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This film contains very strong language | 0:00:09 | 0:00:14 | |
CHEERING | 0:01:19 | 0:01:22 | |
You get a sense of the scale and ambition | 0:01:38 | 0:01:41 | |
of the Church of Scientology from the footage of their galas. | 0:01:41 | 0:01:45 | |
They look more like a Hollywood awards show | 0:01:47 | 0:01:49 | |
than anything recognisably spiritual. | 0:01:49 | 0:01:52 | |
A religion created by a sci-fi writer, | 0:01:58 | 0:02:02 | |
and now run by a mysterious and unapproachable leader... | 0:02:02 | 0:02:05 | |
..whose disciples include top Hollywood actors. | 0:02:07 | 0:02:10 | |
For years, my dream was that I might be the first journalist to see | 0:02:14 | 0:02:18 | |
another, more positive side of the church. | 0:02:18 | 0:02:21 | |
Their commercials promise enlightenment, | 0:02:25 | 0:02:27 | |
using techniques that combine spirituality and science... | 0:02:27 | 0:02:31 | |
..with the ultimate aim of a planet free from insanity, | 0:02:34 | 0:02:37 | |
crime and war. | 0:02:37 | 0:02:39 | |
The videos boast of the church's global reach | 0:02:43 | 0:02:46 | |
and followers, they say, are in the millions. | 0:02:46 | 0:02:49 | |
Watching their promotional films, | 0:02:59 | 0:03:01 | |
I dreamed of experiencing their practises first-hand. | 0:03:01 | 0:03:04 | |
I made repeated requests to be allowed inside, | 0:03:05 | 0:03:10 | |
but my approaches were all turned down. | 0:03:10 | 0:03:12 | |
CHEERING | 0:03:16 | 0:03:19 | |
Gradually, I realised they were never going to let me in. | 0:03:19 | 0:03:22 | |
But inspired by their religious film-making, | 0:03:23 | 0:03:26 | |
I began thinking of another way inside | 0:03:26 | 0:03:29 | |
that was still true to the spirit of Scientology. | 0:03:29 | 0:03:32 | |
I've been in touch with one of the | 0:04:12 | 0:04:14 | |
most prominent ex-members of Scientology. | 0:04:14 | 0:04:17 | |
His name is Marty Rathbun | 0:04:18 | 0:04:20 | |
and my hope is that he can help me realise this idea I have. | 0:04:20 | 0:04:23 | |
For many years, he was one of the | 0:04:26 | 0:04:28 | |
most senior figures in the whole church. | 0:04:28 | 0:04:30 | |
Their photos show him in uniform next to David Miscavige, | 0:04:30 | 0:04:33 | |
the church leader. | 0:04:33 | 0:04:34 | |
And then, in 2004, he left | 0:04:35 | 0:04:38 | |
and started giving interviews about the church and his role within it. | 0:04:38 | 0:04:42 | |
I was basically Mr Fix It for Scientology for a number of... | 0:04:42 | 0:04:45 | |
Well, a couple of decades, frankly. | 0:04:45 | 0:04:47 | |
I mean, I was... | 0:04:47 | 0:04:48 | |
Wherever there was a fire, I was out there to put it out. | 0:04:48 | 0:04:51 | |
-Do you need a push? -Maybe. | 0:04:51 | 0:04:53 | |
The church now regards him as deeply untrustworthy. | 0:04:53 | 0:04:56 | |
This Louis is a yoga master. | 0:04:56 | 0:04:58 | |
But for more than 20 years, he was the consummate insider. | 0:04:58 | 0:05:02 | |
It feels pretty secure. | 0:05:02 | 0:05:03 | |
And he still believes in aspects of Scientology. | 0:05:03 | 0:05:06 | |
You want to just get some B-roll? | 0:05:06 | 0:05:08 | |
Yeah. | 0:05:08 | 0:05:10 | |
Have you driven in LA before, Louis? | 0:05:13 | 0:05:15 | |
I've been living in LA for the last year. | 0:05:15 | 0:05:18 | |
-Get out of town. -Yeah. -Where do you live? | 0:05:18 | 0:05:20 | |
North Hobart, very close to the Celebrity Centre. | 0:05:20 | 0:05:23 | |
I'll be darned. | 0:05:23 | 0:05:25 | |
And we've flown him in from Texas, where he now lives, | 0:05:25 | 0:05:28 | |
and brought him back to Scientology's birthplace, | 0:05:28 | 0:05:30 | |
and his old home, Los Angeles. | 0:05:30 | 0:05:33 | |
-I've got my written response from the church. -Oh, really? | 0:05:39 | 0:05:41 | |
-I wanted to mention that. -OK. | 0:05:41 | 0:05:42 | |
And what they mention is that Mr Theroux | 0:05:47 | 0:05:49 | |
had been in direct communication | 0:05:49 | 0:05:52 | |
with and had interviewed bitter | 0:05:52 | 0:05:53 | |
anti-Scientologist Marty Rathbun. | 0:05:53 | 0:05:57 | |
Is that what poisoned them against our production? | 0:05:57 | 0:06:00 | |
Is that what closed the door to us, do you think? | 0:06:00 | 0:06:03 | |
Or would they never have taken part? | 0:06:03 | 0:06:05 | |
-You can't film me. -OK. -We're not filming you. | 0:06:12 | 0:06:15 | |
You are. You have the camera in my face. | 0:06:15 | 0:06:18 | |
-Turn the camera off. -So what are you doing a documentary about? | 0:06:18 | 0:06:20 | |
It's about the Church of Scientology. | 0:06:20 | 0:06:22 | |
Oh... | 0:06:22 | 0:06:24 | |
You should interview her. | 0:06:24 | 0:06:26 | |
Well, maybe we will, but we should probably finish what we were doing. | 0:06:26 | 0:06:29 | |
Can we finish what we're doing? | 0:06:29 | 0:06:31 | |
I'm an actress and... | 0:06:31 | 0:06:33 | |
Well, we are in LA. | 0:06:33 | 0:06:35 | |
Yeah, but, no, I mean, I've done | 0:06:35 | 0:06:37 | |
over 45 films in French and Spanish... | 0:06:37 | 0:06:40 | |
-Sure. -..and a lot of things. OK, well, my name is Paz. | 0:06:40 | 0:06:43 | |
Paz. | 0:06:43 | 0:06:45 | |
How do you spell that? | 0:06:45 | 0:06:46 | |
-Yes. -That's great. Thank you so much. | 0:06:46 | 0:06:48 | |
They sent her over. | 0:07:00 | 0:07:01 | |
-The church? -Don't you think? | 0:07:01 | 0:07:03 | |
No, they're not this sophisticated. | 0:07:03 | 0:07:05 | |
-Honey trap? -They're not that sophisticated. | 0:07:05 | 0:07:07 | |
You would have done that in your day. | 0:07:07 | 0:07:10 | |
No, I wouldn't have done that in my day. | 0:07:10 | 0:07:12 | |
The founder of Scientology, L Ron Hubbard, | 0:07:17 | 0:07:20 | |
was a writer of pulp fiction | 0:07:20 | 0:07:22 | |
and in 1950 he published a self-help book called Dianetics. | 0:07:22 | 0:07:27 | |
It became the basis for an entire religion, | 0:07:27 | 0:07:29 | |
teaching that we are all immortal spirits called thetans, | 0:07:29 | 0:07:33 | |
who live multiple lifetimes. | 0:07:33 | 0:07:35 | |
Using Scientology processes, we can become enlightened, | 0:07:36 | 0:07:39 | |
remember past lives, | 0:07:39 | 0:07:41 | |
and carry all our present-day memories into future lifetimes. | 0:07:41 | 0:07:44 | |
Over the years, Hubbard won thousands of converts. | 0:07:46 | 0:07:48 | |
Hello. My name is David Miscavige | 0:07:48 | 0:07:53 | |
and I'm very happy that you could | 0:07:53 | 0:07:55 | |
all make it to this important briefing this evening. | 0:07:55 | 0:07:57 | |
And then, in 1986, | 0:07:57 | 0:07:59 | |
there was a gathering of Scientologists | 0:07:59 | 0:08:01 | |
at the Hollywood Palladium | 0:08:01 | 0:08:03 | |
and it was announced that Hubbard had died. | 0:08:03 | 0:08:05 | |
The body he had used to facilitate his existence in this universe | 0:08:05 | 0:08:10 | |
had ceased to be useful | 0:08:10 | 0:08:12 | |
and in fact had become an impediment | 0:08:12 | 0:08:15 | |
to the work he now must do outside of its confines. | 0:08:15 | 0:08:18 | |
The announcement was made in this | 0:08:20 | 0:08:22 | |
famous footage by a young man in his 20s called David Miscavige... | 0:08:22 | 0:08:26 | |
..and he has run Scientology ever since... | 0:08:27 | 0:08:30 | |
..and done so, according to his critics, | 0:08:31 | 0:08:34 | |
in an increasingly unpredictable and volatile fashion. | 0:08:34 | 0:08:37 | |
Joining us live tonight is David Miscavige, whose formal title | 0:08:37 | 0:08:40 | |
is Chairman of the Board of the Religious Technology Centre, | 0:08:40 | 0:08:43 | |
the organisation which manages Dianetics and Scientology. | 0:08:43 | 0:08:47 | |
Mr Miscavige took over as the head of Scientology in 1987, | 0:08:47 | 0:08:51 | |
following the death of the Church's founder, L Ron Hubbard. | 0:08:51 | 0:08:55 | |
In 1992, he spoke to Ted Koppel, the host of Nightline. | 0:08:55 | 0:09:00 | |
It was an unusually revealing encounter | 0:09:00 | 0:09:03 | |
and to date his only TV interview. | 0:09:03 | 0:09:05 | |
So we've got actors coming in to be David Miscavige | 0:09:16 | 0:09:21 | |
and, for me, the idea really is to recreate... | 0:09:21 | 0:09:26 | |
You know, we can't get the real Miscavige, | 0:09:26 | 0:09:29 | |
but we can create our own Miscavige, | 0:09:29 | 0:09:31 | |
using lines from that rare Ted Koppel interview | 0:09:31 | 0:09:34 | |
to help Marty to cast him. | 0:09:34 | 0:09:36 | |
I'm going to lean heavily on Marty. | 0:09:39 | 0:09:42 | |
I'm conscious it's his version and it's seen in hindsight after an | 0:09:42 | 0:09:46 | |
acrimonious split from the church. | 0:09:46 | 0:09:48 | |
OK. | 0:09:50 | 0:09:51 | |
-Hi, Chris. -How you doing? | 0:09:51 | 0:09:53 | |
-Hi. -My name's Chris Garrett. | 0:09:53 | 0:09:55 | |
Shall I...? I mean, should I sit in? | 0:09:57 | 0:09:59 | |
What do you think? Should I do a Koppel voice? | 0:09:59 | 0:10:01 | |
No. No, it's cheesy. | 0:10:01 | 0:10:03 | |
-It's up to you, Louis, whatever... -Yeah, I'll just do... | 0:10:03 | 0:10:05 | |
I'd like to begin, Mr Miscavige, | 0:10:05 | 0:10:07 | |
with, I guess, the kind of broad question | 0:10:07 | 0:10:09 | |
perhaps folks at home may be asking themselves right now. | 0:10:09 | 0:10:11 | |
..perhaps folks at home may be asking themselves right now, | 0:10:11 | 0:10:14 | |
but let me be the guinea pig for a moment. | 0:10:14 | 0:10:16 | |
See if you can explain to me why I would want to be a Scientologist. | 0:10:16 | 0:10:20 | |
Because you care about yourself and life itself. | 0:10:20 | 0:10:24 | |
-Because you care about life... Wait, hold on. -Yourself and life itself. | 0:10:24 | 0:10:28 | |
-Yeah, yeah. -Scientology, the word means study of life, | 0:10:28 | 0:10:30 | |
study of knowledge... | 0:10:30 | 0:10:32 | |
..and that's what it is. It takes up all areas of life itself. | 0:10:34 | 0:10:37 | |
Things that are integral and | 0:10:37 | 0:10:40 | |
maxims related to life and very existence. | 0:10:40 | 0:10:44 | |
Let me give you an example. It's better if I take that | 0:10:44 | 0:10:46 | |
because it's such a broad-ranging subject. | 0:10:46 | 0:10:48 | |
It's better if I take that because | 0:10:48 | 0:10:49 | |
it covers such a broad range of subjects. | 0:10:49 | 0:10:51 | |
That's an area of communication, being able to | 0:10:51 | 0:10:56 | |
communicate with the world around you and everyone here. | 0:10:56 | 0:10:58 | |
Good, good, good. | 0:10:58 | 0:11:00 | |
I just... I want it to feel as real as possible, | 0:11:00 | 0:11:04 | |
but I also... I want to get Marty back into the head space of where he | 0:11:04 | 0:11:07 | |
was when he was inside the church. | 0:11:07 | 0:11:09 | |
And we're using this rare bit of footage because he was there in the | 0:11:11 | 0:11:15 | |
studio, at Miscavige's side, when it was recorded. | 0:11:15 | 0:11:18 | |
Thank you so much. Thank you. | 0:11:18 | 0:11:20 | |
It's not Miscavige. | 0:11:21 | 0:11:24 | |
I'm serious, you know, all these guys that you would like, | 0:11:24 | 0:11:28 | |
-they're no good. -Well, no, but he actually... | 0:11:28 | 0:11:31 | |
This is not a minor game we're playing here. | 0:11:31 | 0:11:34 | |
Every man, woman and child, their | 0:11:34 | 0:11:36 | |
moral future depends on us succeeding. | 0:11:36 | 0:11:39 | |
This is the attitude, this is what you're missing. | 0:11:39 | 0:11:42 | |
You've got to have that intensity, OK? | 0:11:42 | 0:11:44 | |
Because this is not some minor game. | 0:11:44 | 0:11:46 | |
I thought he had that. | 0:11:46 | 0:11:47 | |
This is dying, not just dying in this lifetime, | 0:11:47 | 0:11:50 | |
it's dying and dying and dying and dying, | 0:11:50 | 0:11:52 | |
and being a smouldering ember that floats through space, | 0:11:52 | 0:11:55 | |
hurtling through space. | 0:11:55 | 0:11:56 | |
-Literally that? -It's literally that if we don't succeed. | 0:11:56 | 0:11:59 | |
Is that something he would say? | 0:11:59 | 0:12:02 | |
Absolutely. It's right in the policy | 0:12:02 | 0:12:03 | |
letters in Keeping Scientology Working, | 0:12:03 | 0:12:05 | |
"We'd rather have you dead than incapable." | 0:12:05 | 0:12:07 | |
That's the training attitude. | 0:12:07 | 0:12:09 | |
-That was your mind-set? -Yeah. | 0:12:09 | 0:12:11 | |
For 27 years? | 0:12:11 | 0:12:13 | |
Well, for 22 years. | 0:12:13 | 0:12:15 | |
The first five years, I was pretty laid-back. | 0:12:15 | 0:12:17 | |
It's scary, huh? | 0:12:24 | 0:12:25 | |
It makes you wonder what I'm capable of, right? | 0:12:25 | 0:12:28 | |
-A little bit. -Yeah. | 0:12:29 | 0:12:31 | |
I'll tell you what, let's stick with me, OK? | 0:12:36 | 0:12:38 | |
So far in life, I haven't had a whole lot of trouble communicating. | 0:12:38 | 0:12:41 | |
Now, see if you can communicate to me what it is that you're going to | 0:12:41 | 0:12:44 | |
be able to do for me that makes me a better communicator. | 0:12:44 | 0:12:47 | |
Well, number one, I would never try to talk you into that Scientology is | 0:12:47 | 0:12:50 | |
for you. You see, that's the funny thing about this, | 0:12:50 | 0:12:53 | |
as if I'm now going to give the sales pitch to you on Scientology... | 0:12:53 | 0:12:55 | |
You see that edge? | 0:12:55 | 0:12:57 | |
He's got that down. He's pissed... | 0:12:57 | 0:12:59 | |
But he's not overtly showing it. | 0:12:59 | 0:13:02 | |
But he's combative. | 0:13:02 | 0:13:03 | |
If you want to see something else, | 0:13:03 | 0:13:05 | |
throw any direction at me and I'll just give you another. | 0:13:05 | 0:13:08 | |
Get up and get on my face and put your finger to my chest, and let me | 0:13:08 | 0:13:12 | |
know that my problem is that I buy my own bullshit. | 0:13:12 | 0:13:15 | |
-OK. -OK, go ahead. | 0:13:16 | 0:13:18 | |
Who are you to come in here and tell me that what I stand for and what I | 0:13:19 | 0:13:24 | |
have learned, what I have learned, is the right way? | 0:13:24 | 0:13:28 | |
You people are programmed and sold. | 0:13:28 | 0:13:30 | |
Listen to me, you slimy little cocksucker, | 0:13:31 | 0:13:33 | |
you fuck up one more time, I will rip your fucking face off! | 0:13:33 | 0:13:36 | |
-You got that? -Get with me, motherfucker! | 0:13:36 | 0:13:39 | |
Get personal. Dress the guy down. | 0:13:39 | 0:13:41 | |
I don't want you just to agree with me. | 0:13:41 | 0:13:42 | |
Call him a four-eyed son of a bitch cocksucker. | 0:13:42 | 0:13:44 | |
You're a four-eyed son of a bitch, you cocksucker. | 0:13:44 | 0:13:47 | |
I mean, you had no idea what you | 0:13:47 | 0:13:48 | |
were doing from the beginning and I knew that. | 0:13:48 | 0:13:51 | |
-Louder. -You had no idea what you | 0:13:51 | 0:13:53 | |
were doing from the beginning and I knew that. | 0:13:53 | 0:13:56 | |
-Shove him against the wall. -You son of a bitch. | 0:13:56 | 0:13:59 | |
You listen to me. | 0:13:59 | 0:14:01 | |
This is really good. | 0:14:01 | 0:14:02 | |
OK, you're going to fucking do what I tell you next time and you're | 0:14:02 | 0:14:05 | |
going to actually listen to me. | 0:14:05 | 0:14:07 | |
Louis, this is really good. | 0:14:07 | 0:14:08 | |
-From the start. -OK, cut. | 0:14:08 | 0:14:10 | |
-OK. -You're a cocksucking loser. | 0:14:10 | 0:14:12 | |
You're a piece of shit. | 0:14:12 | 0:14:13 | |
I'm telling you what you're worth. | 0:14:13 | 0:14:15 | |
I'm telling you what you've been doing with your life. | 0:14:15 | 0:14:18 | |
-Don't look away. -He's got it. | 0:14:18 | 0:14:20 | |
He's got it. This is David Miscavige, right here. | 0:14:20 | 0:14:23 | |
Where were you getting that from? | 0:14:23 | 0:14:25 | |
Uh, I tap into anger very easily... | 0:14:25 | 0:14:29 | |
And righteousness. | 0:14:29 | 0:14:31 | |
That's exactly what it is - it's a righteous anger. | 0:14:31 | 0:14:33 | |
That was like being there. | 0:14:33 | 0:14:34 | |
-Yeah. -Thank you so much. | 0:14:34 | 0:14:36 | |
-Thanks a lot, man. -Take care. OK, cheers. | 0:14:36 | 0:14:39 | |
I'm aware that we're going to the | 0:14:39 | 0:14:41 | |
violence quite quickly and to the sort | 0:14:41 | 0:14:44 | |
of negative characterisation. | 0:14:44 | 0:14:45 | |
But I don't know if we're going to get the sense of why, for 22 years, | 0:14:45 | 0:14:49 | |
you were working hand in glove in a devoted fashion with that guy. | 0:14:49 | 0:14:53 | |
Well, as you said, | 0:14:53 | 0:14:55 | |
you thought it was kind of nice | 0:14:55 | 0:14:57 | |
having your face ripped off up against the wall. | 0:14:57 | 0:15:00 | |
Yeah, but that was playacting. | 0:15:00 | 0:15:02 | |
I know. So what's the difference? | 0:15:02 | 0:15:03 | |
The orthodoxy of the Scientology | 0:15:36 | 0:15:38 | |
religion, so that it forever remains faithful... | 0:15:38 | 0:15:41 | |
He's indignant, but he's also trying to make his case to an | 0:15:51 | 0:15:54 | |
-impartial person, like a judge, right? -OK. | 0:15:54 | 0:15:57 | |
Yeah. OK, shall we go? | 0:15:57 | 0:15:59 | |
Go. | 0:15:59 | 0:16:01 | |
I am, and since 1987 have been, | 0:16:03 | 0:16:06 | |
the Chairman of the Board of Religious Technology Centre, | 0:16:06 | 0:16:09 | |
a section 501 C3 tax-exempt non-profit religious corporation, | 0:16:09 | 0:16:14 | |
whose sole purpose is to maintain the orthodoxy of the Scientology | 0:16:14 | 0:16:17 | |
-religion. -I mean, I would take it down a notch. | 0:16:17 | 0:16:20 | |
-OK. -Because I think that went a little too conversational. | 0:16:20 | 0:16:23 | |
Yeah. | 0:16:23 | 0:16:25 | |
Most Scientologists would never meet David Miscavige. | 0:16:27 | 0:16:30 | |
They have normal jobs. They might | 0:16:30 | 0:16:32 | |
volunteer in the church's book shops, which they call orgs. | 0:16:32 | 0:16:36 | |
They don't wear uniforms. | 0:16:36 | 0:16:38 | |
And in LA, many of them are actors. | 0:16:38 | 0:16:40 | |
I grew up in Boston. | 0:16:42 | 0:16:43 | |
Small-town boy with big-town dreams, | 0:16:43 | 0:16:46 | |
so I decided to take the leap to Hollywood and become an actor. | 0:16:46 | 0:16:50 | |
I didn't really have a plan in mind, per se. | 0:16:51 | 0:16:54 | |
I just kind of came here and | 0:16:54 | 0:16:55 | |
just hoped that I would find my way in the business. | 0:16:55 | 0:16:59 | |
So I picked up a copy of Backstage newspaper, | 0:16:59 | 0:17:01 | |
which is the trade newspaper that actors subscribe to that lists | 0:17:01 | 0:17:04 | |
all the different auditions in town and all the different classes. | 0:17:04 | 0:17:07 | |
And there was a huge ad - "How to break into the industry" - | 0:17:07 | 0:17:10 | |
teaching you all the ins and outs of how to make it in Hollywood. | 0:17:10 | 0:17:13 | |
So I took the bus up to the Celebrity Centre and I walk in, | 0:17:13 | 0:17:16 | |
and we went into their theatre room to watch their orientation film. | 0:17:16 | 0:17:20 | |
Right this instant, you are at the | 0:17:21 | 0:17:23 | |
threshold of your next trillion years. | 0:17:23 | 0:17:26 | |
You will live it in shivering, agonised darkness, | 0:17:27 | 0:17:30 | |
or you will live it triumphantly in the light. | 0:17:30 | 0:17:34 | |
-The choice is yours. -That's the one where he says, | 0:17:34 | 0:17:36 | |
"If, at the end of this, you're not | 0:17:36 | 0:17:38 | |
"convinced that this is for you, you're free to walk away." | 0:17:38 | 0:17:42 | |
It would be stupid, but you can do it. | 0:17:42 | 0:17:44 | |
You can also dive off a bridge or blow your brains out. | 0:17:44 | 0:17:47 | |
Blow your brains out, yeah. | 0:17:47 | 0:17:48 | |
That is your choice. | 0:17:48 | 0:17:50 | |
When you're a new actor and you come to somewhere | 0:17:50 | 0:17:53 | |
like the Celebrity Centre and they're telling you, | 0:17:53 | 0:17:55 | |
"We can help make you someone like the new Tom Cruise," | 0:17:55 | 0:17:59 | |
you're like, "Oh, wow, that's what I want." | 0:17:59 | 0:18:02 | |
You know, they just tell you it's a course away. | 0:18:02 | 0:18:05 | |
Your happiness is a course away. | 0:18:05 | 0:18:07 | |
If I see someone on the street, at the bus stop, | 0:18:11 | 0:18:14 | |
you'd go up to them and just try to be their friend. | 0:18:14 | 0:18:16 | |
-Give them one of these? -Give them one of these booklets and say, | 0:18:16 | 0:18:19 | |
"Hey, check out my church." | 0:18:19 | 0:18:21 | |
And if I get you to sign up for services, it helps me because I get | 0:18:21 | 0:18:24 | |
a 10% commission on whatever you buy. | 0:18:24 | 0:18:27 | |
They say it brainwashes people. | 0:18:27 | 0:18:28 | |
It is, it's mind-numbing. | 0:18:29 | 0:18:31 | |
No, no, no. I'm doing the... | 0:18:31 | 0:18:32 | |
They say it brainwashes people. | 0:18:32 | 0:18:35 | |
Do I look like I'm brainwashed to you? | 0:18:35 | 0:18:38 | |
I'm your neighbour. I'm your best friend. | 0:18:38 | 0:18:40 | |
Scientology is an applied religious philosophy. | 0:18:40 | 0:18:44 | |
It's not a religion you just sit down and pray at an altar about. | 0:18:44 | 0:18:47 | |
This is something that you actually apply every single day | 0:18:47 | 0:18:50 | |
in your life - tools to improve yourself. | 0:18:50 | 0:18:53 | |
-Pass them here. -Oh, my God, really? | 0:18:55 | 0:18:59 | |
There is apparently one million spoken and transcribed L Ron Hubbard | 0:18:59 | 0:19:02 | |
-words in all these books. -And you paid for all of them? | 0:19:02 | 0:19:05 | |
I paid for all of them. | 0:19:05 | 0:19:07 | |
How much did you pay for all your materials? | 0:19:07 | 0:19:10 | |
For all the book course materials? | 0:19:10 | 0:19:11 | |
Everything. Just for the whole services, books, everything. | 0:19:11 | 0:19:14 | |
-Everything, 50 grand. -About 50,000? | 0:19:14 | 0:19:16 | |
50,000. | 0:19:16 | 0:19:17 | |
It's a simple ohm meter | 0:19:34 | 0:19:36 | |
and there's a very slight amount of electricity actually passing through | 0:19:36 | 0:19:39 | |
your body, although it's imperceptible. | 0:19:39 | 0:19:42 | |
When I address thought that has some trauma connected with it or | 0:19:42 | 0:19:47 | |
some anxiety connected with it, I get a particular type of reading. | 0:19:47 | 0:19:51 | |
It's a device that measures thought. | 0:19:52 | 0:19:55 | |
All right. Is there a particular area of your life that... | 0:19:55 | 0:19:59 | |
..fixates your attention | 0:20:01 | 0:20:03 | |
-or you feel is...? That, there. -Did you get one? | 0:20:03 | 0:20:07 | |
Yeah. | 0:20:07 | 0:20:09 | |
-Can I answer? -Please. | 0:20:09 | 0:20:10 | |
I'm thinking about a time when I was about 11 or 12. | 0:20:15 | 0:20:20 | |
The most basic practise in Scientology is auditing - | 0:20:20 | 0:20:23 | |
it's a form of counselling using a | 0:20:23 | 0:20:25 | |
primitive lie detector called an e-meter. | 0:20:25 | 0:20:27 | |
OK, is there an earlier similar problem? | 0:20:29 | 0:20:31 | |
Basically, you talk about memories and traumas called engrams | 0:20:33 | 0:20:38 | |
-until they no longer register on the machine. -Interesting. | 0:20:38 | 0:20:41 | |
Your needle's floating. | 0:20:41 | 0:20:43 | |
Which is good, right? That means I've cleared something? | 0:20:46 | 0:20:49 | |
I don't know. Do you feel like you've realised something? | 0:20:49 | 0:20:51 | |
I feel like I've made a connection, yeah. | 0:20:51 | 0:20:53 | |
That's basically what a session is. | 0:20:53 | 0:20:56 | |
So how does this relate to Scientology | 0:20:56 | 0:20:59 | |
and this idea of being clear? | 0:20:59 | 0:21:01 | |
OK, you desensitise a lot of these things, | 0:21:02 | 0:21:05 | |
like this thing that gave you a little bit of angst. | 0:21:05 | 0:21:08 | |
I mean, there's tonnes of things | 0:21:08 | 0:21:09 | |
that any given individual has like that. | 0:21:09 | 0:21:11 | |
-Got it. -That's clear, basically. | 0:21:11 | 0:21:14 | |
Though it's a religion, Scientologists don't worship a God. | 0:21:14 | 0:21:18 | |
Instead, what they offer is a highly detailed, | 0:21:18 | 0:21:21 | |
step-by-step programme of classes and courses, each with a price tag, | 0:21:21 | 0:21:26 | |
and all of it laid out in an extremely complex-looking diagram. | 0:21:26 | 0:21:29 | |
They call the teachings religious technology, or tech. | 0:21:32 | 0:21:35 | |
As you advance up the bridge, | 0:21:36 | 0:21:38 | |
you deal with engrams from past lifetimes. | 0:21:38 | 0:21:41 | |
At the very top are the OT levels. | 0:21:41 | 0:21:44 | |
OT stands for operating thetan | 0:21:44 | 0:21:47 | |
and the possibility of extrasensory abilities. | 0:21:47 | 0:21:49 | |
The most dedicated believers can join Scientology's clergy, | 0:21:52 | 0:21:56 | |
the Sea Org. | 0:21:56 | 0:21:58 | |
You can see them in church photos, styled like a Navy. | 0:21:58 | 0:22:02 | |
Their glossy recruitment posters | 0:22:02 | 0:22:04 | |
depict them as being like warrior monks. | 0:22:04 | 0:22:07 | |
They sign billion-year contracts, | 0:22:07 | 0:22:09 | |
committing all their future lifetimes to saving Earth from ruin. | 0:22:09 | 0:22:13 | |
And while there may be as many as 25,000 Scientologists in the US, | 0:22:15 | 0:22:19 | |
only a fraction are signed up as members of the Sea Org. | 0:22:19 | 0:22:23 | |
And it's within the Sea Org that the most controversial practises are | 0:22:23 | 0:22:26 | |
alleged to have taken place. | 0:22:26 | 0:22:28 | |
We're going down to a little town called Hemet. | 0:22:39 | 0:22:42 | |
And close by Hemet is the headquarters of Scientology, | 0:22:43 | 0:22:46 | |
a legendary location. | 0:22:46 | 0:22:48 | |
We're going there with Mark Headley, | 0:22:51 | 0:22:53 | |
who worked and lived there for 15 years, | 0:22:53 | 0:22:56 | |
from 1990 to 2005, when he blew, | 0:22:56 | 0:23:00 | |
which means he left in an unauthorised fashion. | 0:23:00 | 0:23:02 | |
He later sued the church for keeping him against his will, | 0:23:04 | 0:23:07 | |
but he lost the case. | 0:23:07 | 0:23:09 | |
And like Marty, he's viewed by the church as embittered and a liar. | 0:23:09 | 0:23:12 | |
You know we've been filming with Marty Rathbun? | 0:23:14 | 0:23:18 | |
Yes, I was aware of that. | 0:23:18 | 0:23:20 | |
And you know him, don't you? | 0:23:20 | 0:23:21 | |
-Yes, I do. -Basically, it's where David Miscavige mainly works, | 0:23:21 | 0:23:26 | |
it's where he runs Scientology from, | 0:23:26 | 0:23:28 | |
and it's where, allegedly, in the years running up to 2005, | 0:23:28 | 0:23:33 | |
there was a reign of terror. | 0:23:33 | 0:23:36 | |
There was actually a time in the mid-1990s when I was being accused | 0:23:36 | 0:23:41 | |
of myself being violent with somebody, | 0:23:41 | 0:23:46 | |
one of my own crew, | 0:23:46 | 0:23:48 | |
and I was being interrogated on an e-meter about this incident. | 0:23:48 | 0:23:53 | |
And Marty was actually standing behind the girl that was doing the | 0:23:53 | 0:23:56 | |
interrogation in the little auditing room with us. | 0:23:56 | 0:24:00 | |
And it just kept going on and on and she'd say, "Did you do this?" | 0:24:01 | 0:24:04 | |
I'd say, "No, I didn't do that." | 0:24:04 | 0:24:06 | |
And, "Did you do this?" "No, I didn't do that." | 0:24:06 | 0:24:08 | |
And then Marty actually just said, | 0:24:08 | 0:24:10 | |
"Listen, let's take a break for a second." | 0:24:10 | 0:24:13 | |
And he cold-cocked me. | 0:24:13 | 0:24:14 | |
Just boom. And he's a big guy, he's much bigger than I am. | 0:24:14 | 0:24:17 | |
-He punched you? -He punched me square in the jaw, out of nowhere, | 0:24:17 | 0:24:21 | |
I wasn't expecting it. | 0:24:21 | 0:24:22 | |
It was just, "Boom." And then he goes, | 0:24:22 | 0:24:24 | |
"Good, now go back in there and tell her what she wants to hear." | 0:24:24 | 0:24:28 | |
-This is it? -Yeah, this is it. | 0:24:38 | 0:24:40 | |
We're there. This building up | 0:24:40 | 0:24:44 | |
on the right here, that the cinematography studio. | 0:24:44 | 0:24:48 | |
It's called the Cinecastle. | 0:24:48 | 0:24:50 | |
So they make promotional videos for Scientology in there? | 0:24:50 | 0:24:53 | |
Films and videos. | 0:24:53 | 0:24:55 | |
It looks like you could walk quite close. | 0:24:55 | 0:24:57 | |
If we did, they'd know. I mean, they know we're here right now. | 0:24:57 | 0:25:00 | |
There's cameras right there. We have their attention. | 0:25:00 | 0:25:02 | |
No doubt, 100%. | 0:25:02 | 0:25:03 | |
I'm going to take my lead from you, Mark. | 0:25:05 | 0:25:07 | |
Do you think this is a good place to stop or maybe not? | 0:25:07 | 0:25:09 | |
-Are you OK? -I'm fine. -You just went... | 0:25:09 | 0:25:12 | |
Is it stress or are you just...? | 0:25:12 | 0:25:14 | |
-No, no, I'm fine. -You're good? | 0:25:14 | 0:25:15 | |
-I'm good. -You're not getting flashbacks? | 0:25:15 | 0:25:18 | |
No, no, I'm not getting flashbacks. | 0:25:18 | 0:25:20 | |
It's called Intbase because it's the international headquarters of | 0:25:20 | 0:25:23 | |
Scientology, but it's also called | 0:25:23 | 0:25:25 | |
Gold Base because it's the headquarters of Gold Studios. | 0:25:25 | 0:25:28 | |
And Gold Studios was a production facility | 0:25:28 | 0:25:32 | |
that L Ron Hubbard himself created, | 0:25:32 | 0:25:34 | |
churning out epic Hollywood-style promotional videos. | 0:25:34 | 0:25:38 | |
When the history of this planet is finally told, | 0:25:38 | 0:25:42 | |
it will be a tale of exalted triumph | 0:25:42 | 0:25:45 | |
that forever changed the destiny of Earth. | 0:25:45 | 0:25:49 | |
We are the IAS. | 0:25:51 | 0:25:54 | |
And Mark was well-acquainted with a lot of these very dramatic films and | 0:25:56 | 0:26:01 | |
how they were made because he was working on them as a producer. | 0:26:01 | 0:26:05 | |
You show the best spot. | 0:26:06 | 0:26:08 | |
Yeah. | 0:26:08 | 0:26:09 | |
-Is it this one? -Yeah. -Whose land is this, then? | 0:26:17 | 0:26:20 | |
This is public. This is public land. | 0:26:20 | 0:26:22 | |
So you can see this is the razor wire that's always talked about. | 0:26:23 | 0:26:27 | |
See, they don't have it on the main highway road, but as soon as you get | 0:26:27 | 0:26:31 | |
off the highway, then there's | 0:26:31 | 0:26:33 | |
razor wire around the entirety of the property, just like that. | 0:26:33 | 0:26:37 | |
And you can see the high-powered floodlights, | 0:26:37 | 0:26:39 | |
you can see the motion sensors, | 0:26:39 | 0:26:41 | |
those little black things near every fence post. | 0:26:41 | 0:26:43 | |
Those are called fence shakers, | 0:26:43 | 0:26:45 | |
so if somebody climbs over the fence from the inside, | 0:26:45 | 0:26:48 | |
that sets off an alarm in that main security booth and all those flood | 0:26:48 | 0:26:52 | |
lights all around the entire property turn on, | 0:26:52 | 0:26:55 | |
so they can easily locate someone who's trying to escape. | 0:26:55 | 0:26:58 | |
Let's hop out. | 0:27:02 | 0:27:03 | |
You lived here for 15 years? | 0:27:12 | 0:27:14 | |
-15 years. -Do you feel now, looking back, | 0:27:14 | 0:27:16 | |
that you were kept against your will? | 0:27:16 | 0:27:19 | |
I think that I was a prisoner in my own... | 0:27:19 | 0:27:23 | |
I was keeping myself here based on what they told me. | 0:27:23 | 0:27:26 | |
I knew that there would be consequences of me leaving | 0:27:26 | 0:27:29 | |
that would make it so it would be | 0:27:29 | 0:27:31 | |
very hard for me to live outside of this world. | 0:27:31 | 0:27:35 | |
Those consequences became so minuscule compared to the terror | 0:27:35 | 0:27:39 | |
that I was living through here | 0:27:39 | 0:27:41 | |
that it got to the point where I | 0:27:41 | 0:27:43 | |
would rather be dead than to live here. | 0:27:43 | 0:27:46 | |
They recite events that never took place. | 0:27:48 | 0:27:51 | |
I'm left in a position of my word against their word, | 0:27:51 | 0:27:55 | |
which is precisely the effect I feel they've tried to create. | 0:27:55 | 0:27:58 | |
Their efforts are orchestrated, | 0:27:58 | 0:28:00 | |
pursuant to a well-used litigation | 0:28:00 | 0:28:01 | |
strategy that has been employed against | 0:28:01 | 0:28:04 | |
L Ron Hubbard, various churches of Scientology and me for years. | 0:28:04 | 0:28:08 | |
Namely, the gathering of apostates in search of money, | 0:28:08 | 0:28:11 | |
who are then used as a travelling road show | 0:28:11 | 0:28:13 | |
to present packaged yet false testimony concerning | 0:28:13 | 0:28:16 | |
Scientologists, churches of Scientology and me. | 0:28:16 | 0:28:19 | |
That was very good. | 0:28:21 | 0:28:22 | |
Did you not think that was very good? | 0:28:22 | 0:28:24 | |
Hubbard understood early on that he | 0:28:27 | 0:28:29 | |
could spread his religious ideas using actors. | 0:28:29 | 0:28:32 | |
He wrote screenplays and liked | 0:28:33 | 0:28:35 | |
being photographed on set, directing. | 0:28:35 | 0:28:37 | |
And, as early as 1955, he launched something called Project Celebrity, | 0:28:39 | 0:28:43 | |
a list of high-profile people he hoped to recruit - | 0:28:43 | 0:28:47 | |
James Stewart, Greta Garbo, Danny Kaye - | 0:28:47 | 0:28:51 | |
and the practices of Scientology are like acting class techniques. | 0:28:51 | 0:28:56 | |
You're learning a new role in life. | 0:28:56 | 0:28:58 | |
It's an exciting day today because we are here to cast Tom Cruise. | 0:29:07 | 0:29:12 | |
He's obviously the famous Scientologist in the world. | 0:29:12 | 0:29:15 | |
In fact, probably a lot of people, | 0:29:15 | 0:29:17 | |
all they know about Scientology is that Tom Cruise is a member. | 0:29:17 | 0:29:21 | |
And Tom Cruise is best friends with David Miscavige. | 0:29:23 | 0:29:26 | |
It was widely reported that David Miscavige was best man | 0:29:26 | 0:29:29 | |
at Tom Cruise's wedding to Katie Holmes. | 0:29:29 | 0:29:32 | |
The other thing is that Mark was involved in making the promotional | 0:29:32 | 0:29:36 | |
videos, and one of the most famous and controversial promotional videos | 0:29:36 | 0:29:40 | |
in Scientology was one involving Tom Cruise on Tom Cruise. | 0:29:40 | 0:29:45 | |
I think it's a privilege to call yourself a Scientologist | 0:29:46 | 0:29:49 | |
and it's something that you have to earn... | 0:29:49 | 0:29:51 | |
Because a Scientologist does. | 0:29:51 | 0:29:53 | |
And so we're going to use quotes | 0:29:56 | 0:29:58 | |
from that footage to help us cast our actor | 0:29:58 | 0:30:01 | |
and to understand what motivates Tom Cruise. | 0:30:01 | 0:30:03 | |
All right. | 0:30:03 | 0:30:04 | |
Action. | 0:30:06 | 0:30:07 | |
I think it's a privilege to call yourself a Scientologist | 0:30:07 | 0:30:09 | |
because it's something that you have to earn. | 0:30:09 | 0:30:11 | |
It's a privilege to call yourself a Scientologist. | 0:30:11 | 0:30:13 | |
It's something that you have to earn. | 0:30:13 | 0:30:15 | |
Because a Scientologist does. | 0:30:15 | 0:30:18 | |
-Cut. -This is not a bad place just to do a quick bit of background. | 0:30:18 | 0:30:20 | |
What level is Tom Cruise at in Scientology? | 0:30:20 | 0:30:24 | |
-OT7. -And is that high? | 0:30:24 | 0:30:27 | |
Yeah, the only one higher is OT8. | 0:30:27 | 0:30:29 | |
When he gets to that next one, | 0:30:29 | 0:30:30 | |
there's nothing you can do that's higher. | 0:30:30 | 0:30:32 | |
-And each one costs money, right? -Yeah, yeah. | 0:30:32 | 0:30:35 | |
To get all the way to the top can cost anywhere from | 0:30:35 | 0:30:37 | |
500,000 to 2 million. | 0:30:37 | 0:30:40 | |
So, for me, it really is KSW. | 0:30:40 | 0:30:43 | |
For me, it really is KSW. | 0:30:43 | 0:30:45 | |
And... | 0:30:45 | 0:30:47 | |
I don't mince words with that, you know. | 0:30:47 | 0:30:48 | |
For me, that policy is just... | 0:30:48 | 0:30:50 | |
It really has just gone... | 0:30:50 | 0:30:51 | |
Boy. | 0:30:54 | 0:30:55 | |
-Yeah. -Do you want to tell him what KSW is? | 0:30:55 | 0:30:57 | |
Sure. KSW is Keeping Scientology Working | 0:30:57 | 0:31:01 | |
and Keeping Scientology Working is basically like obliterating anything | 0:31:01 | 0:31:06 | |
that doesn't have to do with Scientology and keeping it working. | 0:31:06 | 0:31:09 | |
Any time somebody does something in Scientology that's not | 0:31:09 | 0:31:12 | |
100% Scientology, you crush that person, | 0:31:12 | 0:31:16 | |
so that they do not ever do that again. | 0:31:16 | 0:31:18 | |
So, for me, it really is KSW. | 0:31:18 | 0:31:20 | |
It's just like... It's something that... | 0:31:20 | 0:31:23 | |
..I don't mince words with that. | 0:31:25 | 0:31:27 | |
That policy, to me, has really gone... | 0:31:29 | 0:31:32 | |
Boy. There was a time I went through and I said, "You know what?" | 0:31:32 | 0:31:35 | |
Can you pause it? | 0:31:39 | 0:31:40 | |
-We just paused that at random, right? -Yeah. | 0:31:41 | 0:31:43 | |
I mean, if you saw him across the breakfast table | 0:31:43 | 0:31:46 | |
looking at you like that... | 0:31:46 | 0:31:47 | |
..that's not, you know, "pass the mustard." | 0:31:48 | 0:31:50 | |
In that KSW policy, L Ron Hubbard says, | 0:31:51 | 0:31:55 | |
"We want you to have a dedicated glare in your eyes." | 0:31:55 | 0:31:58 | |
You know, I feel like there's a bigger question outside... | 0:31:58 | 0:32:00 | |
Like, I don't understand, why does he think this is so important? | 0:32:00 | 0:32:05 | |
Because Scientology's the only way that the world | 0:32:05 | 0:32:08 | |
is ever going to survive. | 0:32:08 | 0:32:10 | |
He thinks that without Scientology, what would happen? | 0:32:10 | 0:32:13 | |
Charred ruins. | 0:32:13 | 0:32:15 | |
When the day is over, the only thing that's workable is Scientology. | 0:32:15 | 0:32:19 | |
Workable as what? | 0:32:19 | 0:32:21 | |
As a technology, as an organisational technology, | 0:32:21 | 0:32:24 | |
as a spiritual technology. | 0:32:24 | 0:32:26 | |
It's a universal solvent that will handle all of the world's problems | 0:32:26 | 0:32:30 | |
and the universe's problems. | 0:32:30 | 0:32:33 | |
-HE WHISPERS: -They said, "So, like, have you met an SP?" | 0:32:33 | 0:32:36 | |
Cos maybe one day it'll actually be like that. | 0:32:39 | 0:32:41 | |
Maybe one day it'll be, "Wow, like, SPs." | 0:32:41 | 0:32:44 | |
Like, they'll just read about those in history books, you know? | 0:32:44 | 0:32:47 | |
Do you want to tell Caleb what an SP is? | 0:32:47 | 0:32:49 | |
If you bad-mouth Scientology or speak out against Scientology, | 0:32:49 | 0:32:52 | |
you're labelled a Suppressive Person. | 0:32:52 | 0:32:55 | |
And there's actually a policy within Scientology | 0:32:55 | 0:32:57 | |
that says how you handle a Suppressive Person, | 0:32:57 | 0:33:00 | |
or how you deal with a Suppressive Person, | 0:33:00 | 0:33:03 | |
is to ruin him utterly. | 0:33:03 | 0:33:05 | |
It's PTSSP. | 0:33:05 | 0:33:06 | |
How to shatter suppression. Confront, shatter suppression. | 0:33:06 | 0:33:09 | |
You apply it, it's like boom. | 0:33:09 | 0:33:10 | |
"Because they don't come up..." | 0:33:10 | 0:33:12 | |
Because they don't come up to me and say that. | 0:33:12 | 0:33:15 | |
Not to my face, you know, or anywhere in my vicinity. | 0:33:15 | 0:33:18 | |
Where they can be... | 0:33:18 | 0:33:20 | |
Confronted. | 0:33:21 | 0:33:23 | |
They just don't do it. | 0:33:23 | 0:33:24 | |
Why not? | 0:33:24 | 0:33:26 | |
Because they're afraid. | 0:33:26 | 0:33:28 | |
Afraid of? | 0:33:28 | 0:33:30 | |
Of what they might find out about themselves. | 0:33:30 | 0:33:32 | |
Yeah, see, that's not in there. | 0:33:32 | 0:33:34 | |
-We were just improving. -No, no, no, I know. | 0:33:34 | 0:33:36 | |
But what he said is exactly true. | 0:33:36 | 0:33:39 | |
Why did you say that? | 0:33:39 | 0:33:40 | |
It's the fear of whatever, but usually themselves. | 0:33:40 | 0:33:44 | |
Are you in character now, or is this you? | 0:33:44 | 0:33:46 | |
A little bit of both. | 0:33:46 | 0:33:48 | |
I was going to say, he's getting really scary on me right now. | 0:33:48 | 0:33:50 | |
I mean, if the intent behind it is to help people, | 0:33:50 | 0:33:52 | |
then, I mean, there should be no harm in that. | 0:33:52 | 0:33:55 | |
-Very good. -Great. -That was nice. Thank you for that. | 0:33:55 | 0:33:57 | |
Not a problem. | 0:33:57 | 0:33:59 | |
You guys have yourself a wonderful afternoon. | 0:34:01 | 0:34:03 | |
-You, too. -You, too. -Very good. | 0:34:03 | 0:34:05 | |
What is the license plate again? | 0:34:32 | 0:34:34 | |
9353... | 0:34:34 | 0:34:37 | |
After four hours of the same car being behind you... | 0:34:41 | 0:34:44 | |
..it starts to look a bit suspicious. | 0:34:45 | 0:34:47 | |
And it's a white pick-up truck, a Tacoma. | 0:34:52 | 0:34:55 | |
He's right behind us now. | 0:34:57 | 0:34:58 | |
His windshield is quite dark, isn't it? | 0:35:00 | 0:35:02 | |
Nothing suspicious about that. | 0:35:04 | 0:35:06 | |
There's no question, is there? | 0:35:10 | 0:35:13 | |
He's a private investigator. | 0:35:13 | 0:35:14 | |
What you've got to remember is - this is a church. | 0:35:20 | 0:35:23 | |
I mean, that's the thing, isn't it? | 0:35:23 | 0:35:26 | |
It's just not like any church that you can really think of. | 0:35:26 | 0:35:29 | |
I can't see him. | 0:35:41 | 0:35:42 | |
I think we've lost him. | 0:35:42 | 0:35:44 | |
So this is a letter that was forwarded to me from... | 0:36:02 | 0:36:04 | |
..one of our producers. | 0:36:06 | 0:36:07 | |
And it's from the lawyers Carter-Ruck, | 0:36:07 | 0:36:11 | |
retained by the Church of Scientology. | 0:36:11 | 0:36:15 | |
So, evidently they've got wind of... | 0:36:15 | 0:36:17 | |
..what we're doing and they say, | 0:36:19 | 0:36:21 | |
"Our client is aware that Mr Theroux has auditioned for actors to play a | 0:36:21 | 0:36:25 | |
"young David Miscavige." | 0:36:25 | 0:36:27 | |
They don't know we've also auditioned actors | 0:36:27 | 0:36:29 | |
to play Tom Cruise. But... | 0:36:29 | 0:36:31 | |
"In Relation to the auditions, | 0:36:32 | 0:36:34 | |
"our client's information is that Mr Theroux filmed these | 0:36:34 | 0:36:37 | |
"with Marty Rathbun in attendance and advising. | 0:36:37 | 0:36:41 | |
"This is most concerning." | 0:36:41 | 0:36:43 | |
And so, how do they know that Marty was at the casting? | 0:36:43 | 0:36:48 | |
Was one of the actors, conceivably, did he put the word out, | 0:36:48 | 0:36:51 | |
tell people in his circle? | 0:36:51 | 0:36:53 | |
And did that get back to the church? | 0:36:53 | 0:36:55 | |
Or was one of the actors a Scientologist, | 0:36:55 | 0:36:57 | |
or was there someone on the inside who was somehow a mole? | 0:36:57 | 0:37:00 | |
Or we were followed. | 0:37:04 | 0:37:06 | |
Or we were followed. | 0:37:06 | 0:37:07 | |
-So you know we're going to see Tom De Vocht? -Yes, sir. | 0:37:18 | 0:37:21 | |
And he is another embittered and disgruntled defrocked apostate. | 0:37:25 | 0:37:33 | |
-Another? -Well, in addition to you. | 0:37:35 | 0:37:37 | |
Why would you call me what the church calls me? | 0:37:39 | 0:37:42 | |
I was... | 0:37:44 | 0:37:45 | |
Do I look embittered? | 0:37:45 | 0:37:47 | |
I could care less, Louis. | 0:37:47 | 0:37:48 | |
Embittered is the last adjective that would apply to me. | 0:37:50 | 0:37:54 | |
I'm way beyond embittered. I don't care. | 0:37:54 | 0:37:58 | |
Hey, hey, hey. | 0:37:58 | 0:37:59 | |
-Guys, this is Erin, by the way. -How do you do? Louis. -Louis... | 0:38:03 | 0:38:06 | |
Erin, nice to meet you. | 0:38:06 | 0:38:08 | |
Are you Tom's other half, could we say? | 0:38:08 | 0:38:10 | |
-We're business partners. -Really? What are you guys doing? | 0:38:10 | 0:38:13 | |
A lot of people have described David Miscavige as an aloof figure, | 0:38:13 | 0:38:16 | |
but I've heard that you were quite tight with David Miscavige. | 0:38:16 | 0:38:22 | |
Yeah, I mean, we became pretty... | 0:38:22 | 0:38:24 | |
It depends how you look at it. | 0:38:24 | 0:38:26 | |
Tight with David Miscavige isn't really possible, I don't think, | 0:38:26 | 0:38:29 | |
but we did get along and he did... | 0:38:29 | 0:38:32 | |
He liked you? | 0:38:32 | 0:38:33 | |
I think what really happens is, he may or may not like you, | 0:38:34 | 0:38:38 | |
but he uses you until you're fucking used up, | 0:38:38 | 0:38:41 | |
and then he chops your head off and everybody's gone. | 0:38:41 | 0:38:43 | |
-It's a pattern. -It is a pattern. | 0:38:43 | 0:38:46 | |
It happens to everybody. | 0:38:46 | 0:38:47 | |
The guy, I mean, it scared you. | 0:38:47 | 0:38:49 | |
You thought, what the hell? | 0:38:49 | 0:38:50 | |
I played backgammon with him and I'd make a point to lose. | 0:38:50 | 0:38:53 | |
-I mean, it was... -Why? | 0:38:55 | 0:38:57 | |
I got good at it, by the way. | 0:38:57 | 0:38:59 | |
-He had to. -If he felt at all that you were more popular | 0:38:59 | 0:39:03 | |
or better in any way or anything, | 0:39:03 | 0:39:06 | |
he'd flip, and he could flip like that. | 0:39:06 | 0:39:09 | |
Then you spent a little time up there, the guy's got somebody - | 0:39:10 | 0:39:13 | |
I'm sure you know this - recording him 24-7. | 0:39:13 | 0:39:15 | |
Even when we were sitting there drinking Scotch, | 0:39:15 | 0:39:19 | |
tape recorder is down and everything's being recorded. | 0:39:19 | 0:39:21 | |
Even if you were just saying... | 0:39:21 | 0:39:23 | |
If we were playing backgammon, that damn thing was rolling. | 0:39:23 | 0:39:25 | |
-Why? -Are you shocked by all this? | 0:39:25 | 0:39:27 | |
You are on record as saying that you saw him beat people. | 0:39:28 | 0:39:33 | |
Unbelievable. | 0:39:33 | 0:39:34 | |
In the real world, you'd go to jail if you did something like that. | 0:39:34 | 0:39:39 | |
But what I don't understand is... | 0:39:39 | 0:39:41 | |
But you seem like a normal, reasonable person, | 0:39:42 | 0:39:45 | |
and Marty's fairly normal and reasonable, | 0:39:45 | 0:39:48 | |
and there are other people there. | 0:39:48 | 0:39:49 | |
How does someone get away with behaving in that way? | 0:39:51 | 0:39:53 | |
This is the only thing I can tell you, | 0:39:53 | 0:39:55 | |
you've got people who wrap bombs around themselves, | 0:39:55 | 0:39:57 | |
fly planes into buildings - it's the same thing. | 0:39:57 | 0:40:00 | |
You believe so much in that technology or so much in whatever, | 0:40:00 | 0:40:04 | |
they can convince you of anything. | 0:40:04 | 0:40:06 | |
When I got interviewed by the FBI, they said... | 0:40:07 | 0:40:10 | |
"Would you help us? If we went in to Gold up there, | 0:40:11 | 0:40:14 | |
"busted open the gates and went in... | 0:40:14 | 0:40:16 | |
"..would you show us where things are?" | 0:40:18 | 0:40:19 | |
I said, "Abso-fucking-lutely, but you're wasting your time." | 0:40:19 | 0:40:22 | |
After I told them the same thing, they went to him to cross-check it | 0:40:22 | 0:40:25 | |
-and we never talked! -And they said, "What are you talking about?" | 0:40:25 | 0:40:28 | |
And I said, "You're going to walk in, you might find | 0:40:28 | 0:40:30 | |
"terrible situations and every one of them are going to go, | 0:40:30 | 0:40:33 | |
"No, no, no, this is the way we want it." | 0:40:33 | 0:40:34 | |
And at that point you're done. They can't do anything. | 0:40:34 | 0:40:37 | |
So they thought they could do a raid | 0:40:37 | 0:40:39 | |
and liberate some of the church members? | 0:40:39 | 0:40:41 | |
They thought they could do a raid and liberate and find the | 0:40:41 | 0:40:45 | |
crazy shit going on. I mean, it's insane. | 0:40:45 | 0:40:47 | |
It is the most destructive... | 0:40:47 | 0:40:50 | |
"religion" cult I have ever read anything about or anything. | 0:40:50 | 0:40:54 | |
It is a fucking nightmare. | 0:40:54 | 0:40:56 | |
It really is. And I see people today, | 0:40:58 | 0:41:00 | |
I meet with people who still believe in a little bit of it. | 0:41:00 | 0:41:02 | |
I just want to shake them and go, "You've got to fucking stop." | 0:41:02 | 0:41:06 | |
It's a crock of shit. | 0:41:06 | 0:41:08 | |
We've come back to Hemet with Mark | 0:41:43 | 0:41:45 | |
and we'll be getting some shots of the base. | 0:41:45 | 0:41:48 | |
But I've also decided to drop off a reply to the latest letter | 0:41:48 | 0:41:51 | |
from the church's lawyers. | 0:41:51 | 0:41:53 | |
David Miscavige lives and works, most of the time, at the Int Base, | 0:42:03 | 0:42:07 | |
so it's very easy for me to... | 0:42:07 | 0:42:09 | |
..to drop off the letter. | 0:42:10 | 0:42:12 | |
It's just sort of saying, | 0:42:16 | 0:42:18 | |
you know, the letter that you sent us has been forwarded on to me, | 0:42:18 | 0:42:21 | |
and that you're concerned that we may be following a kind of | 0:42:21 | 0:42:24 | |
bigoted line, not giving Scientology the respect that it deserves. | 0:42:24 | 0:42:29 | |
Hello? | 0:42:29 | 0:42:30 | |
Oh, can I just give you a letter? | 0:42:30 | 0:42:32 | |
Can I just...? Hello? | 0:42:33 | 0:42:34 | |
-Excuse me, you're trespassing. -Let me just give you... | 0:42:34 | 0:42:36 | |
I've got a letter for Mr Miscavige. | 0:42:36 | 0:42:38 | |
-You're trespassing. -DOOR SLAMS | 0:42:38 | 0:42:40 | |
You're trespassing and, if you don't leave, | 0:42:41 | 0:42:43 | |
I'm going to have you arrested right now. | 0:42:43 | 0:42:44 | |
Can I deliver a letter, please? | 0:42:44 | 0:42:46 | |
LOUIS SIGHS | 0:42:48 | 0:42:49 | |
There's a bloke there, but he seems enturbulated. | 0:42:50 | 0:42:54 | |
It's almost like, just by receiving the letter, he seemed afraid that | 0:42:54 | 0:42:59 | |
he was in trouble or that it represented a threat to him. | 0:42:59 | 0:43:01 | |
We've been told it's a public road. | 0:43:09 | 0:43:10 | |
We own everything. We own that, we own every house on this property. | 0:43:10 | 0:43:13 | |
-The road? -We own everything here. | 0:43:13 | 0:43:16 | |
They have 100-foot right of way from there from the middle of that road. | 0:43:16 | 0:43:19 | |
This is our property. You need to leave. | 0:43:19 | 0:43:21 | |
-The road, I'm asking about the road. -Yes, it's our property. | 0:43:21 | 0:43:23 | |
-We're staying on this road. -This is not a public road. | 0:43:23 | 0:43:26 | |
This is not a county road. | 0:43:26 | 0:43:27 | |
This is our road. | 0:43:27 | 0:43:29 | |
We own everything on this place, | 0:43:29 | 0:43:30 | |
we own the golf course, we own every house along here. | 0:43:30 | 0:43:33 | |
You now need to leave. | 0:43:33 | 0:43:35 | |
-I'm trying to drop off a letter. -The police will be coming. | 0:43:35 | 0:43:38 | |
-We'll see if my partner gets any more information. -Yeah. | 0:43:43 | 0:43:46 | |
They're just probably pointing out to... | 0:43:46 | 0:43:48 | |
Yeah. We're not trying to get in there, on there, | 0:43:48 | 0:43:50 | |
we're not trying to climb on the fence, trying to have a stand out. | 0:43:50 | 0:43:53 | |
Where you guys from? | 0:43:53 | 0:43:54 | |
-London. -London? -From London, England. -How's the weather? | 0:43:54 | 0:43:57 | |
This is beautiful. Is it a little too hot or am I just imagining it? | 0:43:57 | 0:44:00 | |
And this is our...our film permit. | 0:44:02 | 0:44:04 | |
Do you know if it's a public road? | 0:44:05 | 0:44:06 | |
I believe they own the roadway | 0:44:06 | 0:44:08 | |
up to 50% from the centre of Santa Monica. | 0:44:08 | 0:44:10 | |
Look, if I'm six feet tall, say there's three of me from there, | 0:44:10 | 0:44:15 | |
three of me there, then easily it gets to that kerb, doesn't it? | 0:44:15 | 0:44:18 | |
Do you know why this guy is filming us? | 0:44:18 | 0:44:21 | |
It's not bothering you? | 0:44:21 | 0:44:23 | |
-That what? -That he's filming us? | 0:44:23 | 0:44:25 | |
-It doesn't bother me that you're filming us. -Oh, good. | 0:44:26 | 0:44:29 | |
-You guys have a good one, right? -No, I appreciate it. | 0:44:29 | 0:44:31 | |
OK. Thank you. | 0:44:31 | 0:44:33 | |
What's your name? | 0:44:33 | 0:44:35 | |
-You need to leave, too. -Yes, that's fine. | 0:44:37 | 0:44:40 | |
-Both of you. -Yeah. | 0:44:40 | 0:44:41 | |
What's your name? | 0:44:41 | 0:44:42 | |
We're done. Get in the car. | 0:44:44 | 0:44:45 | |
Are you in the Sea Org? | 0:44:46 | 0:44:48 | |
Thanks, guys. | 0:44:50 | 0:44:51 | |
-Did you see that? -Absolutely. | 0:45:00 | 0:45:01 | |
-We had a moment. -Yeah, absolutely. | 0:45:01 | 0:45:04 | |
Did you recognise the woman who came and talked to us? | 0:45:04 | 0:45:06 | |
Catherine Fraser. Yeah. | 0:45:06 | 0:45:07 | |
And she, Catherine Fraser, | 0:45:08 | 0:45:11 | |
her husband is a gentleman by the name of Jeff Hawkins... | 0:45:11 | 0:45:14 | |
-..who is another guy that left. -No. I've read his book. | 0:45:15 | 0:45:17 | |
And he wrote a book, Counterfeit Dreams. | 0:45:17 | 0:45:20 | |
He's the guy... | 0:45:20 | 0:45:21 | |
Who wrote a book about how he was many times, | 0:45:21 | 0:45:23 | |
or at least several times, beaten up by David Miscavige. | 0:45:23 | 0:45:26 | |
He was one of Miscavige's alleged... | 0:45:26 | 0:45:28 | |
-He was a punching bag. -Punching bag. | 0:45:29 | 0:45:32 | |
And then he blew. | 0:45:32 | 0:45:33 | |
We've brought Marty back. | 0:45:49 | 0:45:50 | |
And we're doing drills. | 0:45:51 | 0:45:54 | |
Marty's offered to take us through some of the Scientology TRs, | 0:45:54 | 0:45:57 | |
or training routines. | 0:45:57 | 0:45:59 | |
So this is my chance, and our actors' chance, | 0:45:59 | 0:46:02 | |
to experience the Scientology Tech, its technology, first-hand. | 0:46:02 | 0:46:07 | |
And Marty, when he was in Scientology, | 0:46:07 | 0:46:10 | |
was the Inspector General in charge of tech. | 0:46:10 | 0:46:13 | |
He used to maintain orthodoxy. | 0:46:13 | 0:46:15 | |
He made sure all the Hubbard written drills and processes | 0:46:15 | 0:46:19 | |
were implemented exactly correctly | 0:46:19 | 0:46:22 | |
and so who better than him to take us through drills today? | 0:46:22 | 0:46:27 | |
Hi. | 0:46:48 | 0:46:49 | |
-Are you filming? -Yes. -OK. | 0:46:49 | 0:46:51 | |
-Are you with him? -Yeah. | 0:46:53 | 0:46:54 | |
What are you filming? | 0:46:57 | 0:46:58 | |
Can you say? | 0:47:03 | 0:47:04 | |
We're just filming a documentary for us. | 0:47:06 | 0:47:08 | |
-For you? -Yeah. | 0:47:08 | 0:47:10 | |
-Can you tell me about it? -No. | 0:47:10 | 0:47:12 | |
Can you tell me about the scene you're filming? | 0:47:14 | 0:47:16 | |
I'm a freelance cameraman. I'm just working with her. | 0:47:18 | 0:47:21 | |
With her. What's your name? | 0:47:21 | 0:47:23 | |
Not going to say. | 0:47:23 | 0:47:24 | |
Can you tell me a little bit about why you're here? | 0:47:27 | 0:47:30 | |
We're just filming a documentary. | 0:47:32 | 0:47:34 | |
That's it. | 0:47:35 | 0:47:37 | |
Because you were filming us, so I just wondered if there was a reason. | 0:47:38 | 0:47:41 | |
We're just filming. | 0:47:47 | 0:47:49 | |
That's it. Is that OK or not? | 0:47:49 | 0:47:52 | |
Well, I'd just like to know, since you were filming me, | 0:47:52 | 0:47:54 | |
why you were filming me. | 0:47:54 | 0:47:55 | |
-Would you like to...? -I'm not answering this. | 0:47:57 | 0:48:00 | |
-Well, can you explain? -I'm a freelance cameraman. | 0:48:01 | 0:48:04 | |
-I'm just hired by her to... -Right. | 0:48:04 | 0:48:06 | |
But what did she tell you about what you were doing? | 0:48:06 | 0:48:08 | |
To just roll camera on... | 0:48:08 | 0:48:10 | |
-..on this location. -Come on, help me out. Just... | 0:48:11 | 0:48:14 | |
-She's in charge of this. -I'm happy to tell you about what I'm doing, | 0:48:14 | 0:48:17 | |
but I'd like you to tell me what you're doing. | 0:48:17 | 0:48:20 | |
I guess I can't help you on any of this. | 0:48:20 | 0:48:22 | |
You're going to have to talk to her. She's the one who called me. | 0:48:22 | 0:48:25 | |
I, honestly, I don't know. | 0:48:25 | 0:48:27 | |
You know, we don't have to be silly about this. | 0:48:28 | 0:48:30 | |
Why don't you just tell me what you're doing? | 0:48:30 | 0:48:32 | |
I'm more than happy to tell you about what we're working on. | 0:48:32 | 0:48:35 | |
Come back. Don't run away. | 0:48:39 | 0:48:40 | |
Did you know that we're doing a documentary about Scientology? | 0:48:46 | 0:48:49 | |
I think you're harassing me now. | 0:48:49 | 0:48:51 | |
Listen, you're filming me. How can I be harassing you? | 0:48:51 | 0:48:53 | |
Come back! | 0:48:56 | 0:48:57 | |
Stop running away. | 0:48:59 | 0:49:00 | |
-Do you see any of that unfold? -Yeah, yeah. | 0:49:02 | 0:49:05 | |
What's the big picture here? I mean... | 0:49:05 | 0:49:07 | |
Why are they doing this? | 0:49:09 | 0:49:10 | |
The big picture is... | 0:49:10 | 0:49:12 | |
..if you look into us, we will look into you ten times as much... | 0:49:13 | 0:49:18 | |
and we will make your life... | 0:49:18 | 0:49:20 | |
..too miserable to continue with what you're doing. | 0:49:21 | 0:49:25 | |
That's the point of it, that's the bigger picture. | 0:49:25 | 0:49:27 | |
Been there, done it on both sides. | 0:49:27 | 0:49:29 | |
On both sides. | 0:49:30 | 0:49:31 | |
-Are we gonna started? -Yeah, I think we're good to go - | 0:49:46 | 0:49:49 | |
whenever you want to. | 0:49:49 | 0:49:50 | |
-Hi. -Hi. | 0:49:51 | 0:49:52 | |
My name's Marty. | 0:49:52 | 0:49:54 | |
OK, so he said you were willing to participate in the drills... | 0:49:54 | 0:49:57 | |
-..for real, no? -Mm-hm. -Yeah? OK. | 0:49:58 | 0:50:00 | |
Student and coach sit facing each other with eyes closed. | 0:50:01 | 0:50:04 | |
There is no conversation. | 0:50:04 | 0:50:06 | |
It is a silent drill. There is no twitching, moving, simply be there. | 0:50:06 | 0:50:09 | |
What you can do is, is if you feel like you accomplish something on it, | 0:50:13 | 0:50:19 | |
just raise your hand. | 0:50:19 | 0:50:20 | |
Because we're not doing it under the official auspices of Scientology, | 0:50:25 | 0:50:29 | |
we're doing something that's called squirrelling | 0:50:29 | 0:50:31 | |
and, in Scientology, that is the crime of crimes. | 0:50:31 | 0:50:35 | |
Come on, Marty. Got anything to say? | 0:50:35 | 0:50:37 | |
You can't even defend yourself on this, can you? | 0:50:38 | 0:50:40 | |
-What's your name? -Why don't you answer his question? | 0:50:40 | 0:50:43 | |
-I'm with Squirrel Busters Productions. -Goofball outfit. | 0:50:43 | 0:50:46 | |
Squirrelling is heresy and squirrelling is the reason why, | 0:50:46 | 0:50:49 | |
for more than a year, | 0:50:49 | 0:50:50 | |
Marty was hounded and harassed by the Squirrel Busters. | 0:50:50 | 0:50:55 | |
They were busting him for attempting to set up | 0:50:55 | 0:50:58 | |
a rival church to Scientology. | 0:50:58 | 0:51:01 | |
Marty, knock it off. | 0:51:02 | 0:51:04 | |
Anything that is not official Scientology, authenticated tech, | 0:51:05 | 0:51:10 | |
is terrible, is deeply dangerous. | 0:51:10 | 0:51:15 | |
Woohoo! | 0:51:15 | 0:51:16 | |
And putting the entire fate of the planet, and not just this planet, | 0:51:16 | 0:51:20 | |
all planets in the universe at risk, | 0:51:20 | 0:51:23 | |
because you're not doing it correctly. | 0:51:23 | 0:51:26 | |
How you doing, Mr Squirrel?! | 0:51:26 | 0:51:29 | |
And then debate becomes, well, is that because they want to | 0:51:29 | 0:51:32 | |
maintain a monopoly over the practises because their | 0:51:32 | 0:51:36 | |
whole business model is to do with selling these services? | 0:51:36 | 0:51:40 | |
Start. | 0:51:40 | 0:51:41 | |
You are one ugly motherfucker, you know that? | 0:51:41 | 0:51:43 | |
Flunk, ever so slightly. | 0:51:43 | 0:51:45 | |
Start. You are one ugly motherfucker, you know that? | 0:51:46 | 0:51:49 | |
OK. | 0:51:51 | 0:51:52 | |
Flunk, you twitched. This is the make or break point here. | 0:51:53 | 0:51:56 | |
Now you're going to teach somebody how to have some forbearance | 0:51:56 | 0:51:59 | |
and tolerance and ability to take some shit. | 0:51:59 | 0:52:02 | |
You know? This is the most highly criticised drill, | 0:52:02 | 0:52:05 | |
but it's the most highly sworn by drill, too. | 0:52:05 | 0:52:07 | |
It's called Bullbait. OK. | 0:52:08 | 0:52:09 | |
You're not a very good journalist, are you? | 0:52:13 | 0:52:16 | |
You're really bad at it. | 0:52:17 | 0:52:19 | |
This is probably the best you're going to do. | 0:52:19 | 0:52:21 | |
Your wife really doesn't love you... | 0:52:26 | 0:52:27 | |
..at all. | 0:52:30 | 0:52:32 | |
She's fucking some other guy right now. | 0:52:32 | 0:52:34 | |
It's probably someone you know. | 0:52:35 | 0:52:36 | |
It's probably your brother, | 0:52:38 | 0:52:39 | |
if you have a brother, or a relative of yours. | 0:52:39 | 0:52:42 | |
Your boyfriend's having sex in another room. | 0:52:45 | 0:52:47 | |
God, he's really good. I don't even know what to say. What do I do? | 0:52:52 | 0:52:55 | |
-Let me do something. -OK. -Let me take over for a second. | 0:52:55 | 0:52:58 | |
Let me see. | 0:52:58 | 0:52:59 | |
OK, John, I'm going to do a little drilling with you, OK? | 0:53:00 | 0:53:03 | |
Louis. | 0:53:03 | 0:53:04 | |
Start. | 0:53:04 | 0:53:05 | |
HE SHOUTS | 0:53:11 | 0:53:12 | |
Jesus. Do we have to do that? | 0:53:12 | 0:53:13 | |
I hate you! | 0:53:13 | 0:53:14 | |
Face me comfortably, OK? | 0:53:14 | 0:53:17 | |
HE SHOUTS | 0:53:17 | 0:53:18 | |
-Flunk! -Can we not do that one? | 0:53:18 | 0:53:19 | |
-We've got to flatten it now. -I don't like loud noises. | 0:53:19 | 0:53:22 | |
Now that it's started, we have to flatten it. | 0:53:22 | 0:53:24 | |
We're going to flatten this button, OK? | 0:53:24 | 0:53:26 | |
Start. | 0:53:27 | 0:53:28 | |
HE SHOUTS | 0:53:28 | 0:53:29 | |
I think if you've seen in the public eye | 0:53:32 | 0:53:34 | |
people who are prominent Scientologists, | 0:53:34 | 0:53:36 | |
they have a sort of very forceful bearing and intentional type | 0:53:36 | 0:53:40 | |
of personality - | 0:53:40 | 0:53:41 | |
that's essentially what these things drill in. | 0:53:41 | 0:53:44 | |
Purpose - to make student clearly achieve tone 40 commands. | 0:53:50 | 0:53:53 | |
-Tone 40. -The highest tone. -The highest tone. | 0:53:55 | 0:53:58 | |
So they'd be the most effective commands? | 0:53:58 | 0:54:00 | |
The most effective command. It's an effortless thing, ultimately. | 0:54:00 | 0:54:03 | |
First, locate the space in which the object is located. | 0:54:03 | 0:54:09 | |
-You see that space? -Yes, I do. | 0:54:11 | 0:54:13 | |
Locate the object in that space. | 0:54:13 | 0:54:15 | |
OK. | 0:54:15 | 0:54:17 | |
Command the object in the loudest possible voice he can muster. | 0:54:17 | 0:54:21 | |
Now, we're going to get into the commands, | 0:54:21 | 0:54:23 | |
which are - stand up, thank you, sit down in that chair. | 0:54:23 | 0:54:26 | |
Right? | 0:54:26 | 0:54:27 | |
OK. Put one hand on each side. | 0:54:28 | 0:54:31 | |
OK, good. | 0:54:31 | 0:54:33 | |
So, command it is loudly as you can. | 0:54:33 | 0:54:35 | |
Stand up! | 0:54:37 | 0:54:39 | |
Have it comply. | 0:54:39 | 0:54:41 | |
Acknowledge it as loudly as you can. | 0:54:41 | 0:54:43 | |
Thank you! | 0:54:43 | 0:54:44 | |
Command it as loudly as you can. | 0:54:44 | 0:54:46 | |
Sit down in that chair! | 0:54:47 | 0:54:49 | |
Thank you. | 0:54:49 | 0:54:51 | |
Now have it comply. | 0:54:51 | 0:54:52 | |
-Now... -Thank you! | 0:54:54 | 0:54:56 | |
OK, good. | 0:54:56 | 0:54:58 | |
All right, now do this. | 0:54:58 | 0:55:00 | |
Think the thought, "I am a wildflower." | 0:55:00 | 0:55:02 | |
OK, good. Think the thought that you are sitting in a chair. | 0:55:06 | 0:55:09 | |
Imagine the thought, that thought of you sitting in a chair, | 0:55:12 | 0:55:15 | |
imagine that thought being in that ashtray. | 0:55:15 | 0:55:18 | |
-Imagine it. -OK. | 0:55:18 | 0:55:20 | |
Now get the ashtray thinking that it is an ashtray. | 0:55:20 | 0:55:23 | |
You know, I'm going along with this, | 0:55:23 | 0:55:24 | |
but it isn't making a whole lot of sense. | 0:55:24 | 0:55:26 | |
-OK. -But is that OK? | 0:55:26 | 0:55:28 | |
-Well, it's imagination. -OK. | 0:55:28 | 0:55:30 | |
I'm telling you, put in the ashtray | 0:55:30 | 0:55:31 | |
the intention to remain where it is. | 0:55:31 | 0:55:33 | |
-OK. -OK. Do you get that at all? | 0:55:35 | 0:55:38 | |
Well, I'm imagining it having a little voice saying, | 0:55:38 | 0:55:41 | |
"I'm going to remain where I am." | 0:55:41 | 0:55:43 | |
OK, all right. | 0:55:43 | 0:55:44 | |
Get the idea of putting a thought into my mind about | 0:55:44 | 0:55:49 | |
whether to continue this drill or to dump it. | 0:55:49 | 0:55:52 | |
One way or the other, I want you to put that intention right back here, | 0:55:53 | 0:55:58 | |
whether I should continue this drill or I should dump it. | 0:55:58 | 0:56:00 | |
You want me to continue the drill. | 0:56:02 | 0:56:04 | |
-Yes. -OK, good. I got that. | 0:56:04 | 0:56:05 | |
And we always end up by the portraits of Hubbard. | 0:56:07 | 0:56:09 | |
Let's give a hand to him, and everybody stands up. | 0:56:10 | 0:56:13 | |
If we wanted to do that, would you be comfortable with us doing it? | 0:56:13 | 0:56:16 | |
-You can do it, but I'm going to go. -If we all visualise the picture... | 0:56:16 | 0:56:19 | |
I mean, I advise you guys not to do it, | 0:56:19 | 0:56:20 | |
but if you want to join this guy's cult, that's OK with me. | 0:56:20 | 0:56:24 | |
Just get a sense of what it feels like. | 0:56:24 | 0:56:26 | |
It might not even feel weird. | 0:56:26 | 0:56:28 | |
I mean, Conor's up for it. | 0:56:28 | 0:56:30 | |
I don't want to do it if it's going to annoy you, Marty. | 0:56:30 | 0:56:32 | |
No, go ahead and do it. I'm just not participating, that's all. | 0:56:32 | 0:56:35 | |
The other thing that goes with it, Louis, | 0:56:35 | 0:56:38 | |
is everything positive that happens to you... | 0:56:38 | 0:56:40 | |
..you get validated by attributing it to what you learned from Hubbard. | 0:56:42 | 0:56:45 | |
Everything negative that happens to you, you're counselled that it's | 0:56:45 | 0:56:49 | |
your lack of application of what you did learn. | 0:56:49 | 0:56:52 | |
And then it really becomes mind control, by definition. | 0:56:52 | 0:56:56 | |
And that's the game. That's why I don't even want to participate | 0:56:56 | 0:56:59 | |
-in it. -You don't seriously... | 0:56:59 | 0:57:00 | |
I figured the whole mouse trap out and I just don't want | 0:57:00 | 0:57:03 | |
to engage in it. That's all. | 0:57:03 | 0:57:05 | |
I'm not participating in that shit. | 0:57:05 | 0:57:07 | |
MICROPHONE FEEDBACK | 0:57:07 | 0:57:08 | |
Let's give a hand to LRH! | 0:57:08 | 0:57:10 | |
You see, I think the whole thing was a freaking failure. | 0:57:15 | 0:57:17 | |
You want to know why? | 0:57:17 | 0:57:19 | |
Because they went ahead and did what he suggested after I went through | 0:57:19 | 0:57:22 | |
all that work to try to get them to become self-determined | 0:57:22 | 0:57:25 | |
and able to exercise intention. | 0:57:25 | 0:57:28 | |
And they all went and followed this new cult leader... | 0:57:28 | 0:57:31 | |
..the Louis Theroux cult. | 0:57:32 | 0:57:34 | |
Is he all right? | 0:57:38 | 0:57:40 | |
Do you find my questions inane, in general? | 0:57:56 | 0:57:59 | |
In general, no. I'm just... | 0:58:00 | 0:58:02 | |
But the ones you're asking now, I mean, I find... | 0:58:03 | 0:58:07 | |
I just don't understand why you're asking them like you're asking. | 0:58:07 | 0:58:11 | |
At this point, I've spent so many hours with you... | 0:58:11 | 0:58:13 | |
..and then you make everything sound so pedestrian. | 0:58:14 | 0:58:16 | |
I don't know what... You're wanting me to... | 0:58:16 | 0:58:18 | |
I've told the story, like, I don't know how many times. | 0:58:18 | 0:58:21 | |
You want me to tell you again? | 0:58:21 | 0:58:22 | |
I mean, we went through this last time I was here. | 0:58:22 | 0:58:25 | |
I got into the whole freaking thing. | 0:58:25 | 0:58:26 | |
I remember, these are the same questions coming again. | 0:58:26 | 0:58:30 | |
Like, you're going to get a different answer now? | 0:58:30 | 0:58:32 | |
Or you're going to find an inconsistency? | 0:58:32 | 0:58:35 | |
You know, what's the purpose of this? | 0:58:35 | 0:58:38 | |
Yesterday, it seemed like a couple of times, maybe, I was getting | 0:58:38 | 0:58:41 | |
on your nerves a little bit. | 0:58:41 | 0:58:43 | |
Is that a statement? | 0:58:47 | 0:58:48 | |
I'm sorry you got that impression. | 0:58:51 | 0:58:53 | |
Ask me something that truly puzzles you, | 0:59:05 | 0:59:08 | |
that you think I might have the answer to... | 0:59:08 | 0:59:10 | |
..that you haven't asked me six times already. | 0:59:11 | 0:59:13 | |
What did it feel like punching Marc Headley? | 0:59:17 | 0:59:19 | |
Er... It hurt my... It hurt. | 0:59:22 | 0:59:26 | |
It hurt my fist. | 0:59:28 | 0:59:29 | |
The guy is built like a tank. | 0:59:30 | 0:59:31 | |
We've had another letter. | 0:59:47 | 0:59:49 | |
To be honest with you, we've had a couple more letters | 0:59:49 | 0:59:51 | |
and they are similar in tone, | 0:59:51 | 0:59:53 | |
and what they basically say is, you are embarked on a project | 0:59:53 | 0:59:59 | |
that is run through with religious bigotry. | 0:59:59 | 1:00:02 | |
The church's version of events is that they do massive amounts | 1:00:02 | 1:00:07 | |
of good work, social betterment programmes, | 1:00:07 | 1:00:09 | |
they alleviate illiteracy, drug addiction... | 1:00:09 | 1:00:12 | |
..criminal behaviour, they do disaster relief. | 1:00:14 | 1:00:17 | |
And what we're doing is ignoring all of that | 1:00:20 | 1:00:22 | |
and focusing on a tiny handful of disgruntled ex-members. | 1:00:22 | 1:00:26 | |
And that Marty Rathbun, in particular, is a deeply unstable | 1:00:27 | 1:00:32 | |
and untrustworthy figure with a vendetta against the church. | 1:00:32 | 1:00:36 | |
These are letters from Carter-Ruck, | 1:00:37 | 1:00:39 | |
the lawyers retained by the Church of Scientology, | 1:00:39 | 1:00:43 | |
and they were sent to me. | 1:00:43 | 1:00:44 | |
"These are from Mr Rathbun's weblog, describing the leader of the | 1:00:57 | 1:01:01 | |
"Scientology religion as 'Ayatollah Miscavige' | 1:01:01 | 1:01:05 | |
"and the Church of Scientology as 'Radical Scientology', | 1:01:05 | 1:01:09 | |
"which is obviously abusive and offensive of both Mr Miscavige | 1:01:09 | 1:01:14 | |
"and the Church." Well, first of all... | 1:01:14 | 1:01:16 | |
..I think it's an understatement, if anything. | 1:01:20 | 1:01:22 | |
"Mr Rathbun has an extensive repertoire of misrepresenting | 1:01:24 | 1:01:26 | |
"his position. For instance, he worked as an external... | 1:01:26 | 1:01:30 | |
"in an external affairs position when in the Church | 1:01:30 | 1:01:33 | |
"and never served in an ecclesiastical management role, | 1:01:33 | 1:01:35 | |
"contrary to his claim." | 1:01:35 | 1:01:36 | |
This is absurd. | 1:01:40 | 1:01:41 | |
There's absurd things in these letters that you're taking | 1:01:41 | 1:01:44 | |
-for granted. -What was your issue with that one? | 1:01:44 | 1:01:47 | |
Because I was the Inspector General. | 1:01:47 | 1:01:49 | |
Which is what? What did you do? | 1:01:49 | 1:01:50 | |
Which is actually the highest ecclesiastical position | 1:01:50 | 1:01:54 | |
contemplated ever by L Ron Hubbard. | 1:01:54 | 1:01:57 | |
I was the baddest ass dude in Scientology. | 1:01:57 | 1:02:01 | |
The highest level... | 1:02:02 | 1:02:03 | |
The hierarchy of the Church of Scientology was absolutely | 1:02:03 | 1:02:06 | |
at the beck and call of me. | 1:02:06 | 1:02:08 | |
When you look back at the stuff you did, | 1:02:08 | 1:02:10 | |
what is the stuff you most regret? | 1:02:10 | 1:02:12 | |
Why are you jumping to that? | 1:02:12 | 1:02:14 | |
You ask me these questions that act as if what happened | 1:02:14 | 1:02:16 | |
in a one-minute period is who I was for 28 years. | 1:02:16 | 1:02:20 | |
It's bullshit. | 1:02:20 | 1:02:21 | |
As I've spent time with Marty, | 1:02:22 | 1:02:24 | |
it's become clear he is a double-edged figure. | 1:02:24 | 1:02:27 | |
Both the chief whistle-blower, but also, | 1:02:28 | 1:02:31 | |
as the Church's own documents make clear, in his time, | 1:02:31 | 1:02:36 | |
the chief enforcer. | 1:02:36 | 1:02:37 | |
One of the most notorious episodes | 1:02:39 | 1:02:41 | |
was when he was Inspector General. | 1:02:41 | 1:02:44 | |
Marty claims he arranged for a top Scientology defector to be tailed by | 1:02:44 | 1:02:48 | |
two PIs because they thought he might have absconded | 1:02:48 | 1:02:52 | |
with some religious writings of Hubbard's. | 1:02:52 | 1:02:54 | |
And the tailing apparently continued for around 20 years. | 1:02:55 | 1:02:59 | |
So you could argue that Marty went along with the regime | 1:03:00 | 1:03:03 | |
until he fell out of favour. | 1:03:03 | 1:03:05 | |
By Marty's account, in 2004, he'd been away on assignment | 1:03:06 | 1:03:11 | |
and he returned to the Int Base to find that David Miscavige | 1:03:11 | 1:03:14 | |
had created this punishment area for upper management | 1:03:14 | 1:03:18 | |
called the SP Hole. | 1:03:18 | 1:03:19 | |
And within weeks, Marty himself had been sent there | 1:03:23 | 1:03:26 | |
and it was only then that he blew. | 1:03:26 | 1:03:29 | |
You know, if those are Scientologists, they're not SPs, | 1:03:32 | 1:03:35 | |
they're not outsiders. So why are they going into the Hole? | 1:03:35 | 1:03:37 | |
Well, Miscavige says that they are SPs, who are working against him | 1:03:37 | 1:03:41 | |
and trying to get him to fail. | 1:03:41 | 1:03:43 | |
And they were sleeping in there, they would eat their meals in there, | 1:03:43 | 1:03:46 | |
and you can imagine if you have 30 or 40 people living | 1:03:46 | 1:03:50 | |
in an office space, 24 hours a day, for weeks and months, | 1:03:50 | 1:03:54 | |
you can imagine what it was like. | 1:03:54 | 1:03:57 | |
It was just dirty and degraded. | 1:03:57 | 1:03:59 | |
This is something I was awarded when I got Dianetics | 1:04:08 | 1:04:12 | |
on the bestseller list. | 1:04:12 | 1:04:13 | |
-Oh, see, this is interesting. -A leather-bound copy. | 1:04:13 | 1:04:16 | |
Let me grab some other photos, if I can find them. | 1:04:16 | 1:04:19 | |
That's some photos of my third wife, Catherine. | 1:04:21 | 1:04:25 | |
You know, I went down to the Int Base and I met Catherine Fraser. | 1:04:27 | 1:04:31 | |
-My ex, yeah. -Your ex-wife. | 1:04:31 | 1:04:33 | |
I think she, at heart, is a good person | 1:04:33 | 1:04:36 | |
that's trapped in a not so good system. | 1:04:36 | 1:04:38 | |
But I know that she's a good person at heart. | 1:04:40 | 1:04:42 | |
I've also been spending a bit of time with Marty Rathbun. | 1:04:42 | 1:04:46 | |
What was the impression of Marty at the base? | 1:04:46 | 1:04:48 | |
How was he viewed? | 1:04:49 | 1:04:51 | |
He was... | 1:04:51 | 1:04:52 | |
..tough, uncompromising and... | 1:04:53 | 1:04:57 | |
Liked? | 1:04:57 | 1:04:58 | |
Not really. | 1:05:01 | 1:05:02 | |
Feared, maybe. | 1:05:02 | 1:05:04 | |
That atmosphere brings out the worst in people. | 1:05:04 | 1:05:06 | |
Either they submit or they become one of the predators. | 1:05:07 | 1:05:11 | |
You know? And Marty, for a while, was one of the predators there. | 1:05:11 | 1:05:15 | |
And in a sense, he was the Mr Fix It for David Miscavige | 1:05:15 | 1:05:18 | |
-and did some of the dirty work. -Oh, yeah. Yeah. | 1:05:18 | 1:05:22 | |
And I don't think he's... | 1:05:22 | 1:05:23 | |
divulged all, I'll just say that. | 1:05:23 | 1:05:26 | |
-You don't think so? -I don't think he's divulged everything. | 1:05:26 | 1:05:29 | |
What makes you say that? | 1:05:29 | 1:05:30 | |
Well, cos I've read all of his books and his columns | 1:05:30 | 1:05:34 | |
and stuff like that, and I just get the feeling he's tiptoeing around | 1:05:34 | 1:05:38 | |
some subjects, you know. | 1:05:38 | 1:05:39 | |
Marty knows where all the bodies are buried. | 1:05:40 | 1:05:43 | |
This was the escape route. I was coming the other direction. | 1:05:50 | 1:05:53 | |
The base is about five miles down that way. | 1:05:53 | 1:05:55 | |
-This was your escape route? -Yeah, I was on my motorcycle. | 1:05:57 | 1:05:59 | |
It was about, oh, low 40s, raining. | 1:05:59 | 1:06:02 | |
-Were you pursued? -I don't know. | 1:06:02 | 1:06:05 | |
I didn't see anybody. But I just went like a bat out of hell | 1:06:05 | 1:06:07 | |
and I went down this road here. | 1:06:07 | 1:06:09 | |
When you blew, this is the way you came? | 1:06:09 | 1:06:11 | |
-Yeah. -When you fled the Hole? | 1:06:11 | 1:06:13 | |
Yes, sir. | 1:06:13 | 1:06:15 | |
So the idea is just to re-enact some of the events | 1:06:15 | 1:06:18 | |
-that you lived through, Marty... -Uh-huh. | 1:06:18 | 1:06:22 | |
-..using... -And you want to have the environment to be similar. | 1:06:22 | 1:06:25 | |
Yeah, I want to do it as close to the real place as we can. | 1:06:25 | 1:06:29 | |
Well, it was all inside. | 1:06:31 | 1:06:32 | |
So you could literally recreate it anywhere. | 1:06:34 | 1:06:36 | |
I think we're good. What do you think? | 1:06:38 | 1:06:40 | |
-Have a look. I can't see anything. -Have a look. | 1:06:40 | 1:06:43 | |
Oh, this is great. | 1:06:43 | 1:06:44 | |
So what did you think of the lines? | 1:06:49 | 1:06:51 | |
-What lines? -These, the ones that I... | 1:06:51 | 1:06:52 | |
They sucked, they're unnatural. | 1:06:52 | 1:06:54 | |
-They're from your book. -You've got to be natural. | 1:06:54 | 1:06:56 | |
It just comes out like a flood. | 1:06:56 | 1:06:57 | |
Do we think we're going to put trailers out here | 1:06:57 | 1:06:59 | |
or do you think that we would do just as well doing it in a set | 1:06:59 | 1:07:03 | |
-in LA? -Better. -Better? -Better. -Why? | 1:07:03 | 1:07:06 | |
You don't have the logistical problem of bringing all these actors | 1:07:06 | 1:07:09 | |
out here. This is a logistics nightmare out here. | 1:07:09 | 1:07:12 | |
OK? You've got to create that claustrophobia, you know? | 1:07:12 | 1:07:15 | |
It's nondescript, cheap-ass sort of office set-up. | 1:07:15 | 1:07:19 | |
Well, we'll figure that stuff out. | 1:07:19 | 1:07:21 | |
Hey, before we lose the light, Marty, | 1:07:21 | 1:07:23 | |
I was going to take Andrew just by the base, by the Int Base. | 1:07:23 | 1:07:27 | |
He expressed an interest in doing that. | 1:07:27 | 1:07:29 | |
-You don't want to go by the base, do you? -No. | 1:07:29 | 1:07:31 | |
There's that red car that was there for a long time...that Marty was in. | 1:07:43 | 1:07:47 | |
We're going to lose the light. We better get down there. | 1:07:49 | 1:07:51 | |
What is this...? | 1:08:03 | 1:08:04 | |
"Road closed"? What? | 1:08:04 | 1:08:06 | |
Was this closed last time? | 1:08:06 | 1:08:07 | |
No. Can they do that? | 1:08:07 | 1:08:09 | |
Lights. | 1:08:11 | 1:08:12 | |
Oh, shit. | 1:08:15 | 1:08:17 | |
-What? That's us. -Oh. | 1:08:17 | 1:08:18 | |
That's barbed wire? | 1:08:25 | 1:08:27 | |
I think that's some kind of barbed wire or spikes on top of there. | 1:08:28 | 1:08:32 | |
Spikes? Yeah. | 1:08:32 | 1:08:33 | |
-Whoa. -Oh. That is actually quite helpful. | 1:08:33 | 1:08:35 | |
And there are cameras there as well. | 1:08:38 | 1:08:40 | |
OK. | 1:08:42 | 1:08:43 | |
Is it trying to communicate something? | 1:08:47 | 1:08:49 | |
-Why is it flashing? -You guys are trespassing and you need to leave, | 1:08:53 | 1:08:56 | |
or I'm going to call the cops. | 1:08:56 | 1:08:58 | |
-Hi, how are you doing? -You're trespassing. | 1:08:58 | 1:09:00 | |
You need to leave or I'm calling the cops. | 1:09:00 | 1:09:03 | |
It's OK, we have a permit. | 1:09:03 | 1:09:05 | |
For the third time, you're trespassing. | 1:09:05 | 1:09:08 | |
You need to leave or I'm calling the cops. | 1:09:08 | 1:09:10 | |
-We have a permit, it's fine. -Leave. | 1:09:10 | 1:09:12 | |
We've got a permit, sir. | 1:09:13 | 1:09:15 | |
Are we allowed to leave? | 1:09:16 | 1:09:18 | |
-Are we allowed to leave? -Yeah, while he's calling the cops? | 1:09:18 | 1:09:20 | |
Or is that somehow... | 1:09:20 | 1:09:22 | |
-..not allowed? -Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think so. | 1:09:23 | 1:09:25 | |
-I think that's what they want. They want us to leave. -OK. | 1:09:25 | 1:09:27 | |
Well, it doesn't seem like we're doing much else here, right? | 1:09:27 | 1:09:30 | |
Are you OK? | 1:09:30 | 1:09:31 | |
-I'm fine. -You're not worried about it? | 1:09:31 | 1:09:33 | |
Well, the way that guy was barking at us. | 1:09:33 | 1:09:36 | |
But he was using tone 40. | 1:09:36 | 1:09:37 | |
-I'm serious. -I think it was like tone 20. | 1:09:38 | 1:09:41 | |
-You think 20? -Yeah. | 1:09:41 | 1:09:42 | |
INDISTINCT CHATTER | 1:09:47 | 1:09:50 | |
You can't see where I'm calling? | 1:09:53 | 1:09:54 | |
Yeah. | 1:09:56 | 1:09:57 | |
Hello. | 1:09:59 | 1:10:00 | |
-Did you want to see the permit? -One is from England. | 1:10:01 | 1:10:03 | |
I know he's a BBC reporter. I have no idea his name. | 1:10:03 | 1:10:07 | |
Louis. | 1:10:07 | 1:10:09 | |
-Louis? -Louis. -OK, the road's closed, | 1:10:09 | 1:10:11 | |
you're trespassing and you need to leave. | 1:10:11 | 1:10:13 | |
Apparently, it's a public road. | 1:10:13 | 1:10:15 | |
-No, it isn't. -And we have a... | 1:10:15 | 1:10:16 | |
-No, you don't. -But can I just show you the permit? -No, it isn't. | 1:10:16 | 1:10:19 | |
-It isn't a public road. -Look. -It's trespassing. | 1:10:19 | 1:10:21 | |
Catherine, Catherine... Whoa, whoa, you're assaulting me. | 1:10:21 | 1:10:24 | |
You see that thing? It says "road closed". | 1:10:24 | 1:10:26 | |
-Look. -No, look. -Look. -Come here, come here. -Let me show you. | 1:10:26 | 1:10:29 | |
No, come on. What's your name, Lewis? | 1:10:29 | 1:10:31 | |
-Louis. -Louis. | 1:10:31 | 1:10:32 | |
Look, are you so stupid you cannot see the sign | 1:10:32 | 1:10:35 | |
that says "road closed"? | 1:10:35 | 1:10:36 | |
-But look... -Is there anything about that that you don't understand? | 1:10:36 | 1:10:40 | |
-Closed? -Well, look, I've got a permit... | 1:10:40 | 1:10:42 | |
Do you know what a road means? It's closed. | 1:10:42 | 1:10:45 | |
-We don't want... -The road is closed. -..to create any issue for you. | 1:10:45 | 1:10:48 | |
And I don't want him filming me, so tell him to stop. | 1:10:48 | 1:10:50 | |
-Well, you're filming us. -Tell him to stop. | 1:10:50 | 1:10:52 | |
Well, you tell him to stop. | 1:10:52 | 1:10:54 | |
-Tell him to stop. -You tell him to stop and I'll tell him to stop. | 1:10:54 | 1:10:57 | |
-How about that? -Stop. | 1:10:57 | 1:10:58 | |
-Tell him to stop. -Louis, you need to leave. | 1:10:58 | 1:11:00 | |
Catherine, we don't need to leave. | 1:11:00 | 1:11:02 | |
-Yes, you do. -Catherine, we don't. -You're trespassing. -We're not. | 1:11:02 | 1:11:05 | |
Well, you're not trespassing now. You can stay here all night. | 1:11:05 | 1:11:08 | |
Thank you. Catherine... Catherine, what are you angry about? | 1:11:08 | 1:11:12 | |
-You're going to stand there... -My deep desire is actually | 1:11:12 | 1:11:14 | |
-to speak to someone from the Sea Org. -Right. | 1:11:14 | 1:11:16 | |
-Oh, right. -So you're actually doing me quite a big favour. | 1:11:16 | 1:11:19 | |
Oh, Louis. Oh, yeah. You're like... Oh, yeah, you're so honest. | 1:11:19 | 1:11:22 | |
Oh, yeah. | 1:11:22 | 1:11:23 | |
Yeah. You take the stars in honesty. | 1:11:23 | 1:11:26 | |
So this is good. Let's just keep the conversation going. | 1:11:26 | 1:11:28 | |
No, we're done. Bye, Louis. | 1:11:28 | 1:11:30 | |
You don't have to go. You're not trespassing. | 1:11:30 | 1:11:33 | |
-Wait until the police come. -We'd like you to stay. | 1:11:33 | 1:11:35 | |
Catherine? | 1:11:36 | 1:11:37 | |
Can we talk to you? | 1:11:39 | 1:11:40 | |
Are you in the Sea Org as well? | 1:11:41 | 1:11:43 | |
Are you making a documentary as well? | 1:11:58 | 1:12:00 | |
And if so, who is your one for? | 1:12:04 | 1:12:05 | |
Catherine, I think we're going to go, OK? | 1:12:23 | 1:12:26 | |
Just so you know. | 1:12:27 | 1:12:29 | |
All right? | 1:12:29 | 1:12:30 | |
-MARTY: -You guys are missing all the action inside the terminal. | 1:13:08 | 1:13:11 | |
I've got Marc Yager, | 1:13:11 | 1:13:12 | |
Jenny De Vocht and Dave Bloomberg, another Int guy... | 1:13:12 | 1:13:16 | |
..sort of getting in my face here. I've got it on video tape. | 1:13:18 | 1:13:20 | |
You guys might be interested in it. | 1:13:20 | 1:13:22 | |
Anyway, you're missing the fireworks. | 1:13:33 | 1:13:36 | |
So a call's just come in from Marty saying that once | 1:13:39 | 1:13:43 | |
he'd got through security, there were three prominent Scientologists | 1:13:43 | 1:13:47 | |
on the other side. | 1:13:47 | 1:13:49 | |
So they've started again, squirrel busting. | 1:14:02 | 1:14:04 | |
Can you move on, please? | 1:14:07 | 1:14:09 | |
Can you guys move on, please? | 1:14:10 | 1:14:12 | |
They're behaving in a way that's so obviously pathological. | 1:14:49 | 1:14:52 | |
You would think that they would realise | 1:14:52 | 1:14:54 | |
that other people would see that and think, | 1:14:54 | 1:14:56 | |
"This is a religion of lunatics." | 1:14:56 | 1:14:58 | |
They are doing it for one audience, which is David Miscavige. | 1:15:00 | 1:15:04 | |
They are trying to prove that they are loyal to him... | 1:15:05 | 1:15:08 | |
..because he holds all the strings, | 1:15:09 | 1:15:12 | |
he has the ultimate power in Scientology. | 1:15:12 | 1:15:15 | |
He could banish them from Scientology with a word. | 1:15:15 | 1:15:19 | |
He holds your eternity in his hand. | 1:15:19 | 1:15:21 | |
So it's not just the threat of death, it's the threat of... | 1:15:21 | 1:15:24 | |
..really dying over and over again in ignorance... | 1:15:26 | 1:15:29 | |
..and darkness, and that's what they think is in store for them. | 1:15:30 | 1:15:33 | |
He has ultimate spiritual power over Scientologists. | 1:15:33 | 1:15:38 | |
He says who goes up the bridge and who doesn't go up the bridge. | 1:15:38 | 1:15:42 | |
You know? And he can bar you from Scientology for ever | 1:15:42 | 1:15:45 | |
if you cross him and he knows that. | 1:15:45 | 1:15:48 | |
He knows the power that he's got, the same power Hubbard had. | 1:15:48 | 1:15:51 | |
You worked with David Miscavige quite a bit. | 1:16:16 | 1:16:18 | |
-Oh, yeah. -He didn't like you much, did he? | 1:16:18 | 1:16:21 | |
No, no. | 1:16:21 | 1:16:22 | |
He physically beat me up on about five separate occasions. | 1:16:22 | 1:16:28 | |
There was one case where I was in a meeting with him, | 1:16:28 | 1:16:31 | |
I was presenting an infomercial script that I had worked on. | 1:16:31 | 1:16:34 | |
He hated it and he's getting himself worked up and worked up | 1:16:34 | 1:16:36 | |
and worked up, and finally he jumps up on the conference room table - | 1:16:36 | 1:16:39 | |
he's a little guy, but he's like, you know, muscular - | 1:16:39 | 1:16:42 | |
jumps up on the conference room table, launches himself at me, | 1:16:42 | 1:16:46 | |
knocks me back against a partition, | 1:16:46 | 1:16:48 | |
is beating my face and then he knocks me on the floor. | 1:16:48 | 1:16:51 | |
And then he stalks out of the room, and there was like | 1:16:53 | 1:16:55 | |
literally 30 or 40 top executives in that room. | 1:16:55 | 1:16:59 | |
And they're saying, "Get up, get up. | 1:16:59 | 1:17:01 | |
"You don't want to make him wrong." | 1:17:01 | 1:17:03 | |
You know, like if I... | 1:17:03 | 1:17:04 | |
If I laid there all scratched up and torn, that would be making | 1:17:05 | 1:17:09 | |
him wrong and that would be terrible. | 1:17:09 | 1:17:11 | |
This is the re-enactment, which we've been talking about doing. | 1:17:29 | 1:17:32 | |
And Marty's here and we've got our set, as discussed with him. | 1:17:32 | 1:17:36 | |
We've got actors, we've got a script written by Marty, | 1:17:36 | 1:17:40 | |
based on what allegedly happened at the Gold Base around the time of | 1:17:40 | 1:17:44 | |
the Hole, so we're going to improvise based on that. | 1:17:44 | 1:17:48 | |
And we have as well in the background, | 1:17:48 | 1:17:51 | |
although I haven't told Marty this yet, but we have Tom Cruise. | 1:17:51 | 1:17:54 | |
I'm not suggesting that he was at the Int Base at this time, | 1:17:58 | 1:18:02 | |
or that he knew what was going on, but as Scientology's poster boy, | 1:18:02 | 1:18:07 | |
whatever happened in Scientology, for good or ill, | 1:18:07 | 1:18:10 | |
carries his name on it. | 1:18:10 | 1:18:12 | |
Welcome to the Hole. | 1:18:23 | 1:18:25 | |
This is a re-creation of the watchdog committee conference room, | 1:18:26 | 1:18:30 | |
which was at the International Base out in Riverside, California. | 1:18:30 | 1:18:33 | |
There was a guard at the door, meals were brought in, | 1:18:33 | 1:18:36 | |
sleeping bags were put on the floor, people had to sleep there. | 1:18:36 | 1:18:38 | |
Miscavige then reading in all of these evil intentions | 1:18:38 | 1:18:41 | |
that these people must have against him, and it must be... | 1:18:41 | 1:18:44 | |
And this is kind of Scientology thinking, | 1:18:44 | 1:18:46 | |
that there's some Suppressive Person | 1:18:46 | 1:18:48 | |
that's poisoning everything, unbeknownst to everybody else. | 1:18:48 | 1:18:51 | |
And so there was more and more people getting into it. | 1:18:51 | 1:18:53 | |
When I was there, there was like 60 people, | 1:18:53 | 1:18:55 | |
and apparently it went up to 80 or 100 at different times after I left. | 1:18:55 | 1:18:59 | |
Were they kept against their will, would you say? | 1:19:00 | 1:19:02 | |
All of the doors and windows were barred and there was | 1:19:03 | 1:19:06 | |
a security guard at the door, | 1:19:06 | 1:19:07 | |
so I would call that against their will. | 1:19:07 | 1:19:10 | |
But if they'd wanted to badly enough, | 1:19:10 | 1:19:12 | |
it's hard not to feel they could have made a run for it? | 1:19:12 | 1:19:15 | |
Well, yes. Yes. | 1:19:15 | 1:19:16 | |
And this is one of the things that people don't understand | 1:19:16 | 1:19:20 | |
about that environment. | 1:19:20 | 1:19:21 | |
I mean, take my case. | 1:19:21 | 1:19:24 | |
I finally decided to turn my back on the whole subject and leave. | 1:19:24 | 1:19:28 | |
I had to walk away from a 35-year commitment... | 1:19:28 | 1:19:31 | |
..my wife, who I love very much, | 1:19:33 | 1:19:35 | |
all of the friends I had in the world were at that Int Base. | 1:19:35 | 1:19:40 | |
A person has to be so desperate to just turn their back | 1:19:40 | 1:19:44 | |
on everything and say, "I don't care about all that. | 1:19:44 | 1:19:46 | |
"I have to leave this place because it's just too oppressive." | 1:19:48 | 1:19:53 | |
And walk out into a world that is just totally foreign | 1:19:53 | 1:19:58 | |
and where they don't know anybody, they don't know the rules, | 1:19:58 | 1:20:01 | |
they don't know how to get a job, | 1:20:01 | 1:20:03 | |
they don't know how to get a bank account. | 1:20:03 | 1:20:05 | |
You know? It's a foreign world that they have to go out | 1:20:05 | 1:20:08 | |
and somehow cope with alone. | 1:20:08 | 1:20:10 | |
And people say, "Why don't they just walk out?" | 1:20:10 | 1:20:12 | |
Well, that's why. Because, in essence, it's a kind of a suicide. | 1:20:12 | 1:20:16 | |
You have to say, "My life is over and I'm walking out of my life | 1:20:16 | 1:20:21 | |
"and into a totally different life." | 1:20:21 | 1:20:24 | |
You know? It's that level of desperation that you have to get to. | 1:20:24 | 1:20:28 | |
And people that are still in there, | 1:20:28 | 1:20:29 | |
they haven't gotten to that level of desperation. | 1:20:29 | 1:20:31 | |
The people in the Hole, they haven't gotten to that | 1:20:31 | 1:20:34 | |
level of desperation yet, you know? | 1:20:34 | 1:20:36 | |
And this incident we're doing is when... | 1:20:41 | 1:20:43 | |
..he finally decides the last person that he trusts | 1:20:44 | 1:20:46 | |
he doesn't trust any more and I'm getting sentenced to the Hole. | 1:20:46 | 1:20:49 | |
And then three days later, I was gone. | 1:20:49 | 1:20:51 | |
Because I thought leaving was the only thing I could do to sort of... | 1:20:51 | 1:20:55 | |
..wake him up. Because if I leave, | 1:20:56 | 1:20:59 | |
I hold the keys to the kingdom - that should sober him up. | 1:20:59 | 1:21:01 | |
What the fuck is that doing?! | 1:21:13 | 1:21:15 | |
Get the fuck up! Fucking DB! | 1:21:15 | 1:21:19 | |
Walk! | 1:21:19 | 1:21:20 | |
Walk! | 1:21:20 | 1:21:22 | |
Fucking crawl! | 1:21:22 | 1:21:23 | |
Get down! | 1:21:27 | 1:21:28 | |
Lick the fucking floor! | 1:21:31 | 1:21:33 | |
Lick the floor! | 1:21:34 | 1:21:35 | |
It may be that every religion carries within it | 1:21:38 | 1:21:41 | |
the DNA for its own distinct crimes. | 1:21:41 | 1:21:45 | |
Fucking mental midgets! That's right. | 1:21:45 | 1:21:47 | |
The Hole and the allegations of abuse are, in my view, | 1:21:47 | 1:21:50 | |
an extreme but logical extension of the principles of Scientology. | 1:21:50 | 1:21:54 | |
Where do you sleep?! | 1:21:54 | 1:21:56 | |
Answer my fucking question! | 1:21:56 | 1:21:57 | |
-On the ground, sir. -Where on the ground? | 1:21:57 | 1:21:59 | |
I am so frantic trying to light a fire under your lazy asses, | 1:22:00 | 1:22:06 | |
since you routinely let everything go to hell the second | 1:22:06 | 1:22:09 | |
I don't have a gun to your head. | 1:22:09 | 1:22:11 | |
The Sea Org is imbued with the Spartan warrior ethic | 1:22:11 | 1:22:15 | |
and bull-baiting, squirrel-busting and shattering suppression | 1:22:15 | 1:22:19 | |
are part of their dogma. | 1:22:19 | 1:22:21 | |
This motherfucker! | 1:22:21 | 1:22:23 | |
While I'm busy trying to put things back in order, | 1:22:23 | 1:22:27 | |
cos you fucking degraded beings don't get shit done! | 1:22:27 | 1:22:29 | |
Look at this fucking org board. | 1:22:29 | 1:22:31 | |
Fucking org board! | 1:22:31 | 1:22:34 | |
You fucking SP! | 1:22:34 | 1:22:35 | |
The way you fucking handle an SP... | 1:22:36 | 1:22:39 | |
is you handle him roughly! | 1:22:39 | 1:22:41 | |
You handle him roughly! | 1:22:41 | 1:22:43 | |
Fucking handle him roughly. OK?! | 1:22:43 | 1:22:46 | |
OK? | 1:22:46 | 1:22:48 | |
-Yes, sir. -Yes! -Yes, sir. -Yes! | 1:22:48 | 1:22:50 | |
The church denies the existence of the Hole | 1:22:52 | 1:22:54 | |
and any abuse by David Miscavige. | 1:22:54 | 1:22:56 | |
It provides numerous statements from people who say these | 1:22:57 | 1:23:00 | |
things just never happened. | 1:23:00 | 1:23:03 | |
Sit down, sit down, sit down. | 1:23:03 | 1:23:05 | |
But there are also many ex church members | 1:23:05 | 1:23:08 | |
who say that they did happen. | 1:23:08 | 1:23:09 | |
And I've come to believe a version of this did take place. | 1:23:11 | 1:23:15 | |
And watching it unfold, I kept thinking about Marty | 1:23:15 | 1:23:19 | |
and his years of service and his complicity. | 1:23:19 | 1:23:22 | |
OK. | 1:23:24 | 1:23:25 | |
Anyone listens to this fucking cocksucker, | 1:23:25 | 1:23:29 | |
you're automatically and immediately SP declared. | 1:23:29 | 1:23:32 | |
Have a pleasant evening. | 1:23:33 | 1:23:35 | |
Good. That was a command performance. | 1:24:00 | 1:24:03 | |
We're done. That was just a command performance. | 1:24:03 | 1:24:05 | |
-Is everyone all right? -He was on a roll. -Yeah, yeah. | 1:24:05 | 1:24:09 | |
I just sat back and watched cos it was as if he was channelling | 1:24:09 | 1:24:12 | |
that guy. That is what it was. | 1:24:12 | 1:24:14 | |
And you can see, it becomes a overwhelm and you're like, "Whoa." | 1:24:14 | 1:24:17 | |
What's an SP like you doing in a place like this? | 1:24:27 | 1:24:29 | |
We're actually... | 1:24:32 | 1:24:34 | |
You're not going to talk to us, Marty? | 1:24:34 | 1:24:35 | |
Oh, look, you've got another guy with a camera. | 1:24:35 | 1:24:37 | |
Hey, guys, what are you doing? | 1:24:37 | 1:24:40 | |
We actually came to talk to Marty. | 1:24:40 | 1:24:42 | |
-Go on. -Yeah. | 1:24:42 | 1:24:43 | |
-So, anyway, Marty... -Do you want to identify yourself? | 1:24:43 | 1:24:45 | |
How much is the BBC paying you? | 1:24:45 | 1:24:47 | |
I just wanted to find out, | 1:24:47 | 1:24:48 | |
between the foster care and what the BBC is paying you, | 1:24:48 | 1:24:51 | |
is that enough to cover you? | 1:24:51 | 1:24:53 | |
Can you identify yourself, please? | 1:24:53 | 1:24:54 | |
Did Moby have to go? Actually, I'm having a comm cycle here with Marty. | 1:24:54 | 1:24:58 | |
What's the foster care? | 1:24:58 | 1:24:59 | |
The foster care, do you get paid enough for the foster care? | 1:24:59 | 1:25:02 | |
You, I think, I know. | 1:25:02 | 1:25:03 | |
Where is your friend from last time? | 1:25:05 | 1:25:07 | |
These guys hired me this time. | 1:25:07 | 1:25:09 | |
Can you tell me who they are? | 1:25:09 | 1:25:10 | |
Ask them. | 1:25:11 | 1:25:12 | |
They hired me to work on their documentary. | 1:25:12 | 1:25:15 | |
Did you finish the other project? | 1:25:15 | 1:25:17 | |
-Here's the crew. -Nicely done. | 1:25:17 | 1:25:19 | |
I have no interest in being... Thanks, Marty. | 1:25:19 | 1:25:21 | |
Guys, stick around, please. | 1:25:21 | 1:25:22 | |
It's the same guy. | 1:25:23 | 1:25:25 | |
Which guy, the cameraman? | 1:25:27 | 1:25:28 | |
Can we just have your names? | 1:25:31 | 1:25:32 | |
Between your foster care... | 1:25:33 | 1:25:35 | |
This is really sick, man. | 1:25:37 | 1:25:38 | |
This is really sick. | 1:25:40 | 1:25:42 | |
They're saying, "Are you getting paid enough for your foster care? | 1:25:42 | 1:25:44 | |
"Between this and your foster care, is that paying you enough? | 1:25:44 | 1:25:47 | |
"How much are they paying you? | 1:25:47 | 1:25:48 | |
"Between that and your foster care, are you able to survive?" | 1:25:48 | 1:25:51 | |
I don't know anything about foster care. | 1:25:53 | 1:25:55 | |
Monique and I are providing for him. | 1:25:57 | 1:26:00 | |
It was a straight adoption. | 1:26:00 | 1:26:01 | |
None of these things just happen. | 1:26:03 | 1:26:05 | |
David Miscavige had to direct this. | 1:26:05 | 1:26:07 | |
He scripted it and directed it. | 1:26:07 | 1:26:09 | |
-Oh! -That is a five! That is five. | 1:26:23 | 1:26:26 | |
-All right. -Now I've got to see what I've got to do with it. | 1:26:26 | 1:26:29 | |
You lucky mother fucker. | 1:26:29 | 1:26:30 | |
He brought my wife's name into it and he's brought my son into this. | 1:26:32 | 1:26:35 | |
I didn't want to do it, but I'm going to have to pull the plug | 1:26:39 | 1:26:41 | |
on this organisation. | 1:26:41 | 1:26:43 | |
You don't bring my child into this... | 1:26:44 | 1:26:46 | |
..unless you want me to do something extremely severe in response. | 1:26:49 | 1:26:52 | |
Do the actors know what was going on? | 1:27:00 | 1:27:02 | |
We probably shouldn't tell them. | 1:27:03 | 1:27:05 | |
They'll just get upset. | 1:27:05 | 1:27:06 | |
You know, welcome to my life, Louis. | 1:27:07 | 1:27:08 | |
And I say, you've just illustrated it. | 1:27:10 | 1:27:12 | |
Like, I'm working with these people, but I've got to withhold from them | 1:27:12 | 1:27:16 | |
that these guys are in my face here because they might be upset. | 1:27:16 | 1:27:18 | |
It's the same thing I have to go through | 1:27:18 | 1:27:21 | |
with all of my contacts in life. | 1:27:21 | 1:27:23 | |
I have to live this life | 1:27:23 | 1:27:25 | |
where I can't really share what happens to me on a day to day basis | 1:27:25 | 1:27:29 | |
because, if I do, it freaks people out. | 1:27:29 | 1:27:30 | |
You understand the burden? | 1:27:30 | 1:27:32 | |
We can't make friends. | 1:27:32 | 1:27:34 | |
It's very difficult... | 1:27:34 | 1:27:36 | |
..to say, "Hey... | 1:27:37 | 1:27:38 | |
"..come on over for a barbecue, | 1:27:39 | 1:27:41 | |
"but realise you might be being surveilled | 1:27:41 | 1:27:44 | |
"and it might be going into the archive of the most pernicious, | 1:27:44 | 1:27:47 | |
"dangerous cult the Western world has known in the past 50 years." | 1:27:47 | 1:27:51 | |
You understand what I'm saying? | 1:27:51 | 1:27:52 | |
But I will tell you this, | 1:27:54 | 1:27:56 | |
he will rue the day that he brought my son into this. | 1:27:56 | 1:27:59 | |
He will rue the day. | 1:27:59 | 1:28:01 | |
You know, we talked early on about, you were... | 1:28:08 | 1:28:10 | |
..you ran private investigators... | 1:28:11 | 1:28:13 | |
I mean, some of these techniques were things you did to other people. | 1:28:18 | 1:28:21 | |
You ran PIs, you infiltrated... | 1:28:22 | 1:28:24 | |
You are so wrong. I never, ever even crossed my mind to think about... | 1:28:24 | 1:28:27 | |
...bringing a person's child into something. | 1:28:29 | 1:28:32 | |
I never, ever, ever crossed my mind to use a | 1:28:32 | 1:28:34 | |
terroristic technique like that, ever. | 1:28:34 | 1:28:37 | |
Nothing like this. | 1:28:37 | 1:28:38 | |
I mean, you had people pretending to be people's friends, | 1:28:38 | 1:28:41 | |
-while secretly... -All right. | 1:28:41 | 1:28:43 | |
-I mean, I'm not trying to give you... Isn't that a fact? -Huh? | 1:28:44 | 1:28:47 | |
-Isn't that a fact? -You're a fucking asshole, | 1:28:47 | 1:28:49 | |
that's a fact. Fuck you. | 1:28:49 | 1:28:51 | |
You know, I'm sitting here having my child brought into this thing | 1:28:53 | 1:28:55 | |
and you want to fucking sit here and make me defend myself? | 1:28:55 | 1:28:58 | |
Fuck yourself. I have to be subjected to this shit | 1:28:58 | 1:29:01 | |
-and I've got to take this shit from him? -All right, forget it, Marty. | 1:29:01 | 1:29:05 | |
Fuck yourself. | 1:29:05 | 1:29:06 | |
Truly. | 1:29:06 | 1:29:07 | |
I consider myself fucked. I don't know what to say now. | 1:29:07 | 1:29:10 | |
Like, do you want to change...? | 1:29:10 | 1:29:11 | |
You should apologise, for starters, | 1:29:11 | 1:29:13 | |
and say we're cancelling that and pick up where we left... | 1:29:13 | 1:29:16 | |
-All right, fine, cancel that. -..before that whole thing started. | 1:29:16 | 1:29:19 | |
But even then, I want a minute to cool down | 1:29:19 | 1:29:22 | |
because this is really offensive. | 1:29:22 | 1:29:25 | |
I'm really fucking offended by it. I'm telling you, I have no life, | 1:29:25 | 1:29:28 | |
I can't even make friendships, | 1:29:28 | 1:29:29 | |
I am unemployable, and you start giving me this shit? | 1:29:29 | 1:29:32 | |
That definitely brings us to the close of tonight's event | 1:29:42 | 1:29:44 | |
and the start of a whole new era. | 1:29:44 | 1:29:46 | |
Yet, before we part, I want you to remember the two operative words | 1:29:46 | 1:29:49 | |
with which we opened this evening - necessity level. | 1:29:49 | 1:29:53 | |
The moment you realised the scope of Scientology, | 1:29:53 | 1:29:56 | |
the very instant you accepted its power, one way or another, | 1:29:56 | 1:29:59 | |
you were committed by necessity to help in every way you can. | 1:29:59 | 1:30:03 | |
We mean it. The only slim chance this planet has... | 1:30:03 | 1:30:07 | |
Rests on a few slim shoulders, overworked, underpaid and fought - | 1:30:07 | 1:30:13 | |
the Scientologist. | 1:30:13 | 1:30:15 | |
Later on, if we make it, what will be your answer to this question? | 1:30:15 | 1:30:19 | |
Did you help? | 1:30:20 | 1:30:22 | |
And I say, let's all make it happen. | 1:30:22 | 1:30:24 | |
Thank you very much. To LRH. | 1:30:24 | 1:30:26 | |
That inspirational speech and the film of the 2004 gala | 1:30:27 | 1:30:31 | |
is the dream of how the world would be with Scientology. | 1:30:31 | 1:30:34 | |
Well-ordered and grandiose, and reaching for some higher purpose. | 1:30:37 | 1:30:41 | |
All the bull-baiting and the shattering suppression, | 1:30:42 | 1:30:45 | |
they're justified because of this. | 1:30:45 | 1:30:46 | |
And in spite of everything I now know, | 1:30:49 | 1:30:50 | |
a little part of me still feels the pull of their vision. | 1:30:50 | 1:30:54 | |
It may be tempting to look at the faces and see foolishness, | 1:30:55 | 1:30:59 | |
but you could also choose to see good people, who are members | 1:30:59 | 1:31:03 | |
of a church that's been hijacked by its own Pope. | 1:31:03 | 1:31:06 | |
Thank you very much. See you next year. Goodnight. | 1:31:06 | 1:31:09 | |
Well, they think they're saving the world, right? | 1:31:44 | 1:31:47 | |
They see you as the ultimate Suppressive. | 1:31:47 | 1:31:49 | |
See, that's... That's where you're wrong. | 1:31:53 | 1:31:55 | |
That's where you're wrong. | 1:31:57 | 1:31:59 | |
Ultimately, it's as if he literally, in his warped mind, | 1:32:00 | 1:32:06 | |
is begging me to end all of this for him. | 1:32:06 | 1:32:09 | |
He knows I'm the truth, man, | 1:32:12 | 1:32:14 | |
and that is the scariest thing in the world to him. | 1:32:14 | 1:32:16 | |
I am done with it. | 1:32:20 | 1:32:22 | |
Your number's up, Marty. They're going to arrest you. | 1:32:26 | 1:32:28 | |
They keep pulling me back in. | 1:32:28 | 1:32:30 | |
-Morning. -Howdy. -We're just doing some random inspections here today. | 1:32:30 | 1:32:33 | |
-Yeah. -Need to take a look in the back, | 1:32:33 | 1:32:34 | |
make sure you don't have any skid missiles hidden back there. | 1:32:34 | 1:32:37 | |
There's some guys in there. It is on, yeah. We're filming. | 1:32:37 | 1:32:39 | |
-OK. -We're making a movie. LOUIS LAUGHS | 1:32:39 | 1:32:42 |