The Long Drag The Train Now Departing

BBC Four Collections -

Archive programmes chosen by experts.

For this Collection, Gary Boyd-Hope

has selected programmes celebrating Britain's steam railway legacy.

More programmes on this theme

and other BBC Four Collections

are available on BBC iPlayer.

NOSTALGIC GUITAR AND VIOLIN MUSIC

The scenery's absolutely idyllic.

I mean, it's England, and it seems to me that the locomotive,

and the spirit of the men who worked the locomotive,

is the best of England, and look! Here, look at it.

It's incredible, it really is - absolutely amazing!

And the thought passes lightly through my head

that some people want to close this!

And they actually want to take this away from us - and this is England!

And it's the best spirit of England, the spirit of determination

to get this damn great big engine along the line at tremendous speeds.

'Settle-Carlisle.

'For those of you who think that this is something to do with

'living in that town, you should be informed that Settle-Carlisle

'is one of the most magnificent stretches of railway line

'in England, if not the most magnificent.

'It goes up and over the Pennines, has supreme viaducts,

'is 72 miles long, reaches over 1,100 feet above sea level,

'is England's highest main line, experiences terrible weather,

'was completed in 1875, and was the last main line

'to be constructed in this country by pick and shovel,

'wielded by a couple of thousand navvies

'some 200 of whom died in the five-year task.

'But now they want to close this line

'and shut down a piece of history - the Settle-Carlisle piece.

'Of course, the men who worked here will regret its passing,

'even if their memories are quite clear of The Long Drag -

'as they used to call this line -

'of the days when steam was king,

'of lives dedicated to the Settle-Carlisle.'

The steam engines - they were the daddy of all engineering

in my opinion, for the massive things they could pull.

Right from Kirkby Stephen, you could hear the trains coming.

You couldn't see them, but you could see the smoke drifting away up,

and eventually the old trains used to appear,

and it used to take them quite some considerable time

to get to Ais Gill box.

And the sound was fantastic.

DEREK SOAMES: I remember the times in steam days -

you used to love to get an engine coming from the Leeds area,

which was topped up with good, hard Yorkshire coal,

and you'd say to the driver,

"Drop us a bit of coal off," and he'd drop these big slabs of coal,

and you'd just crack them, and we had a big cast-iron stove in those days,

and feed them in in layers, shut the door, you'd get the stovepipe

about two foot red...you know, you were well away on those times!

JOHN GARDNER: They needed a good fire,

because, well, winter time, when they opened the box

at six o'clock in the morning,

it was really, really, really cold.

GEORGE HORNER: We've had some good times here, yes. Plenty of activity.

Plenty to interest you, you know.

Particularly afternoons, when you had the freights wanting

to shunt in the sidings, and you had the through-freights wanting

to come as well, but many of those were express freights,

and mixed in with those, of course, were the passengers -

the Thames-Clyde and those -

and you'd have the line...the road, clear for those,

so you had to just watch what you were doing

as far as timing was concerned.

At these country stations, you know,

they were ideal paces

for learning railway work, because you got a little bit of everything.

You booked tickets, you booked parcels,

and it was a good education for later on in life.

The whole system's a family, you know,

and they all worked together. This is...

So in many parts of the country on the railways,

it's the old family firm.

I find it particularly strong in areas like this.

I think more so, because you've got to work with your colleagues

very closely when conditions are bad.

You know, the success of the job depends on that.

You can get professional expert railwaymen come on to this area,

then they've got to learn about the Settle and Carlisle -

it's totally different.

OSMOND HUDSON: The isolation, the vastness of the country around it,

and the gradual flow of life.

Although it was out in the wilds, life wasn't slow. It wasn't dead.

There was always something there,

even without the running of the trains.

There was the birds, the curlews, the livestock, the sheep. Everything.

He's his own man, the Dalesman.

He's got his own dialect, for a start,

and he's got his own way of thinking.

I think if you get Dalesmen... yes, they are a different breed.

They've got to be, for the sort of environment they live in.

Ribblehead Viaduct, of course,

is placed right at the head of the dale.

The wind roars in more or less from the sea,

and the first thing it comes to is Ribblehead Viaduct.

And when the wind's in that direction,

you can walk across Ribblehead Viaduct

and you can light your pipe without shielding the match.

The wind'll roar underneath

and it'll hit the parapet and fly over the top.

Now, once you walk off the end of the viaduct,

unless you're prepared for it, it'll bowl you down the bank.

'The Ribblehead Viaduct is both the main attraction

'and the main headache of the Settle-Carlisle.

'Its 24 arches, some over 100 feet high, are in need of repair,

'perhaps an excuse for wanting to close the line.

'But the curving viaduct is a listed structure and cannot be pulled down,

'trains or no trains, and if it has to stand,

'what better purpose can it serve

'than the one for which it was designed - for supporting trains.

'And that goes for the rest of the line, for its other viaducts

'and for all its excellence.'

When you see structures like Ribblehead Viaduct

and Arten Gill and Dent Head, and tunnels like Blea Moor

and Rise Hill, they certainly were engineering feats.

I mean, to someone before the railway was built,

to walk across these fells,

he'd wonder how the hell he was going to put a railway

through here at all, but nevertheless, they did!

And certainly, it is a monument to those that built it.

Well, they're unbelievable.

How did they manage to get the stone cut,

transport it by horse and wheelbarrow?

It's beyond comprehension, really.

Now a line is served by helicopter.

That was done on horseback and foot.

How come they got the tunnels to meet

after walking so far?

The traverse between Blea Moor and Dent Head -

it'd be nothing short of miraculous in those days,

because nine times out of ten, as the old saying says,

if you can see the hills, it's going to rain, if you can't - it's raining!

'We treasure Hadrian's Wall, York Minster

'and all manner of monuments.

'So is Settle-Carlisle one of those

'or just an expensive stretch of track that will have to go?'

One of the sad things, I feel, is for...

not so much MY grandchildren, but grandchildren's grandchildren,

there's going to be an awful gap in history if things like

Ribblehead Viaduct have gone,

because we've preserved medieval things,

and these children are going to say,

"Well, what did my great-grandparents do?" you know.

We've spent so much - not that I've anything against it -

on buying art collections and preserving them,

and yet letting our own English history disappear.

'But for every commuter who loathes the sight of trains,

'there seem to be as many people who can't see enough of them,

'particularly those with steam.

'British Rail has learned that steam excursions - as pulled

'by the well-preserved Sir Nigel Gresley - do make money

'but argues that such tourism is not its job.'

WHISTLE BLOWS

'On this particular excursion,

'to see something of what his ministry was closing down,

'was David Mitchell, Transport Minister.'

Well, I'm a pro-rail minister.

I'm not ashamed of it,

and I think I've sanctioned more expenditure and investment

in modernising British Rail than any other minister in a similar period.

I very much see the railways as having been very much down

and been the Aunt Sally of public comment,

now picking themselves up with modernisation with a huge programme -

electrification, new rolling stock, new signallings -

to get themselves into the 21st century

and really be competitive, be attractive,

not get their business because there's no alternative

but because people actually want to use their services.

WHISTLE BLOWS

'The whole line is now up for sale, including the ten stations

'still operational, and those that are no more than decayed grandeur,

'showing the pride that used to be, as at Hellifield.

'Instead of being vandalised,

'the place could become station number one, en route to Settle

'and Carlisle, and this remnant of the Midland Railway,

'which was incorporated within the London, Midland and Scottish in 1923,

'could once again flourish like the Midland Railway of old.

'The line does still exist.

'So does its equipment, signals and signal boxes,

'and so does the tradition of the Midland Railway Line.'

We like to think, if anybody said, "Which line do you work on?"

it's still the Midland.

After all these years, we still think of it as the Midland,

even though the Midland finished in '22.

And we've taken a pride in keeping the signal box

at Settle Junction as the Midland had it.

It is maroon board with white letters.

I always get up in the morning around about ten past five,

when I'm on early turn, to be here for six.

The dog's downstairs, and it knows which turn I'm on,

because on early turn, it comes with me, on late turn, it comes with me,

on nights, it stops at home with the wife.

When I'm ready, it's ready.

And it comes with me and it'll sit in the box all day long,

and as soon as it hears my mate's car - he can pick it up

further back up the road - he'll know the sound

of his own car, and it'll be stood up ready for going home then.

BELL RINGS

When you passed out as a young lad to be a signalman

and you walked in for the first time, you began to think,

"Well, it's my little kingdom is this.

"Nobody else. It's private, it's mine,

"and I'm the boss of this section of line now."

I think that goes with you all the way through your signalling life.

It is your little place.

We still have two of the original Midland instruments

which has brass centre and brass names on.

We take a pride in keeping the last little bit

of the old Midland shining.

It's like anything else -

once you're used to it, it seems fairly automatic.

I get people sometimes,

they'll call at the box and they'll look at all the levers

and they'll say, "How do you know which to pull?"

So I always tell them the same thing, "What'll come - pull it!"

But it isn't a faff like that.

It's all interlocked nowadays.

TRAIN APPROACHES

You get to know the drivers.

The signalmen put their hand up to the driver, and the driver

either gives you a toot or he puts his hand up and waves back.

The majority of them we know.

Some we only know by sight, but it's a friendly wave,

and you just think, well, there's somebody there that recognises me.

One of things which hasn't perhaps had the spotlight

put on it as much as it warrants

is the sheer dedication of British Rail staff -

signal staff, perhaps, playing an unseen role,

as well as drivers and others,

all of whom make up the team that runs British Rail,

and there is a long tradition there.

One finds, many men I talk to on the railways,

their father worked on the railways before,

and they've spent the whole of their lives working on the railways.

There's not only a love of the railways

but there is a dedication to ensuring that they operate properly.

It's ridiculous. It's only a machine,

but it's got tremendous rhythm.

It's got vitality

and it's got a man shovelling away.

I know what's going on at the front.

There is a man working so hard up at the front there,

shovelling away to get me along the track,

and the engine's putting out this wonderfully responsive sound.

He's responding to the man who's working at his job, sweating,

hot and not giving up - hammering away. It's wonderful!

I was a signalman on Western region. I was a Great Western man.

And I was fascinated to discover a new railway,

um...and to learn how other railwaymen ran their railways.

And to discover the hardships that they had to put up with on this line.

And how they loyally came to work, day in, day out, winter and summer.

We're here on a lovely sunny day. Those men got up anywhere.

The deep snow, freezing rain, and cycled here, walked here.

Don't forget, long before motorcars came,

these men were coming here to work.

One minute, it can be all right.

The next minute, it can be all different.

In a matter of quarter of an hour, 20 minutes, it can change,

just like that. Oh, yeah.

On the Friday, on the 1st of June,

I was going up for six o'clock, early start,

and we'd a clear, white frost.

And I just said to my mate, I said, "It sounds crackers, but it looks

"as though it'll snow." He said, "I know it's crackers, but it does."

And it started to snow and it put about three inch down right sharp.

It snowed like the deuce. Snowflakes like half crowns.

And then it give over about half past eight, nine o'clock,

it gave over. And...the sun came out.

At half past ten, quarter to 11,

it had all gone, and I came home in short sleeves.

If you get a clear, sunny day at Blea Moor, you can see for miles.

And...apart from the trains going by, it's very, very quiet.

You get the feeling of tranquillity up there now.

Very, very quiet.

You're out on the fells, you hear nothing -

only maybe the odd sheep bleat

or the fell birds, the curlews and things like that.

And, yes, you're far remote from the madding crowd,

certainly, up there.

WHISTLE BLOWS

They were tough men.

They had to be tough men because of the geographical location

of the drag, the climatic conditions.

When I first discovered the place,

and I was absolutely amazed that such a railway existed,

coming from Great Western territory.

I'd never dreamt that railways could even look like this.

WHISTLE BLOWS

When you consider the Settle-Carlisle,

you're talking about people.

People under stress, people challenged, the wilderness.

And, of course, the best bit of the Settle-Carlisle is that wilderness

area from Ribblehead through to Garsdale, on to Ais Gill,

where you can walk through peat bogs,

you can have your legs whipped by heather,

and then you suddenly look up in this wilderness

and you're aware of a top-class train travelling along with people

lolling about and perhaps having meals or reading newspapers,

and you get this sudden little dash of civilisation

in an area where everything is still so primeval.

SILENCE

There are countless miles hacked through solid rock,

mile after mile, done in the most appalling weather.

The men who built this railway line weren't the same people as us.

They couldn't have been, could they?

They must have been so much stronger and tougher.

WHISTLE BLOWS

Lots of people use the railway line.

Um...and at the moment,

the people who want to shut it are even saying that,

"Oh, well, they're only tourists."

But they pay their money and they come here.

And they use the railway and they keep it going,

so that we've got this wonderful reminder of what our forefathers did.

Surely no-one who bats for Britain would want to get rid of this?

And this locomotive and the whole thing that it stands for.

This is a Victorian value, this railway is a Victorian value.

DAVID MITCHELL: It's one of the most historic railways in the country.

It's the last one built by pick and shovel.

It runs through the most superb scenery.

And over 60% of the people who ride on it

ride for the sheer pleasure of seeing that scenery

and enjoying the ride.

We don't think that it's necessarily right, that that is an activity

which should be subsidised any more than other pleasures

which one goes to

in the way of tourist attractions are subsidised either.

I would like to feel that the line

would continue as part of British Railways.

I think this is absolutely essential.

The proposal at the moment, of course,

is, in a measure, to privatise it. I think this would be very sad,

because it would no longer be an honest railway,

part of the system, doing a good job

in carrying passengers as part of a network.

British Rail mustn't misunderstand us.

It isn't that we're against them. Quite the contrary.

Those people who've come forward from all over our country

have been people who make use of British Rail.

I'm a regular rail user.

It isn't that I'm simply involved in a campaign against British Rail,

quite the contrary.

And now that there is the prospect of a private operator,

those of us who are involved

are cooperating to make that a success too.

Because whoever owns it, we want to see it in operation.

For instance, we get parcels from all over the country, and if people,

other firms, won't take them to the station, we get Red Star to collect.

So, I mean, for Red Star and British Rail,

it's parcels and money revenue coming in from all over the country,

besides us sending them from here, so it's...very important to us.

Nobody wants to see it shut.

This line is the most direct line from the Midlands

and West Yorkshire to the North.

People come from Scotland, Wales, London. They come on a round trip.

So British Rail are bound to lose revenue from all over the country,

because they're coming here to ride on this most spectacular line.

'In their fight against the impending closure,

'the Friends of the Settle-Carlisle Line Association

'have been campaigning for more business,

'collecting thousands of signatures

'and encouraging visitors to come and see and use what might go for good.'

- Are you drawing up? - I'm drawing up.

Nobody on?

Right, away when you're ready, then.

We mounted the campaign because this railway line is so important

for the people of the localities between Settle and Carlisle.

It's an essential tourist route, in addition.

And from that, of course,

the communities derive an enormous financial benefit,

as we can see from our guesthouse logbooks.

We've had a gentleman staying with us that was on the committee

of the Friends of the Settle-Carlisle Railway, and he said he did...

a survey on it and he said that it is making money. It is.

And if they put more trains on, which they've cut a lot down now,

if they put more trains on, then they could be filled.

ENGINE NOISE DROWNS CHAT

Thank you.

Did you make 'em?

No, no, but they're made locally, though.

They're very nice.

We've got a beaker to give to the driver.

- Pardon, who? - The driver.

- Yes. - Are you the driver?

- Yes. - There you are, look.

Thank you very much.

Kind lad. Thank you.

'A stop for water - and tea and cakes - at Garsdale,

'just before the summit at Ais Gill.'

THEY CHATTER

'It was surely occasion for lynching the minister

'who had announced the closure. But his obvious enthusiasm

'for this piece of England warmed even the enthusiasts.

'Perhaps his keenness was the end of him, as he was soon to be reshuffled,

'given a knighthood and permitted to resign for family reasons.

'Ministers may come and go, but will the line survive, find a backer

'and get the support it needs from those who believe that the majesty

'of a steam train's departure on such a line

'just cannot be allowed to die?'

WHISTLE BLOWS

SHEEP BLEAT

SHEEP BLEAT

When it comes to the future, I'm afraid...finance comes into it.

It is a beautiful railway.

But if there isn't money going through the ticket halls,

it's a shame,

and I can't see why stuff can't be diverted to the railways.

It went once upon a time. Surely it'll go again.

I've been on 43 years now

and, er...I would like to think that I could manage another seven.

I hope that the Settle-Carlisle keeps going.

It'd be nice to think I'd got 50 years in one firm.

As far as I'm concerned, I've done quite a lot of years on the railway.

I think we've come to a situation now where new ideas are coming in.

Quite frankly, I think that people like myself tend to hang back

to the old ideas, rightly or wrongly.

And I think it's probably time we were going

and let some of the younger lads have a go!

I don't think our ideas would probably fit in very well

with the new order, but...

one's got to face progress, I suppose.

We're friends of the line.

And people like myself who live locally

have been rail users and friends of the line for a lifetime.

Perhaps it IS too sentimental, but I'm not ashamed of that.

It's a lovely line,

and perhaps we're having a love affair with it - why not?

It must stay open. It's got to stay open. It can't close.

It's too important to people like ourselves.