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This programme contains some strong language, and scenes which some viewers may find upsetting. | 0:00:09 | 0:00:20 | |
TRANSLATION: | 0:00:34 | 0:00:36 | |
SPEECH OVER POLICE RADIO | 0:01:36 | 0:01:38 | |
I think that my father was somebody who was willing to go | 0:02:18 | 0:02:21 | |
an extra mile for anybody who was in need. | 0:02:21 | 0:02:23 | |
I think my father turned impossible situations into possible situations | 0:02:27 | 0:02:31 | |
for many people who came looking for his aid. | 0:02:31 | 0:02:33 | |
And something like the video, for me, | 0:02:38 | 0:02:40 | |
is something that would go completely in character with him. | 0:02:40 | 0:02:43 | |
And the fact that he would put his life on the line | 0:02:43 | 0:02:46 | |
for a truth to be known for somebody that he cared deeply about | 0:02:46 | 0:02:50 | |
is something that I would definitely consider part of my father's character. | 0:02:50 | 0:02:54 | |
I didn't know about the video. | 0:03:04 | 0:03:05 | |
But I did know he was conducting an investigation | 0:03:06 | 0:03:09 | |
which, at the end of the day, involved certain parts of the government | 0:03:09 | 0:03:12 | |
or people who worked in government. | 0:03:12 | 0:03:14 | |
So that was as far as I knew. | 0:03:14 | 0:03:16 | |
The funeral was horrible. | 0:03:22 | 0:03:25 | |
It was horrible - it was horrible, horrible. I mean... | 0:03:25 | 0:03:28 | |
Er, I think it was something that nobody expected | 0:03:28 | 0:03:30 | |
and since nobody expected it, it made such a profound effect, as well. I mean, there was also... | 0:03:30 | 0:03:34 | |
There's the murmur and, "What had happened," and, "Why was my father killed?" | 0:03:34 | 0:03:38 | |
NOBODY expected this to happen. | 0:03:38 | 0:03:39 | |
I got up, I spoke. I thanked everybody who was there | 0:03:44 | 0:03:47 | |
and who had helped us in accompanying us in our grieving process. | 0:03:47 | 0:03:50 | |
And that's when Luis Mendizabal, a very good friend of my father, | 0:03:50 | 0:03:55 | |
he asked me for permission - if he could say something. | 0:03:55 | 0:03:57 | |
He said, "All of us who are here loved Rodrigo very, very much. | 0:04:00 | 0:04:03 | |
"If you want to know the truth about what happened to Rodrigo, | 0:04:03 | 0:04:06 | |
"then here is his testimony." | 0:04:06 | 0:04:09 | |
The news spread very quickly about it. | 0:04:11 | 0:04:14 | |
Before I knew it, my phone was ringing off the hook. "Listen, I just saw the video." | 0:04:14 | 0:04:18 | |
And they were just speechless. That was all they managed to say - "I saw the video." | 0:04:20 | 0:04:25 | |
The radio station was playing it already | 0:04:32 | 0:04:35 | |
when I was on my way to the newsroom. | 0:04:35 | 0:04:37 | |
The video was all over. | 0:04:40 | 0:04:43 | |
Everybody was listening through their headphones. | 0:04:43 | 0:04:46 | |
I won't ever forget the first lines. | 0:04:52 | 0:04:54 | |
I mean, I think nobody can forget the first lines of that video. | 0:04:54 | 0:04:58 | |
"If you're watching this video, it's because the President killed me." | 0:05:03 | 0:05:07 | |
The reaction was, "What's going on? What happened?" | 0:05:09 | 0:05:13 | |
And I remember someone said, like, | 0:05:13 | 0:05:15 | |
"If he is dead, I mean, this is the truth." | 0:05:15 | 0:05:18 | |
Then El Periodico had the video uploaded immediately | 0:05:34 | 0:05:39 | |
and the site crashed. | 0:05:39 | 0:05:41 | |
THEY CHANT: | 0:05:51 | 0:05:54 | |
The result of that video - all the demonstrations - | 0:06:42 | 0:06:45 | |
was really shocking. | 0:06:45 | 0:06:46 | |
Demonstrations are not spontaneous any more. | 0:06:48 | 0:06:52 | |
It's not common to see the youth | 0:06:53 | 0:06:55 | |
involved in claims of justice. | 0:06:55 | 0:07:00 | |
That's another casualty of war. | 0:07:02 | 0:07:04 | |
We lost the value for life. | 0:07:06 | 0:07:07 | |
But that day, even a 15-year-old kid is talking about justice. | 0:07:09 | 0:07:13 | |
I thought, "Something is going to happen." | 0:07:18 | 0:07:21 | |
That video showed my father in... | 0:07:26 | 0:07:29 | |
one of his best moments. | 0:07:29 | 0:07:31 | |
The ideas that were conveyed in his message were so powerful. | 0:07:31 | 0:07:34 | |
The way that he was able to transmit | 0:07:36 | 0:07:40 | |
that we are living... a hypocritical lie. | 0:07:40 | 0:07:44 | |
We cannot go about saying that everything is OK when it is not OK. | 0:07:44 | 0:07:48 | |
There is no excuse, there is no justification why you are to behave | 0:07:49 | 0:07:53 | |
in a way that is not consistent with your utmost ideals. | 0:07:53 | 0:07:57 | |
And I think it spoke to the very heart of the person that he was. | 0:07:59 | 0:08:03 | |
As I was stirring up my father's office, | 0:08:08 | 0:08:10 | |
where you would expect to find the most important things, the most confidential things ever... | 0:08:10 | 0:08:15 | |
I found a file for each of his kids, | 0:08:15 | 0:08:17 | |
where he had pictures from when we were young, | 0:08:17 | 0:08:20 | |
report cards from his children. | 0:08:20 | 0:08:22 | |
All the things that he... | 0:08:25 | 0:08:27 | |
I think that he felt most precious. | 0:08:27 | 0:08:29 | |
He actually had love letters from my great-grandfather | 0:08:32 | 0:08:37 | |
to my great-grandmother. | 0:08:37 | 0:08:39 | |
He told me that, for him, true love actually did exist | 0:08:40 | 0:08:44 | |
and that it was part of any person's goal to find it and to fight for it, | 0:08:44 | 0:08:50 | |
and to be happy and to be content when you find love. | 0:08:50 | 0:08:54 | |
My father was a lawyer and I was born in England, | 0:09:01 | 0:09:05 | |
where my father was getting his master's degree in law, in Cambridge. | 0:09:05 | 0:09:09 | |
Then after that, we went to Boston and we came back here to Guatemala - | 0:09:10 | 0:09:14 | |
that's where my father lived ever since. | 0:09:14 | 0:09:17 | |
We shared the same office space. | 0:09:18 | 0:09:20 | |
When we worked together, we were just next door to each other, | 0:09:20 | 0:09:23 | |
so I had the chance to spend time with him so much - | 0:09:23 | 0:09:26 | |
probably more than almost anybody else. | 0:09:26 | 0:09:29 | |
He wanted to have a role as a lawyer as he can... | 0:09:32 | 0:09:35 | |
He was able to make a contribution to something good - | 0:09:37 | 0:09:40 | |
that's why he always stayed away from courts and political intervention | 0:09:40 | 0:09:44 | |
and intervention with governments and dealings with governments, | 0:09:44 | 0:09:47 | |
because it's frequently very corrupt. | 0:09:47 | 0:09:50 | |
My father prided himself on being a person who was never corrupt, | 0:09:50 | 0:09:53 | |
who was incorruptible. | 0:09:53 | 0:09:54 | |
I think the fact of him living through the war | 0:09:57 | 0:10:00 | |
made him be aware about how polarised our society really is. | 0:10:00 | 0:10:04 | |
Because after 36 years of internal conflict, | 0:10:06 | 0:10:09 | |
it's not just the time - it's a complete mindset. | 0:10:09 | 0:10:12 | |
Entire generations were born with a culture of conflict. | 0:10:12 | 0:10:15 | |
I believe that my father did feel the need to promote a change in that sense. | 0:10:18 | 0:10:22 | |
THEY SING | 0:12:56 | 0:12:59 | |
ON RADIO: | 0:14:22 | 0:14:24 | |
To be honest, I didn't really know who Carlos Castresana was. | 0:16:22 | 0:16:25 | |
On Tuesday I just walked into the office | 0:16:27 | 0:16:30 | |
and my father's partner told me, "Listen, CICIG wants to talk to you." | 0:16:30 | 0:16:33 | |
We went over to CICIG headquarters on Tuesday, | 0:17:05 | 0:17:08 | |
and we started saying everything we knew... | 0:17:08 | 0:17:10 | |
"Listen, my father was doing this, he was investigating that." | 0:17:10 | 0:17:15 | |
He needed to check my father's files and my father's personal archives | 0:17:15 | 0:17:19 | |
and he said he needed access to his personal folders and computers. | 0:17:19 | 0:17:23 | |
After a while, Carlos Castresana said, | 0:17:24 | 0:17:28 | |
"You can rest assured that if we need to impeach the President, we will impeach him. | 0:17:28 | 0:17:33 | |
"And we will prosecute him if he is, indeed, responsible for what has happened." | 0:17:33 | 0:17:37 | |
Immediately after we had this meeting, | 0:17:38 | 0:17:40 | |
we went over to my father's office and we delivered his two personal laptops - | 0:17:40 | 0:17:44 | |
his office computer and his laptop. | 0:17:44 | 0:17:46 | |
CICIG got full access. | 0:17:48 | 0:17:49 | |
My father was very respected for being a very impeccable businessman. | 0:22:33 | 0:22:37 | |
And my sister - she dedicated herself to work and her daughters. | 0:22:40 | 0:22:46 | |
Very sociable, you know? She was like an angel wherever she was. | 0:22:46 | 0:22:50 | |
They left around 15 to one. | 0:22:54 | 0:22:56 | |
I left two minutes later. | 0:22:56 | 0:22:58 | |
Like, three blocks from here, | 0:23:01 | 0:23:03 | |
I saw my sister's car crashed in a post | 0:23:03 | 0:23:06 | |
but I thought, "It cannot be my sister." | 0:23:06 | 0:23:09 | |
And I parked and I called her. | 0:23:10 | 0:23:13 | |
When the phone rang and rang and nobody answered, then I knew. | 0:23:13 | 0:23:17 | |
My father was attacked from the right side | 0:23:26 | 0:23:29 | |
and one of the bullets shot my sister. | 0:23:29 | 0:23:32 | |
They both died immediately. | 0:23:34 | 0:23:35 | |
At first glance and when it first happened, | 0:23:39 | 0:23:41 | |
nobody really understood what was going on. | 0:23:41 | 0:23:44 | |
And when I heard about the story | 0:23:44 | 0:23:47 | |
and I read about the story in the paper | 0:23:47 | 0:23:49 | |
and you see it was something like 15 shots | 0:23:49 | 0:23:52 | |
were fired into Khalil Musa's body... | 0:23:52 | 0:23:55 | |
And she was just, apparently, collateral damage to the incident. | 0:23:55 | 0:24:00 | |
Rodrigo was very shocked with the killings of my father and my sister. | 0:24:02 | 0:24:07 | |
So the day that my sister was buried, he called me that afternoon | 0:24:07 | 0:24:12 | |
and he said, "I need to talk to you," and I went to his apartment. | 0:24:12 | 0:24:16 | |
And he said, "I want you to know that I will be doing the investigation." | 0:24:17 | 0:24:22 | |
I was afraid that something would happen to him so I said, | 0:24:23 | 0:24:27 | |
"Please, Rodrigo, don't go ahead with this because we suffered enough." | 0:24:27 | 0:24:31 | |
But he said, "No, I will go on." | 0:24:31 | 0:24:32 | |
Ever since Khalil and Marjorie Musa's death, he started on a path | 0:24:36 | 0:24:40 | |
where he was decided - he was not going to simply accept | 0:24:40 | 0:24:45 | |
what we are used to accepting in our society, when something terrible happens. | 0:24:45 | 0:24:50 | |
And he was determined to take this to the last consequences. | 0:24:50 | 0:24:53 | |
He went to Luis Mendizabal. | 0:25:17 | 0:25:19 | |
I recall my father speaking of Luis Mendizabal as this person | 0:25:22 | 0:25:25 | |
who had a lot of information about what was going on in Guatemala, in government. | 0:25:25 | 0:25:30 | |
Somebody my dad trusted implicitly. | 0:25:31 | 0:25:33 | |
This used to be my father's apartment. | 0:31:11 | 0:31:13 | |
About a year later, after he died, I moved in. | 0:31:13 | 0:31:17 | |
For me, the presence of my dad was the fact that he always came back | 0:31:25 | 0:31:30 | |
from work at lunchtime, to have lunch with his family. | 0:31:30 | 0:31:33 | |
When he was a dad is when I feel that he was at his happiest, | 0:31:35 | 0:31:39 | |
where he was most fulfilled. | 0:31:39 | 0:31:41 | |
One of the first presents I had from my father was a Walkman, | 0:31:44 | 0:31:47 | |
a really, really small Walkman, even before I could walk. | 0:31:47 | 0:31:50 | |
LITTLE BOY SOBS | 0:32:00 | 0:32:01 | |
I was ten when my parents got divorced. | 0:34:19 | 0:34:21 | |
We were coming back from this country club | 0:34:23 | 0:34:25 | |
and my father told me, "Listen, I have something to tell you," | 0:34:25 | 0:34:28 | |
and he told me, "Your mother and I are getting divorced." | 0:34:28 | 0:34:32 | |
That was actually the first time I ever saw my father cry. | 0:34:34 | 0:34:37 | |
I think my father felt that his father's shortcomings were | 0:34:42 | 0:34:47 | |
something that he was never willing to accept for himself. | 0:34:47 | 0:34:50 | |
And he told me that afterwards, that he actually never ever even | 0:34:51 | 0:34:55 | |
considered the possibility of him getting a divorce. | 0:34:55 | 0:34:59 | |
He always wanted to be a role model, | 0:34:59 | 0:35:01 | |
somebody who is always there for his children. | 0:35:01 | 0:35:04 | |
He had a responsibility to form a family and a home together | 0:35:07 | 0:35:10 | |
and he couldn't do it. | 0:35:10 | 0:35:12 | |
TELEPHONE CONVERSATION: | 0:37:04 | 0:37:05 | |
TELEPHONE CONVERSATION: | 0:37:22 | 0:37:25 | |
My father was surrounded by situations in his life where | 0:38:16 | 0:38:20 | |
he found the law to be helpless in his aid. | 0:38:20 | 0:38:23 | |
He lived in a place where you were used to people disappearing, | 0:38:25 | 0:38:28 | |
you were used to people getting killed. | 0:38:28 | 0:38:31 | |
When he was very young, when he was about 18 years old | 0:38:31 | 0:38:34 | |
or 20 years old, his brother was killed, he was murdered. | 0:38:34 | 0:38:37 | |
My father had these horrible situations where | 0:40:13 | 0:40:16 | |
he really was helpless to do anything about them. | 0:40:16 | 0:40:19 | |
My uncle as well, he disappeared and then showed up a couple of days | 0:40:19 | 0:40:23 | |
later, dead. His nephews, actually two of his nephews were killed | 0:40:23 | 0:40:28 | |
also in horrible circumstances. They showed up a couple of days later. | 0:40:28 | 0:40:34 | |
They were never really people with ties to government or with ties to | 0:40:34 | 0:40:39 | |
political involvement, or something of the sort, it was just violence. | 0:40:39 | 0:40:43 | |
It was huge news, breaking news. | 0:45:34 | 0:45:38 | |
It was a big success. | 0:45:38 | 0:45:40 | |
You don't get crimes solved like that here. | 0:45:40 | 0:45:44 | |
It was less than four months | 0:45:44 | 0:45:47 | |
and you had someone accused of pulling the trigger. | 0:45:47 | 0:45:52 | |
We didn't have information about how the investigation was going on. | 0:47:26 | 0:47:30 | |
The newsroom got this anonymous envelope with text messages, | 0:47:34 | 0:47:39 | |
love text messages from Rosenberg. | 0:47:39 | 0:47:42 | |
You know, I thought, "How marvellous." | 0:47:45 | 0:47:49 | |
But then I began reading them. | 0:47:52 | 0:47:54 | |
There is a certain point when you realise that there was a very | 0:48:04 | 0:48:09 | |
strong relationship. | 0:48:09 | 0:48:10 | |
We never published a story on them. | 0:48:12 | 0:48:15 | |
I found my father at home, crying. | 0:50:42 | 0:50:45 | |
He was obviously going through one of the worst moments of his life. | 0:50:47 | 0:50:52 | |
When I got close up, I asked him what had happened, he just said, | 0:50:52 | 0:50:56 | |
"They killed her, they killed her!" | 0:50:56 | 0:50:58 | |
And I was like, "They killed who?" | 0:50:58 | 0:51:00 | |
And he said, "They killed Marjorie." | 0:51:00 | 0:51:03 | |
It was at that exact moment that I realised who my father was | 0:51:03 | 0:51:08 | |
having a relationship with after so much time. | 0:51:08 | 0:51:13 | |
I had seen, obviously, the signs and the indications that he was | 0:51:13 | 0:51:18 | |
with somebody and I was aware that he was having a relationship with | 0:51:18 | 0:51:21 | |
somebody, but I really never knew until that moment | 0:51:21 | 0:51:24 | |
in time that the person he had the relationship with was Marjorie. | 0:51:24 | 0:51:28 | |
What CICIG told me is, "We traced back this phone number | 0:55:20 | 0:55:24 | |
"and we linked it to the place of purchase and we were able to | 0:55:24 | 0:55:27 | |
"find some cameras in the store where it was purchased. | 0:55:27 | 0:55:30 | |
"Even though the payphone was paid in cash, there's a clear video | 0:55:30 | 0:55:34 | |
"depicting Luis Lopez as the person who was buying this cell phone." | 0:55:34 | 0:55:38 | |
I remember that the first thought that went through my mind was, | 0:55:42 | 0:55:45 | |
"I don't know how or why, but I know he is not guilty of being | 0:55:45 | 0:55:51 | |
"part of a conspiracy against my father." | 0:55:51 | 0:55:53 | |
More than his worker, he was his friend. | 0:55:54 | 0:55:58 | |
My father confided in Luis some things | 0:55:58 | 0:56:00 | |
he wouldn't even confide in us. | 0:56:00 | 0:56:01 | |
I told him, I said, "Listen, Luis, | 0:56:03 | 0:56:05 | |
"I know that my father has trusted you with | 0:56:05 | 0:56:07 | |
"an amazing amount of information and you were a very close friend | 0:56:07 | 0:56:11 | |
"of my father's, and I will make sure with every force that I have | 0:56:11 | 0:56:16 | |
"and anything in my power, that you will not get in trouble with this. | 0:56:16 | 0:56:20 | |
"But if you ever made any promise to my father that you cannot | 0:56:20 | 0:56:24 | |
"tell anybody about this, you need to tell me about it now | 0:56:24 | 0:56:27 | |
"and you need to tell CICIG about it." | 0:56:27 | 0:56:29 | |
It wasn't until the day before my father died | 1:07:06 | 1:07:09 | |
that I perceived my father was in danger, immediate danger. | 1:07:09 | 1:07:13 | |
I got a call from my father very early. | 1:07:16 | 1:07:18 | |
He called me over and offered me to go to Antigua. | 1:07:18 | 1:07:21 | |
From the moment I told my father I was going with him, | 1:07:21 | 1:07:24 | |
he hesitated in terms of which car we should take, | 1:07:24 | 1:07:27 | |
where we should meet. | 1:07:27 | 1:07:29 | |
We started going out of his house and he was looking | 1:07:32 | 1:07:34 | |
over his shoulder and making sure there was nobody there. | 1:07:34 | 1:07:37 | |
And he said that | 1:07:41 | 1:07:44 | |
he just simply felt there was something that he had to do, | 1:07:44 | 1:07:47 | |
because he could not be at peace - | 1:07:47 | 1:07:49 | |
simply accepting the fact that two people he cared very much about | 1:07:49 | 1:07:54 | |
were murdered and nobody was going to do anything about it. | 1:07:54 | 1:07:58 | |
And he said, | 1:08:00 | 1:08:02 | |
"Even if that means that I'm willing to risk my life to do it." | 1:08:02 | 1:08:05 | |
When I heard that, I was obviously concerned | 1:08:07 | 1:08:09 | |
and I turned to my father and said, "Listen, this is not something | 1:08:09 | 1:08:13 | |
"that you have to do. This is something where you can protect yourself." | 1:08:13 | 1:08:16 | |
He told me he had an offer from a person to leave Guatemala | 1:08:18 | 1:08:21 | |
and go to, I think it was Washington, | 1:08:21 | 1:08:24 | |
and to present a claim before some international court. | 1:08:24 | 1:08:27 | |
He told me, "Listen, if something were to eventually happen | 1:08:27 | 1:08:31 | |
"in terms of what's going on, you have to understand that this | 1:08:31 | 1:08:34 | |
"is not your fight. | 1:08:34 | 1:08:36 | |
"This is my battle, not yours." | 1:08:37 | 1:08:39 | |
I was infuriated at first. | 1:15:15 | 1:15:17 | |
I was appalled. | 1:15:18 | 1:15:20 | |
First thing that went through my mind is, "Of course, why not?" | 1:15:20 | 1:15:23 | |
I mean, that's the easiest way to go. | 1:15:23 | 1:15:25 | |
Because at the same time, there was somebody to blame | 1:15:26 | 1:15:29 | |
but there was nobody to blame. | 1:15:29 | 1:15:31 | |
I told him, | 1:15:32 | 1:15:33 | |
"We will have our own private opinion about it from here on in. | 1:15:33 | 1:15:37 | |
"I do want to ask you one thing," and I asked a favour of him, and I told him, | 1:15:39 | 1:15:43 | |
"If tomorrow in your press conference you feel that my father | 1:15:43 | 1:15:46 | |
"was an honourable man, | 1:15:46 | 1:15:48 | |
"then I ask you to please say it during your press conference." | 1:15:48 | 1:15:51 | |
The newsroom, we were all paying attention to that press conference, | 1:16:28 | 1:16:34 | |
and I remember very well that it was like shock after shock, | 1:16:34 | 1:16:39 | |
and the reporters were, "Oh! Dios mio!" | 1:16:39 | 1:16:42 | |
And then we all kept quiet hearing the rest of the story. | 1:16:42 | 1:16:46 | |
You can never fully accept or you can never comprehend that... | 1:22:45 | 1:22:49 | |
..how something so intricate would have been possible. | 1:22:51 | 1:22:54 | |
You don't come to terms with something as difficult as that. | 1:22:56 | 1:23:00 | |
The sudden death of Marjorie Musa, | 1:23:03 | 1:23:05 | |
was something that I think affected him greatly. | 1:23:05 | 1:23:08 | |
The worst part for him in all of this, was that he found himself | 1:23:08 | 1:23:12 | |
completely impotent to do something to make it right. | 1:23:12 | 1:23:16 | |
I think that dismantled him. | 1:23:16 | 1:23:18 | |
My father was an amazing person, regardless of the way | 1:23:23 | 1:23:26 | |
that his life came to an end. | 1:23:26 | 1:23:28 | |
The way he lived was, for us, the most important thing. | 1:23:32 | 1:23:35 | |
Subtitles for the deaf and hard-of-hearing by Red Bee Media Ltd | 1:25:04 | 1:25:07 |