Transgender Love


Transgender Love

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and through hormone treatment and surgery,

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Every year, a growing number of people find the courage

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to come out as transgender.

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This is me, get over it!

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But finding love when you're trans is as difficult as ever.

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I'm jealous of just about every single other woman out there.

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Existing relationships crack under the strain.

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Lots of arguing and screaming.

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Most families break apart.

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Miss them so much.

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It is extremely tough for children...

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I was picked on, it was horrible.

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..and partners.

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Can I actually do this?

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But in the face of these challenges,

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there are couples trying to make it work...

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If you love someone, you love someone.

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It doesn't really matter, like, what anyone else says.

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And families whose love is strong enough to survive a mum, dad,

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husband or wife changing gender.

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I'm so happy.

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I'm so happy right now, it's unbelievable!

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MUSIC: Let's Work Together by Canned Heat

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# Together we stand

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# Divided we fall... #

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Justine works at Peterhead harbour,

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installing and repairing marine electronic equipment

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on fishing trawlers.

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She has worked here for more than 25 years.

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The lights are going up and down with me just moving the cable.

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That'll have to come off, a bit later on. Oh!

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That'll be a three-person job.

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A woman working on fishing boats is unusual enough.

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But Justine is even more unique.

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For the first 20 years she worked here, she was a man called Justin.

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Probably need to immerse if it's got a nick in the cable already.

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You'll get water in there.

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Then five years ago, she took her workmates by surprise

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and began coming to work as a woman.

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Coming out was my biggest fear round here.

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They were a bit wary.

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There were certain boats I wasn't allowed to come down,

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because they thought...obviously they thought they were going to

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catch something, or maybe make them gay or something, stupidly.

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Have your lights been OK since we've cut it back?

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Aye, aye. Aye? Great, aye. Great.

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We probably first noticed it when she came on the boat, a few

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years ago, the long fingernails and the red hair.

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Now, looking back and after what she's done,

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that was maybe the start of it.

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Years ago, it was frowned upon when people got divorced, I think.

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Now, everybody does it. Know what I mean?

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So, I think transgender people are more acceptable as well, I think.

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Sailing at four o'clock today.

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So, no pressure, it needs to be all right!

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'Years ago, when she used to come aboard on her father's boat,

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'she wasn't very talkative when she was a he, you know?'

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And I don't think I actually said two words to her.

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But since she's had transition and became a woman and everything,

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you cannae get her to shut up nowadays, she's very talkative!

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One of the most difficult challenges of coming out as transgender

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is the impact it has on families and relationships.

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It often comes as a dramatic shock when a wife, husband,

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parent or child reveals their need to change gender.

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The usual reactions - confusion, fear, anger and rejection -

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can send relationships into turmoil.

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Most don't survive.

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Have you done something different with your hair?

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THEY CHUCKLE I've had it cut!

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She says she had her hair cut, but she only got the ends off it.

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So it's not really a haircut, it's a trim.

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For 34 years, Justine lived her life feeling like

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a woman trapped in a man's body.

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But she hid the truth from everyone, including her wife, Julie,

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until one day, she could no longer keep her secret.

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Well, I didn't know how to do it at all, I just panicked and went,

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"You're married to a freak." Just out with it.

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And she was like, "What do you mean?"

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And I didn't know what to do then.

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So it was just a case of telling her to go and have a look

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on the webpage I had left for her.

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And...well, lots of arguing, screaming.

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Well, we were just...

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You didn't understand why, and had it been a lie?

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Yeah, had the last 15 years of everything we had been through

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been a lie? Because obviously,

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you're telling me that you weren't the person I thought you were.

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It was a case of, is everything just lies, is any of this real?

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Just the total disbelief of, "Where does this leave us?"

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and, you know, "What has the last 15 years been about?"

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And it was kind of, "What the hell do I do?

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"Do I chuck Justin?"

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Do I say, "You know what, there's the door - get!"

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Justine and Julie had to explain to their three children, Samantha,

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Cameron and Morgan, that their dad would soon begin living as a woman,

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and through hormone treatment and surgery,

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would physically change from male to female.

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Their eldest daughter, Samantha, was only 13 at the time.

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We weren't sure how fast things were going to change.

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How to deal with it was a big one.

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They're your parents,

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you get concerned when you hear them wanting to be somebody else.

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You're like, "Oh."

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But that's major, it's not something you take like, "Oh, that's fine!"

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It's life-changing, really.

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Before long, news of Justine's transformation

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reached the school playground.

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At the beginning, it was horrendous.

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I had the worst time possible.

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I was picked on, it was horrible.

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I remember getting off my school bus and seeing

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a massive group of pupils, ready to try and go for me.

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It was a case of, "What do I do? How do I get through this?"

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I know I'm away to get a beating

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for something that is outwith my control.

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While the kids were facing problems at school,

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mum Julie was struggling with the idea that her husband was now

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living as a woman, and everybody knew.

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I thought of it, very, very hard - "Can I actually do this?

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"Can I live with the ridicule of other people?"

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It wasn't what I felt, it wasn't what I thought, it was,

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"How are other people going to react to us?

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"How are other people going to deal with us?"

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And then, once I got my head out my backside and realised that

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it's got sod all to do with anybody else, it's our lives,

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if they don't like it, tough. I'm not asking you to like it.

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If you don't want to be my friend - go. The door's that way.

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Those early months were particularly hard, but gradually,

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the bullying stopped and Julie, the kids and the local community

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began to accept Justine's desire to live as a woman.

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It was difficult, but these things take time.

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If you love somebody that much, you stand by them,

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and you help them.

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And I guess that's what happened.

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People say, "Oh, so that makes you a lesbian now?"

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Why? I don't fancy women, I don't fancy men, and I love Just.

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So, lesbian - yes, by default, but is that how I define myself? No.

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Justine and Julie are a rare example of

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a couple who have managed to stay together through a transition.

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Without family support,

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the emotional strain of being transgender can cause

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severe anxiety, depression and in many cases, suicide.

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So, building strong friendships is essential to survive

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the challenges that trans people face.

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MUSIC PLAYS That's the one.

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A bit of Silence Of The Lambs!

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"It must put on the lotion!"

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HE CHUCKLES

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"It must put on the lotion!"

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DRUMBEAT STARTS

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This is the one where he's fucking dancing.

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The fucking... The gown on.

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He sticks his cock between his legs!

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Anne is a 48-year-old bus driver from Perth.

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She was born male, but began living as a woman in 2010.

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Last year, she had surgery to physically transform her

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from male to female.

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Have you got a banana? I do. Have you got a BIG banana?

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SHE CHUCKLES

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Today, Anne is helping her friend Tadhg move into his new house.

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I'm telling everybody I'm your date!

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THEY LAUGH

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You cheeky sod!

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Tadhg is a transgender man, partway through his own journey

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to physically change from female to male.

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The two became friends when Tadhg split from his long-term partner

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and Anne offered him a place to stay.

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It wasn't Anne's fault, but I do remember pulling over on

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the A9 and crying when I was bringing my stuff down, so...

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I was in a very low place when I moved in, and I do remember

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Anne knocking on the door, you know, "You want a cup of tea?"

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THEY LAUGH

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Um, and I kept myself to myself,

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and Anne gave me lots of space and was a really good friend,

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and I'm probably standing here smiling because of her.

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They lived together for nine months,

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Anne transitioning from male to female,

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whilst Tadhg transitioned from female to male.

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Toilet conversations before Anne's surgery...

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Anne didn't always lift the seat. No.

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So, you know, I would have to go in and dry off the seat and suchlike,

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so I'm like, "Anne, when you're having your surgery,

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"I'm going to make sure I piss on the seat..."

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And we would laugh in the hallway and go,

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"Nobody else can have this conversation!"

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Anne and Tadhg's close friendship has got them through some tough

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times, but it's no substitute for a meaningful romantic relationship.

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And when you are transgender,

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that is one of the hardest things to achieve.

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# Just call me angel of the morning, angel

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# Just touch my cheek before you leave me, baby... #

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Finding someone who is prepared to commit is difficult,

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and approaching the wrong person can be dangerous.

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Some guys will become violent if they find out that I used

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to be a man, or just pure nasty.

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That's what scares me the most.

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I just want someone I can come home to,

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or someone to cook for, someone to share my life, you know,

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just to cry and laugh with -

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you know, normal things that normal couples do.

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Fingers crossed, it'll come true one day,

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with someone who loves me and understands what it is

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I've been through, and understands me.

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I'm quite complicated at times, you know?

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But another relationship in Anne's life means more to her

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than finding a partner.

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Until the age of 42, Anne lived as a man called Neville.

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She served 12 years in the Army

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before settling in West Wales with a wife and family.

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When she came out as trans, her marriage collapsed.

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She moved back to Scotland and hasn't seen her son Tyler since.

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What I want more than anything is just to hold him again.

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I used to missed the...

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the hugs and cuddles we used to have on the sofa,

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you know, with his dad.

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I miss them.

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Miss them so much.

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But Tyler has never seen Anne as a woman.

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He has only ever known her as his dad, Neville.

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His biggest fear is...

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that, you know, I'm some sort of freak.

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If I could just sit down and speak to him and show him...

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like, me, now...

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then I can guarantee all that fear, all that...

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you know, doubt, will wash away.

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It's just getting to see him, that's the bloody problem.

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Sadly, Anne's broken marriage and estrangement from her son

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is a story that is all too familiar in the trans community.

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MUSIC: Danger! High Voltage by Electric Six

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Jenny is a 42-year-old transgender woman from Inverness.

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She's been on hormone therapy for three years

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and hopes to get her surgery sometime next year.

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A little bit nervous! I'd be lying if I said I wasn't.

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In her former life, Jenny served in the Navy, repaired helicopters,

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worked on oil rigs and built and serviced rally cars.

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I'll see you on the other side!

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# High voltage!

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# When we touch, when we kiss

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# Danger, danger!

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# High voltage!

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# When we touch... #

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Well worth a try! Was that good?

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That was absolutely amazing.

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Chasing adrenaline kicks is one thing,

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but being trans, Jenny faces genuine fear and anxiety on a daily basis.

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This, as a rush, doesn't come anywhere near, you know,

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as close as the anxieties you feel when you walk out of your house

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for the first time as a trans person.

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When Jenny's marriage ended in 2009, she decided it was finally time

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to come out and start living as a woman.

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It's just one of these mad journeys you never see yourself

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actually going down, but in the end, this is who I am, you know?

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And I'm not going to change for anyone.

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I've hidden it away and put it away for other people,

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and, you know, I can't do it any more, this is me.

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Get over it!

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But when her transition from masculine to feminine

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began causing her two young sons problems at school,

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she was asked to stop contacting them.

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She hasn't seen them since.

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I think about them every day,

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and, you know, I'll be here when they come round and, you know,

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open arms, give them a big squish.

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I do know my boy turned round and asked my folks

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if I still had the same cheeky smile!

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That's one thing that will never go away, so...

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Yeah, and it's there in hope that they do come back.

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MUSIC: Shopping by Pet Shop Boys

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With the support of her wife and family,

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Justine continued her journey from the husband and father

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she had once been, to the wife and mother she would become.

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Right, are we ready for this? You're going to have to hold that.

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Be careful, because my phone's in there. Phone is life!

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And her daughter Morgan has adapted well to life with two mums.

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You liking that? Mm-hm.

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Do you want to buy it for me, yeah?

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Do you want to hoover the living room, too?

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I said I'd hoover the house, yeah.

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Cool. It's yours, then.

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In May 2013, Justine finally underwent

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gender reassignment surgery,

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completing her physical transformation from male to female.

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It's actually better than I thought it would be. See?

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THEY TALK OVER EACH OTHER

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But in all honesty, see that dress you tried...tried to try on before?

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It looked much worse.

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Hee-hee, had to ruin that, sorry!

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Along with her two daughters, Samantha and Morgan,

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Justine and Julie had a 15-year-old son called Cameron.

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In June, while Justine was recovering from her surgery,

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the couple received some terrible news.

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When we got up the stairs, we knew there was something,

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because we could hear the helicopter...

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and, um, then we heard the neighbours saying

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there had been an accident up at the castle.

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But we knew, when they said there had been an accident up there

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and the search and rescue helicopter was out,

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we just knew it was Cameron.

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And then, before anyone could get a chance to go up,

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any of the neighbours,

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the police came and said that he'd fallen.

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Cameron was with his friends, visiting a nearby castle,

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when he accidentally fell from the cliffs.

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He was airlifted to hospital in Aberdeen,

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but there was nothing the medical staff could do to save him.

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As a couple, you know, everything you've been through,

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then lost my child and whatnot, and it's like, "You know what?

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"We love each other, and that's the bottom line."

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You know what, the things that are sent to tear you apart...

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Can make you stronger. ..can make you stronger.

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You know, there's plenty of people out there who need to know that,

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you know, life is worth living.

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No matter what it throws at you.

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There's always more.

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MUSIC: Cigarettes and Alcohol by Oasis

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Marcus is 20 years old and lives in Leuchars, near Dundee.

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He works as a chef in a local restaurant and likes to drink

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and socialise on his days off.

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I like going out, I like going gallivanting.

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I'm a bit of a wild child, to be honest.

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But one major aspect of his life

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sets Marcus apart from other men his age.

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He was born in a female body and, like Tadhg, is partway

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through the process of physically changing from female to male.

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I've been in this body for years.

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I know the ins and outs.

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I've got a lot of discomfort with things, but at the end of the day,

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you want to have a penis, you want to have no chest,

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you want to be a full-blown male. Deal with it.

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One month ago, Marcus began testosterone treatment to

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deepen his voice and encourage the growth of facial and body hair.

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The latest stages of transition require multiple complex procedures,

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including chest reconstruction, genital surgery and hysterectomy.

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I've decided not to freeze my eggs.

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Because I don't want to have to actually, like,

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combine my eggs with my partner's and have kids.

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And I explained to them that I was once a woman but now I'm a man.

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All right, what's happening? 'Hi, did you text me?'

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Yeah, I did, because I wanted to see you.

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In the meantime, Marcus is as keen as any guy his age to meet

0:20:190:20:23

girls and have relationships.

0:20:230:20:25

Yeah, have you got, like, an answer for if you're going to go on a date with me or not?

0:20:250:20:30

But when you're trans-male,

0:20:300:20:32

relations with the fairer sex can be complicated.

0:20:320:20:35

Meet some girls and they're, like,

0:20:350:20:37

"Oh, I'm lesbian but I do like you but I can't because

0:20:370:20:39

"right now you're in a female body on your way to, like,

0:20:390:20:42

"change and get something that I don't want."

0:20:420:20:44

Then you go for someone that's straight and they're, like,

0:20:440:20:47

"Oh, well, I don't really, like... see you right now as anything,

0:20:470:20:52

"like, things would, like, progress right now.

0:20:520:20:55

"Because you've got the wrong parts."

0:20:550:20:57

You've got to take it with a pinch of salt,

0:20:570:20:59

you can't get upset about it. I don't care what people think.

0:20:590:21:01

I'm just myself, just a normal person.

0:21:010:21:04

Having a child reveal their desire to change gender is

0:21:040:21:08

a hard thing to understand.

0:21:080:21:10

Just one year ago, Marcus told his mum, Karen,

0:21:100:21:14

that he wanted to start living as a boy.

0:21:140:21:17

Just texted me saying, "I'm going to be a boy, I want to be a boy."

0:21:170:21:22

I'm like that... SHE SIGHS

0:21:220:21:23

"Really? Right, OK, whatever."

0:21:230:21:25

I suppose I thought it was a phase but...

0:21:250:21:29

it's clearly not! And you just have to go with it and...

0:21:290:21:34

you know, support you, I suppose, eh?

0:21:340:21:37

But having a son who was previously her daughter

0:21:370:21:40

took some getting used to.

0:21:400:21:42

Maybe it's for selfish reasons when I think,

0:21:420:21:44

"Oh, yeah, I'm not going to see my daughter getting married and

0:21:440:21:48

"I'm not going to, you know, see her having her first kid and,

0:21:480:21:52

"you know, I'm not going to be, like, a proper granny."

0:21:520:21:55

What do I do about, you know,

0:21:550:21:56

all these little baby photos I've got when she's clearly a girl

0:21:560:22:00

and she's so cute with her curly hair and your dimples and...

0:22:000:22:04

It's like my memories of...bringing my daughter up, I suppose, and,

0:22:040:22:09

yeah, it is a bit...

0:22:090:22:11

it's tough, but then I think, "Well, is that me being selfish?

0:22:110:22:15

"Or is that...

0:22:150:22:17

"me just being a mum, or...

0:22:170:22:20

"not understanding?" I don't know.

0:22:200:22:22

I really don't know.

0:22:220:22:24

The treatments and surgeries that lie ahead for Marcus on his journey

0:22:240:22:28

to change from female to male are a worrying prospect for his mum.

0:22:280:22:33

It's going to be tough. Going to be very tough.

0:22:330:22:38

Painful.

0:22:380:22:40

But...

0:22:400:22:41

It's obviously what she wants to do and what she feels strongly about,

0:22:410:22:45

so I just have to support and... try and be there,

0:22:450:22:48

try and understand, I suppose.

0:22:480:22:50

So, yeah, I do worry. Obviously, I'm a mum.

0:22:500:22:54

You always worry about your...kids.

0:22:540:22:57

Hoping they make the right decisions!

0:22:580:23:01

Cos this is quite a big...thing.

0:23:010:23:04

Thinking back to when I was actually pregnant with her, I did, like,

0:23:060:23:09

say from the very word go, all the way up until I physically

0:23:090:23:13

gave birth, and I said, "I'm having a boy, I'm having a boy,

0:23:130:23:17

"I'm having a boy."

0:23:170:23:18

Until...she was born.

0:23:180:23:21

And it's like, "Oh, you've got a girl." And I'm like, "Ooh, really?

0:23:210:23:24

"A girl?" And I remember saying, "Can you just double-check that?"

0:23:240:23:28

Because I was pretty sure I was going to have a boy, cos I wanted...

0:23:280:23:31

being a bit selfish, I wanted a mummy's boy, you know?

0:23:310:23:34

That wouldn't have happened.

0:23:340:23:35

And then I got a little girl but then obviously I'm...having a boy now.

0:23:350:23:42

So, yeah... So you're giving birth all over again.

0:23:420:23:45

No, I wouldn't go through that again.

0:23:450:23:47

I think it's going to be weird, the day, though, that I actually wake up with a willy.

0:23:470:23:50

Of course it's going to be weird.

0:23:500:23:52

Probably going to swing it about. You're not.

0:23:520:23:55

It'll be too bloody short to swing about!

0:23:550:23:58

Right, we're 328.

0:24:160:24:18

Right, this way.

0:24:180:24:20

Not the... THEY LAUGH

0:24:200:24:24

Bee is a 20-year-old make-up artist from Alloa.

0:24:240:24:28

Her boyfriend Joe is 23 and works as an IT technician

0:24:280:24:32

for a local business.

0:24:320:24:34

Here we are. Look...

0:24:340:24:36

Oh... Check it, yo.

0:24:360:24:39

They've been a couple for almost a year and live together in

0:24:390:24:42

Bee's parents' house.

0:24:420:24:44

This is lovely. This is well nice.

0:24:440:24:46

But what's unique about their relationship is that Bee is

0:24:460:24:50

a transgender woman and Joe is a straight guy.

0:24:500:24:54

What's in here?

0:24:540:24:55

Oh, my God, do they think we've got babies or something? No, that's if we argue.

0:24:550:24:59

Even though they were good friends first, taking the leap into

0:24:590:25:03

a full-blown romantic relationship was a big decision.

0:25:030:25:07

Especially for Joe.

0:25:070:25:09

I was actually so attracted to you that I couldn't even fathom it myself.

0:25:090:25:14

I tried to... tried to brush it away, I guess,

0:25:140:25:16

because I didn't expect anything to ever happen between us cos...

0:25:160:25:20

at the beginning, Bee, I sort of struggled with the idea of...trans,

0:25:200:25:25

cos I didn't understand it.

0:25:250:25:26

I sort of didn't care, but...

0:25:260:25:29

I don't think you knew that much about it. I felt like...

0:25:290:25:32

I cared more because of other people and what they would say.

0:25:320:25:34

You think it's different because everyone else thinks it's

0:25:340:25:37

something special, it's a novelty, or some folk don't agree with it.

0:25:370:25:41

I felt like that's why I struggled with it more, because if that stigma...

0:25:410:25:44

maybe not stigma, whatever the word, if that wasn't there,

0:25:440:25:48

I'd have gone out with Bee in a heartbeat.

0:25:480:25:51

At the age of just 14, Bee began living as a girl.

0:25:510:25:55

At 17, she began hormone therapy, but suffered severe mood swings

0:25:550:26:01

and depression as a side effect of the treatment.

0:26:010:26:04

All she just kept saying was, "I want to die, I want to die."

0:26:040:26:09

Just kept on telling mysel' that I just didn't want to be here.

0:26:090:26:13

I just wanted to get it over and done wi'.

0:26:130:26:16

Fortunately for Bee, she had supportive parents who helped her

0:26:160:26:20

through those difficult early years.

0:26:200:26:23

Most of the people I work with know that Bee is transgender and

0:26:230:26:28

know that I'm proud of her.

0:26:280:26:30

And there's times when you think, "Right," you know,

0:26:300:26:34

but to be honest, proud of her.

0:26:340:26:36

She's doing really well.

0:26:360:26:37

And now, with Joe's help, she's adjusted to life on hormones

0:26:370:26:42

and is persevering with her transition from male to female.

0:26:420:26:47

There's a few things I'm no' happy with but there's no things that I cannae get sorted.

0:26:470:26:51

Or I cannae...

0:26:510:26:54

deal wi'.

0:26:540:26:56

Like, obviously...the things that I hate, they're obviously hidden.

0:26:560:26:59

And I don't really talk to anyone about my insecurities because

0:26:590:27:03

I feel, like, once you start doing that, everybody starts to notice.

0:27:030:27:06

Like, I have really bad anxiety, like, really bad anxiety,

0:27:060:27:09

and then...then what can I do?

0:27:090:27:11

He's always there to help me. He's the best.

0:27:110:27:14

And I deffo would not be here...

0:27:140:27:16

definitely would not be here if it wasnae for Joe.

0:27:160:27:20

There's been many situations where he's helped me...

0:27:200:27:23

through many things.

0:27:230:27:26

Aye, he's a wee gem.

0:27:260:27:28

Er, how's it going? I'd just like to order some room service, please.

0:27:280:27:32

'You know that I'm straight. And you know I...'

0:27:320:27:36

Like, I'm not a homophobe,

0:27:360:27:38

but equally I prefer not to kiss another man or...

0:27:380:27:42

be right up in my face, you know. No, I get you.

0:27:420:27:46

So if I had any doubts or anything,

0:27:460:27:48

this would never be happening in the first place. OK.

0:27:480:27:51

That's what makes it so special and so...

0:27:510:27:54

..honest.

0:27:570:27:58

Why don't you carry it like this? Cos that looks fucking awful.

0:28:050:28:09

That looks normal.

0:28:090:28:11

There's adjustments to be made for anyone embarking on their

0:28:110:28:14

first serious relationship.

0:28:140:28:16

But Joe has also had to adapt to the negative effects of Bee's

0:28:160:28:20

lifelong hormone treatment.

0:28:200:28:22

Right, come on, press the button!

0:28:220:28:25

'What's the word for dealing with something really well?'

0:28:250:28:29

Do you think you deal with it really well?

0:28:290:28:31

I think I do, cos I've come to figure out when your moods are going

0:28:310:28:35

to change, what's going to happen, when you need to take your hormones.

0:28:350:28:39

I'm the one who gets up to do it. When to get me chocolate.

0:28:390:28:41

When to get you chocolate. Oh, my God, if...

0:28:410:28:45

If we don't give you chocolate, that's the worst thing.

0:28:450:28:49

There's us one day, walking a dog.

0:28:490:28:52

Or a cat.

0:28:520:28:54

Or a mouse.

0:28:540:28:56

I just love Bee so much, and I don't even think about her being trans.

0:28:560:29:00

I just... I love being around her.

0:29:000:29:03

It's got another door. THEY LAUGH

0:29:030:29:06

'You see other people talking about marriage and the future

0:29:060:29:08

'and you're like, "Oh, God, look at them, they're not going to last long." But that's what's different.'

0:29:080:29:13

I'm not worried about you talking about marriage,

0:29:130:29:16

I'm not worried about us talking about the future.

0:29:160:29:18

It's something I can't wait for, just to have a life like that.

0:29:180:29:22

At some point in time, everyone's going to be comfortable with

0:29:350:29:39

whatever choice they want to make.

0:29:390:29:40

And we won't be in this stupid day and age where you have to

0:29:400:29:43

worry about what folks think.

0:29:430:29:45

If you love someone, you love someone -

0:29:450:29:47

it doesn't really matter, like, what anyone else says.

0:29:470:29:50

Being transgender takes courage and determination, and is extremely

0:29:520:29:57

difficult without the support of an understanding partner or family.

0:29:570:30:02

There is medical help available

0:30:020:30:04

but very little on offer when it comes to support.

0:30:040:30:08

For trans-men like Tadhg, it's no different.

0:30:080:30:11

There isn't help out there and there wasn't help out there for me.

0:30:120:30:16

And I was...

0:30:160:30:19

on my own...

0:30:190:30:21

in a very, very low place, and I knew that I got through it

0:30:210:30:28

because I had the reserves, you know?

0:30:280:30:32

And I thought about anybody else that was going through that,

0:30:320:30:35

"Oh, my God, no wonder the suicide rate is high."

0:30:350:30:38

Because I know the struggles that I went through.

0:30:380:30:42

Tadhg established a transgender support group,

0:30:420:30:45

now the largest of its kind in Scotland.

0:30:450:30:48

He also helps people on a personal level wherever he can.

0:30:480:30:53

How you doing? Good.

0:30:530:30:54

Today he is visiting Marcus to discuss his testosterone treatment

0:30:540:30:59

and the delays in his upcoming surgeries.

0:30:590:31:02

I got told before I'd started it

0:31:020:31:04

that I'd be getting a lot more, you know, active,

0:31:040:31:07

a lot more energetic, but all I've wanted to do is sleep.

0:31:070:31:10

You're still technically in a loading phase and it takes a while

0:31:100:31:14

to get to that level where you know that you're functioning right.

0:31:140:31:17

I guess they were just kind of reviewing things

0:31:170:31:20

and trying to push for my top surgery.

0:31:200:31:22

Funding pack didn't help with that kind of crap,

0:31:220:31:25

because I'm getting stressed.

0:31:250:31:27

Marcus is waiting to be recommended for a mastectomy,

0:31:270:31:32

otherwise known as top surgery.

0:31:320:31:35

But in the meantime, to give his body a more masculine profile,

0:31:350:31:39

he has to wear a special vest known as a binder.

0:31:390:31:42

So this is my Underworks tri-top binder.

0:31:420:31:46

It's basically just to, you know, hide your chest.

0:31:460:31:49

It's not sexy, it's not flattering, it's...

0:31:490:31:52

Does the job, I suppose.

0:31:520:31:54

I'll take it off the second I'm going to bed.

0:31:540:31:56

And as soon as I get up in the morning, showered and that,

0:31:560:31:58

it'll just go straight back on.

0:31:580:32:00

Even when I'm getting ready for bed at night and I'll just put

0:32:000:32:04

a hoodie on, it's clearly obvious that I have a chest.

0:32:040:32:07

If I was wider and I had more of a gut, I think I could pass for,

0:32:070:32:12

like, for moobs.

0:32:120:32:14

Or mits, man tits, I like to call them.

0:32:140:32:17

Marcus now has a girlfriend.

0:32:170:32:19

They've been together for four months,

0:32:190:32:22

and although she accepts him as he is now, Marcus still feels

0:32:220:32:26

frustrated with the female body he was born with.

0:32:260:32:30

When I do go to get down to the business and get intimate

0:32:300:32:34

with my girlfriend, you kind of...

0:32:340:32:36

You know what you need to do and you know how you need to act,

0:32:360:32:40

but once you're in that situation where it's so intense that you...

0:32:400:32:45

There's, like, a switch in your brain just clicks and it stops

0:32:450:32:49

and you just have to take a step back and you're like,

0:32:490:32:52

"I can't do this, because... the parts aren't there."

0:32:520:32:55

You want to be able to, you know,

0:32:550:32:57

just whip your kegs off and go for it but you can't.

0:32:570:33:00

I haven't let somebody touch me, in my life, intimately.

0:33:000:33:05

And it's a massive wall.

0:33:050:33:08

And I would love to someday not have that.

0:33:080:33:11

As a trans-woman, Jenny volunteers in a similar way and

0:33:130:33:17

has adopted the role of a transgender Good Samaritan.

0:33:170:33:22

Despite her own problems, she travels the country supporting

0:33:220:33:26

confused, depressed and desperate people, wherever they need her help.

0:33:260:33:31

Today she's come to Aberdeen to see Ash, a young transgender woman

0:33:390:33:44

who lives alone and has been finding trans life especially hard.

0:33:440:33:50

Hey, how's it going? All good, all good. Good to see you.

0:33:500:33:54

You surviving? Uh-huh. That's good.

0:33:540:33:56

To the people Jenny helps in the trans community,

0:33:560:34:00

she's known as Mama Jen.

0:34:000:34:02

So I met Mama Jen four years ago.

0:34:020:34:04

She's been one of my biggest supporters since then.

0:34:040:34:08

Just every time I've needed help or I've been low or...

0:34:080:34:12

she's come up to Aberdeen, she's taken me to appointments,

0:34:120:34:17

helping me out with everything, er, my mental health.

0:34:170:34:21

If there's somebody else there,

0:34:210:34:23

you can go to places together and you don't feel so afraid or,

0:34:230:34:26

you know, just the abuse you can get sometimes.

0:34:260:34:29

But at least as a couple you can laugh it off together.

0:34:290:34:32

I just do it cos it's probably in my nature, so...

0:34:320:34:36

You know, that's what I do.

0:34:360:34:37

We'll get there. I don't know where we're going but we'll get there. Eventually!

0:34:370:34:42

Without the support of others,

0:34:480:34:51

the feeling of isolation and depression can be overwhelming.

0:34:510:34:55

Suicide rates in the trans community are staggering.

0:34:550:34:59

A recent survey found that 48% of trans people under 26 said

0:34:590:35:04

they had attempted suicide.

0:35:040:35:06

In her voluntary care and support role,

0:35:080:35:11

Jenny has literally saved people's lives.

0:35:110:35:14

One person I phoned an ambulance for four times on different

0:35:140:35:17

occasions, you know, and seeing somebody lying at the top of

0:35:170:35:20

the stairs completely out of it, and walking into somebody's room,

0:35:200:35:24

you know, after hearing somebody collapsed on the floor and

0:35:240:35:27

finding pills and wrappers all over the floor,

0:35:270:35:30

it's quite gruesome sometimes.

0:35:300:35:31

Whether you get a thank-you or not, it doesn't matter, you know.

0:35:310:35:35

To see somebody out and enjoying themselves with their group

0:35:350:35:38

of friends or whatever after it all, it's priceless.

0:35:380:35:41

Absolutely priceless.

0:35:410:35:42

In the absence of adequate support, Jenny, Tadhg and many like them

0:35:420:35:47

have created an unofficial care network within the trans community.

0:35:470:35:52

Jenny forms strong bonds with those she helps.

0:35:540:35:57

But it's no substitute for close family contact and the pain

0:35:570:36:01

of not seeing her own children.

0:36:010:36:04

I was told they were getting hurt at school because of me.

0:36:050:36:09

And...I couldn't dispute that.

0:36:090:36:12

So I've stayed back.

0:36:120:36:15

And it's been probably the hardest thing I've ever done.

0:36:150:36:20

Just to not see my own kids, because I'm different.

0:36:200:36:25

But I put out a wish on Facebook

0:36:250:36:28

that one day they'd get back in touch,

0:36:280:36:33

and my oldest son did, about four hours after I wrote the post.

0:36:330:36:38

It was his 13th birthday.

0:36:380:36:41

And...

0:36:410:36:42

I've been told I'm not allowed to send him cards,

0:36:420:36:45

I'm not allowed to send him presents or anything.

0:36:450:36:47

And there's nothing in the world more difficult actually, yeah.

0:36:470:36:53

But...

0:36:530:36:55

he got in touch, and...

0:36:550:36:58

Just the years are so different.

0:36:580:37:01

He's got a voice, he's got...

0:37:010:37:04

He's an adult, you know, he's so grown-up.

0:37:040:37:08

And I've missed, every day,

0:37:080:37:12

not seeing those boys.

0:37:120:37:14

But I love my boys, I will always love my boys,

0:37:200:37:23

and I just hope one day that they'll come and see us.

0:37:230:37:27

In Perth, Anne has decided to throw caution to the wind and

0:37:370:37:42

travel down to Wales in the hope that she can see her son Tyler

0:37:420:37:46

and begin to rebuild their relationship.

0:37:460:37:49

They've been estranged for five years

0:37:490:37:53

and Tyler has never met her as a woman.

0:37:530:37:56

Coming out was especially tough for Anne.

0:37:560:38:00

She experienced alienation and intimidation.

0:38:000:38:05

I had a knock at the door and there was two blokes stood there.

0:38:050:38:09

Pretty big blokes.

0:38:110:38:13

And they basically warned me if I didn't leave the village within 48 hours...

0:38:130:38:19

I wouldn't see daylight ever again.

0:38:190:38:22

They were not happy that a transsexual was living in their village.

0:38:220:38:26

And that scared the crap out of me.

0:38:270:38:30

I could just see the hate in their eyes.

0:38:320:38:35

Pure hatred.

0:38:360:38:38

If it weren't for my son, I wouldn't be going back down.

0:38:460:38:50

Simple as that. I'm doing this for my son.

0:38:500:38:53

I need to see him.

0:38:540:38:56

More than anything.

0:38:570:38:59

Cos I miss him.

0:39:000:39:02

Repairing the relationship with her son is an essential part of

0:39:170:39:22

Anne's transition from male to female.

0:39:220:39:25

She is determined to try and see him, despite the risk.

0:39:250:39:29

This is the first time Anne has returned to Wales

0:39:420:39:46

since her life was threatened.

0:39:460:39:48

The good friends she had were left confused and anxious about

0:39:480:39:52

what had happened to her, so she's come to visit her old pal Nobby

0:39:520:39:57

to introduce him to the woman she has become.

0:39:570:40:00

We did, yeah. It was just that thing going.

0:40:020:40:04

It was just... It was just a good rapport. Good friends. Yeah.

0:40:040:40:07

A very, very good friend.

0:40:070:40:08

And now...my good friend's come back, but now she's Anne. Yeah.

0:40:100:40:15

Doesn't make any difference. No. You're still my friend. Thank you.

0:40:160:40:20

When I first moved to Wales, I had no friends or anything.

0:40:200:40:23

My first day at work, he introduced himself straightaway.

0:40:230:40:28

"Hi, my name's Nobby," and, you know,

0:40:280:40:29

"What's a Jock like you doing in a place like this?"!

0:40:290:40:32

I think it was "ugly Jock"(!) Aye, ugly Jock, like, aye.

0:40:320:40:36

And that just completely broke the ice straightaway and, from then on,

0:40:360:40:39

we have just been firm friends. And to hear him say that is,

0:40:390:40:43

you know...very humbling.

0:40:430:40:45

I feel the only person I have let down, at the moment, is my son.

0:40:460:40:49

Give him a chance.

0:40:490:40:50

Let him make his own mind up.

0:40:520:40:54

It's all you can do. Yeah, I know. It's all you can do.

0:40:550:40:58

He's not a baby any more. He's a man now. Talk to him.

0:40:580:41:01

Talk to him sensibly. Listen to him. More importantly, maybe,

0:41:010:41:04

listen to him. Mm. Yeah. Find out what his fears are,

0:41:040:41:07

because until you know what is in his head,

0:41:070:41:10

you can't put the truth there.

0:41:100:41:11

Justine and Julie's marriage may have survived, but they still have

0:41:160:41:20

a way to go before they can feel truly settled as wife and wife.

0:41:200:41:24

The couple have been together since they were teenagers.

0:41:280:41:31

They met in 1991 and were married in 1997.

0:41:310:41:35

Now, that Justine has officially changed her name and gender,

0:41:390:41:42

they want a new marriage certificate and, some time next year,

0:41:420:41:47

plan to renew their vows...

0:41:470:41:48

That's my dress, if I can get it out. It weighs a ton.

0:41:480:41:52

..this time, as two women.

0:41:520:41:54

Which I can't wait to be wearing on the day.

0:42:000:42:03

That's... I mean, when I tried this on,

0:42:030:42:06

I just about cried.

0:42:060:42:07

The renewal ceremony will have special significance for Justine,

0:42:090:42:13

because this time, she will be a bride, rather than a groom.

0:42:130:42:16

Although I wanted to be there and I wanted to marry Julie,

0:42:180:42:20

I wouldn't change that, I wouldn't change anything that's happened,

0:42:200:42:23

I really wanted that to be me. To me, it's like completing everything.

0:42:230:42:29

I can't wait. I will just feel like a princess for a day.

0:42:290:42:32

Unfortunately, a loophole in Scottish law means that they can't

0:42:320:42:37

get a marriage certificate in Justine's new name,

0:42:370:42:40

because Julie is still officially married to Justin -

0:42:400:42:44

someone who no longer exists.

0:42:440:42:46

It is a minor loophole... Mm. ..but until they close it,

0:42:480:42:52

we can't stick that E... No. ..on the certificate.

0:42:520:42:55

That is all it is. One tiny little E... Mm-hm.

0:42:550:42:59

..to change everything.

0:42:590:43:01

My thoughts were, are the beginning, when I told Julie that I wouldn't

0:43:010:43:05

have a home or I wouldn't have a job, no family.

0:43:050:43:08

I would be on my own, really, and I don't think I would have

0:43:080:43:11

been able to transition on my own. I don't think I'd have made it,

0:43:110:43:15

at all. I don't know what would have happened,

0:43:150:43:17

if I'd have still been here. I don't know.

0:43:170:43:19

So...

0:43:210:43:22

JULIE WHISPERS

0:43:300:43:32

Mm-hm. I know.

0:43:320:43:33

In Wales, it is approaching time for Anne to finally meet her son Tyler,

0:43:410:43:45

for the first time as a woman.

0:43:450:43:47

He has agreed to see her, but has insisted that she come alone

0:43:490:43:52

and after dark.

0:43:520:43:53

HE SIGHS

0:43:570:43:59

What is going through your head right now, Anne?

0:43:590:44:02

Scared, in case he...

0:44:110:44:12

..just turns round and tells me to leave, when he sees me.

0:44:160:44:19

I mean, I have tried to...

0:44:270:44:29

..dress down as much as I can.

0:44:300:44:31

Not much else I can do now.

0:44:380:44:40

Just hope that...

0:44:400:44:41

..hope he accepts us.

0:44:510:44:52

Are you feeling as nervous as he is?

0:44:560:44:58

I am shitting myself.

0:44:580:44:59

I am absolutely cacking my pants right now.

0:45:010:45:03

We are on our way to see my son.

0:45:130:45:15

The first time in five years.

0:45:170:45:19

It's nearly killed me twice, this journey.

0:45:230:45:26

It has separated me from my son for five years.

0:45:290:45:31

I am not a religious person, but I am praying to God right now

0:45:390:45:43

that it all goes fuckin' well.

0:45:430:45:44

What would be the best outcome?

0:45:470:45:49

For him just to hug me.

0:45:510:45:52

For just him to...

0:45:560:45:57

..accept...

0:45:590:46:00

..that this is who I am and...

0:46:020:46:05

..nothing is going to change that.

0:46:070:46:08

If he doesn't, then I am just going to have to walk away

0:46:110:46:13

and it's something I'm just going to have live with the rest of my life.

0:46:130:46:20

I don't know how...

0:46:200:46:21

..but I will figure it out.

0:46:230:46:25

Oh, my God.

0:47:100:47:12

From that little 12-year-old boy that I left,

0:47:120:47:15

to see him... Oh, my God. It was just fantastic.

0:47:150:47:17

And he wasn't...

0:47:190:47:20

The minute he saw me, he...

0:47:210:47:23

He was like that, he was completely relaxed about it.

0:47:260:47:28

I'm so happy.

0:47:300:47:31

I'm so happy right now - it's unbelievable!

0:47:310:47:34

Oh, my God!

0:47:390:47:40

I've got my boy back.

0:47:430:47:44

'Since my surgery last year, it's been nothing but ups and downs.

0:47:460:47:50

'And more downs than ups.'

0:47:500:47:51

But this is just...

0:47:510:47:52

It has just made my day.

0:47:560:47:58

Absolutely made my fucking day.

0:47:590:48:01

Sorry for the language, but I am...

0:48:010:48:03

I'm so happy! You can tell!

0:48:060:48:08

Oh, my God!

0:48:110:48:13

I am SO happy.

0:48:130:48:14

I've got my boy back.

0:48:180:48:19

HE EXHALES DEEPLY

0:48:210:48:23

MUSIC: We Are Family by Sister Sledge

0:48:270:48:30

This weekend is Pride Edinburgh -

0:48:350:48:38

a celebration of diversity and personal identity

0:48:380:48:42

for the lesbian, gay,

0:48:420:48:43

bisexual, transgender

0:48:430:48:46

and inter-sex communities of Scotland.

0:48:460:48:48

There is still so much more to do.

0:48:490:48:53

Every day, there are young people who don't want to go to school

0:48:530:48:56

because they are being bullied. Every day, there are young people

0:48:560:49:00

who don't want to go to work because they are being bullied.

0:49:000:49:03

Now, the Scottish Parliament is one of the most modern, liberal

0:49:030:49:07

and free parliaments in the world, but we should use that opportunity

0:49:070:49:11

to reach out to the wider community and say, "We need your help, too."

0:49:110:49:16

CHEERING

0:49:160:49:17

Have a great day!

0:49:170:49:18

# I got all my sisters and me

0:49:200:49:23

# We are family... #

0:49:250:49:26

Marcus and Tadhg are here to increase visibility

0:49:260:49:29

and raise awareness of ongoing trans-male issues.

0:49:290:49:32

CHEERING

0:49:320:49:35

'It's about appreciating yourself. You've got to be who you are.

0:49:360:49:40

'Don't give a fuck about what anyone else says.'

0:49:400:49:42

I locked myself in the cupboard away for, like, ten years

0:49:420:49:46

and it made me miserable.

0:49:460:49:48

It's about having fun.

0:49:500:49:51

It's about getting to know new people, having a bit of banter,

0:49:510:49:54

causing a riot.

0:49:540:49:55

So...you've just got to be yourself.

0:49:550:49:59

How far on are you? Four months. Four and a bit months on T.

0:50:010:50:04

Right. On what? Testosterone. Oh, right, right. To... Aye.

0:50:040:50:08

Oh, sound. How are you getting on with it? Good.

0:50:080:50:11

It's, "Lock up your daughters," you know! What... Ohh!

0:50:110:50:14

So, what age are you?

0:50:140:50:16

Marcus has been on testosterone for four months and is finally

0:50:160:50:20

starting to see signs that the treatment is working.

0:50:200:50:23

'Got my first injection of libido on Monday.'

0:50:230:50:27

Getting a bit of facial hair. Extra body hair, on my legs.

0:50:270:50:31

It's mental. I'm like a gorilla. It's a bit wild.

0:50:310:50:34

It's weird waking up with tits and a hairy chest,

0:50:340:50:37

'but you get used to it. It's just getting where I want to be.'

0:50:370:50:41

The testosterone may be working, but Marcus still has up to five

0:50:440:50:47

major surgeries ahead of him, before he completes his

0:50:470:50:50

physical transformation from female to male.

0:50:500:50:53

For now, he must be patient and look forward to the day

0:50:560:50:59

he can finally feel comfortable in his own body.

0:50:590:51:02

When the time comes, it will be worth the wait.

0:51:060:51:09

But at the same time, it will be a bit stressful,

0:51:090:51:11

because I could have done it sooner. As soon as the whole lot is done,

0:51:110:51:15

I am just going to go and start a new life.

0:51:150:51:19

Go somewhere. Somewhere else where no-one knows me,

0:51:190:51:22

no-one knows my past.

0:51:220:51:23

I will be absolutely normal.

0:51:230:51:25

I'm not saying I'm not normal now, but I will finally be myself.

0:51:250:51:28

I will finally be able to do what I want. I'll be happy,

0:51:280:51:31

I'll be confident. I'll just be me.

0:51:310:51:33

Paw.

0:51:380:51:39

FORMULA ONE TV THEME PLAYS

0:51:390:51:44

Before she came out as trans, Jenny built rally cars

0:51:460:51:50

and took part as a navigator, with the aim of, one day,

0:51:500:51:53

competing herself.

0:51:530:51:54

ENGINE REVS

0:51:560:51:57

After her surgery, Jenny hopes to return to the rallying circuit -

0:51:570:52:01

this time, as a woman.

0:52:010:52:04

Dirt.

0:52:270:52:28

Right, that was a pretty good session.

0:52:310:52:33

I think you did very well. You have a very strong natural instinct

0:52:330:52:37

for driving. Thanks very much. You have got, er, very good awareness

0:52:370:52:41

of car dynamics. And not everybody has that.

0:52:410:52:44

Overall, I would... I have got pretty high hopes for you.

0:52:440:52:46

You are very, very welcome to the rallying community...

0:52:460:52:49

Thank you very much. ..and I wish you all the best with that.

0:52:490:52:51

ENGINE ROARS

0:52:530:52:56

What a sound!

0:52:570:52:58

Despite being apart from her children, Jenny keeps herself busy

0:52:590:53:04

and her positivity sees her through.

0:53:040:53:06

I hope, by May next year, to have my final surgeries, you know,

0:53:060:53:10

and have the surgeries out the way, so I can just...

0:53:100:53:13

build myself back up, get myself fit again and then carry on

0:53:130:53:16

and do stuff, you know? And get out there and play

0:53:160:53:19

with things like that, so...

0:53:190:53:20

ENGINE ROAR RECEDES

0:53:200:53:22

# La! #

0:53:220:53:23

METALLIC GRINDING

0:53:230:53:25

Ooh! If you can't find it, grind it!

0:53:250:53:28

'I don't get to see my kids, so I adopt everyone else'

0:53:290:53:32

into my life. If I can help others, it helps me, too.

0:53:320:53:35

It takes my mind off my own sort of worries and stuff sometimes.

0:53:350:53:37

So, cover all angles and help people out, if I can,

0:53:370:53:41

and that's it, so...

0:53:410:53:43

I can only be me -

0:53:430:53:44

and this is me.

0:53:440:53:46

Anne has finally got her son back in her life.

0:53:500:53:53

He has come to visit her in Perth,

0:53:530:53:55

so they can start to rebuild the strong bond they once had.

0:53:550:53:59

That might be in... I wonder if it's '90.

0:54:010:54:03

No, it cannae be. No, I'm too young.

0:54:030:54:05

Re-establishing a relationship with her family

0:54:050:54:09

was an essential part of Anne's transition from male to female.

0:54:090:54:16

'It feels fantastic. I'm over the moon.'

0:54:160:54:18

There was a time that I thought we would not get the relationship back

0:54:200:54:24

that we ever did have, but I feel we have gotten

0:54:240:54:27

a lot stronger, actually.

0:54:270:54:28

I feel that, too... Yeah. ..if I'm honest.

0:54:280:54:32

Yeah, I am very happy with the way it has turned out.

0:54:320:54:35

We have bonded a lot closer.

0:54:350:54:36

Check me out, with the beard.

0:54:390:54:41

TYLER LAUGHS

0:54:410:54:42

Oh, my God.

0:54:420:54:43

'I thought I would never fully understand it

0:54:430:54:45

'until I saw him in person and there are parts of me'

0:54:450:54:48

that, you know, did not think I could go through with it. Mm.

0:54:480:54:50

But I went through with it and, as soon as she came through the door,

0:54:500:54:54

we just went back to normal, really. I felt very comfortable.

0:54:540:54:57

I remember one of the things he asked me was,

0:54:570:54:59

"What do I call you now? Do I call you Dad or do I call you Mum?"

0:54:590:55:03

I goes just, "Call me Dad, Tyler, cos I am still your dad."

0:55:030:55:06

That's no' going to change. He can call me whatever he wants.

0:55:060:55:10

He can call me all the sods under the sun, if he wants,

0:55:100:55:12

you know what I mean?

0:55:120:55:14

I'm just happy he's back in my life and...

0:55:140:55:16

..words can't describe it. They really can't.

0:55:180:55:20

The loophole in the law has finally been amended

0:55:330:55:36

and Justine and Julie have come to the registry office in Peterhead,

0:55:360:55:40

to collect their new marriage certificate.

0:55:400:55:42

So, I have got your certificate here.

0:55:430:55:46

So, I will let you have a wee...

0:55:460:55:49

It's perfect. Thank you.

0:55:490:55:50

It must be exciting for you to finally get it?

0:55:500:55:53

At last. Yeah. It's been a long, hard slog to get here,

0:55:530:55:57

to see this one piece of paper.

0:55:570:55:59

Justine and Julie finally have an accurate marriage certificate.

0:56:010:56:08

After a long wait, they are, officially and legally,

0:56:080:56:11

wife and wife.

0:56:110:56:12

Thank you. Thank you. You're welcome.

0:56:120:56:14

Thank you. Take care. Thank you.

0:56:140:56:16

Sorted.

0:56:250:56:26

At the top, it has changed. It now says Bride and Bride,

0:56:270:56:30

rather than Bride and Bridegroom.

0:56:300:56:31

Er, my name, obviously, Justine Melanie.

0:56:310:56:35

And I think... That's it. Is that it?

0:56:370:56:39

Now, we just need to...

0:56:390:56:40

..put on our dancing shoes

0:56:420:56:44

and actually get round to reorganising... Yep.

0:56:440:56:47

..our renewal. Mm-hm.

0:56:470:56:48

Fix a date.

0:56:480:56:50

Rob a bank.

0:56:500:56:51

Yeah! And then, it's all done!

0:56:530:56:54

'We can go back to being wives.'

0:57:000:57:02

No legal "Hm, what are we?" Yeah.

0:57:030:57:06

We are legally wives.

0:57:060:57:08

We can just be normal-ish.

0:57:080:57:10

Yeah. Erm, speak for yourself(!)

0:57:110:57:13

Justine, Julie and their family have come a long way together.

0:57:180:57:22

It has been a difficult journey for all of them,

0:57:240:57:27

but they have stuck together and proved that a relationship

0:57:270:57:30

and a family can survive a wife or a husband changing their gender.

0:57:300:57:35

'I can understand why wives walk away,

0:57:450:57:47

'because it isn't easy and it is a lot to get your head round.

0:57:470:57:51

'It is a lot to take your family through.'

0:57:510:57:53

There is a lot of stigma still attached to it.

0:57:530:57:58

'But for me, I did not fall in love with Just the man'

0:57:580:58:03

'and Just is still the same person, irrespective of gender.'

0:58:030:58:07

Just is Just.

0:58:090:58:10

Rather than reject her, Julie has supported Justine

0:58:100:58:14

through her transition.

0:58:140:58:16

And they have a stronger, happier relationship, as a result.

0:58:170:58:21

'No, I don't miss the old Just.'

0:58:210:58:23

Nor me. Nah.

0:58:260:58:27

You're a better Just now.

0:58:290:58:31

MUSIC: Do You Realise? by The Flaming Lips

0:58:310:58:33

# Do you realise

0:58:330:58:38

# That you have

0:58:410:58:44

# The most beautiful face?

0:58:440:58:50

# Do you realise... #

0:58:500:58:54

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