David Lean Talking Pictures


David Lean

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As a boy, the young David Lean wasn't allowed to go to the cinema.

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His Quaker parents considered motion pictures to be sinful.

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Perhaps that early denial helped spur him on

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through his incredible career.

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He began at the bottom as tea boy at Gaumont Film Studios

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and steadily progressed to camera assistant, to editor,

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and then co-director of Noel Coward's 1942 film

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In Which We Serve,

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his directing big break.

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Over the next decade, Lean put out a run of British classics -

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Blithe Spirit, Brief Encounter,

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Great Expectations, and Oliver Twist.

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And in 1955, he was invited to take part in the programme Film Profile.

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Do you remember Brief Encounter, In Which We Serve, Oliver Twist,

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The Sound Barrier, and Hobson's Choice

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because these are just some of the films made by David Lean.

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Sitting where an actor normally sits and feeling happy?

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No, I don't really like it at all.

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I feel that at any moment I'm going to get up

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and just go behind the camera there and leave you to it.

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Well, I tell you, before you do escape us,

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we would like, David, to make this quite personal.

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Some of the things you have liked making,

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some even that you may have not liked making.

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Some of the problems you've had,

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and get your view on this business of film-making.

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To start with, is a director's life as ulcer-making as people say?

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No, I must tell you I've never had an ulcer. I hope I never do.

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I enjoy this job more than anything I can imagine.

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I think I'm very lucky. In fact...

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..if I had the money in the bank I would pay the film people

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to engage me.

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You mentioned the money then,

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are you concerned with money as a director?

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Well, you always have the pressure of money behind you

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because making a film is a very expensive business,

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and if you've got an expensive cast it can go up to...

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I have worked on films that the running costs is £2,000 a day.

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Now if, when you're making that film,

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you hear those pounds clicking into a till all the time,

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you can lose your head.

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Now, you, as the director, are really the coordinator, aren't you,

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of cameras and lights and artists and so on?

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Yes, as a coordinator.

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Making a film concerns many hundreds of people

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and he is the man

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that gets them all together to put that final results onto the screen.

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I would like to take you back, David,

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to your own start as a cutter, because I've always understood

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that you place enormous emphasis on this question of cutting.

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Yes, well, I personally enjoy cutting...

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..almost as much as direction. I think I find it a fascinating job.

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Most people, I think,

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they think cutting is a question of cutting out things.

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It's nothing to do with cutting out things at all.

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It's the juxtaposition of pictures and um...

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You can make or mar a film by cutting.

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You can't make a bad film good. You can make it tolerable sometimes.

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And you can certainly ruin a good film.

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As a member of the public sitting and watching your film go through,

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-would I recognise a piece of good cutting?

-I hope not.

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Like all technique, one should be completely unconscious of it.

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And, in fact, one should imagine that a film was...

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started to be shot in the morning or whenever the film opens

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and it was a continuous process right up to the end.

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No, you shouldn't be conscious of it at all.

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Now, I like to put you on the spot now

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and ask you to choose from one of your own films,

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the piece of cutting with which you were particularly pleased?

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Well, I think I would choose...

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..a bit out of Oliver Twist, which was the murder of Nancy

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by Bill Sikes.

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This hasn't got a word of dialogue in it and it is just cutting.

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Just going from one picture to another.

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So those numbers of pictures tell the story.

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I've been true to you, upon my soul I have!

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Small point, David,

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but however did you get a dog to behave as competently as that?

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Well, it was quite simple, really, when we found the answer.

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This dog was the most lethargic dog I've ever met

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and he was meant to be terribly fierce.

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Somebody had the bright idea of going into the property department

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and in the property department, they found a stuffed cat.

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Now, we brought that onto the set, showed the dog the cat,

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and it went raving mad.

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So, all we had to do was to hold the dog,

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open that door he was trying to scrabble through

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and show the dog the cat,

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shut the door, shove the cat's tail under the door,

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waggle it, I said, "Action",

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we withdrew the cat's tail

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and the dog just went like a bomb after this cat.

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It's a very bad story I hate to tell, really, but...

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I still think he's a very competent performer

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and I hope you've got him slapped under contract.

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Now, you draw attention to the lack of dialogue.

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What are your views on this question of use of dialogue?

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Well, I must say I find dialogue

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a bore for the most part.

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I think if you look back on any film you've seen,

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you don't remember lines of dialogue, you remember pictures.

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And incidentally, I think people in the movie business

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are going to concentrate more on pictures than on dialogue

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because, fortunately, you boys have got to sit people down like me

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and have them talk and talk and talk.

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Well, I think we can beat you by showing pictures,

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at least I hope so. You're not the enemy.

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Let's talk for a moment about the problem of directing artists.

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Now, you, yourself, were never an actor, were you?

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No, I was never an actor.

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I always suspect that directors are frustrated actors,

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but this is my big moment, I think it will be my last.

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But don't you feel diffident telling an actor how to do his job?

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When I started directing actors, I expected any moment

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they would turn around and say, "What on earth do you know about it?"

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And I would've said, "Well, I don't."

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..really give them a mood to interpret

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and let them do it their own way?

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Well, it's several things with actors.

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First of all, I suppose that all of us are wonderful actors in our bath.

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But as soon as you have

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one of these horrible instruments pointing at you,

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or as soon as you are on a stage, you start to...

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..become paralysed.

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And it's half the director's job

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is taking the nerves out of actors

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because nearly all actors are very, very nervous

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when they start making a picture.

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The sweat will pour off them.

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You will see cigarettes in their hands,

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or if they have that papers to hold, you will see them start to shake.

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And it is a terrifying instrument.

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Well now, the director has got to break that down

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and make them feel completely at ease.

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Then the next job he's got to do is, um...

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..to ensure that they think right

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because acting for the cinema is purely a question of thought.

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If you see an amateur stage show, people pull faces.

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Acting is not pulling faces, it's thinking.

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On the screen, even on a great big long shot

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where the screen's that size and the actor's that size

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and he's walking away,

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if he's not thinking right, there'll be something wrong with his walk.

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I don't know how it happens, but it does.

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An actor has got to know what he's thinking

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every moment during a scene.

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Now, I watched you direct once

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and there was none of this flamboyant shouting at actors.

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You talked very quietly, indeed. That, I take it, is deliberate.

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Yes, it is deliberate.

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What I'm really doing is I'm tickling a talent.

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I'm trying to draw their imagination out.

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They'll...

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..rehearse a scene and I'll say, "Yes, that's fine.

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"Now, try to give it a bit more edge."

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Try to do this, try to do that, and then gradually...

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Carol Reed uses a wonderful expression.

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He says that getting actors ready to do a scene

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is rather like lining up horses at a tape.

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And when they're keyed up to a certain point, boom,

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down goes the tape, up they go and off they go.

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If the camera's not ready or the sound breaks down,

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as it very often does, well, that's the end of the game

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because you have to start all over again.

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Yes, that's right. Yes.

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I would imagine that a director

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can, obviously, make or break himself by the casting.

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Is casting done largely by hunches?

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Yes, you do. I mean, you...

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write a script or work on a script

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and then you get a picture

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of a certain person in your mind, of course.

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And, um...

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..then you begin to think what actor could fit into that picture...

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..been some of the most successful long odd casting that you've done.

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Oh, well, I think it's a story against myself, really,

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because on Great Expectations,

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Alec Guinness played the part of a pale young gentlemen.

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I don't know if you remember, this is what he looked like.

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Mr Pip.

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Well, that's how Alec looked in Great Expectations.

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Now, after I had finished that film, I decided to make Oliver Twist,

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and in it was the part of Fagin.

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Alec came to me and said, "I would like to play Fagin."

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Now, this is what Fagin looks like in Cruikshank's drawings.

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Now as a result of this, I said to Alec,

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"You're out of your mind. You can't play that."

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And he said,

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"Well, look, just give me a screen test. Just give me a test.

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"I'll put a little make-up on and do various things.

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"And, um... I think I can do it."

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I said, "Well, I think you're mad but, all right, do it."

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'And this is what he did.'

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Clever dogs.

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Clever dogs.

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Another long shot that came off brilliantly.

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Well, it came off through no fault of mine.

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That was just Alec and since then, as we all know,

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he's played many, many different parts,

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but at the time, of course, that was quite extraordinary.

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Mm-hmm.

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And now for the 64 question.

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What in your opinion is it that makes and distinguishes

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your great international style?

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Well, I...

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I think it's two things.

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One...

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Way out in front - personality.

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And two...

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I think I can compare a star with a star tennis player.

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A star will say his line, he'll wind it up in a ball

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and flick it at the other actor.

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The other actor will speak, the star will catch it, wind it up

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and flip it back.

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And a sort of tennis match takes place.

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With an ordinary actor, they can be very good,

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but they just haven't got that quality of throwing it back.

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They'll say their line and that's an end of it.

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The star will catch it and bong! Back it goes quickly.

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So really, to get the best out of a star you need another star

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-playing the other side of the net?

-Of course. Every actor...

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It is a sort of duel.

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If you get two really good actors together,

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they'll fence with each other.

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And of course, the best comes out of them.

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Lean brought out the best in his next two films -

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Bridge On The River Kwai and Lawrence Of Arabia.

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But he would often have a difficult relationships with actors

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which many put down to his perfectionism and hard work ethic.

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Omar Sharif considered Lean a brilliant man

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and once described himself as one of the few actors Lean actually liked.

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That's not how Sharif was feeling in this next programme

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which followed the making of another of Lean's epics,

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Doctor Zhivago, in 1965.

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How's that for you?

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Good. Now go to you sitting, Omar.

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'He's a man who is very easy to hate.

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'In other words, it is very easy to hate David

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'and very difficult to like him.'

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He is a very hard man,

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a very selfish man who has no pity for anyone

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and none for himself either, which is a very rare thing.

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He has no self pity and no self-indulgence.

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Therefore, it's very difficult for him to pity anybody else

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or to feel sorry for anybody however tired they may be.

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He considers everybody on the set,

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everybody who's helping to make the film,

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as objects rather than as people.

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They are the things that are making his film.

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And, well, you can see how easy it is,

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if you think that he is considering you as an object,

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how easy it is to be terribly unhappy and rather hate him for it.

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I know that I have,

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at the end of many days shooting, felt terrible hate for him.

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And I know, for instance, most of the people who have worked with him

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and who work with him

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rather dislike him

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because he drives them too hard and he uses them.

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Now the 64,000 question, of course, was who played Zhivago.

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Now, Zhivago is a very passive part

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and I think it would be... It needs a poet.

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And a doctor.

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But the fatal pitfall, I think,

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would have been to cast too much with the type.

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If I'd had a very studious young man,

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I think he'd tend to be a bore in the picture

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and so, I thought, "I will go for immense good looks."

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And I thought of Omar

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because he played the sheikh in Lawrence who came out of the mirage.

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He's a very sensitive actor.

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And, uh, we happen to work very well together.

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He catches on and I think it works

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and I thought I could get...

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..this Russian poet out of him.

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And I backed that hunch. A lot of people thought I was mad.

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'He never loses his temper.

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'I've very rarely seen him lose his temper.

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'He just more or less seems to be at the same pitch sometimes.

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'Terribly worried, obviously, but more or less at the same pitch.

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'But he's certainly intimate.

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'Not a man, but I mean, a director, very intimate.'

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I don't know him socially.

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I only know him as a director.

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Because he's very quiet, retiring.

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Leads a very retiring life, as far as I can see.

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I mean, I don't know him,

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he might be up every night boozing away, but I don't think so.

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'He takes you away and sort of quietly talks to you

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'about exactly what he wants and then he'll say to everybody,

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'"Now, shut up and go away and leave."'

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Thousands of coppers at the back... Get them all out.

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You know, all of the wanderers, all of them - out.

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Now, very quiet! Silencio!

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All right, Omar... Action.

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I suppose I don't have much contact with actors off the set

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because I have so much contact with them on the set.

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I'm, as it were...

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trying to get things out of them.

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I'm squeezing them a little, I'm encouraging them, I'm...

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..a general sort of wetness to actors.

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And I suppose when the day's finished,

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they are part of my job and I want to go off and relax without them.

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In a couple of weeks you'll be with your little girl.

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If I can get on a train.

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I want to be with Katya more than anything in the world.

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Yes, of course.

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Now that we're going, I feel sad.

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Sad.

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Really sad.

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-Well, we've been here some time.

-Yes.

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This must have been a lovely house once.

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-Don't you think?

-What are you going to do?

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-In Gradov?

-Yes.

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-I'll be all right.

-I wish I could think so.

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You could run a laundry.

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-What will you do?

-I suppose I'll go back to the hospital.

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It's funny to think of you there.

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I used to pass it on my way to school.

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-You ever come to Moscow?

-From Gradov?

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If only there was someone to look after you.

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But of course if there were, I'd be destroyed by jealousy.

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Zhivago, don't.

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My dear, don't, please.

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Now, look what you've made me do.

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Yuri, we've been together six months...

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On the road and here.

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And we've not done anything you'll have to lie about to Tonya.

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I don't want you to have to lie about me.

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Do you understand that, Yuri?

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You understand everything.

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MGM welcomed Lean's decision to film the bulk of Doctor Zhivago in Spain,

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a country that hasn't yet priced itself out of the epic market.

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Lean was able to hire local extras at nine shillings a day.

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A stunt horseman cost a tenth of what they would in Britain.

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Lean needed snow, hundreds of tonnes of it,

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so the entire output of a local marble quarry was bought

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and crushed into white powder

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which was scattered over this Spanish plain in high summer

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to recreate Russia in midwinter.

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A forest of trees was sprayed with white plastic snow.

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He needed a cold winter mist,

0:20:400:20:43

so 100 German smoke machines were brought in to do the job.

0:20:430:20:46

It all looked expensive

0:20:480:20:49

and would have been anywhere else in the world, but this was Spain.

0:20:490:20:53

In all, this set cost just £2,000 to erect.

0:20:530:20:56

INDISTINCT YELLING

0:21:000:21:03

-Lean was hard at work.

-Omar can do it.

0:21:050:21:08

'Yesterday I was out on a country road with 400 soldiers and a cart.

0:21:110:21:18

'Now, I had to make a scene out of 400 soldiers and a cart.

0:21:180:21:22

'It's not all that easy. It takes time.

0:21:220:21:24

'But once I've decided on the plan, we're off and we shoot fast.

0:21:240:21:28

'And that's it.

0:21:300:21:31

'And of course, there's this awful pressure of money all the time

0:21:310:21:34

'which if I thought about it too much, it would drive me insane.

0:21:340:21:37

'I always imagine if I'm not careful, of some ghastly fruit machine

0:21:370:21:41

'with dollars clicking through it

0:21:410:21:43

'and spilling onto the floor every second.'

0:21:430:21:45

Action!

0:21:450:21:46

Try it again.

0:21:490:21:51

With two thirds of the film shot,

0:21:510:21:53

it became clear to MGM that Lean might present them

0:21:530:21:56

not only with a box-office success,

0:21:560:21:58

but with a film that could win an Academy Award.

0:21:580:22:01

And an Oscar could be worth 5 million at the box office.

0:22:010:22:04

Open the doors, turn on the fans.

0:22:170:22:19

Open the doors and turn the fans on, boys.

0:22:190:22:21

TANNOY IN SPANISH

0:22:230:22:26

The pace was stepped up to complete the picture

0:22:320:22:35

before the end of the year

0:22:350:22:36

and so qualify for the next awards.

0:22:360:22:38

By this time, Lean himself was working 16 or 18 hours a day,

0:22:420:22:46

seven days a week.

0:22:460:22:47

You generally lose, oh, I don't know, about two stone during the picture.

0:22:560:23:01

One's tummy goes.

0:23:010:23:03

One's in great physical shape

0:23:030:23:04

and after about a week of getting up at 11, one feels fine.

0:23:040:23:09

But it's a pretty killing job.

0:23:090:23:13

I haven't had a Sunday off, for instance,

0:23:130:23:16

for as long as I can remember.

0:23:160:23:17

I go into the cutting rooms...

0:23:170:23:20

when the unit have a Sunday off.

0:23:200:23:23

It's pretty tough but I get very excited by making a movie.

0:23:230:23:27

I suppose it's kind of nervous energy.

0:23:290:23:31

I'm tired now, as I said to you before,

0:23:310:23:35

but I suppose the nerve of that infernal machine wakes me up.

0:23:350:23:40

At the end of September, Lean's camera turned for the last time.

0:23:420:23:46

The studio lights went out, the props were taken away,

0:23:460:23:49

the actors went home to Hollywood, Cairo, Rome and London.

0:23:490:23:54

The technicians cleared up

0:23:540:23:55

and then they too went home Penge, Pinner, Braintree and Horsham.

0:23:550:24:00

Everybody was happy. The deadline for the Oscars had been met.

0:24:000:24:04

Shortly after everybody had left,

0:24:130:24:15

the first advertisement for the film appeared.

0:24:150:24:18

MGM had done what they said they would.

0:24:180:24:20

David Lean was given the star billing.

0:24:200:24:23

But there was still a lot of work for Lean.

0:24:260:24:29

He was to fly to Hollywood to edit the picture there,

0:24:290:24:32

but the most difficult phase was over.

0:24:320:24:34

'I remember I used to go when I was young on a lot of cruises.

0:24:370:24:42

'They lasted about two weeks, and at the end of them

0:24:420:24:45

'it was rather sad because we made all sorts of friendships

0:24:450:24:48

'and so forth and so on. There was a last farewell dinner, etc, etc.

0:24:480:24:52

'Rather sad.

0:24:520:24:54

'It's exactly the same with making a film.

0:24:540:24:57

'But my cruise lasts a year and I work day in, day out

0:24:570:25:03

'with these technicians who obviously I've become very fond of

0:25:030:25:07

'we work very, very close together.

0:25:070:25:09

'And at the end of it...

0:25:090:25:10

'..the bottom falls out of everything in a way.

0:25:120:25:14

'One's suddenly at a loose end. One thing is good, though.

0:25:140:25:19

'It's glorious to be anonymous for a moment.'

0:25:190:25:22

Perhaps this time it won't be so easy to be anonymous.

0:25:220:25:26

Not so easy to slip away out of the limelight

0:25:260:25:28

and become an ordinary, unrecognised tourist.

0:25:280:25:31

MGM are creating an image. A box office draw.

0:25:310:25:35

From now on, David Lean will have to live with that image all the time.

0:25:350:25:39

After three consecutive epics and three big international hits,

0:25:400:25:45

expectations were high for Lean's next film.

0:25:450:25:48

Although it won two Oscars,

0:25:490:25:51

the critics reaction to Ryan's Daughter

0:25:510:25:54

was so negative that it was 14 years before Lean released another film.

0:25:540:25:58

And that was his adaptation of the EM Forster novel,

0:25:590:26:02

A Passage To India.

0:26:020:26:04

And whilst on location,

0:26:040:26:06

Lean spoke about the project to the BBC reporter, Mark Tully.

0:26:060:26:10

Forster mistrusted movie-makers.

0:26:120:26:14

The film rights were only sold after his death.

0:26:140:26:17

Lean then spent 18 months writing his script

0:26:170:26:20

and had to be vetted by the guardians of Forster's masterpiece,

0:26:200:26:24

the fellows of King's College, Cambridge.

0:26:240:26:26

I did the script and they were very polite

0:26:270:26:31

and they asked me to come along, after having read it, for lunch.

0:26:310:26:35

I was just about to start on the fish and they started in on me

0:26:380:26:42

and I said, "I'd wish you had waited till the sweet."

0:26:420:26:47

They...

0:26:470:26:48

They were very, very nice indeed.

0:26:490:26:53

After about two hours, they were very kind and just gave it their blessing.

0:26:530:26:58

How much difference is there between Lean's Passage To India

0:26:580:27:01

and Forster's Passage To India?

0:27:010:27:03

He's a writer, I'm a film-maker. I like movies.

0:27:040:27:08

I've tried to make it a movie that I would like to see.

0:27:080:27:11

The end is different, certainly.

0:27:110:27:14

But I think I wouldn't be ashamed for Forster to read the script.

0:27:140:27:20

I think I stuck with his characters and, on the whole,

0:27:200:27:24

given the limitations of time, I mean, what's one doing?

0:27:240:27:27

One's doing something in two hours with a book that thick.

0:27:270:27:31

It's a sort of sketch of it and I'm extracting a movie from it.

0:27:310:27:35

Those who...

0:27:350:27:36

..want to read Forster, read the book.

0:27:370:27:40

Those that want to go to a movie and don't read, come see our film.

0:27:400:27:45

Poor old English, they've had a rough time in the films lately.

0:27:450:27:48

And, uh...

0:27:490:27:51

It's because, of course, colonialism has gone out of fashion,

0:27:520:27:55

so it's quite easy to take pot shots of a lot of idiots,

0:27:550:27:59

-stuffy idiots, you know?

-Yes.

0:27:590:28:00

And, uh...

0:28:000:28:02

..quite honestly, I think Forster did that too.

0:28:030:28:06

And I think he felt a bit guilty about it.

0:28:060:28:07

I mean, he certainly had a blast with it when the book came out.

0:28:070:28:11

And I'm trying to keep a balance. I don't know.

0:28:110:28:14

I'm trying to tell a good story. That's really what I'm trying to do.

0:28:140:28:17

Helping to tell the story is an army from England.

0:28:210:28:25

They even imported much of their own food,

0:28:250:28:27

including kippers for breakfast.

0:28:270:28:29

But meals aren't the production's only administrative problem.

0:28:310:28:35

Perhaps the worst is India's notorious red tape.

0:28:350:28:38

I took my first baptism of...

0:28:400:28:43

I was going through the customs, you know,

0:28:430:28:45

it takes about two and half hours to get through the customs

0:28:450:28:48

if you've got any apparatus as you no doubt know with that thing.

0:28:480:28:52

They look at every lens...

0:28:520:28:54

-"Are you going to sell this?"

-Yes.

-"How much film have you got?

0:28:540:28:59

"Are you going to sell it?" "No, I wouldn't have bought it to sell it."

0:28:590:29:03

And so forth and so on, and after two hours, one hates the country.

0:29:030:29:06

Then of course, it's wonderful.

0:29:060:29:08

You have certain problems still with the government.

0:29:080:29:11

For instance, you still have to have someone here checking

0:29:110:29:13

that you're shooting according to the script. Does that annoy you?

0:29:130:29:16

They've been very good to me.

0:29:190:29:20

Indians have been so kind, they've even allowed the production

0:29:250:29:28

to monopolise the branch line from Kannur to Ooty.

0:29:280:29:31

At 75, Lean's as demanding as ever,

0:29:340:29:36

taking and retaking scenes until he gets what he wants.

0:29:360:29:39

That's good, that hat.

0:29:390:29:42

That costs, but then producers can't argue with a man

0:29:420:29:45

whose last four films grossed £120 million, not to mention the Oscars.

0:29:450:29:50

But not everyone appreciates the Lean style.

0:29:520:29:54

It's often said that as a director you are, in a way,

0:29:560:30:00

more concerned with visual than with the performance of the actors.

0:30:000:30:04

Balls.

0:30:050:30:07

I like spectacle.

0:30:070:30:09

When I say spectacle, I don't think you can just put on

0:30:090:30:13

a load of spectacle and expect it to be successful with the public.

0:30:130:30:18

Of course you've got to have a foreground action.

0:30:180:30:21

It's often easy for critics to say,

0:30:210:30:23

"Oh, the action...the background swamped the foreground."

0:30:230:30:27

But I don't think I've done that.

0:30:280:30:31

And you found the public react...

0:30:310:30:33

the people who go see your films, react to the spectacular?

0:30:330:30:36

Well, I haven't done badly, no.

0:30:370:30:39

Passage To India was an international sensation.

0:30:390:30:44

Described as one of the cinema's greatest ever screen adaptations.

0:30:440:30:48

In 1984, the year of its release,

0:30:480:30:51

Lean was knighted by the Queen for his services to the cinema.

0:30:510:30:55

Four years later, the great man's 80th birthday

0:30:550:30:59

was marked by Barry Norman with a special edition of Film 88.

0:30:590:31:03

How important was it to have been an editor

0:31:050:31:07

when you finally became a director?

0:31:070:31:09

It's everything.

0:31:100:31:11

You know, I often wonder at directors who've never been editors.

0:31:120:31:17

-Because...

-Me too.

-Oh, really? Well, it's right.

0:31:170:31:21

I just don't understand how they go to work because I'm sitting there

0:31:210:31:25

and if I'm directing you, I'm saying, "Good, good, good," to myself.

0:31:250:31:29

"I can cut the two shot there.

0:31:290:31:31

"I have to retake that in the close up.

0:31:310:31:34

"Mm-hm. Mm-hm. That'll be good on him."

0:31:340:31:37

And so forth. "Right, cut! Now let's go again.

0:31:370:31:40

"One more take," and that sort of thing, you know?

0:31:400:31:44

I kind of piece it together as we're making it.

0:31:440:31:49

And editing is one of the...

0:31:500:31:52

..if not THE chief of the tools of my trade.

0:31:540:31:59

An immensely successful film and another Oscar for you.

0:31:590:32:02

How important do you think Oscars are?

0:32:020:32:04

Well, if you have no hope of getting one, they are despised.

0:32:060:32:09

But if you have, they're very important.

0:32:090:32:12

-That's very honest, I must say. It's easy to...

-It's very nice.

0:32:120:32:16

Yes, it's easy to despise them if you're not in the running, isn't it?

0:32:160:32:19

That's right.

0:32:190:32:20

Of course with your next film, Doctor Zhivago,

0:32:200:32:22

you very nearly did the hat trick. You were nominated yet again.

0:32:220:32:25

But on that one, you lost out the best picture

0:32:250:32:27

to Sound Of Music, I believe. Was that a little galling?

0:32:270:32:30

Oh, terribly, you know.

0:32:330:32:34

Yes, but, you know, I'll tell you what killed us...

0:32:340:32:38

Doctor Zhivago got the most terrible notices. Worldwide.

0:32:380:32:43

I remember the premiere in New York.

0:32:450:32:47

They gave a dinner at the top of one of the big hotels there and...

0:32:470:32:50

I said, "Why are they all reading newspapers?"

0:32:520:32:54

They said, "Well, the criticism are coming."

0:32:540:32:56

Everyone was sitting around the table reading the newspapers.

0:32:560:32:58

At the end of the dinner, they all came and sort of shook my hand

0:32:580:33:02

and said, "Well, David, I liked it." That sort of thing.

0:33:020:33:06

That did nothing to help the film.

0:33:080:33:11

It was disaster and MGM then had a marvellous chap

0:33:110:33:15

called Bob O'Brien who was the boss.

0:33:150:33:19

And he said, "David..."

0:33:190:33:21

He said, "I think this film's great. I'm going to back it."

0:33:210:33:24

And he said, "I'm going to spend another million."

0:33:260:33:28

And he spent a million on publicity,

0:33:280:33:32

and partly on keeping it on at the theatre

0:33:320:33:35

where you can throw rocks around without loss of life.

0:33:350:33:38

And it...

0:33:380:33:41

First week empty, second week empty, third week started...

0:33:410:33:46

to increase. And the fourth week it was packed.

0:33:460:33:48

And we took off, and that film earned me more money

0:33:480:33:52

than all of my other films put together to date.

0:33:520:33:55

Well, it's had an enduring popularity, that film, hasn't it?

0:33:550:33:59

What do you think it was that gave it that?

0:33:590:34:02

Well, it was your old thing I was listening to a couple of weeks ago.

0:34:020:34:05

Story. It's a wonderful story, isn't it?

0:34:050:34:08

-Yes, it is, yes.

-Ah, wonderful.

0:34:080:34:10

And you don't... You want to know what happens next.

0:34:100:34:12

And wonderful characters, you know?

0:34:120:34:14

And Julie.

0:34:160:34:17

Which was quite a face.

0:34:170:34:19

I was amazed that, what, for 14 years after Ryan's Daughter,

0:34:190:34:22

you never made another film. Why? Why not?

0:34:220:34:25

Was it because it got such a bad review, or bad reviews?

0:34:250:34:29

Well, I was very stupid as a matter of fact.

0:34:290:34:32

I thought why... They were universal...

0:34:330:34:35

I don't think there was one good notice for Ryan's Daughter.

0:34:350:34:39

Really, not one.

0:34:390:34:41

And I thought, "Why am I doing this?"

0:34:410:34:43

You know, rather stupidly, and I went off and I started travelling.

0:34:430:34:47

In the end, it was EM Forster's novel about the British Raj,

0:34:470:34:50

A Passage To India, that brought Lean back to work at the age of 76.

0:34:500:34:54

Although in the intervening years,

0:34:540:34:56

he had spent a great deal of time trying and failing

0:34:560:34:58

to set-up productions of both The Bounty and Gandhi.

0:34:580:35:01

Were you pleased with A Passage To India in the end?

0:35:080:35:10

Sort of.

0:35:130:35:14

A lot of people criticised your choice of Alec Guinness

0:35:140:35:17

to play an Indian.

0:35:170:35:18

Would you... With hindsight, would you do that again?

0:35:180:35:21

I don't think really it's the...

0:35:230:35:25

I think Alec could perfectly well have played an Indian.

0:35:250:35:29

I think he got scared of it.

0:35:290:35:30

And I remember him saying to me once,

0:35:320:35:35

"I think you're asking me to play... give an imitation of Peter Sellers."

0:35:350:35:40

Which, in fact, I wasn't.

0:35:400:35:42

-It would have been disastrous, wouldn't it?

-It would rather.

0:35:420:35:45

And, um...

0:35:450:35:46

So I don't think that was one of his best performances, no.

0:35:480:35:51

In simple terms, Miss Quested, life is a wheel with many spokes.

0:35:520:35:57

A continuous cycle of life, birth, death, and rebirth,

0:35:570:36:02

until we obtain nirvana.

0:36:020:36:04

I have contrived a dance based on this philosophy.

0:36:060:36:09

-Do you dance, professor?

-Oh, yes.

0:36:090:36:11

Adela.

0:36:110:36:13

Oh, Ronny, you're early. Let me introduce to you, Professor Godbole.

0:36:130:36:16

-And this...and that's...

-What's happened to Fielding?

0:36:160:36:18

Where's my mother?

0:36:180:36:20

And what on earth are you doing?

0:36:200:36:22

Well, they're seeing college and we're eating water chestnuts.

0:36:220:36:24

-Have one.

-No, thank you. We're leaving at once.

0:36:240:36:27

You have been criticised by people who say that your films

0:36:270:36:31

don't actually say a lot, by which I imagine

0:36:310:36:34

that they have no message for mankind.

0:36:340:36:38

Is this a criticism that irks you at all?

0:36:380:36:41

No, not at all.

0:36:410:36:42

What are you looking for when you make a film? What do you want to do?

0:36:420:36:45

I want to make something that if I went to the cinema,

0:36:480:36:51

and wasn't me, I would enjoy watching.

0:36:510:36:53

I just, as I told you, I just love movies,

0:36:540:36:58

and I would like to make good movies.

0:36:580:37:01

I think part of making a good movie,

0:37:010:37:04

or the greater part of it,

0:37:040:37:05

is a good story which I know is out of fashion.

0:37:050:37:07

And good characters.

0:37:090:37:11

I mean, in the old days when one went to the movies,

0:37:110:37:15

one used to feel one had been out and met some fascinating people.

0:37:150:37:20

I saw the other day The Untouchables on an aeroplane

0:37:200:37:23

and to be quite honest...

0:37:230:37:25

And...

0:37:260:37:28

I didn't really like it at all.

0:37:280:37:30

You know, for somebody who says, and indeed I believe you,

0:37:310:37:35

that you love making movies, you've made very few.

0:37:350:37:37

16 films and 46 years, I think. Why is that?

0:37:370:37:41

Oh, it scares me stiff. You know, I suppose...

0:37:420:37:46

Mm...

0:37:460:37:47

If I take on a movie,

0:37:490:37:51

I want, terribly, to do it frightfully well.

0:37:510:37:55

So therefore, one's got to have a very, very good script.

0:37:550:38:01

So I spend an inordinate amount of time choosing the subject

0:38:010:38:05

and then working on the script.

0:38:050:38:07

And... I suppose it's fear, really, to put your foot in the water.

0:38:080:38:13

After all this time and a couple of Oscars and several nominations,

0:38:140:38:19

I would've thought you could've done without the fear.

0:38:190:38:21

You could've got rid of that by now.

0:38:210:38:23

It doesn't work like that, does it? Do you ever get...

0:38:230:38:26

-Do you ever get nervous when...

-All the time.

0:38:260:38:28

..when you're doing this job?

0:38:280:38:30

You do, yes. Well, there you are, that's the answer.

0:38:300:38:33

It's a sort of... It's a difficult job.

0:38:330:38:36

I mean...

0:38:360:38:37

I feel fairly at home with you here

0:38:370:38:39

because I sort of feel in my element too.

0:38:390:38:42

I know you write movies but when you see that eye boring into you,

0:38:420:38:48

it is difficult.

0:38:480:38:49

And in this minute my lips are rather dry.

0:38:490:38:53

-Very difficult.

-Yes, it's hard to reconcile with another criticism.

0:38:530:38:57

I've been looking into your critics.

0:38:570:39:00

One of them said that you have a dictatorial urge to control

0:39:000:39:03

every aspect of the film when you're making it.

0:39:030:39:07

Would you disagree, you might possibly disagree with dictatorial,

0:39:070:39:10

but would you disagree with any of the rest of it?

0:39:100:39:12

Or would you disagree with none of it?

0:39:120:39:14

I do like to keep a close hold on everything.

0:39:160:39:22

I think that's what being a director is.

0:39:220:39:26

He's...

0:39:260:39:27

..encouraging a talent,

0:39:280:39:30

encouraging things that he saw in the negative, in his mind,

0:39:300:39:35

when he was doing the script,

0:39:350:39:38

and suppressing things that seem to go against it.

0:39:380:39:42

And so, in that sort of way, I'm a kind of gentle dictator.

0:39:420:39:46

As things turned out,

0:39:470:39:49

A Passage To India would be Lean's last picture,

0:39:490:39:52

which was not how he wanted things.

0:39:520:39:55

He spent his final years trying hard to put together

0:39:550:39:59

an adaptation of Joseph Conrad's novel, Nostromo.

0:39:590:40:03

But it was not to be,

0:40:030:40:04

and in 1991 when he died, aged 83.

0:40:040:40:09

Eulogy spoke of his towering visual imagination

0:40:090:40:12

and incredible ambition.

0:40:120:40:14

At the turn of the millennium,

0:40:160:40:17

the BFI's list of the 100 best British movies ever made

0:40:170:40:22

had three of his in the top five.

0:40:220:40:26

Proof, if it were needed, that just like his films,

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the man's talent was truly epic.

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