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I felt scared. | 0:00:16 | 0:00:18 | |
And even telling you this now, my hands are cold and sweaty. | 0:00:20 | 0:00:24 | |
Every time I tell people what happened, | 0:00:24 | 0:00:29 | |
I can feel myself going back into that period. | 0:00:29 | 0:00:33 | |
I went into the boardroom, | 0:00:46 | 0:00:48 | |
a few minutes to nine and everyone was there. | 0:00:48 | 0:00:52 | |
They were talking nervously, louder than normal. | 0:00:52 | 0:00:55 | |
No-one would make eye contact with me. | 0:00:55 | 0:00:58 | |
The only person who wasn't in the room was Kikukawa. | 0:01:00 | 0:01:04 | |
I was feeling, you know, I'm not going to sit here | 0:01:04 | 0:01:07 | |
waiting for my execution indefinitely, | 0:01:07 | 0:01:09 | |
so I started looking at my watch in an exaggerated manner. | 0:01:09 | 0:01:12 | |
And Mori looked over to me | 0:01:12 | 0:01:14 | |
and he could see I was getting agitated, | 0:01:14 | 0:01:17 | |
and said to me, "Michael, it must have been very hard for you | 0:01:17 | 0:01:21 | |
"yesterday in Tohoku visiting the area where the tsunami struck." | 0:01:21 | 0:01:26 | |
I felt this overwhelming sense of revulsion and disgust at the man. | 0:01:26 | 0:01:31 | |
He knew what was going to happen and he would choose that subject? | 0:01:31 | 0:01:34 | |
To humour me, to distract me. | 0:01:34 | 0:01:36 | |
I said, "Mori." I dropped the San, the term of respect. | 0:01:36 | 0:01:40 | |
"Mori, stop it, stop playing with me. | 0:01:40 | 0:01:43 | |
"I know what you're going to do, get on with it." | 0:01:43 | 0:01:46 | |
He was shocked and scuttled off to go and get his master. | 0:01:46 | 0:01:50 | |
Who finally turned up at around 9:07 and he read out the resolution, | 0:01:50 | 0:01:55 | |
the first resolution, saying that Woodford will be stripped | 0:01:55 | 0:01:59 | |
of his presidency, his CEO status and as a representative director. | 0:01:59 | 0:02:06 | |
And before he had finished, all the directors around the table | 0:02:06 | 0:02:10 | |
put their hands up, and physically, pushing to the sky, | 0:02:10 | 0:02:14 | |
and it reminded me of children in a classroom, | 0:02:14 | 0:02:17 | |
and I was watching this behaviour of these men, | 0:02:17 | 0:02:20 | |
some of whom I've known for 30 years, acting like that. | 0:02:20 | 0:02:24 | |
In Japan, hardly anyone gets fired, | 0:02:26 | 0:02:29 | |
and not least you wouldn't fire the president of the company. | 0:02:29 | 0:02:32 | |
It's almost unheard of. Why were they acting like that? | 0:02:32 | 0:02:35 | |
They know that I'm going to not just take this, | 0:02:35 | 0:02:38 | |
so what were they scared of? | 0:02:38 | 0:02:41 | |
Something more scary than me going public. | 0:02:41 | 0:02:44 | |
Let's talk about Olympus. | 0:02:46 | 0:02:47 | |
It is a company best known for high quality cameras. | 0:02:47 | 0:02:49 | |
It is facing a potential scandal. | 0:02:49 | 0:02:51 | |
The company fired its president and CEO Michael Woodford | 0:02:51 | 0:02:54 | |
after he sent a letter to the company's chairman | 0:02:54 | 0:02:56 | |
urging the chairman to resign over "serious governance concerns." | 0:02:56 | 0:03:01 | |
CEO Michael Woodford was sacked after he questioned deals | 0:03:02 | 0:03:05 | |
that he said covered up huge losses. | 0:03:05 | 0:03:07 | |
They wrecked the company, by siphoning off huge amounts of money | 0:03:07 | 0:03:11 | |
on all this nonsense. | 0:03:11 | 0:03:12 | |
If Kikukawa believes thoroughly he is personally innocent | 0:03:22 | 0:03:27 | |
and was only doing right by the company, then I think that says | 0:03:27 | 0:03:30 | |
something very scary about Japan, or certainly about corporate Japan. | 0:03:30 | 0:03:34 | |
The Japanese people toil to build a new nation | 0:04:53 | 0:04:56 | |
under MacArthur's firm hand. | 0:04:56 | 0:04:58 | |
The Japan of tomorrow is being moulded on the streets of Tokyo today. | 0:04:58 | 0:05:02 | |
MUSIC: Even The Bad Times Are Good by The Tremeloes | 0:09:19 | 0:09:23 | |
I was called over for a meeting with Kikukawa. | 0:10:37 | 0:10:42 | |
I suspected he may be telling me who was going to be the next president. | 0:10:42 | 0:10:45 | |
I didn't anticipate it would be me | 0:10:45 | 0:10:48 | |
so I arrived at his office in the afternoon | 0:10:48 | 0:10:51 | |
and went through a few pleasantries and almost immediately he just said, | 0:10:51 | 0:10:55 | |
"Michael, I haven't been able to change this company. | 0:10:55 | 0:10:57 | |
"I think from what you've done in Europe and America and elsewhere, | 0:10:57 | 0:11:02 | |
"you could, and I'd like you to be the next president." | 0:11:02 | 0:11:04 | |
I just said yes. | 0:11:06 | 0:11:07 | |
And because I wanted to change the company, I wanted to do that. | 0:11:09 | 0:11:14 | |
I met Michael for the first time just after he was appointed. | 0:11:14 | 0:11:18 | |
It was a pretty obvious story for us to do. | 0:11:18 | 0:11:20 | |
A British newspaper, British CEO in Japan, | 0:11:20 | 0:11:23 | |
so I interviewed him at the office. | 0:11:23 | 0:11:25 | |
The record of the gaijin CEO in Japan is pretty mixed anyway. | 0:11:30 | 0:11:34 | |
Carlos Ghosn has probably been the most successful. | 0:11:34 | 0:11:37 | |
Renault became a major shareholder of Nissan. | 0:11:37 | 0:11:39 | |
He didn't need to build a power base. | 0:11:39 | 0:11:41 | |
Howard Stringer, less successful. | 0:11:41 | 0:11:44 | |
He was brought over from America, | 0:11:44 | 0:11:46 | |
didn't have the same kind of power base and he struggled. | 0:11:46 | 0:11:49 | |
With Michael, he was kind of a hybrid of the two. | 0:11:49 | 0:11:51 | |
He'd been at the company long time | 0:11:51 | 0:11:53 | |
so I thought that would give him some credibility. | 0:11:53 | 0:11:56 | |
I think a number of managers if they were in that position | 0:12:17 | 0:12:20 | |
and had the freedom to realise the potential of the medical business - | 0:12:20 | 0:12:24 | |
70% market share, wonderful intellectual property. | 0:12:24 | 0:12:28 | |
Olympus should be not just a good medical company, | 0:12:28 | 0:12:33 | |
it should be a company which can take on the Johnson & Johnsons | 0:12:33 | 0:12:37 | |
and the Covidiens, big American health care companies | 0:12:37 | 0:12:40 | |
and German health care companies, | 0:12:40 | 0:12:43 | |
and really use the endoscope business as a platform | 0:12:43 | 0:12:46 | |
to show Japan can be an absolute leader in health care equipment. | 0:12:46 | 0:12:49 | |
I think the fact that he couldn't speak Japanese | 0:12:52 | 0:12:55 | |
definitely contributed to his feeling of isolation. | 0:12:55 | 0:12:58 | |
And if he could speak Japanese, | 0:12:58 | 0:13:01 | |
he might have got a better sense of what was waiting for him. | 0:13:01 | 0:13:04 | |
I didn't, when I was made president, | 0:13:04 | 0:13:07 | |
anticipate that Kikukawa would retain the CEO position, | 0:13:07 | 0:13:11 | |
or create the CEO position, and if you run a company, | 0:13:11 | 0:13:14 | |
you have to have clear leadership, | 0:13:14 | 0:13:16 | |
and what he did, he created two heads. | 0:13:16 | 0:13:18 | |
I was the president and then he had this contradiction - | 0:13:18 | 0:13:21 | |
he was the Ceo. | 0:13:21 | 0:13:22 | |
I was in Hamburg and I received an e-mail from a Japanese friend | 0:13:35 | 0:13:39 | |
who was also a director of a leading Nikkei company. | 0:13:39 | 0:13:43 | |
He wrote to me and said, "Have you seen this?" | 0:13:44 | 0:13:47 | |
I didn't know what Facta was. | 0:13:47 | 0:13:50 | |
I'd never heard of it. | 0:13:50 | 0:13:51 | |
I was returning to Japan the following week | 0:13:55 | 0:13:57 | |
so I thought I would get to understand it properly, | 0:13:57 | 0:14:00 | |
get a full translation. | 0:14:00 | 0:14:02 | |
I came back with an anticipation I would walk into a boardroom | 0:14:12 | 0:14:15 | |
with a great tension and atmosphere. | 0:14:15 | 0:14:19 | |
What was shocking to me was everything was very normal | 0:14:19 | 0:14:21 | |
and mundane and people were very friendly. | 0:14:21 | 0:14:24 | |
"How was your visit in Europe, Michael?" | 0:14:24 | 0:14:27 | |
And I was disorientated to the extent of | 0:14:28 | 0:14:30 | |
the Facta article must be something meaningless. | 0:14:30 | 0:14:35 | |
I became blacker in mood as he went through it. | 0:14:47 | 0:14:50 | |
Monday, the office was normality itself. | 0:14:56 | 0:14:59 | |
Mundane, no-one's saying anything. | 0:14:59 | 0:15:02 | |
That afternoon, I was so anxious | 0:15:07 | 0:15:09 | |
I asked two colleagues who I trusted to come to my office, | 0:15:09 | 0:15:12 | |
Japanese colleagues, showed them the Facta article. | 0:15:12 | 0:15:15 | |
Both of them told me that they had been instructed by Kikukawa | 0:15:15 | 0:15:20 | |
not to tell Mr Woodford. | 0:15:20 | 0:15:22 | |
I was worried and after hearing that I was even more worried. | 0:15:22 | 0:15:25 | |
Why would the chairman of the company be telling my own staff | 0:15:25 | 0:15:28 | |
not to discuss things with me. | 0:15:28 | 0:15:30 | |
It was himself and Mori, it was a room with a very large boardroom, | 0:15:38 | 0:15:42 | |
so there was a table between us. | 0:15:42 | 0:15:45 | |
I'll never forget because he'd organised | 0:15:45 | 0:15:49 | |
a very large and elaborate plate of sushi, and where I was sat, | 0:15:49 | 0:15:52 | |
there was a tuna sandwich, which... | 0:15:52 | 0:15:55 | |
Everyone knew I loved sushi so, | 0:15:55 | 0:15:57 | |
it may be something to say, | 0:15:57 | 0:15:59 | |
"That's your position in the food chain, Michael. | 0:15:59 | 0:16:02 | |
"You're here and we're here. Don't forget it." | 0:16:02 | 0:16:05 | |
The first thing really was, "Why didn't I know?" | 0:16:05 | 0:16:08 | |
And Kikukawa answered. | 0:16:08 | 0:16:09 | |
"I give the instruction that this article shouldn't be brought | 0:16:09 | 0:16:12 | |
"to your attention or discussed with you. | 0:16:12 | 0:16:14 | |
"Because you're the president, because you're too busy, | 0:16:14 | 0:16:17 | |
"you have enough to worry about." | 0:16:17 | 0:16:18 | |
I challenged him and said, "I've just been to New York and Boston | 0:16:18 | 0:16:22 | |
"and London and Paris to see our overseas investors and potential investors. | 0:16:22 | 0:16:26 | |
"I interfaced with the Japanese shareholders and the president, | 0:16:26 | 0:16:30 | |
"people likely to raise this type of question with me. Why?" | 0:16:30 | 0:16:34 | |
He just...left it, and then I asked him, "Were the allegations true?" | 0:16:34 | 0:16:39 | |
And he said, "Some of them." | 0:16:39 | 0:16:43 | |
Mori was an intelligent man, quieter. | 0:16:43 | 0:16:47 | |
I knew he would know everything. | 0:16:47 | 0:16:49 | |
Said to Kikukawa, "Can I have a private meeting with Mr Mori because I need to understand?" | 0:16:49 | 0:16:55 | |
He reluctantly agreed. | 0:16:55 | 0:16:57 | |
I challenged and pushed him for answers, | 0:16:57 | 0:17:00 | |
the Gyrus payment of 700 mills. | 0:17:00 | 0:17:05 | |
He started to explain that this was to do with apreference shares | 0:17:05 | 0:17:09 | |
and I said, "Well, I don't understand, we bought the company outright." | 0:17:09 | 0:17:13 | |
There was no minority interest. | 0:17:13 | 0:17:15 | |
He just stopped talking. | 0:17:15 | 0:17:18 | |
I tried to lighten the mood slightly | 0:17:18 | 0:17:20 | |
and moved onto the acquisition of these three companies. | 0:17:20 | 0:17:24 | |
A mail order face cream company? Come on! | 0:17:24 | 0:17:28 | |
How are we going to compete with that? A plastic plates company. | 0:17:28 | 0:17:31 | |
Why would we buy a plastic plates company? | 0:17:31 | 0:17:33 | |
He wasn't prepared to go any further with me. | 0:17:33 | 0:17:36 | |
It was becoming clear. | 0:17:36 | 0:17:38 | |
I was asking reasonable questions which were being refusing to be answered. | 0:17:38 | 0:17:42 | |
I asked him who he worked for and I anticipated he would say, | 0:17:42 | 0:17:45 | |
"I work for Olympus" or "I report to you, Michael." | 0:17:45 | 0:17:49 | |
I will never forget his words, which were chilling. | 0:17:49 | 0:17:52 | |
He looked at me and his guard came down for the first time, really. | 0:17:52 | 0:17:56 | |
His anger came out. | 0:17:56 | 0:17:59 | |
He looked at me right in the eye and said, "I work for Kikukawa. | 0:17:59 | 0:18:03 | |
"I'm loyal to Mr Kikukawa." | 0:18:03 | 0:18:05 | |
I was in New York. | 0:19:35 | 0:19:36 | |
I was still drinking a lot because I wanted at night to try to sleep. | 0:19:36 | 0:19:40 | |
It was like a torment. | 0:19:40 | 0:19:42 | |
I don't know if you can imagine being the president | 0:19:42 | 0:19:45 | |
of a large company with 45,000 employees. | 0:19:45 | 0:19:48 | |
I felt this sense of responsibility | 0:19:48 | 0:19:50 | |
but here were these strange things which I could not find answers for. | 0:19:50 | 0:19:54 | |
It was around 3:30 New York time. | 0:19:56 | 0:19:58 | |
I looked out the window, the streets were quiet. | 0:19:58 | 0:20:01 | |
I didn't even turn on the lights. | 0:20:01 | 0:20:02 | |
I went to my laptop, I can remember the shimmering light, | 0:20:02 | 0:20:05 | |
you know, my eyes sticky and looking... | 0:20:05 | 0:20:08 | |
and there was an e-mail and in that e-mail, there was | 0:20:08 | 0:20:10 | |
a translation of the Facta article which had been published. | 0:20:10 | 0:20:14 | |
And that article gave a lot more detail of alleged frauds | 0:20:14 | 0:20:20 | |
and the term "antisocial forces", which is a euphemism, | 0:20:20 | 0:20:23 | |
as we know, for organised crime, racketeering, the yakuza | 0:20:23 | 0:20:27 | |
and I was scared and troubled. | 0:20:27 | 0:20:30 | |
New York was waking up | 0:20:33 | 0:20:35 | |
and everything was normal in New York as it always is. | 0:20:35 | 0:20:38 | |
Noise from the street, yellow cabs, | 0:20:38 | 0:20:41 | |
steam coming out from the pavements... | 0:20:41 | 0:20:43 | |
I was thinking, "What was going on at the monolith building | 0:20:43 | 0:20:46 | |
"in Shinjuku? You know, what was behind this? | 0:20:46 | 0:20:48 | |
"What are these people playing at?" | 0:20:48 | 0:20:50 | |
I came to the conclusion then and there that enough is enough | 0:20:54 | 0:20:57 | |
and I am going to formalise my concerns | 0:20:57 | 0:20:59 | |
and I'm going to write to the whole board, and then I'm going to start | 0:20:59 | 0:21:02 | |
asking the questions I want answers on the terms I wanted answered. | 0:21:02 | 0:21:06 | |
You know, who did we buy these companies for? | 0:21:06 | 0:21:08 | |
How did we value these companies? What due diligence was done? | 0:21:08 | 0:21:12 | |
Who assisted us? Who facilitated these transactions? | 0:21:12 | 0:21:15 | |
I didn't want anyone finding a way out, I wanted it to be, | 0:21:15 | 0:21:18 | |
"Here's the question, please answer it." | 0:21:18 | 0:21:20 | |
As the letters escalated, I made it clear as I was unhappy that I would | 0:21:21 | 0:21:25 | |
resign if I didn't get answers, I would go public, | 0:21:25 | 0:21:29 | |
that I was resigning because of governance concerns. | 0:21:29 | 0:21:31 | |
It started in the morning when I said I wanted to see... | 0:21:38 | 0:21:42 | |
It doesn't change my money or terms or anything, I wanted to have... | 0:21:42 | 0:21:46 | |
I said to Kikukawa, "This is a very complex, difficult situation. | 0:21:46 | 0:21:50 | |
"I need the authority to deal with it." | 0:21:50 | 0:21:52 | |
And Kikukawa's response was, | 0:21:52 | 0:21:54 | |
"No, Michael, the Japanese shareholders wouldn't accept that." | 0:21:54 | 0:21:58 | |
And I said, "Fine, I'll resign." | 0:21:58 | 0:22:01 | |
He got angry, Kikukawa, and started to shout at me. | 0:22:01 | 0:22:06 | |
I came right back and told him I wasn't one of his poodles. | 0:22:06 | 0:22:09 | |
He has two toy poodles | 0:22:09 | 0:22:11 | |
and has a screensaver with his poodles dressed up | 0:22:11 | 0:22:14 | |
in their little outfits, which is common here, as you know, in Japan. | 0:22:14 | 0:22:18 | |
It was understanding, really, the way he saw me. | 0:22:18 | 0:22:21 | |
He actually asked me in this meeting - did I hate him? | 0:22:23 | 0:22:26 | |
I was surprised he asked that question, | 0:22:27 | 0:22:30 | |
and I said, "No, I didn't hate him." | 0:22:30 | 0:22:32 | |
I could have been called anything, I could have been called God | 0:22:39 | 0:22:42 | |
and I couldn't have done anything because a board of directors, | 0:22:42 | 0:22:45 | |
would always be able to have a majority. And Kikukawa... | 0:22:45 | 0:22:49 | |
May have given away his CEO, | 0:22:49 | 0:22:51 | |
but he would be still pulling all the strings. | 0:22:51 | 0:22:54 | |
It was on the way back that night that I decided that | 0:23:03 | 0:23:06 | |
I would bring in PricewaterhouseCoopers to evidence | 0:23:06 | 0:23:08 | |
the fraud related to the payment of the 700 million | 0:23:08 | 0:23:12 | |
or a figure approaching that. | 0:23:12 | 0:23:14 | |
It was pretty condemning and it raised a lot of questions. | 0:23:26 | 0:23:29 | |
It was evident that this whole transaction needed to be | 0:23:31 | 0:23:34 | |
questioned and investigated and it would potentially be illegal. | 0:23:34 | 0:23:37 | |
Everything I did, I did in both languages and I sent by e-mail | 0:23:47 | 0:23:50 | |
and by DHL and that was where I pleaded for them not to put | 0:23:50 | 0:23:55 | |
the fact that I've was a foreigner, a gaijin, before the facts. | 0:23:55 | 0:23:59 | |
I begged them not to put their personal relationships | 0:23:59 | 0:24:02 | |
before what was right for the company. | 0:24:02 | 0:24:05 | |
It was a very moving day - as has been the case in the days | 0:24:24 | 0:24:27 | |
after the 11 March earthquake when I came back again. And... | 0:24:27 | 0:24:31 | |
..somehow I got a perspective | 0:24:33 | 0:24:35 | |
when I saw my colleagues clearing this paddy field to make it able | 0:24:35 | 0:24:40 | |
to be used to grow rice again and you see all these fragments of... | 0:24:40 | 0:24:44 | |
people's lives. | 0:24:44 | 0:24:46 | |
And they said to my colleague... | 0:24:53 | 0:24:55 | |
..a man of the same age as me with two children, and... | 0:24:57 | 0:25:00 | |
You know, we knew each other quite well. | 0:25:00 | 0:25:03 | |
Very professional. And I said, "I'm going to be fired tomorrow." | 0:25:03 | 0:25:07 | |
And, erm... | 0:25:07 | 0:25:09 | |
He just went quiet. | 0:25:09 | 0:25:11 | |
You know, I almost knew it was pointless, | 0:25:18 | 0:25:21 | |
but I wanted, ideally, to have one last attempt. | 0:25:21 | 0:25:25 | |
I was never given that chance. | 0:25:25 | 0:25:27 | |
I walk out of the boardroom and then my instincts are, | 0:25:45 | 0:25:49 | |
I've got to get away from this country. You know, I don't know what's going on, who is involved. | 0:25:49 | 0:25:54 | |
An amount of money approaching 2 billion, you know, | 0:25:54 | 0:25:57 | |
bad things have happened to people for a lot less. | 0:25:57 | 0:25:59 | |
So I went to the safe in my office | 0:25:59 | 0:26:00 | |
and I had 1000 or something like that in yen. | 0:26:00 | 0:26:04 | |
I had a picture of my family, a few personal things. | 0:26:04 | 0:26:06 | |
I just wanted to get out with those things, but particularly the stamp. | 0:26:06 | 0:26:10 | |
Kawamata in effect acted as the chief financial officer. Came in. | 0:26:10 | 0:26:15 | |
Kawamata smiled at me. This was gratuitous. | 0:26:15 | 0:26:19 | |
He was gloating. | 0:26:19 | 0:26:22 | |
You know, he was enjoying this. | 0:26:22 | 0:26:25 | |
First, he asked for my computers, | 0:26:25 | 0:26:27 | |
he knew I had two Sony VAIO computers and he wanted them back. | 0:26:27 | 0:26:32 | |
Now, those computers contained e-mails from senior executives | 0:26:32 | 0:26:35 | |
of Olympus from around the world, some of which were | 0:26:35 | 0:26:38 | |
very explicit in criticising senior management, | 0:26:38 | 0:26:42 | |
the people who had been working and helping me. | 0:26:42 | 0:26:44 | |
And I felt a huge responsibility to protect them. | 0:26:44 | 0:26:47 | |
And I said, "No, you can't have them. | 0:26:48 | 0:26:50 | |
"I know what you do, how you work. | 0:26:50 | 0:26:52 | |
"They've gone back to London securely. | 0:26:52 | 0:26:54 | |
"I will deliver the computers back to the British company | 0:26:54 | 0:26:56 | |
"when they'd been forensically wiped." | 0:26:56 | 0:26:59 | |
That made him angry and he said, | 0:26:59 | 0:27:01 | |
"Give me your phones, you have two phones." I had the iPhone. | 0:27:01 | 0:27:04 | |
I moved again towards him and I was feeling pumped up with anger | 0:27:04 | 0:27:09 | |
and frustration and my first was clenched. | 0:27:09 | 0:27:13 | |
I said, "My wife is worried." | 0:27:13 | 0:27:15 | |
"She's going to be worried, I need to phone her." | 0:27:15 | 0:27:18 | |
"Are you a policeman? Are you policeman?" | 0:27:18 | 0:27:21 | |
Is he going to physically take it off me? | 0:27:21 | 0:27:23 | |
And he backed off. | 0:27:23 | 0:27:25 | |
I thought, "I need to go somewhere safe," so I went | 0:27:35 | 0:27:38 | |
to Yoyogi Park, which is just a few minutes from my apartment. | 0:27:38 | 0:27:42 | |
I again tried to remember that I needed to think carefully what | 0:27:42 | 0:27:46 | |
I was doing. I felt at risk, I felt threatened. | 0:27:46 | 0:27:49 | |
I wanted to see somebody quickly. | 0:27:49 | 0:27:51 | |
I wanted to pass over the material I had again | 0:27:51 | 0:27:54 | |
in case something happened to me. | 0:27:54 | 0:27:57 | |
I saw a wire service report that Michael had been fired. | 0:27:57 | 0:28:01 | |
I thought, "That's strange, surprising." | 0:28:01 | 0:28:04 | |
I thought, "I should give him a call," | 0:28:04 | 0:28:06 | |
and then my phone rang and it was Michael calling me. | 0:28:06 | 0:28:10 | |
He immediately said, "No, this is serious. | 0:28:10 | 0:28:13 | |
"There's a lot more going on than what they said. | 0:28:13 | 0:28:15 | |
"Money has disappeared, hundreds of millions of dollars has disappeared. | 0:28:15 | 0:28:19 | |
"This is a big deal and I want to meet you." | 0:28:19 | 0:28:22 | |
So I convinced him instead to meet me at a nearby cafe that | 0:28:22 | 0:28:25 | |
I knew would be quiet and wouldn't have many people. | 0:28:25 | 0:28:28 | |
I thought people might be watching him or following him. | 0:28:28 | 0:28:31 | |
I got there first and I was going into shock. | 0:28:31 | 0:28:35 | |
I knew that if you have shock, you give people a sweet drink, sugar, | 0:28:35 | 0:28:40 | |
so I ordered an ice coffee and I remember | 0:28:40 | 0:28:42 | |
pouring in a huge amount of sugar and drinking it quickly. | 0:28:42 | 0:28:46 | |
You immediately could see that he had something to back this up. | 0:28:46 | 0:28:51 | |
You know, this wasn't just a wild tale, | 0:28:51 | 0:28:53 | |
as soon as he put the binder there and started showing me... | 0:28:53 | 0:28:57 | |
We spent 45 minutes and I went through it. I said... | 0:28:57 | 0:29:01 | |
"You know," To me... he asked what I wanted and I said, | 0:29:01 | 0:29:04 | |
"I want this story on the front page | 0:29:04 | 0:29:07 | |
"and I won't talk to any other media." | 0:29:07 | 0:29:09 | |
It seemed to me that he had done a pretty thorough job | 0:29:09 | 0:29:12 | |
of researching and documenting the fact that money had left | 0:29:12 | 0:29:17 | |
the company and also how it had left the company | 0:29:17 | 0:29:20 | |
through these phoney or inflated acquisitions. | 0:29:20 | 0:29:24 | |
But the trail kind of stopped at the end of that. | 0:29:24 | 0:29:27 | |
It was still unclear who got the money | 0:29:27 | 0:29:30 | |
and that was the source of his fear. | 0:29:30 | 0:29:32 | |
Did gangsters have it? | 0:29:32 | 0:29:34 | |
Did his bosses steal it? | 0:29:34 | 0:29:36 | |
That at the time was still a complete mystery. | 0:29:36 | 0:29:40 | |
And then we left and I flagged down a taxi to Haneda. | 0:29:44 | 0:29:48 | |
I knew by that time all the flights to Europe had left Narita. | 0:29:48 | 0:29:52 | |
The first flight out was in two hours' or so time to Hong Kong, | 0:29:56 | 0:30:02 | |
which I knew I could connect to London and I started queueing up | 0:30:02 | 0:30:05 | |
for tickets for the Cathay Pacific flight. | 0:30:05 | 0:30:08 | |
So everything seemed to... You know, I was paranoid by that point. | 0:30:08 | 0:30:12 | |
And it wasn't until the engines were roaring as we left the runway | 0:30:13 | 0:30:18 | |
and tilted back in my seat that I started to feel safe. | 0:30:18 | 0:30:21 | |
Landed at Heathrow. | 0:30:30 | 0:30:33 | |
I was so exhausted, but filled with adrenaline. | 0:30:33 | 0:30:38 | |
My wife was there and she saw me and put her arms around me. | 0:30:38 | 0:30:43 | |
It felt very, very good to be with her. | 0:30:46 | 0:30:48 | |
She had bought a copy of the Financial Times. | 0:30:48 | 0:30:51 | |
There on the front page was the story. | 0:30:51 | 0:30:53 | |
When I switched on my mobile, it beeped crazily | 0:30:57 | 0:31:00 | |
and the Wall Street Journal and New York Times, | 0:31:00 | 0:31:02 | |
everyone was leaving messages wanting to speak with me. | 0:31:02 | 0:31:05 | |
I was just totally... | 0:31:08 | 0:31:09 | |
..consumed with a sort of sadness and... | 0:31:10 | 0:31:14 | |
a sense of unease of what the future was going to play out. | 0:31:14 | 0:31:16 | |
Now, six months ago, | 0:31:28 | 0:31:29 | |
he became the company's first ever non-Japanese president. | 0:31:29 | 0:31:32 | |
The board of the camera conglomerate Olympus was so impressed | 0:31:32 | 0:31:35 | |
that just two weeks ago, they made him Chief Executive as well. | 0:31:35 | 0:31:38 | |
Then quite suddenly, | 0:31:38 | 0:31:40 | |
after Michael Woodford had uncovered alleged accounting | 0:31:40 | 0:31:42 | |
irregularities among the company's finances, everything changed. | 0:31:42 | 0:31:46 | |
As CEO, one would think you'd be able to go directly | 0:31:53 | 0:31:55 | |
to the people who co-ordinated the deal. | 0:31:55 | 0:31:58 | |
-What responses were you getting at the time? -Totally evasive. | 0:31:58 | 0:32:02 | |
The question still hasn't been answered - for what? | 0:32:02 | 0:32:04 | |
For what and to whom? | 0:32:04 | 0:32:06 | |
And why would you pay to people you don't know who they are? | 0:32:06 | 0:32:09 | |
You can't then establish if there is any related parties | 0:32:09 | 0:32:12 | |
which raises all the issues which are now circulating in Japan | 0:32:12 | 0:32:15 | |
about corruption, links to antisocial forces. | 0:32:15 | 0:32:19 | |
Two seconds here, is Olympus at this point saying they may sue you? | 0:32:19 | 0:32:23 | |
Yes, I would be delighted for them to sue me in the High Court. | 0:32:23 | 0:32:26 | |
There is a public interest story here. | 0:32:26 | 0:32:28 | |
Let the facts come out, let all the facts come out. I'd be delighted. | 0:32:28 | 0:32:31 | |
-All right. -I'd be delighted if they did that. | 0:32:31 | 0:32:34 | |
Japanese companies have long been criticised for their cosy, | 0:33:38 | 0:33:41 | |
insider corporate culture. | 0:33:41 | 0:33:43 | |
The Japanese themselves say that change is difficult | 0:33:43 | 0:33:46 | |
without something called gai-atsu, | 0:33:46 | 0:33:47 | |
which literally translates as pressure from foreigners. | 0:33:47 | 0:33:52 | |
It was 12 days in. | 0:34:19 | 0:34:21 | |
I was in New York visiting the FBI with my wife. | 0:34:21 | 0:34:25 | |
We arrived very late, went to bed exhausted. | 0:34:25 | 0:34:29 | |
After three hours, the phone started beeping. | 0:34:29 | 0:34:31 | |
My wife looked and said to me, "Kikukawa has resigned." | 0:34:33 | 0:34:37 | |
Kikukawa resigning really was, you know, | 0:34:37 | 0:34:39 | |
the edifice was starting to crack. | 0:34:39 | 0:34:42 | |
It was starting to crumble. It took 12 days to drive him down. | 0:34:42 | 0:34:45 | |
Japan had been attracting funds on some levels | 0:38:15 | 0:38:18 | |
because people were seeing it as a kind of safe haven | 0:38:18 | 0:38:22 | |
from the European crisis and so forth. | 0:38:22 | 0:38:25 | |
And now suddenly, | 0:38:25 | 0:38:27 | |
the integrity of Japanese companies, the integrity of the markets, | 0:38:27 | 0:38:31 | |
the integrity of financial reporting, was being questioned in a big way. | 0:38:31 | 0:38:36 | |
Japan was now awake to the story. | 0:47:19 | 0:47:21 | |
And when I landed at Narita there must have been 20 camera crews | 0:47:21 | 0:47:24 | |
and 70 journalists. I'd suddenly become a rock star, you know. | 0:47:24 | 0:47:28 | |
I'm prepared to go back. If the Japanese shareholders don't want me | 0:47:31 | 0:47:36 | |
because I've been somebody who's not been harmonious, | 0:47:36 | 0:47:41 | |
because I've shaken the tree and caused waves. | 0:47:41 | 0:47:45 | |
But the truth of what I was saying has come out. | 0:47:45 | 0:47:47 | |
That would be a very sad statement to the world, | 0:47:47 | 0:47:49 | |
that Japan hasn't changed. | 0:47:49 | 0:47:50 | |
I wanted to come back | 0:47:56 | 0:47:57 | |
because I wanted to challenge Kikukawa, I wanted to look him | 0:47:57 | 0:48:01 | |
in the eye as a human being, | 0:48:01 | 0:48:03 | |
I wanted him to know what I felt and what harm he was doing. | 0:48:03 | 0:48:07 | |
A fascinating situation to observe, the fired gaijin ex-president, | 0:48:21 | 0:48:25 | |
still a director, going back to face the board who had ejected him. | 0:48:25 | 0:48:29 | |
It was strange going back, | 0:48:33 | 0:48:34 | |
because I saw people I knew and many of them smiled at me. | 0:48:34 | 0:48:37 | |
In a way, the meeting was a lot less tense than it would have been | 0:48:37 | 0:48:41 | |
because Kikukawa, Mori and Yamada weren't there. | 0:48:41 | 0:48:45 | |
The board are all contaminated. Absolutely. | 0:48:54 | 0:48:57 | |
They have made these decisions and then they have this huge file, | 0:48:57 | 0:49:02 | |
PWC report, and they still don't act. | 0:49:02 | 0:49:05 | |
All of them have to go. All of them have to go. | 0:49:05 | 0:49:07 | |
APPLAUSE | 0:49:07 | 0:49:10 | |
CLAPPING | 0:51:52 | 0:51:56 | |
Good evening. It is a day that will be in bold print in history books. | 0:52:40 | 0:52:43 | |
Black Monday, October 19th, 1987, | 0:52:43 | 0:52:46 | |
when the stock market went into a freefall, | 0:52:46 | 0:52:49 | |
losing more in one day than it did on Black Tuesday in 1929. | 0:52:49 | 0:52:53 | |
STOCK MARKET BELL | 0:55:35 | 0:55:37 | |
The walls came tumbling down on Wall Street Monday, | 0:55:37 | 0:55:40 | |
as two financial giants, Merrill Lynch and Lehman Brothers | 0:55:40 | 0:55:42 | |
buckled under the real estate and credit crisis. | 0:55:42 | 0:55:45 | |
We have overcome tough challenges before | 0:55:48 | 0:55:50 | |
and we will overcome this one. | 0:55:50 | 0:55:52 | |
Democratic capitalism is the best system ever devised. | 0:55:52 | 0:55:56 | |
SPEAKING IN JAPANESE | 0:57:30 | 0:57:34 | |
So, I had agreed with those two shareholders that I would be | 0:58:31 | 0:58:35 | |
prepared to meet with Mr Takayama, | 0:58:35 | 0:58:36 | |
that I would be prepared to do that. | 0:58:36 | 0:58:38 | |
Work together, avoid a proxy fight. | 0:58:38 | 0:58:41 | |
That's only damaging, that's only harmful, that's only wasteful. | 0:58:41 | 0:58:45 | |
Show some dignity, do the right thing for this company. | 0:58:45 | 0:58:48 | |
If he wants to meet to try to solve | 0:58:48 | 0:58:51 | |
this in a constructive and non-combatitive way, | 0:58:51 | 0:58:54 | |
then I am more than willing, I hold my hand out. | 0:58:54 | 0:58:57 | |
Of course he has to leave because of what he failed to do. | 0:58:57 | 0:59:01 | |
It would be a positive way. I still remain hopeful that he will do this. | 0:59:01 | 0:59:06 | |
However, if he doesn't, then I will fight for this company. | 0:59:06 | 0:59:09 | |
Then it will be the time to fight. | 0:59:09 | 0:59:11 | |
I hope we can avoid it, but if necessary I am prepared. | 0:59:11 | 0:59:16 | |
So, Mr Takayama, you won't speak to me, but if you're a leader, | 1:01:07 | 1:01:11 | |
then stand up like a man and go on the programme yourself | 1:01:11 | 1:01:15 | |
and ask and answer, not with greyness and no comment, | 1:01:15 | 1:01:20 | |
you answer to the employees and let the employees vote | 1:01:20 | 1:01:23 | |
after your hour and a half. | 1:01:23 | 1:01:25 | |
So, Mr Takayama, you go on Nico Nico now. I've done it. You do it. | 1:01:25 | 1:01:29 | |
I asked at a public televised meeting to meet with Kunibe, | 1:01:59 | 1:02:03 | |
the President of SMBC. | 1:02:03 | 1:02:05 | |
He wouldn't even speak to me. | 1:02:05 | 1:02:07 | |
So Japan works as a club, corporate Japan works as a club, | 1:02:09 | 1:02:13 | |
but it's perverted and it's distorted | 1:02:13 | 1:02:15 | |
and it's destroying this country. | 1:02:15 | 1:02:18 | |
I don't think he had a good sense of some of these bankers | 1:02:18 | 1:02:21 | |
when he met them while he was president. | 1:02:21 | 1:02:25 | |
You know, he would always meet them in the company of Kikukawa | 1:02:25 | 1:02:29 | |
and the bankers would address themselves to Kikukawa | 1:02:29 | 1:02:31 | |
and I think in those meetings, it was really brought home to Michael | 1:02:31 | 1:02:37 | |
just how marginalized he was in terms of the Japanese business world. | 1:02:37 | 1:02:42 | |
Nobody really saw him as being in charge. | 1:02:42 | 1:02:46 | |
I was on a small island called La Gomera in the Canaries. | 1:03:10 | 1:03:14 | |
It was New Year's Eve. | 1:03:14 | 1:03:16 | |
Nuncy was again continuing her point that the Japanese shareholders, | 1:03:16 | 1:03:22 | |
"They're not supporting you, | 1:03:22 | 1:03:23 | |
"you can't win without the Japanese shareholders. | 1:03:23 | 1:03:26 | |
"Stop." You know? | 1:03:26 | 1:03:28 | |
The samurai were the Japanese colleagues I was working with | 1:05:14 | 1:05:18 | |
who continue to support me, would have literally died for me. | 1:05:18 | 1:05:23 | |
You know, they cared so much for the company. | 1:05:23 | 1:05:26 | |
And then these weak, spineless, | 1:05:26 | 1:05:28 | |
cowardly, malicious, vindictive... | 1:05:28 | 1:05:32 | |
And this was cloaked in a guise of, you know, | 1:05:32 | 1:05:37 | |
"We didn't know what was going on." | 1:05:37 | 1:05:39 | |
-REPORTER: -'Three former executives | 1:06:27 | 1:06:29 | |
'of the disgraced Japanese Olympus Corporation have been arrested | 1:06:29 | 1:06:32 | |
'at their homes by prosecutors | 1:06:32 | 1:06:34 | |
'over their role in the disgraced Olympus company's | 1:06:34 | 1:06:38 | |
'US 1.7 billion accounting fraud.' | 1:06:38 | 1:06:41 | |
That's the man I'd really like to talk to the most | 1:06:53 | 1:06:56 | |
in this whole case, is Kikukawa. | 1:06:56 | 1:06:58 | |
Because I think his mindset, his reactions | 1:06:58 | 1:07:02 | |
and what he really thinks, if you could pull that out of him, | 1:07:02 | 1:07:06 | |
that would tell you a lot about Japan. | 1:07:06 | 1:07:08 | |
The most important thing for him was himself. | 1:07:33 | 1:07:35 | |
I saw him in meeting after meeting. He cared for himself. | 1:07:35 | 1:07:38 | |
He was a vain, deluded egotist. | 1:07:38 | 1:07:42 | |
And he damaged the company. | 1:07:42 | 1:07:44 | |
He wanted to be the important emperor. | 1:07:44 | 1:07:47 | |
He wanted people bowing to him. | 1:07:47 | 1:07:49 | |
He was ugly, ugly, ugly. | 1:07:49 | 1:07:52 | |
If he truly thought he was doing it for the sake of the company, | 1:08:14 | 1:08:17 | |
then the one thing it shows about Japan is that responsibility | 1:08:17 | 1:08:21 | |
is diffuse to the point of being meaningless in many cases. | 1:08:21 | 1:08:26 | |
You know, this package of secrets and mistakes | 1:08:26 | 1:08:29 | |
and misjudgements gets passed from person to person. | 1:08:29 | 1:08:33 | |
No-one really opens it. | 1:08:33 | 1:08:36 | |
They just hold it for a while. | 1:08:36 | 1:08:38 | |
And they can claim that they have no ownership of it, no responsibility. | 1:08:38 | 1:08:42 | |
They're doing it... | 1:08:42 | 1:08:44 | |
for everyone. | 1:08:44 | 1:08:45 | |
For the people who came before them. | 1:08:45 | 1:08:47 | |
It's not really my story, | 1:08:48 | 1:08:50 | |
it's a story about modern corporate day Japan, | 1:08:50 | 1:08:54 | |
and much broader than that, it's about Japanese society. | 1:08:54 | 1:08:58 | |
Companies and the way corporations work | 1:08:58 | 1:09:01 | |
is just part of the overall society. | 1:09:01 | 1:09:03 |