise the maximum amount of money.

Years before TV appealery

had become commonplace, Blue Peter had been raising millions of pounds.

It had to be something where children could make a difference and have some sense of empowerment.

The 1979 appeal reacted to the devastation in Cambodia

caused by Pol Pot.

I think we were the first people to film there since John Pilger.

It was quite a struggle to get in.

It obviously touched the hearts of the nation because we had a phenomenal response.

An extraordinary £3 million was raised. It bought food, equipment and lorries.

Nine years later,

Blue Peter returned when more help was needed.

'You could see what an enormous change a programme could make.

'We got stuck in mud and people came out to dig the Land Rover out.

'They had hoes from ten years ago still with the Blue Peter stickers.

'I've been in Oxfam shops'

where I've seen kids in tears, giving away their favourite toy.

They didn't understand what was going on,

but they realised that they could help another girl or boy.

You've done it! You've made £1 million!

Your bring-and-buy sales have raised this enormous amount. Well done.

Blue Peter thrives on tradition.

Its cyclical nature is not only demonstrated by the appeals

but by the favourite items that return.

Not coming in, Leslie?

No! There's a rule saying ladies can't swim in the Serpentine in winter!

'This was the moment of truth!

'It was colder than I'd expected!

'You had to be hardy to be a member of the Serpentine Swimming Club!'

Biddy decided to do this film which had been done with John Noakes.

"You'd like to do it, wouldn't you?" I said, "I can't think of anything worse!" She said, "It'll be great!"

I just couldn't jump in. Caron jumped in.

It was like instant frostbite on my foot. I thought, "What's that going to do to other parts?"

Finally, I jump in. I couldn't breathe.

I was just going, "Ahhh! Ahhhh!"

When Biddy saw it,

she said, "You stupid boy! What's the matter with you?

"John Noakes went up and down." I said, "He would, that's typical! At least it's different, Biddy!"

STARTING PISTOL

A new challenge for the men began in 1981 with the first London Marathon.

It was probably the first time I'd been out of the studio to see how the power of TV works -

to run 26 miles through London and see those people cheering.

It felt like my marathon. That was special.

Outside of the studio, leaving TV Centre, you did want to take it all off -

take off the guise of the Blue Peter presenter.

There are things that happen to you where you were forced to do that.

If you nearly get run over and you scream abuse at someone...

It's a good feeling anyway, but when they look at you and think,

"That was Sarah Greene, Blue Peter presenter, telling me to mmm off!"

It has a double impact.

One had to check that there wasn't a five-year-old standing in earshot,

because you're kind of letting them down.

My granny used to say you should always warm the pot first.

'When children saw a presenter,

'it was like an old friend. They'd start a conversation.'

Those presenters were their friends.

She said, "Whatever's going on in those children's lives,

"whether their parents are fighting, or getting divorced -

"I want you presenters there in their living rooms. You're going to be a stable influence."

That stability was shaken periodically when a presenter decided to move on.

'I left it too late, I should have left after seven years - I stayed ten and a half'

It wasn't, "I've got to get away from this." It was, "I've stayed here too long.

"I can't do a kids' programme all my life." I was 40!

-What's in here?

-It's to remind you.

-Good heavens!

LAUGHTER

'Towards the end,'

I was so tired, knackered.

People used to say, "I wish I had your job!" I said, "You can have the bloomin' job - you can have it!"

Percy Thrower!

-Ohh, Percy!

-You remember you gave me a surprise earlier in the year?

Biddy couldn't accept that I would want to present any other programme.

What more could somebody want?

Then, when it transpired that it was another children's programme,

that must have taken some getting over.

Oh, dear. Look at this pink. Matches me hair!

Blue Peter had shown that it could survive the loss of a presenter.

But in 1988, Biddy herself decided to call it a day.

Her deputy, Lewis Bronze, took over.

-There you are.

-You're so kind!

It's a bit like, could we imagine life without Mrs Thatcher?

Well, we could.

We were all very nervous about it.

I would have said it was on the verge of becoming a bit twee.

And during my era there, with Lewis, it had more of an edge to it.

-How long have these cracks been here?

-A couple of weeks.

I wanted to bring a slightly more topical, newsy...

It's not a news programme, but I wanted a more topical edge.

Nelson Mandela has claimed victory in South Africa's election.

He tells his people they can now reclaim their country.

..we can loudly proclaim from the rooftops...

free at last.

Under apartheid, Tim and I wouldn't be able to walk together.

I would never have set foot in a black township like Soweto.

We would have been forced to use separate buses and separate schools.

Diane wouldn't have been able to go to a white town without permission.

For a children's programme to do a trip, without being heavy about it,

presenting the facts, to bring an issue up like that,

in a way children can understand, is one of the strengths of Blue Peter.

In a couple of weeks, there will be three Blue Peters a week.

You can see from our clock which days they're going to be.

The biggest change for Lewis came in 1995.

It was a risk that paid off.

Three times a week worked.

The audience figures were fantastic for six months after we did it.

When I left, I thought, "Go while you're ahead."

During his eight years as editor, he's been known as "Funky Lou".

Lewis Bronze is also credited with bringing in a more relaxed approach,

behind and in front of the camera.

-I'm going to miss the whole team.

-30 seconds on chat.

-And, um... 30 seconds on chat?!

-30 seconds, Lewis!

It's a great programme to work on, Tim.

I love standing on telly with a pom-pom!

His successor, Oliver MacFarlane, had also worked under Biddy Baxter.

He had to face the challenge of cable and satellite channels.

Can't the other three be a bit closer?

PROMOTION: 'Digital television -

'the biggest development in TV since the introduction of colour.'

We'll need to adapt, but we're not going to rush along with the pack.

Blue Peter has a website and its own CD-ROM.

The programme can't dominate in a multi-channel world.

But we can remain distinctive, and be a major voice for children.

The days of one programme dominating the landscape are gone for ever.

They'll never come back.

No programme could become today, starting from scratch,

what Blue Peter was in the '60s and '70s.

I think, as long as BBC ONE exists, Blue Peter will exist.

It may change its transmission times,

or its shape, or its presenters.

But there will always be Blue Peter.

It will always provide that public service -

informational cornerstone to BBC children's programmes.

Subtitles by Red Bee Media